# Spiral wrap to the right or left.



## GOTAWAY

I have built three spiral wrap rod and all the rotation of the eyes have been to the right. I have been seeing a lot of rods lately that go to left. Am I wrong for choosing this direction? These rods perform great. I won't build an conventional rod for myself again. 

What direction do you spiral and why?

By direction, which way your eyes rotate to get your line to the bottom of the blank. This is a Batson 822.5 I built see the rotation to the right. Love this thing. But could it be better by going the other direction?


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## patfatdaddy

I spiral to the left but I don't know why. It seems to me that I read somewhere that you should spiral away from your reel handle but I don't think it really matters.
Pat


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## daryl1979

I spiral to the right if it is a left handed guy and to the left for the right handed guy. I was just thinking how they would set the hook when a fish did hit


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## xxxxxQTRODS

daryl1979 said:


> I spiral to the right if it is a left handed guy and to the left for the right handed guy. I was just thinking how they would set the hook when a fish did hit


Correct-a-mundo


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## Wafflejaw

I dont see how setting the hook relates?.....Either side shouldn't affect performance.

I spiral handle side...Keeps the transition guides up when laying the rod down and make grabbing the line much easier if your flipping ,etc.....

Either ways works fine


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## Charlie2

*Spiral Wrap Direction*



patfatdaddy said:


> I spiral to the left but I don't know why. It seems to me that I read somewhere that you should spiral away from your reel handle but I don't think it really matters.
> Pat


Spiral wrap to the opposite side from the reel handles. Force of habit!

Depends on user preference. C2


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## daryl1979

*Spirel Wrap*



Charlie2 said:


> Spiral wrap to the opposite side from the reel handles. Force of habit!
> 
> Depends on user preference. C2


When i was setting it up, Me being right handed and setting the hook with rod going to my right shoulder. It just looked more natural the way the line was being pulled.


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## Law Dog

Spiral to the left if it is a right handed, and to the right for the left handed.....


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## GOTAWAY

Thanks for the input guys. So I guess since I use a right handed reel I have been doing wrong. I guess I have to build another one. I got a bad habit.

Thinking about starting RBA (rod builder anonymous). You know a support program for people with addiction to this hobby LOL


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## 2400tman

GOTAWAY said:


> Thanks for the input guys. So I guess since I use a right handed reel I have been doing wrong. I guess I have to build another one. I got a bad habit.
> 
> Thinking about starting RBA (rod builder anonymous). You know a support program for people with addiction to this hobby LOL


Sign me up bud! Right their with you.........lol


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## Wafflejaw

GOTAWAY said:


> Thanks for the input guys. So I guess since I use a right handed reel I have been doing wrong. I guess I have to build another one. I got a bad habit.
> 
> Thinking about starting RBA (rod builder anonymous). You know a support program for people with addiction to this hobby LOL


How are you wrong?


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## daryl1979

Ha I don't think he is wrong. I just think he wants to build another rod


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## DPFISHERMAN

I think I have a great answer to the question. Build one each way, fish them both and report back to see if it matters.


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## Wafflejaw

daryl1979 said:


> Ha I don't think he is wrong. I just think he wants to build another rod


:cheers: ah, fair enough!

DP is correct imo...Something subjective like spiral wrapping I would mock up the guides both way and see what you like....I keep a composition book I record notes/measurements in.....Mine again, is mostly for storage purposes since I found no difference in either side...


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## Goags

If you believe the "Coriolos force" is omnipotent, spiral to left north of the equator and to the right if you're south. I've experienced no difference, and just prefer the right...


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## patfatdaddy

I am still not a big fan of spiral wraps on popping rods. I can see a big advantage for heavy offshore rods. I do like micros but I put them on top for my rods. I will do them anyway they want them for others.
Pat


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## GOTAWAY

Right now Im building and XP843 with micros/spiral for my son. I like it... I will build one for me but this time I will spiral to the left. I will fish both and see if there is any difference. 

Guys ya'll advise is great and I'm thankful to have this place to learn.

Gotaway


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## d4rdbuilder

built them both... fished them both... no difference. I might rotate one way or the other depending on things like... off-shore using a reel without a level wind, i'll spiral to the off side of the reel handle to make access to the line a little easier. Would probably do the same if I was setting up a flipping rig.


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## xxxxxQTRODS

*Model car builders verses fishing rod builders*

The nature of the hand is the reason for changing direction. Since most of u have never caught a fish I guess I will have to explain the basics of fishing. When fish is on bait it bends rod. U got me so far, now direction of bend depends on fish right. He can go down or out which is no problem, or the fish can go left or right, this is the problem. Now take your hands and stick them in front of u like u are holding a rod then roll your hands inward and then outwards. It feel natural to roll inwards correct. U model car builders are y'all still with me. There is always a potential for the line to touch where it crosses the blank going from top to bottom through the guides. Alright let's go back to fishing, if u have a fish on and u have the rod in your left hand and the fish run to the left and guides are rolled to the right it is natural to roll your hand to right this will move the guides more under the rod there by pushing the line farther from the blank there by relieving any line touching and same goes for the right hand...........bennie by fishing experience


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## mark blabaum

Bennie, I know that I'm a poor builder and even worse fisherman, but when you have a fish on do they always go one direction; ie always to the left? Maybe it's these pesky northern fish, but when I accidently hook a fish I've had them pull towards my left side making me have the rod tip to the right of me, and if the fish pulls toward my right the rod tip is on my left side. Since I'm right handed I should make sure that the fish go to my left so I won't have to worry about the line touching the blank for a couple of seconds or should I set up the spiral correctly so the line won't touch even by the odd chance I should have a fish take off to my right? I've always thought that a spiral set up correctly should be able to spiral right or left. With this said I do set up my spirals the same as you just not for your reason.


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## jaycook

QTRODS said:


> The nature of the hand is the reason for changing direction. Since most of u have never caught a fish I guess I will have to explain the basics of fishing. When fish is on bait it bends rod. U got me so far, now direction of bend depends on fish right. He can go down or out which is no problem, or the fish can go left or right, this is the problem. Now take your hands and stick them in front of u like u are holding a rod then roll your hands inward and then outwards. It feel natural to roll inwards correct. U model car builders are y'all still with me. There is always a potential for the line to touch where it crosses the blank going from top to bottom through the guides. Alright let's go back to fishing, if u have a fish on and u have the rod in your left hand and the fish run to the left and guides are rolled to the right it is natural to roll your hand to right this will move the guides more under the rod there by pushing the line farther from the blank there by relieving any line touching and same goes for the right hand...........bennie by fishing experience


It must be extremely frustrating having to deal with all us idiots. I thought I was the only that hadn't caught a fish...I feel better now.


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## Swampland

jaycook said:


> It must be extremely frustrating having to deal with all us idiots. I thought I was the only that hadn't caught a fish...I feel better now.[/QUOTE
> 
> Well Jay, glad you're feeling better. It looks like all I do is build model cars. :cheers:


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## Goags

Like custom rods, there are model cars and MODEL CARS...2 different animals! MOST of us strive for the large print. Fishing, what's that? :headknock


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## xxxxxQTRODS

I guess this means a casting contest is out!


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## xxxxxQTRODS

*Mark whats the deal*



mark blabaum said:


> Bennie, I know that I'm a poor builder and even worse fisherman, but when you have a fish on do they always go one direction; ie always to the left? Maybe it's these pesky northern fish, but when I accidently hook a fish I've had them pull towards my left side making me have the rod tip to the right of me, and if the fish pulls toward my right the rod tip is on my left side. Since I'm right handed I should make sure that the fish go to my left so I won't have to worry about the line touching the blank for a couple of seconds or should I set up the spiral correctly so the line won't touch even by the odd chance I should have a fish take off to my right? I've always thought that a spiral set up correctly should be able to spiral right or left. With this said I do set up my spirals the same as you just not for your reason.


Why are u up set, u where not on this posting. I have never said anything bad about your post on this site. I have always complimented your Work it is
beautiful , what I don't understand is some of the rod builder on here think so 
long as u got the finish on perfect that's all that matters. When someone ask 
a question about rod mechanics people who build beautiful but have no clue of 
the mechanic want to chime in. The last I seen was this site was a information forum correct. I have 11 Spiraled wrapped rod been fishing spiral wrapped since the late 80s would not fish with another rod. So if I have offend u im sorry. I have no fight with u...............Bennie


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## jaycook

How many rods, built by the guys on this forum, have you held in your hand or fished, Bennie. How can you claim that somebody knows nothing about "mechanics"?


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## patfatdaddy

I am still not impressed with a spiral wrap on a light inshore rod. I do like it on a big old offshore rod. It is just a question of comfort for me. I don't have a problem with light rods twisting. Let them twist. I have never had a blank failure in my many decades of fishing that was not my fault.
Pat


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## xxxxxQTRODS

jaycook said:


> How many rods, built by the guys on this forum, have you held in your hand or fished, Bennie. How can you claim that somebody knows nothing about "mechanics"?[
> 
> Sorry jay your a wizard!!


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## jaycook

QTRODS said:


> jaycook said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many rods, built by the guys on this forum, have you held in your hand or fished, Bennie. How can you claim that somebody knows nothing about "mechanics"?[
> 
> Sorry jay your a wizard!!
> 
> 
> 
> Never claimed to be. You seem to be the one with magical powers that knows everybody else builds junk...without ever seeing it.
Click to expand...


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## xxxxxQTRODS

patfatdaddy said:


> I am still not impressed with a spiral wrap on a light inshore rod. I do like it on a big old offshore rod. It is just a question of comfort for me. I don't have a problem with light rods twisting. Let them twist. I have never had a blank failure in my many decades of fishing that was not my fault.
> Pat


Pat the question was not weather u like rolled guides or was it.


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## ellisredfish

One of my personal rods is spiral wrapped. One of these days I will rewrap it guides on top. I don't like it. When a fish swims left, I turn my hand to the right, when he swims right, I turn my hand to the left.


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## patfatdaddy

QTRODS said:


> Pat the question was not weather u like rolled guides or was it.


No the question was which way they should be spiraled. I am just saying they shouldn't on a light rod. Of course that is just me, if someone wants spiral wrapped rods they should have them.
Pat


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## xxxxxQTRODS

patfatdaddy said:


> No the question was which way they should be spiraled. I am just saying they shouldn't on a light rod. Of course that is just me, if someone wants spiral wrapped rods they should have them.
> Pat


Pat I just built a rod with Micros on top no smaller than 4.5 on top with tWO 10 on back. This rod feel pretty sweet. Feels good enough to keep.


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## Terrynj

I wanted to jump in on this. I haven't posted much, so to explain my left or right opinion a little better I wanted to give my take on the whole spiraling concept in general. 


I have been spiraling rods for at least 4 years now and have gotten to the point to where I won't even put guides on top anymore. I have been working at FTU now for 4 years, so I am showing and explaining micro guides and spiral wraps everyday to seasoned and inexperienced fisherman/rodbuilders alike. People are always immediately ask me the benefits of putting the guides on the bottom and I turn it back on them and ask for benefits of guides on top. I have yet to have anyone give a mechanical benefit for guides on top of a blank...other than they are just used to them that way. The question I always ask them is...if you were going to lift something heavy with a boom and block & tackle...would you put the tackle on top or the bottom of the boom...everyone immediately says the bottom, it would be stupid to put them on top.

Here are what I feel are the benefits...
Twisting of the blank..guides on the bottom greatly cut down the twisting of the blank since line running in an arc over the top of the rod is a longer path. so the line will naturally twist the blank to get underneath the rod. 

Line touching the blank is greatly reduced...not huge deal as I have never seen a rod damaged for line rubbing...I think it is worse on the line from the friction causing more line wear.
In an effort to keep line off the blank...builders will add more guides (which adds more weight killing the benefits of smaller lighter guides) or use tall guides which means even more weight and the taller guides are like a cheater bar on a wrench...now the line can really jerk the blank around. 

Sensitivity is increased since the wet line is not laying all over your blank and is only hanging from the guides.

Braid is less likely to loop on the tip now that it is upside down.

There is no loss of casting distance with spirals and i would use them even if there was because of all the other benefits. 

Do you need to spiral light weight rods? I believe absolutely, because of the added strain on the blank from twisting, the guides on top being pulled to the right and left (as the fisherman flips the rod from side to side as he works the fish up to the boat)..i.e. its easier on the guides since they aren't torqued anymore, line wear is reduced, and the rod is more stable.


Now back to the original question ...which way to spiral? My opinion is it does not matter and no one can prove one way or the other is better (better for what?) It works fine either way and I recommend to go the direction that makes you feel better about your build. The K2 I just posted is a new wrap I am trying and I like it a lot...but I have always wrapped to the right for righties and those roods have performed very well.
I also cut my line very close to the blank because I feel it is more detrimental to use tall guides and go way out of the way which creates a bad path for the line..I just deviate the path by kicking my stripper over 15 degrees or so, through a very small bumper, into the 3rd guide that is kicked out on the same as the stripper. it creates a pretty straight line from the reel to the bottom without many changes in direction.

Does it rub the blank? It sure can, but take any rod with guides on top flex it under load like a fish, and the line touches EVERYWHERE, sometimes even dropping down below the arc of the blank....I pay little attention if it might sometimes touch in one spot of the rod if it is held a certain way when spiraled..if people are worried about line touch, they have no option but to spiral.


Which way is the best direction to roll? Which ever works best in your mind because it instills confidence and keep in mind... everyone opinions do not makes things facts (including mine).

Now I certainly feel very comfortable with my own opinion about my builds and what I believe. I welcome anyone's hearty debate on my techniques because I believe I can debate the mechanics and we all learn from them interchanges. But this isn't brain surgery and nobody will die if you do something wrong.

Final thought..
Relax, build what you want, express your opinions and ideas, enjoy the hobby and sport, but keep your ridicule and cheap jabs to yourself about others being wrong. I quit going onto forums just for that reason. I would like to come back. Lets keep things between the lines..if you have to dim all the stars to make you appear brighter, it soon ruins a beautiful night sky for all and makes everyone quit looking.


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## pg542

Goags said:


> If you believe the "Coriolos force" is omnipotent, spiral to left north of the equator and to the right if you're south..


..hmmmm..interesting concept Jerry, and I can see the merits of such. However, you do realize all of this is moot when spiraling a fly or spinning rod. The advantages just don't seem to be there on these type of builds.







.....I agree with Terry. Everybody lighten up and build which ever way you like. I've never tried a right or left comparison, but everything I've read seems to agree that the difference(if any) is miniscule.....


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## DPFISHERMAN

Grerat information Terry, thanks for the post.


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## GOTAWAY

Terry thanks for a bit of information you actually gave me your guide lay out for spiral guides about 3 years ago. I think it works great. I started this train wreck to get other opionis on this issue. I unlike others on here I don't know everything. With that said this a great place for information. This forum, you tube, And good people like Terry at FTU is how I got into this great hobby.


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## bowhunter29

To the original question- it doesn't matter. Do what makes you happy. Personally, I spiral mine to the handle side off the reel. Why? So that the bumper guide is 'protected' by the reel handle.

I have to laugh when I read some of these posts. There is so much misinformation flying around. I'm not a hot-shot, big-time rod builder, but I have been blessed with a little bit of common sense. Some of the stuff reported as fact is simply not true. I've even had discussions with other rod builders who claimed that their clients brought back muskie rods that were spiral wrapped because they didn't like the way the rods felt when figure eighting next to the boat. To which I gave them a blank stare... I haven't been muskie fishing all of my life but I've been doing it long enough to tell you that there is NO WAY any human can tell the difference of a spiral wrapped rod verses a conventional build when figure eighting a bait next to the boat. 

I'll get off my soap box now.

jeremy


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## jaycook

Thanks for the write up Terry.


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## xxxxxQTRODS

*Great information terry*

Great information Terry, but the object of the guide is to keep line off the blank. Now look at your reel which is the other half of this picture correct. NOw I'm not bragging, but pretty fair reel mechanic. Know u would agree a rod with out a reel is useless correct. The point is my experience is that one of the reason reel have gotten so expensive is the very smooth innovative drag systems. I talk in terms of the whole system. If u let line lay on the blank it causes improper drag on the line causing an oldtime jerking in the drag system of your 250 dollar reel. This reading is only for people who catch fish that will pull a drag. Everything I read from Fuji about guide is the ceramic is diamond ground so it dissipate heat and cause the line to flow smoothly. So u think that wet laying on the blank is going to flow smoothly.
THIS IS ONLY FOR PEOPLE WHO CATCH FISH THREE POUNDS OR BETTER


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## xxxxxQTRODS

*Great information terry*

Great information Terry, but the object of the guide is to keep line off the blank. Now look at your reel which is the other half of this picture correct. NOw I'm not bragging, but pretty fair reel mechanic. Now u would agree a rod with out a reel is useless correct. The point is my experience is that one of the reason reel have gotten so expensive is the very smooth innovative drag systems. I talk in terms of the whole system. If u let line lay on the blank it causes improper drag on the line causing an oldtime jerking in the drag system of your 250 dollar reel. This reading is only for people who catch fish that will pull a drag. Everything I read from Fuji about guide is the ceramic is diamond ground so it dissipate heat and cause the line to flow smoothly. So u think that wet laying on the blank is going to flow smoothly.
THIS IS ONLY FOR PEOPLE WHO CATCH FISH THREE POUNDS OR BETTER

I'm really going to miss the casting contest this weekend and I'm not trying to be an a?? either, that was fun last year.


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## mark blabaum

Terrynj said:


> Final thought..
> Relax, build what you want, express your opinions and ideas, enjoy the hobby and sport, but keep your ridicule and cheap jabs to yourself about others being wrong. I quit going onto forums just for that reason. I would like to come back. Lets keep things between the lines..if you have to dim all the stars to make you appear brighter, it soon ruins a beautiful night sky for all and makes everyone quit looking.


Very well said Terry.


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## patfatdaddy

QTRODS said:


> Great information Terry, but the object of the guide is to keep line off the blank. Now look at your reel which is the other half of this picture correct. NOw I'm not bragging, but pretty fair reel mechanic. Now u would agree a rod with out a reel is useless correct. The point is my experience is that one of the reason reel have gotten so expensive is the very smooth innovative drag systems. I talk in terms of the whole system. If u let line lay on the blank it causes improper drag on the line causing an oldtime jerking in the drag system of your 250 dollar reel. This reading is only for people who catch fish that will pull a drag. Everything I read from Fuji about guide is the ceramic is diamond ground so it dissipate heat and cause the line to flow smoothly. So u think that wet laying on the blank is going to flow smoothly.
> THIS IS ONLY FOR PEOPLE WHO CATCH FISH THREE POUNDS OR BETTER
> 
> I'm really going to miss the casting contest this weekend and I'm not trying to be an a?? either, that was fun last year.


Sorry about the casting contest. I have a rig that does exceptionally well and would like to try it out against other builders. I hope we can do a casting contest next time.
Pat


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## Terrynj

Thanks so much guys! I am in a rare position in that I get to meet and chat with so many local rod builders. I enjoy sharing everything I have learned and learning from the local talent, Texas has some great rod builders!

Hi Bennie! How are you doing my friend!
Interesting comment about the purpose of guides... (missed your point on the rest)
"Great information Terry, but the object of the guide is to keep line off the blank."
To me, the main purpose of the guides are to connect the line to the blank. Line rubbbing the blank is an obvious byproduct, but what I am learning..not a huge problem. 99.999% of casting rods have the guides on top and rods aren't being sawed in half and the line is not melting in front of our eyes. I have never had anyone show me a rod that was damaged by line rubbing it...maybe buffed it, but that just means you need to wipe you rod down more.lol I think there is more wear on your line than the blank being damaged. 

So I spiral first to;
1. cut the torque down on the blank, 
2. cut abuse on the guides as they are being jerked from side to side
3. cut down line contact with the blank, (this is a sensitivity issue for me)
4. and to make the rod more stable in your hand.

Hope to see you this weekend!

Terry


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## Bubba_Bruiser

This has been a very interesting read. I turn to the handle side because I want to be like WaffleJaw, he is the real wizard, well an apprentice at least. :biggrin:


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## xxxxxQTRODS

*Any u boys feeling that imay have heart your feeling,now yur chance*

The Texas rod show is going to have a casting contest. I will be there and you can have a chance to get even, this is where the rubber meet the road. There's no talking it is pure backlash time. Come put your talent where your mouth is. Twenty years fishing with spiral wrapped rods caught lots of bass. Terry if u build a black bass fisherman a rod where the line hit or touches the blank look for a broken return. Graphite rods fracture first before they break.

I have never in my life had a light rod try to twist out of my hand with guides on top. Another thing u posted last week or month that u roll the guides to the left on that Phenix rod because u Helt the rod in your right and reel with your left. Thats what this mess is all about which way to roll guides. Bunch of people chimed in and said it did not make any difference. The mistake I made was I called them MODEL CAR BUILDER, but since u rolled them right on that Phenix rod. I did not put u in that category.


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## Goags

Bennie, sounds alittle hasty to have a casting contest WITHOUT rules. Maybe next year, after the details of rod length/lb. test/mono or braid/lure wt./distance vs. accuracy have been hashed out?... see ya Saturday in Deer Park. Jerry


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## Skiff

*Chill*

I don't have enough to go around, so everyone please lick your monitors until you feel warm and fuzzy.
This forum is really great and thanks for sharing all of your work. Hope to make it out this weekend and meet some of you guys. I know Terry, he keeps me in debt!


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## jaycook

Bennie, you have never heart my feelings.


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## Terrynj

QTRODS said:


> The Texas rod show is going to have a casting contest. I will be there and you can have a chance to get even, this is where the rubber meet the road. There's no talking it is pure backlash time. Come put your talent where your mouth is. Twenty years fishing with spiral wrapped rods caught lots of bass. Terry if u build a black bass fisherman a rod where the line hit or touches the blank look for a broken return. Graphite rods fracture first before they break.
> 
> I have never in my life had a light rod try to twist out of my hand with guides on top. Another thing u posted last week or month that u roll the guides to the left on that Phenix rod because u Helt the rod in your right and reel with your left. Thats what this mess is all about which way to roll guides. Bunch of people chimed in and said it did not make any difference. The mistake I made was I called them MODEL CAR BUILDER, but since u rolled them right on that Phenix rod. I did not put u in that category.


QUOTE=QTRODS;4804185]

So you are saying that if line rubs the blank, it will fail??
99.99% of the rods used for casting has guides on top...hopefully there won't be any disagreement that the line is all over the blank with this setup. By my quick math and your statement of fact, 99.99% of the casting rods in the world should be broken this morning?

I do like the new setup on my Phenix rod, I look at it as a further refinement in building a rod to match a fisherman's style. 98% of the rods I have built in the past 5 years are spirals that go to the right and they were for righties. None of those have come back to me because they broke catching a fish. One died by car door and another by a guy slipping on rocks and falling on it.

So I am still in the camp of picking what system you feel comfortable with. You have certainly done that and I know you confidence in your build...I have confidence in my approaches.

I do like Jerry's theory on Polar Alignment! I may try that on my next one!


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## xxxxxQTRODS

Goags said:


> Bennie, sounds alittle hasty to have a casting contest WITHOUT rules. Maybe next year, after the details of rod length/lb. test/mono or braid/lure wt./distance vs. accuracy have been hashed out?... see ya Saturday in Deer Park. Jerry


Etc
There will be rule l hope like last year 7 foot rod any lline please show up aggie


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## jchief

So, which way do I spiral a spinning rod????













:work:
:slimer:


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## jchief

Seriously, very good debate. I have only built one spiral in my young rod building experience. 

Terry, you have put spiral wrapping in better terms than I have heard before.

I never truly believed that a rod torquing in your hands was a big issue. I can say that I have witnessed one of my rods with a big red on and the guides twisting to almost 90 degrees and a friend, bass fishing a jig in the grass, pulled 2 of his guides out of the wrap fighting the fish.


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