# Using Public Resource - should you pay more?



## ddakota (Jun 28, 2009)

OK - get your popcorn and get ready.......... this is not meant as guide bashing. I have fished with some great guides who are good people and care about the resource. This is a serious question about a perceived issue. Keep your rants about Guides off this please. MODS - if this is out of line and needs to be moved to another forum, please do so. I just wanted to start a conversation and not bash.

*Question - should Guides pay more for using a public resource to earn a living?*

A Texas Saltwater Fishing Guide pays the state $210 for a resident all water fishing guide license. This is in addition to the Coast Guard Captains license requirement. Not much to deter anyone from entering the business.

With the population boom on the coast and more people fishing now than ever before, it is _*speculated*_ that Guides take more fish than the general public. The average joe has a harder time catching fish now than in the past. Yes, people who fish more often and can track fish movement do better than the weekender who fishes 1x or 2x month. The *perception *though is that there are less fish now than in the past.

Fact - Guides are using a public resource to earn a living.

Proposal - significantly up the price and use the additional money to fund more stocking programs to help offset what they take.

What would be a fair price? $1000 - $2000 - $5000? Or do you think it is fine as it is?

Guides - what do you think? I understand this hits you in the wallet, but many of you have a perception problem that perhaps could be offset by something like this.


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## gater (May 25, 2004)

*Guides*



ddakota said:


> OK - get your popcorn and get ready.......... this is not meant as guide bashing. I have fished with some great guides who are good people and care about the resource. This is a serious question about a perceived issue. Keep your rants about Guides off this please. MODS - if this is out of line and needs to be moved to another forum, please do so. I just wanted to start a conversation and not bash.
> 
> *Question - should Guides pay more for using a public resource to earn a living?*
> 
> ...


It's a much simpler fix than that, raise the minimum size on Croaker to 10 inches and half the licensed guides in Texas would go away because most could not catch a fish without one!


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## bayourat (Jan 7, 2005)

ddakota said:


> *Question - should Guides pay more for using a public resource to earn a living?*


Do you drive on public roads?


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

In general, I have a hard time with the privatization of public resources. 

High fences trap state owned resources, fishing guides (fresh and salt) make money off of public resources, etc. 

On the other hand, those who fish/hunt in these places generally have no other way to access the public resource, especially hunting and especially in Texas where 90+ % of the land is privately owned. 

There is no easy answer. 

For fishing, I think that adjusting the limits is a natural way to maintain the resource. When limits get low enough, like the 2 per day snapper, the numbers of clients that hire guides to go after (& #s of private boats) that resource will get smaller, thus the pressure on/harvest of the resource will be lessened. 

That being said, there are many many people who hire guides to fish for LMB (& private boats) and the limits never come into play due to not retaining any fish. But that resource is doing well under this current situation.


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## acoastalbender (Jul 16, 2011)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


Do you earn your living on public roads?

.


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## redduck (Jul 26, 2006)

I am not a guide but I will give my opinion. When you hire a guide you are hiring someone with enhanced knowledge and experience regarding fishing. Someone who has taken the time to know the water and where the fish hang out. Someone who provides fishing gear (the right kind) and bait or tackle to help the client be successful. Someone who not only cleans your catch but cleans up the equipment including boat for the next outing. I am speaking about professional quides not someone who thinks he/she is a guide. Someone who is a teacher and has enough confidence in themselves that they do not get POed when a former client fishes the locations they were shown by the guide. I think the waters are for everyone including guides and they should not be punished. If anyone wants to be a guide rather than a lawyer, dentist, doctor, plumber, chemical plant operator, laborer, lawn boy or what ever, they can do so anytime.


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


I think a more fair comparison would be, do you drive on toll roads?

If the answer is no, then you don't gain/lose either way. No taxes nor tolls. Same with a non-fisherman, no license, no tax on tackle/fuel/equipment, etc.

If the answer is yes, then you pay extra for that benefit (tolls).


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## bayourat (Jan 7, 2005)

acoastalbender said:


> Do you earn your living on public roads?
> 
> .


Basically everyone commutes on public roads.... so the short answer is yes.


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## tspitzer (Feb 7, 2013)

Ok here is my deal---I used to do Children's Fishing Birthdays--we fished city parks for Carp ** and the kids had a ball ** the city made me come down and sit down and discuss it with them--they wanted me to pay a percentage of what the party made GROSS--of 20-30 per cent--my hands were tied so I agreed--they wanted an invoice so I made one with the mans contact info-and a line item for PARK USE FEES of 30 %--after one party of 12 kids I asked the parents to give him a call-so 12 kids 24 parents and at least 48 if not more with the divorced folks all called this man--I got a e mail asking me too take care of the park and pick up our trash and their would be no more fees--we all pay for everything in one way or another--personally I feel their should be some limits on guides like one trip per day--A guide when I was at SPI last year had three trips-so what does that do to a five fish limit--


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## SaltyBones (Mar 17, 2009)

gater said:


> It's a much simpler fix than that, raise the minimum size on Croaker to 10 inches and half the licensed guides in Texas would go away because most could not catch a fish without one!


X2

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## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

gater said:


> It's a much simpler fix than that, raise the minimum size on Croaker to 10 inches and half the licensed guides in Texas would go away because most could not catch a fish without one!


Simply make Atlantic Croaker a gamefish...No more selling of them for bait :fish:


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## teeroy (Oct 1, 2009)

acoastalbender said:


> Do you earn your living on public roads?
> 
> .


"You didn't build that."


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## Trouthappy (Jun 12, 2008)

The coast seems to have reached a saturation point with guides. At the very least they should be required to attend a 5-night TPW course on conservation, catch-and-release, and how to coach their clients in conservation of fish. With side discussions on not burning shorelines and courtesy on the water. Many guides are simple meat-hunters on the bay, they'll fill the box with anything they can. As for shorelines, we need long sections that are off-limits, out to 150 yards, for running outboards. Poling or electric motor, only.


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## rubberducky (Mar 19, 2010)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


As a hotshot driver yes I do. Well did don't drive anymore. 
And let me tell you first hand I had to pay out the butt to do it. Over 5,000$ a year just to get started. IFTA will eat your lunch DOT is nothing but money. I have no problem with guides paying more. Might weed out some of the other guys and help the real guides make a little more money.
James

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## diverdown (Feb 18, 2014)

*Guides*

NOT YEA , BUT HELL YEA. they should pay 5,000/year to fish , if not more. they are decimating the fish. i'd compromise and say they can't even pick a pole up . let the customers catch the fish then, and let them be real instructors. that'll bring their haul down.but if not make em pay. i thought when they passed the rule they couldn't keep their limit meant they couldnt keep the fish they caught. they just catch 30 and quit. but i aint bashing


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## EdK (Jun 20, 2012)

No benefit - No duty and _Adversus. _


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## KDubBlast (Dec 25, 2006)

I don't agree. The lower limits, makes for a shorter day of fishing and people are happy they caught "limits". Don't need to impose higher fees on someone trying to make a living. Already have Obama for that....


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## tspitzer (Feb 7, 2013)

I have said it before -it will not be long to we have tags for trout just like reds-that would limit them on how many they can keep--

I feel there should be a report on how many fish and what kinds.

our trucks have to report all their miles to the state every month.


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## rubberducky (Mar 19, 2010)

tspitzer said:


> I have said it before -it will not be long to we have tags for trout just like reds-that would limit them on how many they can keep--
> 
> I feel there should be a report on how many fish and what kinds.
> 
> our trucks have to report all their miles to the state every month.


Amen to that! Make guides star logging how many hours fished and on duty and take them out after x amount of hours!

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## bubbas kenner (Sep 4, 2010)

Blk Jck 224 said:


> Simply make Atlantic Croaker a gamefish...No more selling of them for bait :fish:


How does that help when guided trips are taking 20 30 40 or more fish a day x7 days a week all year.Croakers are not eating our trout tourist are.


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## CaptBrad (Dec 29, 2007)

gater said:


> It's a much simpler fix than that, raise the minimum size on Croaker to 10 inches and half the licensed guides in Texas would go away because most could not catch a fish without one!


This. Totally this. 
Every year I can't even count the amount of trucks with guide services on the back window I've never heard of. Most only fish in the summer with croaker. I'm sure most of the more established guides who know how to fish with other baits would do just fine after the stocks replenish, and business gets busier when all the out of town guides are hurting without croaker.

I think an 8inch croaker limit would be sufficient. Wouldn't mine seeing croaker runs again. Good eating.


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## gater (May 25, 2004)

*Yep*



CaptBrad said:


> This. Totally this.
> Every year I can't even count the amount of trucks with guide services on the back window I've never heard of. Most only fish in the summer with croaker. I'm sure most of the more established guides who know how to fish with other baits would do just fine after the stocks replenish, and business gets busier when all the out of town guides are hurting without croaker.
> 
> I think an 8inch croaker limit would be sufficient. Wouldn't mine seeing croaker runs again. Good eating.


You are right, I don't want to ban the use of a certain bait but in the wrong hands they are deadly. You want to talk about taking a public resource, these are the ones that are taking from the resource the seasonal guides and it's not their primary income. Many will argue I'm wrong but I know first hand that there are a good number of these seasonal guides running multiple trips a day even more so with the new 5 fish limit.

Many want to make croaker a game fish, that's not feasible because of its commercial by catch. They are not going to shut down bait shrimping, so much easier to to put a size limit on them.

It's not near as bad on the upper coast but they are still there day after day pounding on the same school and they are not smart enough to realize they can fish out the entire school. After a month or so you'll hear, man we hammered them the last 4 weeks but it recently slowed. Did you ever stop to think you everyone of them, no they just move on to the next clump of shell and start the process over again.

For me I would rather spend all day catching 3 or 4 fish on artificials or shrimp as opposed to catching 10 on croaker in 45 minutes. It's easy money for a guide, that's why so many do it.


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## diverdown (Feb 18, 2014)

guides w/ croakers are killin em no doubt. but i personally like soakin croakers. i usually buy em and throw most back though. still a little bit of a knack to catchin fish on em. there are a few guides out of matagorda that make no secret about using them. in fact it looks as though they are rubbing there nose at everyone while doing it. look at their hauls. it's ridiculous. you dont think TPW can log on to a computer and use their little brains and see that just cant go on. (hence the rule change) weekend warriors aren't hurting anything.BTW i agree w/ everything gater just said. esp. "EASY MONEY" w/ no boss,no deadline, no problem.


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## bigfly55 (Apr 18, 2012)

Guides pay 6x more than what the gen public pays....

That figure is also very much in line with what most other Gulf states are charging.

When guiding in the Keys, we keep 0 fish normally. The only time that we do so is if we are fun fishing and then it is snapper and yellow tails.

When guiding here, we only let the people keep 1 red per person.


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## txwader247 (Sep 2, 2005)

At the end of the day increasing a guide's fees to the state is only going to hit their clients. As fuel goes up so do daily rates with guides, and that hasn't seemed to slow down the industry (I could be wrong, but that's my observation). I think the issue with charging guides more is it opens up a slippery slope that could ultimately effect everyone's use of our coastal resources. At this point though, I wouldn't be opposed to a higher license fee annually if I knew the money was going back into stocking programs.


As far as croaker, what about banning the use of them on any vessle with a licensed charter captain? If guides do as much damage with croaker as some people think they do, this would stop it. It would also keep it legal for the guy who only gets to fish once a week, month, year etc. Is that a compromise that seems plausible to anyone?


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## bayourat (Jan 7, 2005)

diverdown said:


> guides w/ croakers are killin em no doubt. but i personally like soakin croakers. i usually buy em and throw most back though. still a little bit of a knack to catchin fish on em. there are a few guides out of matagorda that make no secret about using them. in fact it looks as though they are rubbing there nose at everyone while doing it. look at their hauls. it's ridiculous. you dont think TPW can log on to a computer and use their little brains and see that just cant go on. (hence the rule change) weekend warriors aren't hurting anything.BTW i agree w/ everything gater just said. esp. "EASY MONEY" w/ no boss,no deadline, no problem.


Guiding is easy money?  that's laughable


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## Littlebeer (Jul 3, 2011)

Imposing rediculous rules on guides will do one of two things, make guides quit the business or promote a "Black Market" approach to guiding. You can only puch a man so far before he breaks.

Just look at the Red Snapper restrictions and the over regulation in that sector.
How many people do you think keep Red Snapper out of season now that the regulations have become rediculous? 

Overregulation has a tendency to creat a catch me if you can response and once a restriction goes into place it is exponentially harder to remove.

I believe there really needs to be a study done to gather information and use that factual data to make a decision. All this specuation is a waste of time and effort. If you want to manage it you have got to measure it. 

My .02


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## Fishcrazzy63 (Feb 2, 2011)

So........if a guide has a trip with 5 guys for 3 days (no other trips for the week) and limits out each day does he use the "public resource" more than the Joe Q. Public guy that takes his 4 buddies out fishing every day for 3 days and limits out? Guides are not the problem.


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## SaltMan (Jun 15, 2012)

Fishcrazzy63 said:


> So........if a guide has a trip with 5 guys for 3 days (no other trips for the week) and limits out each day does he use the "public resource" more than the Joe Q. Public guy that takes his 4 buddies out fishing every day for 3 days and limits out? Guides are not the problem.


What kind of boat does this Joe Q. fella have is there room for a fifth? I'd like to go! Better yet what kind of job does he have that allows him to fish 3 days a week? Cause Ill fill out my application right now:dance:


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## cruss (Aug 31, 2005)

*guides*

How about not letting the guides fish while with a charter. Since your not keeping the guide limit anyway they don't need to fish during a charter just instill the knowledge to the customer and let them catch. Also, wouldn't mind seeing tpw buy back guides license similar to the shrimpers and stop issuing licenses for a while.


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

I wrote a very lengthy response, then deleted it. The point of it was this: a smaller percentage of guides rape the resources than guides who don't. 
We spend a hell of a lot more money than you think. 
We make a hell of a lot less money than you think. 
We think you should pay more for your license to weed out the ridiculous amount of boat traffic running through grass beds we know USED to be a healthy habitat. 
We agree with you that the meat hauling croaker guys that are limiting out in conditions that shouldn't be limited out in are hurting themselves more than helping in the long run. The public is impressed with their stringers. We are not. 
I personally think that a regulation stating that along with the 5 fish limit, only one trip per day may be ran.
The perception that more times than not when a guide goes out, limits are brought in is a flawed one. You see the pics on Facebook and 2cool from the GOOD days. No one posts pics of 5 fish, or no fish. Most of you have friended multiple guides. I know I get several requests a day. So you are seeing limits from all these different guides, but go look at any one guide, in chronological order of his posts and see how many times he or she brought in a cooler full. 
I could go on, but when I get on a roll it is hard to stop. Bottom line is, until you have all the facts, no argument is necessary. I fish both as a general public guy in multiple Bay systems just slogging around for a trophy and observing what I see around me, and as a guide who wants his 2 year old son to have a shot at multiple 30"+ fish someday. Many of the guides out there are the same way as I am. But, I'll make you a deal. If y'all have the power to raise my license to a couple grand, and agree to raise yours to say, half of that, I'm in. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

cruss said:


> How about not letting the guides fish while with a charter.


What about having them have to have one arm tied behind their back?


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

On a majority of charters the guide has to fish bc he can't rely on his clients to catch something so he knows there are fish eating. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## CaptDocHoliday (Feb 3, 2011)

Guides should be required to:

1) Fish only with Zebco reels and plain Stren mono when guiding clients.
1a) Only rods < 6' permitted.
2) Use only barbless hooks.
3) Only be allowed to fish after their customers are good and drunk.
4) Use fresh hardheads instead of croaker for bait.
5) Be required to report every fish caught (kept and released) in publicly disclosed reports that are made available online.
6) Be restricted to 130hp and less.
7) Be required to apologize verbally to every gut-hooked fish.
8) Clean their client's fish with manual fillet knives.
9) Observe a 26mph speed limit after leaving the ramp.
10) Only be allowed to charter 4 hour trips. 
11) No guided trips allowed on weekends.
12) Re-license with the state monthly.
13) Send an email to Barack Obama, requesting his permission to ______. (pretty much anything)
14) Post daily, reliable, detailed fishing reports on 2cool.
and last but not least:
15) provide free moonpies to everyone at the cleaning tables when they return to port.


That should help me catch more fish, right?



In my humble opinion, the increased boat traffic (especially in the 3-6' deep water along the tapering end of the flats) impacts a negative bite more than any other factor I have observed. East Matty on a Saturday is like watching boat-nascar. The Sargent guys ran way far west, the Harbor guys run way far east. It's a constant state of boating right along that sweet zone where the flat transitions into the deeper bay that shuts a lot of the feeding fish down.


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## juan valdez (Jun 21, 2014)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


There's multiple ways we pay for the roads we drive on which are public roads. i see what your point is but the analogy is like comparing apples to oranges


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## Texxan1 (Dec 31, 2004)

You mean you guides out there use electric knives? Really....


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## Shady Walls (Feb 20, 2014)

I'm not a guide, but not everyone can be a guide. Fished with guides before and caught limits, we just didn't keep them all,neither did the guide. Believe it or not guides always don't limit out. From my understanding TPW funds got changed and is part of the General fund. They need there own fund so we could have more stocking programs. Not even going to get into the croaker issue. Personally I say no, hate to see anybody pay more for using natural resources. Should people with water wells pay more for water?


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## Brandon1107 (Jun 16, 2009)

I don't believe guides should have to pay more. There are plenty of clients that buy a license just to fish once a year with a guide. Also, every fisherman that goes out with a guide has the right to use the resource. I take many friends and family members out with me every year and we are usually successful, does this mean I should pay more? I've also been fishing with guides and not kept any fish at my request. 

The croaker argument is another topic that I don't agree with either. If croaker are taken out of the equation, it will be piggies, mullet, mud minnows, or something else. 

What always seems to be missed in these discussions is that it boils down to the choice of the people fishing and their education. There are clients that go out and want to wade, stay in the boat, use lures, use croaker, or shrimp....... they all want to catch fish, and it's their right. If the client wants to limit out on trout do you think the guide will say no? The guides that teach their clients about the resource and it's limits will make a difference. I just feel like fining guides because of their choice of profession is wrong. 

Guides are only in business because there are license holders out there that want to exercise their rights to the resource and they pay guides to do it. Higher fees will just make guide's fees more, cost clients more and send more money to the government. 

The comments about guides killing the resource seem to stem from jealousy. I'm not a guide, nor have I ever been one, but many of the guides I fish with are class acts. These same guides do so much more to educate the population than 99% of the fishing population out there. 

Technology has advanced and made fishing much easier, the resource is not limitless and the pressure it has had to bear is showing. The five trout limit will help and it may ultimately make the difference. I think it's important that we all realize that we are all fisherman and the less the government has to police us the better.

Just How I See It,
B


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## Capt sharky (Feb 22, 2012)

Find something else to ***** about


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## KeithR (Jan 30, 2006)

I have no problem with guides other than the ones that think they own the water and there are too many of those. They are not allowed to keep fish anyway. A guide is the only way some would ever get to fish. The whole croaker thing I dont like but really not interested in legislating how one should catch fish. 

Personally I wish the number of tournaments could be reduced. They kill alot of fish and add to the bay congestion. I think tournaments should have to pay a significant restocking/restitution fee in order to be held.


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## juan valdez (Jun 21, 2014)

And to add to my earlier post, no I don't think guides should pay more. I don't think that's the issue. 
Just because anyone "can" get a license and put advertising on their truck, doesn't mean they'll be good at it or make it in the industry. I don't know a lot about guides but I imagine it's a very word of mouth/performance based industry. If you're not producing you're gonna be chewed up and spit out


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## railbird (Jan 2, 2009)

Guides have to make a living too. Leave it alone and let's see how the new limits effect populations. As for croaker, they sure don't make a trout king out of me. I'll just wait for a perfect day and sight cast my trophy trout! Carry on!


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

It's a good topic and worth discussing. Ya'll keep it civil and stop the name calling.

TH


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## Baffin Bay (Jul 26, 2011)

Agree to 1 guided trip in 24 hr period and a big fee for tournament. EVery organization around is doing a fishing tournament to raise money for something. They even have groups from San Antonio throwing tournaments here in Corpus....come on..Make your money on Lake Medina.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

couple ways to look at this... 

1. most other business requires significantly more than the ~$200 annual license that a fishing guide pays. As a business "outlet" or whatever you want to call it, paying $200 to legally access tens of thousands of acres of public resource for profit seems to be a little off. to that tune, their "product" costs practically nothing. they have operational costs, but there is no tangible cost to what they take... 

2. They pay taxes on the income they make so it's not a situation of them getting something for totally free. what's the total annual income tax they pay? I'd bet it's quite a bit, save the guys that are running a tax write off type guide business to offset the cost of a boat payment. 


I'm not sure what's right, but really wouldn't want to see people pay additional fees just because someone has their panties in a knot. even if they raised the license by 5x, and they paid $1,000 a year... would that even make a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things?


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## wahoozy (Apr 8, 2007)

KeithR said:


> I have no problem with guides other than the ones that think they own the water and there are too many of those. They are not allowed to keep fish anyway. A guide is the only way some would ever get to fish. The whole croaker thing I dont like but really not interested in legislating how one should catch fish.
> 
> Personally I wish the number of tournaments could be reduced. They kill alot of fish and add to the bay congestion. I think tournaments should have to pay a significant restocking/restitution fee in order to be held.


^^^^ 
XXX10000

Limit the tournaments, everyone thinks they need to have a pride fest to prove whose a better fisherman and all it does is send 100 boats out on the water to burn up resources, 100 boats that normally wouldn't be on the water to catch the the breeding females. CCA is the worst about this followed by everyone who does it for some charity or whatever.


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## theyallbreak (Jan 29, 2012)

rubberducky said:


> As a hotshot driver yes I do. Well did don't drive anymore.
> And let me tell you first hand I had to pay out the butt to do it. Over 5,000$ a year just to get started. IFTA will eat your lunch DOT is nothing but money. I have no problem with guides paying more. Might weed out some of the other guys and help the real guides make a little more money.
> James
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


D.O.T dig out a thousand


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## Smackdaddy53 (Nov 4, 2011)

Why make guides pay more? We all use the resource, why not raise the price for all licenses and make boater safety mandatory. No one wants to pay more but this would weed out the people that really are not fishing, just out booze cruising and acting like they are fishing. People don't want to pay more for something they think should be free. Lower limits and higher prices may not be the answer to any of our problems either. I know this is off subject but it all goes hand in hand in the grand scheme of things.
Bottom line is that the root of the problem is not just one thing. Nearly everything mentioned has impacted the fish populations, not just trout either! Blame it on croaker, guides, tournaments, limits, shoreline burners, Chickenboy, whatever but I promise you the one thing that all of these reasons have in common is very simple...the number of PEOPLE on the water has grown exponentially in the last ten years or so. The size of the bays has not grown at all, it has actually grown smaller if you look at how much habitat gets torn up by us. You think the fish populations grow just because there are more of us on the water? Not at all, but the selfish humans would like to think so. More people on the water = less fish need to be taken and restrictions need to be set in place no matter how much you don't want to accept it. This is inevitable and can't be denied. 
Just keep 5? This worries me and many of the people I fish with have the same view on this. When this takes place the meat haulers will focus on keeping 4 of the largest trout to 25" they can and WILL more than likely kill every fish over 25" they can instead of taking 9 average trout and MAYBE releasing one over. Yeah, most can't do this on their own but they can pay someone who can hold their hand so they can fill their limit.

http://www.fishingscout.com/scouts/SmackDaddy


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## ddakota (Jun 28, 2009)

Excellent points made by many, some others......well......

I think we can all agree as fishermen who have a passion for this experience something needs to be done to preserve what we love. I dont have all the answers, just wanted to start a conversation. Things happen when people share ideas. The 5 fish limit is a start, if that doesnt work, what do you think is next? Its going to be interesting to watch the next few years play out. 

I can only hope we take positive actions in the future to keep a portion of what we once had. God blessed us with a perfect playground in this vast universe. The least we can do is try to take care if it....... a wise man once said we were only stewards passing through.

Thank you for the discussion. To the guides, I wasnt bashing you or what you do, it was just one issue out of many. I told a couple of my guide friends I was doing this as a result of conversations we had. They agreed - lets see the fireworks, maybe someone has a good idea........


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## reeltimer (Feb 5, 2010)

wahoozy said:


> ^^^^
> XXX10000
> 
> Limit the tournaments, everyone thinks they need to have a pride fest to prove whose a better fisherman and all it does is send 100 boats out on the water to burn up resources, 100 boats that normally wouldn't be on the water to catch the the breeding females. CCA is the worst about this followed by everyone who does it for some charity or whatever.


I wish to limit your posts and the threads you start.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2


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## pickn'fish (Jun 1, 2004)

Baffin Bay said:


> Agree to 1 guided trip in 24 hr period and a big fee for tournament. EVery organization around is doing a fishing tournament to raise money for something. They even have groups from San Antonio throwing tournaments here in Corpus....come on..Make your money on Lake Medina.


Ã-2. Fees for tournaments. Limit guided trips in 24hour (2 or 1?)

Up to me croaker would become a gamefish... not bait.

Fishing pressures & populations have been increasing for far longer than last 10 years...


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## o.b. (Jan 11, 2009)

I don't beleive guides should have to pay more. I think its hard enough to make a living as it is for them.


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## dang_skippy (Jun 25, 2013)

bubbas kenner said:


> How does that help when guided trips are taking 20 30 40 or more fish a day x7 days a week all year.Croakers are not eating our trout tourist are.


Show me a guide that has success like this and I will show you a movie where Sofia Vergara is topless. Doesn't happen. Anywhere. Ever. Get a clue before you bless us with you intelligence please.


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## fangard (Apr 18, 2008)

Guides get a credit for some of the taxes on gas they use to fuel their boats. Repurpose that to fund some conservation programs.


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

Guides get a credit for the road tax that is in the cost of fuel because they don't drive their boats down the highway. What, donate that money to CCA to help promote the biggest kill tournament of the year, every year? 
Recreational fishermen can get the same credit if you save your receipts and send em to the state. Be sure to tell your rep you want that money repurposed. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## fangard (Apr 18, 2008)

I know why they get the credit. Treat the waterways like a "highway". Just having a conversation. Lighten up Francis.


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

Cmac4075 said:


> What, donate that money to CCA to help promote the biggest kill tournament of the year, every year?


It's a 8lb min for adults and 6lb for teens, so how many trout do you think have been weighed in and killed for the STAR middle coast division in the last 3 years?


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

Never met Francis. 

The government is involved in our pockets enough already.


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

Im Headed South said:


> It's a 8lb min for adults and 6lb for teens, so how many trout do you think have been weighed in and killed for the STAR middle coast division in the last 3 years?


How many times do you think someone thought a fish was heavy enough to qualify, and then it wasn't? More people don't have an accurate measuring device than do. So in my opinion, the answer would be too many.


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## bubbas kenner (Sep 4, 2010)

dang_skippy said:


> Show me a guide that has success like this and I will show you a movie where Sofia Vergara is topless. Doesn't happen. Anywhere. Ever. Get a clue before you bless us with you intelligence please.


Add up all the guides stringers and than every day joes what do you get.My intelligence is not the topic.Sir.


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## specktacle (Oct 11, 2013)

End result: Guide have something else to write off, because they dang sure need it with self employment taxes, and charge the public more to go. Brilliant.


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## tspitzer (Feb 7, 2013)

A hypocrite is the kind of politician who would cut down a red wood tree, then mount the stump and make a speech for conservation.


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

Cmac4075 said:


> How many times do you think someone thought a fish was heavy enough to qualify, and then it wasn't? More people don't have an accurate measuring device than do. So in my opinion, the answer would be too many.


So do you think those fish were going to be CPR'd by someone if not entered in the STAR given they don't even know what fish weighs prior to be throw on ice? That fish was going to die no matter what. Fyi the answer is 26 in the last 3 years combined, there will be more than that many killed in a month from all the pest control, deer breeders, contractor assoc, charity, ect cash tournaments that go on every weekend and none of them put any money back into the resource.


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## Fish Lips (Jul 31, 2012)

I fished Cheasapeake Bay Virginia for many years and loved the croaker runs some up to 16"-18" I was surprised here in TX no croakers. I agree with other of banning the use of croakers min take of 10". As for raising guide fees "YES" they are commericial fisherman an require a commericial fishing license ($5,000/yr).


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## wahoozy (Apr 8, 2007)

I think everyone will agree that there seems to be less fish than years past and there is WAAAAAAAYY to much finger pointing at the guides. At the end of the day that is what they are "Guides" which help others who pay them to help recreational fisherman get their limit. I would much rather see all tournaments banned before adding 1 dime of cost to the guides on the coast. I have fished with probably 30-40 or more guides over the years in the Texas Middle coast and rarely have I seen this so called "meat haul" which might happen 1 out of 10 guided trips. They are NOT out there everyday getting a 4 man limit like some of you have suggested. I have been on 4 guided trips this year and I have yet to see one of our boats come in with a limit. I have seen every weekend tournaments going on and increasing with a fervor... I have a better solution... Why not switch to a hard head and Gafftop tournament? Take some pressure off of the Trout primarily and Red's second. And for those who have said that guides who use "Croaker" and talk like its dynamite and catch everything around tells me that you really havent been with a guide using croaker lately have you... Very tough year!!!


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## Kitchen Pass (Apr 4, 2011)

Im Headed South said:


> It's a 8lb min for adults and 6lb for teens, so how many trout do you think have been weighed in and killed for the STAR middle coast division in the last 3 years?


Agreed.

I think is some ways the STAR has created conservsation on Big Trout.
Anyone seriously interested in the trout for the STAR knows what is needed to place (or should). I suspect the serious trout fishers know when an oversize is not good enough and turn it loose. I have released numerous oversized trout because they would not place in the STAR. Also many because there was no need keep it just to fill the box.

The STAR may also curb the meat haulers that are entered that don't fill their limit because they save a spot for that "what if" fish. Those that were only ending up with 9 will soon end up with only 4.

I may not agree with all that CCA does but for me it has made me conserve the resource more often. I am sure a few others do the same.


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

Kitchen Pass said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I think is some ways the STAR has created conservsation on Big Trout.
> Anyone seriously interested in the trout for the STAR knows what is needed to place (or should). I suspect the serious trout fishers know when an oversize is not good enough and turn it loose. I have released numerous oversized trout because they would not place in the STAR. Also many because there was no need keep it just to fill the box.
> ...


Excellent point about the "what if" aspect, I'd never really thought about that. Wonder how many other folks have? Guess they better think twice about killing that skinny 26" fish when there could a winner waiting for them later in the day, we hold off on keeping that 3rd red because of the tagged wildcard but never thought about the 1 over 25" rule because we never keep any big ones anyway. I've seen the STAR tabbed the biggest kill tournament numerous times and did a little research and found the numbers didn't bear that out imo. I find it laughable that anyone thinks the middle coast is where it's at because 26 fish were weighed during the last 3 years while every weekend of the summer there's probably at least 300 boats fishing in kill tournaments between Matty and Mansfield all of which have a biggest trout division.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

So weigh in stations keep records of ineligible fish?

As to the comments about (any) tournament killing so many big fish.... The law allows people one fish a day over 25". They're not breaking the law by keeping a big fish. If the state declares one a day per person is sustainable then what's the problem?


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## wahoozy (Apr 8, 2007)

Why not for CCA to remove Trout all together from the STAR tournament and add a category for Most Spots on a Redfish in those areas like some tournaments did in FL? To me, 5 boats with 5 tagged redfish is sufficient. Why put a division for trout since this is what most everyone on this thread is concerned about and what seems to be the most scarce ?


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## BIGMIKE77 (May 2, 2009)

This topic has been discussed before. Galveston is the gateway to a major port, it gets enough contaminations, and yes, weekend fishernmen, oyster and shrimp boats, and guides dirty these waters. But the same should apply for all TX bay systems. The state shoudl change the limits, even by 2 fish less on specs, you make a difference. But I think if you go with a guide, you should have an 6 trout limit, and 2 reds. If you are on your own, 10 would be ok because most weekend fishernmen can't hit that number. And Yes, CROAKER should be named a game fish, heck, Croaker taste good, I eat them.


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## CaptDocHoliday (Feb 3, 2011)

Why not take all this money so many of y'all are proposing the state spend on lower limits & enforcement, and instead invest that into growing the fish stocking program that is already in place? 

I'd even suggest giving anglers an option to contribute monetarily to that progect at the time they buy their license.


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## Jaysand247 (Aug 19, 2012)

Heck why don't we make trout a slot fish . 5 fish 15 to 20 inches 1 tag for over 20 . Then everyone can stop whining about it because very few big fish would die .


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## Kitchen Pass (Apr 4, 2011)

Im Headed South said:


> Excellent point about the "what if" aspect, I'd never really thought about that. Wonder how many other folks have? Guess they better think twice about killing that skinny 26" fish when there could a winner waiting for them later in the day, we hold off on keeping that 3rd red because of the tagged wildcard but never thought about the 1 over 25" rule because we never keep any big ones anyway. I've seen the STAR tabbed the biggest kill tournament numerous times and did a little research and found the numbers didn't bear that out imo. I find it laughable that anyone thinks the middle coast is where it's at because 26 fish were weighed during the last 3 years while every weekend of the summer there's probably at least 300 boats fishing in kill tournaments between Matty and Mansfield all of which have a biggest trout division.


I forgot about the Tagged Redfish. I have ended many days with that limit unfilled waiting for that truck & boat.


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

wahoozy said:


> Why not for CCA to remove Trout all together from the STAR tournament and add a category for Most Spots on a Redfish in those areas like some tournaments did in FL? To me, 5 boats with 5 tagged redfish is sufficient. Why put a division for trout since this is what most everyone on this thread is concerned about and what seems to be the most scarce ?


Wouldn't hurt my feelings at all, could also go for designating one weigh in site per section of coast and have them set up receive live trout that one of the hatcheries in that section could pick up to use for stocking or research purposes like TPWD does with the share a lunker program with LMB. I'd also raise the min to 9lbs and make it if you brought in either a dead fish or one that didn't meet the min weight then you'd be DQ'd for the rest of the summer in the trout division. Give the winner a replica of their trout and do what we can to get the genes of what has proven to be of excellent quality back into the resource. Would that ever work I'm not sure but it couldn't it couldn't hurt to try something different.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Jaysand247 said:


> Heck why don't we make trout a slot fish . 5 fish 15 to 20 inches 1 tag for over 20 . Then everyone can stop whining about it because very few big fish would die .


Exactly. They would all live forever and the bays would be over ran with 47" trout.


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## wahoozy (Apr 8, 2007)

Im Headed South said:


> Wouldn't hurt my feelings at all, could also go for designating one weigh in site per section of coast and have them set up receive live trout that one of the hatcheries in that section could pick up to use for stocking or research purposes like TPWD does with the share a lunker program with LMB. I'd also raise the min to 9lbs and make it if you brought in either a dead fish or one that didn't meet the min weight then you'd be DQ'd for the rest of the summer in the trout division. Give the winner a replica of their trout and do what we can to get the genes of what has proven to be of excellent quality back into the resource. Would that ever work I'm not sure but it couldn't it couldn't hurt to try something different.


Excellent idea!


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## SurfRunner (May 22, 2004)

CaptDocHoliday said:


> Why not take all this money so many of y'all are proposing the state spend on lower limits & enforcement, and instead invest that into growing the fish stocking program that is already in place?
> 
> I'd even suggest giving anglers an option to contribute monetarily to that progect at the time they buy their license.


 This is the best I have read right here!^^^^


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

As long as I'm holding the magic wand I'd do a few more things as well 

1. Put a 12" min size on croaker. 

2. Let the snowbirds know that a RV does not qualify as a permanent home and that they are in violation of the law if they have more than a possession limit. 

3. Regulate every tournament on the coast. Require a permit to hold one, tournament directors could pass the $50 per person straight to the contestants. $25 to TPWD for administration and enforcement of the permit and $25 to the hatcheries for restocking. Make the TD document what's being brought so regulators have a better idea what's happening in these tournaments, wave the $25 hatchery fee for live release tournaments. Make the fines steep enough to discourage the skirting of the permit and enforce it. If they don't like the fee's then let them go have a skeet shoot, golf or softball tournament, ect. it doesn't matter to me as long as it doesn't they are taking from a public resource. 

4. Up the guide fee's and make it limited entry profession, not real sure the best way of doing that but the weekend/summer guide population has gotten way out of control in the middle coast. The higher fee's and croaker limit would probably help with that issue quite a bit. 

There you go, blast away lol.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Assign a potential hazard fee of $500 for every MPH a boat does over 50 MPH.....


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## Im Headed South (Jun 28, 2006)

Kyle 1974 said:


> Assign a potential hazard fee of $500 for every MPH a boat does over 75 MPH.....


fify, now your Majek buddies will be exempt :rotfl:


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## gater (May 25, 2004)

*Trout*



wahoozy said:


> Why not for CCA to remove Trout all together from the STAR tournament and add a category for Most Spots on a Redfish in those areas like some tournaments did in FL? To me, 5 boats with 5 tagged redfish is sufficient. Why put a division for trout since this is what most everyone on this thread is concerned about and what seems to be the most scarce ?


Its not hurting anything by having the big trout division. People get the notion that anglers are waiting in line to weighin their 8# trout. You can only keep one over 25" to begin with and these are not your biggest breeders your complaining about.

Again, don't ban the tournaments, ban the use of croaker in these tournaments and see what the quality and qaunity of fish being weighed in is, I think you will be shocked.


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## capt.dave (Jan 3, 2007)

Banning the use of croakers for tournaments and guides wouldn't be the worst idea.

I know a few guides that are artificial only fishermen and they will readily admit that croaker will hands down out-fish lures from about July through mid-September; i.e. hottest time of the year. So, it would cut down on tournament boxes and guide boxes through a good portion of the summer.


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## SaltMan (Jun 15, 2012)

We can sit here and point fingers at every Tom, Dick, and Harry with a rod and reel! But all this *****ing and non effective attempts to change regulations via 2cool :rotfl: won't mean a thing if Mother Nature decides to wipe out the fish population with a hellacious freeze like she did in 83! If last years winter was any indication of where were headed(Global Warming My arse!) shoot it could happen next year remember Mother Nature is the great equalizer!


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Im Headed South said:


> fify, now your Majek buddies will be exempt :rotfl:


I love using 12" croaker for bait anyway!


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## TrueblueTexican (Aug 29, 2005)

*No Guides shouldn't pay more*

Every boat built that runs shallower than 4 inches should have a VAT of ten percent added to the sales tax -

This is a tired OLD argument, no different from the tournament rants,

Guides , tournies etc take no more fish than the five hundred boats in aggregate on the middle coast do on a daily basis -

Good fishermen take fish - weekend warriors don't

Doesn't matter if you fish with artificials or shrimp or pinfish, or croaker or SUPER SECRET ballyhoo -

Tax the weekend warriors wanna be's if ya ask me -

FIX THE 1000 # Gorilla sittin in this ROOM - NO FRESHWATER MAKE-UP TO THE BAYS

Kill all the snowbirds and run off anyone not born in Texas, blow up a few dams on the rivers.

Then stupid questions like this won't exist


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## Texxan1 (Dec 31, 2004)

Why dont we just all quit keeping fish all together!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can count on my fingers how many fish i kept last year... and those were for neighbors

There is no way i can agree that guides should limit what they use for bait or what the customers that hire them can keep.

Customers pay me for an experience, not for a bunch of fillets....

My customers rarely even want to keep a limit, they want to keep a few fish for the night/weekend etc.

I do have the occasional guys who want to keep everything, and for those people they can keep what the law says they can keep.. Period

I pay alot to guide, my licences, my insurances, boat maintenance on 3 boats, purchases at all my local tackle stores, etc etc etc... Its not cheap and I dont make a ton of money at it.. I do it for the love of the fish and fishing....

There are alot of guides on the water and i dont care either way.. However, the simple amount of traffic we have is off the charts... There surely are alot more fisherman than people that catch fish.


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## Cmac4075 (Dec 3, 2012)

^^Captain speaks for a majority of the guides out there. Well said Capt B. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Shady Walls (Feb 20, 2014)

*Guides*



Texxan1 said:


> Why dont we just all quit keeping fish all together!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I can count on my fingers how many fish i kept last year... and those were for neighbors
> 
> ...


That's what my definition of a Good guide- well said!


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## capt. david (Dec 29, 2004)

Tp&w could easily regulate the guide business. I can see limited entry coming. In the next 2years I look for a 5 trout limit state wide. The 5 trout limit is only successful in decreasing the number of fish kept for those that can catch more than 5 now. If your catching less now, nothing will change, you will still catch less than 5. Some people fish with guides to learn some to catch. That will never change.


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## Pasadena1944 (Mar 20, 2010)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


Trucks delivering goods pay a ton more than you for a car...So they pay extra so why shouldn't guides pay more?


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

bayourat said:


> Do you drive on public roads?


Yes, and I pay for the privilege every time I fuel up. Drive more = pay more. 45 cents for every gallon a diesel that goes in my tank.


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## capt. david (Dec 29, 2004)

They do pay more. Guide license, fishing license and Usgc license. They spend more on tackle,bait,ice and gasoline than most people who have boats and fish. They spend money in order to make some money.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

capt. david said:


> They do pay more. Guide license, fishing license and Usgc license. They spend more on tackle,bait,ice and gasoline than most people who have boats and fish. They spend money in order to make some money.


I would say its just the opposite of this. The pay for the trip should cover these cost. Plus, most guides get there lures for free plus other goodies like rods, clothing etc. 
I said most not all have sponsors. In turn the guides get discounts are free merchandise. I'm not bashing guides I know quite a few & have fished with them. You can have that job. I would never want to take that many fish from the sea. But there needed & if thats your cup of tea have at it.
I have hired very few guides in my life but the best one I hired was Steve Littleton that guy was a hoot.
I'll give props to another great guide who I've fished with for years & thats Captain Bruce Baugh. Great guy & fun to fish with.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

I never thought that in my lifetime there would be debates over whether a man out working hard in a legal profession would be a good thing or not.


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## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

boom! said:


> I never thought that in my lifetime there would be debates over whether a man out working hard in a legal profession would be a good thing or not.


Your right but when it starts effecting the population of the fish that are out there. The tables turn. I've really enjoyed saltwater fishing & have always wanted to keep it going for the next generation & so on. I read all the haters against CCA. They do things I don't like but there the only game in town that has actually helped the resource that I'm aware of. The whole game is how to keep the fishery striving & not waiting till its gone & then say Hey we have a problem.
Then there's mother nature that can wipe it out. But from history we do know that it can rebound. But you gotta have an abundance of fish there to overcome a freeze. Its a fine line to keep nature thriving if your gonna take from it like we do. 
We just all need to work together instead of competing with each other about hey I'm a better fisherman than you syndrome.


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## TrueblueTexican (Aug 29, 2005)

*Yep*



boom! said:


> I never thought that in my lifetime there would be debates over whether a man out working hard in a legal profession would be a good thing or not.


And the bunch of **** ant panty waists who ***** about them - people don't have a CLUE how hard a good guide works - up before daylight, in bed by 12AM and do it again the next day - my office USED to be my boat - just fortunate I don't have to work that HARD anymore.

Quit crying because you can't catch fish - you ***** biters have NO CLUE where the real problem lies

OR BETTER YET hire a guide - you just might improve you learning curve -


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## wahoozy (Apr 8, 2007)

TrueblueTexican said:


> And the bunch of **** ant panty waists who ***** about them - people don't have a CLUE how hard a good guide works - up before daylight, in bed by 12AM and do it again the next day - my office USED to be my boat - just fortunate I don't have to work that HARD anymore.
> 
> Quit crying because you can't catch fish - you ***** biters have NO CLUE where the real problem lies
> 
> OR BETTER YET hire a guide - you just might improve you learning curve -


Guides work extremely hard
What the all these recreational guys won't face is how their tournaments are more destructive than the guides and should be forced to "no kill" tournaments. Clean up your own back yard before you complain about your neighbors.


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## bigfly55 (Apr 18, 2012)

Pasadena1944 said:


> Trucks delivering goods pay a ton more than you for a car...So they pay extra so why shouldn't guides pay more?


ummm...guides do pay more. 6x more for the license to be exact. And that is just for the guide license from the state. That does not include the cg license, the extra maintenance involved, the insurance, etc. etc. etc. Not to mention the beating your body takes from guiding. Do you carry extra insurance that protects you so that if one of your guests on your boat steps on a stingray and decides to sue you for everything that you own?

How about looking at some factual numbers instead of just saying they do not pay more. If you really believe that guides do not pay more, I suggest that you try it for a few years then get back to us and tell us how guides do not pay more.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

TTT



$200 isn't much in the grand scheme of things...


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## Fishin' Magician (Jul 17, 2012)

Pot lickers, now pot stirrers. Is there any difference.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bigfly55 (Apr 18, 2012)

Alrighty then. Quite a few have mentioned that the cost of a license to guide is not that much. How about this option then. 

Why don't we say that to be able to fish one must have a license, but to be able to keep any fish, one must purchase another license for $200? So $35 to be able to fish in saltwater then another $200 to be able to kill any fish in that water.

Sounds about as silly to me as what a lot are suggesting here.

How about for each round of golf you play, you must pay an additional amount that goes to freshwater resource restitution fee?

Fact : Guides pay more. period.

If you are unhappy with the amount that we pay, then go to the State level where the rules are made. Bashing us for following the State regulations on a public forum only makes you look the fool for blaming us that the amount we pay is not satisfactory to you.


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## fmlyfisher (Apr 29, 2013)

As an admittedly selfish fisherman, I'd be great with raising the saltwater license fee for the general public to something like buying elk tags in Wyoming. Get it up there around $1000 a head and the traffic on the bays will drop to nothing. Yes it will make it tough on guides and my brother guides out of Rockport so I feel for you guys, but y'all can't be happy with all the yahoos on the water nowadays either right?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## tokavi (May 6, 2006)

SaltMan said:


> What kind of boat does this Joe Q. fella have is there room for a fifth? I'd like to go! Better yet what kind of job does he have that allows him to fish 3 days a week? Cause Ill fill out my application right now:dance:


I work 4-10's and own a 25 Majek so yes I can fish 5 if I want 3 days a week, more if I fish after work.


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## tokavi (May 6, 2006)

Kyle 1974 said:


> So weigh in stations keep records of ineligible fish?
> 
> As to the comments about (any) tournament killing so many big fish.... The law allows people one fish a day over 25". They're not breaking the law by keeping a big fish. If the state declares one a day per person is sustainable then what's the problem?


I run a large once a year benefit tournament on the upper coast. I do keep records of all fish weighed in and yes that includes ineligible fish.

I was also worried about how many big trout we would kill so we put a no more than one trout over 25" per team rule in place. In addition we offer bonuses for live fish, which are then released. Our numbers show that not many trout over 25" are weighed in. 7 in 3 years. The majority were alive and most were in good enough shape to release.

Redfish over 28" weighed in because everyone is looking for the biggest fish possible? In the last 3 years, 5 all alive and released. We fixed the problem of being in possession of and oversized fish that was not tagged this year by making our upper end 27".

Kyle is right the actual number of fish killed in tournaments is not the problem folks.


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## noskunks (Jul 27, 2006)

I fish a few tournaments, and admit it's getting ridiculous. Weekend warriors who now feel entitled to act like ********** on the water because they are "fishing a tournament". I could see a larger fee, no kill, artificial only, or a combination of rules to reduce the number of tournaments as a good thing.

That said, guides are better fisherman than the average weekend warrior and therefore their clients remove more fish from the resource than the weekend warriors. If they paid closer to commercial fisherman rates it would surely thin the herd and you would have the really good ones make it, the ones that are part timers during croaker season would either stop, or continue to practice unlicensed.


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## tokavi (May 6, 2006)

Im Headed South said:


> As long as I'm holding the magic wand I'd do a few more things as well
> 
> 1. Put a 12" min size on croaker.
> 
> ...


As stated before I direct a once a year benefit tournament. All of our money goes to support children's charities in our area. Your idea would prevent us from doing this event and take ten's of thousands of dollars away from these kids. But yeah, you might catch a couple more fish each year at their expense.


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## capt. david (Dec 29, 2004)

What type of commercial license? Maybe in order to obtain your guide license, along with having a current usgc document, you also have to show that 51% of your annual income comes from guiding. That would keep the part timers out of the business. Seems some of you think those that guide 12 weeks a year is the problem.


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## bubbas kenner (Sep 4, 2010)

Going to Gods house this morning I will be praying for a bountiful season and future for ALL.Maybe just maybe we are casting in the wrong direction.


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## Billphish (Apr 17, 2006)

Raise fishing license to $1000. And don't allow fat people to buy them.


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## BullyARed (Jun 19, 2010)

I like fishing guides. I learned much fishing from them from several trips I had. Cheers to them. :cheers: Here is your public resource $$$$$$$$$...$$ at work.

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-seek-border-aid-pelosi-visits-texas-024240033--politics.html


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## Oyster Dog (May 21, 2005)

Billphish said:


> Raise fishing license to $1000. And don't allow fat people to buy them.


Or whiners. :rotfl:


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## tokavi (May 6, 2006)

Billphish said:


> Raise fishing license to $1000. And don't allow fat people to buy them.


Or guys with really ugly dogs! Leave us fat boys out of it.


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## Txredfish (Oct 27, 2010)

I moved here from Indiana about 9 years ago. There were very few tournaments in this area. Now, there seems to be several every weekend. I am retired and do not fish weekends because of all the boat traffic. I don't think the tournaments catch all the fish. It is just all the weekend tournament fisherman running from place to place. The fish get very spooky. Where, I lived in Indiana, the lakes were almost impossible to fish weekends due to so many people on the water. The tournaments just took up the boat ramps along with regular fisherman, skiers, etc. The tournaments just add to the overcrowded problem on the weekend. Thus tournaments do hurt the fishing, not so with catch numbers, but just a lot of boats running around in a close area.


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