# Lock and dam 2/22/09



## Barefoot (Feb 8, 2009)

Well I decided on the way back from making 200+ pounds of deer sausage at my parents house with my dad, uncle and cousin I would wet the lure at the lock and dam.

The fishing was very slow this afternoon. I was only able to stay a couple of hours because I didnt want my sausage to go bad in the cooler. I only landed a few before I needed to leave. Maybe it picked up after I left? Anyway, just wanted to let people know what was going on there today. 

Good luck to everyone.


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## SaltH2oAssassin (Jan 25, 2006)

I was there also yesterday. Got there at around 7:30am and fished til noon. Ended up with 12 whites on cut shad up by the dam. Buddies went down stream a lil passed the bridge and caught about 5-7 each on lures. Saw some people next to me catch two nice size Hybrids. Looked across the river and saw plenty of whites and hybrids caught in the moving current. Sorry no pics because didn't think my catch would be worth sharing.


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## catchysumfishy (Jul 19, 2008)

SaltH2oAssassin said:


> I was there also yesterday. Got there at around 7:30am and fished til noon. Ended up with 12 whites on cut shad up by the dam. Buddies went down stream a lil passed the bridge and caught about 5-7 each on lures. Saw some people next to me catch two nice size Hybrids. Looked across the river and saw plenty of whites and hybrids caught in the moving current. Sorry no pics because didn't think my catch would be worth sharing.


Your Avatar is pic. enough! Thanks for the report!


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## SaltH2oAssassin (Jan 25, 2006)

Here is a stringer of the guy next to me. I took it to share with everyone the size of the hybrid compared to the whites. Like I said all of his was caught on cut shad.










Here is a bonus pic of my bro-in-law's Hybrid that he caught at Lake Somerville the same day. Keep in mind that I wear a size 13 sandal. Look how fat this hog is.


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## james1279 (Jul 9, 2007)

We were the 6 guys on the other side on the wall. We had a six man limit of hybrids to 8lbs and let go at least another 10. Couldn't tell you how many we lost and broke off, there for a while I was hooking up every cast with hybrids. We could hardly get the whites to bite once the hybrids moved in. We probably had 50 or 60 whites between all of us. I'll try to attach the pics, I've never done it before.


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## Bowhntr (Aug 7, 2006)

*Hybrid*

That is a hog.
Were you fishing from boat or land at the L&D? been hearing about that area and would like to get there-wher bout it located? guess it is time for whites to really get going...huh!



SaltH2oAssassin said:


> Here is a stringer of the guy next to me. I took it to share with everyone the size of the hybrid compared to the whites. Like I said all of his was caught on cut shad.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## SaltH2oAssassin (Jan 25, 2006)

*I saw you guys....*

I saw you guys tearing up. I especially notice the guy in the 2nd pic catching a hybrid or white almost on every cast. Way to go. That was my 2nd trip there and had a great time.


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## Bowhntr (Aug 7, 2006)

What were you guys using???/ lures or cut bait. Nice haul of fish there. now who got the cleaning job


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## Gluconda (Aug 25, 2005)

James1279:

Awesome report and pictures! You guys killed them up there? What were the stripers hitting? I heard they love live shad if you can cast net any!


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## james1279 (Jul 9, 2007)

Most fish were caught on 2" curly tails, white or chart. There at the end I was catching them on pretty much everything I threw at them.


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

Awesome L&D trip! Meadowlark, where do you think the wipers are coming from? I'm pretty convinced they are natural hybrids, since TPWD does not stock them in Livingston. And they are not able to reproduce themselves,


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## fishinganimal (Mar 30, 2006)

You can walk by foot down to the lock or did you cross by boat??? Very nice catch. Normally when the Hybrids move up to spawn the whites are movin out. Wish I was there. Great pics


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

shadslinger said:


> Meadowlark, where do you think the wipers are coming from? I'm pretty convinced they are natural hybrids, since TPWD does not stock them in Livingston. And they are not able to reproduce themselves,


SS,

Actually hybrid striped bass (HSB) ARE able to reproduce. They have been documented as reproducing...in one lake, for example, that had only HSB (no stripers and no white bass) the HSB reproduced.

The SRAC has a really interesting paper on this subject and I'll quote a little of it and give the link for those interested in reading the whole paper. It is worth reading, very interesting especially as to the number of eggs a female HSB can produce.

http://www.aquanic.org/publicat/usda_rac/efs/srac/300fs.pdf

*Hybrid striped bass, unlike some other hybrids, is fertile. It is oviparous (egg-laying) like the parental species and produces eggs and sperm in the spring when temperatures are 15 to 20° C. Some males mature at the age of 1 year **(approximately 250 mm long and 500 grams), and all are mature at 2 years of age. A few females are mature at **2 years of age, but all are mature at 3 years. Females produce an average of 160,000 eggs per pound of body weight and spawn once a year. Males may spawn many times over the spawning season. Natural spawning of hybrids has **been verified in a few instances. They may participate in spawning runs with striped bass or possibly white bass. *

My belief is the following:

1) there is a lot about these fish we do not know
2) Livingston apparently has all the ingredients needed by stripers and wipers to spawn
3) there are so many white bass in Livingston, that the odds of a few stripers crossing with whites, even though very remote individually, collectively may be high enough for this to have actually happened.
4) the HSB that result from the unlikely crossing then spawn with other whites and HSB...certainly a possibility.
5) those pictures sure look like hybrids to me as well as some I have caught on Livingston.

I've tried to contact TP&W to ask their biologists...but doubt they will answer a "cold" question from an unknown like me....if anyone knows how to contact them please advise. 

I'm most interested in the answer to SS's question.

QUESTION TO ANYONE WHO HAS RECENTLY CAUGHT A HSB IN LIVINGSTON DURING THIS SPAWNING RUN: *Did the HSB have eggs in them?*


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## james1279 (Jul 9, 2007)

You can walk by foot on both sides of the river, but be careful it's real steep and real muddy at times.


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## james1279 (Jul 9, 2007)

Meadowlark, that is some really interesting information you have there. I am 100% positive these were hybrids not stripers, I have been cacthing hybrids for years in conroe. I have seen a few stripers come out of the L&D not a whole lot. I happen to be pretty close with our TPWD biologist at our east texas deer lease and I'll shoot him an e-mail and see if he can shed any light on the hybrids there at the L&D. -James


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

James,

Did any of the hybrids have eggs in them? They were sure fat and looked like they could have eggs.

I hope your biologist contact responds.

To me (the non-biologist), it is entirely plausible that what you were seeing were hybrids that have Livingston white bass as parents and have simply joined in the white bass runs that their parents have made for generations as the natural thing to do.

The last sentence from the article I mentioned says "Hybrids have been observed participating in spawning acts in areas that contain clear shallow rocky shoals that are 1 to 3 feet"....

Sounds like L&D to me.


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

Those are hybrids, I have caught allot of them, hundreds of stripers and thousands of white bass, so with just one look and I can tell.
MDLK, I wish someone would tell us if they had eggs. 
Ever since I caught my first hybrid below the dam years ago I have enjoyed them, they are tremendous fighters, they hit like a freight train and even after a hard fight will go psycho when they see the boat or you on the bank. 
When I guided I would always caution the client not try and land them the first time they brought them to the boat, cause that is when they will break you off with a sudden run. When they turn that big broad side to you in the water and power down they can really pull hard.
The first year I bought my CC boat and started fishing the lake(2000) instead of behind the dam I got lucky and a guy waved me over to where he was catching them at the Lump. He had his 5 by then and told me what to do to catch them. All four of us in the boat limited, and I went back for three more days and did the same. Most were over 5lbs and a couple around 8lb.
I have gone back every summer at the same time to the lump and have never seen them again there, I do catch some at the hump once in a while.
There is a sunshine bass which is a female white bass and a daddy striper X, and then a Palmetto bass which is a female striper and a male white bassX. I read a good article on the differences the other day and will look for it to post a link.


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## outdooraggie2011 (Nov 24, 2008)

that is one pig of a hybrid salth2o!!! and what a meat haul James!! That's alot of fish!


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

http://www.aquanic.org/publicat/usda_rac/efs/srac/300fs.pdf

Oh this is the same one MDLK posted, lol. Anybody here ever seen the white females come to the top and shimmy to release her eggs? In all of my white bass spawn fishing the only place I have ever seen them do that is all the way up White Rock Creek at the shoal.


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## Barefoot (Feb 8, 2009)

Man, I wish I was able to stay longer, you guys tore them up! I was at the wrong place at the wrong time (it happens alot)! I was catching a few whites by the bridge on 2" yellow and white curly tails, but it sounds like I should of moved up the river some. 

I hope I can make it out there again this weekend if I get a chance.


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## james1279 (Jul 9, 2007)

I let my buddies have my hybrids just because the whites are easier to clean, but I did keep one of my hybrids and it did have eggs. I'll ask my buddy tommorow if the others had eggs. I've have also been told the hybrids will lay their eggs like any other fish but the eggs are sterile and will never hatch.


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## johnmyjohn (Aug 6, 2006)

Interesting you guys bring up the subject, my fishing buddy and I were talking about the hybrids last year. We've fished every Jan. or Feb. for four days since 92 and we both fished the L and D area since 72 and Like the bald eagles we started seeing the birds and catching these fish on a regular basis starting around 2000. The first eagle we saw was around 95 and after that it was old hat, the stripers are becoming more common to the point in the last few years we caught 2-3 average a day, and we are r and r fishing for catfish. Shadslinger, you mentioned TPWD doesn't stock these fish so these fish have to be reproducing. We didn't pay attention to the stripers and the difference between the hybrids but we have been catching hybrids to the most part.


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## Gluconda (Aug 25, 2005)

Can someone tell me where L&D is located at? How far from Houston is it? Thanks!


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## genemu (May 23, 2004)

Interesting discussion here. In addition, *Lots* of Stripers and perhaps a few Hybrids were caught in Trinity, East and West Galveston Bays in 2008. A few Stripers have been around the upper Trinity Bay for years but nothing like recently unless you go back to the early 1900s. Maybe they will make a real come back to their salt water home.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

Unreal to see the hybrids in the Trinity. I have caught a bunch of hybrids on Conroe, and in the springtime they will definitely have eggs. But my understanding was that they are sterile. I have seen both stripers and white bass come from the Trinity during the run, but never hybrids? Had never heard of them in Livingston either.

Is it possible that a lake upstream had a release and that's how they got there? Seems more plausable than that many natural hybribs.


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## Call me WhittieBass (Feb 23, 2009)

We were there saturday here is our haul. We only fish 2 hrs before the rain came. We were south of the bridge.


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## yakfishin (Dec 8, 2005)

To quote a line from Jarassic park "Nature will find away."


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## SAND FISHERMAN (Nov 17, 2006)

were is this place?


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## marty x valley boy (Apr 4, 2005)

*where*

Lock and dam is part of the trinity river. The place is located east of CENTERVILLE. 18 miles or so on highway 7.


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