# fertilizing vegetable fall plants



## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

I have a raised bed garden that I got a late start on, and planted some seedling plants just a few weeks back. Got them at Maas nursery down in Kemah. I planted 3 brussel sprouts, 2 cauliflower, 2 cabbage, 2 types of khale and 3 lettuce plants. They are all doing OK, but don't seem to be growing much. 

Wondering if I need to fertilize them with something? Or did I just get such a late start they may not do well?


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## Yak a Tak (Apr 20, 2012)

If you just started the beds and used bagged soil I suspect you donâ€™t have enough microbiotic life established to promote root growth. All the fertilizer in the world wonâ€™t help if itâ€™s not being absorbed by the plantâ€™s roots. I suspect your small plants have small roots. Feed the soil...not the plant. Itâ€™s possible your nutrients are already too strong or your pH is off.


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

The bed was initially put in this past spring, and yes the soil needed some help. I have another thread on here related to that saga...

https://www.2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=2650767&page=3

A&M tested the soil and recommended 
Nitrogen: 1.4lbs N / 1000 sq. ft.
Phosphorus: 1.9lbs P2O5 / 1000 sq. ft.
Potassium: 2.5lbs K2O / 1000 sq. ft.

I did this a few months ago and also tilled in some Black Kow compost.

So how to establish the microbiotic life you mention?


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## Mattsfishin (Aug 23, 2009)

I use micro life on all my beds. It is expensive but well worth it. I usually buy it from the master gardener sales in january. They have been $6 to $10 a bag cheaper than anywhere else I have looked and I have looked at a lot of places.


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

Which microlife product, I see there are several?

If in fact my soil is lacking microbiotics, would the Microlife humates plus be the right one to add?

http://www.microlifefertilizer.com/...lifenew/product-sheets/3_MLHumatesPlus004.pdf


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## Muddskipper (Dec 29, 2004)

Green bag is the go to for micro life 

Humates are good...itâ€™s like compost...

Add some mulch, and it will help with moister, and break down and add carbon to the soil....


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## Mattsfishin (Aug 23, 2009)

The multi purpose in the green bag. I have never used the Humates. I buy a garden soil blend from a supplier down the road and add micro life to it. I built a block containment area and buy the soil by the yard. It is ok but mix in micro life and it really grow what I need.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

gm, 

Maybe I missed it but what did the soil test show about ph? Very important variable.

One thing that stands out to me (more like slaps me in the face , lol ) in your picture is the amount of barren soil....soil that could be growing "stuff" to improve your soil.

Yes, you can buy bags of stuff with fancy names that include words like microlife and haul it in and apply it....but you will have to do the same thing next year and over and over again. Gets very expensive and highly labor intensive. 

If you are just looking for temporary help you can buy it in bags as suggested, but if you are looking for a long term, efficient and effective soil building program that will be highly productive without the need for any artificial fertilizers, then you need to consider other approaches. 

I've been gardening in the same soil for over 40 years. It never is barren, ever. It is always growing something to not only feed me and my family and friends, but also to feed the soil. I try to add more in than I take out each year.

My current garden, shown below, has already produced several meals of kale and broccoli. Cabbage and cauliflower are coming right along. Notice the absence of barren soil. That's what I was talking about in that previous thread you mentioned. Year after year of soil building works!


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

PH was 7.7 when it was tested in July. Attached is the full report from A&M.


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## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

https://harvesttotable.com/vegetable-crop-soil-ph-tolerances/

That 7.7 pH is too high, according to this and some other things Iâ€™ve read, at least for many vegetables.


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## Muddskipper (Dec 29, 2004)

IT says it right there ... need more fertilizer

Compost will also act as a buffer while you get your acidity up


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

I should clarify, this was the test results from back in July. I did add the recommended amounts of the nitrate, phosphorous and potassium, so they should be at least close to OK now. I did not do anything to address the pH as the Agrilife extension did mention PH in their recommendations.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

I've seen higher ph levels and still be productive in the garden....but I've never seen a calcium level that high in garden soil. 

Looking back at your first picture, there is a lot of white looking stuff showing in your soil...consistent with that very high calcium level reading. Any idea where that may have come from?


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

I think that's just the picture/lighting, not really any white stuff when you see it in person.


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## CopanoCruisin (May 28, 2006)

Meadowlark, just curious as to what you plant for the,ground,cover.Tks........cC


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## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

Cereal Rye, isnâ€™t it? Or maybe heâ€™s changed things up. I think he does Field Peas, something along those lines, in warm weather and Cereal Rye in the cool season, but there might be something else or other trick up his sleeve. Letâ€™s see what Meadowlark says.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

CopanoCruisin said:


> Meadowlark, just curious as to what you plant for the,ground,cover.Tks........cC


I plant a mixture of legumes, small grains and root plants....

My fall/winter covers always include Elbon rye for nematode prevention; Austrian peas, crimson clover, vetch for N2 addition; Wheat, oats for soil building; Turnips and radishes for green manure production and selective eating through the season.

I like some of the deer planting mixes...but they normally don't include Elbon rye which I consider absolutely indispensable to nematode control and weed control.

Of course, that's all fall/winter and in summer/late spring I switch over to various cow peas...crowders, zippers, creams, black eyes, purple hulls etc etc. for their soil building and N2 addition.

I have cover crops growing continuously in my garden and have done so for many years. Very few weeds, virtually no insect damage, efficient crop rotation, and no need for artificial fertilizers are the benefits from this practice.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

CC, 

Not everyone has enough space to warrant buying whole bags of seed for cover crops and the deer food plots offer a cheap, convenient mix alternative. 

I like the "top notch" mixture but as noted earlier it does not have Elbon rye (has other rye grass) which is superior and not enough Turnips for my culinary tastes(love eating turnips) so I make my own mixture for the garden and for several deer food plots 

Whatever seed you don't use one year can be used the next if kept dry and in dark storage. This is far better, IMO, for garden soils, than other far more expensive alternatives.


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## gm (Jun 26, 2004)

Thanks ML. So, say you plant these cover crops in the fall/winter. Then before spring planting you just till the cover crop under?


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

My pleasure , gm. 

Yes, with one added step...along about late Feb. early March, I'll mow the cover with my mulching lawn mower to help with rapid assimilation of the green manure into the soil. By then, it will be three feet high, more in places. That step just makes it easier to then till it all under and prepare a terrific seed bed.


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## jm423 (Sep 18, 2011)

Second the motion to go with what ML says. Right now every square inch of my "fallow" garden (i.e. not planted in some specific edible) is planted with Elbon rye, Austrian winter peas, and hairy vetch. Got late start, vetch is only about 2-3" high but pulled couple plants and it is already nodulating. Never used the winter peas, curious what they are going to do. As to pH, most veg's seem to prefer 6-6.5 range. Might consider a light application of sulfur to start working the pH up


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