# Captains, a question on charter tipping etiquette



## gregv (May 23, 2004)

We have a group headed out of Freepot this month, and I would like a bit of advice on tipping (there will be at least one deck hand and the Captain). I heard (second hand from a freind who heard it from someone else) that it would be a good idea to tip the Captain in advance, and let him know what we would like to target, etc., etc. If this was the case, what about the deckhand? 2 seperate tips, a tip at the end of the trip, or would the Captain take care of the deckhand. Sorry for what might seem to be a silly question, but this will be the big climax for any offshore fishing any of us get to do this year. Thanks a million, and I really appreciate you input.
Greg


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## gregd (May 26, 2004)

hmmm, I'd talk to the Captain about what he plans on targetting and then ask about other possibilities in advance. I'm not a charter captain and I do believe in tipping when it has been earned but not beforehand!!


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## Tex_ (May 23, 2004)

Tipping before hand can be valueable when you are on a party boat with at least 20 other people and you want special attention. You can get it that way.

On a private charter with only 3 to 5 other fishermen aboard, I would not be tipping before hand. Both the capt. and the deck hand should be giving you their 100 percent from the start. If they're friendly and make the trip fun, I'm digging deep and usually tip a smaller amount to the deck hand if he warents it. Heck, I had situations where the captain sucked and the deck hand was great. The deck hand got the whole tip and vice versa when the captain was the good one. By the way, a tip from me starts at 15% of the charter price and goes up to 20% for outstanding service and down to 10% for so, so service.

I plan for it, and budget it into my trip cost. When I put together trips, I advise all particpants to plan for and expect to tip 15%.


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## SabineStalker (May 23, 2004)

Hmmm, I haven't thought about this one. But, the Charter Captain is getting a big chunk of change to begin with, normally at least $800.00 on a basic charter. I would tip the deckhand good, but Im not sure as to wether giving a big tip to the Captain or not. I would assume differently if it was a big charter service and the Captains weren't getting the whole price. When I chartered a boat a few years ago, the Captain got the whole Shabang. That was 800.00 pocketed, well, minus expenses. About $500 profit off of our trip, probably. Thats a lot of money for a day.


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## gregv (May 23, 2004)

*Thanks Fish Smart ;separate tips for Capt. and deck hand?*

We have 11 people on the charter, and I agree with your tippng critera; I don't mind one bit showing my appreciation to a job well done. A question though, should the captain and deckhand be tipped separately? Most of my charter experiece has been either on head boats, or on charters with no deckhand.
Thanks
Greg


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## Tex_ (May 23, 2004)

*Captain or Mate?*

Most captains pay their mate a small fee for the day and a percentage of the tips. Unless the mate (deckhand) was exceptional, I give it all to the captain and let him work the business with his employee.


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## BradP (May 24, 2004)

lol Tex, a % of tips....never heard of that on gulf or East cost. It all depends on situation, I have been on both ends of spectrum and gave my tips to both capt and crew seperately and after the trip was over not before. Paying before hand is not the best option, one never knows what is going to happen the rest of the trip and will prob not net you "better" service. They do this day in and day out, finding fish is what they do.

If the capt is for hire and is paid by the owner, a tip should be given to BOTH capt and mate. Since the capt and mate are both for hire, most likely both get a "salary" or if mate does not there is prob another arrangement made for mates costs to get to and from. one should give prob equal amt of tip to both in this case. All this varies on performance of trip of course.

If Capt is the owner, your charter fee is probably covering most (note most not all) of his regular expenses. In these cases if service was good give more tip to the mate if deserved because he is more than likely not receiving a trip salary from owner. This was the case for my trip in Cabo a few years back, the owner of the boat also capt hired a mate locally the morning of our trip I found out when speaking with him. 

This is only for offshore trips of course, and take it with a grain of salt because I am a bit bias.


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## SabineStalker (May 23, 2004)

BradP, you said pretty much what I wanted to say, but I screwed it up good. Man, the two little words "for Hire" wouldn't come to me.


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## Capt. Bruno (May 28, 2004)

I don't think the captain made off with $500 for the day. Don't forget the cost of boat ownership, insurance, docks fees, maintenance, etc. He either owns the boat and these cost are his or a good part of the funds will go to the owner. If you are used to chartering and not owning, it is easy to overlook this.


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## CHA CHING (May 21, 2004)

*Tip?*

OK guys, I am a charter Captain and here is my suggestion for what it's worth.
First of all, Sabine Stalker, obviously you don't own a boat?
$500 a day profit as you call it is not a lot of money on the Texas gulf coast.
When you consider all the operating expenses involved in owning and operating a charter boat. Insurance, tackle, boat slip, boat maintenance, licenses, bait, ice, fuel, and on and on a figured into that $500.00 a day.
I charter to try to regain some of the operating expenses of owning a boat or boats.
I would recommend telling the captain upfront what you expect. He will in turn tell you what you should expect based on sea conditions, departureport, and time. I can take customers out of Galveston 40-50 miles and put all the snapper and kings in the boat you want. However if you want to catch AJ's the run is a lot further and the customers will have less fishing time. I do explain this upfront and listen to there expectations. 
I had a customer last Friday catch a 75# wahoo along with limits of snapper, kings, a 30# warsaw, 4 amberjack, and 2 ling. My tip was less than 15%. 
Saturday I put a different group of guys on a limit of snapper that you wouldn't believe. They thought it was normal to catch snapper from 12 to 18 lbs. less than 30 miles offshore. We were throwing 10 pounders back. Trip cost was $1175.00 and I got $80.00 tip. That's about 7%. They also caught limits of kings, a ling a 3 amberjack. If I would have recieved that 7% upfront they would have never caught that many big snapper.
Be honest with your captain, tell him your intentions at the dock and he will work and do everything he can to make sure you catch fish and enjoy yourself. I do that every trip, just my nature. Most captains have large ego's and like to look good at the end of the day.
Hope I helped a little.

Good Fishing,

Capt. Jeff Gerrans


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## Sight Cast (May 24, 2004)

Jeff, I am not sure if I understood what you are trying to convey. You say in one sentence that if you would of recieved the 80$ tip they would not of caught that many snaps. A few later you say you bust your hump every trip out regardless. Would they of not caught that many snaps because of their luck, or your effort? Please clarify, thanks. P.S. PLEASE do not think I am stirring the pot cuz this is a good topic that I do not want to see go south. LOL.


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## SabineStalker (May 23, 2004)

Dang, whats that in my yard, can it be a boat, no 2 boats. Yep, I do own Boats as a matter of fact. Come on Jeff, if you go on say 3 charters a week, your making money buddy. Lowest cost is about $800.00 per trip thats $2400.00 for that week. That times 4 is almost 10,000 a month. I dont think he had near those expenses. I know there are slow times and all, but thats a lot of money. I know all about expenses, trust me, Im trying to repower with new outboards, just bought a bracket, did transom work and got rid of 2 i/o motors. I know costs at this point.. But, my captain ran a single new Yamaha 150 engine on a newer Cobia. We ran out to tall rock, whats that, about 30 miles. Thats not much fuel. I have old twins and make a 35 mile trip out and back on 65 gallons. I may have missed it by a little, but not a whole lot. How much of that $1175 went in your pocket?? Are you the owner and captain or Captain for hire. You may do long range trips, if you do then I may be wrong. I may take for granted the fact that I dont have boat notes, mine are paid for, I do pay insurance and Ice, Bait, fuel and such though. I wouldn't complain about an $80.00 tip when your getting $1200 to boot if your opreating your own boat, you set your own prices. Im sure there is a little added in there. I think everyone in this room knows expenses. 

P.S - Im curious as to the above post also..


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## Dunc (May 29, 2004)

WRONG WRONG WRONG. On a charter boat you tip the captain period. This is true on both coasts and the gulf as well as the carribean and pacific. 15% to the captain give or take depending on his attitude..not his ability to land you the monster of your dreams. Do not listen to some disgruntled mate or captain who is looking for $ from suckers because he chose a low paying profession(suck it up jackass, you made the choices in your life.) Think of it as a waiter/busboy relationship. You tip the waiter based on service and he/she in turn tips the busboy. Party boats are different, tip a deckhand in advance if you want "pronto" treatment, then tip the captain at the end. All the rest is pure BS.


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## BradP (May 24, 2004)

lol ok then all of the below is pure BS

"WRONG WRONG WRONG. On a charter boat you tip the captain period. This is true on both coasts and the gulf as well as the carribean and pacific. 15% to the captain give or take depending on his attitude..not his ability to land you the monster of your dreams. Do not listen to some disgruntled mate or captain who is looking for $ from suckers because he chose a low paying profession(suck it up jackass, you made the choices in your life.) Think of it as a waiter/busboy relationship. You tip the waiter based on service and he/she in turn tips the busboy. Party boats are different, tip a deckhand in advance if you want "pronto" treatment, then tip the captain at the end. All the rest is pure BS."


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## CHA CHING (May 21, 2004)

*Tip Again*

The $80.00 tip guys would have caught a limit of snapper but I wouldn't have let them sit there and catch 20 12 pound plus snapper of a hole that I built and make my living of off. Part of me busting my hump to catch them fish is spending a lot of time on the water either finding fish or spending the time to build my own reefs. I bust my *** every day on the water, fishing or not. 
As for expenses, the amount of money I charge for a charter trip comes no where close to cover the expenses of my boats. I do run 60-70 miles one way every trip. I burn a lot of fuel, rack up a lot of hours. My boats are both paid for, my insurance and $500 plus a month boat slip are real killers. 
I am not trying to be an *** but charter fishing is not a money making business if your running the distance I am every trip. I do it because I love it and like to see people catch fish. 
As for the guys who gave me the 7% tip, they were from Dallas and thought catching 20 15 # snapper was normal. After we had our snapper limit they asked if we were going to catch some big fish. lol
They just have no idea, but had a great time anyway.


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## Dunc (May 29, 2004)

BradP, I'm sorry to see they didn't teach you (the mate looking for suckers) the basics of capitalism when you earned your degree from A&M.


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## Outcast (May 20, 2004)

*Captain/Client Relationships*

If you had a better time than you expected whether it be the fish you caught or the treatment you received...... Tip well!!! If you didn't, don't tip or tip less. Simple as that. The guys that deckhand on my boat get a small salary and half the tips. Anyone that has ever been on one of my charters knows that both myself and the deckhand work diligently to make it a fun and eventful day. There is one key factor, we like being on the water as much as the client. I can't tell you how many times the client has had to ask, "is it time to go home yet?" Running charters is not how I make my living, it's simply a way to afford being on the water more often. But yes, when there are no mechanical problems or failures... I do make a decent wage for the day. If I could have a charter boat on "retainer" so to speak, I would definitely consider wearing the other shoes. Just remember the first couple of sentences and you'll probably be just fine. Hope everyone is catching plenty! Good Luck!
Brice
www.outcastsportfishing.com


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## Hoover (May 27, 2004)

Also just to add to what you said Sabinstalker I think a lot of the captains are having a great week if they can run 3 a week. You don't just have tons of trips or anything from october to april and then may to june the wind blows so that leaves only 2 or 3 months of "prime fishing" What I'm saying if one week the wind is flat who's to say they always have trips booked when the week before it blew 30 mph and had to cancel 6. What I guess I'm trying to say is they get lucky to actually to profit a 10-15 dollar an hour amount a year home. I understand you are trying to repower and it is expensive, BUT these guys have to repower every few years a lot of the times. Not cause they want to but so they can ensure they have return business because if they dont and on of the motors goes down your not going to be happy. So you have to think a lot deeper then they make this much a day. You have to think about there maintence cost as far as upgrading and the amount of days they can actually go out. Believe me if it was as easy as making 10K a month every one on this board would be doin it. I know I would.


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## SabineStalker (May 23, 2004)

I still have to agree with BradP. 
Hoover, I understand everything you say and definitely agree 100%, but good Lord, $80.00 plus what you have already made thats almost $1300.00. I sure wouldn't be whining. Thats not too shabby.. Id be happy with 7%, its extra money in your pocket. Sorry Im not teary eyed Cha Ching. I will tip the deckhand every time, but I figure the Captain is making the money already, however if he does an excellent job, he will get a tip.. I am a construction worker, and I guess I got a little ******* in me too. I see a price quote and thats what Im gonna pay. Add the tip in the price if need be. I believe most do anyway.

This isn't meant to be offensive, dont take it that way.


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## BradP (May 24, 2004)

LOL oh my Dunc, don't step too far in your own BS. Yea it's a shame that my A&M degree has me working for one the best companies in my field. If you think there is some form of capitalism in charterboat operations you need a lesson in business 101 my boy. 

Outcast said it best, and describes how most all charters on gulf and east coast operate.


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## fishomaniac (May 22, 2004)

I may be wrong, and I probaly am ChaChing, but from what I do understand of business 500.00 dollars profit is what you make above operating expenses. If you are losing money how can you stay in business? I realize if you make 3 trips a week and you have to pay the deckhands also that doesn't amount to very much. And I am grateful to you guys for allowing me to fish bluewater once and awhile. And I always tip, But I have never been on a really bad trip before so I haven't been tested.


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## SabineStalker (May 23, 2004)

"Anyone that has ever been on one of my charters knows that both myself and the deckhand work diligently to make it a fun and eventful day. There is one key factor, we like being on the water as much as the client. I can't tell you how many times the client has had to ask, "is it time to go home yet?""

Well spoken charter Captain, I like your attitude.. A day like this WOULD earn you a tip as well as the deckhand. But, I still dont think its a MUST to tip at all. Tip if you feel like it has been a nice trip.


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## CHA CHING (May 21, 2004)

*Tip*

Just like Brice, I don't make my living fishing. You can't buy and maintain $500,000.00 worth of boats by fishing. Believe me, you can't. I charter because I love being on the water. Owning a pleasure craft or fishing boat is not a money making business. Being a charter captain just helps with a portion of the expenses of being a boat owner, that's just my experience. Maybe I'm doing something wrong because I'm not making any money at it. If I were in the keys or somewhere I could fish 200 days a year with 30 mile runs, then yes I could make a lot of money. The captains in Venice that I fish with every spring tell me I'm crazy not to move down there where you can actually make money fishing. I fish because I love it! You have to love it or you wouldn't do it. I love the sight of a face no matter if it's a kid, woman, man when a big fish is stripping out drag and it's all they can do to hold the rod. Those of us who experience this type of fishing day in and day out forget what it felt like the first time we hooked a 40 pound aj or a 15 pound snapper. The same guys that I take snapper fishing 4 or 5 times a year feel that same rush when they go tuna fishing with me and it starts over again at a different level. 
I as well as Outcast and other charter captains do it because we love it, not for the money.


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## fishomaniac (May 22, 2004)

Hey Cha Ching, you done stole my dream!


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## James Howell (May 21, 2004)

*Re:*

here it is boys. Capt. Jeff and Brice are correct. You DO NOT make a profit running the types of boats we run for charter. If we were in the keys or Venice, LA, where you can make 150-200 trips a year, maybe, just maybe, a captain could take home a decent salary barring any major mechanical malfunction. (Trust me boys, I have run these numbers ad nauseum for the last 10 years). Out of Texas, on a small charter if you bust 100 trips you have done a bangup job. Tipping in Texas goes like this. 10-20% of the charter, period. If you feel like no effort was put forth, don't tip, and don't charter that boat again. If you feel like a great effort was put forth, tip some more. Captain AND mate (I don't run w/ a deckhand, I am a one man show) should be tipped. And no more comments about A&M, especially from yankees and t-sips


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## Dunc (May 29, 2004)

Ok BradP, I agree we disagree. No more pissin! By the way, I may be a Yankee, but I got here as soon as I could and I did go to A&M. So BradP.....Gig'em.


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## tropicalsun (May 21, 2004)

I made my living as a charter captain for twelve years in Kona, Hawaii. I can tell you that there is no significant money to be had in the charter business. I captained as both a boat owner and as a hired captain. I worked on a salary and I also worked for daily pay. For me, the best option was salaried, then daily pay. As an owner, my break even (after paying crew, gear, slip fees, insurance, maintenance, fuel...) was 15 to 17 charters a month. There were months when I fished considerably more than than, however, there were many ten charter months! So...you can never get someone to believe the economics of the charter business until they have experienced it themselves...

I started as a deckhand way back when. My pay was $40 a day for a full day, $25 for a half day. I also received half of the tips, half of any commissions and one third of the fish sales. So, the tip was an extremely important part of my livelyhood. My arrangement with my deckhands, men with families of thier own, was simple and I believe common (at least in Hawaii) we split the tip...period. I didn't matter which of us received it from the customer. You see, one day a charter may think my crew is the best thing since sliced bread and that I am an idiot and give him the tip. However, the day before, turned out my charter and I grew up in the same town and he only tipped me...My crew and I were partners in making a living fishing. We split tips. How much to tip? As much as you can! Assuming, of course, they worked for it. I have been tipped as high as $5,000 (money from a side pool in a tournament) and I have been stiffed. 15% is a good place to start. You tip a waiter that much who spends three minutes serving you, why wouldn't you tip a crew that spent all day serving you? When I first moved here I chartered a boat out of Freeport (will remain nameless) for a kingfish trip. Boat was dirty, gear was horrible, knots and wire twists were a joke. The gaff was so dull it couldn't penetrate a fish. The deck hand did sharpen it on the way in! I tipped that guy 5% and told him why. 

Don't tip in advance (except on head/party boats) but do let the captian and crew know that you are a tipper. You can do that in casual conversation. Don't worry, they will hear what you are saying. 

Off my soap box...

Tropicalsun
Rob


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