# Reducing weight



## dstocker

I just finished my first rod.

it came out to weigh 3.66 oz(FTU 6'6" Blank, split eva grip, split Phenix reel seat)

I'm looking to reduce weight.

What is the consensus on lightest reel seat available? lightest non-micro guides?

I have double foot guides, switching to single foot guides would reduce weight. How much though?

any info would be helpful. 

Thanks guys!


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## TXFishSlayer

Fuji skeleton reel seat and torzite guides...


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## Swampland

The Phenix seat isn't the lightest seat available.


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## dstocker

thanks for the input

picked up the skeleton, going to give it a whirl


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## Fishsurfer

Get a food scale that can measure down to 1 gram. I like the Fuji SK seats. Depending on the nut they can be less than an ounce. Most of the weight is in the blank, then the reel seat, then the grips and last the guides. Different cork and foam grip types can vary greatly in weight. I believe the balance of the rod is more important than the weight. The weight should be decreased with the balance always being considered. You will have to "learn" how to cast a very light rod. The reel will also come into play, if you want it to be the lightest. What is the point of a light rod without a light reel. Anything under 4 oz in a rod is light, under 3 oz is superlight. With the right reel the total weight can be under 8 oz. (1/2 lbs). It may be more sensitive but will it cast the best it can in a rod of the same class? My incoherent 2 cents worth.


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## Speckled

The blank will weigh the most. Getting a lighter blank from the get-go is a starting point. Going from DF guides to SF guides will help. On casting rods, I still use DF guides for the stripper and the next guide or two, then go to the SF guides. Full or split grips will make a small difference, as will the reel seats. Guides, depending on the frame material and the ring material will also make a difference in weight. The size of the guides will also make a difference. A lot of factors come into play trying to get the overall weight down.

I have a set of Torzite guides and a very light blank waiting for me to get better at building :rotfl:.

Good luck and keep on building.


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## MikeK

It's hard to evaluate 3.66 oz without knowing the starting weight of the blank. With Fuji DPSM or ECSM seats, full length grips, and single foot guides I usually add about 2 ounces to the blank.

In addition to using the lightest possible reel seat, ream your grips to fit, use single foot guides, short guide wraps, and as little finish as possible. If you're really anorexic , skip winding checks, hook keepers, decorative threadwork and decals.


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## cfulbright

A IM-8 med-lite rod is where you need to start.

The lightest that still has great back bone that I have found is the High mod MHX 7' med-lite popping. I cut it down to 6'9" for most of my builds and end with a rod right around 2.5oz-2.8oz

Fuji SK seat trimmed barrel
custom made 3" rear grip, butt.
normal trim work and decal
Fuji guides-(don't have to be torzite or Ti but it helps) Rv stripper, 2-5.5mm(for spiral) KT, 6-4mm kt. If you do a bunch for double foots, or larger then 5mm runners then it probably needs to be Ti.


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## CroakerJO

We routinely see finished 7ft spinning rods under 3oz from our research builders. They are KR Concept rods using small Titanium TORZITE KL-H strippers, SK2 seats, smallish grips and are always built on POINT Blank rod blanks.


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## dstocker

My blank weight was 1.75 oz
New build same blank, i have switched to SF guides(except for the back stripper) and a cork split grip(from eva). 
SK2 split seat
I'm pretty sure the above changes will lower the finished weight. I will let yall know.


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## cfulbright

dstocker said:


> My blank weight was 1.75 oz
> New build same blank, i have switched to SF guides(except for the back stripper) and a cork split grip(from eva).
> SK2 split seat
> I'm pretty sure the above changes will lower the finished weight. I will let yall know.


The Med-lite high mod MHx cut to 6'9 is 1.1 or 1.2oz.


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## themadhunter

Let's see a pic of your first build! 


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## dstocker

I installed the split grip, and reel seat last night. I'm sitting at 3.03 oz without the guides,

the guides by themselves weighs .11 oz, so lighter but not where I want to be...


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## Speckled

dstocker said:


> I installed the split grip, and reel seat last night. I'm sitting at 3.03 oz without the guides,
> 
> the guides by themselves weighs .11 oz, so lighter but not where I want to be...


How light are you trying to build?

Lightest rod I've seen with my own eyes is a 7' MOAR rod from Sarge Rods. Weighed 2.6oz or 2.7oz. Not sure how much the blank weighes but it has to be pretty light. Fuji SK reel seat, EVA grips and Recoil guides. With my Core 50MG7 it weighes 9oz.


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## dstocker

*pics of build one and two*

Three of the pics are of the first build

the pic of the cork is the second build


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## capt.dru

Cork weighs more than eva. If you have eva, that should bring it down some.

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## dstocker

capt.dru,
I weighed both, cork was lighter than eva


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## cfulbright

I finished one last night... blank @6'9 was 1.2oz, finished weight 2.4oz with trim bands, fish measurement marks, 9 guides and decal.


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## dstocker

cfulbright,
I think that is my main issue, starting at 1.75 opposed to 1.2, more or less


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## cfulbright

Yup, you can plan on adding 1oz-1.4oz to what ever you start with. But remember weight on the butt end is not always a bad thing. You can make any rod "feel" light depending on butt weight and reel seat position.

Clint


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## capt.dru

dstocker said:


> capt.dru,
> I weighed both, cork was lighter than eva


Where are you getting your cork and what grade is it? Every cork handle i have weighed was heavier than eva.

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## MikeK

Regarding rod weights, the most recent ABU Garcia catalog lists weights for their rods.

Their top model (Fantasista) shows 4.2oz for a 7' medium power casting rod. It has split EVA grips, an ECSM type trigger seat, a short foregrip and Fuji Titanium/Alconite guides.

A mid range model (Veritas) shows 4.3oz for a 6' 6" medium casting rod. This one has split EVA grips, a 2-piece skeleton trigger seat, no foregrip, and Titanium alloy guides (no mfgr specified).


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## MikeK

To compare weights of grip materials, I made identical butt grips for a small spinning rod with Riley 6# polyurethane foam, 1/2" cork rings, and EVA. The dimensions were 5 3/4" length, 1 1/32" diameter and each was shaped to fit flush with the threaded end of a DPSM 17 reel seat. All were reamed to fit the blank which had a butt diameter about 0.4" (St. Croix 3S63MLXF).

Weights are grams . . .

Riley foam
as shaped 8.6
+ 2 thin coats sealing coats ProKote finish 10.9
+ 2 coats Lumiseal finish coats 12.1

Cork
as shaped 12.3
+ U40 Cork Seal 12.3

EVA
as shaped 11.0


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## Motocrossno2

Honestly weight isn't as big a deal as I've noticed, the best thing is to have a balanced rod. Micro guides help a lot in that aspect


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## Fishsurfer

The reason we build is to make something that you can't get at a store. Whether it be the weight, the weave, quality, conception or ideas of what might work better. I look at a $500 dollar rod at the store and they can't even get the guides on straight. I am at a cross road as are many of you. I have made light rods with very high end components and what I have gotten out of this is that I don't think the lightest will actually cast or fish better unless it has good balance also. Just keep trying new things till the end and find that "best" combination of components that work.


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## CroakerJO

The 6'9" Medium Light Point Blank weighs 1.58 oz. With 1 more oz for seat and guides you end up well below 3 oz. And you have good power with an RDA of 380 grams. Also noticed (I think) some rubberized or chopped cork trim on the EVA grips...that stuff is heavy.


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## katjim00

This is crazy. If you can't cast a rod all day that weighs 4 oz you need to do a lot more 12oz curl training


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## cfulbright

katjim00 said:


> This is crazy. If you can't cast a rod all day that weighs 4 oz you need to do a lot more 12oz curl training


Has nothing to do with that at all! Its all about sensitivity and balance weight is a byproduct. The less it weights the better the sensitivity.

Get you some Torzites, and a high-mod blank build you a rod around 2.5oz, 20-30# braid and it feels like a firecracker went off in your hand everytime a trout sneezes at your bait.

Of course this is all irrelevant if your a cork soaker, or fishing dead shrimp on the bottom.


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## katjim00

LOL....It was just a joke. I personally like to do 12oz curls of beer.

Everything is a give and take. I just built a rod for a guy that said it was the lightest rod he has fished with. He is 100% wrong. I know what he fishes with and they are considerably lighter than what I built. But mine is balanced very well. The blank alone started out at 2oz.

I for one know that I don't have to purchase the "best" of everything to build a high quality rod that is very sensitive and comfortable to fish with. I hope others that are new to this like myself know that as well.

Oh and I bass fish mostly. Sensitivity is needed more for that species than one that is swimming 20mph in an open bay and smacking the tar out of your lead head arty. And I wade fish, not often but enough to know the difference in the fish. 

Personal opinion of course.

No disrespect intended towards anyone....


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## Fishsurfer

cfulbright said:


> Has nothing to do with that at all! Its all about sensitivity and balance weight is a byproduct. The less it weights the better the sensitivity.
> 
> Get you some Torzites, and a high-mod blank build you a rod around 2.5oz, 20-30# braid and it feels like a firecracker went off in your hand everytime a trout sneezes at your bait.
> 
> Of course this is all irrelevant if your a cork soaker, or fishing dead shrimp on the bottom.


 X2. Weight is relative to sensitivity.


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## katjim00

Fishsurfer said:


> X2. Weight is relative to sensitivity.


Hold up now I have known some pretty weighty girls that were real sensitive:biggrin:


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## Fishsurfer

katjim00 said:


> Hold up now I have known some pretty weighty girls that were real sensitive:biggrin:


 Yep like this one.


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## katjim00

Hahahaha.....u know them to


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## TXFishSlayer

Hey there pretty lady! What's your name???!!!!

My old man still likes to tell the story of how one time when I was in high-school I came rolling in and asked him if I could borrow a few dollars to take a couple of girls out to eat. He got up from the couch to see who they were and when he came outside, he said that he could see the skid marks on the driveway from where the bottom of the car scraped as I pulled in. The door suddenly opened up and one of the girls stepped out. He still swears that the car lifted a good 4" - 6" inches she got out of the car, and that was only 1 of the 3 that night I had in the car.

Oh, the good ol' days, lol!


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## katjim00

ROFLMFAO......that was awesome


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## CroakerJO

Overall weight effects sensitivity (we all know what that is); speed (reaction time to bite signals and energy generated during the casting motion); recovery (the ability to snap back to rest with no wobble which increases accuracy and distance); fatigue (less weight requires less casting energy, less lure action energy and less "hold-it-all-day" energy. Generally, lighter blanks are stiffer which translates to more power per gram or rod "efficiency". And a stiffer, lighter rod moving faster transmits more power into the hook set.

Hi-Mod super light blanks are a completely different ball game. You literally need to retrain yourself when you start fishing them. Modify your casting motion (more distance with less backcast), your hook set motion (more speed less distance), and even lure presentation (more response from tiny rod movements). 

Balance is important, but 6oz is 6oz. You can't make it feel like 3oz no matter how good you are.


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## katjim00

Well I actually just weighed the rod last night I built for him. Came in at 5.3oz but it has a lot of acrylic in it so the weight is understandable. I know he fishes with rods that are under 4 easily. Sooooo perception is part of it. Your favorite lure catches more fish because of the confidence you have in it.

Croaker I like your hi mod explanation.


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## dstocker

I'm going to have the final weight this evening after I install the tip top.

I pretty confident that weight was reduced, not sure to what extent(probably half an ounce, more or less)

Thanks everybody for their input, and I will be sure to let everybody know the final result.


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## BigEgg

the blank is the heavy part. also think about your epoxy use. just goign to a skeleton grip will take down weight in plastic but also epoxy. also i wouldnt run ALL single foot guides. first and second guide i would run double foot. at least your stripper guide run double


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## capt.dru

All you need is a double foot stripper guide and the rest single. I build all my rods like this and have never had a problem.

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## Goags

When it finally comes down to it, the reel is the heaviest component. I've got no problem using acrylic, etc behind the seat, especially a mostly all acrylic butt piece. When in hand w/ reel included, it often "feels" lighter(better balanced). I do try to save weight forward of the seat, in my serious builds.


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## dstocker

3.17 is the final weight.


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## MikeK

You shaved 1/2 ounce. Good job!

When you get to fish the two rods side by side, let us know what differences you note and which one you prefer.


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## johnmyjohn

Goags said:


> When it finally comes down to it, the reel is the heaviest component. I've got no problem using acrylic, etc behind the seat, especially a mostly all acrylic butt piece. When in hand w/ reel included, it often "feels" lighter(better balanced). I do try to save weight forward of the seat, in my serious builds.


What he said on weight on the butt end. Man, what's everybody going to do if you're casting and fighting fish all day lol. Just joking guys, I build a rod for the function with the components needed and if comes out light its icing on the cake. I've noticed while fishing that any rod can be sensitive and a lighter rod tends to be more fragile. I'm talking about thinner walled blanks amplify manufactured flaws, two piece seats have twice the chance to come loose etc. don't take it personal, just my take on light weight. Congratulations on getting your fishing pole where you want it, that's the important part


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## dstocker

*Success*

Had to drop the boat back on the island on Sunday, and got a chance to fish for an hour. What better way to test it out than reds on top, rod performed great. Thanks for the info guys.


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## cfulbright

Beautiful reds! Thanks for the picture.


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## johnmyjohn

Now that's how you finish up a rod building post, good fish.


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