# Tarpon Hook Recommendations



## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

Can any of those who have experience with tarpon recommend hooks for tarpon flies? It looks like some guys even tie on circle or kahle hooks, any opinion on that? 

I also see that a lot of guys tie further back on the hook. Is this in hopes that when they hook a fish the tippet won't be coming in contact with the fishes mouth i.e less chance of abrasion?


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## bd24 (Aug 24, 2016)

southpaw said:


> Can any of those who have experience with tarpon recommend hooks for tarpon flies? It looks like some guys even tie on circle or kahle hooks, any opinion on that?
> 
> I also see that a lot of guys tie further back on the hook. Is this in hopes that when they hook a fish the tippet won't be coming in contact with the fishes mouth i.e less chance of abrasion?


I use Tiemco 600SP hooks. A lot of guys swear by the Gamakatsu SC hooks, particularly the SC15 and SC17. Word on the street is Gamakatsu might break on you before a Tiemco does, but you will have more hook ups. Some say the point curls or isn't as sharp on a Tiemco. Pretty **** sharp to me.

A circle hook is meant to set itself, in tarpon fishing you usually feel the bite and try to "pop" him as soon as you can. I don't know many guys who tie on circles. I think it was a fad for a little while, but my theory is that circle hooks are for bait, not flies. At least when it comes to tarpon. A friend gave me a fly on a circle in Belize this past year, and the guide wanting me to put on something new. I pulled out the fly with the circle and he laughed and said he didn't like the hook. This is coming from a guy who fishes tarpon year round.

I was in Belize a few weeks ago, some fancy Florida dude was there and he broke a Gamakatsu hook on a fish that was under a hundred pounds.

Some people use Owner hooks, I have not.

I can't speak to your theory on tying further back on the hook. The Tiemco is a little longer hook shank so if you were going to attempt this, I would use the Tiemco. A fish is gonna swallow that fly however it sees fit, it is really just a matter of how lucky you get as to where it hits in his mouth when you set the hook. I don't see how tying the material less than half of an inch back would make much of a difference. The leader is still the same distance from the hook point no matter where you tie the material.

I will say I was in Cuba in June, and the guide cut the tails off every single bunny fly I threw. Granted we were fishing shallow clear water, so you wanted good presentation, but they also said the fish will miss the fly if the tail is too long. We caught fish on 600SP's.

Tie what you have confidence in, and then go out and use it. If you break one then you know it was quite a battle. Weird stuff happens in tarpon fishing.


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## jhare86 (Dec 8, 2007)

Tying further back on the hook came from days gone by when a snell knot was the preferred leader to hook knot. Don't think it has much purpose these days, I still do it for the classic look when tying bunny's. Believe this was tied on a 1/0 Gamakatsu SC15


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## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks for the input guys. I'll give the 600SP and SC15s a go, although I have had SC15s break on me before on redfish.


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## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

Not that I have ever caught a Tarpon on the fly, but I believe Gamakatsu makes a SC-15-2H that uses heavier wire like their SC-17. Their SL-12S looks good, too. I have tied with the Mustad C70SD and its said to be a Tarpon hook. The size 2 in that hook is way heavier than the Gamakatsu SC-15 in size 2. 

I have a pack of Tiemco 600SP. I guess if you are after the fish of a life time, the cost doesn't factor in. I have not tied with the hooks more that 2 or three times because it seems like such a waste to put them in front of any local redfish or jack to be lost on a reef or jetty. 

I wonder with the folks that have been through many tarpon would say where the lost fish get lost? Is it a bad hook, a busted tippet, unlucky or poor line management, a bad hookset, or none of the above? I've jumped 2, both on conventional tackle. My first one, a 4.5' fish, busted my 15# fluorocarbon leader on the second mind blowing leap. My second fish, a 3', leaped a dozen times, but never got loose. That fish went for a rapala suspending shad shaped plug and mangled the factory hooks pretty severely.


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## Permit Rat (May 13, 2014)

Back in my day, all tarpon flies were tied on an Eagle Claw 254-N, size 4/0. ("N" stands for "nickel plated") I would still use this hook, if I were still in the Keys, but here in Texas, where opportunities for tarpon are a lot fewer and farther between, the hook rusts too quickly for my likes....especially with the price of flies these days. As it was, I never sharpened the hook, until we actually used the fly. At that, if we wanted to change flies after a few hours, the hook would show a little surface rust at the point where I had sharpened it and had removed the plating. But it is a short shank hook, which means that the line of pull is into the fish's mouth and this hook will really dig in, no matter where it lands within.

Today I like my flies tied on Owner Aki hooks. They are still a short shank hook but do not rust nearly as badly. The barb is a lot smaller too, which is a good thing and doesn't hinder penetration, like a fuller barb might. The only problem with them is the much finer point. I still touch them up with a diamond board but triangulating the whole point, would leave almost nothing left....OR it would be so thin that it would be prone to curling.

For baby tarpon (2 to 30 lbs.) You could possibly use the Owner Flyliner series. These are light wire hooks , but should hold under the pressure of 7-8-9 wt. fly rods. The lighter wire diameter further enables penetration in the smaller tarpon, which are capable of actually being "moved," (toward the angler) when that angler sets the hook. (as opposed to the larger tarpon that are like setting the hook into a fence post. They do not move and thus receive the full power of the hookset, however much that may be.) The point still needs to be touched up a bit, with a diamond board. I confess to never having actually used these hooks yet, but I am going to try them, the next time I tie for smaller tarpon.

When sharpening hooks, I always triangulate, no matter how much or how little I am going to sharpen. But contrary to public opinion, I triangulate with the flat surface _on top_ of the point and have a cutting edge on the bottom. The reason is simple: If you have a cutting edge on top of the point, the hook can cut itself _OUT_ of the fish's mouth, just as easily as it cut itself in. This is especially important with tarpon, as often the hook only penetrates a thin layer of skin/sinew, before hitting solid bone.

OBTW.....at least back in the day, flies were tied with the materials more toward the rear of the hook, to hopefully prevent the wings from fouling around the hook itself, especially when wet. Accomplished casters don't normally have a problem with this, (LOL) unless buck fever comes into play when sight fishing.


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## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

Those Owner Aki hooks look nice. Run about half the price of the 600SP on the site I checked.


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## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks for all the great info guys. Once again Permit Rat, you are a wealth of great information. I'm going to have to check out those owner hooks. Interesting point about the shorter shank giving you a better hookset. 

Can you expand a little more on how you triangulate your hooks when you sharpen? I'm having a hard time visualizing what you're talking about when you say you do so with the flat surface on top of the point. 

Now to perfect my bimini twists!


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

I admit I don't tie many Tarpon flies any more...but if I did I would use the Owner Aki 5170-121 hook.

Check out this guy's study...not enough data points to be statistically valid, but its good enough for me.

http://www.fishermanscoast.com/jetsam/tarpon_hooks.html

Favorite Tarpon flies...and all I've ever needed to catch 'em: black death and cockroach...if they won't hit one of those or the other, you're probably wasting your time on that fish.


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## Permit Rat (May 13, 2014)

I can't think of when the triangulating technique was developed, but it is mentioned in Lefty's first printing of Fly _Fishing in Salt Waters_, dated 1972. I guess a lot of people took the photo to heart, because it shows a hook triangulated with a cutting edge UP and to this day, most people sharpen in this configuration. But I could swear that the text in the book, directs one to put the cutting edge on _"the same side as the bend."_ (or words to that effect) IMO the latter is what one wants and for the reasons I mentioned before.

But basically, if you take a hook point, its cross section would be a circle or at least an oval shaped configuration. The idea is to change that cross section into a triangle that has 3 sharp corners and a flat side on top where the barb is located. I have actually cut myself on the edges of big 9/0 triangulated marlin bait hooks, so those edges can be very sharp and that's what we want. With larger hooks, a fine bastard file can be used, but I use a small hook stone, like you could get for 10 cents in some tackle stores. Begin by holding the hook at approx. 40 degrees to the stone and grind down the side of the hook point. Then turn the hook over and repeat on the other side. Then hold the hook exactly upside down and grind the top of the point, where the barb is. YES, you are probably going to diminish the barb but like I said before, that can be a good thing, as a smaller barb is easier to penetrate tough skin.

The basic rule of thumb, is that the larger the hook, the more it can be triangulated. For most fly hooks, except billfish, it is usually desirable to triangulate just the very tip of the point. Sharpening too much can make a hook point that is too short and once that happens, you actually lose ease of penetration. Too long and thin and the point may curl.

One hook I forgot to mention, is a live bait hook, the Mustad 9175. This style of hook is the only hook I used as a guide when I had to use bait. I think it would make a very good tarpon hook as a fly as it is for tarpon using live bait. This is a forged hook and very very strong. I remember using it for kingfish and having to use a stinger hook attached with #5 wire. If the eye of the hook wasn't closed enough for such a small diameter wire, I had to find another hook, because it was impossible for me to close the eye of one of those hooks with pliers....they are that hard and strong. These hooks have excellent well supported points that can stand to be shortened a tad by sharpening. I have caught hundreds of tarpon with these hooks and never had a curled point that I know of.....or can remember... LOL.

Meadowlark, I wholeheartedly agree with your selection of tarpon flies. In the Keys however, you'd be obliged to add the Apte fly for the worm hatches and I would also add the Apte II, which is tied with brown furnace hackles and has a squirrel tail collar with a flame orange head. I think I was the first person to substitute squirrel tail for the natural brown bucktail in the cockroach as Cal originally tied it. In my tie, the fly sinks much better and is the go-to in the early Spring when the fish might be in the shallow channels (deeper water).


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

Here's a one minute video...technique I use and it works for me.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...0C1BC2691C1E41B8917C0C1BC2691C1E4&FORM=VRDGAR


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## Ish (Oct 30, 2008)

aki 1/0 or 2/0.


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## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks again for all the info fellas. 

PermitRat that makes a lot more sense now. Thank you for clarifying


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## Permit Rat (May 13, 2014)

bdd24.....funny you should mention Gamakatsu as a hook that breaks, as opposed to the Tiemco. I know a guide/commercial tyer in Florida who has stopped tying on Tiemco because of breakage.....I mean several hook breaks over a period of time, some on fish other than tarpon. There have been others with similar experiences.

Also, I don't exactly know why, but smaller flies are just about a necessity in the Keys and Caribbean for tarpon. Not so much around the Gulf coast, even in the clear waters around Homosassa, so the clear water shouldn't have much to do with this. Maybe it has something to do with fishing pressure but I don't know. Only once have I seen a tarpon "nip" a fly, where I could still see the fly after his mouth closed. Anyway, that is a possibility as to why your guide clipped the tails of your bunny flies.

You don't hear that about Mustad, Owner or Gamakatsu, although ANY hook can break, especially the stainless hooks, as they are much more brittle to begin with. But we don't use stainless for tarpon and the reasons are several, breakage being one of them and this is mostly due to the fact that very often, a hook has to hold with just the point alone, embedded in the fish's mouth. I submit that if it was more the norm to be able to set a hook in a tarpon up to the bend of the hook, that we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Personally, I don't like the Gama's, because their hook points are beaked...Not so much in the SC series but I am still leery of them. With some beaked hooks, you can put the hook on a flat surface and see that the point curls up and according to the line of pull, would simply skate across a hard surface, (such as the inside of a tarpon's mouth) and never really dig into it. That said, some beaked hooks have very long points that would be prone to curling. Sometimes the beak can be removed by sharpening and _sometimes_ you can end up with a very good looking and well supported hook point. My question to all this, is "why bother" when you can go out and buy the forged (very strong) Owner hook and not have to mess with it? Just my opinion. Bd24 is also very correct: Go with the hook you have confidence in. I just happen to have a little tarpon experience on all forms of tackle and these are my experiences and observations.

Karstopo, the reason we all lose so many tarpon on plugs, is because the force of setting the hook is now spread out over 6 or 9 hook points (meaning 2 or 3 treble hooks) instead of just the one point of a single hook fly or jig. It is nearly impossible, using light tackle, to get an effective hookset and the tarpon eventually throws the plug.............at least, that's what I tell my clients LOL!!!

PS.....Check these out.....just saw these: Mustad C68SNP-DT


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