# New to fly fishing question ?



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

Going to Carpenter Dam to catch me some rainbow trout this weekend. Question is I was there a few weeks ago. Caught a few on spinner bait with a spinning reel. I gutted those fish at home and inside their stomach is full of them algae weed that grows on the bottom floor. This will be my first time trying to catch a rainbow on a fly. Queston is should is is there a fly bait that imatates those algae weeds. If not what will be a few bait to use four rainbow trout in the 1-2lb wieght ? I have a few clousers. Was told they were good for white bass but would them rain bow trout go for these clousers ? You guys don't mind posting some of the pictures to go with some of them fly. Really appreciated. Thanks for your help.


----------



## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

If they ate a spinner bait, then they're not exclusively eating algae stuff. You sure it wasn't just poo? Try flies that would imitate the spinner you were using. Clouser may work, but try other small streamer patterns like a wooley booger.


----------



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

Ni sir it was not poo. It was the same stuff that kept getting hooked on to my spinner bait. Absolutely sure. Everyone of them trout intestine was pack full of it all the way to their throat.


----------



## southpaw (Feb 25, 2009)

Huh, just looked it up. Apparently they do eat algae, along with just about anything else out there. Welp, I'd still say throw something that looks and moves similar to that spinner you caught them on. Also, go to a nearby fly shop and ask them what's been working.


----------



## Permit Rat (May 13, 2014)

southpaw said:


> Huh, just looked it up. Apparently they do eat algae, along with just about anything else out there. Welp, I'd still say throw something that looks and moves similar to that spinner you caught them on. *Also, go to a nearby fly shop and ask them what's been working*.


 ^^This^^.....There is no substitute for local up-to-the-minute knowledge....like when certain hatches start to come off.


----------



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

My theory is that ever since they back up on the water release at the dam no more bait fish is coming down the dam. I see no bait activity in the river at all. These fish were raise in hatchery. Feed a diet consist of vegi and released into the wild. Now they must adapt when live bait is scarse and started to eat the algae to survive. Similar to what they were feed.
And guess what. Them trout are all fat and healthy eating those algaes. I'll take some pics this time when i catch some and gut them. Show it to y'all.


----------



## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

Bruce, 

I've never heard of or tried anything to imitate algae for catching rainbows...but sure would be interested to see that. 

I've fished Carpenter a few times and had pretty good luck with nymphs fished down through the algae...i.e. hare's ear and other nymphs like the prince, pheasant tail, copper bounced along on the bottom and fished with short strips. Also, you can't go wrong with sow bugs on just about any Ark creek. 

Be sure to keep an eye out for big stripers chasing shad on the surface...and maybe take a casting rod you can rig with a balloon and live shad...some very big stripers there. 

Here's a hare's ear nymph with and without a beadhead...the BH helps get it down to where the fish are feeding among the algae on the bottom. Good luck and tight lines.

p.s. I'll be looking forward to those pictures of the algae eating trout.


----------



## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

I wonder if those trout were eating scuds? Scuds hang out in the bottom algae and muck and are big on trout's menu. They might be getting little scuds that are hard to see and some algae with them.


----------



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

Show me some pics of a scud and I'll look for it with a magnafying glasses next time I gut them.


----------



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

Meadowlark said:


> Bruce,
> 
> I've never heard of or tried anything to imitate algae for catching rainbows...but sure would be interested to see that.
> 
> ...


Thanks Larry for the pics. I think i got a few of those. The guy at Bass Pro sold me a box with the complete life cycle of that nymph.


----------



## 8weight (Mar 24, 2016)

brucevannguyen said:


> Show me some pics of a scud and I'll look for it with a magnafying glasses next time I gut them.


http://www.google.com/search?q=scud+nymph+pattern&espv=2&biw=1680&bih=925&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwixgITtv53NAhUXQFIKHUCqDwMQ_AUIBigB

Well they are definitely eating a nymph (underwater bug). Keep it small. Something like what Meadowlark posted or a prince nymph









or wooly bugger.










or copper john









You'll want to rig it like this (I don't put floatant on my leader):


----------



## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

karstopo said:


> I wonder if those trout were eating scuds? Scuds hang out in the bottom algae and muck and are big on trout's menu. They might be getting little scuds that are hard to see and some algae with them.


Scud image


----------



## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

http://www.flyfisherman.com/how-to/beginners/what-do-trout-eat/

Above states scuds thrive in weedy tailwaters


----------



## brucevannguyen (Oct 21, 2012)

WOW!! Thanks guy's. I'm a million years away from pefecting this fly fishing thing. But pratice makes better. If I didn't see a guy catching trout on every cast on a fly I wouldn't of believe it. But that's what I saw 4 weeks ago at a different body of river. Fly fishing is pretty affective if one's know what they are doing. I'm a believer now.


----------



## 8weight (Mar 24, 2016)

Welcome to the addiction!


----------



## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

brucevannguyen said:


> WOW!! Thanks guy's. I'm a million years away from pefecting this fly fishing thing. But pratice makes better. If I didn't see a guy catching trout on every cast on a fly I wouldn't of believe it. But that's what I saw 4 weeks ago at a different body of river. Fly fishing is pretty affective if one's know what they are doing. I'm a believer now.


There are times that fly fishing will catch fish faster than anything including bait. Good fish too


----------



## Permit Rat (May 13, 2014)

8weight said:


> http://www.google.com/search?q=scud...ved=0ahUKEwixgITtv53NAhUXQFIKHUCqDwMQ_AUIBigB


That was an interesting link. I was amazed at how innovative some tiers had become, over the decades. I saw some very lifelike imitations on that page and borrowed a photo, to illustrate a problem this can present.

Note how similar the imitation is to the natural, both in size and color. Point is, _how is a trout going to know to hit your fly and not the natural?_ It becomes a game of chance on the river, as your 1 fly mingles with the hoardes of naturals in the water.

Several decades ago, in San Francisco Bay, when it was discovered that the stripers were gorging themselves on grass shrimp, everyone went home and tied up grass shrimp flies and I'm told the imitations were beautiful. Problem was that still, very few bass were caught........until one frustrated angler tied on one of those original Phillips pink shrimp bonefish flies.....and the bass fell like cord wood. The moral is/was that something needs to be added/left out of a fly, in order to make it stand out from the natural, but still look like the natural. I imagine that in the trout world, size is usually the most likely ally. Many of the scuds I have seen (on a Missouri stream), would be imitated on 22-24 hooks. An 18 might catch more trout, were it a perfect match in color.


----------



## 8weight (Mar 24, 2016)

"how is a trout going to know to hit your fly and not the natural?"

I don't know but somehow they do. I guess that's fishin too....the parts you can control are the fly and the presentation and then you just hope to get a bite!


----------



## Meadowlark (Jul 19, 2008)

brucevannguyen said:


> WOW!! Thanks guy's. I'm a million years away from pefecting this fly fishing thing. But pratice makes better. If I didn't see a guy catching trout on every cast on a fly I wouldn't of believe it. But that's what I saw 4 weeks ago at a different body of river. Fly fishing is pretty affective if one's know what they are doing. I'm a believer now.


Bruce, its all about the journey....and enjoying your progression as you go along.

It's not only effective, but it's great fun and never gets old. I still hugely enjoy tying a feather on a hook and catching bluegills from ponds....after doing it for well over 1/2 century. Never get tired of it.

Hope you have a great trip!


----------



## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

Permit Rat said:


> That was an interesting link. I was amazed at how innovative some tiers had become, over the decades. I saw some very lifelike imitations on that page and borrowed a photo, to illustrate a problem this can present.
> 
> Note how similar the imitation is to the natural, both in size and color. Point is, _how is a trout going to know to hit your fly and not the natural?_ It becomes a game of chance on the river, as your 1 fly mingles with the hoardes of naturals in the water.
> 
> Several decades ago, in San Francisco Bay, when it was discovered that the stripers were gorging themselves on grass shrimp, everyone went home and tied up grass shrimp flies and I'm told the imitations were beautiful. Problem was that still, very few bass were caught........until one frustrated angler tied on one of those original Phillips pink shrimp bonefish flies.....and the bass fell like cord wood. The moral is/was that something needs to be added/left out of a fly, in order to make it stand out from the natural, but still look like the natural. I imagine that in the trout world, size is usually the most likely ally. Many of the scuds I have seen (on a Missouri stream), would be imitated on 22-24 hooks. An 18 might catch more trout, were it a perfect match in color.


Man, I so agree with this. Fly has to be enough like what they are feeding on, but just different enough to attract attention and not so different to send them heading for cover.


----------

