# Food for thought on high fences



## sasquatch (Jul 8, 2008)

I have been wanting to post up for a while and give my opinion and maybe gain some new perspective on the subject of high fences from others. In Texas if someone poaches a deer they must pay restitution to the state. The state says that deer belongs to the state and all its residents. I agree, however if this is so, how can someone buy a piece of property and put up a game fence and trap all the deer within its confines. Do these deer not belong to all residents also? I recently watched Kieth Warren talking about how much good these landowners of high fenced property do the deer herd by feeding water and nutrients year round. They are feeding their livestock to get maximum price, not the deer herd of the state of Texas. I understand why he is saying this, he is sponsored by a couple of commercial deer farms. I have hunted on a high fence ranch. I took my daughter on a hunt last year after being unsuccessful on a TPWD draw hunt for the fourth year in a row. She shot a nice buck, she saw more trophy class deer than most men will see in a lifetime and it was the worst mistake I have ever made. If any of you are planning on introducing your kids to hunting on one of these high fenced ranches that is your business. However, I hope they are sucessful enough in life to continue hunting on these types of ranches because to a new hunter this will set the standard for how hunting is. The state is now in the trophy deer business(13inch rule). Some like it and some dont. To be honest I have not heard why the state went to the rule, just individual opinions. At any rate there has to be agreement that the state of Texas is guilty of some level of hypocrocy. You cant boast about how tough you are on poachers and then let people trap entire herds of deer, fatten them up and sell them. I do not condone poaching but honestly someone who poaches a deer for freezer meat has a lot less impact on my deer hunting than the guy who buys the property next my hunting land and puts up a game fence. Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas :cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

ohhhhhhh...time to pop the popcorn. Good post, with good points - this should be interesting to watch.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

it's funny, everyone says "the deer belong to the state"....so what happens when i hit a deer on a public road way in our great state and try to get my money reimbursed for expenses paid to fix my truck...LOL

nobody claims them, then. :cheers:


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Fencing a property does not mean you fatten 'em up for the frying pan, nor does it make hunting 'em easier, nor does it mean you automatically have an awesome deer herd. If you own the land, you can fence it. We can beat this to death all day long and have ... again, and again, and again.

Let me tell you how I shoot deer off high fenced property, I do it the same way I shoot them off the side-view mirror of my truck. Deep breath in, saftey off, half breath out ... squeeze the trigger.

If you really think hunting a high fenced property make the deer easier to hunt, well ... that's what you think and there isn't a sole here that can change your mind. But, I would probably agree that it isn't "fair" to fence the guys next door out. But let me pose a questions:

Define "fair chase" ... keeping these two scenarios in mind.

1. A guy on an elk hunt takes a big bore 500 yard bench mark rifle hunting on 20,000 acres of low fenced property in the "state of your choosing", gets the wind right, and shoots an monarch of an elk at 400 yards while sipping coffee. The elk crumples at the shot never to even hear the report because the bullet travels faster than the speed of sound. The elk never knew he was there, never had the benefit of winding him or even seeing him.

2. Same guy goes to the "name your high fenced ranch" in the "state of your choosing" and rattles up a deer who crosses from downwind to catch his scent in brush thicker than you can see through at 20 yards ... the deer bolts at the sound of the safety coming off and upon smelling the hunter ... the hunter trots 5 yards to an opening and connects with a shot just as the deer stops 120 yards away before making his final exit. The deer was one of 40 bucks on the 1250 acre fenced "pen" and occasionally fed protein and grew to 162" at 5.5 years old, which is moderately impressive compared to a similar deer on the low fenced property next door who grew to 164" at 5.5 years old as a "free range buck" who was killed in nearly the exact same circumstance.

Which animal was killed fair chase? And which hunt was more fair to the animal ... 1 or 2 ... ?

Poachers do a hell of a lot of damage, they do it in mass and they raise the cost of you and me hunting with antlers sold illegally, which damages OUR resources. We're not talking about the simple salt of the earth poor dude who kills a deer in June to feed his barefoot prego wife here ...


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

What about other problems; diseases, inbreed, no water, and other deteriorating factors of the remaining deer trapped between game fences or away from its usage, by game fences. Funny how one point of view uses the fences to get richer at the expense of the other side? What happen to the


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

Oh goody another high fence thread. :fireworks


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

soooo....you would want the state to what? pass a law saying you can only have a fence of a certain height on your land? or would the law say you can't charge anyone for hunting on your property and MUST allow them to hunt? 

um....I don't think so.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Too Tall said:


> Oh goody another high fence thread. :fireworks


did you bring the beer?? I've got the popcorn


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

RogerB said:


> did you bring the beer?? I've got the popcorn


i've got CR-XR :doowapsta


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

neverlimit said:


> What about other problems; diseases, inbreed, no water, and other deteriorating factors of the remaining deer trapped between game fences or away from its usage, by game fences. Funny how one point of view uses the fences to get richer at the expense of the other side?


Those are all very good concerns ... on any piece of property regardless of fence heigth. In fact.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

I do have beer. Popcorn warm?


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Too Tall said:


> I do have beer. Popcorn warm?


yup, would you care for extra butter on yours? osoobsessed?? you? extra butter??? I have regular salt and sea salt too.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

eh, i'm confused. LOL


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> Those are all very good concerns ... on any piece of property regardless of fence heigth. In fact.


true statement - anthrax epidemics don't recognize high fence. neither does spotted mountain tick fever and some of the other diseases out there.

'xcuse me - popcorn is popping again and Too Tall wants a refill.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

In before the lockdown:bounce:

They don't keep deer in, they keep unwanted deer out....thats what RogerB has told me


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

I'll take mine with ice cold milk ... sinus infection ... %@*!

If this thread takes 100 hits before 10 am tomorrow ... I'll mail each of you a 2 dollar bill. DUDE, don't cross that fence ... there's anthrax on the OTHER side ...


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

I got the popcorn salt.


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

I'll throw out my opinion. I agree with the OP in that the deer belong to the state, not ANY individual land owner and when he restricts the deer from freely moving from one pasture to the other (puts up a high fence) he has taken possession of the deer just as if he had shot it. My solution would be to require a permit for a high fence, part of the permitting would be a survey of the number of deer on the property. The land owner would pay the same restitution per animal as would the poacher. It probably wouldn't stop the fence nor help the guy next door but it would end the discussion about who owns the deer inside of that fence.

I am not making any statement about the "fair chase" part of high fencing, don't care where you choose to hunt.


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Thread*

LOL Stumpy! I'm in too.:doowapsta Let me say for a fact I am against it. Or for it, depending on the question.
BB


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> In before the lockdown:bounce:
> 
> They don't keep deer in, they keep unwanted deer out....thats what RogerB has told me


you misunderstood - high fences were to keep one-armed hunters out...:slimer:


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## KJON (May 1, 2006)

We hunt next to a high fence ranch, never had any problems:redface:


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## Little-bit (Oct 19, 2005)

I’m against high fencing. Why? Simply because I feel that the wildlife that god gave us was created to roam. High fencing property is only one of the many things that are depleting the numbers of wildlife. I also understand and respect the feelings of other land owners. I am also a property owner. Some of witch I purchased specifically for deer hunting and I certainly wouldn't want someone telling me that I couldn't put a high fence around it if I wanted to. You bought it you figure out what you want to do with it. We all agree to disagree…..


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> you misunderstood - high fences were to keep one-armed hunters out...:slimer:


I'm good then I have an arm just the hand is missing...you old fart


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Little-bit said:


> High fencing property is only one of the many things that are depleting the numbers of wildlife. ..


I think I'd reconsider that if I were you. Ever been to the Y.O?? I just hunted a 23,000 acre high fence in West Texas (fence only around the perimeter) I didn't see any depletion of wildlife and trust me there's no shortage on the Y.O either.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> I'm good then I have an arm just the hand is missing...you old fart


be nice, I'm your elder - and I'll take away your popcorn too. kisssm


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

oh hell yeah! that's all it takes to go a 200" deer... buy some land, throw up a fence, and just like magic the deer appear practically overnight! 

the only downside to high fences is that you can't blame those ****ty neighbors for shooting all YOUR deer anymore.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

spec-rig.006 said:


> I ...


 okay - that's it, no more beer for spec


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ...

I retract my offer to mail everyone 2 dollar bills ... this is going to hit 100 this afternoon. Rodge ... sorry about that delete, I'm so jacked up on sinus meds I can't see straight.


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## S-3 ranch (May 26, 2004)

we need a high fence tax, just tax the crude out of people that want them or make them have draw hunters like other states ? poppcorn ready


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## KJON (May 1, 2006)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ...
> 
> I retract my offer to mail everyone 2 dollar bills ... this is going to hit 100 this afternoon. Rodge ... sorry about that delete, I'm so jacked up on sinus meds I can't see straight.


Now THAT'S,,,,,,,the difference between commital and committed!:cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

pilar said:


> poppcorn ready


yes it is but you'll have to get it away from state_vet and too tall - they're being pigs about it again and won't share.:brew:


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## redduck (Jul 26, 2006)

Those people that like high fenses are usually on the inside and those that don't well you know where they are at.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

so the OP and a number of you here state that high fence is going to "destroy" hunting as we know it. 
hmm....lemme see. there were no fences when buffalo roamed most of the West - including Texas - what happened to them? 
there were no fences when Elk were prevalent in Texas - wonder what happened?
oh yeah, that's right - they were hunted almost to extinction...

back to the popcorn


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

I'm with Dad, I mean Roger ...

High fences have saved game in a great number of places. Anyone ever hear of a buffalo jump. Anyone every been to South Africa ... ?! If it were not for high fences, there wouldn't be an animal left.

All right ... peace out ... I'll argue with you guys on Monday. I've got to go poach some ducks off my high fenced canned hunt baited pond.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> I'm with Dad, I mean Roger ...
> I'll argue with you guys on Monday. I've got to go poach some ducks off my high fenced canned hunt baited pond.


and you're leaving your poor ol' Dad behind again - tsk...have fun "son".


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## moneypit (Aug 15, 2005)

High fence ranch hunting is what it is.....just a bunch of rich people letting off steam because they have lots of money.....it's something anybody with money can do....want to impress me ...go to the east texas piney woods with a bow and kill even a 120" deer of any kind....lets hear a responce from someone who has actually done that.....you will hear,Waaa...i hunted east texas and did not see anything....well maybe you should learn how to REALLY hunt and not just let money be your guide....high fence hunting ought to be AGAINST THE LAW ....CASE CLOSED


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

RogerB said:


> back to the popcorn


Had to run get more beer. Y'all are some thirsty fellers.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

moneypit said:


> you will hear,Waaa...i hunted east texas and did not see anything...


Yep I hear you Waa, Waa'ing. BTW I've been on a high fence place in East Texas and saw plenty of animals. :wink:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

sooo East Texas is tough huh? well, I'd go - but here's the problem with that I hunt West Texas - where I hunt has either no fence or fence so low I can walk over it - and state_vet will tell you - that means it's REALLY low fence. And yes, I've taken some really nice 120" deer out that way - not this year - but in years past. 
you didn't see anything in East Texas? well, maybe you need to bone up on your skills - I've got a friend that's hunted East Texas most all his life on public and paper company land and always been successful bringing home a good mature buck.

and you want high fence against the law too huh? sure, let's have a government that restricts how you protect and manage your land, hey!! let's do the same thing with what size of house you can buy, what kind of car you can own....ah...never mind...I'll go pop some more popcorn.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Too Tall said:


> Had to run get more beer. Y'all are some thirsty fellers.


'bout time - I'll take one - but I gotta go pee first.


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## redman35 (Jul 1, 2008)

Here i will help you guys out. I have a good friend who owns a high fence property he breeds the deer and releases them after or sells them to other ranches. First of the state does inspections and deer count on the property atleast once or twice a year. He also has to have a permit so he does pay the state. He is also the one buying about 60,000 dollars a year to feed these deer that are in his high fence. He can only have so many deer in the high fence property is why the state comes and counts them. Any questions please ask i will be happy to help answer them.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

moneypit said:


> High fence ranch hunting is what it is.....just a bunch of rich people letting off steam because they have lots of money.....it's something anybody with money can do....want to impress me ...go to the east texas piney woods with a bow and kill even a 120" deer of any kind....lets hear a responce from someone who has actually done that.....you will hear,Waaa...i hunted east texas and did not see anything....well maybe you should learn how to REALLY hunt and not just let money be your guide....high fence hunting ought to be AGAINST THE LAW ....CASE CLOSED


right on brother! I'd much rather hunt in teh traditional east texas way.... you know... at night, out of season, and at the first sight of someting "brown" you pull the trigger. I can only assume that by "learning how to hunt" you mean "shoot the first thing that walks out because you think your neighbor will shoot if if you dont"?

I think they should cut every high fence down in the state. That way there will be some good deer for a year or two, until they're all shot out, and people find something else to blame on "the man".

what really should be illegal and "case closed" is some guy that owns 14 acres, and shoots every deer that happens to stroll across his place. Apparently, striving for the best possible deer is unethical, but raping a natural resource is perfectly fine... as long as you smell like a pine tree.


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Fences*

HEY!!! HE SAID CASE CLOSED!!!!! 
Doesn't anyone listen anymore?
BB


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

yup...I KNEW it...go pee. come back and it gets all het up agin...where's the beer.


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## drred4 (Aug 12, 2005)

HydraSports said:


> I'll throw out my opinion. I agree with the OP in that the deer belong to the state, not ANY individual land owner and when he restricts the deer from freely moving from one pasture to the other (puts up a high fence) he has taken possession of the deer just as if he had shot it. My solution would be to require a permit for a high fence, part of the permitting would be a survey of the number of deer on the property. The land owner would pay the same restitution per animal as would the poacher. It probably wouldn't stop the fence nor help the guy next door but it would end the discussion about who owns the deer inside of that fence.
> 
> I am not making any statement about the "fair chase" part of high fencing, don't care where you choose to hunt.


Now this is a good idea, makes sense!


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> 'bout time - I'll take one - but I gotta go pee first.


how long does it take to replace a Depends?:wink:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> how long does it take to replace a Depends?:wink:


if you had two hands it wouldn't take nearly as long...at least there's no safety pins any more, I got a little tired of you sticking me all the time


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> if you had two hands it wouldn't take nearly as long...at least there's no safety pins any more


I almost wrote you an anry response, then I reread what you wrote

at first I thought it said this:
"if you had two hands it wouldn't *look *nearly as long"


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## Johnboat (Jun 7, 2004)

*Here is the legal history answer in a nutshell*

English law the sovereign, i.e. the king owned wild animals

Zoom forward to Texas, the sovereign, i.e. the state owns the wild animals.

The statute used to read something like. "wild game belongs to the people of the State of Texas" or something close to that.

That law kept folks from killing all they wanted on their own property,etc., but wealthy ranchers did not like one bit the fact that someone on a neighboring 100 acre tract could shoot "their" deer just because they moseyed off the big ranch.....and they wanted to "improve" "their" herds of deer.

So they lobbied, contributed, etc and changed the law...it now reads something like "wild game belongs to the people of the State of Texas, provided nothing in this law shall prohibit high fences"

So the question is very logical. The whole picture of the law used to be that the landowner did not own the wild animals....it is perfectly logical to draw from that premise that high fencing should be illegal...but the law was amended.

Kind of like saying: "Murder is illegal, but nothing in this law shall prohibit a person from discharging a firearm directly at the torso of another person with intent to kill that person"

What could have been done and what should have been done? There could have been prorationing of deer taken....just like oil and gas regulation.....1000 acres so many deer can be harvested....100 acres so many deer can be taken...etc. But that ship has sailed.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> I almost wrote you an anry response, then I reread what you wrote
> 
> at first I thought it said this:
> "if you had two hands it wouldn't *look *nearly as long"


:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl: - I'll have you know, falling out of a chair from laughing makes it tough to get up - especially with bad knees - popcorn?? with or without extra butter??


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Thread*

Here we had a perfectly good high fence thread going and RodgerB and State Vet had to go ruin it!:slimer: I am a little grossed out right now.
BB


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Johnboat said:


> .it is perfectly logical to draw from that premise that high fencing should be illegal...but the law was amended.


so let me just throw this out there "Kings law" or no "kings law" tell a Texan he can't protect his property by putting a fence up and you'll have a fight on your hands.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

BigBuck said:


> Here we had a perfectly good high fence thread going and RodgerB and State Vet had to go ruin it!:slimer: I am a little grossed out right now.
> BB


you're just jealous - have some popcorn
state_vet washed his hand first before putting in the bowl.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

Kind of like a dam question! Pun intended.


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## Johnboat (Jun 7, 2004)

*OK Roger B. but*



RogerB said:


> so let me just throw this out there "Kings law" or no "kings law" tell a Texan he can't protect his property by putting a fence up and you'll have a fight on your hands.


Didnt the history of the west involve bloody fights over fencing vs open range. Didnt you watch old western movies? Wasnt the great old song "Don't fence me in" about that issue.

Used to be a true Texan would have fence cutters on him at all times to cut through those **** homesteaders and farmers fences to get his cattle where they needed to go.

Starting I guess with the King Ranch and maybe the XIT it was rich folks who fenced off their empires and changed history. And then came the invention of barbed wire......


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

yup I saw those "old movies" I'm just telling you the facts... Like I said, all that open range is wonderful isn't it? That's why we still have Buffalo and Elk in Texas - (oops, my mistake - they're no longer native to the state) both *were *native to the state in those days of wonderful open range, low fence properties, and were plentiful too - where are they now??


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

ooops, sorry i got lost in the XR, where we at now?

rich people showing off
can't hunt the real way (over feeders is the real way)
those are the state's deer, even though when they cross a "low fence" you can't legally shoot them if you don't have permission from the neighbor to hunt

east texas deer hunting is true hunting


that cover it?

Roger, popkern...i got extra with extra butter..... LOL


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## gordaflatsstalker (Jul 3, 2008)

There's nothing I love more than hunting on a well managed high fence ranch. The only problem I have with high fences is I can't afford to hunt them. Sometimes my buddies let me kill some culls though.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

okay, so I gotta go for awhile and I'll quit hijacking this thread (for a little anyway) but let me leave you with this.
I'll agree that high fence ranches have increased the price of hunting but that's not the only reason. There's plenty of no fence, low fence properties that you can hunt - the cost is based on demand and what you're willing to pay. The land owner that owns the ranch where I hunt has limit restrictions so the herds won't be decimated by the hunters who lease the property for the right to hunt. It's low fence and like I said in some places no fence. the restrictions are reasonable and based on an attempt at game management. The cost? for me reasonable as well.

eveyone who objects to paying for the right to hunt deer owned by the people of the state here's a few things to think about:

The state has a considerable amount of hunting opportunities available through the state draw system. Unless I'm mistaken, the state has never met it's harvest goal for the hunts they offer. Those hunts don't cost very much, and in fact there is public hunting available (whitetail included) on state lands for the low cost of $40.00 for a public hunting permit in addition to your standard hunting license with deer tags and they NEVER harvest the allotment there either.

Personally, I think Texas has it pretty damned good. With MLD properties available hunting seasons for native game is expanded beyond the normal seasons and exotic hunting is available and reasonably cheap compared to the cost of a trip to a South African or a European game preserve.

If you don't want to hunt MLD properties, put in for the state draws, if you don't get picked go to one of the state's hunting locations during the dates that the hunt is scheduled for and see if you can get on under the standby rule. If that's not available, pay the $40.00 to purchase a public hunting permit and go where there is hunting available.

have fun y'all - I gotta go buy more popcorn


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## jdickey (Jan 30, 2009)

Roger....ya got any more of that pop corn...and I'll take more of that OTB(other people's beer)....and put on Lonesome Dove that a pretty good story....and it's about my grand mother's uncle uncle, Oliver Loving. He started all that cattle driving business....then the fences went up....people started fussing....and here we are 150 years later and people are still fussing over fences (pun intended)!


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## Johnboat (Jun 7, 2004)

*On a serious note*

High fencing is an experiment without any scientist controlling it. No one knows what the long term effects on deer will be. The hard life of free range free to migrate, find food and water must have bred in some tough survival qualities vs pampered fed high fenced deer. Those wild deer outside of the high fences can no longer move and migrate where they might need to go to survive. Will fenced deer become like overbred show dogs with new forms of ailments and problems? Will some disease wipe them out? Who knows.


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## Titus Bass (Dec 26, 2008)

The breeding program on our high fenced ranch, has just a few more bugs to work out......


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

I don't even like gun hunters. Be a man and use a bow. :cop:


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## MikeS2942 (Mar 5, 2010)

I am on my second bag of popcorn reading this thread.

I always thought selling white tail was illegal, your hear about all the money trading hands to shoot a trophy deer on a ranch, is this not selling state property?


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## Little-bit (Oct 19, 2005)

The Buffalo weren’t over hunted to extinction. The buffalo were purposely eradicated to starve the Indians or drive them out in search for food. The few remaining buffalo were taken out by the cattle ranchers as more settlers arrived. Cattle ranchers—fences ring a bell. The Texas Elk…..well I don’t believe they were ever plentiful in Texas. 

RogerB… love your location description-“Gods Country”. It goes great with your high fencing philosophy.

Yall have fun with this one.. I’m on vaca till Jan-9th. Have a Merry Christmas and happy deer hunting.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

devil1824 said:


> I don't even like gun hunters. Be a man and use a bow. :cop:


Exactly what type of "bow" do you have to use to be a "man'?


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## workn2huntnfish (Aug 1, 2008)

*High Fences Suck*

Boys, and the occasional gal, there is a reason why Boone and Crockett doesn't allow any buck shot behind HIGH FENCE to be listed in their record book and it is because the animal needs to be free ranging. 95% of Texas' hunters don't have a clue how to hunt deer except by box blind/high rack/corn feeder. Now, go argue with B&C about why they won't list your 215", corn/protein engineered megabuck you shot off some high fence deer farm. Please don't get the idea that I can't afford to shoot on those farms and that I am just jealous because I can pay my fee. I just don't like the idea of shooting a buck as if it is one of my black Angus bulls. But, if that is what you like doing, go knock yourself out. Please understand that there is a reason B&C won't let you in their record books. Adios.


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## texasbagman (Oct 1, 2007)

State_Vet said:


> Exactly what type of "bow" do you have to use to be a "man'?


I think he was talking about this...


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

texasbagman said:


> I think he was talking about this...


thats purty:cheers:


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## Tommy2000 (Mar 23, 2008)

I hunt. Rifle, shotgun, bow, handgun, knife, whatever I can use. I hunt high fence, low fence, no fence. I don't care. I just like to hunt. I've chased a bear for two days up and down mountains in Maine and I've shot a hog off the back porch in Texas. I've bow hunted for a week in Wisconsin and never seen a deer. I've hunted deer in Iowa and ran out of shells and tags, killing so many. I've shot exotics behind high fences because that's where they are here in this country and I've shot antelope on an Indian Resrvation where there are no fences.
There are so many ways and places to hunt. Enjoy the hunting you can do and leave others to hunt the way they do.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Tommy2000 said:


> I hunt. Rifle, shotgun, bow, handgun, knife, whatever I can use. I hunt high fence, low fence, no fence. I don't care. I just like to hunt. I've chased a bear for two days up and down mountains in Maine and I've shot a hog off the back porch in Texas. I've bow hunted for a week in Wisconsin and never seen a deer. I've hunted deer in Iowa and ran out of shells and tags, killing so many. I've shot exotics behind high fences because that's where they are here in this country and I've shot antelope on an Indian Resrvation where there are no fences.
> There are so many ways and places to hunt. Enjoy the hunting you can do and leave others to hunt the way they do.


Well said Tommy!


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## Johnboat (Jun 7, 2004)

*Exact statute wording for any who are interested.*

*Texas Parks and Wildlife Code*

*Section 1.011. Property of the State*

"(a) All wild animals, fur-bearing animals, wild birds, and wild fowl inside the borders of this state are the property of the people of this state."

*Section 1.013. Fences* _(added by acts 1997)_

"1. This code does not prohibit or restrict the owner or occupant of land from constructing or maintaining a fence of any height on the land owned or occupied, and and owner or occupant who constructs such a fence is not liable for the restriction of the movement of wild animals by the fence. The existence of a fence does not affect the status of wild animals as property of the people of this state."

The first provision is ancient law. The second provision is the result of the influence of rich landowners....it absolutely guts the first provision and makes it a joke. Welcome to Texas.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> Little-bit said:
> 
> 
> > The Buffalo weren
> ...


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Stupid iPhone. Brb


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> Stupid iPhone. Brb


right....old age has nothing to do with it. I bet some nice person is looking at your "id tag" to see where you belong. Another sad case of the elderly wandering around lost in public:spineyes::biggrin:


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

My major concerns on this debate have been and will always be that some of these fences are cutting off trails or corridors used by game for centuries in order to spread and exchange genetic diverse material. We are creating genetic bottlenecks.
My other concern is the a-hole who buys 100 acres, high fences, puts out 6 feeders, and puts 2 or 3 one way trap gates on the fence. He then traps and sells these deer on day hunt packages. In a low fence day lease, deer learn by themselves to avoid the over hunted property by escaping a few times. Once in the one way gate, they have no opportunity for an escape and to learn to avoid that area.
I have softened my anti high fence position for ranches of 660 acres or more ethically ran. They can be a good thing, but I am still concerned about the genetic bottlenecks we are creating. Mother nature intended deer to roam.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Sorry, Some of you guys are more feminine then me. I should have sent a pic the first time. Try one of these. then pull your panties out of your butt its just a joke. :biggrin: O.K. for real I don't agree with high fences. Simple as that.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

devil1824 said:


> Sorry, Some of you guys are more feminine then me. I should have sent a pic the first time. Try one of these. then pull your panties out of your butt its just a joke. :biggrin: O.K. for real I don't agree with high fences. Simple as that.


hmmm I thought a "real man" would shoot a bow that he made by hand, not one like that with fluffy things on it and a glove to protect his manicure:biggrin:


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

State_Vet said:


> hmmm I thought a "real man" would shoot a bow that he made by hand, not one like that with fluffy things on it and a glove to protect his manicure:biggrin:


 LOL! An adle-adle or spear is the only true he-man way to hunt! And a true sportsman hunts in the nude with his adle-adle.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

I cringe every time I shoot that 1957 ben pearson. I ain't pullin back a bow that I made by hand.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

State_Vet said:


> hmmm I thought a "real man" would shoot a bow that he made by hand, not one like that with fluffy things on it and a glove to protect his manicure:biggrin:


I think you just described Bountyhunter. He makes his own bows and arrows. Not sure about the glove but I'll give him a pass for the other two. :cheers:


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

P&Y and B&C don't have to list what they don't want to and nobody is forcing them too, they are a "private" club, they make their own rules, what's wrong with that?



workn2huntnfish said:


> Boys, and the occasional gal, there is a reason why Boone and Crockett doesn't allow any buck shot behind HIGH FENCE to be listed in their record book and it is because the animal needs to be free ranging. 95% of Texas' hunters don't have a clue how to hunt deer except by box blind/high rack/corn feeder. Now, go argue with B&C about why they won't list your 215", corn/protein engineered megabuck you shot off some high fence deer farm. Please don't get the idea that I can't afford to shoot on those farms and that I am just jealous because I can pay my fee. I just don't like the idea of shooting a buck as if it is one of my black Angus bulls. But, if that is what you like doing, go knock yourself out. Please understand that there is a reason B&C won't let you in their record books. Adios.


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## Miles2Fish (Dec 2, 2008)

It's ironic that we continue to beat this topic to death yet no one ever brings up the fact that this State has seen this topic on its grandest scale back when barb wire was invented......the biggest invention to ever impact the Republic and yet it allowed ,and owners to actually claim their land and their cattle. If high fence property owners are bringing in breeder or bred does and fawns and feedinf and supporting them it should be that they may manage these animals as they see fit as long as they are contained ON their property.......Ironic....


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## wellconnected (May 30, 2005)

Typically I dont post on these types of threads but do enjoy reading them. This weekend I did observe a few things. The area we hunt is basically littered with high fences for miles and miles. Very few of the ranches remaining in the 50 square mile radius are low fenced. We hunt on a ranch that is high fenced on three sides. This weekend I saw two different bucks on my side of the high fence get into a full blown fight with two other bucks on the high fenced ranch. Makes for a very strange sight. The other odd thing, there is several stretches of county road driving in that is high fenced on both sides. This is a very narrow road. Deer will come off a low fence ranch and get into this "corridor" and beat themselves to death trying to get through this corridor. They have to make it down this long stretch until they get to the next low fence (our ranch) and they escape. This again is very sad to watch. At some point in time, I feel that one of two things is going to happen. One, most all ranches regardless of size will be high fenced, or two, high fences will slowly start coming down. There are some ranches that I know that are not going back with high fences for different reasons. I guess the bottom line is those who are inside the high fence will always defend them and those who are outside will always hate them. One of the ranches we border took down miles of perfectly good high fence only to go up with a new high fence a little taller. I sure wish I had that kind of money to burn!


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

Miles2Fish said:


> It's ironic that we continue to beat this topic to death yet no one ever brings up the fact that this State has seen this topic on its grandest scale back when barb wire was invented......the biggest invention to ever impact the Republic and yet it allowed ,and owners to actually claim their land and their cattle. If high fence property owners are bringing in breeder or bred does and fawns and feedinf and supporting them it should be that they may manage these animals as they see fit as long as they are contained ON their property.......Ironic....


 Thats deer ranching, not hunting.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Too Tall said:


> I think you just described Bountyhunter. He makes his own bows and arrows. Not sure about the glove but I'll give him a pass for the other two. :cheers:


x2 he hunts the hard way


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> I'll take mine with ice cold milk ... sinus infection ... %@*!
> 
> If this thread takes 100 hits before 10 am tomorrow ... I'll mail each of you a 2 dollar bill. DUDE, don't cross that fence ... there's anthrax on the OTHER side ...


13 more posts and I'll send you my address:bounce:


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

> Originally Posted by *Spec-Rig.006*
> _I'll take mine with ice cold milk ... sinus infection ... %@*!
> 
> If this thread takes 100 hits before 10 am tomorrow ... I'll mail each of you a 2 dollar bill. DUDE, don't cross that fence ... there's anthrax on the OTHER side ..._





State_Vet said:


> 13 more posts and I'll send you my address:bounce:


Send mine to Stumpy. A little donation to the Good Ol Boys Hunting Club. :cheers:


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Too Tall said:


> Send mine to Stumpy. A little donation to the Good Ol Boys Hunting Club. :cheers:


Thanks!:bounce::cheers:


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

Anytime Bro


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## hookmandba (Nov 12, 2007)

As a state certified deer biologist I see both sides of the argument. I have managed a high fenced ranch and I must say that it is not 'like fattening cattle' and requires significant financial resources and dedication to maintain. The state law allows this practice and regulates it annually through CWD audits with all scientific breeders. I have participated in scientific breeding and sales of deer and enjoyed every minute of it. Personally, I have an 800 acre low fence deer lease in Leon county which is where I hunt. To each his own my friend and congratulations on your daughter's memorable hunting experience inside the high fence.


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## Miles2Fish (Dec 2, 2008)

*Really?*



Sea-Slug said:


> Thats deer ranching, not hunting.


Well duh! but I didn't say anything about hunting, just the owning and management of land and deer herds......Although I had the opportunity to hunt high fence last weekend and even though there are alot more deer to hunt they still have ears and noses and will bust you if you make a mistake! That being said I hunt 100 low fence acres in Brown county and 80 low fence acres in Llano county and really do fell it is more sporting. But if you have the land and the means it is pretty cool hunting high fence once in a while......


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> right....old age has nothing to do with it. I bet some nice person is looking at your "id tag" to see where you belong. Another sad case of the elderly wandering around lost in public:spineyes::biggrin:


well, I was gonna respond to little-bit but I won't - the fact that someone has taken offense to my location line "Texas-God's Country" is disturbing but each to his own. 
I guess I see it this way. Fences, high and low are here to stay. So I'm going to find places I want to hunt, that I would enjoy hunting and do so. Some folks spend enormous sums on vacations. Me? I'm addicted to hunting more than I am to tobacco and that's just the way it is.
I won't defend EVERY high fence (or low fence) hunting operation around - there's plenty of bad ones - each to his own.


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

Miles2Fish said:


> Well duh! but I didn't say anything about hunting, just the owning and management of land and deer herds......Although I had the opportunity to hunt high fence last weekend and even though there are alot more deer to hunt they still have ears and noses and will bust you if you make a mistake! That being said I hunt 100 low fence acres in Brown county and 80 low fence acres in Llano county and really do fell it is more sporting. But if you have the land and the means it is pretty cool hunting high fence once in a while......


 I agree, I am not saying I will never hunt in a high fence. I have turkey hunted in a high fence place but never deer hunted in one. I hunted a low fence place once that was high fenced in on 2 sides. Thats as close as I ever got, not because I cant, I just feel better about hunting low fence. I wont rule it out on a large place.


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## tdebo_713 (Nov 14, 2009)

Open Range is now playing on AMC...just sayin


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## wacker (Mar 22, 2006)

Funny stuff Rodger and vet:cheers:

I Love hunting a well managed property High or low fence no matter. I do think that the state of Texas needs to define *TRAP *A little better.Putting up 90% of the fence and feeding like crazy for a month and then popping up the panels is just plain trapping. 2 months latter they do a game survey and the state gives them 150 doe and buck tags, fence paid for! :hairout:


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Sea-Slug said:


> I agree, I am not saying I will never hunt in a high fence. I have turkey hunted in a high fence place but never deer hunted in one. I hunted a low fence place once that was high fenced in on 2 sides. Thats as close as I ever got, not because I cant, I just feel better about hunting low fence. I wont rule it out on a large place.


Dang sea slug, now they are fencing the turkeys in also.Where will it end. How high was THAT fence ?


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## Brute (Apr 29, 2009)

I have two complaints about high fences.

1. I don't think you should be able to put a high fence with in a certain distance of a public road. It becomes a hazard to people driving the road. It could easily be solved by not allowing high fence with in X amount of feet of the road.

2. Not sure if this is customary but I was trapping on a ranch that put up a high fence and was killing off all the deer they didn't want on the ranch. They had intentially fed tons of feed to pull deer from the surrounding properties before closing it up.... just to kill off what they didn't want. I think if you high fence you should have to re-locate those deer off the ranch at your cost.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

don't know about number 2 but number 1 I can comment to. Anyone ever drive hwy 55 between Uvalde and Camp Wood back in the 60's?? I know, most of you weren't even a twinkle in your Daddy's eye back then. But in those days when everything on both sides of the highway were low fence (and barbed wire) there were some horrific accidents due to cars hitting deer on that road. The last few times I've driven that road I didn't even see a deer because of high fence on both sides. And unless I'm mistaken there is an easement on each side of the road on state roads and interstates that has to be respected - could be wrong but I don't think so.

just a comment.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Brute said:


> I have two complaints about high fences.
> 
> 1. I don't think you should be able to put a high fence with in a certain distance of a public road. It becomes a hazard to people driving the road. It could easily be solved by not allowing high fence with in X amount of feet of the road.
> QUOTE]
> ...


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

I know I'm tired of the jackwagons on public land!! That could be one positive in my eye about a high fence ranch.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

> Originally Posted by *Spec-Rig.006*
> _I'll take mine with ice cold milk ... sinus infection ... %@*!
> 
> If this thread takes 100 hits before 10 am tomorrow ... I'll mail each of you a 2 dollar bill. DUDE, don't cross that fence ... there's anthrax on the OTHER side ..._


TADA!!! 101 posts (not counting this one) pay up Spec-Rig!!


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> TADA!!! 101 posts (not counting this one) pay up Spec-Rig!!


I want my cash too or were headed over to high-fence your house:tongue:


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## scubiguana (Aug 31, 2006)

all i can say is WOW, sasquatch had a valid opinion. i didn't read the entire thread because i got tired of reading all the bull _ _ _ _ , popcorn and beer comments, i can see now how alot of y'all get you post count up. my family has land in another state. i would object highly to the idea of putting a high fence around the place. i dont agree with high fence. if you import exotics to your land, its like putting in a duck blind on a public water body. once its there, it becomes public also. thats my 2 cents.


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## Brute (Apr 29, 2009)

RogerB said:


> don't know about number 2 but number 1 I can comment to. Anyone ever drive hwy 55 between Uvalde and Camp Wood back in the 60's?? I know, most of you weren't even a twinkle in your Daddy's eye back then. But in those days when everything on both sides of the highway were low fence (and barbed wire) there were some horrific accidents due to cars hitting deer on that road. The last few times I've driven that road I didn't even see a deer because of high fence on both sides. And unless I'm mistaken there is an easement on each side of the road on state roads and interstates that has to be respected - could be wrong but I don't think so.
> 
> just a comment.


What if they would have only high fenced one side of that road? Would the fences have helped or hurt the situation.

Let me get this one for you.... hurt.

I was talking morel like 300-500' off the road so the deer are pressured as much when you drive by.


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

sotol buster said:


> Dang sea slug, now they are fencing the turkeys in also.Where will it end. How high was THAT fence ?


 I went spring turkey hunting on a high
fence place near Ft. McCavitt my buddy owns. I did it because I figure turkey can fly over it so it is still fair chase. I never deer hunted on the place but I can if I want. I dont feel right about it for some reason. I did not mean the turkey were penned in with a roof. They just happened to be on the ranch with a game fence. They are still free ranging.


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## Tiny (Dec 19, 2006)

Unless that high fenced ranch is like a hunderd acres with a one deer per acre ratio... high fence hunting aint always easy.. I'll hunt anywhere I can. But I will not shoot any deer that is tied up to a tree or in a 1 acre pen either..


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## Sunbeam (Feb 24, 2009)

Here is the latest step in the hunting evolution from "Lonesome Dove" to the commercial high fence deer farm.
It is also the latest step in the evolution of the American hunter from food provider to a lazy, out of shape, over paid, egotistical trophy collector.

http://www.prlog.org/10539008-virtual-deer-hunting-live-vdhlivecom-adds-lazy-ranch-to-lineup.html


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

sounds like a spin off of something tried here in Texas a few years ago. Remote hunting. the "hunter" logs on views the animal through live video, and "pulls" the trigger by remote. The animal is collected, harvested, caped, mounted and sent to the hunter along with the meat. supposedly created to provide handicapped persons the opportunity to continue hunting it ultimately resulted in state law being passed outlawing the practice.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Brute said:


> What if they would have only high fenced one side of that road? Would the fences have helped or hurt the situation.
> 
> Let me get this one for you.... hurt.
> 
> I was talking morel like 300-500' off the road so the deer are pressured as much when you drive by.


so you're asking the land owner to basically give up 300 to 500 feet of his property line before he fences it? what about low fence? I've seen low fence properties just as close to the highway has high fence? ever seen a vehicle that's run through a barbed wire fence - ain't pretty.

Can't answer if it would have helped or hurt to high fence one side of the highway. I do know it began that way and all of hwy 55 is still not completely high fence. I don't think the high fences went up to protect motorist, they went up for whatever reasons the owner decided.


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## fillet (Dec 2, 2010)

I think it would be a terrible thing for me to put up a high fence around my propery I feel that all three of my neihbors should high fence their property that way all I would have to fence would be the side along the highway!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

scubiguana said:


> all i can say is WOW, sasquatch had a valid opinion. i didn't read the entire thread because i got tired of reading all the bull _ _ _ _ , popcorn and beer comments, i can see now how alot of y'all get you post count up. my family has land in another state. i would object highly to the idea of putting a high fence around the place. i dont agree with high fence. if you import exotics to your land, its like putting in a duck blind on a public water body. once its there, it becomes public also. thats my 2 cents.


and your 2 cents and your preference for not having high fence is your choice. Sorry your offended by the popcorn, beer humor - most of us on this forum (many on here before I joined) have seen this discussion ad nauseam and know where it leads. High fence discussions/debates have been around since the first high fence went up and will continue. There's valid points on each side but typically these discussions tend to lead to rather caustic comments by defenders of each opinion. a little humor tends to lighten the discussion from time to time. If it offends you, just do a search on this forum for high fence - I'm sure you will find all the discussions you want on this.

There's been valid points in this discussion by all parties - and humor.
so you'll have to excuse me now - I'm gotta go make some more popcorn and "get my post count up"


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## fillet (Dec 2, 2010)

As far as the fence along the highway just put in a walk through gate and give the neighboring deer the combo to the lock that way they can get off the road.


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## lazzer65 (May 25, 2006)

*High Fence*

For what it's worth...I watched a bruiser of a buck all season in Pearsall clear a high fence anytime he wanted. Never saw another do it, but the old eight would do it whenever he felt like it.

Dale


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

yeah, I saw one jump a high fence just a few weeks ago out in West Texas, cleared it like it was nothing.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

lazzer65 said:


> For what it's worth...I watched a bruiser of a buck all season in Pearsall clear a high fence anytime he wanted. Never saw another do it, but the old eight would do it whenever he felt like it.
> 
> Dale


I would be laughing my butt off if I saw that!


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## lazzer65 (May 25, 2006)

*The reason*

I posted that was to say that life finds a way...Now, I have a place out of Centerville and if one of those over-grown dogs we call a deer cleared a fence, I would be really be shocked.

Like everybody has said, they both have their places, we as hunters can gather all the facts and make a choice based on those facts. Well, that and the dollars it takes to shoot a trophy off a high fence pasture. Then again hunting is expensive either way you look at it and that is another debate that could be beat to death too.

Dale


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

If I own 500 acres with high fence places on all 4 sides, am I considered high fenced?


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## Encinal (Jan 18, 2008)

This thread is hilarious...


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Thread*

Encinal, always is! :work:
Of course, if you choose to shoot a wounded spike with a .17 rem pistol on a high fence place in Mexico, now that would be a thread!
BB


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## LakeSnake (Nov 16, 2010)

Several years ago, the LCRA sold 500+ acres of Hill Country property in Burnet County (Camp Creek). The new owner put up high fence and that property is now forever closed to the public. I really miss being able to hike and mt bike on that beautiful piece of property. I do get some revenge when exotics get out and show up at my place. I call the ranch foreman and ask if he is missing any animals. If he says "no", I put them in my freezer. These are $600+ animals if I were on their ranch.


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## cpthook (Jan 16, 2008)

Now I'll add my two sence, in Texas with every Tom Dick and Harry shooting the first deer with horns to step out and every millimeter of land spoken for most land owners find it necessary to high fence in order to allow deer to age(it only makes sence). Texas has a 3 month rifle season and most people hunt with rifle. Please don't knock me for saying this but in my humble opionion there is not much of a challenge in killing a deer with rifle however it is the traditional way to hunt in Texas and is necessary to keep the herd in check. After rifle and bow hunting Texas for many years I've moved on to Kansas where the rifle season is only 9 to 12 days long and archery season runs from mid Sept to Dec 31, and high fencing is not even a topic of discussion. You never hear or ask was it behind high fence? Needless to say deer grow old even on a 100 acre land plot. The difference is when you see the animal, the hunt is for the most part over when hunting with a rifle, whereas it's just beginning when hunting with a bow. Don't get me wrong I'd have no problem killing a 225B&C behind fence with rifle, but I would not have the same sence of accomplishment as if i had killed that same buck with bow. With all being said a land owner unless fortunate enough to have been born into a 10k or larger ranch must fence to acheive the desired goal.


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## surfspeck (Jun 7, 2006)

The bottom line is, too many people are worried about impressing their peers. On one hand you have the vain high fence hunters who want to impress you with the "highest scoring deer" money can buy and on the other hand you have the vain low fence/public land hunters who want to impress you with their "impecable hunting skill" and their ability to harvest a respectable deer on public land or low fence property. These two distinct groups of hunters are on opposite ends of the spectrum and are out there for the wrong reasons. I say get out there and enjoy the outdoors and do what you do however you want to do it, not to impress your peers, but to enjoy yourself. Im about sick and tired of people squawking about this debate. LOL!! 

Merry Christmas!!


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

A landowner can do however he chooses, but the MAIN motovation to high fence is GREED, MONEY!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

shaggydog said:


> the MAIN motovation to high fence is GREED, MONEY!


danged Capitalist!! shame on him, he should tear down that fence and "share the wealth"


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

Isn't hunting high fence like shooting fish in a barrel ? I have friends that hunt High fenced leases and say that it doesnt take much hunting. its more like a waiting game most guys sit in a enclosed blind watching atleast 1 if not 3 or more feeders .My friends say they know the deer are there its not like the neighbors shot them or they traveled out of the area.But regardless I still enjoy seeing pictures of the deer and pictures of harvested animals it's just hard to hold them in the same light as a same size deer killed on a low or non fenced areas. whats more impressive a 150-160 class deer taken in a high fence area or a 150-160 class buck taken on public land ?


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

scubiguana said:


> all i can say is WOW, sasquatch had a valid opinion. i didn't read the entire thread because i got tired of reading all the bull _ _ _ _ , popcorn and beer comments, i can see now how alot of y'all get you post count up. my family has land in another state. i would object highly to the idea of putting a high fence around the place. i dont agree with high fence. if you import exotics to your land, its like putting in a duck blind on a public water body. once its there, it becomes public also. thats my 2 cents.


typical post count envy

oh look mine went up one:bounce:


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Spex said:


> Isn't hunting high fence like shooting fish in a barrel ? I have friends that hunt High fenced leases and say that it doesnt take much hunting. its more like a waiting game most guys sit in a enclosed blind watching atleast 1 if not 3 or more feeders .My friends say they know the deer are there its not like the neighbors shot them or they traveled out of the area.But regardless I still enjoy seeing pictures of the deer and pictures of harvested animals it's just hard to hold them in the same light as a same size deer killed on a low or non fenced areas. whats more impressive a 150-160 class deer taken in a high fence area or a 150-160 class buck taken on public land ?


so how hard do you hunt on your low fence place.... with your trail cameras and corn feeders?

the deer don't know they are in a fence.

deer in a high fence can still die in a fight, die of infection, die of other injuries... the only thing a high fence does is decrease the chances a deer can get shot by someone else.

ideally, if you were surrounded by people who were all on teh same plan, they wouldn't be needed, but there is always some A hole that will set up fenceline feeders and reap the benfits of other's time and effort.

is shooting that big deer on low fence more rewarding, not beceause of how "hard" you hunted, but how lucky you got shooting a deer that happened to eat corn at your feeder?


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## Nokillbill (Nov 27, 2006)

i was talking across the fence with my nieghbor. he has the woods that hold the local deer.i mentioned to him that i hope he never clear cut the woods . he said what would you think if i put a high fence up (jokeing). well i told him he couldnt afford it. he said why hell yes i can aford to put up a high fence . told him i knew he could afford to put it up but i didnt think he could aford the maintenence to keep fixin it .


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## Johnboat (Jun 7, 2004)

*Yes Boom, but you are my hero*



boomgoon said:


> If I own 500 acres with high fence places on all 4 sides, am I considered high fenced?


By my calculation, your neighbors paid maybe $60K+ for the fence and you get a free high fence....and your 500 acres is just the right size for herd improvement at reasonable effort and cost according to my friend in a similar situation (but he had to pay 100% to high fence his 500 acre place).


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

So here's a question for you:

Is it the high fence or the size of the enclosure that's the issue?

For those of you who have said that you're against hunting behind the high fence, I wonder if you would hunt on one of the islands off the Canadian coast if you think about it there's not much difference between these islands and a high fenced ranch - the animals movement is restricted by a man-made or natural barrier.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

State_Vet said:


> So here's a question for you:
> 
> Is it the high fence or the size of the enclosure that's the issue?
> 
> For those of you who have said that you're against hunting behind the high fence, I wonder if you would hunt on one of the islands off the Canadian coast if you think about it there's not much difference between these islands and a high fenced ranch


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## ComalClassic (Apr 16, 2010)

I experience both sides of this arguement. 

1. My brother owns 80 acres outside of Hondo, he shoots 3 deer every year (Thats one for him and one for each son(thats 2 sons for those of you in East Texas, jk!)). 2 years ago the ranch that surrounds him on 2 sides decided to put up a high fence. Its extremely frustrating to see the decline in activity and easy to blame it on the **** high fence.

2. I own 640 acres outside of New Braunfels, we shoot about 15 deer a year.. may seem high but when you see 20 deer and each feeder you realize you need to keep the population under check. Next to me is 30 acres that new this year has 5 deer blinds and 5 feeders. Opening day sounded like a war zone. Our deer numbers have really dropped! To top it off these guys hung their racks on the gate entering their proprety. I cant find the picture to recount what they had but roughly 15 racks, from spikes and 4pt to a nice 12 pt. Easy fix is put up a high fence around my place. However, then Im buying in to the same issue my brother is facing. For the other folks around me that do have smaller acreage but act as good sportsman and repect my property, my high fence would ruin their future hunting.

What I find to be the problem is that everyone is givin the right to shoot up to 5 deer. They may have to travel to multiple counties, but they can do it. So, for the 30 acres next to me with 5 blinds, one hunter in each blind means they can shoot 25 deer legally on that 30 acres. And yes, they could have two hunters in each blind and legally shoot 50 deer. 

Im not saying only people that own land should be able to kill deer. But I am saying that the state needs to start managing the lands, not just the people. I think this antler restriction is a step in a good direction. 

Dont blame the high fences.. blame the a-holes that dont respect neighboring property owners.

(No I havent and wont put up a high fence.)

As far as the threat of the high fences to drivers.. just how many beers have you had?:brew:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> So here's a question for you:
> 
> Is it the high fence or the size of the enclosure that's the issue?


tsk....their known as "outclosures" remember??:rotfl::rotfl:


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> tsk....their known as "outclosures" remember??:rotfl::rotfl:


I forgot, must be all the popcorn and beer:biggrin:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

State_Vet said:


> must be all the popcorn and beer:biggrin:


shhh...you'll get us in trouble again. We're not supposed to clutter up this thread with "bull..... about popcorn and beer" all it does is increase our post count and adds nothing to the subject...:bounce:


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## paulss (Aug 16, 2007)

Sorry, but if the issue han't been resolved in the first 100,000 threads on this and every other forum, it isn't going to be solved in this one.

Someone has WAAAAAAAAYYYYYYY too much time on their hands.

Merry Christmas and good hunting (on the high fence or low fence ranch of your choice)


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## Sumdog (Dec 23, 2010)

It is more difficult to hunt high fence than low fence. It takes way more of a sportsman to take a deer off a high fence place. Consider all the money you have to spend, the anxiety your body goes through looking at several 180 to 200inch deer wondering which one you can afford. Then the story you have to make up, to where it sounds like you actually had to stalk him for the kill. When actually you were in a tower blind with a heater, a guide, and a check book. That sound like fun to me. I might see if I could buy the deer and bring him home, and not shoot him. After all your just paying for the deer not the hunt.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

Boy... I guess it all boils down to “Who owns the deer.” Next it will be all bodies of water and "Who owns the fish" as soon as someone figures out how to do it.


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Management*

I think it is mostly just class envy. I hunt a 4,000 ac. low-fenced ranch in Edwards Co. We have been managing this place for 25 years. When I show video of hunts to friends that hunt non-managed ranches, they tell me that is not hunting, that is just shooting. Yes, I usually see 4-8 bucks each hunt, and some are nice deer. I guess because they see 1-2 bucks a year and shoot all of them, they are better hunters. We kill a max of 3 trophies off our lease every year, the rest are management and cull bucks. And we kill a ton of does. Two years ago, our neighbor's hunters (also 4,000 acres) killed 21 bucks over the Thanksgiving holiday. Nothing under 8 points. Very few mature bucks. If I could high-fence them out and let them manage their own deer would I? In a heartbeat. 
Everyone likes to say the deer belong to all of us. Then they hunt 40 acres and kill 10 deer. Really? Is that your herd density? How long can you keep doing that? As long as your big neighbor doesn't do the same. How many deer do you own? If high fences means you own the herd defacto, so be it. To each his/her own. 
RodgerB did you eat all of that popcorn?
Still enjoy an little humor being injected into this stupid thread.
BB


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> shhh...you'll get us in trouble again. We're not supposed to clutter up this thread with "bull..... about popcorn and beer" all it does is increase our post count and adds nothing to the subject...:bounce:


FORGOT AGAIN wouldn't want to make a worthless post to run up my post count and anger the "post monitor"


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

BigBuck said:


> RodgerB did you eat all of that popcorn?
> Still enjoy an little humor being injected into this stupid thread.
> BB


well said post - George has all the popcorn - and won't share, And then I've got Too Tall sitting in a corner carving green stuff from under neath his toe nails and wiping his bowie knife on my good couch...have a beer - they're cold.


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## hog (May 17, 2006)

Might as well open up​
Ranch Raised Cattle hunting.. 
​
Ya get more poundage of meat for the freezer too​


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## das71198 (Aug 12, 2005)

I do not have a problem with a land owner putting up a high fence. IMO - they just need to remove all deer that belongs to the people of the state of Texas & restock (purchase) with exotics as they wish. If I owned a significant amount of property I would probably high fence a section and do as I stated above. Again, this is my opinion. One quick question - is it ethically right for one person to make profits on game that belongs to the people of the state of Texas ( not free ranging animals ) that are trapped behind a fence? What are your thoughts??


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

and just where would you put all those deer you just displaced? if you're not careful you'll stress the herd in whatever location you put them in, causing over population and all the problems that go with it.

is it "ethically" right? depends on your ethics I suppose. I've no problem paying the land owner who spends his time, money and resources feeding that animal.
that's what's known as "capitalism". I don't and won't spend an enormous amount of money for something I don't get a certain level of enjoyment and satisfaction out of.

like I said before, not every high fence hunting operation is a slam dunk nor is it a cakewalk. I do prefer to have the opportunity to hunt low fence and have been fortunate enough to secure a good spot on a place in West Texas that is exactly that - low fence and enjoy hunting there either on foot or sometimes in a blind. sometimes I'll hunt near the feeder, sometimes not.
big buck and the others who've posted the same comment are right - to each his own. The laws are what they are, fences - high or low - are not going away. 
there's still plenty of hunting opportunities through TPWD for anyone who doesn't want to pay a landowner, either by getting drawn for one of the draw hunts or by paying the extra $40.00 for a public hunt permit to hunt the public lands where deer hunting is permitted. The national wildlife management areas in Texas offer deer hunting too. just send 'em a post card and you'll usually be successful. Last time I talked to those folks they said it almost wasn't worth the trouble to offer those hunts anymore because the number of requests are so small.
all the whining, griping and complaining that high fence ranch owners are "greedy" and how hunting is going down the tubes - that's simply not the case. If you want to hunt, and spend a little time and effort - you can find a place and/or opportunity.

heck, I was offered the possibility of hunting a place this year - low fence so don't get all het up about it - not too far south of San Antonio - great deer country - Big deer, for FREE - 300 plus acres - surrounded by approx 16,000 acres - just me - no other guns, no other hunters - I didn't take it. Not because it wasn't an AWESOME offer, but because I thought I might be able to find someone who really wanted to hunt but couldn't afford a lease like mine (and mine is pretty reasonable given the costs in the surrounding locations). so yeah, I found someone and he's having the time of his life - already taken a HUGE 10 point and maybe with some luck another before season ends.

it depends on how hard you try - but you can find a place.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

Johnboat said:


> By my calculation, your neighbors paid maybe $60K+ for the fence and you get a free high fence....and your 500 acres is just the right size for herd improvement at reasonable effort and cost according to my friend in a similar situation (but he had to pay 100% to high fence his 500 acre place).


Yeah, but I can't claim a low fence trophy. I hate those hi fence guys.


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

Kyle 1974 said:


> so how hard do you hunt on your low fence place.... with your trail cameras and corn feeders?
> 
> the deer don't know they are in a fence.
> 
> ...


kyle 1974
I'm not knocking high fences they have there purposes.just speaking to friends who hunt them that is there take on them also.They are just enjoying it while they can afford it or as long as it last.I really enjoy hunting public Land ,But the hunting is just to difficult for my family to enjoy with me.I have a lease and I do corn feed for the wife and kids.Public Land hunting has No feeder ,No Baiting"illegal to do so" and very little vehicle access.you really have to get off your butt and scout by logging many of miles on foot through the woods. and find ambush spots which in many instances you cant see 40yds. To me killing a buck that scores 150-160 on public land is much more rewarding to me than one behind a fence. I enjoy the hunt and how hard I hunt and scout.I don't depend on luck but it sure is nice to have it shine on you once in a while.:wink::wink:!!! Good luck to ya'll however you hunt becareful enjoy the outdoors and leave it as clean or cleaner than you found it.


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## Titus Bass (Dec 26, 2008)

State_Vet said:


> FORGOT AGAIN wouldn't want to make a worthless post to run up my post count and anger the "post monitor"





RogerB said:


> well said post - George has all the popcorn - and won't share, And then I've got Too Tall sitting in a corner carving green stuff from under neath his toe nails and wiping his bowie knife on my good couch...have a beer - they're cold.


You two post whores get out of here....


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Titus Bass said:


> You two post whores get out of here....


:rotfl::slimer:
have some popcorn Titus.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Titus Bass said:


> You two post whores get out of here....


calling me a post whore while you post a picture of a bunny with a pancake on his head...I guess he was raised behind a high fence?


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

funny how only really ****ty places with little to no management are considered "real hunting"... 

I guess I could talk to everyone on the lease... we could kill everything on it, then after a few years of complete annihilation of every living deer, a few would manage to come back in... then whoever got one of those, would be a REAL hunter!


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

Kyle 1974 said:


> State_Vet said:
> 
> 
> > So here's a question for you:
> ...


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

Kyle 1974 said:


> funny how only really ****ty places with little to no management are considered "real hunting"...
> 
> I guess I could talk to everyone on the lease... we could kill everything on it, then after a few years of complete annihilation of every living deer, a few would manage to come back in... then whoever got one of those, would be a REAL hunter!


 Yea I hear you. I guess it is just up to each of us to do what he feels is ethical. I do not think it is unethical to kill a deer high fenced in on a 1500 acre place. But I also dont like high fences for the reasons I stated earlier. I aint losing no sleep over it either way. I was raised hunting low fences and times are changing I guess. Might try the high fence thing soon, who knows? My Dad is against them, and I learned long ago that my father is a wise man, so I wont fault a man for not liking high fences. I wont fault a man who likes them either, unless it is the guy with 65 acres high fenced with one way trap gates and running a day lease operation, that IS UNETHICAL IMO!


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Sea-Slug said:


> Kyle 1974 said:
> 
> 
> > Deer are great swimmers. I have saw deer several times swimming in the open lake at PK and at Texoma., way out in the middle! I have saw deer on the big island at Texoma also. I got pics in here somewhere of the 8 point we saw swimming across PK near Hells Gate. We pulled right beside him in the boat. They can swim at least a few miles no problem.
> ...


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Sea-Slug said:


> I went spring turkey hunting on a high
> fence place near Ft. McCavitt my buddy owns. I did it because I figure turkey can fly over it so it is still fair chase. I never deer hunted on the place but I can if I want. I dont feel right about it for some reason. I did not mean the turkey were penned in with a roof. They just happened to be on the ranch with a game fence. They are still free ranging.


I know what you meant, just funnin ya. Would it be a sight to see some guy fence in 10 acres with a 50' tall turkey fence. PS. did you get any of that popcorn I keep hearing about ?


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

State_Vet said:


> Sea-Slug said:
> 
> 
> > So basically whether its manmade or natural chances are its not "deer proof"
> ...


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

sotol buster said:


> I know what you meant, just funnin ya. Would it be a sight to see some guy fence in 10 acres with a 50' tall turkey fence. PS. did you get any of that popcorn I keep hearing about ?


 I read a story once of some guy selling canned turkey hunts near Weathorford by pen raising gobblers with clipped wings and letting them go by his clients stands on a small place. People will do anything for money I guess. I think the guy got caught and arrested, I dont know if he was prosecuted or not.


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## Dagger Island Drifter (Oct 26, 2009)

*What is my ranch considered?*

I own a section of land in South Texas, my neighbors have put up high fences, so I have high fences on all sides, is my place considered high fenced? I have not paid for a single foot of high fence, so will the Boone and Crocket club accept my deer?


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

somewhere in all of this someone said they'd never seen a deer jump a high fence:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Dagger Island Drifter said:


> I own a section of land in South Texas, my neighbors have put up high fences, so I have high fences on all sides, is my place considered high fenced? I have not paid for a single foot of high fence, so will the Boone and Crocket club accept my deer?


I guess you'd have to ask B&C about that.


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## -D (Jul 13, 2010)

Someone needs to delete this Thread before some government employee see's it and the state decides we need to check every deer killed with them so the state can assess a trophy fee.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

-D said:


> Someone needs to delete this Thread before some government employee see's it and the state decides we need to check every deer killed with them so the state can assess a trophy fee.


My bet is its too late, one of them state government employees has probably already seen this thread.


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## RAYSOR (Apr 26, 2007)

My conclusion on my ranch that I have high fenced is this, Those that do not own a ranch want to and have high fenced for the protection of their investment, Those that do own a ranch are glad they have high fenced or wish they could, its pretty simple the good ole days of the deer hunting at the deer lease hoping to see a big one as we like to say are gone, get over it and move on,when you see a lot of quality deer for a session of stand sitting do you really think to yourself that you wish you were some where else hoping to see a buck that never existed but you keep hoping or do you get excited every time that one walks out and you learn the young from the old deer and can really see the quality in the herd, after absorbing this post I think know there is only one logical conclusion, unless you are just completely in denial.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

If high fences are here to stay, do you think the State is going to let the States’ deer population be controlled by high fences and not by them? With all the high fences going up to keep the deer in or out, eventually everybody is going to be high fenced whether they like it or not. I think you better have fun with the high fences while you still can! Kind a like moving the wet lands, but they just haven’t thought (power of money gets in the way) this through yet.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

how has the state lost control of high fenced ranches?


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

I guess they wouldn't let that happen!


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## RAYSOR (Apr 26, 2007)

State_Vet said:


> how has the state lost control of high fenced ranches?


Great reply! some folks must think there are separate rules for property owners with high fences, I can assure you there are not we all follow the same rules that the state regulates.


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## Main Frame 8 (Mar 16, 2007)

Not sure what happened to that post. 

Oh well, for those that say high fences are coming to all of us, tap the brakes. I would be surprised if the percentage of hunting land that is high fenced exceeds 5%. It may not surpass 1%.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

I just can’t see everyone having to high fence their acreage to claim a piece of Texas and “protect” what wildlife that’s left on their property. Hunting pressure will always drive off deer to a less pressured area. So, even if 100 acres is fed year round and then hunted hard the deer will move. So, the 10,000 acres right beside it, if not hunted just as hard will have all the deer as a safe haven. Also, the bucks won’t even show until the rut and you have to have the doe around for them so you can’t shoot the doe if you want a buck! So the argument for “protection” doesn’t stand, because if you don’t hunt just as hard, you’ll have all the deer by default. I think nature has a way of protecting itself and that high fences are just greed! I think the deer are either free ranging and belong to Texas or they are trapped by high fences and belong to the high fence trappers. Either way, with all the high fences going up, the State will come around and eventually have to make a decision on “its” free ranging deer or not.


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

I guess your same logic applies to goat proof fencing which restricts the movement of hogs , javalinas, coyotes, ect. because they too are are "free ranging" and owned by the citizens of Texas. 

Funny, I've never heard anyone complain about restricting the movement of hogs, it must be that old double standard


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## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

those of us who remember still long for 50's-60's deer huntin' where either an invite, jug of whiskey or 40 bucks got a feller a decent deer lease.
before TTH and B&C and bucks were judged by points and not "score".
before the money got in the way.
"sigh"


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

kweber said:


> those of us who remember still long for 50's-60's deer huntin' where either an invite, jug of whiskey or 40 bucks got a feller a decent deer lease.
> before TTH and B&C and bucks were judged by points and not "score".
> before the money got in the way.
> "sigh"


the boone and crockett club was founded in 1887. Kind of hard to blame them for the cost of deer hunting....

the reason it's expensive is because people will pay for it. There is no vast conspiracy. It's just what the market value of it is.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

Follow the money!


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

I just copy and pasted this statement from another earlier thread on basically the same subject that I posted about and I still stand by it:

I have very strong opinions on this subject and I think most on here that have been around the hunting board long enough know my feelings on the subject and I am totally against any *PRIVATIZATION* of any native wildlife in Texas, period! 

They, in my mind are no better than poachers that take away a resource thats owned "By the People of the State of Texas". Whether its by bullet or high fence that resource is no longer available to the adjoining lands. 

I for one do not need nor do I want another individual managing the resource for me or another land owner. You want to own those deer or other native wildlife, no problem either remove all native wildlife from your land or pay the restitution fees to the "People Of The State Of Texas" for each and every native animal thats been fenced in just as a poacher has to do for removing that resource and we will call it good! 

I bet, I would probably pay a few fines and spend some time in a jail cell if I went out to my duck/goose lease and rocket netted a few hundred ducks and or geese and then penned them up and for a fee allowed hunters to come in and kill their limits? Heck, I could even go in and put some leg and neck bands on a few to really charge a pretty penny for those trophy birds!!! Whats the problem? They were on my land and in my roost pond!?!?!?

If it ever comes to the point of me having to decide whether to hunt a high fenced place or not hunting at all because thats all their is, then I will place my rifles and bows in the safe and tell my son of times when the deer I hunted didn't have tags in their ears, pedigrees, or names! Although, on the up side, I will have MUCH MORE time to fish or duck hunt. At least, until someone finds out a way to privatize those as well.

PEACE OUT!


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

nice post txdrake... so essentially, you're against private organization of hunting... unless it's your own lease. Then it's fine. 


awesome.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Kyle 1974 said:


> nice post txdrake... so essentially, you're against private organization of hunting... unless it's your own lease. Then it's fine.
> 
> awesome.


Kyle,

You might want to go back to that cow college and figure out how the word *PRIVATIZATION* in my statement is being used in this context. I am not on a lease that is high fenced so no I am not privatizing the deer hunting for me, my group or customers and no I am not selling any hunts from any high fenced enclosures. By the way, the lease I'm on is in a Co-Op (might want to look that one up, by the way its an Abbreviation) and it works great for growing big deer without the need for high fencing.


Awesome, Dude!!! Even you should be able to figure it out, eventually. You might want to lay off the Tea, Bud!


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## broadonrod (Feb 26, 2010)

PoPcOrN!!! In HaNd !!!:work:hwell::headknockrosesm Its still Christmas (Merry Christmas to all.........


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

TXDRAKE said:


> Kyle,
> 
> You might want to go back to that cow college and figure out how the word *PRIVATIZATION* in my statement is being used in this context. I am not on a lease that is high fenced so no I am not privatizing the deer hunting for me, my group or customers and no I am not selling any hunts from any high fenced enclosures. By the way, the lease I'm on is in a Co-Op (might want to look that one up, by the way its an Abbreviation) and it works great for growing big deer without the need for high fencing.
> 
> Awesome, Dude!!! Even you should be able to figure it out, eventually. You might want to lay off the Tea, Bud!


Why can't you be more like Mike? LOL!


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

TXDRAKE said:


> Kyle,
> 
> You might want to go back to that cow college and figure out how the word *PRIVATIZATION* in my statement is being used in this context. I am not on a lease that is high fenced so no I am not privatizing the deer hunting for me, my group or customers and no I am not selling any hunts from any high fenced enclosures. By the way, the lease I'm on is in a Co-Op (might want to look that one up, by the way its an Abbreviation) and it works great for growing big deer without the need for high fencing.
> 
> Awesome, Dude!!! Even you should be able to figure it out, eventually. You might want to lay off the Tea, Bud!


are you on a "private" lease, which has some some of contract with a "private" land owner?

you're against HF hunting... fine. If you're against "privatization" of hunting, then you might want to review your stance on land ownership in general. Or just read the definition of privatize. It doesn't have anything to do with a high fence. By your own agreement with a land owner, you ARE participating in the "privatization" of hunting. ...

here's a link to webster's definition. Imagine that... it doesn't have anything to do with high fences. dont tell me they didn't even call before they published this?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/privatize


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

I have read in several post "the fence is to keep the other deer out" <<TOTAL BS<< plain n simple, 99% of the high fence ranches started with trying to get all the deer they could inside ANYWAY they could, some were very illegal. I know from exper that many men have become great deer hunters once inside a high fence operation, what, you don't believe it, just go ask one, if you still don't believe it, they got the 165B&C on the wall for Gods sake and if that don't make them a bonified deer hunter then WHAT does, oh yea it don't count against them if they still don't know how to load the gun they shot that glourious day. I have some old Taxidermy pics from the late 50s n early 60s of some deer with exceptional racks and after reading all the above, I have no idea how they had this big of horns with NO management practices No high fences and no deer where you pay by the inch....WW


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## Encinal (Jan 18, 2008)

For all the complaining about fences etc, very few people have been worried about the animal's ability to evade.

It's all about the animal not being available for THEM to shoot.

TXDRAKE, You have no idea about the consequences of your beliefs... If HF landowners were made to pay restitution for deer they would then OWN them and the state would be unable to regulate their harvests etc... That is the last thing the state wants or needs.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

I heard deer in a high fence have their eyesight and hearing damaged intentionally to make it easier to shoot them too.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Kyle 1974 said:


> I heard deer in a high fence have their eyesight and hearing damaged intentionally to make it easier to shoot them too.


Only if on the 'juice', a few 'ranches' you don't need a gun >>just a handfull of corn and a ball peen hammer, I have mounted several of these animals, some with a tatoo in the ear....WW


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## workn2huntnfish (Aug 1, 2008)

Dagger Island Drifter said:


> I own a section of land in South Texas, my neighbors have put up high fences, so I have high fences on all sides, is my place considered high fenced? I have not paid for a single foot of high fence, so will the Boone and Crocket club accept my deer?


Great question! But, since you will have one side open, you are still considered free ranging, in most cases. Of course, there are those that will leave an opening the size of a walkway and that deer would not be allowed in the book.


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## workn2huntnfish (Aug 1, 2008)

TXDRAKE said:


> I just copy and pasted this statement from another earlier thread on basically the same subject that I posted about and I still stand by it:
> 
> I have very strong opinions on this subject and I think most on here that have been around the hunting board long enough know my feelings on the subject and I am totally against any *PRIVATIZATION* of any native wildlife in Texas, period!
> 
> ...


 Outstanding comment.


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## sasquatch (Jul 8, 2008)

RAYSOR said:


> My conclusion on my ranch that I have high fenced is this, Those that do not own a ranch want to and have high fenced for the protection of their investment, Those that do own a ranch are glad they have high fenced or wish they could, its pretty simple the good ole days of the deer hunting at the deer lease hoping to see a big one as we like to say are gone, get over it and move on,when you see a lot of quality deer for a session of stand sitting do you really think to yourself that you wish you were some where else hoping to see a buck that never existed but you keep hoping or do you get excited every time that one walks out and you learn the young from the old deer and can really see the quality in the herd, after absorbing this post I think know there is only one logical conclusion, unless you are just completely in denial.


What part of their investment are they protecting with the high fence?


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

sasquatch said:


> What part of their investment are they protecting with the high fence?


Protein, time, management???


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## sasquatch (Jul 8, 2008)

boomgoon said:


> Protein, time, management???


 Protein?? Management?? Oh, that they are feeding to the deer that DON'T belong to them. The land is their investment, not the wildlife that resides on it. That is the point.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

sasquatch said:


> Protein?? Management?? Oh, that they are feeding to the deer that DON'T belong to them. The land is their investment, not the wildlife that resides on it. That is the point.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

wet dreams said:


> I have no idea how they had this big of horns with NO management practices No high fences and no deer where you pay by the inch....WW


Several 100,000 less hunters and a considerably lower statewide population would be my guess.


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

I have not read all the reply's, but i will say this. As soon as I get the current owner of this section totally convinced, it will be high fenced. We are tired of feeding them till they reach 13"s at 2 and go to jump the fence, then catch a bullet before they hit the other side. We are red dirt with great brush and in 50 yrs. have never shot a deer over 141". No mature deer.
If we high fence and the state wants their deer they can come get them,and would be doing us a favor. Get these 60 yrs of shot down South Texas genetics off this place. Save me the bullets. 
Forever it's been, if there was a 2 yr. old ten and a 4 yr. old eight, The hunter says "WOW a ten point, BOOM". Sad
We have a small place on the back side, if they want to shoot a thousand deer(brothers,sisters,mom,dad, uncles, aunts, grandpa,grandma,cousins, and ALL the friends of all the above they can fit on the fencline) then they can.
NO Sir, we are done with low fence. I don't even bother going out anymore. Texas needs to go with a per acre deer harvest like Mexico.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Bukkskin said:


> Texas needs to go with a per acre deer harvest like Mexico.


 I agree 100%. That's one of the biggest problems... 10 people on 200 acres shooting the **** out of everything, then *****ing about the 13" rule, or the "rich guy" on the high fence place that lets deer walk that they would love to shoot, etc... etc..


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

All I am saying is anybody that can shoot can kill a big deer behind high fence it's as simple as that. There isn't much hunting its just waiting you know Darn well a big deer will come by sooner or later ! How hard is that. LOL !!!!


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## Shaky (May 21, 2004)

Spex said:


> All I am saying is anybody that can shoot can kill a big deer behind high fence it's as simple as that. There isn't much hunting its just waiting you know Darn well a big deer will come by sooner or later ! How hard is that. LOL !!!!


Ive been on both sides of this argument. But will disagree with you here.

Its not near as easy as it looks. Lots of bucks never show themselves even on a high fenced place. Tons of cover in a 2500 acre high fenced ranch.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Too Tall said:


> Several 100,000 less hunters and a considerably lower statewide population would be my guess.


This is true BUT there were NOT near the number of deer as today not even close....WW


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

wet dreams said:


> This is true BUT there were NOT near the number of deer as today not even close....WW


and of course, that wouldn't have anything to do with fenced hunting, game management and leasing now would it?


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Spex said:


> All I am saying is anybody that can shoot can kill a big deer behind high fence it's as simple as that. There isn't much hunting its just waiting you know Darn well a big deer will come by sooner or later ! How hard is that. LOL !!!!


speaking from experience? or hearsay? I know several high fence hunting ranches that offer "no kill, no pay" why? because it's not as easy as you think. These places won't let you shoot the first 1.5 to 3.5 year old deer you see just to satisfy your manhood.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Kyle 1974 said:


> I agree 100%. That's one of the biggest problems... 10 people on 200 acres shooting the **** out of everything, then *****ing about the 13" rule, or the "rich guy" on the high fence place that lets deer walk that they would love to shoot, etc... etc..


yup.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

kweber said:


> those of us who remember still long for 50's-60's deer huntin' where either an invite, jug of whiskey or 40 bucks got a feller a decent deer lease.
> before TTH and B&C and bucks were judged by points and not "score".
> before the money got in the way.
> "sigh"


yeah, I remember those days. I remember my Uncle's neighbors who owned ranches talking about the drunks that destroyed the land, killing anything in sight, and if it wasn't big enough to "thump their chest" about back home, just leaving it to rot. Hunting camps that were filthy at the end of the season, creeks polluted by human waste and trash, fires started because "city boy" didn't understand you don't leave your camp fire burning when you're done and decide to leave, fence lines cut because it was easier to get from pasture A to pasture B. Yeah - "the good ol' days". game shot and killed because "if it's brown it's down".

and for what it's worth - with a little work you can still get those places if you get to know the rancher, take care of his property like it was yours, offer to help around the ranch rather than just strip it of it's game and destroy it's habitat. Contrary to the comments here about "all about the money" it's more than just that. Sure, ranchers supplement their yearly income with hunting lease money. It IS their land after all, and they aren't obligated to give you free access to their ranch and it's game any more than you're obligated to give me free access to your house and your freezer - unless of course you believe in "share the wealth".


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

can i just ask a honest question...

to the guys that complain about HF and say it isn't real "hunting"

why is it all about the "big buck", if you are truley hunting, shouldn't it just be about shooting a deer, period?

on the outside of the fence, are you happy seeing what you see or are you buying into the trophy hunting aspect as well by complaining there are no "deer" or "big bucks" to shoot outside of the fence?


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Ya know I hunt about 2700 acres hi fenced. I have deer on game cameras that I have never seen. There is deer that have been seen once or twice but never lately (hunting seasson). Yes we let nice young deer walk to grow up and shoot the over the hill gang. I guess its all about management to let the deer reach their potential. No imported deer all local genetics. And no its not my property we lease it. Wish I could afford to have some property of my own like that. And yes, I would hi fence it.
The only time the deer (buck) knows he is hi fenced is when he caint get to that hot doe on the other side.

Too Tall, 
I like butter on my popcorn and my beer cold.. and caffene free diet coke with my rum.

Charlie


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I know this much, growing up it was about the biggest deer in my family. Not necessarily the biggest buck. from age 12 until I joined the Army at age 17 and the 6 hunting seasons I got to enjoy on the ranch my uncle was foreman on I was fortunate enough to take 4 bucks and two doe. The doe? one field dressed 95lbs (hill country doe, near Camp Wood Texas) I remember her as much as I do the bucks I took - I had to pack her out of the hills, 5 miles to the truck after tracking her for over 2 hours. Every deer was a trophy, but none of them would be worthy of a spot on the walls of some of the people who post here. I only kept the antlers on one buck, my last one. My Dad had a good friend who would process the game into sausage, linked and breakfast sausage, cut and wrap the rest - his price was the hides and the antlers. for my family it was a good deal, boiled hide and roasted antlers don't go far at the dinner table. 

I'm still that way, I don't have set of antlers over 130 I would guess and that's fine, the deer I've shot are big deer and mature deer - most from low fence leases and a few from high fence large ranches in excess of 5,000 acres, only one came from a high fence ranch of less than 1,000 acres. I'll match my hunting skills against anyone here - but if you expect the "result" to be who shot the biggest antlered deer - you'll have to find someone else to compete against. for me - it's about the hunt - the challenge and the sheer enjoyment of being outdoors. 

I've taken one buck and one doe this year - on a 23,000 acre high fence ranch. I've not harvested anything on my lease yet - I've seen plenty - every time I've been out - but what I've seen isn't old enough yet to even consider - I won't shoot something just to have bragging rights - not my style. I've seen one 8 point that was pretty nice and maybe 3.5 or 4 - and have a couple of game pics of a 10 point that's maybe 2.5 years old. with a little luck - maybe no one will see these guys and they'll have a chance to grow a little older - pass along their blood lines and in another year or so maybe make a mistake and find themselves staring at me in the brush.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

CHARLIE said:


> Ya know I hunt about 2700 acres hi fenced. I have deer on game cameras that I have never seen. There is deer that have been seen once or twice but never lately (hunting seasson). Yes we let nice young deer walk to grow up and shoot the over the hill gang.
> 
> Charlie


didn't ya hear Charlie? - that' 'cause you didn't wait long enough - don't you know? - them deer just don't know what to do with a high fence "penning" them in - they don't know how to escape and evade, how to hide, they're just like ducks on a pond - after all, that's what all these "experts" say who don't like high fence hunting :rotfl:


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Anybody know a good consultant on ranching for the money? I keep hearing people are doing it for the money. I been successful enough in other fields to earn enough to pay for a couple of ranches but can't seem to turn the corner in the deer ranching business. I sell hunts but always wind up pulling money out of my pocket to run the ranch. I wish one of these people that say landowners do it for the money would buy me out and show me how it's done.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

CHARLIE said:


> Ya know I hunt about 2700 acres hi fenced. I have deer on game cameras that I have never seen. There is deer that have been seen once or twice but never lately (hunting seasson). Yes we let nice young deer walk to grow up and shoot the over the hill gang. I guess its all about management to let the deer reach their potential. No imported deer all local genetics. And no its not my property we lease it. Wish I could afford to have some property of my own like that. And yes, I would hi fence it.
> The only time the deer (buck) knows he is hi fenced is when he caint get to that hot doe on the other side.
> 
> Too Tall,
> ...


Butter, cold and caffeine free. Got it.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Too Tall said:


> Butter, cold and caffeine free. Got it.


I guess I better git off my butt and go buy some more popcorn - state_vet ate all we had. Should I get salted or unsalted butter??


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

M16 said:


> Anybody know a good consultant on ranching for the money?.


have some popcorn - one of these high-fence "haters" will be along directly to tell you just how evil and how rich you are.


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

.... still .... ?!?!?! Really .... ! Damnit that's a lot of 2 dollar bills ....


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> .... still .... ?!?!?! Really .... ! Damnit that's a lot of 2 dollar bills ....


so you finally decided to show up again?? I feel sorry for ya "son" you owe a TON of money


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Yeah for real ... wow. Got sent home sick last week and just now sat back down on the computer. I've not yet connected the computer in the new house. Plus, if I had a 2cool connection at home I'd probably be divorced.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Not a hater but , I've seen first hand on both sides both lrg and small enclosures, I have no problem with most of the lrg acreage 1000+ high fence properties. I do have a problem with the way a few lrg and most small ones operate, like I said before all you need for some is a handfull of corn and a hammer. BTW I have hunted AND taken deer inside a 15k HF ranch in Del Rio and turned down trips on a cpl of 500 acre ranches that WERE canned...WW


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

wet dreams said:


> turned down trips on a cpl of 500 acre ranches that WERE canned...WW


and you know this how?? I've seen 500 acres plots of land that should really be 1500 acres if they were flattened out they would be.
I'm not for canned hunts at all - but I'd like to know how you know this to be true.


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## RAYSOR (Apr 26, 2007)

RogerB said:


> so you finally decided to show up again?? I feel sorry for ya "son" you owe a TON of money


Funny!


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## cpthook (Jan 16, 2008)

*Its simple*

I personally don't hunt HF however, If you have the money and land have at it and enjoy life. If you don't you are probably jealous so let it be, don't worry about it, and do your own deal. It's like driving a Bentley, if you have the money and thats your deal enjoy it, if you don't drive your junk and let it be.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

cpthook said:


> I personally don't hunt HF however, If you have the money and land have at it and enjoy life. If you don't you are probably jealous so let it be, don't worry about it, and do your own deal. It's like driving a Bentley, if you have the money and thats your deal enjoy it, if you don't drive your junk and let it be.


yup.


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## tufffish (May 11, 2006)

osoobsessed said:


> it's funny, everyone says "the deer belong to the state"....so what happens when i hit a deer on a public road way in our great state and try to get my money reimbursed for expenses paid to fix my truck...LOL
> 
> nobody claims them, then. :cheers:


slow down.... the deer has just as much right to be out as you do.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

tufffish said:


> slow down.... the deer has just as much right to be out as you do.


so last month I stopped dead in the middle of the road 'cause there were about a dozen deer running back and forth across the highway. One of those deer ran smack into the side of my suburban - do I sue the people of the state of Texas for reckless endangerment and failing to control "their" animals? just askin'


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

tufffish said:


> slow down.... the deer has just as much right to be out as you do.


why slow down, i'm doing the posted speed limit in broad daylight, good driving conditions on roads i pay taxes for.

point i was trying to make, although sarcastic a little was, everyone "claims" the deer belong to the people of the state....so why not pony up and pay for the damages on my truck due to negligence on "your" deer's part. :work: :slimer:


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

It's considered an act of God.


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## Marshman (Jul 24, 2008)

Been kinda sitting here and following this the last few days. Lots of good posts.... lots of emotion, some facts... some more emotion.

I DID enjoy reading the posts about ranching for money and needing a consultant to do it, that was great!

I am not sure that most of the HF haters have ever been on one, or have had the experience that some here have had, managing a property, in spite of the hunters on it, the neighbors next to it, the rain that doesn't ( or does sigh...) fall on it. 

As far as the original premise, that the deer belong to the state, that kinda got lost. Speaking as a HF guy, one of things we least want, are the deer on the place already. Most of what is there is there because it wasn't a trophy or had no potential to be one. We have a pile of permits to cull this this year, and it is the HARDEST thing to get people to shoot does and spikes. We end up setting up a couple hunt weekends with a handful of guys that shoot well and taking the bulk of them then. I have had to put a deal in place for the kids - OK to shoot your trophy, but you gotta shoot does afterwards, no sleeping in cuz you got yours.

Bottom line for me ( and I respect your decision regarding HF, be different than mine) is that we can't manage our land without HF around it. Sometimes it is tough with it, like the neighbors lessee's opening our gates and herding critters thru it. I have hunted lots of low fence, and have a couple B&C bucks from those days as well. Funny thing is..... these days, I get more satisfaction from watching someone else shoot something special, than I do shooting it myself. I get a bang out of shooting pigs and culling probably more than shooting a trophy. Watching a kid or friend do well is way better for sure..... it ain't about the fence, that is way down the list, on the whole of things.

One thing I have noticed, the more high fences in the area, the less illegals tromping through. I guess they avoid areas with lots of fence, so as to keep a low profile. Anybody else see this?


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Marshman said:


> One thing I have noticed, the more high fences in the area, the less illegals tromping through. I guess they avoid areas with lots of fence, so as to keep a low profile. Anybody else see this?


good post! - as for the last paragraph, I've heard the same thing from other folks who have HF. one thing for sure, if Border Patrol catches them inside a ranch it's a lot easier to jump a low fence than climb a high fence.


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## wacker (Mar 22, 2006)

WOW, Can't believe this horse is still alive.LOL 

Polish the bubble on your helo, mend your nets and get to trapping cuz I think the white tail trapping season ends late March.:work:


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

RogerB said:


> good post! - as for the last paragraph, I've heard the same thing from other folks who have HF. one thing for sure, if Border Patrol catches them inside a ranch it's a lot easier to jump a low fence than climb a high fence.


yeah, but that shouldn't count. THey should let them free since it wasn't a fair chase.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Kyle 1974 said:


> THey should let them free since it wasn't a fair chase.


:rotfl::rotfl:


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## fillet (Dec 2, 2010)

I cant believe this post is still going I think yall are just som bored SOB's and just want something to argue about. Why dont we all just put up medium fences and buy the world a coke and sing in perfect harmony.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

fillet said:


> I cant believe this post is still going I think yall are just som bored SOB's and just want something to argue about. Why dont we all just put up medium fences and buy the world a coke and sing in perfect harmony.


coke ruins crown, mmmmmmmmmmmmkay! :slimer:


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

osoobsessed said:


> can i just ask a honest question...
> 
> to the guys that complain about HF and say it isn't real "hunting"
> 
> ...


I don't know who you are refering to.But I am happy seeing what i see.I mainly hunt public land but do have a lease further away than I care to drive every weekend.I also consider myself a trophy hunter. I only shoot deer that are truely mature or trophies for where I hunt. I don't expect to kill a 200" deer. But as stated I truely enjoy the hunt more than anything.But I am not knocking high fences well some any way.


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

Let me ask this Question. How many people on here think that all these hunting shows and videos are really hunted fairly?"Food for thought" Most all of those hunts are High fenced canned hunts anybody who denies that is kidding themselves.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

RogerB said:


> and you know this how?? I've seen 500 acres plots of land that should really be 1500 acres if they were flattened out they would be.
> I'm not for canned hunts at all - but I'd like to know how you know this to be true.


My dad started a Taxidermist buss in Beaumont in the mid 50s till late 70s, I got layed off in 81 from the RR, asked him to help me start the business back up, we did and my bro still runs the shop today. With about 50+ yrs in the Taxidermist Bus along with 25 yrs processing and one that got and still gets more buss than ANYONE between E Houston n Baton Rouge >>I can say I have done work for more than a few hunters and ranchers some good and some NOT. We have done work for a cpl that ended up doing some Fed time, both had a small HF operations. In the last 10 yrs my bro has mounted over 100 animals that came from the same lrg acreage HF operation in ?????? with ONE client spending up to 20K per whitetail sometimes up to 5 20K$ animals a yr not to mention the others as he would contract 20 deer a yr, this ranch is one were all you need is a hammer. We also mounted 150 animals yearly for 3-4 yrs that came off the LaFonda ranch which is a 15K HF ranch in Del Rio, I have nothing but respect for the guys at LaFonda and the owners. So RogerB I speak from what I have saw and encountered, some mite say " your biting the hand that feeds you" BUT I'm not one bit scared to speak my mind....WW


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

Spex said:


> I don't know who you are refering to.But I am happy seeing what i see.I mainly hunt public land but do have a lease further away than I care to drive every weekend.I also consider myself a trophy hunter. I only shoot deer that are truely mature or trophies for where I hunt. I don't expect to kill a 200" deer. But as stated I truely enjoy the hunt more than anything.But I am not knocking high fences well some any way.


it was just a general question among the people that truely dislike HF ranches, especially the ones that say it's "ruining hunting", wasn't directing it at you specifically.

seems you and me agree on lots of points in your post, i hunt for the pursuit and the overall exp....i personally don't hunt HF, but only because i can't afford it, but i don't knock the guys that do.

and honestly, there are some HF canned places i don't care for and they give the honest large HF ranches some black eyes, especially when it comes from people who have never been in or on a true HF ranch hunt.



Spex said:


> Let me ask this Question. How many people on here think that all these hunting shows and videos are really hunted fairly?"Food for thought" Most all of those hunts are High fenced canned hunts anybody who denies that is kidding themselves.


you can't really compare the 2 equally....the TV hunting shows are just that, TV...what you don't see is all the prep work that goes into a 30min segment and what has been edited out.

look at the Lakowski's for example, they have a few farms they manage well and hunt, they have the same bucks year after year and let them grow, they are NO FENCE, but they provide ample graze, food, water and bedding area, so those deer don't have to leave, just short of being "conditioned"....kind of like a LOT of South Texas ranches, example is our lease in Encino, it's bordered by the KR 3 sides, LF, but....we can corn the roads and by the time you get to the end, the sendero is covered in deer with a mix of doe and bucks.

i have met a few TV personalities over the years, they hunt just as hard as most here do as well and some that do hunt HF are hunting places like Indian Head Ranch out of Del Rio and that's 10,000 acres of TOUGH country.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Well folks I am going to try and get away tomorrow to go hunting. Its a hi fenced place and I have been hunting this nice deer all year and havent seen him yet. He has been seen twice by others who didnt get a chance at him. So really its not like shooting fish in a barrel. With the rut going on there is no telling where he may be. Wish me luck Another thought there is one that has been seen on game camera before the season that no one has seen. I would like to find him too.. 

Charlie


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Good Luck Charlie! I'm heading out tomorrow afternoon to Del Rio and my lease near Comstock, hope that big 'un finds its way to your spot. 
Happy New Year!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

wet dreams said:


> RogerB I speak from what I have saw and encountered, some mite say " your biting the hand that feeds you" BUT I'm not one bit scared to speak my mind....WW


and I appreciate the feedback. I'm not about to defend every HF operation we all know there are plenty that border on the illegal, there are some that are legit as well.



Spex said:


> Let me ask this Question. How many people on here think that all these hunting shows and videos are really hunted fairly?"Food for thought" Most all of those hunts are High fenced canned hunts anybody who denies that is kidding themselves.


no comment - I know a little about this subject but I won't comment beyond stating that these are what they are "tv shows" entertainment, designed to keep you watching.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

CHARLIE said:


> Well folks I am going to try and get away tomorrow to go hunting. Its a hi fenced place and I have been hunting this nice deer all year and havent seen him yet. He has been seen twice by others who didnt get a chance at him. So really its not like shooting fish in a barrel. With the rut going on there is no telling where he may be. Wish me luck Another thought there is one that has been seen on game camera before the season that no one has seen. I would like to find him too..
> 
> Charlie


good luck Charlie....i gotta guide Thursday and Friday, then i might head to Falls City to pop a doe or 2, then run down to the family lease in Encino Monday Tuesday Wed. :cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Falls City? - do you know about Pollaks meat market? that's where I have my venison sausage made every year - I know there's some great places that make venison sausage, and some great recipes but this place does an awesome job.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

RogerB said:


> Falls City? - do you know about Pollaks meat market? that's where I have my venison sausage made every year - I know there's some great places that make venison sausage, and some great recipes but this place does an awesome job.


oh ya! i stop there and at (i can't spell it) Veeatricks there in Poth every time i go to my uncle's rancho. :texasflag


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Hunt*

Good luck to you Charlie, be sure and post pics when you return. I am heading for my LF lease in Rocksprings this afternoon, will be there through the weekend. I only have culls left to shoot, and maybe a doe or 2. Good luck to everyone this weekend, LF or HF.
BB


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

I can't believe I don't hear crickets chirping when I open this thread ...


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> oh ya! i stop there and at (i can't spell it) Veeatricks there in Poth every time i go to my uncle's rancho. :texasflag


Wiatreks maybe? I've stopped there once or twice. Their summer sausage with cheese and Jalapeno is among the best I've found.
http://www.wiatreksmeatmarket.com/smeats.html

We've had Pollaks making our venison link sausage now for 17 years - won't go anywhere else.


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## fillet (Dec 2, 2010)

Spex said:


> Let me ask this Question. How many people on here think that all these hunting shows and videos are really hunted fairly?"Food for thought" Most all of those hunts are High fenced canned hunts anybody who denies that is kidding themselves.


 All hunting shows are fair how could you deny that and all the products they are pushing are real you just pour the miracle mixture on the ground and a 200" buck will come running to lick it up didnt you see it on film how could you deny it. I can tell you for fact I personally poured out some greens enraged on the ground this year and the cows on my place loved it I never saw ten dollars disappear so fast and I was bow hunting had those beast at 15 yards I could have got them all but I left them to grow bigger proper game management is a must. Oh by the way I developed special corn that only trophy bucks eat you just pour it out and you will have your pick of monsters I will start selling it soon the price will be 50 dollars a pound just pm me your credit card # experation date and proof code found on the back of your card and I will send you some your address is optional.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

but they only work if you buy those 150.00 sets of camo, odor free, "invisible to deer" clothes - I've always wondered how it was ever possible for anyone to ever get a deer in the days before charcoal embedded, camo clothes. I still hunt in a comfortable hunting shirt (sometimes it has a camo pattern, most times is what's now called "forest green), a pair of blue jeans and my huntin' boots. I'm usually pretty successful - in or out of the blind.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

RogerB said:


> Wiatreks maybe? I've stopped there once or twice. Their summer sausage with cheese and Jalapeno is among the best I've found.
> http://www.wiatreksmeatmarket.com/smeats.html
> 
> We've had Pollaks making our venison link sausage now for 17 years - won't go anywhere else.


that be the one! told you i couldn't spell it! 

they have a mean slab of fajitas for the grill as well. :cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> t
> 
> they have a mean slab of fajitas for the grill as well. :cheers:


note to self: put fajita meat on the grocery list. Thanks!


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## Spex (Aug 20, 2009)

Charlie Good luck Hunting I hope that the buck you are after makes his finale mistake !! Let us know how you do


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

RogerB said:


> note to self: put fajita meat on the grocery list. Thanks!


just tell the sweet lady behind the counter to please tenderize them for you...they are awesome! :cheers:


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

RogerB said:


> but they only work if you buy those 150.00 sets of camo, odor free, "invisible to deer" clothes - I've always wondered how it was ever possible for anyone to ever get a deer in the days before charcoal embedded, camo clothes. I still hunt in a comfortable hunting shirt (sometimes it has a camo pattern, most times is what's now called "forest green), a pair of blue jeans and my huntin' boots. I'm usually pretty successful - in or out of the blind.


I'm a bow only guy and u better have your stuff oder free or u ain't gonna see nothin! I hunted on the ground in a couple bushes in Menard this year and had a buck within 10ft of me just before sun up and he never new I was there. I was camo from head to toe with a face mask and plenty of Scent killer on. I don't go in the woods without it. Once he was 25 yards away I had to ground check him. I know what u mean though.


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## "Dawn till Dusk" (Dec 28, 2010)

First time blogger, long time observer!!!! Frankly this whole thread has been silly to say the least. Bottom line is opinions are like rearends, everybody has one. "different strokes for different folks". I personally dont hunt high fences. But if a man or woman are within the law and want to hunt {kill** in a high fence so be it. thats what makes this nation and state such a great place. Freedom!!!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> just tell the sweet lady behind the counter to please tenderize them for you...they are awesome! :cheers:


thanks I'll do that



devil1824 said:


> I'm a bow only guy and u better have your stuff oder free or u ain't gonna see nothin!


well, I reckon I better destroy those racks I have from bow hunting - without camo, without scent kill.  I don't bow hunt anymore, used to but bad knees have slowed me up a touch, once they get replaced I may have to pick it up again. And no - I don't hunt with camo or scent killer -maybe it works, maybe it doesn't - but I don't need it.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

devil1824 said:


> I'm a bow only guy and u better have your stuff oder free or u ain't gonna see nothin! I hunted on the ground in a couple bushes in Menard this year and had a buck within 10ft of me just before sun up and he never new I was there. I was camo from head to toe with a face mask and plenty of Scent killer on. I don't go in the woods without it. Once he was 25 yards away I had to ground check him. I know what u mean though.


you would hate me then, i have smoked cigs in my tree stand (tripod) and had deer 20 yards away from me and never knew i was there....course screwed up and missed a doe at 10 yards, but hey, who's watching! 

it's all about playing the wind. :cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> it's all about playing the wind. :cheers:


exactly


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## jamrice (Mar 6, 2010)

The response to this issue is simple and can actually be applied to many things now a days. The fact is, THIS COUNTRY IS BROKE!!!! And Texas along with every other state is looking for ways to find money.
Simply put, high fence hunts on ranches bring in more money than low fenced hunts.
I hate this, but it is true. 
Hunting is big business!
It isn't about hunting, its about MONEY. 
Hunting today isn't like it was when I was younger. We had tons of place to hunt and it just wasn't as expensive as it is today. I love the hunting channel, however look at all those sponsors, who do you think they are,,,,,, they are businesses trying to grow the market. And they just aren't going to get people excited enough to buy their equipment and gear to shoot a spike. everyone wants a trophy. Its actually very sad,,,, but as we now say, it's "the new normal".


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

jamrice,
so how do you explain that high fence hunting has been around for some time now? I know a few owners of HF operations and I don't see them driving new cars, making tons of money either. hunting, like a lot of other pasttimes has gone up in price - just the nature of the beast so to speak. I'll disagree with everyone about one thing though - we STILL have tons of places to hunt - look at the stats from the past few years posted by TPWD on public hunting harvest and the stats from the public draw system. There's no where near the number of animals harvested that TPWD would like to see harvested. There's also plenty of standby spots every year for most of the lottery hunts. 
And like I said in an earlier thread - there's plenty of public land available to hunt for the price of a $40.00 public hunting permit along with your hunting license. That includes deer hunting as well. 
There's another problem I see all the time - convenience - how many hunters want to travel to hunt? most I see want to drive an hour or so from their house to the lease and hunt. If you're willing to put the effort out, you can find good quality hunting - it depends on your commitment and your desire to hunt. I've been fortunate - I've not had to travel more than 4 hours one way to hunt most years. This year I did travel 6 hours one way - and got an awesome 8 point buck and doe. I'm gonna do the same thing next year and in addition to that I'll still have my lease (approx 4 hour drive one way). 
my total cost for hunting lease and trips this year is approx 3K - that includes hunts for two grandsons and my son (Christmas Gift) - total harvest for 4 hunters? 4 bucks (all management bucks three 8 pointers and one 7 point), two doe - still got a couple of days left - might get another doe or that old spike that everyone has been seeing - he's 4.5 and spikes are 8-10 inches I hope he makes a mistake and comes my way. 

and for anyone who thinks 3k is too much - that's fine - I've done it for less and had as much success. it depends on what you want and how hard you want to work at it.

and by the way - good post jamrice.


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## Dagger Island Drifter (Oct 26, 2009)

workn2huntnfish said:


> Great question! But, since you will have one side open, you are still considered free ranging, in most cases. Of course, there are those that will leave an opening the size of a walkway and that deer would not be allowed in the book.


I Have a easement through one ranch to get to mine, I actually have 5 ranches that touch my fence line, so I am completely high fenced on all sides but have not paid for a foot of it, I ask again, is my section of land considered high fenced?


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I guess you'd have to ask TPWD or B&C. not your fence so I'm not sure how that works. 
sounds like you saved some money on fences posts and wire though.


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## Dagger Island Drifter (Oct 26, 2009)

Yes sir, there is perfectly good three strand barbed wire fence with brand new high fence built right next to it.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

I just love the guys caught up in the cammo thing deer hunting. Thats another "people" thing. People think they have to have it but the deer have no clue. I have to hunt in blaze orange in Colorado and the deer dont mind. Yes I have had them a few feet from me and they dont know I am there. I dont use scent killer either. I dont smoke, never aquired the habit. Usually hunt in my jeans and a shirt from Academy some cheap "T" shirt if its not too cold. Nope dont have any of that stuff to put on my face either. I have to chuckle when I see folks "duded" up like that. But as said many times its whatever makes you happy. Its all about movement, the less the better. 

Charlie


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

The scent from smoking won't ruin your hunt, the motion could.

The scent from spitting dip under your stand WILL ruin your hunt.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> The scent from smoking won't ruin your hunt, the motion could.
> 
> The scent from spitting dip under your stand WILL ruin your hunt.


why?? I understand deer are as addicted (if not more so) to tobacco than humans are. if you could grow a food plot you should try growing a few tobacco plants (if it's legal - knowing the feds they'd tax you for doing so).

I knew few good old boys from North Carolina and Kentucky who would tell of tobacco farmers who would let you hunt their farms for free to get the deer out of the tobacco fields.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

CHARLIE said:


> I just love the guys caught up in the cammo thing deer hunting. Thats another "people" thing. People think they have to have it but the deer have no clue. I have to hunt in blaze orange in Colorado and the deer dont mind. Yes I have had them a few feet from me and they dont know I am there. I dont use scent killer either. I dont smoke, never aquired the habit. Usually hunt in my jeans and a shirt from Academy some cheap "T" shirt if its not too cold. Nope dont have any of that stuff to put on my face either. I have to chuckle when I see folks "duded" up like that. But as said many times its whatever makes you happy. Its all about movement, the less the better.
> 
> Charlie


yup - but I sure wish I'd been smart enough to buy stock in some of the companies that make camo hunting stuff - don't misunderstand - I do have some but I rarely wear it - the only reason I have it is because it was a gift or I bought it on sale and couldn't find something cheaper


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

CHARLIE said:


> I just love the guys caught up in the cammo thing deer hunting. Thats another "people" thing. People think they have to have it but the deer have no clue. I have to hunt in blaze orange in Colorado and the deer dont mind. Yes I have had them a few feet from me and they dont know I am there. I dont use scent killer either. I dont smoke, never aquired the habit. Usually hunt in my jeans and a shirt from Academy some cheap "T" shirt if its not too cold. Nope dont have any of that stuff to put on my face either. I have to chuckle when I see folks "duded" up like that. But as said many times its whatever makes you happy. Its all about movement, the less the better.
> 
> Charlie


Whatever works for u dude. My success has greatly improved since I started washing my clothes with the scent free stuff and drying with earth scent fabric softners and bathing with scent free soap and using scent free deo. When I smoked and did not do all that I did more hunting and not killing. I use a recurve and compound, the closer the better.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

Charlie, I don't understand. You're on HF, dont you guys just keep them tied to trees out there?


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## jetlag887 (May 11, 2006)

The problem with HFs is that they restrict the natural flow of wildlife, palin and simple. It allows the property owner to fence deer that don't belong to them, the deer belong to me, and every other resident of Texas. By fencing the deer you are robbing me of the oppurtunity to legally harvest the animal.
And for you guys that say "hunting in a high fence is NO difference that hunting a low fence," and say "deer jump the fence when the want to.." Then why go to all the expence to build the fence in the first place???


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

jetlag887 said:


> The problem with HFs is that they restrict the natural flow of wildlife, palin and simple. It allows the property owner to fence deer that don't belong to them, the deer belong to me, and every other resident of Texas. By fencing the deer you are robbing me of the oppurtunity to legally harvest the animal.
> And for you guys that say "hunting in a high fence is NO difference that hunting a low fence," and say "deer jump the fence when the want to.." Then why go to all the expence to build the fence in the first place???


can i file my insurance claim with you then? :slimer:

would it make any difference if you couldn't shoot the deer that are on your neighbor's property, but never venture to yours, without a HF?

i mean, if you are surrounded by large tracts of land, those deer that do not travel to your property are off limits anyway, right?

deer don't need to travel great distance if they have what they need to survive right in front of them, just like when you don't see deer around feeders during a big acorn drop.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

jetlag887 said:


> TThen why go to all the expence to build the fence in the first place???


um...because it's THEIR land and last time I looked there's this thing called "property rights" in Texas that gives them the right to fence it, not fence it. What right do I have to tell them the can't?

as for the "natural flow of wildlife" I think we've already done that - highways, cities, towns, artificial barriers. So here's an idea - let's outlaw fences of every kind, including those around your house (after all, it interferes with the natural flow of your neighbors as well as wildlife- or better yet - let's outlaw houses - everyone live in a teepee. rip up the roads, get rid of the cars, everyone buy a horse instead. (kinda like my idea a little ).

with 2.1 million (estimated) whitetail in Texas I don't think we're in danger of not having deer to hunt. More land is being swallowed up by developers than any high fence threat that I can see. 
Ever been to one of the states WMA's?? I have, several are high fenced. Why? to keep the wildlife from being killed by crossing freeways, going into neighboring subdivisions, towns, homes.

fenced ranches are here to stay, if an owner wants to high fence - it's going to happen. You're not going to get a law that says it can't.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> deer don't need to travel great distance if they have what they need to survive right in front of them, just like when you don't see deer around feeders during a big acorn drop.


I used to know an old rancher that knew almost every buck on his 6,000 acre low fence ranch. Nearly every buck was the son, grandson, great-grandson, great-great grandson of the first buck(s) he'd ever seen. Most of them lived and died in a 40 acre area within the ranch seldom traveling outside that 40 acre range.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

RogerB said:


> I used to know an old rancher that knew almost every buck on his 6,000 acre low fence ranch. Nearly every buck was the son, grandson, great-grandson, great-great grandson of the first buck(s) he'd ever seen. Most of them lived and died in a 40 acre area within the ranch seldom traveling outside that 40 acre range.


exactly what i mean, Roger...if a deer has ample graze, nutrition, water, cover/bedding area and plenty of females around, he's not gonna travel too far away from that home area.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

osoobsessed said:


> exactly what i mean, Roger...if a deer has ample graze, nutrition, water, cover/bedding area and plenty of females around, he's not gonna travel too far away from that home area.


yup - I did a meat hunt about 16 years ago, right after I moved back to Texas after leaving the Army. the hunt was on a place south of San Antonio - was supposed to be something like 40,000 acres all low fence (placed called Macho Creek Lodge)- the guy who took me to my blind told me - "there's a big 12 point that lives in this area - no one got him this year so he's still around. He's the great-great-grandson of a monster buck that lived and died in this pasture so be careful shooting those doe and spikes he's not legal now" (it was the extended season). Guide told me that this buck and all his ancestors had lived their entire lives in that pasture of approximately 40-50 acres.

I saw him - and believe me I spent a loooooooooooong 5 minutes wondering how much it would cost me if I shot that dude - he was a true trophy in every sense of the word.


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## bearwrestler (Nov 16, 2010)

As a fellow Texican, I say set our deer free.


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## Kyle 1974 (May 10, 2006)

bearwrestler said:


> As a fellow Texican, I say set our deer free.


I agree. let's tear down all the high fences, and set the deer free.

then kill them all in the first year, and find something else to complain about.


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

RogerB said:


> I used to know an old rancher that knew almost every buck on his 6,000 acre low fence ranch. Nearly every buck was the son, grandson, great-grandson, great-great grandson of the first buck(s) he'd ever seen. Most of them lived and died in a 40 acre area within the ranch seldom traveling outside that 40 acre range.


 Roger- I agree with that as the rule but there are exceptions. I have got pics of a buck or two in on of our pastures before and then harvested the same deer on a greenfield over 3 miles away in a different pasture the same year. It was a drought year. I think in drought they will travel farther to feed. And during the rut they will roam into another bucks territory, we see bucks we never get pics of during the rut and seldom any other time, the rest of the year it is the same old bucks.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

RogerB said:


> I guess you'd have to ask TPWD or B&C. not your fence so I'm not sure how that works.
> sounds like you saved some money on fences posts and wire though.





Dagger Island Drifter said:


> I Have a easement through one ranch to get to mine, I actually have 5 ranches that touch my fence line, so I am completely high fenced on all sides but have not paid for a foot of it, I ask again, is my section of land considered high fenced?





osoobsessed said:


> can i file my insurance claim with you then? :slimer:
> 
> would it make any difference if you couldn't shoot the deer that are on your neighbor's property, but never venture to yours, without a HF?
> 
> ...





RogerB said:


> I used to know an old rancher that knew almost every buck on his 6,000 acre low fence ranch. Nearly every buck was the son, grandson, great-grandson, great-great grandson of the first buck(s) he'd ever seen. Most of them lived and died in a 40 acre area within the ranch seldom traveling outside that 40 acre range.





osoobsessed said:


> exactly what i mean, Roger...if a deer has ample graze, nutrition, water, cover/bedding area and plenty of females around, he's not gonna travel too far away from that home area.





RogerB said:


> yup - I did a meat hunt about 16 years ago, right after I moved back to Texas after leaving the Army. the hunt was on a place south of San Antonio - was supposed to be something like 40,000 acres all low fence (placed called Macho Creek Lodge)- the guy who took me to my blind told me - "there's a big 12 point that lives in this area - no one got him this year so he's still around. He's the great-great-grandson of a monster buck that lived and died in this pasture so be careful shooting those doe and spikes he's not legal now" (it was the extended season). Guide told me that this buck and all his ancestors had lived their entire lives in that pasture of approximately 40-50 acres.
> 
> I saw him - and believe me I spent a loooooooooooong 5 minutes wondering how much it would cost me if I shot that dude - he was a true trophy in every sense of the word.





RogerB said:


> um...because it's THEIR land and last time I looked there's this thing called "property rights" in Texas that gives them the right to fence it, not fence it. What right do I have to tell them the can't?
> 
> as for the "natural flow of wildlife" I think we've already done that - highways, cities, towns, artificial barriers. So here's an idea - let's outlaw fences of every kind, including those around your house (after all, it interferes with the natural flow of your neighbors as well as wildlife- or better yet - let's outlaw houses - everyone live in a teepee. rip up the roads, get rid of the cars, everyone buy a horse instead. (kinda like my idea a little ).
> 
> ...


Roger and osoobsessed,

First, If we are speaking of rights, why doesn't Dagger Island Drifter have the "right" to not want his ranch fenced in? Why do the other land owners rights supersede his? Aren't they're rights infringing on his now?

Second, If thats the case of deer staying in areas that they have everything they need then why high fence? Is it because of Ego and or Greed?

Third, So your telling us that you know owners of high fence ranches that don't have any money? I guess all that high fencing was donated to them? WOW, how do they pay the taxes? I guess they have LOTS of Tax "Right Offs/Deductions" from all the hunts they give away, But wait they wouldn't use those donations as "Right Offs/Deductions" as they do those from the pure goodness of their hearts, it has nothing to do with the "Right Offs/Deductions" that it would bring!! I know quite a few people, that if you didn't know they had money you would never know guess it by what they drove? So, give me a break!

Fourth, Tell me exactly what brings land owners to high fence their property? I can't think of one thing other than Ego's, Greed, Exotic species (that they sell for profit), or opening up your own prison as the reasoning? Give me one "Valid" reason for it other than keeping the neighbors deer out (what a "Cop-out") because that apparently doesn't work because you gave video proof (Right!! those fences in the video were at max in any of them 5-6 foot tall, at max!) that deer can freely jump high fencing and so the deer can come and go as they wish, right?


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

TXDRAKE said:


> I guess all that high fencing was donated to them? Government will pay for some of it so yeah you could say donated.
> 
> Give me one "Valid" reason for it. They own the land, have the means and a legal right to fence their property however they see fit.


:texasflag


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

Dagger Island Drifter said:


> I Have a easement through one ranch to get to mine, I actually have 5 ranches that touch my fence line, so I am completely high fenced on all sides but have not paid for a foot of it, I ask again, is my section of land considered high fenced?


I Don't Know, But you are one lucky Sumbeach. LOL



Spec-Rig.006 said:


> the scent from spitting dip under your stand WILL ruin your hunt.


. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Spec, Please say it isn't so. Your gonna make me give up Hunting.sad2sm LOL

I have been raising deer for 4 yrs now,and never had one jump in or out.(for the guys that think they can jump it easy) Had wild deer fighting thru the fence with my Breeder, though. That was an easy buck to shoot.hwell:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Not going to try and cut 'n paste. iPhone doesn't like it sometimes. 
I believe Too Tall answered some already I never said ranch owners were poor. As for all their greed? It's called capitalism. I suppose you'll just have to live with it or leave. I'm frankly growing tired of all the whining. I'm getting ready to go hunt. A low fence lease if it's any of your business. I leave tomorrow like I said and as others have said these ranch owners have the right. This isn't some communist HOA where a "board" decides how they satisfy your personal wants and that's a good thing


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Sea-Slug said:


> Roger- I agree with that as the rule but there are exceptions. I have got pics of a buck or two in on of our pastures before and then harvested the same deer on a greenfield over 3 miles away in a different pasture the same year. It was a drought year. I think in drought they will travel farther to feed. And during the rut they will roam into another bucks territory, we see bucks we never get pics of during the rut and seldom any other time, the rest of the year it is the same old bucks.


Yup no doubt. I'm simply telling you what was told to me and what I saw. West Texas deer tend to travel over a broader range because of the terrain and resources. So the "40 acre" rule doesn't ALWAYS apply. But someone answer this for me. 16 years ago I bought a house that I still own (almost paid off too) at the time I bought it there was farm and ranch land all around. I used to see a really nice 8 point (maybe 150-160). All the time. As far as I know he died of old age living in my area as it got stripped of it's habitat and turned into subdivisions. He lived out his life in a 60 acre area surrounded by subdivisions and business. I saw his son and now his grandson live in the same area. And te deer population hasn't decreased that I can see. So exactly HOW is HF "destroying" hunting?


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## kweber (Sep 20, 2005)

I agree Rog... nature will find a way.
in fact, just do a search on all the black panther sightings east of SA.:slimer:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Oops. It sent itself before I was ready. To finish - if Deer can survive and even thrive in urban areas do you really expect me to believe that high fences are going to lead to their destruction? I don't think so. I've said this multiple times and will say it again. There's ample opportunity to hunt and hunt without high fence or fences at all if that trips your trigger. It's up to you. When the day comes that the only deer in Texas reside behind high fence come see me. Somehow I don't think that will ever happen. Until then I hope you find some way to enjoy the hunting opportunities available without being jealous of those who hunt differently


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

kweber said:


> I agree Rog... nature will find a way.
> in fact, just do a search on all the black panther sightings east of SA.:slimer:


No that's funny. I owe you green for the laugh. But I gotta reload first


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Valid reasons hmm

If I had a place I would hi fence it so I couild raise and feed and care for the deer and allow them to grow to maturity and have nice deer. Is that valid ? Recent studies show that buck deer from birth through the 1st few years almost 50 % die in the wild with no special feeding. I will feed them so as to allow them to mature and not die from natural causes. Its not predators, older deer they starve or exhaust themselves during the rut eventually dying from lack of proper food. And in the final stages (older deer) the death rate goes back up because of poor range and lack of feeding they die. Thats just my thoughts on that issue, what I would consider my valid reasons..

Charlie


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Careful Charlie. You'll be accused of being a greedy "deer farmer" with a bucket of corn in one hand and a ballpeen hammer in the other, instead of a steward of the land and the wildlife.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

RogerB

Oh well thats life I guess and I guess thats why there are Fords and Chevys. Guess I am just a greedy, dirty, old man. But been called worse than that. But I am leaving in the AM but dang sure not just taking a hammer. I havent seen that big deer much less get close to him. Guess I will have to put on my paint face and cammo and stink repellant.

Charlie


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

CHARLIE said:


> RogerB
> 
> . Guess I will have to put on my paint face and cammo and stink repellant.
> 
> Charlie


:rotfl: be careful. Don't make yourself too invisible. That wouldn't be "fair". Be safe on the road sir. Good luck and Happy New Year I'll be headed West not long after you leave


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Hmmm.. 283 posts, 12,000 plus views and we're still here. Could be wrong but I think this is the longest thread on high fence I've seen.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

I think its been talked out and probably taking up to much space. Should be gone before long..

Charlie


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Yup. Reckon you're right.


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

CHARLIE said:


> I think its been talked out and probably taking up to much space. Should be gone before long..
> Charlie


It ain't over, Let's see if I can Help



sasquatch said:


> I have been wanting to post up for a while and give my opinion and maybe gain some new perspective on the subject of high fences from others. In Texas if someone poaches a deer they must pay restitution to the state. The state says that deer belongs to the state and all its residents. I agree, however if this is so, how can someone buy a piece of property and put up a game fence and trap all the deer within its confines. Do these deer not belong to all residents also? I recently watched Kieth Warren talking about how much good these landowners of high fenced property do the deer herd by feeding water and nutrients year round. They are feeding their livestock to get maximum price, not the deer herd of the state of Texas. I understand why he is saying this, he is sponsored by a couple of commercial deer farms. I have hunted on a high fence ranch. I took my daughter on a hunt last year after being unsuccessful on a TPWD draw hunt for the fourth year in a row. She shot a nice buck, she saw more trophy class deer than most men will see in a lifetime and it was the worst mistake I have ever made. If any of you are planning on introducing your kids to hunting on one of these high fenced ranches that is your business. However, I hope they are sucessful enough in life to continue hunting on these types of ranches because to a new hunter this will set the standard for how hunting is. The state is now in the trophy deer business(13inch rule). Some like it and some dont. To be honest I have not heard why the state went to the rule, just individual opinions. At any rate there has to be agreement that the state of Texas is guilty of some level of hypocrocy. You cant boast about how tough you are on poachers and then let people trap entire herds of deer, fatten them up and sell them. I do not condone poaching but honestly someone who poaches a deer for freezer meat has a lot less impact on my deer hunting than the guy who buys the property next my hunting land and puts up a game fence. Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas :cheers:


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I guess I better go buy another popcorn machine.


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## Crazyfish07 (Dec 14, 2006)

My uncle has land in hill country and has been in family for 60 years, we love to go and hunt there every year with cousins and uncles and have a good time, we are sitting in the prime zone for all deer to pass throught the property and it is all low fence, well some idiot bought all the land around and decided to put a high fence up and completetly shut us out, i don't think that is right, there should be some kind of law or restrictions on this, My dad has been taking me to hunt there for 20 years and his dad has been taking him there to hunt to, and now i want to take my boy and can't because the idiot put a high fence all around, we also have a creek that runs through there to and it just trickels on the other properties, i hate high fences's, these deer are wild and shouldn't be caged in, unless you pay a good penilty for having a high fence or you should have a certain acreage you can only high fence in, maybe there should be a stiff payment if you are going to put a high fence!!!!!!!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I'm done. Not worth the aggrevation to cut and paste all the responses to this comment. The rest of y'all have fun.


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

Crazyfish07 said:


> My uncle has land in hill country and has been in family for 60 years, we love to go and hunt there every year with cousins and uncles and have a good time, we are sitting in the prime zone for all deer to pass throught the property and it is all low fence, well some idiot bought all the land around and decided to put a high fence up and completetly shut us out, i don't think that is right, there should be some kind of law or restrictions on this, My dad has been taking me to hunt there for 20 years and his dad has been taking him there to hunt to, and now i want to take my boy and can't because the idiot put a high fence all around, we also have a creek that runs through there to and it just trickels on the other properties, i hate high fences's, these deer are wild and shouldn't be caged in, unless you pay a good penilty for having a high fence or you should have a certain acreage you can only high fence in, maybe there should be a stiff payment if you are going to put a high fence!!!!!!!


I'm sorry for ya, but unless ya'll were sponging off this obviously larger property, ya'll should be in deer heaven. Especially with that running creek. Now ya'll are the only ones taking from the herd. Just saying. I personally, would be greatful if my neighbors high fenced me in.


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

> Roger and osoobsessed,
> 
> First, If we are speaking of rights, why doesn't Dagger Island Drifter have the "right" to not want his ranch fenced in? Why do the other land owners rights supersede his? Aren't they're rights infringing on his now?
> 
> ...


sorry, TXDrake was playing Black-ops on Xbox live last night, so i didn't get a chance to chime in, you know....cuz i'm greedy with internet bandwidth and rich. :slimer:

1. that is a special situation and honestly i have no first hand knowledge about what "right" is actually right, so i can't and will not answer that.

2. do you always automatically judge people for things they do when you don't even or haven't met the actual person. Most people that own large ranches or even small tracts of land either have worked their tail off to afford their land or it was handed down to them through family, why the ego and greed comment, jealousy mabey?

it honestly reminds me of, lets see "all" duck hunters that setup blinds on public water, but get ****** off because they feel entitled to that blind once season has started even though it's on public waterway and first come first serve, per TPW. then again, i know a few duck hunters and they are good old boys just like us.

3. who cares if they have money, some people have it, some people don't, that's life, get over it. i guess instead of buying a 200,000 house in the burbs, they bought a ranch instead, is that wrong?

4. nobody owes you a "valid" reason for high fencing THEIR own land, but again, you only back yourself and argument with emotion (greed, ego claims), which again would lead me to believe there is a case of "class envy" (see how easy it is to judge someone)...they have the money, they bought the land, they can do what they want with it, they don't owe you or me ANY reasons.

you'd be surprised if you actually got to meet some of these greedy, ego driven HF ranch owners, couldn't be any worse than a lot of the "duck hunters" on public land.

:cheers:


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Bukkskin said:


> I personally, would be greatful if my neighbors high fenced me in.


.....even if it was only 10 acres smack dab in the middle of a super buck producing ranch. LOL, happened to a guy I know. He sued and he lost. Still has his worthless 10 acres with cabin. No deer but an occasional javilina. His plan was to buy the land and shoot monster bucks for the rest of his life. Plan fell through.


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## neverlimit (Mar 26, 2007)

Bucksnort,

The guy you know with the 10 acres alt to bring in some huge “wild” pigs…just a thought! Is that legal?


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

Bucksnort said:


> His plan was to buy the land and shoot monster bucks for the rest of his life. Plan fell through.


Saw it happen to some guys that setup blinds on the fence line to an adjoining ranch. We had 5000 acres leased and they had 200 they bought in the middle of this ranch. Came down to hunt one weekend and the 200 was fenced out.


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## Jock Ewing (Mar 26, 2006)

We used to have a 10k acre high fenced place near Pearsall. Some jerkoff had 30 acres that was maybe 200 yards wide that ran all along our shared fence. They had 12 blinds running down the fence. 

We fences our land in and that jerk was shutdown. Idiots like that are why people high fence.


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## FishSlap (Mar 20, 2009)

Too Tall said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *TXDRAKE*
> _ I guess all that high fencing was donated to them? Government will pay for some of it so yeah you could say donated.
> 
> ...


What gov program will pay for part of a HF?


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

RogerB said:


> Careful Charlie. You'll be accused of being a greedy "deer farmer" with a bucket of corn in one hand and a ballpeen hammer in the other, instead of a steward of the land and the wildlife.


Actually your waistn corn with a whole bucket, you don't need but a handfull, and for goodness sake any type hammer will work although I do perfer a ballpeen BUT you take a chance on busting the skullcap up, that would be make it hard to measure the width, them inches is $$ and the $$ is what it takes to keep them from eating dry cereal....WW


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

FishSlap said:


> What gov program will pay for part of a HF?


Not a program but I was able to deduct the cost of my high fence as a business expense. $240,000 worth.


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