# Garden soil help.



## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

The wife and I backup to Oyster creek and we cleared a small patch of land a couple years ago for our garden. The soil, although seemingly fertile, doesn't have great texture and dries out quickly. I've attached a couple pictures of what it looks like. It sends to be a pretty fine pilly(if that is a word)type of texture and typically has a crust that forms on the top after tilling. the layer under the crust will keep moisture but the texture is horrible for things like opions and potatoes. After rain and water the soil simply starts packing in. We've added compost and leaves etc. every year it seems to help but what could I do to offset the texture and help get that nice black loose garden soil?

Here are some pictures for reference.

Also if anyone can tell me the proper name of the soil type i'm working with and what causes it


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## chumy (Jul 13, 2012)

could be gumbo, gypsum is a good product to loosen that soil up along with compost.

I've used the above in my gumbo along with sand, top soil over the years to achieve the texture I want.


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## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

I've thrown some gypsum powder out. I guess i could bring in some sand too.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

My garden is totally sand. I add nutrients all the time. Onions & potatoes like sand. I personally think all veggies grow good in sand. I'm lucky cause my whole farm is like living on the beach. 
However I do have to pump the water to it. I have well water & drip irrigation on a timer.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

Just from the pictures and description....sounds like gumbo. If it were mine, and of course its not, I would bring in a load of topsoil and spread it around. After that get as much organic matter as you can in it. Till it all in and as time goes on, keep adding organic matter. It will be some work, but the rewards are worth it!


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## jm423 (Sep 18, 2011)

I call it "buckshot clay" in polite society, if it tills up into pellets. As others have posted, organic matter and some sandy topsoil will help. Just a matter of getting enough of each. Wouldn't mind having a little of yours to mix into my "post oak blowsand"-not suggesting a trade though.


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## peckerwood (Jun 9, 2012)

Meadowlark said:


> Just from the pictures and description....sounds like gumbo. If it were mine, and of course its not, I would bring in a load of topsoil and spread it around. After that get as much organic matter as you can in it. Till it all in and as time goes on, keep adding organic matter. It will be some work, but the rewards are worth it!


Exactly what I have done,and am finally getting my gumbo to loosen up.Lots of horse ****,pea vines,sand,and anything else that's not clay.After 10 years I'm seeing very good results.The only problem I have is catching it dry enough to till for spring planting.We use to have peanut dryers up here and they'd give you all the shells you wanted.They sure worked good in tight land.Folks turned to cotton hull from the gins,and really screwed up because of the defoliant that was sprayed on it.


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## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

I tried the old mason jar text yesterday. and noticed a good bit of separation but also noticed that i had larger clumps in the bottom. I shook the jar hard again and this morning it was basically water and ultrafine particles no defined 3 types of soil components. I might have messed up by shaking it twice though.


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## jm423 (Sep 18, 2011)

JG, I think you just confirmed what we thought--you have a plain old clay soil, and again , organics and sand, time and tillage are the answer. PW, know what you mean about cotton burrs-we screwed up a garden spot with them. This was when they were using an arsenic based defoiliant ahead of cotton strippers. Don't know what is used now, am out of cotton country (and plan to stay uot!)


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

peckerwood said:


> ....Folks turned to cotton hull from the gins,and really screwed up because of the defoliant that was sprayed on it.


I've heard that but what I experienced was about as bad....got a load of mushroom compost one time and it was littered with condoms (clearly used) and syringes (also clearly used) and no telling what else in there.

Needless to say, I don't trust anything I don't personally get from my land. It can take many years to build a great garden soil and all that work and expense can be negated in just one bad event.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Meadowlark said:


> I've heard that but what I experienced was about as bad....got a load of mushroom compost one time and it was littered with condoms (clearly used) and syringes (also clearly used) and no telling what else in there.
> 
> Needless to say, I don't trust anything I don't personally get from my land. It can take many years to build a great garden soil and all that work and expense can be negated in just one bad event.


Never had that problem. I see some rubber gloves & thats it. Grown some great gardens with mushroom compost from Monterrey Mushroom. Been using it forever.


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## cajunautoxer (Aug 10, 2011)

how big is the area for your garden? I moved to a new house last fall and instead of trying to fix the soil I opted for a raised bed


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

Rubberback said:


> Never had that problem. I see some rubber gloves & thats it. ...


You better hope they were just rubber....gloves. LOL, not for me.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Meadowlark said:


> You better hope they were just rubber....gloves. LOL, not for me.


They were! After using the chips this year I'm going back to black plastic too. The weeds are growing like mad. I'm not lazy just have better things to do than pick weeds for hours on in. Plus, the black plastic retains heat & my plants would be a lot bigger especially my maters.


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## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

Thanks for the help again guys. To answer a couple questions. Garden is roughly 30x30. Last year I had a load of compost brought in from a local nursery and let me tell you we had more weeds then ever before. the whole garden turned into a long thinned bladed grass farm. I was great to keep moisture in the ground but sucked for everything else.

I'll do some more research on amended my clay soil. I took another sample yesterday of the soil and this a.m. the jar was basically all a fine light brown material. No real separation of material at all.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Lark, I know your against using Mushroom Compost because yours contained needles & rubbers etc. I asked you once before Where did you get yours ? I've been using it for at least 10 years. 
It is good stuff. I use bird poop for my maters but never have enough to do all my gardens. With this soil I have it does not hold nutrients for more than a year. So, every spring I have to add to the soil. My soil after a year is like turning over an hour class. 
So, this being said I have to add some backbone to the soil. 
I've tried topsoil, garden mixs etc. but didn't have much luck. The best additive & cheapest has been Mushroom Compost. 
Again, yes I find rubber gloves in it. Guess they use the gloves to pick the mushrooms. But if I ever found what you found I guarantee I would show Monterrey Mushroom farm what I found & I guarantee they would stop that from ever happening again.


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## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

Well here is the results of my highly scientific mason jar test..


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

Rubberback said:


> Lark, I know your against using Mushroom Compost because yours contained needles & rubbers etc. I asked you once before Where did you get yours ? ....


It was several years ago, and purchased from a local re-seller. No idea where it originally came from.

Just reporting my experience. Just the facts, as Friday used to say.


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## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

JuiceGoose said:


> Well here is the results of my highly scientific mason jar test..
> 
> ...


So, what do you conclude?


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Meadowlark said:


> It was several years ago, and purchased from a local re-seller. No idea where it originally came from.
> 
> Just reporting my experience. Just the facts, as Friday used to say.


I remember Friday! The stuff just adds texture to my soil & seems to grow veggies & its cheap. That's all! I'll continue to use it.


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## Ready.Fire.Aim (Sep 22, 2009)

For gardening With that soil, it would be easier and more productive to create raised beds with sides. 

Then bring in load of Rose bed mix from TexasGarden Soils in Brazosport ( Richwood off of FM 523). 979-848-2282. 

Start small with a 4 ft wide bed 16 ft long 10" high and see if that method is more productive with less work.

I buy dump truck loads of high quality mushroom compost from them. ( no syringes or condoms ).


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Ready.Fire.Aim said:


> For gardening With that soil, it would be easier and more productive to create raised beds with sides.
> 
> Then bring in load of Rose bed mix from TexasGarden Soils in Brazosport ( Richwood off of FM 523). 979-848-2282.
> 
> ...


I like the stuff! I wish I could mend my soil without having to add all the time. But it won't happen here. Its sand & needs backbone every year. I've found the cheapest route is MC. Its cheap & works.


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## JuiceGoose (Oct 4, 2006)

Any close mushroom compost places to katy?


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## Muddskipper (Dec 29, 2004)

Do what RFA is saying.....I would even make it simpler and not do side....just long rows.

There is a reason you don't see many veggie farms in your area....

Compost should be followed by mulch to suppress weeds on top.....weeds will take over any bare area w/ fertile soil especially in your area.

Last- if you ever have the opportunity to get shredded tree trimmings in bulk.....get it....I'm talking 3-5 cubic yards......blend that in your soil on your area.


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## Wado (May 15, 2011)

*Concrete*

I have the exact same soil, it works up beautifully but once it gets wet it packs into something similar to Portland Cement. I have a feeling the area I am in was a rice field years ago or had massive amounts of cotton grown on it. I have gardened in this same spot for about five years and it is progressively getting looser due to the corn stalks and pea bushes I have been working in. I have seen soil in Frio County ( the red kind ) that would crust over and keep wheat from sprouting, usually happens after a short hard rain followed by dry wind. Right now I have peas pushing through and have to keep it damp so they can break the crust. Just need a bunch of compost, best garden we ever had in gumbo was heavily fertilized with cow manure. My dad and I shoveled manure out of cattle pens into pickups for three days and spread it out by hand. We smelled like a cow pen for days.


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