# Update on CCA Tagged/Polygraph



## rpouledeau (Nov 3, 2004)

For those interested in how Steve Chavez' polygraph for the CCA tagged redfish turned out, here is an update. He was allowed a re-take of the poly using a different examiner. The examiner treated him much better than the first examiner and base line questions were more reasonable. After testing he felt positive he could now claim his prize. The examiner left him alone in the room and then returned to say he had another question...asked the question, then left again...returned later to say he had not passed. Again no reason given and no review. Steve is now out over $1500. for cost of transportation, cab fare and polygraph and they will not allow any further discussion...disqualified, end of story. Steve received a phone call from someone with CCA who did not clearly identify themselves to him. This person explained he was disqualified but, again, no reason. At the end of the phone call, Steve felt he was a criminal. A knowledgeable person on another website suggested we should consider the CCA "membership" of the other person in the boat at the time the fish was caught...and the price of tea in China is...?? Do all persons in the boat have to be registered ? If they suspect something, why not tell the guy. He entered the Star Tournament with good intentions, and assumed as anyone else, they would treat him the same..why not be up front with him...are they afraid he will take legal action. He knows by entering the tournament he forfeited all legal rights. Nonetheless, below is the "e" mail response from Bill Kinney of CCA to several folks here in the Valley. _Subject 
> RE: CCA Tagged Redfish 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guys,
> Please see the following statement from STAR Director Bill Kinney.
> 
> 
> 
> The polygraph test of Mr. Chavez was given in accordance with standard procedures by Boyd and Co., who has been the administrator for polygraph testing for CCA STAR for 19 years.
> 
> 
> We have offered Mr. Chavez the courtesy of a re-test, with a different examiner, as is our standard protocol. We had sincerely hoped that Mr. Chavez would pass his re-test, thereby meeting the rules which govern this tournament. As you know, the rules for the CCA STAR tournament are strictly enforced to protect the integrity of the tournament for all participants.
> 
> 
> Mr. Chavez did not pass his subsequent re-test. Therefore, the fish cannot be qualified as a winner. We have a legal responsibility that constrains us from saying anything more.
> 
> 
> Thanks for caring enough to inquire. Please feel free to pass this along to those who share your concern.
> 
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> 
> 
> Bill Kinney
> Director--CCA Texas STAR Tournament
> www.ccatexas.org
> [email protected]
> 713-626-4222
_Form your own conclusions...I guess they think he will try to take legal action. The way I see it, CCA bungled this from the start. They could have been more pro-active by dealing with Steve on a eye-to-eye level. As an entrant they invited to join their contest they owe him that much. Maybe they should just stick with Conservation and stay out of the lottery business. As a side note, the original comment had over 16,000 visits and 13 pages of comment before being blocked. CCA, are you listening ? Does the Star Tournament have anything to do with Conservation. Because an awful lot of folks think there is a problem with the Star Tournament...


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## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

*The answer is litigation*

Its unfortunate or maybe it is fortunate for Mr Chavez, but his only option at this juncture is litigation. I'll bet if there are as many people with ill feelings over CCA as there seems to be, he will have no problem acquiring funding assitance for legal counsel.

In defense of CCA, they must abide by the Tournament rules and their by-laws. They have no choice until a judge or their Directors order a change.


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## SSMike (Aug 15, 2005)

That's messed up.... Do people actually collect these prizes from CCA? Anyone know people who actually passed?


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## SSMike (Aug 15, 2005)

The other option is he is hidding something.... you never know. Those exams are reliable from what I have read....


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## Silverspoon (Jun 1, 2005)

Hmmm?


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## Mrschasintail (Dec 8, 2004)

Do you think the CCA just keeps all the boats and trucks for themselves? LOL

There are 2 sides to every story. Period.


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## FishinHippie (Jun 19, 2005)

a second exam by a different examiner... and the same result? 

Hmmmmm...


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## Javadrinker (Feb 13, 2008)

Silverspoon said:


> Hmmm?


yeppers..light on the butter please


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## SpeckReds (Sep 10, 2005)

Something is not right here.

I took a CCA polygraph test in 2005 from Boyd and company and passed just fine. We collected the $50,000 prize without any problems what so ever.
I was nervous also. And everyone that I know that has taken one was nervous and passed.

I also know several others that have caught winning fish over the last 7 or 8 years that also passed with no issue.
They won boats, boat and truck packages, and college scholarships. NO issues.

Not sure what the problem is here, but something is not right.

I feel bad for him if he did do everything right.

CCA is trying to give these prizes away. Not keep you from getting them.
But they also want to make sure that all rules and regulations we followed.


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## jeeper2 (Mar 24, 2008)

I am sure he was super-nervous and there is no way a valid test could be performed after what happened the first time. Sorry to hear this. Thank you for posting all of this story, I won't be sending CCA any money. What is the deal anyway? This tourney is like a forest conservation group holding a logging contest, with backhoes and chainsaws as prizes!!


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## Lat22 (Apr 7, 2005)

> a second exam by a different examiner... and the same result?
> 
> Hmmmmm...


Hmmmmmm indeed.


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## ANYBDYHERE (Mar 16, 2007)

Ive heard they are quite reliable....Im not pointing a finger..but com"on twice in a row...Hmmmmmm! Sumthin jus aint right!!....You might even say there might be sumthin " Fishy "............:rotfl:


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## Mudwhistle (Apr 29, 2008)

Now i wonder about the guy taking the exam. Like someone said though, 2 sides to every story.
Oh well i'm not lucky enough to catch a tagged red anyway. LOL


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## SargentMike (Apr 16, 2008)

Welcome to the Maury Povich show!!!!!!! Why is it when someone fails a polygraph they jump and blame someone else. There is that 1% they did tell the truth but then there is that 99% they didnt. Why blame the polygraph company? (the 1st and 2nd company)


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## Piledriver (May 23, 2007)

Well, as it was said "lawyer up" and stand his ground if he knows he caught a legal fish.

Something tells me if this went far enough, the courts would throw the use of polygraphs out the door for determining if someone "cheated" in any kind of tourney.

just to stir the pot a little

_United States v. Scheffer_, 523 U.S. 303 (1998). The United States Supreme Court examined the admissibility of polygraph results in court, stating: 
The contentions of respondent and the dissent not withstanding, there is simply no consensus that polygraph evidence is reliable. To this day, the scientific community remains extremely polarized about the reliability of polygraph techniques. Some studies have concluded that polygraph tests overall are accurate and reliable. See, e.g., S. Abrams, The Complete Polygraph Handbook 190-191 (1968) (reporting the overall accuracy rate from laboratory studies involving the common "control question technique" polygraph to be "in the range of 87 percent"). *Others have found that polygraph tests assess truthfulness significantly less accurately - that scientific field studies suggest the accuracy rate of the "control question technique" polygraph is "little better than could be obtained by the toss of a coin," that is, 50 percent. *
​


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## Mrschasintail (Dec 8, 2004)

Yeah, I guess the CCA could just stop this incentive too.


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## Bigwater (May 21, 2004)

SargentMike said:


> Welcome to the Maury Povich show!!!!!!!(the 1st and 2nd company)


SOOOO he really wasn't the father of the fish!??

Biggie


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## Fishtexx (Jun 29, 2004)

I smell something... I have taken and passed polygraph tests on 3 different occasions for fishing tournaments with thousands of dollars at stake each time. Nervous ?? Heck yea. Follow all the rules and tell all the truth, you will pass the test. PERIOD My 2c


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## z-cat (Jul 24, 2007)

Once again, if you have nothing to hide, or lie about, it's a simple test. I won a boat in 2006 for the biggest ling. Nervous as ever, sweating and all. Simple test, nice people admistering the test. No questions about drugs, booze, sexual preference or anything of the such. I am upset with CCA about their recent stance on red snapper, and probably won't renew my membership. That aside, the tournament and polygraph are fine. When you join the tournament, it is very clear that if you don't pass the polygraph, you don't get a prize. I doubt if there is a conspiracy of any sort, and I doubt if they don't want to give away the prizes as some people suggest. Just my opinion, based on my dealings with CCA.


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## Javadrinker (Feb 13, 2008)

jeeper2 said:


> This tourney is like a forest conservation group holding a logging contest, with backhoes and chainsaws as prizes!!


LOL ..good one


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## BIG PAPPA (Apr 1, 2008)

*makes me sick*

CCA has been and always will be Stand-up. I read on another site some issues and couldn't agree with the guy more. They have rules that must be followed. Heck, if you were lying and passed, you would get the package. The rule states "You Must Pass a Polygraph".They cannot and will not make ANY Exceptions period..CCA does not pay for these items and want them to be won. It creates more memberships and makes our organization stronger. I can't beleive ANYONE would Bash the strongest angling organization that Support our Children and their education to the EXTREME. CCA will not bad mouth or discuss issues such as this ever. especially on a chat type forum. Every Polygraph i've ever heard of is Filmed and i'd bet $1,000.00 the polygraphs the getleman took was indeed filmed with his permission. I'll get off my soap box and i understand CCA has NOT been involved with some issues we feel need their help but you can bet, they are looking into them and will act accordingly.But sometimes even the strongest organizations can't move fast enough to satisfy everyone.


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## Bayscout22 (Aug 9, 2007)

FishinHippie said:


> a second exam by a different examiner... and the same result?
> 
> Hmmmmm...


My thoughts exactly...


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## netboy (Dec 12, 2006)

Maybe Mr Chavez can chime in here and tell us what the issue is.


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## west bay chaser (May 3, 2005)

I don't have an opinion about the rules being followed or not. But I wonder if the second examiner worked for the same company (Boyd). If he did I would have serious doubt that the new test would be any different than the first. It would be a nightmare for CCA to see that the first test could have been wrong.


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## CoastalOutfitters (Aug 20, 2004)

the question that blows most people out is basically like "did you hook, fight and land the fish".........i am by no means saying this was the case, but many times a cork goes under and a rod gets picked up by person a and handed to person b


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## johnny a (Jun 10, 2006)

SSMike said:


> Those exams are reliable from what I have read....


I beg to differ. In Jan of 89 I was given a test from my employer at the time. The company was having alot of issue's with equipment getting stolen and they decided they were going to give everyone the test. Since my last name starts with A I was the first one to take it. I was a total nervous wreck when I sat down in the chair, every bad thing I had ever done all the way back to a teenager was going through my head. Upon completion of the test I returned to work where I was told I failed and that they no longer needed my services. Everyone knew who the thief was but the vice pres did not want to believe his brother was the guilty one. And once they got me they gave no one else the test. 6 months later I had to go and pick up some records and the vice pres came in with his head held low asking me to come back to work because he caught his brother with some of the stolen property that he was using to support his 1/2oz a day coke habit.

I might be alot of things but a thief I have never been.


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## Hooked Up (May 23, 2004)

> Those exams are reliable from what I have read....


 Uh,.....No, they most definitely are not. I've taken a few and the only one I ever "failed" was the one where I told the ABSOLUTE TRUTH in 1976. Never failed one after that. Nough said......., H/U


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## iridered2003 (Dec 12, 2005)

*same old song and dance*



rpouledeau said:


> For those interested in how Steve Chavez' polygraph for the CCA tagged redfish turned out, here is an update. He was allowed a re-take of the poly using a different examiner. The examiner treated him much better than the first examiner and base line questions were more reasonable. After testing he felt positive he could now claim his prize. The examiner left him alone in the room and then returned to say he had another question...asked the question, then left again...returned later to say he had not passed. Again no reason given and no review. Steve is now out over $1500. for cost of transportation, cab fare and polygraph and they will not allow any further discussion...disqualified, end of story. Steve received a phone call from someone with CCA who did not clearly identify themselves to him. This person explained he was disqualified but, again, no reason. At the end of the phone call, Steve felt he was a criminal. A knowledgeable person on another website suggested we should consider the CCA "membership" of the other person in the boat at the time the fish was caught...and the price of tea in China is...?? Do all persons in the boat have to be registered ? If they suspect something, why not tell the guy. He entered the Star Tournament with good intentions, and assumed as anyone else, they would treat him the same..why not be up front with him...are they afraid he will take legal action. He knows by entering the tournament he forfeited all legal rights. Nonetheless, below is the "e" mail response from Bill Kinney of CCA to several folks here in the Valley. _Subject _
> _> RE: CCA Tagged Redfish _
> _> _
> _> _
> ...


i will go back and rear this whole post later, but this is the same old song and dance. would anyone like to hear my story again? the CCA/STAR is not on the up and up! all of you that believe that they can't or will not screw someone have not been bent over by them yet. believe all you want, but don't come on this board crying like a baby when they burn you. remenber, you believe in the cca/star! sorry this guy got burned. i would like to talk to this guy. if anyone can get me intouch with him, please do so.


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## ANYBDYHERE (Mar 16, 2007)

iridered2003 said:


> i will go back and rear this whole post later, but this is the same old song and dance. would anyone like to hear my story again? the CCA/STAR is not on the up and up! all of you that believe that they can't or will not screw someone have not been bent over by them yet. believe all you want, but don't come on this board crying like a baby when they burn you. remenber, you believe in the cca/star! sorry this guy got burned. i would like to talk to this guy. if anyone can get me intouch with him, please do so.


Wouldnt we all.....


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## tufffish (May 11, 2006)

i have never taken a polygraph test but, i have heard that not all the questions pertain to catching the fish. is it true that there are questions about the lights on your boat and what other people in the boat may have caught and if any law was broken during the whole fishing trip,even if not by the guy that caught the fish, you fail. if this is correct he may be up and up and still fail the test. if anyone can give these answers it may shed a little light on the whole deal.


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## FishinHippie (Jun 19, 2005)

pass the butter please...


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## z-cat (Jul 24, 2007)

Simple questions (if I remember correctly) 

are the lights on in this room?
Did you catch the fish?
Did somebody else catch the fish, and give it to you?
Are you in Houston Tx. right now?
Have you ever lied in order to win a fishing tournament before?
Did anybody else in your boat catch the fish in question?
Have you ever lied to get yourself out of a situation? (I answered yes)
Do you live in the Valley?


Simple questions, simple answers. While I don't believe that polygraphs are foolproof, I feel that the questions, and the way the test is administered, should be no problem for somebody that is telling the truth.


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## wading_fool (May 3, 2005)

This guy didn't seem to have any problems with the Polygraph this year

http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=169882&highlight=CCA+Star

CCA isn't holding the STAR tournament to keep all the prizes for their sponsors, the more winners there are in the tournament the more exposure the sponsors get. The guy retested and failed the retest, why would it be a nightmare for CCA if he passed the second test after failing the first one. it would have been great if he passed the second test, I bet he feels he did nothing wrong, but something in the rules or something he did tripped him up.


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## Jason Slocum (Jul 9, 2004)

*Z-cat pass?*

Did you pass the test upon answering Have you ever lied to get yourself out of a situation? (I answered yes)? just courious. Thanks Jason Slocum


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## z-cat (Jul 24, 2007)

I answered yes, and yes I passed the test.


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

what happens to the boat and truck packages that are not won?


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

I'm sure they are not distributed. The boat and truck packages are not purchased by CCA. They are donated by the manufacturers and are given away when they are won. If they are not won then they are not distributed.


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## The Machine (Jun 4, 2007)

that ain't right


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## SkeeterRonnie (Aug 11, 2005)

i thought the fishing tournament buys insurance on the prizes, and the insurance pays the dealer the small cost for the prizes. so the tourney org. is out the insurance money either way.. does not matter to them if they give away the prizes, as they already paid the insurance fee. nothing to win or lose by having someone fail the poly. rules are rules- read them 3 times and follow them to a T. 2 failed attempts at the poly tells me something wasnt right(even reference in a previous post about another unregistered individual in the boat).... so who actually caught the fish???


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Skeeter, you may be right. I made assumption when I commented earlier. Machine, I meant that they are just not provided by the dealers when they aren't won, not that they are in the possession of CCA and not distributed.


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## baylvr (Jun 28, 2004)

Bigwater said:


> SOOOO he really wasn't the father of the fish!??
> 
> Biggie


Now that's funny right there!!

They gave him a chance and he failed again... end of story.


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

im still wondering what happens to the pakages.they are donated buy the manufacture so im sure they write them off but if nobody wins them then who gets them im sure its not the manufacture and ive never heard of them being sold after the tournement they only give a few away each year and after 19 years thats a lot of trucks and boats


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## wading_fool (May 3, 2005)

I am pretty sure its like SkeeterRonnie said, the tournament buys the insurance on the package price and if someone catches a tagged red the insurance pays to the sponsors the agreed upon price. The STAR is not like say the IFA that gives a boat away at every event, those boats are spoken for as there is always a winner and will be paid out. There are insurance companies that specialize in that sort of thing, a bass club I belonged to years back looked into giving away a boat from a dealer for a regional tournament we put on. The cost of the insurance is dependent on the value of the prize and how the prize is given away (odds it will be won). These packages are not sitting in CCA's possession and they just acrue them over the years, the sponsors probably put 2 or 3 packages together that travel around for advertising at various locations and are the first ones given out if someone wins. The rest are put together after you win them.


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

o


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## SpeckReds (Sep 10, 2005)

My son won the Starkids Sheepshead division in 2005 and I stated earlier in this thread I took and passed the polygraph test with no issues. 

What I know about the prizes.
The sponsors DONATE these prizes as write off. Donations/advertising

Houston Community Newspapers was the sponsor for the Starkids Sheepshead division that year. 
They paid for the $50,000 Scholarship that my son won. They buy an annuity based on the kids age when they win and when that kid will attend college. Thankyou again HCN.

They buy an annuity for $30k or so then it matures to $50k by the time the kid is old enough for college. That is why they give bigger money for the younger kids. It has longer to mature before it is used.

Now in most categories Trout, Flounder, ETC. You have a 1st through 5th winner. If 1st does not passed the test, then they move to the 2nd place finisher and so on until they have a passed test and declare a winner. They give all those boats and gift cards away accordingly

With the tagged redfish packages. The first 5 redfish caught and passed poly tests win Boats and trucks. The 2nd five just win boats.

If they only have 4 or 5 to pass the test they only give away that many packages. CCA does not get them, sell them, or profit in any way off packages not givin away. They simple are not donated. 
Ford and boat supplier simply do not donate those packages. There is NO conspiracy. THEY WANT TO GIVE THEM AWAY. It is great advertising. It is also a write off. 
You see Ford commercials all summer promoting CCA and the fact that Ford is giving away up to 5 trucks.

Unfortunately with that much money on the line people try to cheat. Not saying that is the case here, but I know people that have won CCA prizes and scholarships because the person that was in first tried to cheat the system and got caught. 
So CCA moved to the next person in line and they passed the test. Then won the prize.

It is hard to take if you believe you are in the right. But the rules state you must pass a polygraph test to win. For some reason this guy is not passing. Even after 2 tests. Something is not right. Innocent mistake resulting in disqualification or delibrate intent not sure.


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## great white fisherman (Jun 24, 2008)

We don,t no both sides of the story and we never will. Polygraphs are a good tool and sometimes they are wrong but not often. As far as nerves go the polygraph machine takes readings based on that and it becomes part of your base line. The polygraph does not have the same base line all the time. It is set by each person. That is the reason for the dum questions and some of the time running. I feel that since two tests where done by two different people highly qualified that there is more to this. He could be one of those few percent that got it wrong or maybe there is some things we will never know about. Since we don,t have the facts on eathier side I say lets just move on and say both sides are good people. I personally do not feel that CCA is trying to screw this guy in any way form or fashion. I am not a member and never have been. The rules state you must past the lie detector test. He has not end of story.


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## Cartman (Jun 18, 2008)

west bay chaser said:


> I don't have an opinion about the rules being followed or not. But I wonder if the second examiner worked for the same company (Boyd). If he did I would have serious doubt that the new test would be any different than the first. It would be a nightmare for CCA to see that the first test could have been wrong.


Exactly. Boyd would lose a lucrative contract and have a smear on their reputation because of the publicity of this incident. It would cost them a ton of business. C.Y.A. at its finest.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Oh, so it's a conspiracy after all cartman? You have proof of this or are you just blowing smoke? The rules are the rules are the rules! You sign up you must abide by the rules. Do they have to keep giving this guy a test until he passes? The rules state that you are eligible for a second test at your expense, so if he passes the second time then he gets the prize. Some of y'all are pretty funny with your conspiracy theories regarding CCA.


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## Cartman (Jun 18, 2008)

Pocboy said:


> Oh, so it's a conspiracy after all cartman? You have proof of this or are you just blowing smoke? The rules are the rules are the rules! You sign up you must abide by the rules. Do they have to keep giving this guy a test until he passes? The rules state that you are eligible for a second test at your expense, so if he passes the second time then he gets the prize. Some of y'all are pretty funny with your conspiracy theories regarding CCA.


I wish we could look back at the original thread. The guy was treated in a completely shoddy way by the first examiner. Imo, management covered his and their arses.

The declining membership in CCA is another conspiracy theory. Surely, their membership numbers haven't really plummeted lately.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

As stated earlier, there are two sides to this story and some guy coming in and saying his buddy was treated bad does not cut it for me. Also, STAR membership is up this year so there goes that theory as well.


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## skinnywater (May 26, 2004)

CoastalOutfitters said:


> the question that blows most people out is basically like "did you hook, fight and land the fish".........i am by no means saying this was the case, but many times a cork goes under and a rod gets picked up by person a and handed to person b


You said it all!!!!!!


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## Larry Pure (May 18, 2006)

*Open your eyes*

I cain't believe all this BS about failing the Polygraph. It is the same as the line breaking at the boat. The RULES clearly state that the fish is to be caught via the rules AND a POLYGRAPH PASSED to claim the prize. This tournament is designed to generate membership, more membership = more voting power to POLITICIANS. More voting power = beter bills from POLITICIANS = CONSERVATION. Its not important why Mr. Chavez has not passed the test, only that one of the qualifings rules was not meet. Would he sue the line manufacturer if it broke at the boat ? NO !!!! More prizes awarded = better
PR = more entrants next year = MORE CONSERVATION. I hope Mr. Chavez has better luck next fish, keep trying.


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## bleb (Mar 6, 2008)

*polygraph*

13% chance the test is wrong and if it is wrong once it may be wrong for the same reason a second time!!



Piledriver said:


> Well, as it was said "lawyer up" and stand his ground if he knows he caught a legal fish.
> 
> Something tells me if this went far enough, the courts would throw the use of polygraphs out the door for determining if someone "cheated" in any kind of tourney.
> 
> ...


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

I can't believe there are so many willing to possibly cut their own throat for a very remote chance to win a boat. I am not voting for or against cca at this point, but until I am comfortable that they support my position, I'll just have to eat all tagged redfish that I might catch.
I hope that peta is not aware of all of this as I am sure that they could get fishermen to sell themselves out for a dreamboat.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

goon, are you implying that fishermen are selling themselves out in this case? You say you are not voting against CCA but your opinion is very clear. Say whay you mean but don't try to hide your bias.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

Go to school boy until you can read. Let me clarify for you son. Until I make my descision, no one is getting my money reguardless of what they offer for a prize.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

You were perfectly clear on what your views are. you said that anyone who is entered in STAR is either cutting their own throat or selling themselves out. You did put your words in english so I was able to decipher them.


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## Hooked Up (May 23, 2004)

boomgoon said:


> I can't believe there are so many willing to possibly cut their own throat for a very remote chance to win a boat. I am not voting for or against cca at this point, but until I am comfortable that they support my position, I'll just have to eat all tagged redfish that I might catch.
> I hope that peta is not aware of all of this as I am sure that they could get fishermen to sell themselves out for a dreamboat.


 Good post Boom. I used to support them and actually looked forward to playing that lottery every year. I wont deny the fact that they have done some good things either. I am definitely more than a little put out over what they do now and I'll not prostitute myself for their new agendas. For now, if I catch one with a tag I'm gonna eat it and have a mount "tag and all" made for my wall. I wont discount the hard work that many good people have put into helping our resources under the guise of the "new and improve" GCCA but I do find it sad that in "truth" they have sold us out (IMHO) and are not the least bit ashamed of using "good" people to further their questionable aganda(s). Oh well, such is politics and that's ALL this is. Tight lines to "all" of you, Guy


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Here they come! It took a little longer than usual but they don't disappoint.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

And you are a freaking teacher? That explains a lot about kids today.

"I can't believe there are so many willing to *possibly *cut their own throat for a very remote chance to win a boat."

What I am saying for the teachers on the short bus, is to research the orgs that you donate to especially when they offer new boats. You are a freaking idiiot, and if you represent cca, you just clearly made my case.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Ok, you are backpedaling now and that's ok. I don't remember insulting you anywhere on my posts but if you need to resort to that to make you point then that is ok too.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

I call them like I see them teach. You were so quick to condem me that you didn't even read my post. 
Like I also said in my post, I am sure that peta could count on your support for a shiney nickel.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Ok, goon, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.


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## douglasgilbert (Feb 22, 2008)

Lie detectors are BS. You do not pass or fail. Results are subjective. I do not know how the CCA could possibly determine winners based on the results of a "lie detector". On the other hand I can not offer a possible solution. I suppose if I were the fisherman and caught the fish I would lawyerup and before it was over I would own the CCA.


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## swade36 (Jun 26, 2008)

Larry Pure said:


> I cain't believe all this BS about failing the Polygraph. It is the same as the line breaking at the boat. The RULES clearly state that the fish is to be caught via the rules AND a POLYGRAPH PASSED to claim the prize. This tournament is designed to generate membership, more membership = more voting power to POLITICIANS. More voting power = beter bills from POLITICIANS = CONSERVATION. Its not important why Mr. Chavez has not passed the test, only that one of the qualifings rules was not meet. Would he sue the line manufacturer if it broke at the boat ? NO !!!! More prizes awarded = better
> PR = more entrants next year = MORE CONSERVATION. I hope Mr. Chavez has better luck next fish, keep trying.


what percentage of people want to enter a tourney, knowing in advance, that they may have to "lawyer up", in order to win a prize? I'm not entirely certain that the majority of the people that fish the STAR know that they are becoming a "paying member" of a political organization. I first joined to enter the event! I didn't know where my money was going, but I thought it was to a good cause run by "like minded" people. I'm not sure what the goals are anymore. It's not PC to say you are against conservation. Conservation, to what degree? What are the methods, where are we going, how are we going to get there, will I like or approve of the end result? Conserve to the point that my kids can't do ANY of the things I did as a child? One thing is 100% clear to me....I don't want my STAR entry fee to be interpreted by ANY politician, as my stamp of approval, for policies I haven't heard or goals I haven't seen, or used as political leverage. Don't assume that the leadership of the GCCA is backing an issue and you will automatically get my vote.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

Disagree on what? cca or that you are an idiot? I will speak real slow for you boy, 
"I am not voting for or against cca at this point" I will make an INFORMED descision. That statement right there leaves you out. You don't get to change my words or have any input what so ever in my descision, for or against.
It appears that you are pushing for support of cca, am I right? What makes you think that attacking people is the way to get support? I gotta tell you teach, you have a lot to learn about recruiting members.


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## Pocboy (Aug 12, 2004)

Like I stated earlier sir, you opinion is obvious no matter how you try to disguise it. I also never claimed to be recruiting members for CCA, I was only commenting on your post. If you think that stating an opinion and backing it up is attacking people then your last post is an atom bomb. I'll continue to be civil with you but I don't hold any hope that I'll get the same in return.


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## TOM GRAHAM (Mar 15, 2006)

WHY DON'T WE PUT THIS THREAD ON HOLD FOR A WHILE. LETS SEE WHAT MR. CHAVEZ DOES. IF HE GETS A LAWYER AND GOES AFTER CCA, THEN WE CAN CONSIDER THAT AT LEAST HE FEELS LIKE HE WAS SCRE*ED OVER. IF HE QUIETLY GOES AWAY, THEN MAYBE HE KNOWS WHAT THE PROBLEM WITH THE TEST IS.

IF I FELT THAT I HAD WON $60,000 WORTH OF TRUCK AND BOAT FAIR AND SQUARE, I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT I WOULD HAVE RUSTY HARDIN BEATING ON THEIR DOOR.


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## DUKFVR (Aug 19, 2004)

I have no dog in this fight over the polygraph yet, but do in star & CCa. I feel CCA is going off base in their original goals. It has become like alot of other so called we are on your side conservation orgs. It is getting too big & too much money for the little guys like most of us,IMO. Been a member since it formed & now it takes 2 emails & 3 mo to get member cards for Star & alot of issues they are siding up with go against alot of the members or just one side of the membership speaks up. After the fiasco this year of getting my membership sorted out CCA is history with me.


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## GulfCoast02 (Feb 29, 2008)

labdog said:


> WHY DON'T WE PUT THIS THREAD ON HOLD FOR A WHILE. LETS SEE WHAT MR. CHAVEZ DOES. IF HE GETS A LAWYER AND GOES AFTER CCA, THEN WE CAN CONSIDER THAT AT LEAST HE FEELS LIKE HE WAS SCRE*ED OVER. IF HE QUIETLY GOES AWAY, THEN MAYBE HE KNOWS WHAT THE PROBLEM WITH THE TEST IS.
> 
> IF I FELT THAT I HAD WON $60,000 WORTH OF TRUCK AND BOAT FAIR AND SQUARE, I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT I WOULD HAVE RUSTY HARDIN BEATING ON THEIR DOOR.


I would probobly doo the same thing labdog,but they said he is already out 1500.$ and its not like he can apply for a court appointed here, so unless there is a lawyer out their willing to take the truck or boat as collection of payment, he may just have to cut his losses and charge this one to the game.


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