# 458 socom build



## Bird

I just started a 458 socom build. Planning on 16" heavy barrel, carbine length gas system and heavy buffer spring. I have read that opening up the ejection port a little is supposed to help reliability with ejection. Any other suggestions from 2cool socom shooters? Going to start building my lower this weekend.


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## Wado

*40 Smith and Russian*

I read a little bit about a guy that took 7.62x39 and chopped it and sized it up for .40 caliber and had a .40 caliber AR barrel reamed for this wildcat. He's shooting super sonic handloads with good success but I don't know what mod's he did if any to the gas or recoil system or the ejection port.


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## Navi

Stick with parts from Marty, or some of the few people he has authorized. There are a few out there that reengineered his chambers etc and I learned the hard way about buying them.


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## Bird

Navi said:


> Stick with parts from Marty, or some of the few people he has authorized. There are a few out there that reengineered his chambers etc and I learned the hard way about buying them.


 Apparently Marty has moved to the other side of the world. I think SBR inc is handling all the Teppo Jutsu stuff now. Wilson Combat has a good kit I'm looking at. Barrel feed ramp already ground and polished and includes heavy buffer spring, gas tube, adjustable gas block and complete BCG.


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## Bird

Got most of the upper and lower mostly complete. Aero Precision upper and lower, Anderson lower parts kit, Aero ambi charging handle and Black Rain ejection port cover. Need to order barrel, buffer tube, spring, buffer, BCG, barrel and furniture...


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## Bird

Few more pieces added. Going to order 14.5" SS Wilson Combat barrel with mid length gas system next week. Will have Wilson muzzle brake pinned and welded to make legal minimum length. Not sure about the hand guard yet. Either Aero Precision or Black Rain.


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## DIHLON

I would hate to have a chunk of lead that size flying at me. Is this going to be a pig killer?


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## Bird

DIHLON said:


> I would hate to have a chunk of lead that size flying at me. Is this going to be a pig killer?


Yes. 325gr Hornady FXT, 1750-ish fps should do the trick...


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## Bird

Have changed my mind on the Wilson Combat barrel kit. Going to go with Tromix for the barrel, brake, BCG, gas block and gas tube. The Tromix barrel uses the licensed and original chamber reamer measurements from Teppo Jutsu (the inventor of the 458 socom). They also offer all of those parts individually instead of a kit which gives me some versatility since I plan to build a couple more.


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## chicken fried

I liked the Tromix site also. I didnt know that about them i will surely use them if i decide to build one instead of getting a complete upper. That is a bad to the bone round.


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## Bird

Well, I ran into a road block so to speak. While waiting for my hand guard and barrel to arrive, I got my hands on some once fired brass. I had read that sometimes the port needs to be milled out on the upper and enlarged to give the spent case plenty room to eject. As you can see the results are not promising. I've got a call into my local gun store asking about the estimated cost to open this one up. I will likely just buy another upper from Tromix that is 458 ready.

FYI- Case measures 0.540" and ejection port measures 0.495". Milling drawing I found online shows opening should be 0.615". If any of you 2coolers are thinking of building a 458 socom, make sure you get a 458 ready upper or just buy a complete upper. Eventually this will be a super cool gun but for now it has been pretty frustrating finding the parts I want.


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## Ready.Fire.Aim

What ammo load specs are you using ( or buying)? 

Are you going to suppress the rifle?


I sat on the fence and finally ordered a Tromix 12" upper today. Tony Rumore has a good .458 SOCOM case gage, also bought that. 

I had him build a Saiga S12 SBS years ago, they do great work.


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## Bird

Ready.Fire.Aim said:


> What ammo load specs are you using ( or buying)?
> 
> Are you going to suppress the rifle?
> 
> I sat on the fence and finally ordered a Tromix 12" upper today. Tony Rumore has a good .458 SOCOM case gage, also bought that.
> 
> I had him build a Saiga S12 SBS years ago, they do great work.


Initially I will shoot ammo from SBR, 300-325 grain. I will reload with 325gr Hornady FXT looking for 1750fps-ish. Eventually I will suppress it and either SBR it or just build another. I want to get this one on the range and then look at cans as more come on the market. I've heard the Tromix case gauge is a must have for reloading 458 so will order one soon.


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## Bird

Changed my mind and decided to just grind out my Aero upper ejection port. It was pretty easy after all and came out better than I expected. I opened it up up from .495" to .580" and there is plenty clearance. A little flat black "black gun" touch up paint it should look new.


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## Ready.Fire.Aim

Very nice job opening up the ejection port!

Received a Tromix 12" upper and required reloading components.

Primed some brass, will load BARNES 300g TTSX tonight.


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## Bird

RFA, please post up your reloading results. I'm really excited about this cartridge. Made some more progress...


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## sleepersilverado

**** I wanted a 458 a few years back, you are giving me the itch again.


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## Wado

*Bolt Gun*

I am seriously thinking about doing a 458 bolt rifle. Monday I am going to call my machinist friend and see if he has done one yet. Anybody have an old Savage model 11 or Axis II laying around they need to get rid of for say...... 200 Bucks?







Pretty please?


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## Bird

Wado, please keep us posted if you build that one. Should be a cool build.


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## Wado

*Savage SOCOM*



Bird said:


> Wado, please keep us posted if you build that one. Should be a cool build.


I saw a Savage that had been barrelled to 458 on a hog hunting forum and it caught my interest. The pre- threaded barrel might be tricky locating, lots of stuff for AR's. Apache does them but according to the website they are not taking orders until they are caught up, sounds like quite a wait. I need to get rid of a couple of safe queens anyway.


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## Wado

*Socom*

Well, parts are coming and I ordered a Lee die set. Poop on the internet is Lee's are a waste of time so I guess I will see. I can use the crimp die if the rest is junk and suck it up and buy the Redding if I can find one. Lee's are supposed to work if you lube heavy and the first run of dies were supposedly out of dimension, more internet poop.hwell:


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## Bird

There is plenty reported on Hornady dies not being in spec either. Still $90 for a set of Redding's is a lot for a 2 die set


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## muney pit

Wado said:


> Well, parts are coming and I ordered a Lee die set. Poop on the internet is Lee's are a waste of time so I guess I will see. I can use the crimp die if the rest is junk and suck it up and buy the Redding if I can find one. Lee's are supposed to work if you lube heavy and the first run of dies were supposedly out of dimension, more internet poop.hwell:


I have several lee sets and they work fine. The crimp is great. I wouldnt worry about there die sets. I even use there press to size my 50 bmg rounds because it has a bigger opening than my rcbs one. The handle is hollow and the piece that holds it to the press is know to break but i havent yet.


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## Wado

*Lee Dies*

I have several Lee dies that work just fine, just the SOCOM is getting a bad reputation for some reason. Anyway I have a backup if it is caca. Three months to get a barrel unless something changes when I call Monday.


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## Bird

Just a quick update on my 458. A few guys at work wanted custom 5.56 AR's so I'm in the process of building 5 other rifles so I set the 458 aside for now. I'll get back to it in a couple months to finish it up. Hopefully Wado will keep us posted with his build while I finish this other project...


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## Wado

*Getting There*

Time for an update. I went scavenger hunting for an action and pretty much struck out in the pawn shop/used variety for my fantasy 200 dollar donor. It looks like Axis is the economy Savage go to now but just wasn't what I wanted so I went for a plain Modell 11 bottom safety with the detachable magazine. I ended up buying a new raffle gun somebody traded after they stripped the scope off of it for a little bit more than I wanted to spend but it's brand new. I am going to try the plastic stock it came in before I get too carried away with this science project. I might do some glassing to try and stiffen this thing up. I already bought brass from Graf's and saw it's back in stock at Midway. They had nickel plated but now have both, might ought to get another hundred before they disappear. Projectiles are no problem, picked up some Hornady 300 grain hollow points at Academy for about 40 cents each, Barnes will be more. Might have to research on the powder but I have some I believe will get me started. I have a set of Lee dies and bought a Redding full length die just in case so they are available. Now for the good part, a barrel. That's still up in the air.

I pulled the donor out today to get the barrel out so this might be a bit off the subject but it might help someone if they mess with a Savage. This rifle has a smooth barrel nut and Wheeler sells a wrench for it. I was going to make one but for a little over twenty dollars you get both styles. Reading the forty plus reviews I almost didn't but there are a bunch of folks out there that just don't get it so I ordered it any way. First, you HAVE to use an action wrench. I have a home made one that I pulled dozens of Mauser barrels off and had a barrel vise in my other shop but it was attached permanently to the bench so when I moved it stayed. Second it comes with a brass shim, you have to use it and align the gap of the shim with the gap in the wrench. Look at the pictures. Third, you have to get this on the nut squarely and use the recoil lug to help position it. It comes with an all threaded bolt and if you over tighten it it's going to shear off, I think they did this so you can't over tighten the wrench and crush the nut. I tightened the bolt to where the gap in the wrench was closing then hit the wrench with a dead blow hammer with the action secured in the action wrench. The first lick slipped the wrench. I tightened it a hair more and gave it another whack and the nut and barrel spun off together. The problem is with this wrench when you tighten it down it compresses the nut to the barrel therefore locking it up. If you hold it by the barrel you can beat on it until you pass out, it ain't coming. You have to hold the action. Loosen the bolt on the wrench and the nut will spin off by hand but while it's tight you can't budge it.

Last but not least, when they blue or phosphate these guns some of the chemical or something gets in the barrel threads. It's best to clean this off before removing the nut. I just used air and some gun blaster cleaner then brushed the threads with a bronze brush. A little 3in1 oil and it spun off.

Don't ask me how the end of that action wrench got beat up. My Dad used it for a punch or something.:headknock


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## Bird

Cool!


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## Wado

*Barrel*

I just put a deposit on a Mcgowen SS barrel. I haven't checked my e mail to see if they had a blank. If not, it's going to be a while.


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## blfuller123

I built this 458 last year, I just got the Form 4 for my can.


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## Ready.Fire.Aim

blfuller123 said:


> I built this 458 last year, I just got the Form 4 for my can.


How do you like the Bower's can? Did you get a .50 or .458?
Mine is in NFA jail for a few more months.


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## blfuller123

Ready.Fire.Aim said:


> How do you like the Bower's can? Did you get a .50 or .458?
> Mine is in NFA jail for a few more months.


Its the 458. I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet.


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## Bird

Let us know how you like the Bowers can. I've been looking at the Silencerco Hybrid of my 458 when I finally finish it


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## Wado

*Extended Magazine*

Since it looks like I may be drawing social security before I get the barrel for my Savage SOCOM I decided to take a stab at making a high capacity magazine for the 458. Snyder Fabrication will do them but they don't offer a 458 but might do it at your risk, I don't know I did contact them about making one though with a .243 mag. After some searching I learned a .300 WSM mag will work with some mod's so I got a couple then I saw how to do an extended one with a HK 91 mag. This ain't too easy and you need a lot of tools so Snyder would be the way to go if they will do it. First, you need a steel HK magazine and usually they are about nine bucks. I bought one for twenty.







Then you have to machine the spot welds off to get the plate at the top of the mag off that has the stops for the H&K. I cut mine at three inches but two is the standard for making a .308 ten rounder after you weld it to the Savage mag. There is a four degree angle on the Savage bottom so I cut the other one to match it. Welding the H&K mag was like welding an old piece of exhaust pipe, not easy even with my mig machine set to 22 gauge. The follower of the donor has to be epoxied to the bottom of the Savage's and has some major alteration to pull this off. I spot welded an angle bracket to anchor it to the Savage follower that has a recess in the bottom of it. If I had a torch and some brass I would have brazed the halves, I had a heck of a time cleaning the well of the mag up. After welding them then you have to take the plastic Savage mag base and cut the inside out to slip it over the body and snap it in place where it belongs. The first time I put it on upside down and almost didn't get it off.







This conversion is for either an Axis or a Model 11 with the bolt release in the trigger guard the top release models are a different process. To make the nose heavy fat SOCOM feed a ramp has to be installed in the front of the mag well and I believe I cut it at 21 degrees. I put it in with machine screws and modified the follower so it would fit. Finally it is put together using the H&K spring that you have to cut off, that's trial and error. I loaded six rounds in it and they all fed and I believe if I play with the spring I should get ten in it. If you have an AR 458 you don't have to go through all this mess, just use standard 5.56 mags with a little grinding. Pics.


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## Wado

*Feed Ramp*

I made the ramp out of a piece of solid nylon I had laying around. Of course it had to be ran through my planer and a step machined in it to match the two different mag's then drilled and counter bored for the nuts to sit in. I am not doing this again, I still have to modify the three round 300 WSM mag. Cheers.:brew2:


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## Bird

Great work!


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## Wado

*McGowen Custom Barrels*

I just received my tracking number for my barrel. It should be here Monday with any luck. I had them put a turbo brake on it and got a slotted nut also. I have been looking at a Boyd's stock and may spring for one if the tupperware one gives me the redazz. I just realized it's a youth length. Hurry up and finish that AR build that should be interesting.


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## muney pit

Keep up the great reports. Build is looking awesome. Thanks for all the effort in letting us see your progress


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## Wado

*$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$*

I guess this is we build stuff. Try to keep five fingers on each hand and two eyeballs in the process. 
http://www.cmmginc.com/product-category/rifles/458-socom/


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## muney pit

Wado said:


> I guess this is we build stuff. Try to keep five fingers on each hand and two eyeballs in the process.
> http://www.cmmginc.com/product-category/rifles/458-socom/


Wow. They're proud of them for sure.


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## Bird

Just a quick update. My barrel and brake will ship tomorrow from Tromix. 16.25" SS 1:14 twist. Hopefully here next Tuesday. I promise build complete pics ASAP.

Thanks to Wado for keeping me motivated


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## Wado

*Socom*

What's next? I have to take a break on these projects. I haven't put the pencil to my addition yet but I can guarantee I went over budget. I used to buy Mauser rifles just for the actions and sunk tons of money in them before I had something worth a dang. AR's and Savages are way easier to mess with and deliver in the end, but, are just as addictive. I better stay away from that Tromix site.


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## 78thomas78

Loaded some test subsonic pills to try through the hybrid at the ranch this weekend! Sub data is hard to find on anything under 500 grain pills. After much looking/reading I found one person shooting 325's as sub speeds. Will report back next week if there is anybody else looking to do the same.


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## Bird

Last of my parts arrived today. Finally finished the 458 socom. In all the excitement I forgot to take pics of the parts as I was putting them all together but here are a couple of pics of the finished product.

Aero Precision upper and lower, Fail Zero nickel boron BCG, Aero 15" free float MLok hand guard, Tromix 16.25" SS barrel with Tromix brake.

Big hole on the business end!

For comparison 223 with 77gr pill, 300 Blk with 110gr pill, 458 socom with 350gr sledgehammer


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## Wado

A couple of questions. Do you do anything to the threads on the barrel like lapping or polishing or the retainer nut as well? And there is some kind of neverseize I read about you must use. I guess when kitchen table gunsmiths started making these at home there was a few incidents where the barrel spun off on these big bores. I figured it was just a screw together job to put a barrel in an AR and no head spacing or how is that accomplished? Anyway it looks like some real fun. One tip on bullet seating, get a better die than the Lee. It is hard as heck to get the projectiles to go straight without a bullet guide built in to the die. It's way worse than 45 Auto going in crooked. I checked my rounds with a Hornady concentricity gauge and some were almost ten thousands out and no way to straighten them. You may be tempted to lube the inside of the necks to make it easier but according to the experts this causes terrible accuracy, I don't know I have yet to fire a round off. Another thing, lube heavy and resize new brass and trim it before you load it. I took a short cut and loaded fifty rounds right out of the bag and then decided to try and chamber a couple. Out of five I had one that was pretty snug in my bolt gun. It left a nice line right on the tiny shoulder of the case. I didn't get a case gauge so if the bolt won't shut shame on me. I don't think I can pull these bullets and my inertia bullet puller won't work either keep that in mind if you make a mistake. My next quest is to find some CCI 350 primers, all of mine are Winchester Large Pistol and they were sure hard to push in for some reason. I'm anxious to see some targets with big holes in them.


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## Bird

Wado, the barrels slide into the upper receiver and have manufacturer installed receiver extension pre ground feed ramps for the 458. Headspace is set by the extension lip, any other headspace issues will require adjusting the sizing die to move the shoulder where it needs to be. Barrel nut slides over barrel and gets the snot torqued out of it. I think mine is around 60 ft lbs and yes I used high temp antiseize.

Tony at Tromix said he finds no real difference in the Hornady and Redding die sets and kinda prefers the Hornady because of the bullet seating collar that slides down.

Go read the FAQ's about 458 socom on the Black butterfly ammo website. Really good info about shooting and reloading these thunder beasts.


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## Wado

Bird said:


> Wado, the barrels slide into the upper receiver and have manufacturer installed receiver extension pre ground feed ramps for the 458. Headspace is set by the extension lip, any other headspace issues will require adjusting the sizing die to move the shoulder where it needs to be. Barrel nut slides over barrel and gets the snot torqued out of it. I think mine is around 60 ft lbs and yes I used high temp antiseize.
> 
> Tony at Tromix said he finds no real difference in the Hornady and Redding die sets and kinda prefers the Hornady because of the bullet seating collar that slides down.
> 
> Go read the FAQ's about 458 socom on the Black butterfly ammo website. Really good info about shooting and reloading these thunder beasts.


The Lee seats them crooked, I don't care how good you start them and pull the ram lever slow because you are pushing a slug of air ahead of the bullet. I ordered a Redding seater that is supposed to have a bullet guide but not a sliding one like the competition model, those babies are over a c note each. I have a collection of Wilson chamber seaters for my bolt rifles that set bullets as straight as you can get, if your brass is good to begin with. I will check out the







website, hope I don't get a virus. Sounds like a coochie mama site.

I ordered a Redding seater so we'll see how it works.


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## Bird

*458 socom range report*

So off to the range and a few more things to figure out. First off this thing is a true thunder beast. Recoil is like a single shot 20gauge with 3" shells, but the muzzle blast of a 10gauge goose gun. It wouldn't be fun without the brake...

The rounds wouldn't feed so I had to grind the front of the mag down. Part of the problem is that with standard AR15 magazine followers the rounds aren't angled up enough to allow the round to strip out of the mag and up the feed ramp. After the first couple shots I realized the lips on top of the mags needed to be bent up a little to allow the round to angle up and ride higher in the mag so the bolt could consistently strip and feed rounds. The first 5 rounds were mostly single shot.


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## DIHLON

Now you're just teasing us by not showing us the softball sized holes it punched in the targets. Lol.


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## Bird

Ok Dihlon...here it is. 50 yards, from shooting bench, unsupported i.e. no rest or sandbag, 25mph wind and a red dot sight I grabbed from the shelf. The other holes are from my 10yr old shooting his 22 for comparison. Nevermimd the random shots, he was just shooting as fast as he could.


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## DIHLON

Nice! :cheers:


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## Ready.Fire.Aim

I use Lancer 20 round polymer mags in my 458. They have steel uppers mounted to polymer bodies. I have had zero problems feeding. I read that tip on the 458 Forum.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/26...rfighter-magazine-ar-15-223-remington-polymer


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## Bird

Thought I'd add a summary of the things I learned in case any of y'all want to put together a 458 in an AR platform.

Buy an upper that has the ejection port milled out for a 458
Buy your bolt and barrel from the same manufacturer so you don't need to worry about headspace issues
Get a big muzzle brake
Get a case gauge from SBR or Tromix
Read what magazines work best for the rounds you are shooting. Consider getting 458 followers for your GI mags if you choose to use metal.
Run the gun pretty wet while breaking in and clean often, especially around the bolt and locking lugs on the barrel.
Consider buying a complete upper and avoid lots of the builder surprises I had. There is no Mil-Spec for 458 socom parts


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## Wado

*Socom*

When you find loading components buy them. For some reason 300 grain .458 bullets are scarce right now where I shop. If you need a case gauge and can't find one call Wilson, they make them. I called them and they made me a case holder for their trimmer, 21 bucks. Lube heavy when you resize. I hope you get yours running that's all I have to offer until something else comes up. I got McGowen's turbo brake if that's any consolation. A little pricey but it's back bored with a blast chamber the way it looks and works really well. I think some brakes are just cylinders with holes in them and I saw one a machinist made with the holes slanted forwards, I thought they should slant back or be neutral. Correct me if I am wrong.


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## MrG

Bird said:


> Thought I'd add a summary of the things I learned in case any of y'all want to put together a 458 in an AR platform.
> 
> Buy an upper that has the ejection port milled out for a 458
> Buy your bolt and barrel from the same manufacturer so you don't need to worry about headspace issues
> Get a big muzzle brake
> Get a case gauge from SBR or Tromix
> Read what magazines work best for the rounds you are shooting. Consider getting 458 followers for your GI mags if you choose to use metal.
> Run the gun pretty wet while breaking in and clean often, especially around the bolt and locking lugs on the barrel.
> Consider buying a complete upper and avoid lots of the builder surprises I had. There is no Mil-Spec for 458 socom parts


I'll add a few.

I built mine from the Wilson Combat 14.5" upper kit. Barrel, headspaced BCG, adjustable gas block, gas tube, muzzle device, and heavy recoil spring. I bit the bullet and bought their stripped lower just for the rollmark. The guys on the 458 forum frown on any barrels that aren't licensed by Teppo Jutsu but Wilson Combat has a large market standing and is a well known brand. Their customer service has been over and above.

I opened my upper up myself. Not all that hard with a Dremel. The effort was worth the cost savings. I was planning to have the rifle cerakoted so the raw edges didn't bother me. If I were going to leave it black I would buy a premilled upper.

I couldn't afford to shoot this thing enough to enjoy owning it if I didn't reload. It's still not cheap.

I bought brass and Redding dies from kakindustry.com. $100 set of dies but have had zero issues. Think I read someone on here that said, "Buy once, cry once." Just looked at their site and they have dies and 100 pieces of brass for $160. Get it.

Imperial Sizing Wax is your friend. You don't want to stick a $1 piece of brass in a $50 die.

Load data calls for CCI350 large pistol magnum primers. I get mine at Academy. $4/100 but I'm not gonna shoot 1000 rounds out of this thing in quite awhile.

LilGun, while quite accurate, is temperature sensitive. Loads worked up in January show pressure signs in August. AA1680 is what I worked up my last batch in. Happy. H4198 is recommended by a lot of internet folks. I have a couple of pounds so that is my next foray.

You can spend as much money on .458 bullets as you have in the bank. Some approaching $3 per. I figure that anything weighing 300+ grains moving at 1600+fps will do as much damage as is needed to succumb any critter any of us will ever encounter in Texas from a reasonable range. I load Hornady's because they're easy to find and relatively cheap. 40 to 60 cents/bang. Yesterday Cabelas in Waco had 325gr FTX for $24/50. I'll guarantee you that bullet will turn a mule deer's neck into a sack of jello at 125 yards.

I'd recommend a 4 lb+ trigger. I have a Geissle S3G in mine and with it's short reset will bump fire 2 or 3 round bursts from the bench if it's not properly anchored to the shoulder and you don't follow through with the trigger pull. That will make your but pucker. On my list to change out.

Recoil? I'd say a 20ga auto.

I haven't had any issues with regular MagPul mags. The 30's seem to bulge a little when fully loaded but still seem to work. 20's work great. I do have a couple of Lancers which are recommended buy Wilson Combat.

Now for the good news. I spent many many hours of internet research before I ever loaded a round. You've heard that if it's on the internet it must be true. I don't know how many times I've ducked my head under a concrete shooting bench to light off the first round of a new load with the .458. I was in Cabelas yesterday and noticed that there were a few new editions of reloading manuals. I thumbed through a couple and lo and behold, there she was. I brought home the Lyman's 50th. It even has a few subsonic loads. Evidently I stuck my head under the bench for nothing. The loads are pretty much what I worked up originally.

Last but not least, Imperial Sizing Wax is your friend.

A few pics. My Cerakote guy put the WC logo and '458 Socom' on the upper.


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## Wado

*SOCOM Reamer*

When I ordered my barrel from McGowen I asked about the reamer. They told me it matched the ammo being produced so it was standardized I guess you would say. I used PTG headspace gauges also.


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## MrG

Loaded up some subs from the Lyman manual. 530gr Potsel's. All came out of the end of the barrel. The 1680 loads pretty much went into the same hole at 25yds. I'm working on chronoing them to make sure they are really subs. I'll shoot them at 100yds to see if they stay straight. Much more recoil than the 325's at 1600fps


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## Bird

Keep us posted with your load data! Appreciate the info.


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## M9

*Radical Firearms is what i used...*

I purchased a complete upper from Radical Firearms to avoid any of the issues with the port and ejection. I have only shot 300gr Barnes factory loaded ammo through it but i can say that it has been a flawless running weapon that is just deadly for hogs within 100 yards. At 100 yards, best i can get is a 2" group with my 16" barrel. I also am fortunate to own a SilencerCo Hybrid that serves to tame the noise a bit. I do have friend that purchased the same upper and has some ejection issues with the poly case ammo. I will try and post some pictures of the completed build when i get back in town....it is a fantastic gun.


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## M9

One other thing...my gun likes to run pretty wet. Instead of using expensive gun oil from Academy...i just purchased a quart of 10-30 Mobile1 that I have been using on all my ARs and have had no issues. Best luck to you....it's a fantastic weapon to have.


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## Bird

Spent some quality time at the range today with some A1680 and Lil'Gun and Hornady 325 FTX pills. 34, 35 and 36 grains of A1680 just wouldn't give me the numbers I was looking for. Tried 28, 29 and 30 grains of Lil'Gun with good to OMG results. Turns out 28 gr of LG gave me an avg of 1745fps. The 29 and 30 gr loads were flattening primers and getting ejector marks on the brass. I'm going to try some 4198 loads tomorrow. By the way, 1868fps with a 325'pill out of a 458 is really hot. The plus side is no cycling problems :wink:


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## Wado

*Maxed out*

I think I read a lot of comments on the SOCOM forums that 28.5 grains of Lil' Gun was about it for a max load and seemed to be a bit hot when the temp's go up. I have a bunch of new loads made up for my Savage but haven't tried them. I came down with a nasty sinus/cold event right after I put them together. I shot some loads with 4198 and wasn't impressed and saw a lot of un-burnt powder in the barrel but I was probably on the low end and a heavier charge might clean it up. What was up with the 1680, a little on the slow side or malfunctions in feeding? That stuff is supposed to make plenty of gas to run an AR.


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## Bird

The A1680, which I really like using in my AR's of all calibers, just wouldn't get the velocity I wanted and there was no consistency. At 35.9gr (max load suggested by Western Powder) the best I got was 1588 but I had as low as 1034. I'm not giving up on it, but will load and shoot the Lil'Gun for a while. At first I thought it might be my chrono but all of the Lil'Gun loads were pretty consistent (SD 30.4) and I shot them after the 1680. 

FYI- I'm using CCI 350 magnum large pistol primers which might have a little extra spark over the Winchester large pistol primers. Just more stuff to try out.


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## Wado

*Weird Science*

There's something strange going on with your loads of 1680 varying almost 500fps. I would imagine accuracy even at fifty yards would be an issue for sure. I am switching to CCI 350's also and I am hoping after fire forming my brass my targets look a little better.:ac550:


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## Bird

I introduced my 458 to 5 2x10's that were nailed together. 2 shots with Hornady 325gr FTX pills punched all the way through and blew the back couple boards off. I recovered one of the bullets which had really impressive weight retention.


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## Bird

Here's a close up of the bullet I recovered. I haven't weighed it yet, but I'd expect 90% weight retention or better.


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## MrG

A buddy's first reaction to the .458. Listen to the last line.


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## snapperlicious

Things a beast. MrG at 8 years old you better be careful when you shoot that thing! Lol


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