# Why I gave up on religion



## 76794p

In recent months I have gone through a phase where I started reading books by notable scientist and authors. I read_ Death by Black Hole and Other Cosmic Quandaries_ by Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson, _Under The Banner of Heaven _by Jon Krakauer and _Don't Believe Everything you Think_ By Thomas Kida. The first book is a collection of essays by Dr.Tyson which primarily discuss the creation of the Universe and life. The second book is about Mormonism, which is a sect of Christianity and the third one is about questioning what you believe. After reading these books, specifically the 1st and 3rd, something clicked.

What clicked was that what I have been taught about religion does not make sense. Everything from the idea of the earth being only 6,000 years old despite there being strong evidence for it being 4.5 Billion years old to the idea that humans suddenly appeared and did not evolve from anything thing. Also everything in between. Also there being little to no hard evidence proving the existence of a God made me question my religion, such as the lack of a body of Jesus and other things. Then another thing went off in my mind.

That other thing is if God is all loving and forgiving, why does he **** people to hell for eternity if they do something wrong? If I live a life full of sin and vice The bible says I will be damned to Hell, but it also says Jesus die for my sins and I should be forgiven and go to Heaven. The bible contradicts itself. This was my tipping point that pushed me over the edge to becoming an agnostic/ atheist.

The final thing that caused me to give up on religion is history. Religion claims to be all about peace, but in reality it is not. The Crusades killed tens of thousands of people, which were done in the name of God by the Catholic church. Also churches, specifically the Catholic church, during the 15 and 1600's killed people that disagreed with them. Examples of this include scientist saying the Earth was not the center of the Universe, let alone the center of the Galaxy. This was no more peaceful than the Invasion of Iraq in 2003.

In closing, religion has innumerable flaws, facts that don't add up and is filled with hypocrisy. I am not completely ruling out the existence of a deity, or a God. If I am presented with evidence accepted by the scientific community that proves that there is a some sort of higher power, then I will believe. However, until then, I will be an agnostic.

Please message me if you want to discuss this with me. Just because I an not religious does not make me some horrible person. I am completely sane and a nice guy a good fisherman. I believe that one can live a rewarding and happy life with out the burden of a God on their back. Life a journey and it will be interesting where I go in life by living this way.

To quote the late, great Carl Sagan,"Extraordinary claims, require extraordinary evidence."


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## Seeker

Be careful with self.. He is your worst enemy. I don't practice religion either, but I do have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ himself. I call it "Faith". And that's all I have for hope. Nobody said being a Christian is easy.. just worth it. Pick up a bible and read it through from front page to last. Pay close attention to the Gospels and then make up your mind. Good luck on your adventure. Jesus tends to get your attention when it's time. Lol.. trust me.. in due time. Science was created and is flawed by man. God is, was, and always will be.


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## frank n texas

Interesting to see that at the ripe old age of 19 you have figured out all of life's mysteries....

:biggrin:


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## Fish&Chips

I've been where you're at. I wanted to keep living in sin and tried to convince myself of the same thing. But there was something deep inside that would not allow me to continue on that road of self destruction. Yes I gave up on man-made religion, but I could never give up on Jesus Christ. The absence of Jesus' body just proves that the bible is accurate.


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## Joey2

I attend Nassau Bay Baptist Church. The Church is located across the street from NASA in Houston, Texas. We have several members that are scientist for NASA that believe in God. I really enjoy listening to them and their debate over creation and evolution it gets deeper than I can understand. I do know evolution has never been proven. The Bible is only place that states the creation of the world. Why do we believe George Washington was president? Do we have eye witnesses? Do we have any documents signed by him? We only have what people have told us about him but we still believe he existed. You have a lot of searching ahead of you. Good luck in your quest. Look honestly for the truth and you will find it.

God Bless!


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## michaelbaranowski

Why can't "Creation and Evolution" be combined? I believe in Jesus/Moses/Muhammad/Buddha, etc (a superior being) but have seen how things (animals, insects, plants) can change thru breeding. So I believe that this superior being created but has changed over time. I also have a feeling that "god/Moses/Muhammad/Budda" might even me the some person.

I know that some people say that earth is only 6,000 years old but when is there a chance that times in literature not 365 days like we think today. But might be just spoken in general and a year might be 100,000 or million days.


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## tngbmt

i wouldn't suggest reading the bible .. it's old, symbols and messages are so hidden that after 2000 years, scholars still are trying to comprehend its meaning. god gives every person the free will to choose a path .. a plant has no free will, if there is a drought, a fire .. it can't up root and run from danger. god didn't give animals a conscience so survival is its only way of life. ever seen a cat looking at a beautiful goldfish that jumped out of the tank? its only thought, snack? can a dog see the beautiful garden you've toil and sweat and proud to display when it digs it all up looking for the bone it left there last month? you however was part of creation that have everything these animals and plants didn't get in line for... and that part is what religion calls .. in God's image.

shall i continue?


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## WillieT

It is really nice to see a young person that has a spiritual interest. I can see by your questions that you are confused right now, but because you are concerned about how you feel about religion shows me that you have a spiritual need. When I have a little more time, I will get back to you with some things that will hopefully answer some questions. Some of the things you stated are just not true, but are taught by many religions. I too, had many questions several years ago, and yes, there is a tremendous amount of hypocrisy in religion.


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## 76794p

The bible was written by man, or more specifically several men over a period of 1,600 years. Science, unlike the bible is continually changing and we are learning more about the universe every year. We have discovered that the universe has a lifespan of several hundred billion to several trillion years. Also that the majority of the universe is made up of dark matter and energy. 

I have given up on all Abrahamic religions. I am willing to consider Buddhism. 

The idea that one day in gods time is equal to more than one day in our time is illogical. A day is a day. The bible was written by men that knew a day as a period of 24 hours, so when they said day, they meant a period of 24 hours. 


To quote Dr. Tyson "God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance"


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## Stumpgrinder

Faith. You either have it or you do not. 

If you have faith you won't ask for proof. The God I trust and believe in trumps all the scientists and philosophers you will ever quote.


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## Fish&Chips

Good luck on life's journey young man. I'm sure there are people praying for you. Don't worry, one day when life throws you a curve ball, God will be there for you. No matter how much you have distanced yourself from him, he will be there for you.


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## Saltwater Boy(1)

76794p said:


> In recent months I have gone through a phase where I started reading books by notable scientist and authors. I read_ Death by Black Hole and Other Cosmic Quandaries_ by Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson, _Under The Banner of Heaven _by Jon Krakauer and _Don't Believe Everything you Think_ By Thomas Kida. The first book is a collection of essays by Dr.Tyson which primarily discuss the creation of the Universe and life. The second book is about Mormonism, which is a sect of Christianity and the third one is about questioning what you believe. After reading these books, specifically the 1st and 3rd, something clicked.
> 
> What clicked was that what I have been taught about religion does not make sense. Everything from the idea of the earth being only 6,000 years old despite there being strong evidence for it being 4.5 Billion years old to the idea that humans suddenly appeared and did not evolve from anything thing. Also everything in between. Also there being little to no hard evidence proving the existence of a God made me question my religion, such as the lack of a body of Jesus and other things. Then another thing went off in my mind.
> 
> That other thing is if God is all loving and forgiving, why does he **** people to hell for eternity if they do something wrong? If I live a life full of sin and vice The bible says I will be damned to Hell, but it also says Jesus die for my sins and I should be forgiven and go to Heaven. The bible contradicts itself. This was my tipping point that pushed me over the edge to becoming an agnostic/ atheist.
> 
> The final thing that caused me to give up on religion is history. Religion claims to be all about peace, but in reality it is not. The Crusades killed tens of thousands of people, which were done in the name of God by the Catholic church. Also churches, specifically the Catholic church, during the 15 and 1600's killed people that disagreed with them. Examples of this include scientist saying the Earth was not the center of the Universe, let alone the center of the Galaxy. This was no more peaceful than the Invasion of Iraq in 2003.
> 
> In closing, religion has innumerable flaws, facts that don't add up and is filled with hypocrisy. I am not completely ruling out the existence of a deity, or a God. If I am presented with evidence accepted by the scientific community  that proves that there is a some sort of higher power, then I will believe. However, until then, I will be an agnostic.
> 
> Please message me if you want to discuss this with me. Just because I an not religious does not make me some horrible person. I am completely sane and a nice guy a good fisherman. I believe that one can live a rewarding and happy life with out the burden of a God on their back. Life a journey and it will be interesting where I go in life by living this way.
> 
> To quote the late, great Carl Sagan,"Extraordinary claims, require extraordinary evidence."


Ah yes, famous books by "Dr.s" who have proof of the here and now based on "evidence" solid concrete substance and no hocus pocus.

Excuse me while I lol. It amazes me how these "doctors" base every theory and conclusion on visible proof. Yet how many have been to the hereafter to "SEE" that nothing waits beyond the last breath?

Blows my mind.....

I commend you for "testing your faith" if you will. By all means step out and see what the world has to offer. The bible covers that adventure as well. The cool part is the ending where the father still loves/accepts the son back to his place at home.

Do not listen to people saying "You will not ask for proof if you have faith" You need to explore, you need to see. Do not be in "religion" blindly. Know what you believe and why you believe it. Your heart will always crave the Lord. Mine did, one day we will all be brought back to his grace.

It is so funny that no matter what path we chose it all leads back to him.

Let me address this claim....



> The final thing that caused me to give up on religion is history. Religion claims to be all about peace, but in reality it is not. The Crusades killed tens of thousands of people, which were done in the name of God by the Catholic church. Also churches, specifically the Catholic church, during the 15 and 1600's killed people that disagreed with them. Examples of this include scientist saying the Earth was not the center of the Universe, let alone the center of the Galaxy. This was no more peaceful than the Invasion of Iraq in 2003.


PEOPLE ARE STUPID, lol.

Every race/religion/everything has their stupids.

The only thing that bothers me about this ENTIRE thread is that Dumb word "RELIGION"

Son, religion is a 4 letter word as far as I am concerned. You could be baptist/pentecost/mormon/muslim.... If you do not have a relationship with God, then it does not matter what badge you wear.

It isn't about religion, it's about relationship. In a way I am so glad you are done with "religion", because that won't get you into heaven any quicker than a passport lol.


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## tngbmt

the bible is a collection of answers to questions man have asked about man kind for thousands of years. if you collect all the scientific books, essays & theories into a 'scientific book of knowledge' since fire was discovered what would you expect to get? (flame on ) science is suppose to evolve and grow. science discard bad theories and embrace new ones, proven or not. yes, science has mistakes, good and bad scientists and wrong assumptions. trial and error is science. science change.
what hasn't changed since the beginning of recorded history is the love of a father for his children, the evil in a jealous brother. the bible wont solve linear equation, but it tells of the good in humanity. what mistakes did abraham, david, moses make and the results. which path did they take that i can apply today? do you assume that knowing right from wrong is genetically coded in us? if it was possible, would you be willing to give up your life so your sons and daughters could be saved? the human race? man makes mistakes .. the bible recorded those too.

funny u should consider buddhism since i'm reading thru a few articles on the subject .. have you sourced/research any original translations. i tend not to read the 'this is my politically correct view of why i think religion should be' from thinkers. we can make any religion sound sweet and worthy, alluring. it's the harsh truth that scares the timid away.


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## 98aggie77566

Stumpgrinder said:


> Faith. You either have it or you do not.
> 
> If you have faith you won't ask for proof. The God I trust and believe in trumps all the scientists and philosophers you will ever quote.


Amen bro!!

If the OP is looking for "scientific proof" that God exists, and Jesus is his only son...he won't find it.

Thus the reason it takes faith.


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## WillieT

A quick reply is look at the prophecies in the Bible. If you really study them you will see that things happened time after time just as were foretold in the Bible. How could that be, unless it was inspired by God. As for science, when science said that the world was flat the Bible said the world was round. Look how that turned out. Many years before the destruction of Jerusalem, the commander of the army that invaded Jerusalem was NAMED. Studying the prophecies really helped me to determine that the Bible was truly inspired by God. After studying the scriptures for several years, I can tell you that many things that are taught by most religions are false teachings. The thought of a truly loving God torturing people eternally is ridiculous. The scriptures are very clear. 

Romans 6:23 â€œThe wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord.â€ 
Ec 9:5 For the living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, Have you ever touched something hot, a stove top for instance? Did you know it? Sure you did. 

One more Ps 146: 3,4 ) Do not put YOUR trust in nobles, Nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. Â 4â€¯His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; In that day his thoughts do perish.
These scriptures show the true condition of the dead. Then there is the resurrection to look forward to.


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## sotexhookset

Stumpgrinder said:


> Faith. You either have it or you do not.
> 
> If you have faith you won't ask for proof. The God I trust and believe in trumps all the scientists and philosophers you will ever quote.


This.

76. No God then no "sins" then no worries. Go bang a barely legal hooker for me and tell me how it was. I can't as I'm married and do fear a sins consequence but youre good to go. Thank you in advance.


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## dan_wrider

Joey2 said:


> I attend Nassau Bay Baptist Church. The Church is located across the street from NASA in Houston, Texas. We have several members that are scientist for NASA that believe in God. I really enjoy listening to them and their debate over creation and evolution it gets deeper than I can understand. I do know evolution has never been proven. The Bible is only place that states the creation of the world. Why do we believe George Washington was president? Do we have eye witnesses? *Do we have any documents signed by him?* We only have what people have told us about him but we still believe he existed. You have a lot of searching ahead of you. Good luck in your quest. Look honestly for the truth and you will find it.
> 
> God Bless!


We have the Constitution. Just sayin.


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## WillieT

Many people are mislead for a variety of reasons and question the validity of a god or a religion. I completely understand. While I never questioned that there was a supreme being, I certainly questioned religion. There was just to much hypocrisy to give it a lot of thought. Too many people doing things that they should not be doing, including the religious leaders. I understand where he is coming from. Hopefully he will get some good guidance and draw the correct conclusions.


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## Fish&Chips

Saltwater Boy(1) said:


> *It isn't about religion, it's about relationship.* *In a way I am so glad you are done with "religion", because that won't get you into heaven any quicker than a passport lol*.


X2


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## Fish&Chips

michaelbaranowski said:


> Why can't "Creation and Evolution" be combined? I believe in Jesus/Moses/Muhammad/Buddha, etc (a superior being) but have seen how things (animals, insects, plants) can change thru breeding. So I believe that this superior being created but has changed over time. I also have a feeling that "god/Moses/Muhammad/Budda" might even me the some person.
> 
> I know that some people say that earth is only 6,000 years old but when is there a chance that times in literature not 365 days like we think today. But might be just spoken in general and a year might be 100,000 or million days.


All those characters are dead and in the grave but Jesus Christ is alive. Don't go by your feelings.


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## WillieT

michaelbaranowski said:


> I know that some people say that earth is only 6,000 years old but when is there a chance that times in literature not 365 days like we think today. But might be just spoken in general and a year might be 100,000 or million days.


I think the earth was created millions of years ago, long before man was created. A year for a day, a day for a year may be what you are referring to. God does not measure time like man does.


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## 76794p

The bible was not written by God!!! It was written by men. Men who are flawed just as we are. There are not any perfect documents in the world. Even the bible and the constitution have their flaws.


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## Saltwater Boy(1)

76794p said:


> The bible was not written by God!!! It was written by men. Men who are flawed just as we are. There are not any perfect documents in the world. Even the bible and the constitution have their flaws.


The bible was written by men who God USED to do so.


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## 76794p

The bible was not written by God!!! It was written by men. Men who are flawed just as we are. There are not any perfect documents in the world. Even the bible and the constitution have their flaws.


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## Saltwater Boy(1)

76794p said:


> The bible was not written by God!!! It was written by men. Men who are flawed just as we are. There are not any perfect documents in the world. Even the bible and the constitution have their flaws.


The bible was written by men who God USED to do so.


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## WillieT

76794p said:


> The bible was not written by God!!! It was written by men. Men who are flawed just as we are. There are not any perfect documents in the world. Even the bible and the constitution have their flaws.


The Bible was written by men, imperfect men just like you and me. But it was written under the INSPIRATION of God, as found in 2Timothy 3:16-17 â€¯All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17â€¯that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.

God told them what to write.


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## JayTray

*if proof is what you need...*

HE is risen.


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## pintail74

I am not a religious man, but in general - Judeo-Christian principles are admirable qualities that lead to success in life, regardless of whether you think the earth is 6000 years old or 4 billion. Believe and practice the principles if nothing else, and you'll find success in life.


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## bubbas kenner

76794p said:


> The bible was written by man, or more specifically several men over a period of 1,600 years. Science, unlike the bible is continually changing and we are learning more about the universe every year. We have discovered that the universe has a lifespan of several hundred billion to several trillion years. Also that the majority of the universe is made up of dark matter and energy.
> 
> I have given up on all Abrahamic religions. I am willing to consider Buddhism.
> 
> The idea that one day in gods time is equal to more than one day in our time is illogical. A day is a day. The bible was written by men that knew a day as a period of 24 hours, so when they said day, they meant a period of 24 hours.
> 
> To quote Dr. Tyson "God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance"


Who else do you want to trust if not the one and only God who did send His Son.Young man trust and obey for there is no other way.


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## WillieT

bubbas kenner said:


> Who else do you want to trust if not the one and only God who did send His Son.Young man trust and obey for there is no other way.


I agree, but you have to believe before you trust and obey. I appreciate the fact that he is reaching out to find the answers.


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## atcfisherman

When you see a painting, you know there is a painter.
When you see a building, you know there is a builder.
When you see creation, you know there is a creator.

Cause and effect theory states that every effect had an initial cause. If you don't believe in a creator, then what cause the initial "big bang?"

Also, one of the laws of mater is that it can't be created or destoryed, only transformed from one form to another. This is a basic physical law all through out the universe that has been noted. Therefore, where did all the matter come from if it wasn't created?

Be careful of following others ideas just because they are printed in a book. I challenge you to go to www.ICR.org and do some studies. You will find that many scientist admit that there are more scientific holes in the theory of evolution than the theory of creation.

Did you know that when Mt. St. Helens blew that many of the dating results were saying the newly formed rocks were millions of years old?

See below:
*The Lava Dome at Mount St Helens Debunks Dating Methods*

Radioisotope dating conveys an aura of reliability both to the general public and professional scientists. In most peopleâ€™s minds it is the best â€˜proofâ€™ for millions of years of Earth history. But is the method all itâ€™s cracked up to be? Can we really trust it? The lava dome at Mount St Helens provides a rare opportunity for putting radioisotope dating to the test.
*New lava dome*

In August of 1993, with geologist Dr Steven Austin and others from the Institute for Creation Research, I climbed into the crater of Mount St Helens to view the lava dome. It was one of those experiences that was well worth every exhausting moment! The dome (Geology of the Grand Canyon figure, shown in More and more wrong dates) looks like a small mountain, roughly 1.1 km (Â¾ mile) long and 350 m (1,100 ft) high. It sits directly over the volcanic vent at the south end of the huge horseshoe-shaped crater that was blasted out of the mountain by the spectacular eruption on 18 May 1980.1 From the crater, the dome appears as a huge steaming mound of dark, block-like rubble. It is made of dacite, a fine-grained volcanic rock that contains a sprinkling of larger, visible crystals, like chopped fruit in a cake.
Actually, the present lava dome at Mount St Helens is the third dome to form since the 1980 eruption, the previous two having been blasted away by the subsequent eruptions.
The current dome started growing after the volcanoâ€™s last explosive eruption on 17 October 1980. During 17 so-called dome-building eruptions, from 18 October 1980 to 26 October 1986, thick pasty lava oozed out of the volcanic vent like toothpaste from a tube.1
Dacite lava is too thick to flow very far, so it simply piled up around the vent, forming the mountain-like dome, which now plugs the volcanic orifice.
*How radioactive â€˜datingâ€™ really works*

Why does the lava dome provide an opportunity to test the accuracy of radioisotope dating? There are two reasons. First, radioisotope-dating methods are used on igneous rocksâ€"those formed from molten rock material. Dacite fits this bill. Fossil-bearing sedimentary rock cannot be directly dated radioisotopically. Second, and most importantly, we know exactly when the lava dome formed. This is one of the rare instances in which, to the question, â€˜Were you there?â€™ we can answer, â€™Yes, we were!â€™
The dating method Dr Austin used at Mount St Helens was the potassium-argon method, which is widely used in geological circles. It is based on the fact that potassium-40 (an isotope or â€˜varietyâ€™ of the element potassium) spontaneously â€˜decaysâ€™ into argon-40 (an isotope of the element argon).2 This process proceeds very slowly at a known rate, having a half-life for potassium-40 of 1.3 billion years.1 In other words, 1.0 g of potassium-40 would, in 1.3 billion years, theoretically decay to the point that only 0.5 g was left.
Contrary to what is generally believed, it is not just a matter of measuring the amount of potassium-40 and argon-40 in a volcanic rock sample of unknown age, and calculating a date. Unfortunately, before that can be done, we need to know the history of the rock. For example, we need to know how much â€˜daughterâ€™ was present in the rock when it formed. In most situations we donâ€™t know since we didnâ€™t measure it, so we need to make an assumptionâ€"a guess. It is routinely assumed that there was no argon initially. We also need to know whether potassium-40 or argon-40 have leaked into, or out of, the rock since it formed. Again, we do not know, so we need to make an assumption. It is routinely assumed that no leakage occurred. It is only after we have made these assumptions that we can calculate an â€˜ageâ€™ for the rock. And when this is done, the â€˜ageâ€™ of most rocks calculated in this way is usually very great, often millions of years. The Mount St Helens lava dome gives us the opportunity to check these assumptions, because we know it formed just a handful of years ago, between 1980 and 1986.
*The dating test*

In June of 1992, Dr Austin collected a 7-kg (15-lb) block of dacite from high on the lava dome. A portion of this sample was crushed and milled into a fine powder. Another piece was crushed and the various mineral crystals were carefully separated out.3 The â€˜whole rockâ€™ rock powder and four mineral concentrates were submitted for potassium-argon analysis to Geochron Laboratories of Cambridge, MAâ€"a high-quality, professional radioisotope-dating laboratory. The only information provided to the laboratory was that the samples came from dacite and that â€˜low argonâ€™ should be expected. The laboratory was not told that the specimen came from the lava dome at Mount St Helens and was only 10 years old.
The results of this analysis are shown in Table 1. What do we see? First and foremost that they are wrong. A correct answer would have been â€˜zero argonâ€™ indicating that the sample was too young to date by this method. Instead, the results ranged from 340,000 to 2.8 million years! Why? Obviously, the assumptions were wrong, and this invalidates the â€˜datingâ€™ method. Probably some argon-40 was incorporated into the rock initially, giving the appearance of great age. Note also that the results from the different samples of the same rock disagree with each other.
It is clear that radioisotope dating is not the â€˜gold standardâ€™ of dating methods, or â€˜proofâ€™ for millions of years of Earth history. When the method is tested on rocks of known age, it fails miserably. The lava dome at Mount St Helens is not a million years old! At the time of the test, it was only about 10 years old. In this case we were thereâ€"we know! How then can we accept radiometric-dating results on rocks of unknown age? This challenges those who promote the faith of radioisotope dating, especially when it contradicts the clear eyewitness chronology of the Word of God.
_Table 1. Potassium-argon â€˜agesâ€™ for whole rock and mineral concentrate samples from the lava dome at Mount St Helens (from Austin1_).
*Sample **Age / millions of years *1 Whole rock 0.35 Â± 0.05 2 Feldspar, etc. 0.34 Â± 0.06 3 Amphibole, etc. 0.9 Â± 0.2 4 Pyroxene, etc. 1.7 Â± 0.3 5 Pyroxene 2.8 Â± 0.6


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## big v

The only thing that will give you answers to your questions, is time. So in the meantime enjoy the things that are real and simple. A trout exploding on top water, a beautiful girl, good music, good friends, cold beer. Time spent arguing over something that cannot be proven is pointless and can ruin many friendships. Enjoy the time you have and the people you love and the rest will fall into place. Relax brother your 19, spend as much time around mother nature and keep you eyes and heart open for anything. You will probally go back and forth with your feelings around this subject many times before you land in balanced place that will allow you to feel content. Good luck


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## Saltwater Boy(1)

big v said:


> The only thing that will give you answers to your questions, is time. So in the meantime enjoy the things that are real and simple. A trout exploding on top water, a beautiful girl, good music, good friends, cold beer. Time spent arguing over something that cannot be proven is pointless and can ruin many friendships. Enjoy the time you have and the people you love and the rest will fall into place. Relax brother your 19, spend as much time around mother nature and keep you eyes and heart open for anything. You will probally go back and forth with your feelings around this subject many times before you land in balanced place that will allow you to feel content. Good luck


Best advice in the thread!


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## 76794p

Saltwater Boy(1) said:


> Best advice in the thread!


Brillant!!! Question, it seems like every thing christians do is for the afterlife. What are they so obsesssed with life after death and not enjoyinh the only one you will ever have?


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## WillieT

76794p said:


> Brillant!!! Question, it seems like every thing christians do is for the afterlife. What are they so obsesssed with life after death and not enjoyinh the only one you will ever have?


I can assure you that I am not obsessed with life after death. I know with all certainty what will happen. I try to enjoy my life to the fullest. I try to follow Bible principal and feel that is the best way of life for me. If I am wrong, I still feel like I will have led a better life.


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## Saltwater Boy(1)

76794p said:


> Brillant!!! Question, it seems like every thing christians do is for the afterlife. What are they so obsesssed with life after death and not enjoyinh the only one you will ever have?


Who says we do not enjoy life?

I fish, I party, I give back, and I receive....Life is lived full on my end.


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## KGLS

Itâ€™s about Karma and the Dharma brother. Understanding that there is such a thing as cause and effect for your actions and thoughts is the key. Accepting the truth in front of you and not simply having blind faith in an institution or person is mighty important. We all have the power of understanding. We are all in a life of suffering. No matter what belief you have, or none at all, know how lucky you are to have the ability to use your mind to make a choice in what you believe. Just remember to be kind, have no ill thoughts, and give yourself to other beings. I think that is a statement that any rational person on here could agree with.


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## Joey2

So glad we live in America!! We are free to choose, discuss our beliefs. Thanks to everyone who protects our freedom. Now lets go catch some fish!!


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## jmhall87

I was in your shoes before bro. I think it's a little bit of everything. I believe in God but the earth is literally 4.5 billion years old all the mt. St. Helens stuff doesn't cut it for me I find it oddly suspicious that those are the results from people who's entire purpose is to try to disprove science.


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## tngbmt

> When you see a painting, you know there is a painter.
> When you see a building, you know there is a builder.
> When you see creation, you know there is a creator.


i love it, someone who actually used the simplified teachings. i forgot the OP is only 19. i was there a while back, got the t-shirt too.


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## grassman

Watch out putting your beliefs in doctors. They said:

The earth used to be flat
Smoking used to be healthy
The sun rotated around the earth


But the Word of God remains True.


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## atcfisherman

grassman said:


> Watch out putting your beliefs in doctors. They said:
> 
> The earth used to be flat
> Smoking used to be healthy
> The sun rotated around the earth
> 
> But the Word of God remains True.


AMEN!!! The scriptures never say anything about what doctrine to follow. Doctrines are derived from men pulling certain scriptures out to justify their beliefs. We must take the entire bible from the first word in Genesis to the last word in Revelation as real doctrine and not try to use a few scriptures to build man made doctrines.

I am not a calvinst nor an arminanist, I'm a christian who strives to be Christ-like, be a follower of Jesus, a disciple of Jesus and to trust God's salvation through Jesus.

Anyway, good insight grassman!!


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## JFolm

76794p said:


> Brillant!!! Question, it seems like every thing christians do is for the afterlife. What are they so obsesssed with life after death and not enjoyinh the only one you will ever have?


I believe that if I live my life the right way, as my faith tells me is right. Then I will have a glorious life on the other side. Now, since I know what is in my future, it makes this short time on earth so much better and easier. I would be willing to bet me and you would taste the same drink differently.


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