# Todays Hunting Terms - I hate



## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

There are a few terms being used today in regards to hunting that I really hate to hear. They are

Meat Hunt - Heck from the way I was taught all hunts are meat hunts. 

Cull or Management Buck - What some folks refer to as a Cull or Management buck is a trophy to many folks. When a buck is called a cull or management deer it is tagged as a lesser animal and that is just wrong. Each animal you take should receive the same respect as any super trophy. 

I guess these are just a sign that hunting is just a business. Really I still see hunting as a part of my heritage, a heritage that I have tried to pass down to my son. It has been hard to teach him the old ways of hunting with all he hears and sees. 

With deer being bought and sold then rised in farm like enviroments now a days I guess we should change the term hunting to harvesting. Yes I know there are a lot of you folks on this forum that make your living from hunting and don't hold that against you in the least bit. All I'm saying is do we need to give these animals and hunts such business like names?

Sorry if this offends anyone, but these new terms and the way hunting is being treated in today's world has offended the ways I was taught.


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## bayourat (Jan 7, 2005)

How about "harvest"? Give me a break... You KILL an animal not harvest it.


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## garrettryan (Oct 11, 2004)

Amen


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

I have to agree. Don't like cull buck, especially when a kid kills it. He gets to go to school and tell everyone he got a deer but it was just a cull. I also don't like harvest, sounds like farming.
I shot a doe the other day. She was walking into the clear and I thought, two more steps and you are dead, not two more steps and you are harvested. lol


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

Cast and Blast , cant stand it............
OR cull.
Bad part is I've started using the cull word in the last 5 years and now my boys do the same....


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## 220swifter (Apr 5, 2005)

Not that I disagree with you, but if you want to stay on a good lease these days, you had better know what a "Cull" is. I learned it the hard way. I was invited on a "Cull" hunt. My son shot a 118 BC main frame 8 that was 6 years old. I did not see that it had very small split brow tines. I have been banned from that lease, and basically lost a friend over it. I also learned that good optics are a must.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

Yep, they could reterm Cast and Blast to something like Fin and Feather and make it more appealing to everyone.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

220swifter said:


> Not that I disagree with you, but if you want to stay on a good lease these days, you had better know what a "Cull" is. I learned it the hard way. I was invited on a "Cull" hunt. My son shot a 118 BC main frame 8 that was 6 years old. I did not see that it had very small split brow tines. I have been banned from that lease, and basically lost a friend over it. I also learned that good optics are a must.


Oh I know what it means, and the meaning is business related and you need to go to college to be able to determine which is and or is not a Cull. They should make it easier for everyone and just paint a big red "X" on the side of the bucks they want shot then you could go on an "X" hunt and there wouldn't be any banning or lost friendships.


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

If you do away with the term "cull" would you also do away with the term "trophy"? Both are merely adjectives and are used subjectively...


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Just my two cents ...

"Harvesting" is a term used in your Outdoor Annual TP&W Field Regulations Mannual and on the back of your hunting license ... there isn't a thing wrong with this term, it's respectful.

I too hate the term "cull", it's thrown around along with the term "trash buck" and I don't care to hear either term ever again. Management deer, for me is another story ... if your taking a management deer, despite his or her short comings as having inferior genetics or just being to plentiful ... your taking that animal for the better of the herd. As long as respect is given to the fallen animal, I don't see much offensive in using the term management ...


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

220swifter said:


> Not that I disagree with you, but if you want to stay on a good lease these days, you had better know what a "Cull" is. I learned it the hard way. I was invited on a "Cull" hunt. My son shot a 118 BC main frame 8 that was 6 years old. I did not see that it had very small split brow tines. I have been banned from that lease, and basically lost a friend over it. I also learned that good optics are a must.


Hmmm ... that sounds like deer lore to me.

Unless the deer was only 2.5 yrs. old, most any biologist in the state would recommend you shoot every main frame 8 pt. you see (3.5 and up); unless they're sitting in the 130's at 2.5 and 3.5 yrs. old ... there's no reason to get thrown off a lease for that ... bummer ...


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## Charles Helm (Oct 22, 2004)

vBulletin MessageYou must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Haute Pursuit again.
​


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## Spots and Dots (May 23, 2004)

220swifter said:


> Not that I disagree with you, but if you want to stay on a good lease these days, you had better know what a "Cull" is. I learned it the hard way. I was invited on a "Cull" hunt. My son shot a 118 BC main frame 8 that was 6 years old. I did not see that it had very small split brow tines. I have been banned from that lease, and basically lost a friend over it. I also learned that good optics are a must.


not a very good friend.


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## PortATrout (Aug 15, 2005)

The term cull can go away but management needs to stay. Even a deer that people term a cull is generally taken for management purposes. People just need to understand that there different quality management animals depending on the region and specific ranch. I know a lot of people would drool at the chance to shoot some management deer on certain ranches. These deer are on the lower end of the herd and need to be taken out for either quality or quantity reasons. A deer can still be a management deer and a trophy at the same time. All depends on the shooter.


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## "Reddrum" (Dec 15, 2005)

Spots and Dots said:


> not a very good friend.


No doubt - hope the door didn't hit him in the arse on the way out!

Biggest pet peeve phrase - "_______ of a life time". How does anyone know it was the hunt of a life time, fish of a life time or anything else for that matter!


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I don't see what's wrong with cast and blast. Meat hunt doesn't bother me too much.

Cull and management are words that are often used to brag. Many folks are really trying to say - look how much better my lease is than yours because we consider this big 8 point second class even though you'll probably never see a deer this big in your life. There are lots of guys that hunt on big ranches that shoot the same deer and post a pic showing a big 8 that they or their kid took without saying that their lease called it a cull. Those are guys that don't feel a need to brag and just wanted to share a nice memory with others. 

"Harvest" I can't stand. It's a sure sign of pc'ism, which is why it's on the license and in the regs. It makes no sense to use the word in regard to hunting. You let plants grow and bear fruit/seed prior to harvesting. You let cows/pigs/animals grow and fatten prior to slaughtering or butchering. If you can't handle the word "kill", why choose a word that's only associated with plants? That seems rather disrespectful to the game to be put on a level with plants just to avoide the imaginary ethical delima of killing an animal.


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## elkhunter49 (Jun 7, 2004)

Before I begain let me say I'm not in the outdoor business in anyway 
and I'm not even on a deer lease.
I'm not offended and I don't oppose the terms managment or cull bucks
at all. I was raised to treat any animal you shoot with respect and to 
properly care for the meat no matter if it's your biggest buck ever or just 
a doe. The way most ranches are operated nowdays is much different
than when I begain hunting 40+ years ago, and the state wide deer herd
is in great shape because of it. 
If you are going to feed protein to a deer herd year round and pay alot
of money for a lease then a solid (managment) program will benefit 
everyone including the deer themselves. Calling a smaller, older or in someway
inferior deer a cull is not degrading to the animal it's calling a spade a spade.
The child who shoots a cull buck will be as proud as punch if bragg on him
and the deer and keep it all positive. 
Let's not over dramatize this folks, If you take your son or daughter hunting
and allow them to harvest/shoot/kill a deer then the way they are going to feel about the experince is mostly up to you as a parent. If you allow other's
to talk down their buck, the experince will not be what it should. Be
carefull who you hunt with. I'm not trying to pick an arguement here it's just
my .02 worth. By the way--- Good post bountyhunter Later Baker


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

Haute Pursuit said:


> If you do away with the term "cull" would you also do away with the term "trophy"? Both are merely adjectives and are used subjectively...


No trophy can still be used and in fact it needs to be used a lot more. Heck every deer I've ever taken is a trophy to me in some way, buck or doe. Sure we all like to tell the story of our biggest deer, but I've been know to tell just as many stories about doe that I've killed. My dad, rest his soul, would roll over in his grave if he was to know some of the deer he killed were no more than culls, trash that needed gotten rid of and no more. He taught me to be proud of every deer you were able to take and there is nothing proud about taking anything that has been deemed a cull.


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## Leemo (Nov 16, 2006)

"Cull" is what it is, it's a cull, I don't have problem with calling it a cull or teaching my son to do the same, he shoots "cull" bucks on our lease and every cull buck in his mind and heart are TROPHYS, I think the same, anything he shoots is a trophy, cull is just the name we give them for management objectives, trophy on our place refers to any buck 10 pts. or better that the paid hunter wishes to shoot, yeah I know not all 10's or bigger are "trophys" but you have to draw the line somewhere.. trophy trout or dink?


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## parkman14 (Jul 27, 2006)

bountyhunter said:


> There are a few terms being used today in regards to hunting that I really hate to hear. They are
> 
> Meat Hunt - Heck from the way I was taught all hunts are meat hunts.
> 
> ...


I used to be the same way. I used to think high fence hunting was easy but I have come to find out it isn't. Now just b/c I shoot a buck and it is a cull for us, doesn't mean I give it any less respect. I still remember almost all of my cull deer over the past 8 years and can barely remember some of my trophy deer from mexico. Which are about the same size. As long as I am in the woods I am happy just being there and if I get a deer awesome another memory to go in the scrapbook.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

I hate to hear "you missed" , "we are out of beer" , and "the toilet stopped up"


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## Jfreeman (Nov 3, 2004)

BEER4BAIT said:


> I hate to hear "you missed" , "we are out of beer" , and "the toilet stopped up"


LOL!


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## Angler 1 (Apr 27, 2005)

How about..

The "Management" of this Ranch wants you to "Harvest" some of those "Culls" so the herd can be managed correctly.


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## 220swifter (Apr 5, 2005)

I know. This deer had reached its potential IMO(and most of t he lease member's opinions), but I was told to shoot only an older 8 point. I did not see the split brow tines which made it a 10. I even offered to pay for the deer because I felt so bad. It was my son's first buck ever, so I tried my best to shield him from all the politics.

It is a shame, but I guess he was not that good of a friend to begin with.



Spec-Rig.006 said:


> Hmmm ... that sounds like deer lore to me.
> 
> Unless the deer was only 2.5 yrs. old, most any biologist in the state would recommend you shoot every main frame 8 pt. you see (3.5 and up); unless they're sitting in the 130's at 2.5 and 3.5 yrs. old ... there's no reason to get thrown off a lease for that ... bummer ...


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## swtmike (Jul 20, 2005)

I just hate that I can't call my trash "trash" anymore because it might be someone else's treasure.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

Angler 1 said:


> How about..
> 
> The "Management" of this Ranch wants you to "Harvest" some of those "Culls" so the herd can be managed correctly.


I have sit here for over an hour thinking about your statement, and there just isn't any way I can state my true fellings about it without stepping on toes or offending you are somebody else and that just wasn't the purpose of this thread.


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## goatchze (Aug 1, 2006)

Cull buck? I like Pawpaw's term "Brush Idiot"...I guess at 89 years old you get to say just about whatever you want...LOL


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## Clint Leopold (Mar 7, 2006)

Hunters against hunters.........what you want to call YOUR deer is YOUR business. We're gonna put the sport we all love doing out of business.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

here in the back woods with Bounty we do not kill or harvest but bust the he77 out of some deer. We cull through the ice chest for a beer and manage to keep from running out of beer.


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## swtmike (Jul 20, 2005)

Man, I think you are taking the approach that all hunters which refer to a cull buck are referring to the buck as a less meaningful buck. If someone is, then I think those people do not have any reason to be hunting. But would you mount a large 10 point on your wall or a small 4 point that was 4 1/2 years old. It's just a phrase, and although I typically do not say cull buck, I do say management buck, and I don't think anything less of that type of a buck than that of a trophy, although the trophy will be on my wall.



And as far as "harvesting", it is the politically correct way of stating that you killed an animal. No I do not say I'm going to harvest an animal when I'm by myself or with hunting buddies, but I would say that if I'm posting on a public forum or talking about a hunt in a public area or to someone that is not familiar with hunting. And it's really just because I think it paints a less gruesome picture in someone's mind who is not involved with hunting. Just my .02


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

swtmike said:


> And as far as "harvesting", it is the politically correct way of stating that you killed an animal. No I do not say I'm going to harvest an animal when I'm by myself or with hunting buddies, but I would say that if I'm posting on a public forum or talking about a hunt in a public area or to someone that is not familiar with hunting. And it's really just because I think it paints a less gruesome picture in someone's mind who is not involved with hunting.


I agree 100% but a word of caution ... I opened this can of worms early last week and got tagged as an elitist, a tree hugger, a gun hater, a jr. game warden and probably worse ...

It's like trying to argue with your girlfriend or wife ... no matter how much logic you use, they hear what they want to hear and your wrong ...


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## swtmike (Jul 20, 2005)

Spec., you couldn't have said that any better. I just try to give tree huggers and other political radicalists the least amount of ammunition for any future battles over hunting or gun control. I don't know where the sport will be 20 years from now, but I know we don't need any help giving any of it up.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

B4B is right we bust them every chance we get, but the only time I cull through the cooler for beer is when someone has put Pearl Light in there with my Lone Star.


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## Lezz Go (Jun 27, 2006)

I was only on a lease once in Dewit County. It was a year round lease that was part of a bigger management program. We had 1000 acs of a 3000 acre family place with the best landowner one could wish for. I was a newbie deer hunter (late bloomer) so the rancher's son shoed me a video of some deer on the place and educated me on what was a shooter. The first year we hunted I did not pull the trigger, but we had turkeys and hogs out the wazoo and many many good times with the rancher and his son. I finally shot a little 8 pt that barely made the requirement, but you would have thought I shot Muy Grande by the way I was treated. Good times.

IMHO, nowadays getting on a deer lease is expensive, and full of politics. I get that **** at work. I have gone to hunting axis deer, black buck, fallow deer and other critters at a place in the hill country (high fence) that is affordable, the owner makes sure we all have a good time, and as long as you are safe, there are no rules other than to have a good time. 

Seems to me deer hunting has just gotten too complicated these days.


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## Hughoo222 (Aug 24, 2005)

True hunting is almost dead. Deer have merely become cattle as of late, sit in a box over a solar powered feeder and wait for the 8pt 3.5 yo typical with a 16" inside spread and then plaster it all over the internet screaming score this , score this, all for a deer that was no harder than a domestic cat to shoot and not much bigger. Fact is if you want a trophy, you can get it for a price, period, no skill and not much work involved. The term hunting is used very loosely these days imo.


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

I read all this and I have read other threads along the same line. Lots of people who's opinions I respect have replied. 
I can live with management as a hunting term but cull doesn't have a place in my camp. I've never shot one.
I also understand the inclination to not peeve PETA, etal, in a public way. But I resist that inclination because they put the pressure on before we ever started doing that, we changed the terminology subsequently and did they back off, NO. It merely emboldens them. Changing kill to harvest only whets their appetite for a grander victory.
I'll land here. We kill deer, some of them to manage the herd, some as trophies, all to enjoy at the table and all with due respect.


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## JD761 (Jun 7, 2006)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> I agree 100% but a word of caution ... I opened this can of worms early last week and got tagged as an elitist, a tree hugger, a gun hater, a jr. game warden and probably worse ...
> 
> It's like trying to argue with your girlfriend or wife ... no matter how much logic you use, they hear what they want to hear and your wrong ...


Spoken like a true anti-hunting tree-hugger.


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## Fishaholic (Jan 9, 2005)

I don't see what is the matter with blast and cast??? And a cull deer is an acceptable term. It can be from a doe to a washed up buck that doesn't help their ranch anymore so they are culling it out of gene pool. I know that some peoples culls are anothers trophy, and I am often very jealous of the cull deer people shoot. But it is their ranch and their deer and they are doing what they think is best for it by culling out the lesser animals to make room for the bigger better ones. So I believe nothing is wrong with blast and cast or cull deer.


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## swtmike (Jul 20, 2005)

Here's one that I despise:

"I just meat hunt"

Now that is a term that is used too loosely these days. If you're just meat hunting, then shoot a doe and let me kill the buck, since it wouldn't be as good of table fare as the doe; but I get a bonus, I horn hunt which is a great complement to the table fare I will get from my buck.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

swtmike said:


> Here's one that I despise:
> 
> "I just meat hunt"
> 
> Now that is a term that is used too loosely these days. If you're just meat hunting, then shoot a doe and let me kill the buck, since it wouldn't be as good of table fare as the doe; but I get a bonus, I horn hunt which is a great complement to the table fare I will get from my buck.


I do just meat hunt and generally the first two legal deer I see get invited into my freezer. If one happens to be a big boy that's fine, but I'd really rather have a doe or young buck for eating.

Even though we can kill 4 in our county I just take two and with the one or two my son takes we have enough meat till the next season. The way I was taught that is the right way to do it, take what you can eat and only what you can eat.


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

I think some of ya'll are putting way too much thought into all of this. 

If you shoot deer you kill them, unless you're a bad shot.

If you've hunted on a well managed ranch then you've probably dealt with inferior deer or "cull" deer as they are called, and with trophy deer. Quite possibly where you hunt any buck is a trophy to you and that's great, I hope you hypervenilate and get the shakes after every kill...if you don't then what's the point? 

The 13" rule that is in effect in a lot of Texas counties is a "management" tool put in place by the state to improve the age class of bucks in those counties. Before that rule came to be law, in a lot of those counties you were lucky to see a buck that was 2.5 years old and the law was put in to place because "we" couldn't manage things ourselves.

I don't have a problem using the word "cull" to describe a deer that is less than what you want out of a deer on your property. I don't have a problem with the phrase "meat hunt", I've been on a lot of them and when you have to kill 50 or more doe on your place due to the advice of a TP&W biologist, that's what it is...a meat hunt. You can "horn hunt" if you want to and I do that each time I sit in a stand or against a tree or whenever I carry a bow, rifle or revolver into the woods and hunt deer.

There's nothing wrong with sitting in a comfortable deer blind 150 yards from a corn feeder; it's still hunting. There's nothing wrong with sneaking around in the timber in full camo, face mask, scent shield, and a re-curve bow...that's hunting too; it's just a different type of hunting. You can run naked through the mesquite and retama in Encinal with a sharp ironwood spear after deer if you want to, that's hunting too. It's all relative.

If anyone here feels discriminated against for coming on here and voicing their opinions about how we should use "harvest" instead of "kill" or if people on here label you a "tree hugger", "PETA" poster boy or what have you, then maybe your opinion, no matter how logical it seems to you, isn't thought highly of here.

This is a hunting board...most of us here kill deer, varmints, ducks, geese, elk, moose, bear, dove, quail and a lot of time.

There are a few here who "harvest" their crops, but during hunting season they kill things.

Get over it.

TH


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## RockinU (Aug 13, 2006)

I don't really understand this. Why should you care what terms anyone else uses? It seems to me that it's your own interpretations of other's terms that are offending you. Just because someone "culls" a buck doesn't mean that they are any less proud, or respectful of it. Some people are even more proud and pleased because they feel they have done the overall herd a service. As for management, well that is a very subjective term that is used for so many different deer. I read about a place that considers every 3.5 deer with less than 135 inches a management deer. Others a mature 8 point, and still others any deer over 6.5 years old. I could really care less myself, but when I do hear the term it does make me feel that there is at least a plan, and some thought being given to managing that herd's population, which I do think is important. Wether anyone likes it or not, numbers are an important factor for us, and in order for us to maintain a healthy herd of deer to hunt, wether for trophy, managemet, cull, or heritage...the population must be managed. Now having said that, here's to no man trying to tell another how to manage theirs. Good hunting to all no matter what you are after or what you want to call it, and remember that we have to stick together, as there are those who would take away what we love.


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## JD761 (Jun 7, 2006)

swtmike said:


> Here's one that I despise:
> 
> "I just meat hunt"
> 
> Now that is a term that is used too loosely these days. If you're just meat hunting, then shoot a doe and let me kill the buck, since it wouldn't be as good of table fare as the doe; but I get a bonus, I horn hunt which is a great complement to the table fare I will get from my buck.


Used to have kin come down to our place in Frio Co. for a "meat hunt". They would shoot the first buck with any horns. Didn't last long when my uncle and I stepped in...


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

I like your thinking Bounty, go back 200 years and see how many deer were passed up. Dont get me wrong I like big bucks but I cant spend big bucks. I like to eat deer infact I like to eat lots of creatures. I am on a West TX quail Lease and they call me a Utillity Hunter and I am proud of it. I shoot rabbits ducks geese cranes quail turkey ***** hogs and deer some times all in the same walk. I have said it many times here if you are in the bush and you are having fun that is what it is about, period, the end, nothing to argue about. I have never met the BEST hunter.


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## capt_joe (Sep 19, 2006)

I must be from the lower middle class or the upper lower class...... Because I've never seen a Cull Buck, much less shot one. Where I hunt now and grew up hunting all we ever had was Whitetail.

Naw, I don't care for or use the term "cull" or "harvest".... I hunt deer, turkey, hogs, coyotes, etc. and when I find what I want I kill it...... After which I say a prayer to God and my savior Jesus Christ. Than I clean the animal to eat...(except coyotes)

Oh, ya....I'm PC-Correct either....


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

whats wrong with coyotes? Coyote is a fine meal.



capt_joe said:


> I must be from the lower middle class or the upper lower class...... Because I've never seen a Cull Buck, much less shot one. Where I hunt now and grew up hunting all we ever had was Whitetail.
> 
> Naw, I don't care for or use the term "cull" or "harvest".... I hunt deer, turkey, hogs, coyotes, etc. and when I find what I want I kill it...... After which I say a prayer to God and my savior Jesus Christ. Than I clean the animal to eat...(except coyotes)
> 
> Oh, ya....I'm PC-Correct either....


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## tc hardhead (Jun 19, 2006)

I like to hunt with people who hunt ethically and responsibly. I don't care what kind of deer they want to put their tag on it's just not worth getting upset about. I came by with a phrase this year and it is "renewable resource." As long as we are responsible with the number of deer we take off of the land we hunt then the deer will remain a renewable resource that we can enjoy. So let's just enjoy the time we have to spend in the woods and joke about hunting terms we hate.


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## yazoomike (Aug 31, 2006)

Term I hate to hear_____ Leemo just fa#%ed. Everyone run!!!!!


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## DANO (May 23, 2005)

I'm still looking for a "Good Recipe" for Deer Horns,...


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Have read all posted, I raise a garden every yr and I dont harvest nothing, I pick peas, tamaters n peppers, I pull corn, I cut okra but I kill deer, ducks among other things. I dont care about being 'PC' on any subject especially something I have been doing since about 6y/o. I have NEVER shot a cull, I have never refered to any deer as a cull, just some better than others although some would argue all my deer except a few were culls. Come hunt with me and I promise a trophy will be less than you thought it would be. WW


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## Outcast (May 20, 2004)

Well, here I go. I think all this deep thought is nice but I bet we all lose our religions so to speak at some time in the field. Who cares what you call stuff!? Everyone has their interpretation of each term. Wanna talk about animal respect? How about the respect of letting an animal reach a mature age and growth potential?? "Can't eat the horns! The young ones tasted the best! I'm a meat hunter!" Where is the respect in those statements? It's all in the way a person interprets things and what they are looking for in respects to their hunting rights. Better get used to "harvest" unless you wanna feed ammo to PETA! It was brought up in this thread earlier concerning crops and livestock about promoting better groceries and animal herds. I don't see anything wrong with that. Deer mgt is no different.

It's a passion for me and each person is entitled you treat the situation as they wish as long as they abide by the rules. 

No offense meant to the thread starter or it's contributers but to me......this thread is pointless and nothing more than a gripe session. (here I sit typing away  )

Ya ever seen one of those "shut up and fish" shirts??? I think I'm gonna "shut up and hunt"! Anyone coming!!!?????????


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## SSMike (Aug 15, 2005)

Trouthunter said:


> There's nothing wrong with sitting in a comfortable deer blind 150 yards from a corn feeder; it's still hunting. There's nothing wrong with sneaking around in the timber in full camo, face mask, scent shield, and a re-curve bow...that's hunting too; it's just a different type of hunting. You can run naked through the mesquite and retama in Encinal with a sharp ironwood spear after deer if you want to, that's hunting too. It's all relative.
> 
> If anyone here feels discriminated against for coming on here and voicing their opinions about how we should use "harvest" instead of "kill" or if people on here label you a "tree hugger", "PETA" poster boy or what have you, then maybe your opinion, no matter how logical it seems to you, isn't thought highly of here.
> 
> TH


Wow... very nice. Next year, I'm doing the naked spear thing....

Seriously, the PC hunting nonsense drives me up a wall. Well said TH.


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

OK, the thing with peta and their ilk is they don't need encouragement. Give one inch and they want the whole mile. We will NEVER satisfy them by conceding a little here and a little there, so let's just be hunters, who kill and butcher and eat our PREY.
I reiterate, anyone who thinks that if we all start saying we harvest our quarry so we don't have to say we kill it, and that that will appease people of the mindset of peta is misguided. 
They don't want to hear us say we harvest deer, they want to hear us say we were totally wrong for ever having done it and that we are now vegan and we will protest with them for the good of the planet, and hunters are mean and bloodthirsty and cruel and all a bunch of uneducated hillbillys.

Tell you what, let's just start saying we incorporated a deer into our lifestyle, is that soft enough????


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I truly believe that using terms like "harvest" is what is feeding the antis, not the other way around. You are basically fueling the belief that killing an animal is inheritantly bad by attempting to gloss over the killing part of the sport. In the long run, that's not a good thing. You can claim it's all about the experience and spending time outdoors, but if you're allowing kids or non-hunters to continue to believe that the act of killing is inheritantly bad, they're going to find other ways to experience the outdoors because they will feel guilty when it comes to the killing part. I've seen this first hand more times than I can count.

Instead, I firmly believe that our best strategy is to not make any attempt to gloss over the killing part. It is about the experience - but killing the animal is a part of that experience too, and it needs to be put forward as a good thing and not something that needs glossing over. Respectfully killing an animal for tablefare is a pleasant experience, and a person doesn't have to be a sicko to enjoy it. Trapping hogs isn't about time outdoors or anything else, but I still enjoy shooting them, dressing them, and putting them on the table for my family. Trying to gloss over any part of that is doing hunting a disservice.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

I don't think I've showed ya'll a picture of my Daughters show steer !!!

Whatcha think ??


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## SSMike (Aug 15, 2005)

Rack Ranch said:


> I don't think I've showed ya'll a picture of my Daughters show steer !!!
> 
> Whatcha think ??


I think flaunting around an animal in show for money is wrong. I hope all the steers in that show received the same ribbon so as not to hurt any other steers feelings. I hope that stick in her hand was not used on the animal.

jk. Great looking steer! You must be proud of her! Nice try with the diversion... don't think it will work though...


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## cloudfishing (May 8, 2005)

IMO most of these "terms" are a direct result of comercialized hunting. Game biologist spend a great deal of time in training and school to learn these terms. Our children will be eatin up confusing retoric that our hunting society has created. Game ranches use this jargon to control the game herds, this would be the same jargon used in pen raising fish. It is all relative.


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## mastercylinder60 (Dec 18, 2005)

who really cares what you call it? it's just personal semantics preference, anyway ... no matter what you call it, they still mean the same thing. if you don't like "harvest," call it "kill." if you don't like "kill," call it "harvest." either way, you still slayed a deer.


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Trouthunter said:


> I think some of ya'll are putting way too much thought into all of this.
> 
> If you shoot deer you kill them, unless you're a bad shot.
> 
> ...


Hilarious ... and well said, I'll be sharpening my ironwood spear immediately! Wow, look ... we agreed on something!

However if you think I give a rats ***** what my opinion is thought of on a forum with a bunch of keyboard whipping naysayers ... your even funnier than I thought!

~Cheers bro ...


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## Reel Screamer (Jun 8, 2004)

Rack Ranch said:


> I don't think I've showed ya'll a picture of my Daughters show steer !!!
> 
> Whatcha think ??


Nice move Walker..... So, How bout' them Cowboys!!!!!


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## Spotted Wadin (Jan 20, 2006)

When I am hunting I always say prayers and in my prayers I ask God to allow me to harvest an animal. I use the term harvest instead of kill because I like to be specific. I can kill can an animal but not find it for what ever reason....and yes I will put forth every effort to locate an animal that was shot. In my mind, if I shot an animal and could not recover it....I killed it but can not reap the bounty of the animal. Which would make me feel terrible.

In my mind (again) harvest means to kill an animal and take it home for consumption. I think harvest and kill basically mean the same thing, its just that I think the term harvest implies a more responsible, ethical KILL.

I also believe that everyone is entitled to there own opinion and I just gave you mine. I will also respect yours.

JM


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## Fishin-Inc (May 27, 2004)

*Imo*

My opinion.

You guys all go hunting. Stay off the bay.
That way, it's a touch quieter. You shoreline burning wacko's!! J/K


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

I grew up hunting in the deep woods. You could hunt all season and only see a deer or two. If you got off a shot and bagged a deer, tho', it was a big one. We still hunted or climbed trees, but stands were banned. Shotguns only, per the rules of the land we hunted.

I moved to Texas in '90 and went on my first hunt. Feeders and tiny little deer conditioned to walk in for their meal every morning. Big heated towers. Lots of rules about "cull this", "don't shoot that".

I finally figured it would be safe to kill a spike, since everyone said they wanted them culled. I saw a couple that first morning, but they were so teeny, I couldn't believe I would be allowed to kill one.

I was chastized when I told the rest of the group what I saw that first day. "Just cull one out!"

The next morning, the little deer returned. Embarassed and thinking the big ol' rifle I had borrowed would blast it to bits, I pulled out my pistol and shot one. It took a step, then fell right over, dead. I picked it up and carried it back to camp to dress it there. I think it dressed out about 65-70lbs. Jeesh.

It tasted great (corn fed, you know) and I had a great time hanging out in luxury, drinking whiskey and lying about stuff, but it was not hunting as I knew it.

It was the last time I went, but now my 14yr. old is asking to go. I guess I'll hire a guide, since I don't want to be banned from a hunt for shooting some rare deer I'm not allow to shoot because it has teeny, invisible split tines that my old eyes might miss.

No offense. I think he's missed something by never hunting, as my hunting memories are my fondest memories of time with my dad. I just wish it weren't such a big business here.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

A lot more has been read into my original post or added to this thread than I ever intended.

Hunting Methods - I never called out anyones method of hunting. I could care less how you choose to hunt just as long as it is all legal. If you are hunting illegal then I would have problems with that.

Businesses/Ranches/Guides - As my original post stated I am not against any of you in your business efforts. More power to each and everyone of you as I truely hope you are fruitful in your endeavers. I just had some concerns with the terms that have been a direct result of hunting businesses.

Cull was not used as part of hunting until it became a business. Sure some of you will argue that it is a management term, but management itself is a term directly related to a business.

Cull means an inferior product or produce that generally gets a lesser price. That is fine and dandy for you business types, but when I kill a deer on my property or on public land I really am offended when one of you refer to that deer as nothing but a cull, or one that I should have let walk. Statements like that come from the many that have never hunted a small property or on public land where if and when you see horns you had better shoot if you want meat in the freezer. If you don't shoot and let it pass there is a very good likelyhood there won't be a second chance.

I am speaking for a lot of folks out there that don't have the money it takes today to be able to hunt on a big ranch or be on a lease. There are a lot of us that just can't afford the price tag that has been placed on hunting, but we still want to hunt and hand down that heritage to our kids so we do what we can do buy owning small pieces of property or hunting on public lands. The problem is that you folks that run these businesses or have the money to hunt these places are always trying to push your beliefs onto us that don't have the big bucks as in money. It is just like everything else in this world, those with dictate to those without.

There I've said my peace, like it or not. I'm just going to go back to the woods, where I'm far away from these dang PCs and the Big Business views and cook me some nice backstrap steaks or maybe some fresh squirrel potpie.


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## cloudfishing (May 8, 2005)

Here is a good term "Sacrifice" for good eatin


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## d hop (Aug 12, 2004)

How about "plus $100-$200 an inch" I HATE that term.


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## tommy261 (May 3, 2006)

i hate the term harvest. i harvest corn, i kill deer. this term is used to make things sound better to the animal rights people. i do not apologize for killing deer and i will not water it down. i am given the right to kill animals by God and i will not cowar down to these people so they won't get upset with me.


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## THE JAMMER (Aug 1, 2005)

Deer hunting terms I hate:

You can have that one over there for $1500
You can have that one just to the right for $2250
You can have that one over to the left for $3500, nope $4000- he's got a kicker
You can have that doe for $900

Please check method of payment, enter you pin number, and press enter.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

How bout when you duck blind buddy says "you smell that yet?"


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## Angler 1 (Apr 27, 2005)

Jammer,

Don't you do charters and have different prices for different kind of trips? not much different except one is fishing and one is hunting.

What if someone told you they hate the terms

Nearshore $750.00 50 miles
A little bit farther offshore $925.00 51 miles
A little bit farther then that $1500.00

Everybody has different ways of viewing things. This is not a perfect world and you cannot make everybody agree on the same things. The point is everybody is entitled to there own opinion which there is no right or wrong way to see things. The right thing is everybody should just get along and respect each others opinions if you disagree.



THE JAMMER said:


> Deer hunting terms I hate:
> 
> You can have that one over there for $1500
> You can have that one just to the right for $2250
> ...


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## deadeye68 (Jan 19, 2007)

Walker ,that is a good lookin steer your daughter is raising. As for the rest of you, is there a right way and a wrong way or is it just an individuals way of stating what they kill,harvest, slaughter, take, shoot, arrow,or whatever. I think that managing your land or lease is what is bringing back deer to areas that have been shot out or over hunted and to do this, culling and or managing the population are necessary terms. As far as being PC, why? If we as hunters make concessions to those who are offended by us, they will simply demand more. You can't please them so you might as well p*ss them off.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

I haven't been around here much lately, but, I'm gonna say a few things.

First of all, the deer population/health is better today than it was 20 years ago. The reason is herd *management*. Whether that has been for personal or business reasons, the result has been the same. The resulting reality is, in many places, deer have to be removed to maintain that superior herd health. Many times in great numbers (I think this is where the term harvest came in). Like someone said, they pick their tomatoes. However, if they had 500 acres of tomatoes, I bet they would *harvest* them. See my point. So, I don't really have a problem with the term and I use it from time to time. Usually when referring to the taking of large numbers of animals. So far as the political correctnes of it...I don't give a rat's arse. I *KILL* game and thats that. I won't apologize for it.

As far as the term *cull*. I view that as a completely relative term. I've had the opportunity to hunt some really well managed ranches (ranches managed for optimum horn potential) in my life. And, quite frankly, there are some deer that not only do not meet the desired horn criteria, they are detrimental to the management plan. Those deer are considered culls (remove immeadiately). Other deer that are just "not up to snuff," based on their predetermined trophy criteria, are considered management deer. Management deer, IMO, are generally deer that might meet the trophy horn criteria for many or most other hunters. Again, it's all relative. Trophy, management, and cull deer are all different to each of us. Some might not have a need for categories at all. A deer is a deer, and you kill what you can. On some ranches I hunt, I kill the first deer I see, on others I'm more selective. It's all a matter of perspective.

In the end, refer to a deer by whatever terms help you best communicate with those around you. Just don't do it to appease those that don't agree with you.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

All this talk has got me in the harvesting mode, I'm about to go and get me a cull doe. WW


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

Whats ''NUB LOVE" ???????????


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

Rack Ranch said:


> Whats ''NUB LOVE" ???????????


Best to just leave it alone Walker. lol just walk away from it.


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## yazoomike (Aug 31, 2006)

RR that just don't sound right. I'm staying clear.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

Rack Ranch said:


> Whats ''NUB LOVE" ???????????


Ask Trouthunter!!

Where is State_Vet anyways?


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## Swampa (Aug 14, 2004)

This thread is making me want to drink a beer and get off the internet!!!!!!


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Thread*

All I can say about this thread is... I agree.

I sure hope I did not hurt anyone's feelings with that statement, if so, I disagree.

Now let's go reduce some animals to usable protein.

BB


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

I wonder what the deer think of the hunters they see on my lease? Way past his prime, never going to amount to nothing, deformed, too young ,too old, should not be given the chance to breed more like him, and that's just my close freinds I hunt with!!! 
It's all a matter of which end of the barrel you are on.


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

BigBuck said:


> All I can say about this thread is... I agree.
> 
> I sure hope I did not hurt anyone's feelings with that statement, if so, I disagree.
> 
> ...


Can I go too?? I want to incorporate a deer into my chosen lifestyle.


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## Captn C (May 21, 2004)

I agree with DE68 and the pale one...there is no sense trying to appease those who disagree with our hunting and fishing life styles. Have you read some of the things PETA has done?

They regularly kill dogs and cat to keep us from haveing them. They want all the cows killed so we won't be able to eat them. They have not concern for the animal, all they want is impose their agenda on us!

I really suck at trying to be PC, so won't even try!

OLT-IMO-I think showing the type weapon you use when you're hunting shows/proves it has other useful purposes (if it's not necessarily a normal "sporting arm") than what it was originally designed for!


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## THE JAMMER (Aug 1, 2005)

Angler one,

I really don't think your analogy is the same thing. You know as well as anyone that the only thing you can guarantee on a chartered day of fishing is a day of fishing. Maybe someone has, but I still haven't figured out how to high fence the Gulf, so that I could offer a 40# dolphin to a client for one price, and a 50 ling for another price, and so forth.

For me different prices for different trips are because of the amount of time spent on the water. It used to be for the extra gas, but I think most guides have gone to a lower flat fee plus gas these days. I think it is reasonable to charge a client more money if I am going to spend more time helping him to find his fish, not to mention the extra wear and tear of my boat.It is not any where near the same category of what I was talking about- paying a different price for a different animal like you were shopping for them in a store.

Also as you said, everyone has the right to their own opinion, and since the title of this thread was, things about hunting you don't like, I simply gave my opinion. Didn't say it was wrong for anyone else. Didn't say I didn't respect anyone else's opinion. Just said it's not my thing.

You know well enough, that offshore fishing in the gulf is the ultimate in fair chase. There is no way you can "offer" a client a certain size or species of fish, like you can on some of these deer hunts. There have certainly been those days when I wished I could have. You know those days I'm sure, where if you could buy a good fish yourself for a client, you would.

What actually triggered my initial response to this post, was a deer hunting trip I took my kid on when he was 9. We were sitting in a blind with the guide/owner, and he went through that almost exact verbage with us- pricing out the deer that walked out. Made it kinda tough when my kid says, "Why can't we shoot that one Daddy?" Sorry it's TOO EXPENSIVE. We'll have to go over to the discount aisle.

Another story, I'll make it short. I was archery hunting on the Baca Ranch in New Mexico with my recurve- could only afford to go for a cow. As I was gumshoeing down a mountain late one morning, very quietly, the whole world moved 15 yards in front of me. Was at least a 350 6X6 bull of a lifetime. There I was. I obviously had the skill to get close enough, even I could make the 15 yard shot. As I sat there I said, "I can have him if I want him. Nope, I just don't want to write that $8000 check." I'm satisfies just being here.

IMHO,

THE JAMMER


Angler 1 said:


> Jammer,
> 
> Don't you do charters and have different prices for different kind of trips? not much different except one is fishing and one is hunting.
> 
> ...


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## THE JAMMER (Aug 1, 2005)

Now that's the funniest thing I've read on this board in a long time. How many of us would fall into a deer's "cull category?" I know I would.

THE JAMMER


sotol buster said:


> I wonder what the deer think of the hunters they see on my lease? Way past his prime, never going to amount to nothing, deformed, too young ,too old, should not be given the chance to breed more like him, and that's just my close freinds I hunt with!!!
> It's all a matter of which end of the barrel you are on.


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

Those high fences don't make the deer get bigger. Money and lots of work do.


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## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

this may ruffle a few feathers, but so be it. the words that iritate me the most are Boone&Crockett, Texas Trophy Hunters Assn, Buckmasters, score and genetics. they have made a business out of a pastime.
ya got 10 grand to spend? we'll put a 190 on yer wall.
Bill Gates could be the next trophy whitetail record holder just because he can spend it.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

Meanwhile back at the farm...


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## RockinU (Aug 13, 2006)

I still don't really understand all this apparent animosity. Is it just towards high-fence? Or is it artificially breeding? Is it pen-raising? Protein feeding? Selling deer? That all classes of deer are available for all kinds of prices? How apparently easy it can be if you have the means? I mean, if it's not your thing, don't participate. If you can't afford it, find another option. There is no reason to resent it. I am from very modest means, as are most of the guys I hunt with. We have worked hard, followed a plan, and are seeing results. We do sell some mature 8's to help us defray some of the expenses, we sell some quail too. Point is there are opportunities for most every budget, and aspiration, you just have to be creative sometimes. As long as everyone is enjoying what they are doing, and they are doing it in an ethical and legal manner, why should any of it bother anyone?


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

This Is Not A Thread About High Fences... Go Back To Post#1 And Start Reading!!!!!!!!!


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

*So....*



sotol buster said:


> I wonder what the deer think of the hunters they see on my lease? Way past his prime, never going to amount to nothing, deformed, too young ,too old, should not be given the chance to breed more like him, and that's just my close freinds I hunt with!!!
> It's all a matter of which end of the barrel you are on.


You're really saying that the deer know you well?

Good thing they can't shoot, huh? 

TH


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## RockinU (Aug 13, 2006)

Been reading since it started. My post isn't about High Fences either, don't know anything about them. I just don't understand, why everyone seems so peeved about so many things.


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

Me too... there is ample opportunity to hunt however you like here.


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## bountyhunter (Jul 6, 2005)

RockinU said:


> Been reading since it started. My post isn't about High Fences either, don't know anything about them. I just don't understand, why everyone seems so peeved about so many things.


Not sure what you mean with you say peeved about so many things. I was only making a point that saying I didn't like the terms "Cull" and "Meat Hunt".

Once more so everyone can see it, that point is...............

Don't label my deer as a Cull or a Management deer by your standards!

and

Aren't all hunts meat hunts, cause if they are not then something is very wrong!

This was never about how people hunt, where people hunt or why people hunt. It was not about the various different opportunities available in Texas for hunting. The only reason that Big Ranches and Big money were ever discussed at all is because it is those folks that like to determine what my deer should be labeled. I just want people to know that I don't want you labeling my deer and I'm sure there are others that feel the same way just judging from the number of greenies that I have gotten for this thread. You guys call your deer what ever you want, but stop labeling other people's deer!

I sure hope that is clear enough for everyone to understand, cause this is getting really tiring trying to explain.


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## Outcast (May 20, 2004)

Hey Bountyhunter!!! You started it!!  J/K It's good to vent and everyone has their opinions. We just all need to agree to disagree! Let's go hunting while we have some time left!!!


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

BH your last post IMO hit the nail ON THE HEAD, in one of my post the last sentence, "you come hunt with me and a trophy will be less than what you thought it would be".


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## capt_joe (Sep 19, 2006)

That was a really nice Steer....


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## LIONESS-270 (May 19, 2005)

We spend thousands of dollars, 100s of hours working on our place and feed dear round (low Fence)...We have family and friends help Harvest and kill "Cull" "inferior and "Management" deer and on occasion kill-harvest a trophy by our standards.....and have no problems with well run High fence operations or how others hunt legally or what names they use to refer to their kills/Harvest.

Get over it and go hunting......why all the whining?. 

Total wasted emotions on labels that are not going to change. Do your own thing...help other hunters when and all you can.... and if someone calls your deer/game something that you disagree with...PM or talk to them or ignore it.

JMO

Well said RockinU....Thanks

Oh...and I forgot. We do meat hunts too. every year we harvest/kill 2 extra deer that are comm. processed into Jerky...Vaccum packaged in 2oz packs labeled Thank you..ect...ect and sent to our troops in Iraq.
So Hunting names and labels don't mean a lot to us.

Everyone have a great and safe seasonn, Hunt Hard and enjoy....and a very Merry Christmas.


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

bountyhunter said:


> The only reason that Big Ranches and Big money were ever discussed at all is because it is those folks that like to determine what my deer should be labeled. I just want people to know that I don't want you labeling my deer and I'm sure there are others that feel the same way just judging from the number of greenies that I have gotten for this thread.


America is still a free market society and if a land owner can avoid going bankrupt by growing and selling big deer vs. starving on inadequate agricultural subsidies ... it should be honored ...

No one's labeling your deer ...


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## activescrape (Jan 8, 2006)

It's kind of crazy really. I've been killing deer since the 70's. That is 4 decades and I know there are many others on the board who have too. We never paid on lick of attention to Boone and Crockett, all we knew is that was for world record deer, something none of us had any fantasy of achieving. For decades when you told someone you got a deer the first question was, invariably, "How many points did he have?" That was it, how many points. Not how wide, how much mass, etal. If you could say "8", you were the man. You had done the deed, yep you had bragging rights, an 8 pointer was a goodun'. If you got more points that that you were a legend.

BUT, that was because nearly everyone killed every deer they saw with horns. So, I love it that people are passing up immature bucks now and that everyone has a chance for a buck that we only dreamed about when I was young in my career. I'm glad that there is no stigma anymore in killing a doe, it is definately better for the overall health of the herd to have a better balance between bucks and does. We have made lots of progress.

It's just that cull sounds disrespectful to me, it's like saying runt, you know, like it's worth less(and I don't mean monetarily) just because it's smaller or has smaller horns etal. I do not feel that way. I respect them all. 
I know it rubs some people the wrong way to have this opinion, but I can't help how I feel. We were just always so happy just to get a deer, period. Lots of hunters never lived through deer hunting that long ago and cull has been part of the terminology since they started deer hunting so it just sounds normal. 

Let's just say deer hunting has gone through a BIG change in my lifetime. It's not all bad, some of it is very good, but it just seems more clinical now. I don't like that part.

And one more time, never buy in to the concept that if you concede to PETA etal a little at a time you will eventually appease them. Pictures of deer with blood on them or with their tongues hanging out don't offend me in the least. That is reality, that is what you see when you do it, it is part of the experience. Killing an animal is primal, it's bloody, it's predatory. I don't know why I should feel the need to sugar coat it for fear someone might get offended, trust me, they are already offended. The only reason this is relevant is that I think some of the terminology we are talking about has it's roots in trying to not offend the people that despise us anyway.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

"meat hunt"
How many times have I heard " who cares ,you can't eat the horns"; to which I respond ," try mounting a hindquarter and hanging it on the wall"!!!

Happy hunting errrr-harvesting.


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## Solid Action (May 21, 2004)

Get over it and hunt. Stop worrying about what everyone else does. The terms cull, management deer and trophy are all relative to the area and the ranch anyway.


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## Outcast (May 20, 2004)




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