# Spike or Undeveloped Fawn?



## SpottedAg (Jun 16, 2010)

The story goes... I shot this deer at a buddy's ranch with the instruction to eradicate all pigs and spikes. 

I'm convinced it is a spike with a gnarly antler that got pushed over during hardening. 

He weighed 85 lbs. Shot in Zavala county 40 mi from the border. 

What says the 2cool brain trust? Spike or _______??


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## AvianQuest (Feb 7, 2006)

Don't understand why it's questioned?

It's a spike.

Any way you can get more blood on the scene?


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Pretty sure I see spikes.

What's an undeveloped fawn?


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## SpottedAg (Jun 16, 2010)

Explained to me as a deer that would have spikes one year and forks+ during a following year. 

Sorry for the blood.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Sorry I am confused. Plain its a young spike probably year old.


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## AvianQuest (Feb 7, 2006)

SpottedAg said:


> Explained to me as a deer that would have spikes one year and forks+ during a following year.
> 
> Sorry for the blood.


Might.....might not. It could be several years old and still only be a spike.

If they wanted spikes shot, you did your duty.


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## Goags (May 28, 2004)

AvianQuest said:


> Might.....might not. It could be several years old and still only be a spike.
> 
> If they wanted spikes shot, you did your duty.


Yep, that's how I see it, too. Jugular shot? No wasted meat!


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## T-Roy (Oct 4, 2004)

In my opinion a deer with an unbranched horn is a spike. Sorry. Hamburger meat. You did exactly whet I would expect any one I told to shoot spikes to do.


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## ReelEasy (Jan 23, 2006)

Happy with you carrying out your orders. However just a suggestion as to refer to ethics training in the basic hunters education class. Approach is acceptable but this Presentation doesn't sit well with the views of animal rights activist. Just don't want to give them any ammunition to fuel there fire. Note when taking pictures of animals you should never make it seem like a gruesome ordeal. 

Respectfully,

Your fellow outdoorsman....


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

Looks like a Unicorn in need of viagra


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

The blood doesn't bother me. It's part of death, and killing animals is what's done. This is a hunting board not an art forum. 

That deer is a one year old deer. Not a fawn. Fawns do not grow hardened before their first year.


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

Open the mouth and look at the teeth. A fawn will have the third tooth (premolar)with three cusps, and they will be sharp. A yeearling will have the same tooth, but it will be very worn. A 2.5 will have two cusps on the third tooth,and it will be sharp.
My guess is 1.5, but definately not a fawn. Hardened antler, not a fawn.
BB


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## Main Frame 8 (Mar 16, 2007)

Well, it should be tender.


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## PortATrout (Aug 15, 2005)

A fawn would have been born this summer. If it is a buck fawn it will have bumps on it's head. Near the end of January until they lose their antlers they may bust through the skin. (Buck fawns lose their antlers just like bigger deer) That deer is a minimum of 1.5 years old and could be older, but no way is it from this years fawn crop. I think a lot of people get confused when they talk about fawns and yearlings. A fawn is 6 months old right now and a yearling is 1.5 years old.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

PortATrout said:


> A fawn would have been born this summer. If it is a buck fawn it will have bumps on it's head. Near the end of January until they lose their antlers they may bust through the skin. (Buck fawns lose their antlers just like bigger deer) That deer is a minimum of 1.5 years old and could be older, but no way is it from this years fawn crop. I think a lot of people get confused when they talk about fawns and yearlings. A fawn is 6 months old right now and a yearling is 1.5 years old.


X2

Just a note. Once time I did see a fawn on a pen raised deer place that had antlers. Not much but they were there.


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

I have heard of that too Charlie, but never seen it personally. I have seen fawns that have some sort of fuzzy appendage from the pedicle, but it was obvious it was not hardened. I would not think a normal fawn would have the testostorone level to dry the velvet and shed. Really difficult to say never/always in nature. 
BB


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## AvianQuest (Feb 7, 2006)

BigBuck said:


> Open the mouth and look at the teeth. A fawn will have the third tooth (premolar)with three cusps, and they will be sharp. A yeearling will have the same tooth, but it will be very worn. A 2.5 will have two cusps on the third tooth,and it will be sharp.


Once you've determined that, release the beast and shoot it before it gets out of range.


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## mako (Nov 10, 2004)

AvianQuest said:


> Might.....might not. It could be several years old and still only be a spike.
> 
> If they wanted spikes shot, you did your duty.


 If it's #85, it's most likely a 1 year old buck that hasn't developed yet. Personally, I don't kill "spikes" until they appear to be 2.5 yrs old..as a good deer can start out as a 1 yr old spike.


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## Medic2011 (Dec 13, 2012)

mako said:


> If it's #85, it's most likely a 1 year old buck that hasn't developed yet. Personally, I don't kill "spikes" until they appear to be 2.5 yrs old..as a good deer can start out as a 1 yr old spike.


Agree fully. I Worked 2 yrs for deer breeder, seen many 1.5 yr spikes turn into monsters at 2.5. Remember this is High genetic , high protein; but very very rarely did a crappy 2.5 yr old improve. Iv also seen fawns have hardened horns at 6 months working out there. They were tiny but there. I'd agree with the deer in that pic is a 1.5 yr old but typically the reason they grow that funky is he fractured low and will be permitted. I'll try to find the pics, we had a 12 that was symmetrical... Minus the fact his right side grew under his head.


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## HELOLT (Aug 1, 2013)

Spike allday


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

Kyle 1974 said:


> That deer is a one year old deer. Not a fawn. Fawns do not grow hardened before their first year.


yep



BigBuck said:


> My guess is 1.5, but definately not a fawn. Hardened antler, not a fawn.
> BB


yep



PortATrout said:


> A fawn would have been born this summer. If it is a buck fawn it will have bumps on it's head. That deer is a minimum of 1.5 years old, but no way is it from this years fawn crop. A fawn is 6 months old right now and a yearling is 1.5 years old.


and yep


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

mako said:


> If it's #85, it's most likely a 1 year old buck that hasn't developed yet. Personally, I don't kill "spikes" until they appear to be 2.5 yrs old..as a good deer can start out as a 1 yr old spike.


X2


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## SpottedAg (Jun 16, 2010)

Some very good info presented here. Thank you all. 

The info Mako provided was of most concern. Whether or not he had potential to develop more than two points later in life. Unfortunately the jaw is gone and he's in the freezer (as stated, tender!) so his age will remain unknown. 

Thanks again


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## fishdfly (Sep 12, 2010)

Seems every one who does not "own" their own land is an expert at removing deer. 



Some say remove all spikes, not always a good idea. Read Dr. James Kroll's book in Harvesting and Managing Whitetail deer, you might just learn something, especially as we come out of 8 years of drought.



I had pictures of a very "a-typical " buck in East Texas in velvet in the first week of November. He disappeared on me.



I talked with Dr. Kroll's daughter and she told me "he" had a hormone problem. Talked with the Biologist with Texas Parks and Wildlife in Tyler and his thoughts were it was a doe with antlers. Huh. 



Pulled some February 2013 pictures from the same place and found another deer in velvet in the same field.



Placed a new camera this week on a scrape/rub to see what was coming to an area that we do not go into. There was my missing buck, whatever "it" maybe, it 

has dropped a 9" drop tine, a 4" drop time and managed to go from solid 12 point down to 7 points or so.



Often times a person needs to get educated about deer, nutrition and rainfall before removing critters.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

Fish, do you by chance hunt HF or a large parcel of land with protein? Just asking

Sent from my phone


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## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

my area is so over-run that one more or less wont matter...


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## bubbas kenner (Sep 4, 2010)

Kyle 1974 said:


> The blood doesn't bother me. It's part of death, and killing animals is what's done. This is a hunting board not an art forum.
> 
> That deer is a one year old deer. Not a fawn. Fawns do not grow hardened before their first year.


Very well put.Great report, more real, good meat in the pot post


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## cwbycrshr (May 23, 2013)

Yep...1.5 Year old. Dependoing on the area, he may have grown into something if you poured the feed to him (see Nunley/Chitam thread). Most likely, he would never have amounted to much. 

Regardless, he is dinner. And very tasty at that. Personally, I like to turn the entire animal (on the smaller ones) into chicken fry and cuttlets. To tender to waist on hamburger. The 2 large muscles in each hind quarter makes excellent pot roast as well.


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## Bowhntr (Aug 7, 2006)

First congrats 
2nd: don't give the anti hunters more fuel against hunters. Before posting pictures clean up the harvest or move to another spot for better picture. Leave out the gore and make a better impression for future hunters don't want the anti to think we're blood thirsty hunters.


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## letsgofishin (Sep 28, 2009)

*Keep um thinned out!!!*



bubbas kenner said:


> Very well put.Great report, more real, good meat in the pot post


Obviously not outta a good gene pool. Thin um out before they can spread that gene. Make more room for the good uns!!!!!!
Good job keep it up!!!!!
:texasflag


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