# Conclusion: Email From A Local Guide



## daparson (Dec 4, 2004)

For those who have not read the previous post - here is the link: http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=17858

*Ecclesiastes **12:13** Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: *

Well, at best it has been an interesting few days. It has been enlightening to read both the public and private responses to this thread. I also, as part of public disclosure, invited the guide who authored the Email(s) to read - and post to this thread. His response was, "I am sorry but I will not make the message board. And I hope you will understand. The email was for you. If you wanted 40 view points on it then you did the right thing by posting it. I think the Romans did this to someone in the past."

I thought it would be good to bring this thread to a conclusion by sharing my observations on this entire episode.

*Guides*

There are many wonderful guides - but there are some that simply don't get it. I have received several comments, both public and private, from Captain's who were embarrassed and outraged at the original email from this Guide. Many speculated who the Guide might be - all speculated one Guide in particular because of previous dust-ups - all were wrong. No one correctly guessed this man's identity. 

What I believe this guide doesn't get is that he does not have a "higher right" to a spot, a drift, or a patch of water because he is a guide. I truly believe there are some guides believe they "own" a spot and if someone else is there - be it another guide or fisherman - then their "Guide Rights" have been violated.

At the jetty - I have watched where and how particular guides have fished - and watched them effectively fish. And you can bet that if the conditions are favorable, next time out to the jetty, if someone isn't in that spot - I am going to try and fish it. One great way to learn is to watch how those that are better than you do it and emulate them. Where a guide goes and what he does is public domain - if you are just watching at a distance. This does not include following him - but just casual observation as you fish..

Now, please understand, it is wrong for any fisherman - guide or recreational fisherman - to "crowd" another boat or cut off his drift. There are times that anchors dislodge, winds shift, etc - but boating etiquette is something that all fishermen should pursue. 

If I am at that spot - anchored - and someone comes to say - "You are in my special spot!" - then he is in the wrong. That water, spot or jetty does not belong to him. Regardless of his being a guide or recreational fisherman.

Most guides understand this and have no problems with it. However, the man that emailed me does not grasp this concept.

*Posting on the Internet.*

In one of the Guides emails, it was said "If I put 12000 people around where you were fishing who would you email? If every fisherman in the Galveston Bay complex did what you are doing what would fishing be like in Galveston? It is not about me. It is about everyone that was run over today........."

My Response was: 

_"First of all - I don't think 12000 people read what I - or anyone else posts._

_Secondly - if 12000 came out there - they have just as much right to be there as you or I do._

_Thirdly - if 12000 people did read my posts - and wanted to go fishing - but didn't have a boat - perhaps they would hire you or some other guide. One way of thinking about this is that I could be contributing to you or other guides business! (smile)_

_Perhaps it isn't the amount of people that are out there - but the courtesy they show._

_I was at the jetty one day - a pretty miserable day - fishing a spot about 100 feet off the jetty. There wasn't another boat the length of the jetty - and that isn't hyperbole - there really wasn't. This guy flies up the jetty - throttles down about 100 yards away - and then putts up and anchors between us and the jetty. I kid you not! Frustrating? You bet. Rude? Without a doubt. Discourteous? Absolutely. But he had just as much right to be there as I did - even though we were first. It happens out there all the time._

_I think it has little to do with posts on a website - but more perhaps with the growing number of people fishing. Not just the Jetties - but all through the bay. I am sure as a guide you have had people cut through a drift - or fish some "secret spot" in the bay. That is just life! Nothing either of us can do or say is going to change that._

_I have been told there are about 9 miles of jetty - I think there is room for all of us. _

_Thanks again for listening."_

Again - the Jetty, Bays, Gulf and Public Boat Docs are public domain. I understand that a Guide may make his living fishing these waters - but they don't belong to Guides exclusively.

This would be like an 18 wheeler who earns his living making deliveries demanding that people stop sharing directions to destinations because more cars cause more traffic and make it more difficult for him to make deliveries! The road doesn't exclusively belong to the "Professional Driver" because he makes his living on it.

And finally, I will continue to post reports and pictures about my fishing adventures. They bring joy to me, those who I fish with, and many of you. And as I discover more ways to help others - new anchoring techniques - new ways to rig terminal tackle - how to deflate the air bladders of drum and reds to increase survival rate - I will pass them on.

*Conclusion:*

What I believe this all boils down to was a Guide that thought I was "bragging and flexing my muscles" by posting reports and pictures on the website. By doing this - it encouraged people to go fishing at the Jetties which made it more crowded and difficult for him to make his living as a guide.

I admit - I do enjoy posting the reports and pictures form the fishing trips. I enjoy the comments, the questions, and the people that make their way to my fishing blog. I think to some extent we all enjoy this. I also greatly enjoy reading other posts - looking at other pictures - and learning from their experiences. That is what this website is all about.

I don't make a penny off of my fishing. In fact - it has cost me money. I purchased several matching rods and reels so I would have the equipment just to take people out and put them on some Bull Reds or Big Nasty Drum. I so enjoy doing that - not for profit - but for the sheer enjoyment.

Whether or not that contributes to the "circus at the Jetties" - I don't know. Perhaps it does. But the circus was there long before me and will be long after all of us are gone.

Let me leave you with one final thought - and it was my closing words to the Guide with which I have been emailing these last few days. "_I do hope we meet one day - and if and when we do - you will be treated as a fellow fisherman - with true dignity and respect." _


Let me extend that same invitation to all of you. I would enjoy meeting each and every one of you &#8230; probably lined up on the jetty fishing. (smile) I appreciate your input, thoughts and insights. 


 Now - enough with this already - let's go fishing. 


Mark Redd


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## BPitcher (Aug 23, 2004)

Well put!


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## Free_loader (Nov 4, 2004)

Very well put .. thanks for providing us with a conclusion .. and i commend you for the manner you handled yourself in regards to his email .. alot of people i know would not have handled his email as politely as you did!!

however .. be aware that i'm gonna hit you up for a fishing trip next time i make that 14 hour drive to the gulf coast ;-)


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## boat_money (May 21, 2004)

i read the previous posts and i do agree with what you say... but let's say you and i fish together from time to time and i call you up with a hot tip on a hot spot. we go there and kill 'em. you went home and posted the exact location with your reports. the next day i go to hit my spot and it's stacked from all your other buddies. 

i know different situation, but similar in ways. i took a friend of a friend to my free duck hunting spot when in college. we killed some birds and next time i go there he and 2 other groups of guys he told are all over the spot with 3 sets of decoys out. no it wasn't my spot and it definitely wasn't a secret anymore. 

many people don't even share what system they were in anymore when they report. i remember getting the feeling that a certain group of guys that fished matagorda would all separately post about reports in e gorda that they were kiiling it so when the showed up in w gorda they'd have more room to fish. 

you're right about this situation, but thank you for not bringing the guide's name into this. if i find that window open in x-mas on a saturday and plan to come back on sunday, you won't hear my report about how great it was saturday until after sunday. and if you know x-mas the window is probably closed by the next saturday.

if you notice, most guys said what's the big deal, it's the jetty... that's no secret. start talking abou their gps coordinates on a uncrowded shoreline and then ask is it ok to post it up, or has the situation changed.

the information we share here can be powerful and we all walk that line(especially when we offer our opinions on what's the right thing to do).


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## Fishnut (May 21, 2004)

*You handled it well*

I also commend you for keeping a tight lip on who this guy is, even though it is bugging the #$%#^ out of me.. hwell: Sounds like you have this Bull Redfishing thing down out there. I have a little spot out there I use to produce some good reds myself but it's away from everybody. If this guide was worth his Salt he would have his own spots away from the crowd himself.

Boat Money - I think that is a totally different thing, all he has really been saying is that he was at the end of the jetties. Everyone knows about the jetties.

However I do always ask the people who I show new spots to, to please not put them on the web. That is one reason I rarely make a report except to say what bay system they where caught in. I learned (as well as others) not to do that in this forum because you can bet the farm that spot will be covered up the next weekend. Now I'm not opposed to taking someone to that said spot but.....


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## deke (Oct 5, 2004)

Boat Money I agree with you 100%. It is different than a good spot in the bay, thats why it doesn't bother mw to see vague locations. They aren't being rude just practical. There was a guy that use to post here that came from another board, he posted exact spots down to which side and areas of coves and times, tide, lures everything. I know some of you guys like that, me personally It ****** me off. He was posting about areas that I fish most often and put the time in to learn. He believed that it was no big deal, that they won't be there the next day. I don't know about you guys but I have been on fish in one spot for much longer than one day. Lets all remember here it's not just us reading this it's hundreds of people that don't contribute to the site but just want free info. I'm sure I'll get slammed for this but it's how I feel.

Fishnut, I have asked people to do that also, but they seem to "forget" about that part of the conversation. I just recently took a buddy to a spot that I had been keeping from him for many years, because of an instance with his mouth. He calls last night saying he's going back next weekend, am I going to fish next weekend because him and another person are going to go. I asked if he remembered our conversation and he said that this guy doesn't fish much it's no big deal. He is done, I'll never share anything with him again. I knew I shouldn't have taken him but I really wanted into that spot, the conditions were right and we were down there.


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## propdinger (May 27, 2004)

Well said, Mark.


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## Farmer Jim (May 21, 2004)

daparson said:


> Whether or not that contributes to the "circus at the Jetties" - I don't know. Perhaps it does. But the circus was there long before me and will be long after all of us are gone.
> Mark Redd


MARK, I agree with the others that you've handeled the exchanges very well. As for the "circus", well you can tell the guide he shudda been there yesteryear.

There aren't many around who remember the almost unbelievable trout runs at the jetties during the mid 70's, but those who do will vouch that today is nothing compared to then. Not only were there two years in a row with unbelievable fishing, but access was a snap with the launches and bait camps that were at the base of the south jetty back then.

As best I remember the two fantastic summers were 1975 and 1976 (I could be off by a year or two though). There were extremely wet summers and the bay system was almost fresh until fall both years. Specs stacked up at the jetties like you wouldn't believe. Catches of 50 to 100 two to five pound trout per boat were common (remember this was the 70's). Both jetties produced well, but the north jetty was the best and there were times that there were three solid rows of boats 50 feet apart from the boat cut to the end. I saw days when boats around the concrete ship were so packed together that there was less than 25 feet between boats. There were lines crossed, tangled anchor lines, boats drifting into each other, and several times I saw fish tangled in the lines of two or more boats. Never saw a fist fight, but I witnessed some of the darndest shouting matches you ever heard. Your guy just thinks he has seen a circus.


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## Bull Minnow (May 28, 2004)

*Daparson*

I will repeat what everyone else has said. Well done. I personally enjoy getting on here and reading everyone's reports. I am not a lurker trying to get everyones hot spots but I do get on here quite a bit. Due to the fact that my wife and I have a 6 month old baby, i don't have a lot of time to fish as of yet. If and when I go fishing I will post reports good or bad. I personally do not need to hear about gps coordinates and will not post exact locations, but I don't see anything wrong with your posts. Thanks for your reports. Just my 02.


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## Tail Chaser (May 24, 2004)

Well put Redd. I guess that's why you're the preacher and the rest of us ain't lol! My only concern is that this incident might make you think twice before posting reports again. Keep em coming buddy!


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## Bubba T. (May 27, 2004)

*mark, well said*

right on mark, i think you handled it well, but, remember this, now you have to reload.... remember the alamo, there are more guides coming everyday. lol

farmer jim, i know that was the 70's and digitals were not around, but i would love to see a still shot of all those boats at the jetties! maybe one from above, you know, airplane shot.

I often wonder how good fishing must of been back in the 30, 40, 50's in galveston bay. Only grand pa knows and he's gone now!


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

deke said:


> Boat Money I agree with you 100%. It is different than a good spot in the bay, thats why it doesn't bother mw to see vague locations. They aren't being rude just practical. There was a guy that use to post here that came from another board, he posted exact spots down to which side and areas of coves and times, tide, lures everything. I know some of you guys like that, me personally It ****** me off. He was posting about areas that I fish most often and put the time in to learn. He believed that it was no big deal, that they won't be there the next day. I don't know about you guys but I have been on fish in one spot for much longer than one day. Lets all remember here it's not just us reading this it's hundreds of people that don't contribute to the site but just want free info. I'm sure I'll get slammed for this but it's how I feel.
> 
> Fishnut, I have asked people to do that also, but they seem to "forget" about that part of the conversation. I just recently took a buddy to a spot that I had been keeping from him for many years, because of an instance with his mouth. He calls last night saying he's going back next weekend, am I going to fish next weekend because him and another person are going to go. I asked if he remembered our conversation and he said that this guy doesn't fish much it's no big deal. He is done, I'll never share anything with him again. I knew I shouldn't have taken him but I really wanted into that spot, the conditions were right and we were down there.


Typical honyok!!!!


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## boat_money (May 21, 2004)

honyok??


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## SEAHUNT186 (Dec 24, 2004)

What language is that redfishr? LOL!!


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Well said Brother DaParson. Fish on and keep posting...sure would have been nice to have been out at the jetties today...


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## daparson (Dec 4, 2004)

*Appreciation*

Fishermen - Fisherwomen - Guides and Guidettes!

Thanks for all the kind words and comments. To all the guides who chimed in - thanks for providing insight. I am jealous of your profession and I hope you not only put people on fish - but have both enjoyment and profit while doing so.

For the rest of us - I agree that would shouldn't be too specific with fishing locations - especially if you are beholden to whomever showed it to you.

For all of us - simply put - treat other fishermen the way you wish to be treated. Ok - so that isn't original with me - but still good material. Be courteous and practice good boating ettiquette.

Fish hard this weekend - but perhaps on Sunday Morning - leave the boat at home - head to church - it does us all a world of good! (smile)

Mark Redd


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## kenny (May 21, 2004)

Farmer Jim,
I remember the jetty wars of the late 60'and 70's. Great trout fishing and unbelievable crowds was the rule. If it had happened today there would have been bloodshed.

Do you remember Tuffy hiring the two guys to dynamite the channel to the bait camps?


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## finseeker (May 21, 2004)

*Howdy,*may the Good Lord guide and direct you and if he directs you toward the jetties and you catch a nice one,I would hope you will share it with us!*GBY*


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## Fishin-Inc (May 27, 2004)

*Redfish tourney*

I love this guy. Without rereading everyone posts again.
The redfish tourney was won there last year.
So why complain at all. It's a beyond well know, it's history in 
the making on every trip. Inc.


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## daparson (Dec 4, 2004)

*Agreement*



boat_money said:


> if you notice, most guys said what's the big deal, it's the jetty... that's no secret. start talking abou their gps coordinates on a uncrowded shoreline and then ask is it ok to post it up, or has the situation changed.
> 
> the information we share here can be powerful and we all walk that line(especially when we offer our opinions on what's the right thing to do).


 Boat Money - I agree about the GPS or Honey Holes - but keeping it general as to fishing at the North Jetty seems to be vague enough to pass muster. Also - I am aware of telling a person your spots and have them pass it along to their friends - who in tell pass it along - etc. I can see how one would have to be careful there.

But one question comes to mind: If I see a guide fishing a spot along the Jetty and take note of it. Not following - not spying - just see the guide there and move on to my spot. Am I in the wrong if I come back at a later date and fish that spot? (assuming someone isn't in it) And if successful - state that I was fishing the North Jetty with no mention of the spot?

Is that breaking some sort of etiquette I am not aware of?

Thanks for your insight.
Mark


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## hardheadkiller (Nov 18, 2004)

WELL DONE< You handled that a lot better then I would have. I have a lot of respect for you and appreciate all the great posts and pics u put up. I don't post often on this sight but skim through every now and then. Everytime I see one from daparsons I always stop and take a look. You're alright in my book , no matter what anyone else says about you. LOL. j/k. Great job and good luck.
-KRIS-


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## Walkin' Jack (May 20, 2004)

I would like to add my comments to those above. And I'd like to say that I think you are a class act. Your guide friend in here could take a lesson on the subject from you. He seems to be of the mind-set that only those who guide for a living have any rights at all and all of us recreational fishermen are wasting HIS resources and getting in the way of HIS business. 

To this nameless guide: People have been fishing in that, and other areas, for many, many years. You should have thought of that when you chose your occupation. We will continue to do so. If you don't like that, perhaps you should see about a NEW profession, one where you can tell every one what to do. I know lots of guides all up and down the coast. Not many suffer from your brand of arrogance. If you would like to come out in the open, shoot me a PM or e-mail and I will break it all down for you so that you will see how you look to 95% of the people fishing around you.


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## deke (Oct 5, 2004)

Redfishr, are you refering to me or the guy I was talking about?


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