# A copy and paste from NewWater's site



## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

_STILT_
Scheduled for release in summer of 2009, the Stilt has spawned more rumors than Paris Hilton and Britney Spears put together. It will make history for its sleek, artistic design, and its unparalleled performance as a technical poling skiff.

Photos and details will soon follow!

So has anyone seen one of these bad boys? Going to be way out of my price range and I plan on keeping my current boat for a long time right now anyays.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

i'll never do business with him again.

i paid a premium for a poling platfrom i had made cuz he had a reputation for delivering quality. he charged for the quality, but that was fine, i wanted quality. picked it up and was sorely disappointed in the shoddy work. i told him it was unacceptable and that he had to fix it, so after another week i go pick it up and it's only marginally better. big mistake i made was paying for it up front, but i figured with his reputation, it was a safe bet. WRONG!

two weeks later, he did the same thing to a buddy of mine. i'll let him tell that story...it's even more unbelievable than mine.

at least he's finally attempting to make a poling skiff. i always found it comical that he put poling platforms on those $40-60K scooters he's been making.


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## hand (Nov 1, 2006)

That buddy would be me. 

I also paid up front for a platform for my HPX-T. Made an appointment 3 weeks in advance to drop the boat off. After the boat was there 2 weeks I called and it was still not ready. A couple of days later I went to pick it up and they did not build it they way I wanted it. Tim said this looks better. I have size 14 feet and I don't want a tiny step. I gave them pictures of another platform he built and all the dimensions of what I wanted and he still screwed it up. He said "well these little jobs are a pain".

2 days later I go back to pick up up and the fiberglass top is cracked in several places and the engine notch was gelcoated with a putty knife and never cleaned up. It really looked bad. I paid just shy of $1000 for the platform. 

After discussing the issue of the cracked top he told me "what do you expect for a thousand dollars". I was speechless, for the first time in my life!!

Proline will never see another dime of my money. Good luck with the Stilt. I hope he does better work on his own stuff than he does with other guys stuff.


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## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

Dang, that stinks. I was just curious about what the boat looked liked. I ain't got no dog in this fight.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

i haven't seen it, but i was told it's nothing special.

he said it was a longer (~20') and narrower (~5') skiff than the scooters NW currently makes. he said it's similar in design, but a little bigger than, the glades skiff but with a tiny little cockpit. the front deck looks like you are looking off the front end of an aircraft carrier because NW put that curlew style rod storage up front, but with the rods facing forward. only other significantly different feature is it has a tunnel, which means it's gonna draft more at rest than if it was completely flat across the bottom.

again, i haven't seen it and may be wrong, but if that's the case what's so history making about that? it's sounds like it's nothing more than glades skiff/ambush knockoff with a tunnel, tiny cockpit, and different rod storage.

meh...


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## schuyler (Aug 4, 2005)

Did he build that platform on your hpx-t? Other than the hassle with Clancy, do you like the platform? I just bought an hpx-t and had a platform built - I pick it up today. I think mine is very similar to yours - not hanging off the back of the boat over the motor, but also not low and in front of the motor. Mine is 33" tall with a notch in the back for the motor, and the back of it should be pretty much flush with the raised motor mount part of the transom. BTW do you live in Austin? Been getting a kick out of your posts.
Schuyler


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## bslittle79 (May 24, 2004)

Stuart,

I've seen the little model of the Stilt at the boat shows but thats about it. 

I will say I was a little upset when I saw Mr. Clancy finally building a true poling scooter. I thought the plug I'm working on was going to be the first technical poling scooter(to my knowledge at least). I guess I'll have to play second fiddle if I ever finish mine.

At least Mr. Clancy is 100% original and isn't in the business of knocking off existing boats. He gets full respect in my book. Too bad Ish and others didn't have satisfactory service with him.

BTW Stuart, you'll be able to afford mine, haha.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

sent u a PM, schuyler.


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## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

Congrates Schuyler on the new skiff...hope to see you soon in POC. Come by the compound. Watch out for this Ish guy he's got Salesman written all over him or are those just freckles?


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## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

As long as y'all have derailed my thread  How about Bruce Wild's boats. Looks like an overgrown canoe, but I bet that thing is skinny and stealthy. Looks tippy.

http://www.caller.com/photos/galleries/2009/jun/19/build--boat/22045/


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## wadespade (Mar 6, 2008)

he's trying to camo himself in with the specs.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

i was looking at/discussing the thing with trimble a while back. looks like a very neat little boat. it's basically the texas version of a gladesmen.

only downside i see to it is it takes awhile to get anywhere and thus, the range is limited.


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## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

Wouldn't want to cross any big water during bad weather or cross a Bertram's wake in it. Also must be some way to put a raised poling platform on it to help with Poler's visability. The new wave push towards stripped down to nothing poling skiffs looks like the future of saltwater sightfishing. These new craft appear to limit the number onboard (2) and are not so comfortable for the guide or his client but that's the old days...now days it's shut up and fish - cheap.


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## MUDFLAT (Jun 7, 2005)

Sorry to hear that some of you have had a problem with Tim. I am a very satisfied Curlew owner, that has found him more than accomodating, and stands strongly behind his work. In the past 31/2 yrs. he has gone out of his way to handle minor problems at no cost. I'm sure his skiff will function as well or better than any on the market.


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## ghillhouse (Jan 6, 2008)

Stilt...

http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=211780&highlight=stilt


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## Bruce J (Jun 27, 2004)

I've fished with Billy Trimble on his Big Easy skiff in the above link. It's 20-22 feet as a I recall and not much wider than a canoe. It floats in about 4" and is of course silent and stealthy. I didn't find it as tippy as it looks while on the bow, but I was fishing on a very calm day. It doesn't have a big front deck and you definitely want to be paying attention.

Since I fished with him on it I know he modified the back end to be a little more square and with harder chines. It would definitely be a cool boat for fishing areas like Light House Lakes or B&R Flats where you need to be skinny and don't need to cross much water to get to them.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

MUDFLAT said:


> In the past 31/2 yrs. he has gone out of his way to handle minor problems at no cost. I'm sure his skiff will function as well or better than any on the market.


after conning someone into paying $45K+ for scooter he SHOULD handle ALL problems at no cost.

just sayin'


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

Bruce J said:


> It doesn't have a big front deck and you definitely want to be paying attention.


that's cuz the designers knew what they were doing when it came to designing a poling skiff.

from a guide's point of view, putting a large/long/big/whatever front casting deck on a poling skiff is a mistake. it encourages the sport to walk around and make use of all the space. once you climb up on the poling platform and have some knucklehead walking all over the place you realize why HB, etc. put a small deck on the gladeskiff, etc.

not only does it make it easier to get knocked off the platform, but having someone walking around a narrow beam boat makes it rock all over the place. a poling skiff that is rocking back and forth spooks fish and defeats the purpose.

but that rod storage sure will be cool...


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## d-donaghue (Oct 30, 2007)

good point...


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## TailStalker (May 11, 2006)

Ish,

The glades-skiff has a short deck cause it was designed to have a tent pitched in the cockpit area for guys that wanted to sleep from in their skiff way back in the glades. 
I think it comes to choice because as an avid angler, designer, and lastly skiff builder cockpit space is wasted space. IMHO

Also it allows two anglers up front if going conventional or one angler w/fly to have an area to lay line in front,side, or behind...it's also easier for a newbie on a small skiff to be standing on the flat area of the hull rather than being forced to stand on the "V" portion or entry area of the skiff. Tippy is an opinion too...

Lastly, a guide can control his customers so I think that's also moot as well.
Just wanted others to see the other side of deck space. :O)

Kevin


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

TailStalker said:


> Ish,
> 
> The glades-skiff has a short deck cause it was designed to have a tent pitched in the cockpit area for guys that wanted to sleep from in their skiff way back in the glades.
> I think it comes to choice because as an avid angler, designer, and lastly skiff builder cockpit space is wasted space. IMHO
> ...


"control his customers..." that's awesome.

yeah, cuz you never hear a guide bit*ching about how all day he had to tell the sport to stop rocking the boat. no really, it never happens...

put two anglers on the bow of a gladesskiff and it'll be underwater. you build canoeskiffs...you should know this stuff.

pack a couple of coolers, extra gas cans, water, tent/camping gear, etc. in your boat and then tell me cockpit space is wasted space. course if you did run out of space, it would probably be fine sitting up on that monstrous casting deck running through the chop.

spin it however you want. not everybody buys marketing hype.


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## TailStalker (May 11, 2006)

I guess you never spent any time in our skiffs huh?
We all have choices in our mind and there's always a choice to be given. I've spoke my peace and you have yours. I can speak for other skiffs, only ours. Two guys up front on any of our skiffs and it will still be above water. :biggrin:

And yes we build a model that's a hybrid canoe but we also build three other models that are pure skiffs with two more on the way..maybe three more:wink:

And yes, there are those guides that ***** about the customer and there are those that don't...
Alot of our customers that are guides don't ***** as they do a pretty good job of getting to know about the customers needs/experience BEFORE they get on the skiff/book the trip...but again, to each his own.
Tight lines!
Kevin


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## TailStalker (May 11, 2006)

p.s. What's marketing hype when it's true? Where did I say or mention ANY marketing hype? I only stated MHO which lead into why we build our boats and give them the design/layout. Go back and re-read what I wrote...

Your post prior, to my first post, makes it sound that any builder that builds a skiff w/a big deck is clueless....

You wrote- "cuz the designers knew what they were doing when it came to designing a poling skiff. 

Relax ISH, go fish....realize different srtokes for different folks duude!


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

HOLY ****!!! no wonder you were so sensitive about the aircraft carrier front deck comment.

that's hilarious.



i've been on a couple of your boats. i like that little gladesmen, but i lost interest after i kept hearing service horror stories from my buddies in Orlando.



TailStalker said:


> You wrote- "cuz the designers knew what they were doing when it came to designing a poling skiff.


and i'll stand by that. HB designed great skiffs. you obviously agree cuz you're boats are very similar. some would say knockoffs.



TailStalker said:


> Relax ISH, go fish....realize different srtokes for different folks duude!


i'm not the one who got my panties in a bunch.


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## TailStalker (May 11, 2006)

Ish said:


> HOLY ****!!! no wonder you were so sensitive about the aircraft carrier front deck comment.
> 
> that's hilarious.
> 
> ...


Nor did I bro...you don't know we well enough but anytime your in Fl. please feel free to fish w/me 321.217.1086 and i'll take ya!

Here's another new skiff owner coming to your backyard that had "another" brand" and now has his air-craft carrier. LOL J/K


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## ghillhouse (Jan 6, 2008)

Ish said:


> HOLY ****!!! no wonder you were so sensitive about the aircraft carrier front deck comment.
> 
> that's hilarious.
> 
> ...


This is silly. Kevin, you make great boats, so please don't feel obliged to reply to this. Anyone who has spent a decent time fishing understands the trade-offs of storage room, deck space, live wells, center vs side consoles, not to mention beam, deadrise, draft, and size. I have my skiff for an extremely narrowly defined set of needs, and assume that anyone that berates another skiff enjoyed by others doesn't really understand the demands that skiff makers have to satisfy us and our particular intentions with their boats. Personally, there is no way in Hells Bay I am going to tent in a skiff overnight, but I can understand some better men than I who would. Until I find someone who can make a boat with a ton of storage that drafts in 3", has a tunnel and runs in 2", with a plenty of deadrise for the nasty stuff, but easy to pole into a wind, then I am stuck with making hard decisions about which boat to buy, and how to rig it. Thank goodness for companies like ECC who give us some great options.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

TS - what brand do i "soo strongly seem to support?" i don't recall supporting or promoting any brand, but if i'm wrong, please show me.

and PLEASE keep selling those skiffs to guys over here.


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## Bruce J (Jun 27, 2004)

Lots of sarcasm in here for what could and should be a friendly and useful discussion about boats. 

Any element of boat design has its advantages and disadvantages and that's one of the best things about variety and choice. I've fished on poling skiffs with big decks and small ones, flatter hulls and ones with more deadrise, tunnels or not, taller or shorter platforms, side or center consoles, etc. Any of us would choose our preferences differently for our own good reasons, and t's nice to have a wide choice of manufacturers and models.


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## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

Kev, did you run that Caimen with the E-Tec 30? Lots of folks curious about that motor.


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## TailStalker (May 11, 2006)

Wasn't that impressed...
Great hole-shot and I like the trim switch location but hated the tiller handle design and shifter.Mid-range was weak...

I also didn't get to run it long enough to do it justice. So, if another comes along hopefully I'll be able to run it longer.


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## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

I thought that was an interesting choice for someone who is squeezing every dime. I haven't priced the new smallest e-tecs but all the rest of the e-tecs are pricey


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## superflyguy (Jun 1, 2009)

Enjoying the discussion on skiffs. I also enjoy seeing Ish get schooled on something he thinks he knows sooooo much about and feels strongly that his way is the only way. I got in a discussion with him a week or so ago. He can't seem to understand that different people like different things; thus the reason for so many options within the industry. Regardless of the product being used (rods, reels, lines, boats, etc.), everyone has the option to buy what suits their needs best. Ish thinks we should all be using what he uses. Next time we all go to buy a fly fishing product, we don't need to research the product or test it, we just need to ask Ish what he would do. I got an idea...I think I'm going to make bracelets up for everyone that say WWID (what woudl ish do) and send them to everyone on this blog.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

fool, help me understand how i got schooled? every point i made was valid, and if it's not explain how.

where did i say that "(my) way is the only way?"

i simply put out my opinion. some like it, some don't. meh... that's what places like this exist for, to put opinions out there, to tell stories, and to banter with others. it's fun and that's why we come here (that, and to hear you whine).

where exactly did i say everyone needs to be using what i'm using? for that matter, what am i using? where was that stated?

bracelets are ghey, but don't let that stop you from making them.

so let's see it...bring the goods and answer the above questions because without being able to do that, all the drivel that fell out of your mouth and onto your keyboard is nothing more than _*opinion* _(which is fine, it's making me laugh). after you cry about me expressing mine, it's pretty ironic (and very funny) that you're doing the exact same thing you were snivelling about...opining.


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

stu, i was intrigued by that engine too. only downside i see to it is the weight (146-177 lbs.), the cost, and the fact that it's a 2 cylinder. 

unfortunately there aren't really many choices out there anymore that weigh much (if any) less.

the best one i ever saw was the old (discontinued) 30 hp 2s yamaha i had. 3 cylinder (read torquey) and it only weighed 132 lbs.


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## Salty Dog (Jan 29, 2005)

I have a great solution to folks walking around on the front deck. I tell 'em anyone who pitches me off the platform because they are being a bonehead will walk/swim back to the dock.


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