# Las Vegas shooting



## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

http://abc7.com/20-killed-100-injured-in-las-vegas-shooting;-lone-wolf-suspect-dead/2477628/

This stuff has to stop. 20 confirmed dead and over 100 injured.


----------



## Knot Kidding (Jan 7, 2009)

They had time to reload!


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

I wish the Sheriff would give more info:

_Sheriff Joe Lombardo of Las Vegas Police confirmed at a news conference that the shooter had fired from the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay. He said officers responded and the suspect was dead. _
_He said the suspect was identified as a local resident, but did not name him._


----------



## RRbohemian (Dec 20, 2009)

Looking for the POS shooter's roommate.

"He also says that police are looking for the gunmanâ€™s roommate, an Asian female named Mari Lou Danley â€” approximately 4â€™11â€.

Edit: Newsmax is reporting 50 dead.


----------



## bill (May 21, 2004)

I'm hearing 50 Dead and 200 hurt/injured

prayers sent


----------



## going_deep (Apr 13, 2014)

Terrible!!


----------



## Lucky (Sep 1, 2005)

Omg... Prayers for those affected.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## agonzales1981 (Jun 12, 2008)

Man... W T F???


----------



## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

When I saw the headlines saying "automatic weapon" I thought, typical uninformed journalist. Wow, the guy did have a fully automatic rifle.


----------



## bluefin (Aug 16, 2005)

Shooter - 64 yr old Steven Paddock. Had an automatic weapon.


----------



## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

First off, prayers for all those affected. Hits close to home for alot of us I'm sure, been on the crowded streets of Vegas a few times. Sucks there are such messed up people in the world!


----------



## old 37 (Nov 30, 2014)

I can't understand what goes on in a persons mind that makes them want to kill hundreds of complete strangers for no reason. Thoughts and Prayers to the families .


----------



## BullyARed (Jun 19, 2010)

I woke up to this new this morning at 6:00AM! Prayers for all victims. Horrible!!!


----------



## fishinguy (Aug 5, 2004)

That is terrible. There is no need for this kind of thing to happen.


----------



## RRbohemian (Dec 20, 2009)

antifa members tweeting out praising him and glad to see the trump supporters slaughtered. What has the country become?


----------



## boltmaster (Aug 16, 2011)

RRbohemian said:


> antifa members tweeting out praising him and glad to see the trump supporters slaughtered. What has the country become?


Site your source for this statement please.


----------



## RRbohemian (Dec 20, 2009)

boltmaster said:


> Site your source for this statement please.


KLBJ radio in Austin. The guy was reading from some tweets.


----------



## Fishy Eye (Sep 2, 2015)

Just insane. Sounded like a bump fire stock on that rifle. Rate of fire was slow and not steady like a true full automatic. Sick POS.


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

RRbohemian said:


> KLBJ radio in Austin. The guy was reading from some tweets.


Heard the same thing on 950 Houston's WaltonNJohnson. This coward was some kind of anti Trump loser.From the same mold as the one in Washington shooting at Republicans on the baseball field.


----------



## MarkU (Jun 3, 2013)

Insanity... I saw this before I left for work. At 64 years, what could snap in someone's head. To do something this terrible? He knew none of his victims. He planned this, and planned to die. What agenda, other than taking out as many white, and probably Trump supporters, would this align with?


----------



## Hullahopper (May 24, 2004)

My daughter and son in law were at the event but were unharmed. Crazy, Crazy Crazy! Prayers going out for all those there that were not as lucky.


----------



## RRbohemian (Dec 20, 2009)

Hullahopper said:


> My daughter and son in law were at the event but were unharmed. Crazy, Crazy Crazy! Prayers going out for all those there that were not as lucky.


Wow. It's good to hear some good news out of such a tragedy.


----------



## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

Reporting over 400 injured.


----------



## Fresh2Salt (May 21, 2004)

Cut n Shoot said:


> Heard the same thing on 950 Houston's WaltonNJohnson. This coward was some kind of anti Trump loser.From the same mold as the one in Washington shooting at Republicans on the baseball field.


I'll be surprised if the liberal media reports that little bit of info.


----------



## tbone2374 (Feb 27, 2010)

Fishy Eye said:


> Just insane. Sounded like a bump fire stock on that rifle. Rate of fire was slow and not steady like a true full automatic. Sick POS.


Pls. explain bump fire stock???


----------



## Fishing Logic (Aug 25, 2005)

tbone2374 said:


> Pls. explain bump fire stock???


bump fire.stock
http://www.slidefire.com


----------



## davis300 (Jun 27, 2006)

Sick sick world we live in.

Prayers for the deceased and injured. 

I fly into Vegas Thursday night and supposed to stay at Mandala Bay.


----------



## bill (May 21, 2004)

tbone2374 said:


> Pls. explain bump fire stock???


Uses the recoil of a semi-automatic firearm to fire multiple shots in rapid succession.
It takes a semi-auto, where you have to keep pulling the trigger each time, and turns it into pull trigger and it goes bang until you release the trigger or run out of ammo or malfunction (usually don't happen as it's very reliable technology)

I don't know if is what was used, just passing the info on the bumpfire


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

Catastrophic event...Condolences to everyone affected...If someone had told me that something like this was going to happen 25 years ago, I would have called them insane...I can't honestly say that I am thoroughly shocked at any current events this day & age...My concern is that now a new terrorist manslaughter record has been set, It will be just a matter of time for the next psychopath to try and make a name for himself by raising the bar...I cringe when I think (but probably can't imagine) of what my Grandchildern might have to see on down the road


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

tbone2374 said:


> Pls. explain bump fire stock???


----------



## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Sure sounds like an auto but could be a bump stock given the short bursts...assuming needed to reload. Prayers for those affected...

http://www.facebook.com/OfficialAlBSure/videos/vb.21887218939/10155110451133940/?type=2&theater

Went back and listened again...not a full auto. For those that don't have Facebook...


----------



## batmaninja (Jul 15, 2010)

_ Paddock was â€œknown toâ€ Las Vegas Police before he opened fire from the Mandalay Bay Resort and Casino in Las Vegas late Sunday night and killed at least 50 people who were attending the Route 91 Harvest Festival. However, the 64-year-old did not have any major offenses on his criminal record_....

_Paddock also had a private pilot license, FAA records show. The license was issued on November 17, 2003 and he was allowed to fly a single-engine airplane and an instrument airplane. His most recent medical examination according to the records was in February 2008. At the time he got the pilotâ€™s license, he was living in Mesquite, Texas in Dallas County. _

http://heavy.com/news/2017/10/stephen-paddock-criminal-record-lawsuit/

How hard is it to get a pilots license?


----------



## okmajek (May 29, 2012)

Headed to Vegas for SEMA on the 30th..I just went a month ago for my wedding anniversary.
**** these crazy mother ****ers !!!! 
This Nuts brother said "He was the most normal guy he Knows"..No politics, No religion ,No Nothing..


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

.308 reported used.No wonder so many casualties.


----------



## roundman (May 21, 2004)

apparently mesquite nevada

Records show that Danley and Paddock lived together in a three-year-old, two-bedroom home on Babbling Brook Court in the tiny desert community of Mesquite, which is 80 miles north east of Las Vegas near the Arizona state border. Record show the property cost $396,000 Â£297,554). 
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...on-Marilou-Danley-detained.html#ixzz4uMNgnXPc 

http://ec.tynt.com/b/rf?id=bBOTTqvd0r3Pooab7jrHcU&u=DailyMail
​


----------



## okmajek (May 29, 2012)

davis300 said:


> Sick sick world we live in.
> 
> Prayers for the deceased and injured.
> 
> I fly into Vegas Thursday night and supposed to stay at Mandala Bay.


I would like to hear about your trip and experience when you return.
I'm Going on the 30th .. Just curious what might be different because of this craziness..? These Wackos want to Murder ,cause chaos and disrupt peoples lives, While destroying things, before they eat a bullet.. :hairout:
Effing POS P*&^y Arse Cowards..!!!
My thoughts and Prayers are with all of these poor folks families and friends..


----------



## Tortuga (May 21, 2004)

Reports say he had TEN automatic rifles in the room with him. Sound on videos sounds like 30 round clips..with pauses.. I guess to reload...

THIS WORLD AND THIS COUNTRY HAVE GONE STARK STARING MAD !!!!!!!!


----------



## texcajun (Feb 22, 2009)

My heart goes out to all that were affected by this senseless tragedy at the hands of a cowardly terrorist. The one question I'd like an answer for is if this was automatic weapons fire, did the shooter have a FFL for owning them?


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

okmajek said:


> I would like to hear about your trip and experience when you return.
> I'm Going on the 30th .. Just curious what might be different because of this craziness..? These Wackos want to Murder ,cause chaos and disrupt peoples lives, While destroying things, before they eat a bullet.. :
> 
> *Effing POS P*&^y Arse Cowards..!!!
> My thoughts and Prayers are with all of these poor folks families and friends..*


God must confused!


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

boom! said:


>


Had not idea such a thing existed.


----------



## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

tbone2374 said:


> Pls. explain bump fire stock???


It's a stock that you shoulder, it's spring loaded. So when you fire, it allows the gun to travel back more so than a typical stock.

If you do it right, you basically depress the trigger the entire rifle moves back and fourth, your finger stays still, and it fires the gun multiple times.


----------



## Mikeg77583 (Jul 11, 2014)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Mallardman02 (Sep 13, 2007)

bwguardian said:


> Sure sounds like an auto but could be a bump stock given the short bursts...assuming needed to reload. Prayers for those affected...
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/OfficialAlBSure/videos/vb.21887218939/10155110451133940/?type=2&theater
> 
> Went back and listened again...not a full auto. For those that don't have Facebook...


Did you see that cup get hit at the 42 sec. mark??


----------



## oc48 (Aug 13, 2005)

sounds like the shooter was using a bump stock. the shots weren't uniformly shot.


----------



## Archer (Jul 10, 2006)

A lot of what youâ€™re hearing is echo off the surrounding buildings which makes the spacing sound irregular. That definitely sounds like full automatic fire as heard from a distance and if the reports of 7.62 rounds are accurate that would match well with an SKS/AK type weapon converted to fully automatic. The opening barrage went on for a long time and sounds like a drum magazine to me with the later barrages coming from 30-40 round mags. All of them are readily available.


----------



## 71 Fish (Dec 21, 2005)

Mallardman02 said:


> Did you see that cup get hit at the 42 sec. mark??


Looks like the person running by kicked it.

If that is the hotel he is shooting from in the background, shouldnt you be able to see the flashes from the gun?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Death toll now 58, injured 515


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

In the recent past, the guy also owned a nice house in Florida. The neighbor said that the first time they met him, the shooter handed him a key to the house and asked him to keep an eye on it, because he would only be using it once in a while.

The neighbor said that the house had a few pieces of furniture, and some computers.


----------



## Mallardman02 (Sep 13, 2007)

71 Fish said:


> Looks like the person running by kicked it.
> 
> If that is the hotel he is shooting from in the background, shouldnt you be able to see the flashes from the gun?


Turn the sound on and you can hear it!


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

This guy didn't just snap, something had to be the motivation behind this. You don't just snap and have that many guns on hand and somehow be set up right across from an outdoor venue


----------



## The1ThatGotAway (Jun 24, 2009)

gbollom said:


> This guy didn't just snap, something had to be the motivation behind this. You don't just snap and have that many guns on hand and somehow be set up right across from an outdoor venue


And you would be correct...


----------



## Dos_Curados (Oct 31, 2012)

in the brothers interview he says there was no indication or red flags or history but i guess he just didn't know his brother that well cause there had to be something there right you don't just turn psychopath overnight and do this. 

god bless the victims and families.


----------



## Hullahopper (May 24, 2004)

batmaninja said:


> _
> 
> How hard is it to get a pilots license?_


_

I read that the guy owns 2 small planes and was instrument rated and a retired accountant. So it appears he was smart, wealthy and crazy. He also lived in a pretty expensive Dell Web (over 55) community in Mesquite which is about an hours drive north of Las Vegas._


----------



## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

stdreb27 said:


> It's a stock that you shoulder, it's spring loaded. So when you fire, it allows the gun to travel back more so than a typical stock.
> 
> If you do it right, you basically depress the trigger the entire rifle moves back and fourth, your finger stays still, and it fires the gun multiple times.


Bump stocks are not spring loaded, you pull forward with one arm on the forestock and that causes the stock to bump back and forth. You can add a spring I imagine, that that makes them illegal.

I have one and I can tell you they are very hard to fire accurately.

Also, you cannot keep them firing over 5-10 rounds. That rifle sounds like an AK47 to me.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Dos_Curados said:


> in the brothers interview he says there was no indication or red flags or history but i guess he just didn't know his brother that well cause there had to be something there right you don't just turn psychopath overnight and do this.
> 
> god bless the victims and families.


The reports that he was a "regular guy" who never had guns before aren't going to cut it.

They are reporting that he had 10 long guns in the room. You don't collect those overnight. Also, he second burst has some small gaps that really sound like the results of a bump stock. (And, no, not from echo. You can really be sure they are gaps in that second burst.) If it is a bump stock, then he had to have practiced with it. If it was a gun modified to full auto, he didn't learn how to DIY that overnight.

He owned a $400k house in Vegas, and had owned a very nice house in Florida. I haven't seen verification of the planes, but they showed pictures of his houses. They are saying that he had no job, and claimed to support himself by gambling. I don't know what the whole truth is, but I bet that's not it.


----------



## OnedayScratch (May 23, 2012)

gbollom said:


> This guy didn't just snap, something had to be the motivation behind this. You don't just snap and have that many guns on hand and somehow be set up right across from an outdoor venue


Agreed. He had planned this.

Sad, very, very sad.


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

bigfishtx said:


> Bump stocks are not spring loaded, you pull forward with one arm on the forestock and that causes the stock to bump back and forth. You can add a spring I imagine, that that makes them illegal.
> 
> I have one and I can tell you they are very hard to fire accurately.
> 
> *Also, you cannot keep them firing over 5-10 rounds*. That rifle sounds like an AK47 to me.


Uh, yes you can. I do agree that bumpstocks are inaccurate, but how accurate do you have to be when shooting down into a crowd? It may or may not have been an AK, but I can and have run many 30 round mags through my bumpstock without a failure.


----------



## LandLocked (Apr 28, 2005)

Dos_Curados said:


> in the brothers interview he says there was no indication or red flags or history but i guess he just didn't know his brother that well cause there had to be something there right you don't just turn psychopath overnight and do this.
> 
> god bless the victims and families.


Yea he didn't know him at all apparently. One of the things about the shooters brothers interview that struck me as odd...when asked when was the last time he had spoken with the shooter...the brother said he received a text 2 weeks ago when the hurricane went through Florida asking if their Mother was OK.

You would think that someone in their late 50's early 60's would have called instead of texted in a situation like that. Makes me think they were not very close at all.

Really messed up.


----------



## roundman (May 21, 2004)

Dos_Curados said:


> in the brothers interview he says there was no indication or red flags or history but i guess he just didn't know his brother that well cause there had to be something there right you don't just turn psychopath overnight and do this.
> 
> god bless the victims and families.


like my brother , in school teachers said he was a daydreamer , never really spent anytime with family or keeping up with family but seems to have a real thing for family history , even at my moms funeral him and his wife chose to go eat with themselves other than with the family, i dont really know her or him , she did call my sister awhile back concerned about his drinking , told her she better take care of it


----------



## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Apparently his dad was on the most wanted list by the FBI for bank robbery. He then escaped prison here in Texas in the late 60's. Sounds like this family has issues...


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

boom! said:


> Uh, yes you can. I do agree that bumpstocks are inaccurate, but how accurate do you have to be when shooting down into a crowd? It may or may not have been an AK, but I can and have run many 30 round mags through my bumpstock without a failure.


Well I would say pretty accurate when your targets are a quarter mile away.


----------



## sotexhookset (Jun 4, 2011)

Over a 1/3 of a mile actually. Almost 600 yards is a long ways away. Sad ordeal for sure. That son of a *****.


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

ChuChu said:


> Well I would say pretty accurate when your targets are a quarter mile away.


40,000 targets.


----------



## Boat 2 (Sep 22, 2016)

It just amazes me that ABC keep stressing that he is a hunter. What does that have to do with this.


----------



## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

ChuChu said:


> Well I would say pretty accurate when your targets are a quarter mile away.


Shooting a bump stock is just for fun. Plus, you cannot rest it and make it work, it must be held free hand. A 308 is heavy and harder to fire.

If he was shooting 7.62, I do not believe he was using a bump fire stock. I think it was a modified AK 47


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

the toninator said:


> 40,000 targets.


22,000 targets.

An estimated 22,000 people dived for cover as hundreds of rounds of shots rained down on the crowd during the Route 91 Harvest Festival at shortly after 10pm on Sunday local time (6am Monday BST). An off-duty police officer was among the dead.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

The investigators have seen the rifle. Didn't they say it was full auto? My prayers go out to all involved. 
I read his father was a bank robber on the 10 most wanted list. Whatever that's worth?
This has been a rough year.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

the toninator said:


> 40,000 targets.


32 stories up and across the street. A massive glob of humanity is the only thing I can figure. Incredibly sad.


----------



## Bird (May 10, 2005)

Iâ€™m think law enforcement will find some interesting piec s to the motive puzzle when tweeting wife/girlfriend is fully interrogated. She was detained, out of the country. 

Regardless of the reason, just terrible


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

I'm gonna just sit back and wait till they tell us the weapon and clip types. It sounded like something that throws a lot of lead relatively fast. Definitely not a muzzle loader.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Tortuga (May 21, 2004)

Dos_Curados said:


> in the brothers interview he says there was no indication or red flags or history but i guess he just didn't know his brother that well cause there had to be something there right* you don't just turn psychopath overnight and do this.
> *
> god bless the victims and families.


Not true... "Psychotic Episodes" are not rare in this world..Happens all the time...but none have been this lethal..


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Yes, the distance was long but from the angle he was at, hitting an area larger than a football field doesn't sound that difficult physically. Particularly while the crowd was still fairly tight, he would hit a person even if his aim was 50 feet off.


----------



## Ducatibilt (Jul 8, 2010)

So how many rounds/mags do you think he could have went through for that many dead and injured? Granted shooting into a crown that large made it easy, but that's still a lot of people hit. Just trying to wrap my head around it.

That's almost 600 people hit, so that's 20 30rd mags right there.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Ducatibilt said:


> So how many rounds/mags do you think he could have went through for that many dead and injured? Granted shooting into a crown that large made it easy, but that's still a lot of people hit. Just trying to wrap my head around it.


x2


----------



## bluefin (Aug 16, 2005)

I'm betting many of the injured were hit by ricochets or even bullets that hit someone and passed thru them, hit the concrete and bounced up hitting another person.


----------



## Mikeg77583 (Jul 11, 2014)

What do you do now? What measure needs to be taken? Any mount of security at the concert wouldnâ€™t have stopped it.... add metal detectors/security to hotels? Avoid public gatherings/venues? Outlaw guns/high cap mags?.... IMO I can I think the media plays a big role, the Orlando shooter was said to have stopped mid way and check his Facebook/news to see if he had â€œwent viralâ€ .... Iâ€™m not saying this Vegas shooting was motivated being media and wanting his â€œ5 sec of fameâ€ I do see all these news folks talking about setting records and efficiently shooting. Theyâ€™re setting the stage for another crazy to come in and gain attention. I understand about freedom of press but I believe itâ€™s fueling the fire. Prayers for everyone involved prayers for us and prayers for the future.


----------



## bluefin (Aug 16, 2005)

Mandalay and the concert promoters are going to get hit w/ a lot of lawsuits over this. Do you think they have any responsibility?


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

ChuChu said:


> 22,000 targets.
> 
> An estimated 22,000 people dived for cover as hundreds of rounds of shots rained down on the crowd during the Route 91 Harvest Festival at shortly after 10pm on Sunday local time (6am Monday BST). An off-duty police officer was among the dead.


Fair enough 22,000 targets. Not much aiming needed.


----------



## Dos_Curados (Oct 31, 2012)

1/4 mile is what 400 yards and a mass of 20k people crowded up i don't think you would need to be very accurate at all like. that first or 2nd clip emptied before people really began to scatter i can see being when most of the injuries happen especially with rounds skipping around off the ground. makes me angry


----------



## prokat (Jul 17, 2010)

Vegas pd scanner...chit





Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

bluefin said:


> Mandalay and the concert promoters are going to get hit w/ a lot of lawsuits over this. Do you think they have any responsibility?


I don't see how the concert promoters would be sued. There is open concerts and festivals all over the country.

I'm not sure about Mandalay. Are there alarms or sensors that go off when a window is broken?


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Now they are reporting a shooting at a school in Nevada?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Dos_Curados said:


> 1/4 mile is what 400 yards and a mass of 20k people crowded up i don't think you would need to be very accurate at all like. that first or 2nd clip emptied before people really began to scatter i can see being when most of the injuries happen especially with rounds skipping around off the ground. makes me angry


You still have to aim.


----------



## Tortuga (May 21, 2004)

Ducatibilt said:


> So how many rounds/mags do you think he could have went through for that many dead and injured? Granted shooting into a crown that large made it easy, but that's still a lot of people hit. Just trying to wrap my head around it.
> 
> That's almost 600 people hit, so that's 20 30rd mags right there.


Think first reports I read said..." 50 killed and 400+ 'injured'....lots of folks were probably trampled and hurt in the panic to get OUT of that crowd.....report said one fellow fell on his girl to protect her and still had footprints on the back of his shirt ....

truly horrible event either way...


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

More than just a rumor. Looks like they do have another shooting at a school in Nevada. They had several incidents in Europe over the weekend. Big coincidence?

http://www.ktnv.com/news/shooting-at-pahrump-school-reported


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pocjetty said:


> More than just a rumor. Looks like they do have another shooting at a school in Nevada. They had several incidents in Europe over the weekend. Big coincidence?
> 
> http://www.ktnv.com/news/shooting-at-pahrump-school-reported


This is in your link:

UPDATE AT 11:25 A.M. According to the Director of Nye County Emergency Management, there was not a shooting at any of the schools in Pahrump.


----------



## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

The only explanation I can come up with is cowardice. Firing on unarmed civilians from a perch above is cowardly behaviour, as was taking his own life as the SWAT team cornered him.

There is a reserved spot in hell for this bastage.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

ChuChu said:


> This is in your link:
> 
> UPDATE AT 11:25 A.M. According to the Director of Nye County Emergency Management, there was not a shooting at any of the schools in Pahrump.


Heh. That's not what it said just before I posted it. They added a bunch to the top. Down at the bottom it shows the "original story". (It was on a bunch of outlets.) If you can't trust the good ol' mainstream media, who can you trust?

"A shooting has been reported at a school in Pahrump. In addition, public offices in Pahrump have been closed."


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

ChuChu said:


> You still have to aim.


You didnt say 'aim' "Well I would say pretty accurate when your targets are a quarter mile away."
with the established 22k people/targets in a small area and a full barrage of bullets you dont really have to be very accurate. 
Your argument has been rendered moot by facts, give up the ghost.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

the toninator said:


> You didnt say 'aim' "Well I would say pretty accurate when your targets are a quarter mile away."
> with the established 22k people/targets in a small area and a full barrage of bullets you dont really have to be very accurate.
> Your argument has been rendered moot by facts, give up the ghost.


Show me the facts. Or shut up.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Tortuga said:


> Think first reports I read said..." 50 killed and 400+ 'injured'....lots of folks were probably trampled and hurt in the panic to get OUT of that crowd.....report said one fellow fell on his girl to protect her and still had footprints on the back of his shirt ....
> 
> truly horrible event either way...


Agree completely. I somewhat fear, or at very least respect possible problems of a large crowd moving like that.
IMO the gunman was responsible for any deaths or injuries that occurred though, so the reports are accurate. 
In many ways it is good he killed himself, but I hope authorities can somewhat find out what his problem was.


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

I wonder if the Sheriff is gonna w/hold weapon types in order to hopefully avoid any copycat stuff?


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

kweber said:


> I wonder if the Sheriff is gonna w/hold weapon types in order to hopefully avoid any copycat stuff?


It will come out.


----------



## Bull Red (Mar 17, 2010)

Sad state of affairs


----------



## prokat (Jul 17, 2010)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


----------



## GuyFromHuntsville (Aug 4, 2011)

If a bump stock was used, be prepared for the attempt to outlaw them.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

RRbohemian said:


> antifa members tweeting out praising him and glad to see the trump supporters slaughtered. What has the country become?





boltmaster said:


> Site your source for this statement please.


I don't know about Antifa, but the comments are out there. This one was a VP with CBS. I agree with RRBohemian - what has this country become?

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/10/02/top-cbs-lawyer-no-sympathy-for-vegas-vics-probably-republicans.html
CBS has parted ways with one of the companyâ€™s top lawyers after she said she is â€œnot even sympatheticâ€ to victims of the Las Vegas shooting because â€œcountry music fans often are Republican,â€ when discussing the tragic mass shooting that occurred in Las Vegas late Sunday night.Â


----------



## dk2429 (Mar 27, 2015)

Very sad ordeal.. Prayers to those involved


----------



## LandLocked (Apr 28, 2005)

pocjetty said:


> http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/10/02/top-cbs-lawyer-no-sympathy-for-vegas-vics-probably-republicans.html
> CBS has parted ways with one of the companyâ€™s top lawyers after she said she is â€œnot even sympatheticâ€ to victims of the Las Vegas shooting because â€œcountry music fans often are Republican,â€ when discussing the tragic mass shooting that occurred in Las Vegas late Sunday night.Â


WOW...just WOW!


----------



## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

bigfishtx said:


> Bump stocks are not spring loaded, you pull forward with one arm on the forestock and that causes the stock to bump back and forth. You can add a spring I imagine, that that makes them illegal.
> 
> I have one and I can tell you they are very hard to fire accurately.
> 
> Also, you cannot keep them firing over 5-10 rounds. That rifle sounds like an AK47 to me.


hmm I've only fat fingered one, didn't shoot it.

Always thought they had a spring in em. I get to learn new things every day.

now I have looped a finger in my belt loop, and accomplished the same thing. But that only fun for about 10 rounds.


----------



## sotexhookset (Jun 4, 2011)

LandLocked said:


> WOW...just WOW!


No chit wow. I hope this wretched whore loses her career, her family and eventually sooner than later her life.


----------



## Ltrichel (Jan 18, 2013)

the last time I bought a weapon or ammo was 40 years ago and have not fired either since then. but I thought as a result of some of the security and guns control laws when people buy ammo it gets fed into some type of data base that looks for the accumulation of 'excessive' ( what ever that is) consumption or purchase of firearms and ammo. One of the reports said he shot for almost an hour. Does such a law or process exist that tracks ammo purchases and with that many rounds fired surely they will uncover massive purchases or something.


----------



## GuyFromHuntsville (Aug 4, 2011)

Ltrichel said:


> the last time I bought a weapon or ammo was 40 years ago and have not fired either since then. but I thought as a result of some of the security and guns control laws when people buy ammo it gets fed into some type of data base that looks for the accumulation of 'excessive' ( what ever that is) consumption or purchase of firearms and ammo. One of the reports said he shot for almost an hour. Does such a law or process exist that tracks ammo purchases and with that many rounds fired surely they will uncover massive purchases or something.


No ID required to buy ammo, and rightly so. I buy a lot of ammo because we (as a family) shoot quite a bit. I don't want to be on any government watch list.


----------



## bluefin (Aug 16, 2005)

What's considered a 'massive purchase'? What he used I have on one shelf. I'd hardly consider that massive. 
As far as the bump stock, I don't get that either. Why put something on that almost ensures you won't hit your target? Only reason he did was b/c of the area spread of concentrated targets.


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

I smell a RAT. No record, no history, found dead in room.. Hmmm


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

id like to see the hotel surveillance vids of him checking in with his baggage. and the hallway vids also. you know they have them.. 10 long guns in the room..
:ac550:


----------



## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

JOHNNY QUEST said:


> id like to see the hotel surveillance vids of him checking in with his baggage. and the hallway vids also. you know they have them.. 10 long guns in the room..
> :ac550:


I'm betting he had most of it boxed and shipped to himself at the hotel. Probably all broken down.


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

Haute Pursuit said:


> I'm betting he had most of it boxed and shipped to himself at the hotel. Probably all broken down.


there should be a record of that as well..


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

JOHNNY QUEST said:


> id like to see the hotel surveillance vids of him checking in with his baggage. and the hallway vids also. you know they have them.. 10 long guns in the room..
> :ac550:


Disassembled, all ten in one suitcase.


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

ChuChu said:


> Disassembled, all ten in one suitcase.


good thing they have hotel dollys, cuz you nor I could pick it up for long..


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

ChuChu said:


> Disassembled, all ten in one suitcase.


Golf bag.Many go to Vegas with clubs.


----------



## Gasspergoo (Nov 14, 2010)

I'm with JQ. Something isn't right with all the info so far. I know he was firing into a huge crowd, but from 320 or so feet high and at least 400 yards away?? Seems like more than one shooter is a real possibility here.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Gasspergoo said:


> I'm with JQ. Something isn't right with all the info so far. I know he was firing into a huge crowd, but from 320 or so feet high and at least 400 yards away?? Seems like more than one shooter is a real possibility here.


Could be there were 2 windows knocked out. Maybe the other shooter shot him and ran.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

JOHNNY QUEST said:


> good thing they have hotel dollys, cuz you nor I could pick it up for long..


My wife will pack a 100# in our big red suitcase when we travel. Yes, I use bellhops.

He had four days to get ready, plenty of time to pack guns and ammo to his room.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Rubberback said:


> Could be there were 2 windows knocked out. Maybe the other shooter shot him and ran.


Early reports said he had the guns and two rifle stands in the room. Maybe there is another shooter. Hotel cameras should have caught that.


----------



## old 37 (Nov 30, 2014)

My questions: He had this planned and the plans took days to complete since ha had been checked in for a few days.Someone else knew about this and how could the woman that LIVED with him not be aware? I don't have the answers but this was not an older guy going over the edge.


----------



## I Fall In (Sep 18, 2011)

This is a sad day. All I can do is pray for those involved and pray for our country.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

ChuChu said:


> Early reports said he had the guns and two rifle stands in the room. Maybe there is another shooter. Hotel cameras should have caught that.


Didn't think of that.


----------



## bassguitarman (Nov 29, 2005)

Haute Pursuit said:


> There is a reserved spot in hell for this bastage.


Hell is too good for this one


----------



## RLwhaler (Sep 10, 2005)

Hmmmm....Let's see, one man kills 50 and wounds 200, is killed quick and in an hours his house is being searched and they aren't looking for anyone else....yea, I ain't buying this. Not for a second.


----------



## Bozo (Jun 16, 2004)

Vegas is the convention capitol of the world. I'm sure it isn't out of the ordinary for guests to have a lot of boxes and shipping cases in their rooms. Tons of salesmen hawking products and wares day in and day out at the various hotel ballrooms and convention centers.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

JOHNNY QUEST said:


> id like to see the hotel surveillance vids of him checking in with his baggage. and the hallway vids also. you know they have them.. 10 long guns in the room..
> :ac550:


You are right, in Vegas there has to be video. Maybe any big place would, but Vegas in particular.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

older 37 said:


> My questions: He had this planned and the plans took days to complete since ha had been checked in for a few days.Someone else knew about this and how could the woman that LIVED with him not be aware? I don't have the answers but this was not an older guy going over the edge.


The sheriff has taken her off the suspect list because she is out of the country. Is the shooting why she left the states? I think she knew what he was going to do, maybe not when and where, and he sent her off to protect her.


----------



## Wes427 (Nov 6, 2016)

Didn't anyone else catch the part where Jason Aldean just ran and didn't say a [email protected] thing?

Sent from my LG-H900 using Tapatalk


----------



## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

Wes427 said:


> Didn't anyone else catch the part where Jason Aldean just ran and didn't say a [email protected]n thing?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H900 using Tapatalk


Yeah, one of the first things I noticed... Hard to say what I would do though in the same situation.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Wes427 said:


> Didn't anyone else catch the part where Jason Aldean just ran and didn't say a [email protected] thing?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H900 using Tapatalk


Would you stand around with bullets flying around? He did what anyone including you and ran for cover.


----------



## DIHLON (Nov 15, 2009)

This is from the rooftop of the hotel looking at the event center. Google shows the distance to be ~1K'. It would not require a 2nd gunman to pull this off. Those people were like shooting fish in a barrel. You can remove your tin foil hats now. Prayers for all the victims and their families.


----------



## Wes427 (Nov 6, 2016)

Hell yeah I would run! But the dude had a cordless Britney Spears mic on!

Sent from my LG-H900 using Tapatalk


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

RLwhaler said:


> Hmmmm....Let's see, one man kills 50 and wounds 200, is killed quick and in an hours his house is being searched and they aren't looking for anyone else....yea, I ain't buying this. Not for a second.


Amazon has tin foil hats on sale for $12.95 due to the upcoming conspiracies surrounding this Las Vegas thing. Get em while their hot.


----------



## rynochop2.0 (Jul 14, 2016)

I love the conspiracy theory nut jobs and false flag stuff.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Watching this live Sheriff Joseph Lombardo interview. This guy is a master of the high stress interview. He is handling this like the G.O.A.T.


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

Sheriff just said 16 guns in hotel,18 more in his home with thousands of rounds and explosives.Ammonium nitrate in his car.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

Cut n Shoot said:


> Sheriff just said 16 guns in hotel,18 more in his home with thousands of rounds and explosives.Ammonium nitrate in his car.


I know these people are nuts, but why do they spend the time and money to buy so much, leave at there house and car. But never use it?

I get that they are not think right to begin with but what is sequence he would have played out to be able to use all 3 caches.

Put car ontimer to blow up, shoot at people running from car bomb, take a taxi to his home cause he just blew up his ride, then have it out at home? This is the 3rd one thats left stuff elsewhere. Just weird.


----------



## JLJ1981 (Nov 7, 2014)

Gasspergoo said:


> I'm with JQ. Something isn't right with all the info so far. I know he was firing into a huge crowd, but from 320 or so feet high and at least 400 yards away?? Seems like more than one shooter is a real possibility here.


Shooting a crowd at 400 yards with an AR-15 is not hard. Depending on your zero, you can aim center of mass and have combat effective hits at 400 yards. Add a tripod and full auto capability and it gets even easier. From my understanding he was there for a few nights before the shooting. I'm sure this nutjob ranged the target and scouted the whole thing out. With all the available ballistic calculator apps on android it's not hard to get your correct elevation including high angle calculations.


----------



## old 37 (Nov 30, 2014)

Still, I will say it again. No way he could pull this off without someone else knowing something. The woman lived with him and she just happened to be out of the country. PURE BS


----------



## RLwhaler (Sep 10, 2005)

tstorm5 said:


> Amazon has tin foil hats on sale for $12.95 due to the upcoming conspiracies surrounding this Las Vegas thing. Get em while their hot.


Ahhh... I didn't realize you were the leading investigator..Have that report on my desk first thing in the morning.


----------



## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

RLwhaler said:


> Ahhh... I didn't realize you were the leading investigator..Have that report on my desk first thing in the morning.


Your tin foil hat has night vision doesn't it bro? :cheers:


----------



## RLwhaler (Sep 10, 2005)

Haute Pursuit said:


> Your tin foil hat has night vision doesn't it bro? :cheers:


:rotfl::rotfl: :brew::brew:


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

I wonder if the autopsy on Stephen Paddock will reveal anything? 
Charles Whitman had a brain tumor.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

JLJ1981 said:


> Shooting a crowd at 400 yards with an AR-15 is not hard. Depending on your zero, you can aim center of mass and have combat effective hits at 400 yards. Add a tripod and full auto capability and it gets even easier. From my understanding he was there for a few nights before the shooting. I'm sure this nutjob ranged the target and scouted the whole thing out. With all the available ballistic calculator apps on android it's not hard to get your correct elevation including high angle calculations.


22000 packed into a small area and all those guns. Wonder not more are dead. Terrible situation.


----------



## the toninator (Jan 19, 2016)

Whitebassfisher said:


> I wonder if the autopsy on Stephen Paddock will reveal anything?
> Charles Whitman had a brain tumor.


CTE? ALS? Dementia?


----------



## Tortuga (May 21, 2004)

Someone reported that he was a big time gambler...and was 
on a losing streak....

Lotsa guys have swallowed a bullet for that....or less....

I knew a few who sat down at the game on the third
floor of the Country Club...went home...and did just this, but
without taking any others with them...


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

RLwhaler said:


> Ahhh... I didn't realize you were the leading investigator..Have that report on my desk first thing in the morning.


No problem. Iâ€™m one of the surviving Branch Davidians so I donâ€™t believe everything I hear either. Hold on a minute...

OK, Iâ€™m back, thought I heard approaching FBI agents. It was a neighbor out for a walk.

Iâ€™m just having a little fun here as I am so stressed over the not quite dead Tom Petty situation.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Well this appears to be an answer to some of the discussion from earlier:

http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-deadly-shooting-20171002-story.html
By the time a SWAT team burst into the room, Paddock had killed himself â€" leaving in the hotel room at least 17 weapons, mostly military-style rifles. *At least one of them had been modified with a legal "bump stock"-style device that enables the shooter to rapidly fire off rounds without actually converting the rifle to a fully automatic weapon*, one federal law enforcement source said. Other weapons may have been converted to fully automatic fire and were still being examined.


----------



## scwine (Sep 7, 2006)

Didn't read the entire thread, saw a few posts about getting guns up to the room......
You can(could, maybe after today)..walk through any LV hotel lobby and to the elevators with Pelican cases full of guns. People do it for various legitimate reasons.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

scwine said:


> Didn't read the entire thread, saw a few posts about getting guns up to the room......
> You can(could, maybe after today)..walk through any LV hotel lobby and to the elevators with Pelican cases full of guns. People do it for various legitimate reasons.


I always take a rifle of some sort on any overnight trip. I dam sure aint gonna leave it in the truck. Never have had anyone even bat an eye, maybe some will.....if they even notice. I use sport bags mostly now though.


----------



## 4 Ever-Fish N (Jun 10, 2006)

Interesting. No overnight trips without a rifle? What kind of areas are you visiting? I don't blame you for not wanting to leave any values in your vehicle.



muney pit said:


> I always take a rifle of some sort on any overnight trip. I dam sure aint gonna leave it in the truck. Never have had anyone even bat an eye, maybe some will.....if they even notice. I use sport bags mostly now though.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

These Las Vegas Sheriff Dept folks are very good at providing updates to the press.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

23 firearms found at Mandalay Bay and 19 in his house. That from the Las Vegas Sheriff Dept at 9:14 CT


----------



## Fishy Eye (Sep 2, 2015)

pocjetty said:


> Well this appears to be an answer to some of the discussion from earlier:
> 
> http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-deadly-shooting-20171002-story.html
> By the time a SWAT team burst into the room, Paddock had killed himself â€" leaving in the hotel room at least 17 weapons, mostly military-style rifles. *At least one of them had been modified with a legal "bump stock"-style device that enables the shooter to rapidly fire off rounds without actually converting the rifle to a fully automatic weapon*, one federal law enforcement source said. Other weapons may have been converted to fully automatic fire and were still being examined.


Yep, and 23 firearms in the hotel too! What the hell? That guy had a real screw loose. Hell bent on killing.


----------



## batmaninja (Jul 15, 2010)

Why no videos of him, it was Vegas. Cameras are everywhere and the news is showing some pic of the shooter with his eyes closed?


----------



## Wizness (Jun 15, 2011)

People will start panic buying slide fire stocks soon enough. Watch the price skyrocket.


----------



## tbdoppler (Aug 27, 2011)

Fishy Eye said:


> Just insane. Sounded like a bump fire stock on that rifle. Rate of fire was slow and not steady like a true full automatic. Sick POS.


I thought the same thing myself when I heard it.


----------



## jimk (May 28, 2004)

Ideological killing??
Media isn't following their usual pattern of blame.


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

how long was the shooter active until they stopped him?
had to been quite a while to just locate him.


----------



## TexasWineGuy (Jun 19, 2017)

pocjetty said:


> Well this appears to be an answer to some of the discussion from earlier:
> 
> http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-deadly-shooting-20171002-story.html
> By the time a SWAT team burst into the room, Paddock had killed himself â€" leaving in the hotel room at least 17 weapons, mostly military-style rifles. *At least one of them had been modified with a legal "bump stock"-style device that enables the shooter to rapidly fire off rounds without actually converting the rifle to a fully automatic weapon*, one federal law enforcement source said. Other weapons may have been converted to fully automatic fire and were still being examined.


POC, I'm not buying that. I've used those Bump Fire techniques and devices and have never seen anyone that can sustain the cyclic rate that we heard on those videos. IMO, he had full-auto weapons.

TWG


----------



## TexasWineGuy (Jun 19, 2017)

kweber said:


> how long was the shooter active until they stopped him?
> had to been quite a while to just locate him.


The police entered his room 70 minutes after the shooting started, whereupon they found him dead due to a self inflicted gunshot (allegedly).

TWG


----------



## cubera (Mar 9, 2005)

kweber said:


> how long was the shooter active until they stopped him?
> had to been quite a while to just locate him.


Smoke alarms going off in the room gave them a location.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

kweber said:


> how long was the shooter active until they stopped him?
> had to been quite a while to just locate him.


They identified the room when the smoke alarm went off.


----------



## batmaninja (Jul 15, 2010)

I think he modified his guns with a crank trigger versus the slide stock. Read he had tripods which would aid with the crank trigger. Still dont know how an accountant knows how to do this stuff or how he get the bomb making supplies?

Have seen a several of reports about a shooter closer to the fourth floor.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

batmaninja said:


> . Still dont know how an accountant knows how to do this stuff or how he get the bomb making supplies?
> 
> .


The internet is an amazing thing!!


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Video from cab driver sitting at Mandalay Bay when it started and at 9:00 mark some people trying to run away jump in her cab. 





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

bzrk180 said:


> The internet is an amazing thing!!


yep... took me less than 1 min to locate 50 and 100rd drum mags for AR platforms...


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Couple of things I hope they release soon. The number of shots fired and the number of people that were actually struck by a bullet. There has to be a pile of shell casings laying in that hotel room.


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

tstorm5 said:


> Couple of things I hope they release soon. The number of shots fired and the number of people that were actually struck by a bullet. There has to be a pile of shell casings laying in that hotel room.


me, too!
also would like to know what rds were used...
5.56, .308, 7.62x39...
and FMJ ammo can pass-thru and strike multiple bodies... 
supposedly this guy had money, so getting any type of firearm was probably not difficult (full auto)


----------



## prokat (Jul 17, 2010)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


----------



## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

Ducatibilt said:


> So how many rounds/mags do you think he could have went through for that many dead and injured? Granted shooting into a crown that large made it easy, but that's still a lot of people hit. Just trying to wrap my head around it.
> 
> That's almost 600 people hit, so that's 20 30rd mags right there.





bluefin said:


> I'm betting many of the injured were hit by ricochets or even bullets that hit someone and passed thru them, hit the concrete and bounced up hitting another person.





tstorm5 said:


> Couple of things I hope they release soon. The number of shots fired and the number of people that were actually struck by a bullet. There has to be a pile of shell casings laying in that hotel room.


He's credited with this staggering # of injured, but listening (on NPR) to the HMFIC at the Trauma Center where these people* were taken, he said that a lot of the people he saw were broken bones and injuries from the rush to escape, many were not gunshot related.

*the doctor interviewed said he'd treated 180pp, so there were multiple facilities used, but his perspective on percentage injuries sustained from gunshot vs trampling is what was being conveyed


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

kweber said:


> me, too!
> also would like to know what rds were used...
> 5.56, .308, 7.62x39...
> and FMJ ammo can pass-thru and strike multiple bodies...
> supposedly this guy had money, so getting any type of firearm was probably not difficult (full auto)


The Sheriff said .308 and .223..That first volley was from a drum mag,IMO, around 50 RDS.I'm guessing he had two different positions in order to let one rifle cool.An AR 15 .223 on one position, a AR 10 .308 on another.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

prokat said:


> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


And your point is?


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

prokat said:


> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


Is this really a guy taking a swig and then giving the bird to the shooter?


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

kweber said:


> yep... took me less than 1 min to locate 50 and 100rd drum mags for AR platforms...


You just got flagged by the Govt!! lol!!


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

TexasWineGuy said:


> The police entered his room 70 minutes after the shooting started, whereupon they found him dead due to a self inflicted gunshot (allegedly).
> 
> TWG


so he had at least an hour to utilize over a dozen weapons...
so he could have fired many hunderds or even a thousand rnds w/crank-trigger, bump-stock and converted semi's ...
I still think the SO's office is purposely keeping weapons and accessories under wraps because it's so easy to amass this stuff w/enough funds


----------



## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

So now there is a video showing possibly another shooter down on the 4th-5th floor. I am wondering if the lower floor windows open though someone made mention of an air vent below the window that could be utilized. The upper 32nd floor did show 2 windows out which would make sense of the 2 gun scenario given letting one cool.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

#_psychopathicaccountants_


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

don't need to let one cool w/20+ guns (assuming most were ar/ak/ semi-auto types)
run a full drum thu one, pitch it and get on a fresh one...
an hr is an eternity to run off 100rds in 20 guns...
that is if all of them were utilized. we still don't know how many he used...


----------



## POC Troutman (Jul 13, 2009)

someone mentioned this earlier, but at 400 yards with that amount of ammunition and the supposed number of rounds fired, it's an absolute miracle that more people were not killed. 

prayers for the families, what a tragedy. so sad.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

gbollom said:


> Is this really a guy taking a swig and then giving the bird to the shooter?


Dayum. I wonder if that's real? Classic if it is. Brave? drunk? both? -FU crazy psychopath shooter!


----------



## big john o (Aug 12, 2005)

poppadawg said:


> Dayum. I wonder if that's real? Classic if it is. Brave? drunk? both? -FU crazy psychopath shooter!


He was making himself a target as well as everyone else huddled around him.


----------



## gotmuddy (Dec 19, 2013)

bwguardian said:


> So now there is a video showing possibly another shooter down on the 4th-5th floor. I am wondering if the lower floor windows open though someone made mention of an air vent below the window that could be utilized. The upper 32nd floor did show 2 windows out which would make sense of the 2 gun scenario given letting one cool.


while I believe there were two shooters, I do not believe there was one on the 4th-5th floor. I dont believe you can even see the crowd from there.


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

bwguardian said:


> So now there is a video showing possibly another shooter down on the 4th-5th floor. I am wondering if the lower floor windows open though someone made mention of an air vent below the window that could be utilized. The upper 32nd floor did show 2 windows out which would make sense of the 2 gun scenario given letting one cool.


Do you have a link on this one? Was there flashes coming from the 4th floor that leads them to believe so?


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

Wow.. This is starting to sound like the grassey knoll.It doesn't make sense, I'll give the tin foil hat peeps that.The Filipino couple in the crowd telling folks that they were all going to die just freaks me out.Who knows? Will our government tell us the truth?


----------



## glenbo (Apr 9, 2010)

I'll bet a beer that autopsy will find some psych drugs in him. It's happened with every single other mass shooter.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

If there had been a second shooter he would be caught on tape somewhere. It is Vegas. Also the motive is a mystery. Two wacko mass murderers without a motive? Too far a leap for me


----------



## fishinguy (Aug 5, 2004)

gbollom said:


> Do you have a link on this one? Was there flashes coming from the 4th floor that leads them to believe so?


I think this is video where they are calming are flashes on the 4th floor. I do not think that it is a muzzle flash looks like a light to me.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

glenbo said:


> I'll bet a beer that autopsy will find some psych drugs in him. It's happened with every single other mass shooter.


Good question. They have psych drugs in them cuz they crazy, or did the psych drugs make them crazy?


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

gbollom said:


> Do you have a link on this one? Was there flashes coming from the 4th floor that leads them to believe so?


Reports I read were it looked to be a strobe light....But its hard to tell from the video out there.


----------



## Mallardman02 (Sep 13, 2007)

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/onl...e-photos-of-las-vegas-shooters-guns/618716556

Sure looks like a slide fire (bump stock).


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

big john o said:


> He was making himself a target as well as everyone else huddled around him.


I'm pretty sure the whole crowd was already a target,not sure if this pic is what it seems but at 400yds and 300' up I don't think the shooter would have been focused on one guy.


----------



## big john o (Aug 12, 2005)

fishinguy said:


> I think this is video where they are calming are flashes on the 4th floor. I do not think that it is a muzzle flash looks like a light to me.


Its a reflection from the lights on the cop car


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Majek11 said:


> I'm pretty sure the whole crowd was already a target,not sure if this pic is what it seems but at 400yds and 300' up I don't think the shooter would have been focused on one guy.


and dark.


----------



## saltwatersensations (Aug 30, 2004)

gbollom said:


> Do you have a link on this one? Was there flashes coming from the 4th floor that leads them to believe so?


Apparently a strobe/disco light....


----------



## grittydog (Jan 16, 2008)

saltwatersensations said:


> Apparently a strobe/disco light....


It was 20 minutes into it when hotel security was shot outside the shooters room by the shooter, I bet he shot himself around that time. That's what I read anyway

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk


----------



## POC Troutman (Jul 13, 2009)

Mallardman02 said:


> http://www.fox25boston.com/news/onl...e-photos-of-las-vegas-shooters-guns/618716556
> 
> Sure looks like a slide fire (bump stock).


no doubt it is in that one picture.


----------



## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

I read somewhere that the flashing light on the 4th floor was the strobe from the fire alarm.



> Is this really a guy taking a swig and then giving the bird to the shooter?


Looks like a chubby Nicolas Cage...I can see him doing that as he's Leaving Las Vegas.

TH


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Iâ€™m not always on the cops side but this sheriff in Las Vegas is doing a great job dealing with these press folks.


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

big john o said:


> Its a reflection from the lights on the cop car


That's what I was thinking,I didn't see any other pics of broken windows at that level


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

Looks like he sent a lot of money to the Philippines before he went off the deep end,starting to see pics of him over there showing up on the news.Lots of terrorist activity over there.


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

I'm wondering if the sicko video taped the whole event now.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

boom! said:


> I'm wondering if the sicko video taped the whole event now.


Yea he did. Did you guys not see the pic of the p.o.s on the floor and some of the rifles he used? He had a note on one of the table and its been reported he video himself. His body should be taken out in the desert and left for the buzzards. We need to start showing theses sicko's they're not gonna get burried in piece.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-03/first-pictures-emerge-vegas-shooters-weapons


----------



## Lucky Banana (Jun 24, 2016)

bzrk180 said:


> http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-03/first-pictures-emerge-vegas-shooters-weapons


These pictures give me goosebumps. Just thinking about the premeditated aspect of all this is crazy.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

Lucky Banana said:


> These pictures give me goosebumps. Just thinking about the premeditated aspect of all this is crazy.


You still think he did it on his own?


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

muney pit said:


> You still think he did it on his own?


I think it is VERY possible that he did it on his own. Really, not sure why one would think that is not possible. He had 3 days (that we know of) to set up and prepare the weapons and stage the ammo (which it looks like he did). In the gaps of the shooting, he could have easily walked from one window to the other and changed out weapons or clips. If he had this methodically planned out as it appears he did, I think it is more than reasonable to think that he could have done this alone.

A madman with a plan and ambition to make it so is a VERY intimidating concept.

I am disgusted with this act and the harm that it has done, and will do for a lifetime to these people and their families. However, I am very interested to see how this story comes together. I would not be one bit surprised if they find a manifesto, or a trail of some kind of documentation that will lead up to this event. This is FAR too planned out not to have this documented....

I will lean to the idea that he is VERY proud of this accomplishment and will be VERY proud to have left a legacy of such a violent act. There will be MUCH more to this story over the next several weeks, of that one can be sure!!


----------



## Lucky Banana (Jun 24, 2016)

muney pit said:


> You still think he did it on his own?


Who am I to speculate?


----------



## DCAVA (Aug 5, 2013)

Crazy chit going on in this crazy world we live in. One crazy MF POS white boy!!!


----------



## SteveZissou (Apr 23, 2015)

Slide fire stock prices are already on the rise


----------



## Wizness (Jun 15, 2011)

SteveZissou said:


> Slide fire stock prices are already on the rise


Bought mine yesterday since I had a feeling a slide fire was used. May be a good investment.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

SteveZissou said:


> Slide fire stock prices are already on the rise


Good greif. The thing is fun but not that fun. I bought one years ago. Put it on an ar and its so sloppy you do good to even hit the backstop. I ended up putting it on a 22lr. It looses its appeal after a few minutes. Couldnt tell ya the last time i shot it.

Edit.to say i ment it feel in the lake with all my other guns in a boating accident


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Wizness said:


> Bought mine yesterday since I had a feeling a slide fire was used. May be a good investment.


Would you sell that to a stranger? How do you cash in on that investment


----------



## Wizness (Jun 15, 2011)

poppadawg said:


> Would you sell that to a stranger? How do you cash in on that investment


I've sold guns, ammo, tools whatever to strangers before. If it legal and within my rights I don't see a problem. It's not like they can't go to cabelas and pick one up.


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

poppadawg said:


> Would you sell that to a stranger? How do you cash in on that investment


Why wouldn't you?


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

No I don't think I would. But then I wouldn't sell any gun to a stranger. Never sold any of my guns for that matter. I don't like strangers. Never even heard of a bump stock till now. Wouldn't feel comfortable with it after this tragedy. Not a moral attack, just a personal choice.


----------



## Lexy1 (Jul 12, 2012)

Wizness said:


> I've sold guns, ammo, tools whatever to strangers before. If it legal and within my rights I don't see a problem. It's not like they can't go to cabelas and pick one up.


As matter of facts, quite a lot of people buy guns from individuals cuz they cannot buy from Cabelas/BPS/Academy.


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

Lexy1 said:


> As matter of facts, quite a lot of people buy guns from individuals cuz they cannot buy from Cabelas/BPS/Academy.


If they can't buy from a store then they aren't supposed to have one which makes them criminals which proves that no matter what laws they make,criminals will break them.


----------



## donf (Aug 8, 2005)

The slide fire, or bump fire device is a gimmick . I used it once , there is no controlling the aim point, and the Ar is basically bouncing around in your hand to give you the impression that you are replicating full auto fire. The AR is still being fired one shot at a time , the recoil is creating a faster trigger pull. At the lunatics elevated position, spray fire from 400 yards away, into a crowd of thousands, achieved his demented goal. 
This specific type of attack is almost impossible to prevent at a outdoor venue that is not high profile, like a Super Bowl.


----------



## SteveZissou (Apr 23, 2015)

Majek11 said:


> If they can't buy from a store then they aren't supposed to have one which makes them criminals which proves that no matter what laws they make,criminals will break them.


100% correct. Also be ready for the dems to start the push for more gun legislation and universal background checks. As well as no more than 9 suit cases per person in a vegas hotel. I'm not a tin foil hat dude, but those for more gun control will use this tragedy as their base.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Majek11 said:


> If they can't buy from a store then they aren't supposed to have one which makes them criminals which proves that no matter what laws they make,criminals will break them.


Exactly! But they will ban some stuff this time. Watch and see. Guess it will satisfy the public.
But no way it will stop this. There is to many guns out there and bullets. Black market will win. 
That nut had some guns. Black ones.
I would say his girlfriend new all about what he did. That's why she left the country. Just my guess. 
He sent her money. Wonder if she will come back? Will see!


----------



## Main Frame 8 (Mar 16, 2007)

SteveZissou said:


> 100% correct. *Also be ready for the dems to start the push for more gun legislation and universal background checks.* As well as no more than 9 suit cases per person in a vegas hotel. *I'm not a tin foil hat dude, but those for more gun control will use this tragedy as their base.*


 As they have every time a similar event happens. Next will come the panic purchases of "black guns" and related accessories for them, ammo prices rise............you know the drill.


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

muney pit said:


> You still think he did it on his own?


Yep, until evidence proves otherwise. Speculation that says â€œno way one man did thisâ€ or the guyâ€™s background isnâ€™t enough

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Wizness (Jun 15, 2011)

Unfortunately the hearing protection act is prob gonna be shut down. Was due for a vote this week. Gonna suck for sure.


----------



## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

In the video posted of the cab driver you can hear how he moves from window to window. One set of rounds sounds close up in the video then the next set sounds like from a slightly different angle. Looked as if room was a corner room.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

fishin shallow said:


> In the video posted of the cab driver you can hear how he moves from window to window. One set of rounds sounds close up in the video then the next set sounds like from a slightly different angle. Looked as if room was a corner room.


It was he had tried to get that room the week before but it was already booked. So he waited until he could get that room.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

Wizness said:


> Unfortunately the hearing protection act is prob gonna be shut down. Was due for a vote this week. Gonna suck for sure.


No, paul ryan killed it. That sob has help kill the repeal odumbo care, now he killed the suppressor thing. That dude is a dem in disguise.


----------



## Wizness (Jun 15, 2011)

muney pit said:


> No, paul ryan killed it. That sob has help kill the repeal odumbo care, now he killed the suppressor thing. That dude is a dem in disguise.


Piece of trash indeed


----------



## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

Slide fire stocks were 120$ yesterday and now they are sold out with them selling for up to 600$ on auction sites, the hoarding has begun.


----------



## DIHLON (Nov 15, 2009)

jjtroutkiller said:


> Slide fire stocks were 120$ yesterday and now they are sold out with them selling for up to 600$ on auction sites, the hoarding has begun.


They can have them. Never had the urge to buy a tacticool Slidefire stock.


----------



## RLwhaler (Sep 10, 2005)

muney pit said:


> No, paul ryan killed it. That sob has help kill the repeal odumbo care, now he killed the suppressor thing. That dude is a dem in disguise.





Wizness said:


> Piece of trash indeed


I thought that limp-wrist Ryan got rid of it too. We'll see....

" A number of news reports out this afternoon claim Speaker of the House Paul Ryan shelved a vote on legislation which includes the deregulation of firearm suppressors in response to the attack in Las Vegas Sunday night. The reports also imply Ryan pulled the bill in response to criticisms from Hillary Clinton and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer.Â 
Those reports are false. The bill in question, the SHARE Act, was never scheduled for a vote this week. Ryan said this during a press conference earlier today.Â "

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katie...ll-on-silencers-because-of-las-vegas-n2390255


----------



## D HOGG (Jul 2, 2012)

tstorm5 said:


> I'm gonna just sit back and wait till they tell us the weapon and clip types. It sounded like something that throws a lot of lead relatively fast. Definitely not a muzzle loader.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I agree with you. However, the problem here is wait till they tell us. Unfortunately these days to get accurate news reporting you almost have to turn to foreign news sources. Our National and local news reporting is so agenda driven it's sickening. Even Fox News isn't so fair and balanced as it used to be ...

Getting the truth from this horrible event will be challenging to say the least ...


----------



## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

DIHLON said:


> They can have them. Never had the urge to buy a tacticool Slidefire stock.


Same here!


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Pretty sure I just saw on Fox News where some guy called police and gave them the exact room where shooter was and he is now â€œdemandingâ€ to know why it took them an hour more to finally get in killers room. 
I wish this clown demanding stuff would put himself in the position of the cops and realize no one knew how many shooters there were and try to imagine what itâ€™s like to go looking through hotel hallways and rooms for a person or persons that might be trying to shoot back at you.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Now here comes Trump and I doubt he understands the difficulty the local police have in dealing with shutting down McCarron Airport, assisting Secret Service and preparing for a Presidential arrival. These Vegas cops are already running around trying to do normal stuff and investigate this shooting. Now a Presidents visit on top of everything else. Poor bastages.


----------



## BullyARed (Jun 19, 2010)

and if he doesn't go, the hypocrite liberals and POS liberal MSM along with late night idiot jokers will call for his head!


----------



## GMTK (Sep 8, 2008)

Silver mag is a 100 rounder. Looks like a stack of more behind it (I count 18)./

Wow.

http://www.surefire.com/mag5-100.html


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

tstorm5 said:


> Now here comes Trump and I doubt he understands the difficulty the local police have in dealing with shutting down McCarron Airport, assisting Secret Service and preparing for a Presidential arrival. These Vegas cops are already running around trying to do normal stuff and investigate this shooting. Now a Presidents visit on top of everything else. Poor bastages.


You know better though, right?


----------



## irbjd (Aug 11, 2005)

tstorm5 said:


> Pretty sure I just saw on Fox News where some guy called police and gave them the exact room where shooter was and he is now â€œdemandingâ€ to know why it took them an hour more to finally get in killers room.
> I wish this clown demanding stuff would put himself in the position of the cops and realize no one knew how many shooters there were and try to imagine what itâ€™s like to go looking through hotel hallways and rooms for a person or persons that might be trying to shoot back at you.


They were on the 32nd floor within 16 minutes and taking fire. He wasn't confirmed dead until a little more than an hour later.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ne-how-las-vegas-shooting-unfolded/729034001/


----------



## Notenoughtime (Mar 7, 2011)

irbjd said:


> They were on the 32nd floor within 16 minutes and taking fire. He wasn't confirmed dead until a little more than an hour later.
> 
> http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ne-how-las-vegas-shooting-unfolded/729034001/


Doesn't look like he is "demanding" anything.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/915286426278879233


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

GMTK said:


> Silver mag is a 100 rounder. Looks like a stack of more behind it (I count 18)./
> 
> Wow.
> 
> http://www.surefire.com/mag5-100.html


This shows the guy didnt know guns. Those surefire mags suck ***. They jam more than not. Normal 30 rounders work just fine.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

Anyone else find the pic of the POS on the floor odd? The gun has a blood trial going to it and ole dude supposedly shot himself mid center of the chest?


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Notenoughtime said:


> Doesn't look like he is "demanding" anything.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/915286426278879233


Is it possible there were two people that called police and the one Fox News was talking about was a different person?


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

muney pit said:


> Anyone else find the pic of the POS on the floor odd? The gun has a blood trial going to it and ole dude supposedly shot himself mid center of the chest?


The pic I saw shows he put the gun in his mouth. He does have blood mid chest area too.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

muney pit said:


> Anyone else find the pic of the POS on the floor odd? The gun has a blood trial going to it and ole dude supposedly shot himself mid center of the chest?


He has something mid center of chest, maybe sweat, maybe eats sloppy and dribbled on himself. It could be blood, not sure. At the shot, blood would have gotten on gun and his hand in that instant, and could get spread.

He shot himself with gun inside his mouth. When he fell, his chin was fairly high the way his head was on the floor. His mouth filled with blood and ran out.... gravity.

Realize guns recoil, it may move after the shot. His nerves and muscles may have moved some after the shot. No two bullets act exactly the same, and brain or central nervous system shots can vary IMO.

The revolver may have ended in that spot, but was possibly kicked further away by a cop. Even when someone looks obviously dead to me, they tend to kick weapons aside to ensure safety.

That is what I see.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

muney pit said:


> Anyone else find the pic of the POS on the floor odd? The gun has a blood trial going to it and ole dude supposedly shot himself mid center of the chest?


I made a conscious decision not to post that picture here. I don't know what ghoul took that photo, and then released it to the general public. I haven't heard any official source say that he shot himself in the chest, but there are lots of rumors flying around, about a lot of things.

It was a gunshot to the head. I've seen a picture like that before - family relation. It looked just like that. That's all I have to say about it.


----------



## saltwatersensations (Aug 30, 2004)

Cut n Shoot said:


> The pic I saw shows he put the gun in his mouth. He does have blood mid chest area too.


Those pics look fishy to me. Dried blood pool and a wet one also.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

pocjetty said:


> I made a conscious decision not to post that picture here. I don't know what ghoul took that photo, and then released it to the general public.....


I respect you and can understand the above, but also feel like we deserve the uncensored truth in this situation. Maybe it's just my inherent distrust of the media, but I don't want them choosing what to release to me.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

saltwatersensations said:


> Those pics look fishy to me. Dried blood pool and a wet one also.


It looks to me like the blood soaked into the carpet was immediate fresh arterial blood that had time to soak in...The gelatinous glob is perhaps bloody brain matter that oozed out over time and 'floated' above the initial fresh blood...The shell casing in the middle of the blob looks suspect...It seems like it would have pushed away like the other one @ one o clock...Cucking Foward!


----------



## MEGABITE (May 21, 2004)

tstorm5 said:


> Now here comes Trump and I doubt he understands the difficulty the local police have in dealing with shutting down McCarron Airport, assisting Secret Service and preparing for a Presidential arrival. These Vegas cops are already running around trying to do normal stuff and investigate this shooting. Now a Presidents visit on top of everything else. Poor bastages.


You know all of the eternal whiners and MSM would all be crying "Where's The President!?" if he didn't.

Do you think the entire police force is investigating this?  I would guess the FBI is on it instead.

Also, AF1 would probably land at one of the Air Force bases nearby.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

muney pit said:


> Anyone else find the pic of the POS on the floor odd? The gun has a blood trial going to it and ole dude supposedly shot himself mid center of the chest?


Make entry, kick gun away from body and assure the threat is eliminated.


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

bzrk180 said:


> Make entry, kick gun away from body and assure the threat is eliminated.


yep...
SWAT team don't knock first...
their job is to eliminate threat... the detectives can figger it all out later...


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

saltwatersensations said:


> Those pics look fishy to me. Dried blood pool and a wet one also.


Blood coagulates fairly quickly...Especially the top layer in a particularly dry climate with air moving through the room. It is entirely possible that the body laid on that floor for 15 minutes before secured entry...Allow another 10 minutes to secure the hotel and another 30+ minutes before investigators are allowed into a the scene to start processing....And I would suspect that these are pretty conservative time frames with other possible concerns such as booby traps and explosive possibilities.


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

bzrk180 said:


> Make entry, kick gun away from body and assure the threat is eliminated.


Blow the door put a round in his chest to make sure


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Whitebassfisher said:


> I respect you and can understand the above, but also feel like we deserve the uncensored truth in this situation. Maybe it's just my inherent distrust of the media, but I don't want them choosing what to release to me.


No, it's a sad thing that we have reached the point of such distrust that if they tell us he committed suicide, we can't believe it unless we see the picture of his brains spilled out on the carpet - and maybe not even then. It's even sadder that much of that distrust is justified. There are so many people who would like to score some political point, who would gladly skew the truth to their own advantage.


----------



## gotmuddy (Dec 19, 2013)

pocjetty said:


> No, it's a sad thing that we have reached the point of such distrust that if they tell us he committed suicide, we can't believe it unless we see the picture of his brains spilled out on the carpet - and maybe not even then. * It's even sadder that much of that distrust is justified*. There are so many people who would like to score some political point, who would gladly skew the truth to their own advantage.


this, we are always lied to.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

MEGABITE said:


> You know all of the eternal whiners and MSM would all be crying "Where's The President!?" if he didn't.
> 
> Do you think the entire police force is investigating this?  I would guess the FBI is on it instead.
> 
> Also, AF1 would probably land at one of the Air Force bases nearby.


I agree its better that he go visit Las Vegas. I have to imagine the cops are still a little unraveled over this mess. There is no way that place is back to normal yet. 
Trump landed at McCarran which is conveniently 1/2 mile from the strip.


----------



## saltwatersensations (Aug 30, 2004)

No one mentioned anything when all that glass hit the ground from the windows?


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

tstorm5 said:


> There is no way that place is back to normal yet.


Its Vegas...Whats "normal" mean!? lol


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

bzrk180 said:


> Its Vegas...Whats "normal" mean!? lol


LOL!!! Yeah, that place is not your average city. You can see every form of crazy just walking down the strip for 30 minutes.


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

saltwatersensations said:


> No one mentioned anything when all that glass hit the ground from the windows?


Looking at google maps, looks like it could have fallen on the roof/overhang of the driveway below. Either way, I don't know.

I thought more about a sensor going off alerting that a window was broken but at this point I'm not speculating anymore and will let the investigators figure it out and present it.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

saltwatersensations said:


> No one mentioned anything when all that glass hit the ground from the windows?


It crossed my mind about falling glass. But by the time someone could use their cell or walk inside to the desk, he was probably already shooting anyway.


----------



## glenbo (Apr 9, 2010)

Just got this in an email from Front Sight, copy of an article written by John Lott:



"Within hours of the horrible attack in Las Vegas, before we knew most of the relevant facts about the tragedy, gun control advocates were calling for more gun control. Here is something I would like those advocates to consider: Europe, which has all the gun controls that are being pushed in the aftermath of the Las Vegas carnage, has actually suffered more bloodshed from these types of attacks than the U.S.

You heard that right: Countries such as France may have made all semi-automatic guns illegal, but that hasn't stopped killers from getting fully automatic machine guns to use in mass shooting attacks. All four of the 2015 mass public shooting in France involved machine guns, including the 130 people killed in November of that year in multiple attacks including one at a concert venue.

In the 1970s, 80s and 90s, Europe saw machine gun attacks in airports and nightclubs by groups such as Black September and the Red Army Faction. In fact, machine guns are commonly used in mass shootings in the rest of the world.

This has not been the case here in the U.S. In fact, Sunday's attack on a country music festival in Las Vegas - that left at least 58 people dead and more than 500 wounded - may be the first mass public shooting in the U.S. involving a machine gun, if it turns out the killer did use such a weapon. According to a Wall Street Journal report, the gunman, 64-year-old Stephen Paddock, is believed to have used at least one fully automatic weapon - weapons that are heavily restricted under U.S. federal law.

It is an attack that is likely to rank 14th in the most deadly mass public shooting in the world since 1970. It is the worst ever in the United States, according to data collected by the Center for Crime Research where I am founder and president.

There were 29 such shootings (four or more fatalities in a public place, according to the FBI's official definition) in the U.S. during the eight years of the Obama administration; 26 in Europe. The rate at which people are killed is virtually the same in the European Union as in the United States.

Again, many of the facts about what happened in Las Vegas remain unknown at the moment, including exactly what type of firearm the gunman used. But one sad fact that everyone calling for gun control needs to consider is that, as Europe has shown, you can have all the gun control laws you want and you still won't be able to stop horrors like this from happening."

John R. Lott, Jr. is a columnist for FoxNews.com. He is an economist and was formerly chief economist at the United States Sentencing Commission. Lott is also a leading expert on guns and op-eds on that issue are done in conjunction with the Crime Prevention Research Center. He is the author of nine books including "More Guns, Less Crime." His latest book is "The War on Guns: Arming Yourself Against Gun Control Lies (August 1, 2016). Follow him on [email protected]


----------



## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

pocjetty said:


> No, it's a sad thing that we have reached the point of such distrust that if they tell us he committed suicide, we can't believe it unless we see the picture of his brains spilled out on the carpet - and maybe not even then. It's even sadder that much of that distrust is justified. There are so many people who would like to score some political point, who would gladly skew the truth to their own advantage.


I agree, but we're being told a guy killed 59 folks from several hundred yards using a bump fire stock.

That's nuts.


----------



## TranTheMan (Aug 17, 2009)

glenbo said:


> Just got this in an email from Front Sight, copy of an article written by John Lott:
> 
> You heard that right: Countries such as France may have made all semi-automatic guns illegal, but that hasn't stopped killers from getting fully automatic machine guns to use in mass shooting attacks. All four of the 2015 mass public shooting in France involved machine guns, including the 130 people killed in November of that year in multiple attacks including one at a concert venue.
> 
> .


With the collapse of the Eastern Bloc some of the former Eastern Bloc countries have joined the EU (Bulgaria, Croatia, Estonia, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia ...) and with them there are plenty of illegal weapons available to the Western markets. They are the real McCoy, not bump-fire stock type.

It is kind of surprised that it has not happened more often over there, so the French must have worked very hard to prevent it -- the French gendarme deserve a lot of credits on this.


----------



## cubera (Mar 9, 2005)

tstorm5 said:


> LOL!!! Yeah, that place is not your average city. You can see every form of crazy just walking down the strip for 30 minutes.


Crazy, the very reason I quit making it a destination.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Fishy Eye said:


> Just insane. Sounded like a bump fire stock on that rifle. Rate of fire was slow and not steady like a true full automatic. Sick POS.


Gotta give Fishy Eye some credit. He knew it from the sound on the videoâ€™s.


----------



## grman (Jul 2, 2010)

I think it was wise for Ryan to delay the vote. Let things calmness down a little. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## RLwhaler (Sep 10, 2005)

grman said:


> I think it was wise for Ryan to delay the vote. Let things calmness down a little.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


We'll see... Ryan's been known to :

1) Bend over and take it

2) Drop to his knees with knee pads.

3) BOTH


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Well here's part of the reason it took "so long" to get police into the room.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/unarmed-security-guard-jesus-campos-took-on-las-vegas-killer-stephen-paddock


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

stdreb27 said:


> I agree, but we're being told a guy killed 59 folks from several hundred yards using a bump fire stock.
> 
> That's nuts.


I don't want to just argue with people for the sake of arguing. I've always said that the bump stocks are only suited for hosing down an area of densely-packed people. They are fun, but I can't imagine me getting into a situation where I really need one. But from that high ground, and with that many people packed in to one area? I just don't see it being that surprising. Be glad he didn't have tracers.

Now I'm not buying that he got off one of those long bursts the first time he ever used a bump stock. He had practice somewhere. So this story that he never really had anything to do with guns before isn't getting there for me. Somebody knew this guy was shooting, and you have to wonder if they've come forward yet. Or why they haven't.


----------



## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

pocjetty said:


> I don't want to just argue with people for the sake of arguing. *I've always said that the bump stocks are only suited for hosing down an area of densely-packed people*. They are fun, but I can't imagine me getting into a situation where I really need one. But from that high ground, and with that many people packed in to one area? I just don't see it being that surprising. Be glad he didn't have tracers.
> 
> Now I'm not buying that he got off one of those long bursts the first time he ever used a bump stock. He had practice somewhere. So this story that he never really had anything to do with guns before isn't getting there for me. Somebody knew this guy was shooting, and you have to wonder if they've come forward yet. Or why they haven't.


apparently you hit that nail on the head.

Who knows about his practice, I mean there is wide open public land out there where you can shoot to your hearts content. I'd ASSUME that it would be relatively empty of people for the most part.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

stdreb27 said:


> apparently you hit that nail on the head.
> 
> Who knows about his practice, I mean there is wide open public land out there where you can shoot to your hearts content. I'd ASSUME that it would be relatively empty of people for the most part.


Meh - I guess you're right. There's a lot of desert out there. He could have gotten it done without anyone knowing. Still tough to believe that the girlfriend, at least, didn't have any idea.


----------



## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

pocjetty said:


> Meh - I guess you're right. There's a lot of desert out there. He could have gotten it done without anyone knowing. Still tough to believe that the girlfriend, at least, didn't have any idea.


They're saying she's a person of interest again. So who knows.

Heck they got JFK with 2 shots from a grassy knoll in a moving car.


----------



## Highflier (Jun 22, 2006)

pocjetty said:


> Meh - I guess you're right. There's a lot of desert out there. He could have gotten it done without anyone knowing. Still tough to believe that the girlfriend, at least, didn't have any idea.


If you've ever gone with friends (that live there) to shoot off a few in Vegas, they go to the desert. 
20 min outside of town and there' nothing but desert. 
He could easily have been shooting at his spot in the desert for years and nobody would have a clue.

Fwiw, He was clearly patient in his planning.
I could easily see how nobody else would know what he was doing.


----------



## mas360 (Nov 21, 2006)

pocjetty said:


> Meh - I guess you're right. There's a lot of desert out there. He could have gotten it done without anyone knowing. Still tough to believe that the girlfriend, at least, didn't have any idea.


Most women cannot and do not care to know the difference between a muzzle loader and an AR15 let alone of accessories such as bump fire stock. In this case she is a live in girlfriend, not even wife and have children with him, and he apparently has financial superiority over her. I doubt she would dare questioning him if he told her to mind her own business.


----------



## ElmerFudd (Feb 10, 2006)

Why have there been no releases of CCTV footage of him in the hotel / hallway / casino, etc from Mandalay Bay / police? I've seen the footage from his fall in 2014, but nothing from Sunday, or the days before?
I understand not showing how he transported everything to the room, but nothing at the hotel check-in, or lobby?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Ongoing investigation maybe?


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Don't worry, before this is over you will wonder why news stations will not stop showing those video's.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

tstorm5 said:


> Don't worry, before this is over you will wonder why news stations will not stop showing those video's.


TRUTH..... Or the interviews with survivors...and friends that "knew" the guy....Or documentaries of how it was all put together... His credit score, TP he used, fuel he preferred, favorite lunch meat, boxers vs briefs....and so on....


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Highflier said:


> If you've ever gone with friends (that live there) to shoot off a few in Vegas, they go to the desert.
> 20 min outside of town and there' nothing but desert.
> He could easily have been shooting at his spot in the desert for years and nobody would have a clue.





mas360 said:


> Most women cannot and do not care to know the difference between a muzzle loader and an AR15 let alone of accessories such as bump fire stock. In this case she is a live in girlfriend, not even wife and have children with him, and he apparently has financial superiority over her. I doubt she would dare questioning him if he told her to mind her own business.


Well that's what perspective is all about. I never lived near a desert where I could blast away with a full-auto and no one would notice. Just don't think that way. And I promise you my wife would notice if I left the house with one. Or if I showed up with a bunch of new ones. I can't think like that, either.

I understand that she might not have spoken up... but not to even notice? Seriously? You're probably right, but that's just an alien lifestyle to me.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

pocjetty said:


> Well that's what perspective is all about. I never lived near a desert where I could blast away with a full-auto and no one would notice. Just don't think that way. And I promise you my wife would notice if I left the house with one. Or if I showed up with a bunch of new ones. I can't think like that, either.
> 
> I understand that she might not have spoken up... but not to even notice? Seriously? You're probably right, but that's just an alien lifestyle to me.


She knows trust me.


----------



## mas360 (Nov 21, 2006)

pocjetty said:


> Well that's what perspective is all about. I never lived near a desert where I could blast away with a full-auto and no one would notice. Just don't think that way. *And I promise you my wife would notice if I left the house with one. Or if I showed up with a bunch of new ones. I can't think like that, either.*
> 
> I understand that she might not have spoken up... but not to even notice? Seriously? You're probably right, but that's just an alien lifestyle to me.


The big difference is your wife is a wife by law.....not a live in girlfriend. She has the law backing her up if you are not in line..... Your wife has family and friends here for her support system. She has to keep track of what you do, what you spend on.....and likewise perhaps also splurges on many pairs of shoes.....

This woman is a live-in girlfriend from another country far away and from another culture. Most likely she has no one else to count on, has no solid career/income and she therefore is totally dependent on him. He is obviously a very smart and wealthy guy. Unless he is ****y whipped, which I doubt, he calls the shot in their relationship. If he did send her that 100K for her to build a house for her family as reported then I am sure she is happy with whatever he does and not ask any questions that may strain their relationship.

If she was in cahoot with him to commit this murderous crime, I doubt she would return to the US on her own will. She could easily stay in the Philippines and with Duterte as the President, who despises the US and has been rubbing up to China, a request for her extradition would get a thumb down.

I would not be surprised that she is going to be the key person to provide the FBI with a lot of useful insight to sketch Paddock's profile. I would not be surprised to see her on Good Morning America and other shows afterward.


----------



## Fishy Eye (Sep 2, 2015)

tstorm5 said:


> Gotta give Fishy Eye some credit. He knew it from the sound on the videoâ€™s.


Well, I knew that's what he had by listening to the rate of fire slowing and increasing. I have shot with a slide fire stock and it's a novelty item. The whole gun is recoiling into the stock and accuracy is not good (unless shooting down on a target of 20,000 people in a pen). "bump firing" is a shooting technique. You can do this with any semi-auto with your hand and a belt loop from the hip. Amazing listening to the "news" how completely ignorant most people are about firearms in general. Guns are just tools. Inanimate objects.


----------



## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)




----------



## Fishy Eye (Sep 2, 2015)

barronj said:


>


Listen. You can easily adjust the rate of fire with a bump fire stock and slow it down or speed it up with forward pressure on the gun. it's like a drummer doing a drum roll. Hard to explain but it easy to do.


----------



## jimk (May 28, 2004)

"Source" saying he put some rounds in jet fuel tanks about 700 yards from hotel and about 400 yards from the concert. Luckily no explosion.


----------



## fishinguy (Aug 5, 2004)

pocjetty said:


> Well that's what perspective is all about. I never lived near a desert where I could blast away with a full-auto and no one would notice. Just don't think that way. And I promise you my wife would notice if I left the house with one. Or if I showed up with a bunch of new ones. I can't think like that, either.
> 
> I understand that she might not have spoken up... but not to even notice? Seriously? You're probably right, but that's just an alien lifestyle to me.


I go out to the ranch with my wife and bring a ton of ammo and guns to shoot hogs and up from time to time. I have burned through hundreds of rounds at times shooting up cactus. It is fun, that doesn't mean I would plan to involve myself in a mass shooting.

I have plenty of friends that go out shooting and their wives aren't into it at all. Their wives have little idea as to what they are up to with their shooting. Again they also don't plan to be involved in a mass shooting either and I doubt their wives would suspect as much.

So I am just saying I doubt someones wife is going to run out to the authorities if she sees her husband going out to go shooting, especially if it is routine. This guy likely has been shooting and collecting guns for years. So far it looks like this guy just went off on his own for whatever reason and decided to do this, I doubt his girlfriend thought he was going to do this.


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

jimk said:


> "Source" saying he put some rounds in jet fuel tanks about 700 yards from hotel and about 400 yards from the concert. Luckily no explosion.


Must have been some really thin tanks,and jet fuel is pretty close to diesel/kerosene so it's not easy to ignite especially with a non tracer bullet.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

fishinguy said:


> I go out to the ranch with my wife and bring a ton of ammo and guns to shoot hogs and up from time to time. I have burned through hundreds of rounds at times shooting up cactus. It is fun, that doesn't mean I would plan to involve myself in a mass shooting.
> 
> I have plenty of friends that go out shooting and their wives aren't into it at all. Their wives have little idea as to what they are up to with their shooting. Again they also don't plan to be involved in a mass shooting either and I doubt their wives would suspect as much.
> 
> So I am just saying I doubt someones wife is going to run out to the authorities if she sees her husband going out to go shooting, especially if it is routine. This guy likely has been shooting and collecting guns for years. So far it looks like this guy just went off on his own for whatever reason and decided to do this, I doubt his girlfriend thought he was going to do this.


Oh no, that's not my point at all. I sure don't think anyone who shots a lot needs to be reported, or anything remotely like that. The interviews with the brother and girlfriend have almost sounded like they were surprised the guy even owned guns. If someone asked, I'm sure your wife would say, "Oh, yeah, my husband goes out and shoots all the time."

All I was saying is that it's a hobby that seems pretty hard to keep under wraps. And with all the publicity on TV, even a disinterested wife or live-in would notice if you had a BUNCH of what looked like military weapons.

The brother said that he (the shooter) had "helped make the family wealthy". It didn't sound at all like they were estranged or anything. If my brother owned a bunch of weapons like that, I'm pretty sure I would know about it. I wouldn't condemn him for it, but I would know about it. So if I was asked, I wouldn't act surprised.

So if he really did keep all that from people he was around all the time, he had to work pretty hard at it. And that, in itself, seems like it would make for some very squirrelly behavior. I'm not saying they are guilty of anything, or knew he was going to shoot up a concert. Just amazes me that they could not know that they guy owned that many weapons and practiced with them.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

jimk said:


> "Source" saying he put some rounds in jet fuel tanks about 700 yards from hotel and about 400 yards from the concert. Luckily no explosion.


Yeah, the window on the right (the end of the building) was to give him an angle on the concert. The window on the left was to give him an angle on the fuel tanks.

I'm a little surprised, frankly, that he was able to put holes in those big fuel tanks without armor piercing rounds. So if he knew enough to plan for that, how could he not know that jet fuel isn't that easy to ignite?

I bet they are having a field day with his Internet search history.


----------



## pmgoffjr (Jul 30, 2009)

Most cities require "fire guard" above ground fuel tanks, which are double walled with concrete poured between the walls. Just to prevent some moron from shooting a hole in them. Guess they worked.

You can't set anything but that in most counties in and around Houston.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pmgoffjr said:


> Most cities require "fire guard" above ground fuel tanks, which are double walled with concrete poured between the walls. Just to prevent some moron from shooting a hole in them. Guess they worked.
> 
> You can't set anything but that in most counties in and around Houston.


Say what? I worked in pipeline operations for 40 years and I have NEVER seen anything like you describe. I call BS!


----------



## pmgoffjr (Jul 30, 2009)

Well no disrespect but what does that have to do with fuel storage in urban areas?

http://www.transliquidtechnologies....MIgO2268PZ1gIVwkOGCh1zqAPvEAAYASAAEgInuvD_BwE

Contact any fire marshal in any major city and ask them what type of fuel storage is allowed.

I am in the fuel delivery business. Deal with this every day.


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

ChuChu said:


> Say what? I worked in pipeline operations for 40 years and I have NEVER seen anything like you describe. I call BS!


I've been a Pipeliner for 25 yrs and every fuel tank we have has to have containment,hell we even have to put a water pump or generator in one.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pmgoffjr said:


> Well no disrespect but what does that have to do with fuel storage in urban areas?
> 
> http://www.transliquidtechnologies....MIgO2268PZ1gIVwkOGCh1zqAPvEAAYASAAEgInuvD_BwE
> 
> ...


I thought you were talking about REAL storage tanks, not little bottles. I still call BS.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Majek11 said:


> I've been a Pipeliner for 25 yrs and every fuel tank we have has to have containment,hell we even have to put a water pump or generator in one.


well hell, every storage tank has containment wall, firewalls that are designed to hold the contents of the tank in case of leakage.. 
You put a pump inside a tank? A generator inside a tank? I call BS on that!


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Tank at McCarran airport that media reported as shot.










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pmgoffjr said:


> Well no disrespect but what does that have to do with fuel storage in urban areas?
> 
> http://www.transliquidtechnologies....MIgO2268PZ1gIVwkOGCh1zqAPvEAAYASAAEgInuvD_BwE
> 
> ...


How many of those bottle tanks would it take to fuel a commercial passenger jet?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pmgoffjr said:


> Well no disrespect but what does that have to do with fuel storage in urban areas?
> 
> http://www.transliquidtechnologies....MIgO2268PZ1gIVwkOGCh1zqAPvEAAYASAAEgInuvD_BwE
> 
> ...


And do you deliver 50,000 barrels of fuel to those tanks? Or a million barrels of fuel?


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Well a typical 757 holds more than 10,000 gallons. My guess is more than 1???


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

tstorm5 said:


> Well a typical 757 holds more than 10,000 gallons. My guess is more than 1???


And there are about 1700 flights a day. So now, how many of those bottle tanks would it take?


----------



## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

ChuChu, you get a gold star for derailment.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

pmgoffjr said:


> Well no disrespect but what does that have to do with fuel storage in urban areas?
> 
> http://www.transliquidtechnologies....MIgO2268PZ1gIVwkOGCh1zqAPvEAAYASAAEgInuvD_BwE
> 
> ...


I don't think your link is "Just to prevent some moron from shooting a hole in them." It is fire protection yes, but not just for bullets. If there is a fire in one tank, that helps prevent the tank next to it from catching fire.

Also, similar fire-proofing is used on structural braces that hold pipes (called pipe racks) full of flammable materials. It is to keep the steel from losing integrity and falling over, which then compounds the tragedy.

I also mean no dis-respect, but I don't think bullets are the problem that fire proofing is meant to prevent. Perhaps a fire marshal could say.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

barronj said:


> ChuChu, you get a gold star for derailment.


Me? No, the idiot that claimed the fuel tanks at McCarran airport are double wall with concrete between them. And I still call BS on his comment.


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

> Me? No, the idiot that claimed the fuel tanks at McCarran airport are double wall with concrete between them. And I still call BS on his comment.


Chu Chu- You have a habit of proving to fellow 2coolers that you think you are right and they are wrong.


----------



## pmgoffjr (Jul 30, 2009)

We were part of install for world fuel at dfw. 
Same tank batteries with double wall and filled gap. 
Do just a little looking. 
I threw up the first picture I could find. Donâ€™t go pompous without having a clue.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

cman said:


> Chu Chu- You have a habit of proving to fellow 2coolers that you think you are right and they are wrong.


Well, the guy that says those tanks are double wall IS wrong. He evidently deals with above ground small fuel tanks like farmers use. And yeah, SOME of them are double wall. But large tanks such as the ones at Mccarran are NOT double wall.


----------



## jetbuilt (May 4, 2010)

I work for the largest pipeline company in the US and am responsible for assets in 27 states, we don't have a single double walled concrete filled refined products tank in our inventory. I doubt that a 5.56 round fired from 700 yards away would do much more than remove the coating from the outside of a tank and make a slight dent, much less penetrate one if using non armor piercing ammunition. pmgoffjr, can you please clarify the size storage tank that you are referring to?


----------



## BretE (Jan 24, 2008)

tstorm5 said:


> Tank at McCarran airport that media reported as shot.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's not a tank......

This is a tank......


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Earthen berms or other containment around tanks is to contain leaks for environmental, not fire prevention. Fireproofing is to save structural integrity, not to stop bullets.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pmgoffjr said:


> We were part of install for world fuel at dfw.
> Same tank batteries with double wall and filled gap.
> Do just a little looking.
> I threw up the first picture I could find. Donâ€™t go pompous without having a clue.


How many tanks along 225 are double wall and concrete between them?

I don't need to look, I know the truth. I pipelined millions of barrels of JP-4, aviation grade kerosene, gasoline and diesel to Austin, San Antonio, Victoria, North Houston, and further north to DFW, including the airport. Not a single storage tank had double walls. 
The Texas City tank farm that ARCO built had five, one million barrel tanks and no double walls.

Your little farmers above ground tanks MAY have double walls, but real tanks don't.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

People have been watching too many MacGyver TV shows.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

ChuChu said:


> Me? No, the idiot that claimed the fuel tanks at McCarran airport are double wall with concrete between them. And I still call BS on his comment.


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

Who cares??????????????????????


----------



## 61Bubbletop (Apr 29, 2011)

jimk said:


> "Source" saying he put some rounds in jet fuel tanks about 700 yards from hotel and about 400 yards from the concert. Luckily no explosion.


I read that too, but what I read said that the bullets did not penetrate the tanks.


----------



## BretE (Jan 24, 2008)

61Bubbletop said:


> I read that too, but what I read said that the bullets did not penetrate the tanks.


That's because they were triple walled.....


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

BretE said:


> That's because they were triple walled.....


You big Dummy...This is triple walled tanks...


----------



## BretE (Jan 24, 2008)

Blk Jck 224 said:


> You big Dummy...This is triple walled tanks...


Lol....


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

I for one want this fuel storage crisis resolved before anyone starts discussing the Las Vegas shooter again.


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

BTW, the Sheriff updated the timeline...
10:05 First shots being fired by Paddock
10:15 Last shots fired by Paddock
(Not sure if this means shots at crowds or all shots)
11:20 SWAT breaks in and finds dead Paddock


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

There still may be a left leaning side to this since it times with the election:
_
Investigators said something may have happened to Paddock between October last year and September this year that compelled him to purchase more weapons and ultimately lead to the massacre. Paddock bought 33 firearms, mostly rifles, during that 11-month period, authorities said. _


----------



## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

tstorm5 said:


> I for one want this fuel storage crisis resolved before anyone starts discussing the Las Vegas shooter again.


Loser eats a fist full of ghost peppers & chugs a 40 of malt liquor, filmed, posted.

<--Complicit in derailment


----------



## DIHLON (Nov 15, 2009)

tstorm5 said:


> I for one want this fuel storage crisis resolved before anyone starts discussing the Las Vegas shooter again.


The guy was an idiot to think he could penetrate a steel tank with a .223/.308 round from 600 yards. Solved. What do I win?


----------



## MEGABITE (May 21, 2004)

At that point the coward had nothing to lose. Trying to cause as much carnage as possible.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

DIHLON said:


> The guy was an idiot to think he could penetrate a steel tank with a .223/.308 round from 600 yards. Solved. What do I win?


See the post above your's.

This is what you don't win:

*Loser eats a fist full of ghost peppers & chugs a 40 of malt liquor, filmed, posted.*


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

He may have been targeting a plane.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

Whitebassfisher said:


> There still may be a left leaning side to this since it times with the election:
> 
> Unclear if we will ever find out what his motive was, but I don't get the feeling that it was a political, racial, or religious demonstration...Prolly flipped out when he couldn't get a Vegas hooker off while his girlfriend was in the Phillipines...'Paddock's Mirage' will be the name of the movie coming out next Spring with Christopher Walken as Paddock, Angelina Jolie as Danley, and Lindsay Lohan as his hooker girlfriend that got him all strung out on crack, made him loose most of his money, & caused him to flip farking out...Chu Chu will make his Hollywood debut in this film as the expert commentator in the credits as to why the fuel tanks did not explode during the massacre...


----------



## MEGABITE (May 21, 2004)

I think he he was trying to murder as many Trump supporters as possible, personally.


----------



## jimk (May 28, 2004)

The amount of firepower in that room makes no sense for only 1 shooter. Somebodies failed to show...but didn't deter him. This was his end game.
It looks like the unarmed guard stopped the shooting early...that's probably when he ended his own life.


----------



## prokat (Jul 17, 2010)

More footage 





Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

DIHLON said:


> The guy was an idiot to think he could penetrate a steel tank with a .223/.308 round from 600 yards. Solved. What do I win?


A weekend with Chu Chu


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

> More footage
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Shocking the amount of people who walked and who kept their drinks.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

DIHLON said:


> The guy was an idiot to think he could penetrate a steel tank with a .223/.308 round from 600 yards. Solved. What do I win?


See, that's what I thought. Most of the stories say that one of the bullets penetrated, and that workers had repaired them the next day. Forget about double-wall, triple-wall, containment barriers, etc. The nature of a liquid storage tank that big is that it has to be pretty thick/strong, just to maintain structural integrity. Maybe those stories are inaccurate - there's a lot of that going around - because it's pretty hard to believe.

For all the talk of this guy being some kind of criminal genius, shooting a jet fuel tank from that distance, especially with .223 or .308 rounds doesn't support it. He also had 50 lbs. of Tannerite in his car. If he was going to kill himself, he could have done a LOT of damage in a hotel with 50 lbs. of Tannerite.

He had cameras set up outside the room, and knew the security guard was out there - so he shot him through the door. But he shot low enough to hit him in the leg? Good thing he didn't think of piling Tannerite at the door and blowing up whoever was in the hall, huh?


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

pocjetty said:


> See, that's what I thought. Most of the stories say that one of the bullets penetrated, and that workers had repaired them the next day. Forget about double-wall, triple-wall, containment barriers, etc. The nature of a liquid storage tank that big is that it has to be pretty thick/strong, just to maintain structural integrity. Maybe those stories are inaccurate - there's a lot of that going around - because it's pretty hard to believe.
> 
> For all the talk of this guy being some kind of criminal genius, shooting a jet fuel tank from that distance, especially with .223 or .308 rounds doesn't support it. He also had 50 lbs. of Tannerite in his car. If he was going to kill himself, he could have done a LOT of damage in a hotel with 50 lbs. of Tannerite.
> 
> He had cameras set up outside the room, and knew the security guard was out there - so he shot him through the door. But he shot low enough to hit him in the leg? Good thing he didn't think of piling Tannerite at the door and blowing up whoever was in the hall, huh?


The old saying "It can't get any worse" is one of the stupidest I have heard. As you mention above, it could have been much worse.

Now I will get slammed for this,but it's an honest question: Why is Tannerite legal? I have never played with it, but isn't it similar to dynamite?


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

MEGABITE said:


> I think he he was trying to murder as many Trump supporters as possible, personally.


What makes you believe that?


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

There are stories out now that say he was part of a gun sales sting operation gone bad. Would explain the amount of weapons and amo in the room. They shot him and spread lead. I know its true because i heard it on Facebook..


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Whitebassfisher said:


> The old saying "It can't get any worse" is one of the stupidest I have heard. As you mention above, it could have been much worse.
> 
> Now I will get slammed for this,but it's an honest question: Why is Tannerite legal? I have never played with it, but isn't it similar to dynamite?


Heh. You probably will get slammed, but not by me. The only "purpose" I've ever heard for the stuff is exploding targets. But the best I can tell, it's mostly used by people who want to make YouTube videos of stuff exploding. Don't get me wrong - I've always enjoyed fireworks, and blowing things up in general. But do a simple YouTube search for "50 lbs. of Tannerite" and see how much damage he could have done. Even I have a hard time stretching "keep and bear arms" to include that. Everyone falls back on it needing to be shot by a high-velocity bullet, but I'm just pretty certain I could kludge together a pretty effective timer triggering mechanism.

Aaaaand there goes the discussion for the rest of the afternoon. :smile:


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

Also his name appears on a few NASA documents as an outside contractor and other government agencies.. just saying. This should get better as time rolls by.
:smile:


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

JOHNNY QUEST said:


> Also his name appears on a few NASA documents as an outside contractor and other government agencies.. just saying. This should get better as time rolls by.
> :smile:


There are a LOT of rumors and conspiracy theories flying. I've got a pretty unusual last name, but my Gmail address has the number "2" behind it, because there's another guy with the exact same name who got there first.

But there are a few things that are documented legit that sort of make me scratch my head. There is a head-picture of the guy dead, and bleeding from his head. (I thought it was a little odd that I don't see a lot of blood splatter, but you can't see the rest of the room.) But there is also another picture of him dead. See anything odd in it? Actually, two odd things. Okay, make it three odd things. (And, no, not the red circle that Alex Jones says is a suicide note.) I'm not making up conspiracy theory, but there are a few things in there that are really tough to reconcile.


----------



## Duckboys42 (Oct 1, 2012)

What is odd about the picture?


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

LV had another press conference on their response efforts today. They had one yesterday, and numerous previously. 
I wonder why they keep having press conferences on how good their response was. I'm pretty sure just about everyone would acknowledge that there was ample heroism there, that the response was adequate, and that the security guard is one brave son of a gun. Seems like one of 2 press conferences on that would have been enough. 
What gives?


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Could be wrong but how did his left foot get underneath the rifle?


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Duckboys42 said:


> What is odd about the picture?


I thought you'd never ask. :biggrin:

The guy is wearing long sleeves and gloves. They look like heavy gloves, but I can't be 100% certain. Odd, but okay - he's just shot a bunch of innocent people from a hotel window. He's odd. Still, I can't imagine wearing gloves in that situation.

Next - he's dead from a self-inflicted gunshot. Look where his feet are - his left foot especially. Maybe he fell backwards after shooting himself, but he didn't walk forward. Don't you think it's odd for his foot to be under that gun on the bipod? Like I said, not a conspiracy theory. Just odd.

But... the third thing. Look more closely at his gloved hand. What's that under it? That's right... another long gun. (I'm sure someone could identify it, but I can't.) The rifle is laying across his body at about the waist level, and the stock of the gun is under his left hand. [edit - well the gun is under his body, not on top. Different filter.]

In the head picture of him dead, there is a pistol that everyone assumes he used to kill himself. So did he shoot himself with his right hand, while somehow holding the rifle at waist level with his left hand, while standing with his foot up under the bipod? And then managed to hold onto the rifle on his way to the floor?

I know, I know... it doesn't _prove_ anything. And I'm not suggesting any nefarious thing that it suggests. But it's definitely odd.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

I just edited - a different filter looks like the gun is under his body, not on top. That one isn't as odd as I thought.

Okay, how about this?

The guy rented two rooms, which explains how far apart the windows were. They say the casino comped the room. But two rooms? He played $100 video poker, but he was far from a "whale". Two rooms? Still, he might have used points, and just rented two rooms.

But the police breached the door to the room and found him dead. Then, they noticed a second door in the room that they couldn't get through. (The door into the other room.) They had to breach it, too. So after he shot a bunch of people, and before he shot himself, he decided to lock the door separating him from an empty room?

Okay, maybe he wasn't planning on killing himself, and thought the locked door would buy him more time if they came in the other room's door first? Still, odd.

Oh - on his way to the hotel, he stopped and bought a new bolt-action rifle. It wasn't in the room, or in his car. What did he do with that one? Why stop and buy a new weapon, on the way to a massacre, and then leave it somewhere else? Maybe he just liked buying guns, and wanted to experience it one last time?

Probably all any of this shows is that people who do stuff like this are... odd.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Considering how hot the guns would have been, maybe the gloves were to protect his hands while changing magazines? I noticed his left foot under the rifle on a bipod, but he may have been sitting basically in that position when he shot himself.

This paragraph may sound horrible, but I have shot a lot of deer in the head. I finally quit due to chance of wounding, but sometimes they went down like a sack of potatoes, and sometimes their nerves/muscles made them do _really_ strange things. Without some very good medical doctor explanation otherwise, I think it hard to say much about body or gun positions.

I don't know if it's possible to figure out what someone like him did.

PS - I thought the required second breaching was odd too, but you may have already answered that. Police haven't said why they claim this yet, but they have said they don't think he originally planned on suicide.


----------



## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

I'll play...

No blood splatter behind his head? He was probably standing up when he pulled the trigger. The pooled mass behind the head could have just leaked out after he hit the floor.

Foot under bipod rifle? It would not be uncommon for the nerves to twitch and his legs and arms moving and or twitching after he fell to the ground.

Gloves? At the rate he was firing, those rifles would be hotter than a new ghetto corvette.

All that said, I'm still not completely convinced that everything that has been disclosed is the complete story by any means. I am particulary uneasy about the FBI guy and the Sherriff's difference on the theory of him not doing this act all on his own.


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

Just a theory but the men that were in the market for the guns capped him and started shooting up the crowd to make it look like it was him. The second room door was open. When they noticed the unarmed security guard in the hall they shot thru the door and fled thru the open door locked it behind themselves and exited the other rooms door into the hallway around the corner. :biggrin:


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

ChuChu said:


> well hell, every storage tank has containment wall, firewalls that are designed to hold the contents of the tank in case of leakage..
> You put a pump inside a tank? A generator inside a tank? I call BS on that!


You should get your eyes checked old timer,I never said we put pumps and generators in tanks,we have to put them in containments,in case of fuel spills.We also have to build concrete containments under all valves,flanges and anything else that could leak.Times have changed since the days of when you were pipelining with wooden pipe and digging with shovels!ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜Ž


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

Since we're throwing conspiracies out there, the security guard did it all or was an accomplice. Shot himself to look innocent or had it out with the other guy


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Here's another oddity:

This is the service cart outside the second room. It does look like a lot of plates for just one person. The two rooms are on a dead-end hallway, so he didn't get them from the room across the hall or anything. But maybe he was just hungry, or figured it was his last meal. 

But he set up two cameras outside, so he could see when the police came. They said he had them linked to a tablet inside the room. Pretty sophisticated. Until you notice that they were wired cameras. You can see that one was under two plates on the cart, and one was on the floor (at least when the picture was taken.) You can see the wires, and the one on the floor clearly goes under the door.

I don't know how you connect two wired cameras up to one tablet, and he either had very long wires or he left the tablet near the door, and watched it from across the room. But it's a lot lower-tech than I had pictured.

There's a killer on the road
His brain is squirming like a toad


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

where do i find the dead shooter pic. can't find it


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

found it


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Haute Pursuit said:


> All that said, I'm still not completely convinced that everything that has been disclosed is the complete story by any means. I am particulary uneasy about the FBI guy and the Sherriff's difference on the theory of him not doing this act all on his own.


Fog of war. Mostly all I'm doing is looking at that. The differences between stories. And between the stories and what we can actually see. Not even trying to prove anything or suggest anything.

I think it was about 12 hours or so after the incident that they announced that the girlfriend was definitely not involved. I thought it was an odd thing to announce that soon. Maybe they didn't want to spook her into disappearing?

The thing that always intrigues me is not that people say things that later turn out to be incorrect. I always like to try and look at why they thought those things when they said them. Or sometimes why they say them when they really don't believe them. There were so many garbage stories after the Boston Marathon bombing, and a lot of them were from "official" sources.

People suffer from "paresthesia" - the tendency to see patterns where they don't exist. I like to step through things to see if it's possible to pick out the ones that are real and the ones that are imagined.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Trump did it.


----------



## bg (May 21, 2004)

pocjetty said:


> Here's another oddity:
> 
> This is the service cart outside the second room. It does look like a lot of plates for just one person. The two rooms are on a dead-end hallway, so he didn't get them from the room across the hall or anything. But maybe he was just hungry, or figured it was his last meal.
> 
> ...


They're probably just power cables for a typical wifi camera.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk


----------



## batmaninja (Jul 15, 2010)

pocjetty said:


> The guy is wearing long sleeves and gloves.


You ever shot a gun inside? How about a few hundred rounds?

Wonder if he was wearing ear protection?


----------



## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

poppadawg said:


> Trump did it.


Nahh, it was Killary!


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

batmaninja said:


> You ever shot a gun inside? How about a few hundred rounds?


Huh? What? I'm sorry but ....


----------



## Cat O' Lies (May 21, 2004)

pocjetty said:


> Here's another oddity:
> 
> This is the service cart outside the second room. It does look like a lot of plates for just one person. The two rooms are on a dead-end hallway, so he didn't get them from the room across the hall or anything. But maybe he was just hungry, or figured it was his last meal.
> 
> ...


A quick DNA test on the plates and utensils to see if all matches the shooters DNA.


----------



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

bwguardian said:


> Nahh, it was Killary!


Oh she was definitely in on it. She was the mysterious second shooter. She was heard yelling Allahu Akbar before the shooting began. I think there is a video of it on Youtube. We should dissect it. 2cool CSI will have that beetch convicted in no time


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pocjetty said:


> I just edited - a different filter looks like the gun is under his body, not on top. That one isn't as odd as I thought.
> 
> Okay, how about this?
> 
> ...


He was in a suite, not two rooms. There is a video from before the shooting made by a guy that stayed in that room. It clearly shows both views.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/chilling-video-shows-shooters-room-view-las-vegas-50251992


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Majek11 said:


> You should get your eyes checked old timer,I never said we put pumps and generators in tanks,we have to put them in containments,in case of fuel spills.We also have to build concrete containments under all valves,flanges and anything else that could leak.Times have changed since the days of when you were pipelining with wooden pipe and digging with shovels!ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½


_I've been a Pipeliner for 25 yrs and every fuel tank we have has to have containment,hell we even have to put a water pump or generator in one._

One what? (That is another question mark)

My eyes are good. I guess you missed the question marks. (?) I was asking for a clarification. I have seen wooden pipe, but it was water pipe from the 1800's in Teague, Texas

But I guess I have to admit I have met my match. You are by far the most intelligent person I have ever dealt with.


----------



## pipeliner24 (Apr 10, 2013)

ChuChu said:


> _I've been a Pipeliner for 25 yrs and every fuel tank we have has to have containment,hell we even have to put a water pump or generator in one._
> 
> One what? (That is another question mark)
> 
> ...


A CONTAINMENT!!! Anything with fuel or oil in it has to be in a containment,in case of failure or spillage.If I have a 5,000 gallon fuel tank onsite it has to be inside a containment,if I have a 2000watt generator running it has to be in a containment.Youre making this a very ridiculous argument.If I'm the most intelligent person you've ever delt with you need to get out more often!Im done here,my prayers go out to all the victims of this tragedy and I'll say one for you tonight also Chu chuðŸ˜Ž


----------



## bd24 (Aug 24, 2016)

I will be interested to hear the reaction about bump stocks now that the NRA is asking the ATF to review....

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...new-regulations-after-las-vegas-shooting.html


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

bg said:


> They're probably just power cables for a typical wifi camera.
> 
> Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk





ChuChu said:


> He was in a suite, not two rooms. There is a video from before the shooting made by a guy that stayed in that room. It clearly shows both views.


See there? The 2Cool brain trust can figure out _anything_.

Yeah, I see that it's a suite now. The one bedroom just had its own door. They just comped him one really, really nice room. He still went to the trouble of locking the bedroom door. Hard to imagine the chaos in a mind like that.


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

bd24 said:


> I will be interested to hear the reaction about bump stocks now that the NRA is asking the ATF to review....
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...new-regulations-after-las-vegas-shooting.html


Obama's ATF ok'd the bump fire stocks.Where's the outrage toward Obama?


----------



## bd24 (Aug 24, 2016)

Cut n Shoot said:


> Obama's ATF ok'd the bump fire stocks.Where's the outrage toward Obama?


I am really just curious how the hard core gun lobby will react to the NRA seemingly asking for additional regulation or "review" as the article states. I guess I am not super interested in blaming one party or the next. We are where we are at this point in time no matter who approved the legislation initially.

Other than being able to help people with limited hand mobility shoot a semi auto rifle is there any other justification for these being legal?


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

Majek11 said:


> A CONTAINMENT!!! Anything with fuel or oil in it has to be in a containment,in case of failure or spillage.If I have a 5,000 gallon fuel tank onsite it has to be inside a containment,if I have a 2000watt generator running it has to be in a containment.Youre making this a very ridiculous argument.If I'm the most intelligent person you've ever delt with you need to get out more often!Im done here,my prayers go out to all the victims of this tragedy and I'll say one for you tonight also Chu chu


I donâ€™t want to stop what looks like the beginnings of a lifelong friendship but in the case of Chu Chu you may want to follow this guys lead









Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

pocjetty said:


> See there? The 2Cool brain trust can figure out _anything_.
> 
> Yeah, I see that it's a suite now. The one bedroom just had its own door. They just comped him one really, really nice room. He still went to the trouble of locking the bedroom door. Hard to imagine the chaos in a mind like that.


Supposedly a $550 a night room. But comped due to his gambling level. I'm hearing now that he didn't get that room the first two nights, that he moved to it on Saturday.


----------



## Mikeg77583 (Jul 11, 2014)

I havenâ€™t read anywhere about shooting outside the stage area .... I donâ€™t really have a point or direction just a thought after watching all the videos.... people are pouring out into the street and he keeps his aim at the stage area ? Also the strip had to of had lots of pedestrians ... were all victims ticket holders? I havenâ€™t kept up with it to much and might be completely off so just asking.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Majek11 said:


> A CONTAINMENT!!! Anything with fuel or oil in it has to be in a containment,in case of failure or spillage.If I have a 5,000 gallon fuel tank onsite it has to be inside a containment,if I have a 2000watt generator running it has to be in a containment.Youre making this a very ridiculous argument.If I'm the most intelligent person you've ever delt with you need to get out more often!Im done here,my prayers go out to all the victims of this tragedy and I'll say one for you tonight also Chu chuí ½í¸Ž


Most intelligent I have ever DEALT with, not delt with. But that little mistake makes me have second thoughts, you have been pipelining for 25 years, right? Have you figured out that pipe has a hole in the end or are you still working on that one.

Look grasshopper, you have to remember us old timers wrote the book on pipelining so you would have it easy. I have an extra copy if you would like to read it. You can read?


----------



## Chuckybrown (Jan 20, 2012)

ChuChu said:


> Have you figured out that pipe has a whole in the end .....


Have you figured out that pipe has a *HOLE* in the end.....

Fixed it for 'ya....


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Chuckybrown said:


> ChuChu said:
> 
> 
> > Have you figured out that pipe has a whole in the end .....QUOTE]
> ...


----------



## Chuckybrown (Jan 20, 2012)

I just thought you were ornery.....


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

bd24 said:


> I will be interested to hear the reaction about bump stocks now that the NRA is asking the ATF to review....
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...new-regulations-after-las-vegas-shooting.html


It may be a forward thinking action on the NRA's part. Considering what happened, they may feel that this would be in their best interest in the long run.

We must admit that both sides use politics, and I have heard this mentioned a few times the last few days: _The Obama administrationâ€™s ATF gave its seal of approval to selling the devices in 2010 after concluding that they did not violate federal law. _
By the NRA calling on the ATF to review that assessment, they can shift the burden to the libs.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Chuckybrown said:


> I just thought you were ornery.....


Ain't that part of being an old timer?


----------



## Cut n Shoot (Dec 11, 2015)

Millionaire, bump stocks, grassy knoll shooters,coagulated brain matter,double walled jp5 tanks,room service dna,what a thread!!


----------



## Lucky Banana (Jun 24, 2016)

Chuckybrown said:


> I just thought you were horny.....


FIFY


----------



## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

only one question, here...
where Dan Tanna?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Lucky Banana said:


> FIFY


_Originally Posted by Chuckybrown View Post
I just thought you were horny.....
_

That happens from time to time. And the bi-polar old broad loves it when it happens.


----------



## sotexhookset (Jun 4, 2011)

ChuChu said:


> Most intelligent I have ever DEALT with, not delt with. But that little mistake makes me have second thoughts, you have been pipelining for 25 years, right? Have you figured out that pipe has a hole in the end or are you still working on that one.
> 
> Look grasshopper, you have to remember us old timers wrote the book on pipelining so you would have it easy. I have an extra copy if you would like to read it. You can read?


Well then you know what a pig is bud? Haha! I took them from 4's to 12's to school for show and tell when I was just little oil patch trash kid. Lol


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

sotexhookset said:


> Well then you know what a pig is bud? Haha! I took them from 4's to 12's to school for show and tell when I was just little oil patch trash kid. Lol


Yeah, I have run 3", 4", 6", 8", 10", 12", 18", 20", 36", 48", smart pigs, cleaning pigs, transition pigs, and sizing pigs. I have run them in refined product, crude oil, and so many petrochemicals I can't name them. Like I said, 40 years of pipelining.


----------



## Lucky Banana (Jun 24, 2016)

Can you guys go somewhere else and talk about this...


----------



## Harbormaster (May 26, 2000)

...and all this has what to do with the Las Vegas chit show?


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Lucky Banana said:


> Can you guys go somewhere else and talk about this...


Now there is the pot calling the kettle black.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Lucky Banana said:


> Can you guys go somewhere else and talk about this...


Here you go, I created a space for them and put it in the Jungle so they can get serious.

http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?p=21873506#post21873506


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...new-regulations-after-las-vegas-shooting.html

Yâ€™all prolly all knew about this already. NRA calls for ATF review of bump stocks.


----------



## GCELLC (Feb 23, 2017)

Majek11 said:


> Must have been some really thin tanks,and jet fuel is pretty close to diesel/kerosene so it's not easy to ignite especially with a non tracer bullet.


The bullets bounced off the fuel tanks.


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Authorities have determined the shooter scoped out Fenway Park in Boston, and in August, Paddock booked a room at Chicago's Blackstone Hotel that overlooked the park where the Lollapalooza music festival was held that weekend, and downtown Las Vegas.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Sounds like the guy did his homework! Will we ever Know? My question now is how long had he planned this before he actually did it? 
Bought a lot of guns in the last few years.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Rubberback said:


> Sounds like the guy did his homework! Will we ever Know? My question now is how long had he planned this before he actually did it?
> *Bought a lot of guns in the last few years.*


Yes, but really got serious the last 11 months, bought 33 in that time.


----------



## jimk (May 28, 2004)

Was he really prepared to die? For what??
Was someone else in the room when the firing at the guard took place...and left at that point...maybe doing the deed to look like suicide???
Supposedly about 200 rounds were fired at the guard...surprised nobody else was hit in other rooms.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

Whitebassfisher said:


> Yes, but really got serious the last 11 months, bought 33 in that time.


Your right ! New it was a bunch of guns. Well sounds like at least a year. Wonder if they can figure out where he learned to shoot these guns?


----------



## The1ThatGotAway (Jun 24, 2009)

Lucky Banana said:


> Can you guys go somewhere else and talk about this...


It's a shame you wasted one of your 88 posts in this


----------



## DIHLON (Nov 15, 2009)

Rubberback said:


> Your right ! New it was a bunch of guns. Well sounds like at least a year. Wonder if they can figure out where he learned to shoot these guns?


You can find anything on YouTube.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

pocjetty said:


> I like to step through things to see if it's possible to pick out the ones that are real and the ones that are imagined.


Unless there is a video of him step by step through the process of set up to the initiation of the plan, they are ALL imagined!


----------



## photofishin (Aug 7, 2009)

I didn't read the 40 pages of posts. My wife and I just returned from Vegas tonight as I had a week long conference at the Mandalay Bay. We went to the Rivea restaurant on the 64th floor of the Delano Sunday night for dinner and were watching the concert until around 8:00pm. We were tired as hell from our travel that day so made it an early night and were in bed around 9:00 Las Vegas time. We woke up to a cop in full riot gear at the foot of my bed! He told us they had an active shooter situation and to stay in our room. We watched the news, stayed on social media until around 8:00am and had heard the shooter was dead. We had no other communication from the Mandalay Bay. We headed downstairs to try to get breakfast. As the shooting had taken place during shift change, very few employees of the hotel were there. It was eerie to walk through the casino and hear silence where you'd usually hear the ding ding ding of slots machines. We finally found a small coffee shop open and they were giving out coffee for free. The folks running the conference canceled the first day and as a vendor, I DO have to say that NetApp, the conference holder, really communicated well to all of us. 4100 people marked ourselves safe. Several had been outside all night as the hotel had been on lockdown. A couple of vendors had people who were hurt or killed at the concert. It definitely gave me a different perspective when a horrible event like this takes place. First I ask that you pray for the victims and their families. Second, the Las Vegas Metro Police did a stellar job considering the massive area of the crime scene. (If you've ever been to the Mandalay Bay, the crime scene covers from the Delano to the Mandalay Bay all the way to the Luxor and across the street where the concert took place. Third, I ask that you let ALL the facts come out before passing on conspiracy theories. 
Here's a photo I snapped with my phone of the concert area. It's apropos that there's a church right behind the area of the shooting. The cross hit my heart as I snapped the shot so I thought I'd share. I still haven't processed much of the events and we weren't event at the concert. I can't imagine the grief and overwhelming feelings some others there had. I DO know that each of us who were there has a story.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

I ask that you let ALL the facts come out before passing on conspiracy theories.

That is alot to ask! 

'apropos'

Thanks for the new word (of French origin BTW)...Gonna have to log it in!

ADJECTIVE


very appropriate to a particular situation: 
"the composer's reference to child's play is apropos"
*synonyms:* appropriate Â· pertinent Â· relevant Â· apposite Â· apt Â· applicable Â· suitable Â· [more]
germane Â· fitting Â· befitting Â· material Â· right on

*antonyms:* inappropriate


----------



## jimk (May 28, 2004)

There's a reason casinos comp certain customers...and it isn't because they "win" money.


----------



## doyou (Nov 8, 2014)

I want to join in for fun ..

My Question:

Where are the cctv footage of him the casino has 123123 cameras. We get "leaked" photos of the room but nothing of him in the casino even gambling day of or hauling guns? --- I get people say they dont want to expose how he got the guns in there but we all know it would have had to be a suitcase

Some more stuff to make your wheels turn:

Video of 2 final shots which are the last shots of the night. One to the chest and then to the head? One to the head and one to security guard leg ?




3:25 and 3:35 are final shots

swat claims he was dead when they entered, but on the public chan clearly states one officer fired: 








 , first shots when i believe he was shooting out the windows or range finding before he unloads

take it and run .. have fun


----------



## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

Ugh, that audio makes my stomach turn.


----------



## Tburford87 (Apr 8, 2015)

Wonder if those first few shots were hitting those fuel tanks?


----------



## Harbormaster (May 26, 2000)

Looks like muzzle flashes on the 4th floor to me. Suppressed?


----------



## doyou (Nov 8, 2014)

Harbormaster said:


> Looks like muzzle flashes on the 4th floor to me. Suppressed?


been debunked as strobe lights or fire alarm of some sort. I think in other angle videos its flashing and going off way before the shooting and keeps on going


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Harbormaster said:


> Looks like muzzle flashes on the 4th floor to me. Suppressed?


Are you thinking the flashes are gunfire while the newscaster in talking on the air? That would be a long time after the shooting stopped if so. Look at the time in the top left of the screen. Also flashes to the right of the newsguy.


----------



## Harbormaster (May 26, 2000)

Here i go..."Pulling up the rear!"

I didn't see the time. :smile:

Prayers for all those affected


----------



## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

Harbormaster said:


> Here i go..."Pulling up the rear!"
> 
> I didn't see the time. :smile:
> 
> Prayers for all those affected


Soon as they switch from the studio to the reporter. About the 2 second mark. Top left hand corner. Says 4:07 Am


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

If you watch current footage on TV the late evening live broadcasts from the site have that flashing going on in that exact same area.

I canâ€™t be 100% sure but Iâ€™m guessing itâ€™s not gun fire.


----------



## w_r_ranch (Jan 14, 2005)

Harbormaster said:


> Looks like muzzle flashes on the 4th floor to me. Suppressed?


There were no broken windows on the 4th floor... Bullets will not pass through glass.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Harbormaster said:


> Looks like muzzle flashes on the 4th floor to me......





w_r_ranch said:


> There were no broken windows on the 4th floor... Bullets will not pass through glass.


For several days now I have thought "Are there any balconies on lower floors or will windows further down open?" Seems like the obvious first question about all the 4th floor theories.


----------



## doyou (Nov 8, 2014)

Let me keep it coming for yall :

Room key was used after his car left the parking garage
https://web.archive.org/web/2017100...-probing-whether-others-were-gunman-s-n808431


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

doyou said:


> Let me keep it coming for yall :
> 
> Room key was used after his car left the parking garage
> http://web.archive.org/web/20171006...-probing-whether-others-were-gunman-s-n808431


Female visitor???

I imagine Mandalay Bay has elevator cams, hallway cams, parking lot cams and of course casino cams. Before this is all over I suspect they will know exactly where this guy was every step of the way.
Its gotta be in Mandalay Bay's best interest to donate whatever they can to help figure this out.
I can't believe we haven't heard much from the sheriff about any camera footage yet. Or maybe I just missed it.


----------



## doyou (Nov 8, 2014)

I think the general consensus if they dont want to release anything because its an on-going investigation. But I agree they should have his every step on a camera


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

A couple of news shockers...

Authorities believe Paddack was mentally ill

They are trying to locate mystery woman with Paddock


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

B.S. this whole thing stinks of a cover up. No video of him in the hotel like every other crime that makes the news. He owns a plane that was used by Obama contractors. The tail number is in another plane. It all stink and they're not makeing it any better by not releasing info


----------



## LandLocked (Apr 28, 2005)

muney pit said:


> B.S. this whole thing stinks of a cover up. No video of him in the hotel like every other crime that makes the news. He owns a plane that was used by Obama contractors. The tail number is in another plane. It all stink and they're not makeing it any better by not releasing info


Agree. Cameras all over Vegas. Definitely holding something back. Given the MSM nothing would surprise me.


----------



## JOHNNY QUEST (Mar 6, 2006)

I told you guys from the start. I SMELL A RAT. I would know..:ac550:


----------



## glenbo (Apr 9, 2010)

Just saw this on yahoo:

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/article177736071.html

HPD's avocado running his mouth about gun control. Never misses a chance to get heard or seen.


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

glenbo said:


> Just saw this on yahoo:
> 
> http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/article177736071.html
> 
> HPD's avocado running his mouth about gun control. Never misses a chance to get heard or seen.


Surprised? He came from Austin. He's tring to do the same thing here.


----------



## photofishin (Aug 7, 2009)

Heavy suggestion: I know you guys are trying to play jr. detective, however I was there. This may seem fun to you, but 58 people died and 500+ were shot/injured. Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.
My wife and I both are struggling with nightmares/visions of what "could have been". (it's 4:00am and I woke up at 2:30am to another dream about the shooting)
We're both active in recovery and are seeking counseling for this horrific event. Let the police do their jobs. EVERYONE wants answers...however NOBODY here has the facts the police do...


----------



## tstorm5 (Aug 27, 2009)

photofishin said:


> Heavy suggestion: I know you guys are trying to play jr. detective, however I was there. This may seem fun to you, but 58 people died and 500+ were shot/injured. Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.
> My wife and I both are struggling with nightmares/visions of what "could have been". (it's 4:00am and I woke up at 2:30am to another dream about the shooting)
> We're both active in recovery and are seeking counseling for this horrific event. Let the police do their jobs. EVERYONE wants answers...however NOBODY here has the facts the police do...


The internet is big and filled with many opinions and thoughts. There are times for some people when it is best to avoid threads that are sensitive areas.


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

photofishin said:


> Heavy suggestion: I know you guys are trying to play jr. detective, however I was there. This may seem fun to you, but 58 people died and 500+ were shot/injured. Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.
> My wife and I both are struggling with nightmares/visions of what "could have been". (it's 4:00am and I woke up at 2:30am to another dream about the shooting)
> We're both active in recovery and are seeking counseling for this horrific event. Let the police do their jobs. EVERYONE wants answers...however NOBODY here has the facts the police do...


Sorry what y'all are going through but you might not want to click on the jungle, turn on a tv, open a news paper, go into a barbershop, look at a newspaper, etc.

BTW, the police could end a lot of the speculations by releasing information.


----------



## RRbohemian (Dec 20, 2009)

The sad thing is that media spins the news to their audience and govt officials lie that it's difficult to filter out what is real and what is fake these days.


----------



## BBCAT (Feb 2, 2010)

Glad yall made it out ok. But this is a mystery, and people are going to guess and speculate.


----------



## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

photofishin said:


> Heavy suggestion: I know you guys are trying to play jr. detective, however I was there. This may seem fun to you, but 58 people died and 500+ were shot/injured. Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.
> My wife and I both are struggling with nightmares/visions of what "could have been". (it's 4:00am and I woke up at 2:30am to another dream about the shooting)
> We're both active in recovery and are seeking counseling for this horrific event. Let the police do their jobs. EVERYONE wants answers...however NOBODY here has the facts the police do...


I am sorry you were so closely involved with the mess. 
Hardly anyone trust our government or the news anymore. So, anytime there is an event, people speculate. That is life.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

photofishin said:


> Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.


Hmmm...I'm kinda getting a Hardy Boys vibe


----------



## muney pit (Mar 24, 2014)

boom! said:


> Sorry what y'all are going through but you might not want to click on the jungle, turn on a tv, open a news paper, go into a barbershop, look at a newspaper, etc.
> 
> BTW, the police could end a lot of the speculations by releasing information.


This is so true. Its taken this long to tell us the note the POS had was a dope chart? What BS. They could ease alot of folks apprehension by letting such stuff out ealier.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

photofishin said:


> Heavy suggestion: I know you guys are trying to play jr. detective, however I was there. This may seem fun to you, but 58 people died and 500+ were shot/injured. Maybe your time would be better spent praying for the victims than playing Nancy Drew on social media.
> My wife and I both are struggling with nightmares/visions of what "could have been". (it's 4:00am and I woke up at 2:30am to another dream about the shooting)
> We're both active in recovery and are seeking counseling for this horrific event. Let the police do their jobs. EVERYONE wants answers...however NOBODY here has the facts the police do...


Although it is terribly tragic that you had to experience this terrible event, it is just human nature to try and understand who, what, when, where and why... Sadly, the world doesn't stop for victims of tragic events... Its goes on, and so must you. I fear that your attempt to distance yourself from people who are questioning this event is going to leave you disappointed... I would encourage you to avoid open topics on this event...Don't re-traumatize yourself. Victims of such events can downslide really quick by engaging in discussions about said events...


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

RRbohemian said:


> The sad thing is that media spins the news to their audience and govt officials lie that it's difficult to filter out what is real and what is fake these days.


The media and the government information sources actually spawn a lot of the conspiracy theories by releasing bad and/or incomplete information. When people have reason to believe that they are being lied to, they start to suspect bad intentions.

Remember the first "explanation" for how the Twin Towers came down so quickly? I'm not an engineer, but I had a few physics classes. My first thought was, "I don't know what the truth is, but I know _that's_ not it. Finally enough engineers and physicists debunked it, so they came out with another official explanation. Same thing. So finally, I think, it was the third "official explanation" that they said was final. By that time there were a hundred theories based in pure fantasy. But a lot of them took root because when people believe that they are being lied to, they start looking for the reasons why. Throw in all the news and online sources that automatically point fingers at someone - the Left, the Right, the Black, the White, etc.

By the time the truth comes out, if it ever does, half the people already have their minds made up.


----------



## PassingThru (Aug 31, 2005)

Surprised it took this long for a bump stock lawsuit.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime...iles-lawsuit-against-bump-stock-manufacturer/


----------



## photofishin (Aug 7, 2009)

boom! said:


> BTW, the police could end a lot of the speculations by releasing information.


you obviously don't know how a police investigation works. This ISN'T about ending speculation...it's about using factual data to get down to the why/how of it all. Las Vegas PD is doing a fantastic job. People here got extremely upset when mob mentality took over in Ferguson and Baltimore from (speculation). Obama isn't running things anymore and the federal government isn't interfering in this investigation. Let the facts come out.
I'm a big boy and can handle news...what irks me though is rumor and outright lies spread on social media that poses as real news.


----------



## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

photofishin said:


> I'm a big boy and can handle news...what irks me though is rumor and outright lies spread on social media that poses as real news.


Perhaps you suffer from a low irk threshold


----------



## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

photofishin said:


> you obviously don't know how a police investigation works. This ISN'T about ending speculation...it's about using factual data to get down to the why/how of it all. Las Vegas PD is doing a fantastic job. People here got extremely upset when mob mentality took over in Ferguson and Baltimore from (speculation). Obama isn't running things anymore and the federal government isn't interfering in this investigation. Let the facts come out.
> I'm a big boy and can handle news...what irks me though is rumor and outright lies spread on social media that poses as real news.


Get help dude. I've reviewed my posts on this thread and if you have issues with them, they are your issues. You don't own this tragedy or this website so there isn't anything that you can do about it except ignore my posts. Good luck with the recovery.


----------



## POC Troutman (Jul 13, 2009)

new time line came out saying security guard was shot 6 minutes prior to the start of the concert shooting.


----------



## gbollom (Apr 16, 2012)

So what did they say was written on the paper in the room?


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

gbollom said:


> So what did they say was written on the paper in the room?


Calculations for firing his guns.


----------



## smokinguntoo (Mar 28, 2012)

gbollom said:


> So what did they say was written on the paper in the room?


Calculations for bullet drop with distance and initial elevation factored in.

Pardon me, but I have trouble believing that this millionaire could continually gamble up to a $M/day on video poker for years and not lose everything. I'm suspicious that he had some source of clandestine funding. Interviews with family and coworkers indicates he was quite generous. Maybe he found the holy grail of beat video poker program (or wrote one).

SG2


----------



## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

Rubberback said:


> Calculations for firing his guns.


Iâ€™ll call BS. Heâ€™s just trying to make a POS slidefire run with a bunch of POS magazines into a half-acre target that isnâ€™t THAT far away, not go sub-MOA here. Good answer when people started asking what was on it, but nope.


----------



## Rubberback (Sep 9, 2008)

dwilliams35 said:


> Iâ€™ll call BS. Heâ€™s just trying to make a POS slidefire run with a bunch of POS magazines into a half-acre target that isnâ€™t THAT far away, not go sub-MOA here. Good answer when people started asking what was on it, but nope.


Whoa! I just read this! I have no idea what it said! Could of been a hookers #.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

I just read a local FOX affiliate story that said he tried to buy tracer rounds at a gun show in Phoenix a couple of weeks earlier. I said right after it happened that it was a good thing he didn't have tracers. As bad as it was, that would have made it much worse.

I also read a couple of stories that say they think he carried his stuff up the freight elevator. Someone (FOX?) had an interview with Steve Wynn earlier, and he said that he could not imagine a situation where a customer could have access to the freight elevator without an employee knowing about it. He apparently knew something about the freight elevator being involved - after he blurted that out, they asked if it was used, and he tried to change the subject.

I could see an employee letting a regular break the rules, not knowing that he was taking guns up to the room. But that would answer some of the questions people have been asking about how he got all that iron upstairs.


----------



## 3GENTS_Fishing (May 16, 2014)

pocjetty said:


> I just read a local FOX affiliate story that said he tried to buy tracer rounds at a gun show in Phoenix a couple of weeks earlier. I said right after it happened that it was a good thing he didn't have tracers. As bad as it was, that would have made it much worse.


I believe some of his mags were loaded with tracers. Report I read said unclear if any were fired. Not on videos I've seen if he used them.


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

pocjetty said:


> I also read a couple of stories that say they think he carried his stuff up the freight elevator. Someone (FOX?) had an interview with Steve Wynn earlier, and he said that he could not imagine a situation where a customer could have access to the freight elevator without an employee knowing about it. He apparently knew something about the freight elevator being involved - after he blurted that out, they asked if it was used, and he tried to change the subject.
> 
> _I could see an employee letting a regular break the rules, not knowing that he was taking guns up to the room_. But that would answer some of the questions people have been asking about how he got all that iron upstairs.


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/10/11/bellhop-reportedly-helped-las-vegas-gunman-with-bags-as-resort-cops-differ-over-timeline.html

"A Las Vegas bellhop may have unwittingly helped Stephen Paddock carry his arsenal of weapons and ammunition up a freight elevator Paddock accessed through a special hotel perk and into the out-of-view 32nd-floor suite Paddock used to rain down mayhem on a country music concert crowd."

Here's another weird little tidbit from the article:
"Adding to the confusion:* there are no surveillance cameras in the floorâ€™s hallway*, but only on elevator banks, and *the timestamps on the hotelâ€™s communications systems in some cases may have been off*, Clark County Assistant Sheriff Tom RobertsÂ told the Los Angeles Times Tuesday."

What happens on the 32nd floor stays on the 32nd floor?

And then the finger-pointing and blame-avoiding:
_
Roberts said Campos â€œcalled it inâ€ to hotel security before Paddock started firing out the window of his room. â€œHe manually called down and he used his radio to callâ€¦Thatâ€™s what we were briefed this morning,â€ Roberts told the Los Angeles Times, adding officials hope to release a complete timeline on Friday.

ButÂ Lombardo said MondayÂ officers werenâ€™t even aware of Camposâ€™ situation until they arrived on the 32nd floor 18 minutes after he was shot, raising doubts resort security relayed the message to police.

Even more damning: Roberts, in his interview, said the hotel dispatched its own armed security team that arrived â€œright around the same timeâ€ as Las Vegas officers._

So the story is that a Mandalay Bay security guard got 200 bullets fired at him, radioed it in, and the casino didn't send anyone to check on him for 18 minutes? And the police who arrived at the same time (18 minutes later) were unaware that the security guard had been shot at, and was somewhere on the same floor?

I've seen casino security go after table cheats, purse snatchers, and ticket scalpers. Once I saw a guy snatch some chips off a table and make a dash for a nearby door - he never had a chance. There were guys with radios _everywhere_. Nothing about this story adds up with how things work there. It's another case of, "I don't know what the truth is, but that's not it."

Maybe they are trying to protect casino business. Maybe they are trying to protect someone's reputation. But I'm not buying that a hotel security guard reported getting shot at, and no one from the hotel rushed to help him.


----------



## THA (Jan 5, 2016)

I have two questions,
How many people were killed and wounded by bullets and how many were killed and wounded by crowd panic and trampling each other

Also, it sounds like we have been fed a load of BS from the start and now media releases have been caught and they are going for damage control. What do they not want us to know.


----------



## cman (Apr 17, 2009)

Why did he buy a bolt action one week before the shootings?


----------



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

cman said:


> Why did he buy a bolt action one week before the shootings?


He didn't. He bought it the same day - just hours before the shooting. From a gun shop in his home town, 60 miles away. The first story was that he bought it on his way to check into the hotel.

Now we know that he checked in to the hotel three days before the shooting. So he went back to his home town some time after checking in. Then, a few hours before the shooting, he was 60 miles away from Vegas, and he stopped to buy a bolt action .308. But he didn't bring it with him to the hotel room, and it wasn't in his car.

You can toss it off by saying the guy is crazy. But everything I've seen so far looks like he was pretty orderly. He came up the freight elevator, to a floor without security cameras. He took the time to screw shut the stairway door right outside his room. He set up security cameras outside his room. He had drills and tools to set up his security system, and screw the door shut.

Maybe he was crazy, but he wasn't random. He stopped to buy that weapon for some reason.


----------



## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

Funny how they still dont have a motive... After my phone call today, I think I figured it out...

He found out that the representative he was dealing with on the phone from an insurance/hospital dispute was going to the concert....

GRRRRRR!!!


----------

