# Non-level wind reels



## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

I've been researching bigger reels for fishing for bigger fish, sharks, etc. from the surf and I have a question about keeping the line level on the spool.
Filling the spool with new line or reeling in a line without a fish should be no problem.
My question is will the line self-level when there is the extra weight of a fish or will it still need to be guided on with my thumb?
It seems it would be easy to forget about guiding the line while fighting a large fish.


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## jimj100 (Dec 1, 2012)

same rules apply. But it will become second nature. you are more likely to find yourself using your thumb to distribute line on a LEVEL WIND reel than you are to forget to distribute on a non-level wind after a little bit of use. Don't hesitate to get one.


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

Next question, I have a Penn 309. I have read that it would function/cast much better if I were to remove the level-wind. Would that be a good choice?

Also, what would be a good "beginner" non-levelwind reel?
I was considering getting a 6/0, but I can get a 9/0 cheaper from BassPro or even WalMart. The 6/0 is $179.99 and the 9/0 is $149.99.
What advantages does the 6/0 have over the 9/0 that would warrant the higher price tag? 
It would seem to me the 9/0 would be the obvious choice. It has more line capacity and a slightly higher drag weight. The only downside I can see is the 9/0 has a 2.5:1 gear ratio, while the 6/0 has a 2.9:1. The 9/0 would take longer to reel up, but would have a little more power to hoist in a large fish.
Any other suggestions or advice?


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## troutless (Feb 17, 2006)

If your after medium size Sharks 5'-6' I would recommend that a Daiwa Sealine HA 40 or 50 would be good choice. It cast good or better than Penn reel and you can get them from Charkbait.com for alittle over a hundred bucks and usually has free shipping. Now I yak out my baits on the 50 I would put on approximately 300 yards of 65 lb braid and fill it a 40 lb mono line plus a 400 or + mono leader with a 16/0 or 20/0 circle hooks.


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## troutless (Feb 17, 2006)

I would invest more money on high priced R&R until I fished a while to see if was my addiction. Oh, for bigger equipment I'll let the other guys answer your questions. Good luck.


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## Fishingmatt (Aug 16, 2012)

It becomes instinct like they said... You don't even think about it after you have done it a few times


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

I restarted surf fishing this summer after a 14 year absense, and I had only been a few times before that, so I'm not exactly sure what I am after, I just know eventually I'm going to want/require something bigger than my 309 and 209.
Another question about what rod to pair it with.
I am partial to Ugly-Stik and I'm thinking about getting a pair of the 12' BWC110012 rods for the 209 & 309.
Would this rod be a good choice for a bigger reel?


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## Rawpower (Jul 4, 2011)

I got this Daiwa Sealine 30 on CR a while back. These reels don't have a Levelwind on them. It takes a little getting use to. The first time I threw it a got a backlash from hell. Now I can chuck it a country mile. I have seen some guys take the level wind off their Ambassaduers. X3 on it becoming second nature on using your thumb. Just be careful with braided lines.


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

Isn't the X30 a little small as far as line capacity?
It holds about half as much as the Penn309, for almost 3 times the price.
The drag weight is also the same.
What am I missing?

I would eventually need something with more capacity to be able to kayak out baits a few hundred yards.


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## Rawpower (Jul 4, 2011)

I use this reel for Bull Reds and small Sharks. It is smaller than the 40â€™s and 50â€™s but I load it with braid so there is plenty of line. I bought it used so price was really cheap. Penn makes an awesome reel. If your heart is set on a Penn go for it . I have a few Penns but use them more for off shore. Either way you cant go wrong.


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

I'm not dead-set on a Penn. When I do get another reel, it will have more line capacity though.
The Daiwa you mentioned seems to be about the same as the 309 I already have, plus it's almost 3 times the cost of a 309. There has to be something to warrant that price difference. What is it?


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## bigwalt (Jul 4, 2013)

I just started using a 3/0 and 2 6/0 penn senators and I thought the same about trying to remember but once you do it there's really nothing to it. I found really good deals on them on ebay so you make take a look on there. There is some expensive ones but if you're patient you can buy them cheap. I paid less than $50 each for all 3 of mine.


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## setxdargel (Jun 8, 2011)

My only advice since you have already been given some would be to look for the U.S.Made Penns.The newer ones are made over seas.I was just given a new 9 and although it works it is definitely cheaper built.Go with a 6/0 as a beginner and slap some braid on bottom and bar pack it with your mono.My 6/0s have taken some serious abuse from Upper Coast average sharks up to 7 ft and only one had to be serviced.You can upgrade the drag washers for little of nothing.I'm with the others on now I run 50 and 80s but the 6/0 is a great Bull Red/Shark weapon.P.S. it's all personal preference but I don't like to give my sharks to much leverage so no 12 foot rods.I would much rather have one at 10' with back bone then one at 12 with a wippy tip.


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## 535 (May 23, 2004)

Dtrojcak said:


> I'm not dead-set on a Penn. When I do get another reel, it will have more line capacity though.
> The Daiwa you mentioned seems to be about the same as the 309 I already have, plus it's almost 3 times the cost of a 309. There has to be something to warrant that price difference. What is it?


going from a Penn 309 to a modern reel like the Daiwa or even a modern Penn is like going from a horse drawn carriage to corvette

like others have said, guiding the line on non-level wind will become second nature with very little thought or effort

I'd look at getting one of the Daiwa's is a 50 or look at the Penn GS 555... there are a lot of others in that size range that are great for casting pretty heavy baits (with the right rod) and when spooled with braid have enough capacity to yak baits... its a versatile setup. But if you are strictly going big like the 6/0 or 9/0 sized reels, casting isn't even a real option


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## SaltwaterTom (Jun 23, 2013)

My son and I had this same conversation last night; X4, it will become second nature to "self-levelwind" as you reel. I used to use Penn Longbeach models because they were inexpensive, hold huge amounts of line, and are easy to work on. Downside, they don't have a lot of drag, and they are slow to reel in. I finally bit the bullet and got a Penn Squall 15 (with the magnatic cast control) and an Avet MXJ. Yeah, they go for around $150, but Charkbait spooled them with 300 yards of braid and topped them with BBG for free plus free shipping. I wish I had bought these reels a long time ago. The Squall throws a mile without back lash and has a fast retrieve. The Avet is a land winch with a smooth as silk strong drag. I could never drop the money for an Accurate (I'm not judging), but that extra $110 ($55 X 2 reels) I spent as opposed to going cheaper was money well spent.


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## troutless (Feb 17, 2006)

X2 on Avet's, I've never heard a bad word on them and the BTB guys love them.


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## Mustad7731 (May 23, 2004)

*Surf Reels*

Dtr...
Before you go out and spend a lot of $$$$, I'd suggest you investigate
used reels...
The reels like the 6/0 or 9/0 are overkill in almost all cases...If you want 
as big a reel as you can cast without lots of problems and big enough to
Yak out with moderate size baits up to 2 lbs....I'd suggest something like
a used Penn GS 555. You can get about 300 to 400 yds of 40-50 lb braid
and 150 to 200 matching mono topshot 
This reel with a 10'-12' ugly stick will handle almost anything you will catch
in the surf!!! 
I don't think they are as "BulletProof" as the older made in America Penns, 
but, they are good reels with good casting characteristics, high speed 
retreive, sufficent line capacity and a price most of us can afford.
Later when you have seen a lot of other reels you will be better equiped
to start buying all that HIGH DOLLAR Gear that some guys on this board 
use....But it's up to you...
My $0.02
Mustad7731
Jack


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

Thanks for all of the advice. I'm not looking to buy anything bigger anytime soon. 
I just like doing research and getting expert advice beforehand in case I run across a good deal at a pawn shop, garage sale, etc.


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## Cylinder (Oct 8, 2006)

Dtr...

Penn 209's and 309's have landed a lot of fish over the last 60 years. They can land most 4'-5' sharks and any Bull Red on the Texas coast. Removing the level wind won't improve your casting distance enough to make a big difference, but it will let you learn to wind your line on without help. Removing the level wind will eliminate the chance of it screwing up in the middle of a cast or with a big fish on. I would do that in a heartbeat.

The 309 doesn't have the right design to cast as far as the wider casting reels, but will work for what your doing. A 12' UglyStik would be a good match with either reel and you can upgrade your reel as you see fit. 

Guessing the 6/0 is a "Special" with red sideplates vs. the 9/0, which has black sideplates. Neither of these is for casting. These are strictly for sharks larger than 5' and baits that are yaked, swam, or otherwise paddled out. I would go with the 9/0 for line capacity. Drags are comparable. There is not enough weight difference not to go bigger.

Hope this helps. Good luck, Roger


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## Cylinder (Oct 8, 2006)

PS: I would stay away from braided line in the beginning. Cost is one reason, but a burned thumb is the biggest reason. Be sure to put some water on your reel before your first cast. Roger


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## Dtrojcak (Jun 17, 2012)

I've taken the level wind out, but haven't fished with out yet. My rods are scheduled to arrive Friday and I'm planning on going fishing Sunday and Monday, so I'll see how it goes without the level wind. 
I've got about 150-200 yards of 50# braid with the rest filled with 30# big game on top of that. 
I've read that braid doesn't last too long rubbing on the sandbars, plus I can imagine the thumb burns that would inevitably happen. 
I figure with braid on bottom, I get a little extra yardage on the spool. Plus the braid will never even come off of the spool unless I've got something big on the line.


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