# Newbie



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

I'm a fly newbie. Just learning to cast a 5 wt in fresh now. So, I want to know opinions; is the new Sage 8 wt Xi3 as awesome as all of the online reviews say it is?


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

Short answer is yes, its an awesome rod. A rod like that is a bit like a ultra high tech driver in golf. A guy with a great swing can get the most out of it and can tell the difference between it and the competition, but that same golfer could probably hit a ladies club almost as well. A good caster can catch fish with 30 yr old fiberglass fenwick. Will he be able to throw the whole line or blast a cast through the wind? Probably not, thats where the Xi3 comes in. Bottom line is to try as many as you can before you buy, and the casting stroke and good double haul is far more important than the rod.


----------



## dsim3240 (Nov 12, 2008)

I agree with Pl, Xi3 is the best. If money is no problem then go for it. If money is an issue then get the best you can and learn to cast well. I recommend the Sage VXP as a high quality intermediate rod. TFO also make some nice less expensive rods that make great starter outfits.


----------



## CObob (Sep 23, 2010)

don't waste your money at this point, this new to it you won't know the difference. Ultra-fast rods arn't good for learning casting technique anyways. Start with a TFO or similar quality, and ugrde as your skills develop. You'd be that 16 y/o kid with a super-sports car and no clue how to drive it.

pluss scott makes a better rod


----------



## Worm Drowner (Sep 9, 2010)

Its an excellent rod. I have that very one, myself. That said, Joan Wulff or Left Kreh could cast circles around me all day long with a broom handle, but what the heck. I enjoy it and it gives me incentive to improve my casting to the level of the rod.


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

The Xi3 is a great rod, best suited to throwing a tight loop. This make it a good rod to fish floating line in the wind, as you can throw a very tight loop and punch right through the wind. The Xi3 is a poor rod for throwing indicator rigs, especially with multiple flies. If you throw a tight loop with such a rig, you're going to tangle it pretty regularly. You'll have to open up the loop, which makes the Xi3 a waste. Depending on what style of fishing you do, it can be a great rod or a mediocre one. As others have said, as a beginner you shouldn't spend the money on it. Get something slower/softer and less expensive. The VT2 or VXP is a good intermediate rod, and a better use of your money.


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Thanks guys. This may be a dumb question but, does your "entry level rod" opinion change when you know I can get it for 50% off list price?

How far can an accomplished caster cast it into a typical 20kt coastal wind?

Also, which reels do you like best and why? I'm looking at Ross and Tibor. I like what I've read about the Ross drag system which seems superior to Tibor's. Opinions???


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

Ross makes a decent reel, but the drags (in my experience) are sticky. They will surge a lot while you're fighting a fish. No bueno. Tibor makes a hell of a reel. Nautilus makes a stupidly awesome reel. The Lamson reels are solid too. I own a couple of Ross reels, and I'd put them at the bottom of this list.


----------



## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

"How far can an accomplished caster cast it into a typical 20kt coastal wind?"

Some guys can do quite well, but water conditions arn't so good in a 20 knot wind. Not many of us will be fishing (sightcasting) in that kind of wind. So just because the Xi3 rod might be able to perform in that condition not the reason to go out and buy one. If you are set on that kind of rod go get one. But in my opinion they are best suited for casting short distances 10' to 40' very quickly like if you were fishing from the bow of a skiff. If you are wading you have all the time you need to get your cast off and wouldn't need a fast tip rod. Like I said thats my opinion. TFO or Echo make some very nice rods for less than half the price of the Xi3 and they have the same or better warranty. 
I like the driving analogy - Good Luck with your Ferrari Testarossa during the parallel parking test.


----------



## Bruce J (Jun 27, 2004)

I'll second the other comments about the Xi3. At 50% off it certainly takes a lot of the sting out of it, but it would still be more than say a TFO BVK whic is also a great stick. Like others have said, if you've got the bucks and like the idea of having one of the "best" fly rods out there, then load one up.

I'm more of a "reel guy" than a "rod guy", but it's just because I like the beautiful machining and smooth operation of the high end reels like the Tibors. They are, however, completely unnecessary for catching redfish and trout around here which rarely get into the backing. If you plan to chase some bonefish or smaller tarpon or permit, which can all rip off 200 yards of line in a hurry, then the true performance of the reel is more important. You can spend anywhere from about $100 to $800 on the reel, just depending on what you'll be fishing for and how important the other considerations are. All the names mentioned previously are good to consider.


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

The Xi3 isn't a freshwater rod, so its no surprise that it would be less than ideal for nymphing on a trout stream. As far as reels go, do you want to buy one or buy one every 3 to 5 years? If you want to buy one that your son and possibly grandson would be able to fish with then go with the Tibor. Personally its the only reel I will use in saltwater and I've tried everything except the Charlton Mako's (1000 bucks plus) Ross's and Abel's aren't bad either, but the Tibor's are superior due to the *warranty*, craftsmanship, reliability, least amount of maintenance, fewest moving parts, cork drag and general bombproofness. They have more drag than you would ever use in a fishing application. Even for deep dropping a full sink line for amberjacks or bait and switching pelagics. I think they're smoother than the abel's and the hatch's especially when engaging the drag. Bruce J is right about the unnecessary part for reds and trout, and is also right about the grand slam species. I've seen a bonefish literally smoke a Gold Cup reel from bass pro. Lamson's are a favorite of fly shop guys to push on unsuspecting people (possibly some sort of dealer incentive involved), but they're garbage in my humble opinion.


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

*Thanks!*

I will mostly be fishing the fly from a skiff. I asked the 20kt wind question because water clarity stays pretty good in Mule Slough and the Espiritu Santo, San Antonio, Aransas marshes and lakes in these typical wind conditions.

I have looked at the TFO reviews too and the 8 wt BVK does compare favorably in some reviews.

You guys are awesome! Thanks for sharing your thoughts!


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Boboe, do you fish the VXP? What length do you prefer in this rod & why?



Boboe said:


> The Xi3 is a great rod, best suited to throwing a tight loop. This make it a good rod to fish floating line in the wind, as you can throw a very tight loop and punch right through the wind. The Xi3 is a poor rod for throwing indicator rigs, especially with multiple flies. If you throw a tight loop with such a rig, you're going to tangle it pretty regularly. You'll have to open up the loop, which makes the Xi3 a waste. Depending on what style of fishing you do, it can be a great rod or a mediocre one. As others have said, as a beginner you shouldn't spend the money on it. Get something slower/softer and less expensive. The VT2 or VXP is a good intermediate rod, and a better use of your money.


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

the vxp is a nice rod. Its basically the old XP blank with a new color. The XP 8wt is one of the all time classic rods from sage, so much so that they re-released them a couple of years ago before the VXP came out. Fly fishing in a 20kt wind is challenging in any location regardless of water clarity. Its hard to see fish in that kind of chop. Practice you're double haul and aim low to the water right at the fish. This will help mitigate the wind pushing the line way off course. Strong winds will generally make the fish less spooky to an aggressive cast because they wont be able to see or hear your boat as well.


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

9 ft rod is all you need for the coast. Unless you're 5' or 7' there's no need to go up or down.


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Do you guys have any opinions on Sage's line of reels?


----------



## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

Yeah, don't worry as much about casting a long way. Occasionally you may "need" to, but *accurate* casts to 30 feet are plenty good in most scenarios.

And do as I say with the accuracy, not as I do. LOL


----------



## CObob (Sep 23, 2010)

Laguna Freak said:


> Thanks guys. This may be a dumb question but, does your "entry level rod" opinion change when you know I can get it for 50% off list price?
> 
> How far can an accomplished caster cast it into a typical 20kt coastal wind?
> 
> Also, which reels do you like best and why? I'm looking at Ross and Tibor. I like what I've read about the Ross drag system which seems superior to Tibor's. Opinions???


50% off is huge, I'd still start with a softer rod for better line feel. Maybe a Scott A4 and even if you just bag it as a backup rod in 6 months the softer feel will be worth it as you learn to cast. If funds are not an issue also consider multiple weights. Plenty of days where a 6 or 7wt is preferred.

For wind just bump up a weight, line also plays a roll. When it's that big I'd prefer wadeing over the skiff.

Ross is good but not great (and I grew up in CO). Don't have experience with Tibor but know they are real popular with salt guys. Just picked up my 2nd Bauer and I'll probably be with them for a while, best drags I have ever used.


----------



## CObob (Sep 23, 2010)

Laguna Freak said:


> I will mostly be fishing the fly from a skiff. I asked the 20kt wind question because water clarity stays pretty good in Mule Slough and the Espiritu Santo, San Antonio, Aransas marshes and lakes in these typical wind conditions.
> 
> I have looked at the TFO reviews too and the 8 wt BVK does compare favorably in some reviews.
> 
> You guys are awesome! Thanks for sharing your thoughts!


Who is going to be polling you in this wind? Save the $ to buy thee beer after that


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Roflmao!!!



cobob said:


> who is going to be polling you in this wind? Save the $ to buy thee beer after that


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

Laguna Freak said:


> Boboe, do you fish the VXP? What length do you prefer in this rod & why?


No, I don't have one. I've casted it in 9' 8wt before, but only just for a few casts, then handing the rod back to its owner.


----------



## CObob (Sep 23, 2010)

Laguna Freak said:


> Roflmao!!!


glad you like it...

don't kid your self that you will be able to buy the "perfect rod," and not buy any more. blow your lode on an 8 and what happens when you need a 6 or a 10? a 12? what about that trip to the hills for a trout? better get a 3 and a 5 just to be sure... if $ is no issue go for it, but you will need another in no time, so be ready :brew2:


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

CObob said:


> glad you like it...
> 
> don't kid your self that you will be able to buy the "perfect rod," and not buy any more. blow your lode on an 8 and what happens when you need a 6 or a 10? a 12? what about that trip to the hills for a trout? better get a 3 and a 5 just to be sure... if $ is no issue go for it, but you will need another in no time, so be ready :brew2:


3wt? What're we fishing for, baby bream? :biggrin:


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

No doubt...it seems I'm a li'l queer for gear. I'm learning to cast a 5 wt LL Bean that was a gift. Went trout fishing in a murky post rain Guadalupe river bend yesterday and caught notta.



CObob said:


> glad you like it...
> 
> don't kid your self that you will be able to buy the "perfect rod," and not buy any more. blow your lode on an 8 and what happens when you need a 6 or a 10? a 12? what about that trip to the hills for a trout? better get a 3 and a 5 just to be sure... if $ is no issue go for it, but you will need another in no time, so be ready :brew2:


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Laguna - 

A few things stand out that I didn't see much comments about. I will try to be short, but the main thing here is giving you the advice that I've learned and that I've passed on to others.

First, you said you were new to fly fishing. New fly fishers get drawn to high-end rods thinking it will help them cast better. 

This is not the case. I know since I've been there myself.

It takes time for the muscle memory to burn in, plus additional time to learn how to haul, then finally double haul. If your cast is not efficient, or has problems, going to a fast action rod will only exaggerate those issues. Fast action rods (like the Xi3) devour line speed. If you can't create line speed efficiently, you'll look at the rod and think "wow, it is pretty and high tech, but I can't throw it 40 feet".

You are starting off in fresh which is good, but stream and river fishing lends itself to developing bad habits. There is a big difference between continuously chunking nymph rigs and putting a fly on the head of a tailing red 50+ feet out. The timing and accuracy are different. Nymphing doesn't have to be precise - tailing and cruising fish do have to be precise (some may argue this, but if you ever want to catch bones, snook, permit and tarpon, accuracy is a MUST).

So considering that, my advice is to not start with Xi3 since it will be too fast a rod for your cast (unless you have been gifted at birth). You may buy it if it is a good deal since it will last you for life, but you need a medium-fast rod to begin with.

My father-in-law bought a fast action rod (which I won't bad mouth, but it was a broom stick) because the person at the shop told him it is a great salt water rod and would increase his cast. Well, he couldn't hit 30' feet with it, but he also isn't a great salt caster - he is a river and stream caster. I noticed what was wrong with his cast and tried to correct, but no luck. So I put him on my Winston BIIx 8 weight, which is a fast rod, but much more forgiving than the other rod. With a few adjustments, he was hitting 50'.

The other rod just wasn't forgiving enough for his cast and the conditions. I still take the BIIx with me and always put novice casters on it instead of my BII-MX rods, which loves line speed, which is done through hauling. It is a slower stroke than what I commonly use in the salt, but I can throw it just as far since I know how to adjust my timing for the stroke of the rod.

So my advice is to get a medium fast rod, or one that has a little give in the stroke until you have a solid cast. Jumping right into a fast or fast+ is like trying to run before you walk. Take some casting classes to help with the fundamentals. Make or buy a practice casting rod you can use in the house to control your loops (yarn and an older tip section of a rod work well). And practice, practice, practice.

I bought my first fast action rod for salt around 10 years ago and recall not being able to cast it 40'. I was bummed. I was told it was the rod to get. Now, all of my salt rods are fast+ and 50' is the starting point of my range, with me throwing my 12 weight with intermediate line into the backing for poons. But it took practice and understanding my cast to make that happen. But I will take accuracy and timing over distance any day, but they do go hand in hand.

And if you want a good guide to learn the Guad and also take casting lessons, give Chris Johnson a call at Living Waters Fly shop in Austin a call. He knows the guad like the back of his hand and is a really good casting instructor.

Tight lines,

Coconut


----------



## CObob (Sep 23, 2010)

Boboe said:


> 3wt? What're we fishing for, baby bream? :biggrin:


thats what the 1wts for.....:biggrin:

well, was.. sold the 1wt, seemed a little silly for here, would have kept if if i still lived in colorado. the 3wt holds its own though, it was my go-to on barton creek untill i maxed it out on a bigish bass, and it has caught more then one trout over 20


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

CObob said:


> glad you like it...
> 
> don't kid your self that you will be able to buy the "perfect rod," and not buy any more. blow your lode on an 8 and what happens when you need a 6 or a 10? a 12? what about that trip to the hills for a trout? better get a 3 and a 5 just to be sure... if $ is no issue go for it, but you will need another in no time, so be ready :brew2:


Very very true, its a slippery slope.... I just got myself a 14wt because, you know, I really needed one...


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

*Coconut Groves*, thank you for taking the time to share your experiences and insights. Even though my friend who is on the Sage staff is pushing me toward the Xi3, I am leaning toward the Sage VXP for the reasons you mentioned about a fast rod.

Its interesting that you mentioned the difference between stream and salt casting. I had experienced that difference when fishing the Guadalupe with my friend. He was trying to get me to slow down my casting motion and told me how it should be an easy, rythmic motion. This is the same friend who has been fly fishing streams for 10 years and who I took to the salt on a guided poling skiff last June and he was unable to cast an 8 wt Sage rod with 40 feet of line out. As we discussed the technique he was attempting to teach me, we compared it to his experience in the salt. This discussion was my first clue that there was a significant difference between stream casting and flats casting.

At the time I took him to the salt, I knew absolutely nothing about fly fishing. However since that time last June, I've learned, a little, and have practiced and become relatively proficient at casting my 5 wt LL Bean up to 35 ft in a 5 - 10kt wind on a single back cast with no haul. This required me to learn to pick it up overhead quickly , wait for the back cast to load and then with a quick, smooth motion, cast forward to my target spot, often drifting to different target spots on numerous successive casts. I tend to stand in my backyard and cast repeatedly until my right arm is tired and then without pausing, I switch the rod to my left hand and repeat the exercise until my left arm is tired, then switch back to the right hand, and so forth until I need a cold adult beverage to refresh myself. I have no idea if my technique is correct. I only know that it seemed to be working. However, I had no tippet or leader to entangle itself, only a piece of yarn tied to the fly line.

I'm thinking of buying some casting lessons but am a little apprehensive about developing river/stream habits which may impede my saltwater proficiency. Any advice y'all 2coolers can offer is appreciated.


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

Casting a line in the backyard with no fly is very different than casting that rod with a wet, heavy fly on it. Whether you'll be fishing *heavy* flies for what you do, I don't know. I watch a lot of people get frustrated who have gotten good at casting their floating line with no fly in their backyard, and then get a 250 gr sink tip and a 4" weighted bunny leech and can't cast it worth a flip. "I was so good at home! Why can't I cast this thing?!" Same goes when they get a 12' indicator rig with a 3/0 split shot. It doesn't work like practicing in the backyard  Nothing is a substitute for time on the water!


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Great! :headknock

The good news is, I'll have another reason to get on the water. The only saltwawter fly fisherman/friend I have is a guide in Port O. He usually casts a light "crab" fly at reds in the lakes and sloughs. I have no idea what he casts at tarpon. I guess I'm fixin to learn...many casting techniques. Hopefully I'll be back on the Guad before sunrise tomorrow morning.

Thanks guys. I guess there is a whole lot mroe to fly fishing than I could have imagined. Please keep the advice coming if anyone thinks of anything else.



Boboe said:


> Casting a line in the backyard with no fly is very different than casting that rod with a wet, heavy fly on it. Nothing is a substitute for time on the water!


----------



## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

LF
After reading all of this may I offer a bit of advice.

1.) Do not practice standing in the back yard and casting with both hands. Choose one and stick with it. If you're going to practice what you even admit may not be a correct casting motion you are still developing muscle memory of what might be something it will take you years to let go of.

2.) If you feel you are going to be mostly fishing from a bow of a skiff, well then if you must practice, stand on a chair and practice casting 30' into the wind to several targets scattered out in the yard without moving the chair. That will eliminate you tranfering your wait forward and back during the cast which is not good when on the front of a skiff! Make sure your back cast is at a high angle to the ground (45 to 50 degrees) as if you are casting over your guides head up on the platform but you are still to place the fly onto your target (use a small hula hoop). That's the cast you need to have on a skiff. Forget about the 60' cast for now...you probably cant see that far ahead in the water anyways.

3.) Your guide friend in POC probably should not advise you to spend your time tarpon fishing because it take a whole different skill set that you need to master first. Especially if you are paying him a guide's fee.

4.) The best advice I coud give you is for you to contact a local casting instructor...we have several FFF Certified Instructors in our Texas Flyfishers Club (have you joined yet???) and arrange either private ($$$) or group lessons (way less $$$). Spam alert - Check out our site *texasflyfishers.org *you might like it.

If you are serious about learning correct casting techniques. Do not spend your time flailing in the backyard! Look at our website or send me a PM and I will be glad to get you in touch with excellant instructions. It will make your Saltwater Experience a world better ...trust me.

Golden
Texas Flyfishers of Houston
Saltwater Outing Chairman


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Laguna - 

It sounds like you are taking the right approach. I wish I would learned the right mechanics from the start instead of going self taught. The good news is that my cast has been good for a while now, but I did go through a "what am I doing wrong" phase a while back. Now, I can look at and know what is causing it to be off, which is very important because it is very easy to be lazy when casting.

I recently had a friend who was a die-hard bait and artificial chunker who talked trash about fly fishing for years. He and is dad called fly fisherman "pretentious" - hey, which some are. I took him striper fishing one day and got him on some crashing bait on top. He loved it. I took him white bass fishing and he tore it up. He wanted to catch a red on the fly, so I took him out to a field to work on his cast and had him double hauling in an hour hitting 50' consistently, with 60' being in reach. He didn't have any bad habits that kept him from making a great cast. We went to the Bahamas on a couples trip a few weeks later and I got him on a cruising bonefish on his first morning of bonefishing. He is hooked now. He wants to go on a full bone, **** and permit trip now, but he isn't ready yet for the **** and permit. That takes lots of time on the bow to reach that level.

Good luck and tight lines. I hit Port O' from time to time, so maybe one day we can hook up. What's your friend's name in Port O'? Dropping a name is also good advertising...


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Hehe, for some reason I can't edit the above post, but the "****" in it are the short name for tarpon. Guess the board thinks I am being dirty....


----------



## SKIFFSTIFF (May 8, 2009)

*rods & reels*

X2 on all of the comments mentioned.I have fished with the rods you are asking about.Golden is on point about sight casting from a skiff.Most important is speed & accuracy.Fast or med/fast rods that are over lined will get the job done .Most cast are point blank to close and long line casts are rare.Wading or stalking on foot are better served with med to med/fast rods as you have time to make any kind of cast that you want make from close to far.I fish with my TFO rods 99% of the time and my high dollar super fast rods are collecting dust sitting in the closet.

SKIFFSTIFF


----------



## PL (Sep 28, 2011)

I highly recommend reading _Fly Fishing in Salt Water_, by Lefty Kreh. Some consider it the bible of salt water fly fishing.


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Cool! 

When my new skiff arrives most of my fishing will be from it. Whether I'm fishing Austin area lakes or the coast, I intend to do a lot of fly fishing and bait casting with arties when the wind becomes a problem.

Do any of y'all know if the casting instructors at Sportsman's Finest in Bee Caves are any good?


----------



## mikedeleon (Aug 9, 2010)

Laguna Freak said:


> Cool!
> 
> When my new skiff arrives most of my fishing will be from it. Whether I'm fishing Austin area lakes or the coast, I intend to do a lot of fly fishing and bait casting with arties when the wind becomes a problem.
> 
> Do any of y'all know if the casting instructors at Sportsman's Finest in Bee Caves are any good?


People up at Sportsman's are top notch.


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Laguna - I can't answer who does the casting lessons now at Sportsman's since Ted and Joe are no longer there. Joe Robinson is a great casting instructor and I highly recommend him. Chris Johnson at Living Waters is also good. It is good that you asked this question because Living Waters is having their Christmas party on Saturday (12/17) and Joe is doing a casting demonstration at 10 am. I highly recommend trying to attend if you can so you can meet Joe and ask him about a private lesson. If you plan on going let me know so I can say hi to you and we can talk shop a bit.

Here is the link to LW - http://livingwatersflyfishing.com


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Coconut Groves,

Thanks for the heads up but I'll be in another training session that day. I'll probably try SF since they're conveniently located for me. I'll be sure to tell my instructor the type of fishing I'll be doing. Hopefully I can master stream and flats casting techniques.

Maybe we can hook up sometime and bury the hook in some red jaws when my Lostmen gets here.


----------



## robdog (May 10, 2006)

I am new to fly fishing myself but spend a lot of time fishing in heavy winds which most people would not consider. I will blind cast for hours in 20+ if I know there are fish out there. I have an 8wt BVK I won at Roy's last month and love it. I had never thrown one and it's the same rod I used in the contest. They had three rods to choose from and the BVK just happened to be the one I grabbed to use in the contest. If anyone was there they will vouch the winds were every bit of 30+ and probably gusting to 40. I was shocked how good it performed in the wind. Like I said I am new at this but I am sure I am sticking with my BVK for some time.


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Laguna - 

I will try to get Joe's contact information for you via Chris at Living Waters. I think Joe is still doing lessons, and if so, I recommend contacting him. I took a lesson from him years ago and the way he approaches casting instruction is second to none.


----------



## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

LF ...man when you jump in you really jump in. Will this be your first specialized watercraft? How much time have you spent poling a shallow draft skiff? In reviewing this post, It seems to me you are relatively new at the saltwater game. Have you spent hours on end poling a boat with a fisher on the bow. It is not the easiest thing to accomplish when you are first exposed to let say moderate winds and currents. The only reason I ask is that I am debating on whether or not to organize a class for people to get exposure to just such an experience. It is much better to really know what you are getting into before you spend $20K+.

I have heard of many people going out to buy and HPX or Hells Bay and suddenly after going round and round and never really getting the hang of it ending up taking a hit in selling the craft in frustration. Remember this - most of your buddies that you would like to take fishing on your skiff will not be able to pole the boat for you! So be prepared to NOT get much time on the bow yourself.

Do this if your guide buddy in POC has such a craft ask him if you can pole him around for the day. I know he'll say sure...but you better be in decent shape. Your shoulders, back and feet will be killing you at first after only a few hours. It takes time to develope the stamina it takes to pole a skiff around. Remember your up there to call out fish for the fisher and you cant do that while looking back to see where your putting the pole so you can adjust the path your taking. When the pole hits the motor skeg or hull, the noise will scare of any fish within 50' so you have to be quite. You have to not rock the boat, oh yeah red at 10:00 oclock moving left to right at thirty feet...calling out fish accurately is not easy especially when you are having trouble keeping the boat pointed straight. So once you get your new boat, and before frustration sets in CALL ME I'LL LET YOU POLE ME ALL DAY BACK IN MULE SLOUGH while you learn oh yeah one other thing - can I use your new Xi3 too?

Just having some fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!

)<(((*>


----------



## Coconut Groves (Nov 2, 2011)

Laguna - PM sent with two contacts for fly casting lessons.

Golden - Very good points. I took two friends who are new to fly fishing out with me over the summer and one begged to pole. After 10 minutes, he said he couldn't believe how hard it was and I reminded him we hadn't seen any fish yet.  He stepped down pretty quick.

Honestly, I love poling nearly as much as being on the nose. When poling, you get to see the ENTIRE game happen. You see the whole angle, where the fisherman is looking, where his line is going, and where the fish is going. Putting it all together is the ultimate satisfaction. Sure, there are times when I've did little and the guy on the nose spotted and landed the fish. But I've also called out fish, location and distance that the fisherman never saw and got them on it.

But again, I agree - it helps to have buddies who care as much about it, or more, than you do. Oh, and it helps if it is their boat too!


----------



## Stuart (May 21, 2004)

I've had several newbs that have never poled a skiff learn pretty quick on my skiff. You'll figure it out in short order unless you have zero coordination. Most people make too big of corrections and get the boat going back and forth all over the place. The footprint where you place the pole on the bottom is surprisingly small. Just get the heck out there and do it. Y'all are WAY overcomplicating this stuff as us fly fishers are known to do and get a bad wrap for. A lot of reds (not all) are just stupid. Have had plenty dart off after I flubbed a cast only to have them turn around and eat on a subsequent cast. Now a sheepie, that's another story.

A) You already have a skiff coming
B) Buy any decent 8 wt rod 
C) Spend good money on a good line
D) Put a crab fly pattern on there
E) Get out there and start scouting, poling, learning
F) Go, go, go, there is no substitue for getting out there and putting the time in.

Thank you and your welcome


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

Golden, not sure where you got the idea that I am new to the saltwater world. I'm definitely new to fly fishing but I've been wadefishing the coast since '97. 

I have poled my 20' flats boat too many times...THAT SUCKED! I gave that stiffy to my buddy that owns a 15 scooter. I have poled an EC Lostmen (3 men aboard) for less than an hour which is what I am buying. It was sweet! I agree its not as easy as it looks but there are tricks, like avoiding poling long distances into the wind, avoiding trying to hold her in a strongish current, using the shoreline to your advantage, etc. No doubt I've got a lot to learn and muscles to get sore. Mostly though, I just hope I don't fall off the platform over oysters. 

I pretty much have Stuart's attitude... In my experience redfish, trout, flounder, etc are like deer or turkeys...not the sharpest tools in the shed. They simply rely on instinct which I regularly conquer. Plus I am blessed (or cursed) with an attitude that says I can do anything I put my head and heart to doing. I've done it more times than I can remember in subjects that I had little or no experience with. So yeah, I sold my flats boat and jumped into the poling skiff world with both feet...cuz I ain't skeert!


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

You got it bro...but you're gonna have to take your turns on the pole. :slimer:

I just knew this whole poling skiff/fly fishing thing was gonna turn me on to lots of new friends! Y'all are 2cool!!! :texasflag



Golden said:


> LF ...man when you jump in you really jump in...
> 
> So once you get your new boat, and before frustration sets in CALL ME I'LL LET YOU POLE ME ALL DAY BACK IN MULE SLOUGH while you learn oh yeah one other thing - can I use your new Xi3 too?
> 
> ...


----------



## Golden (Aug 1, 2006)

So does that mean I lost my shot at the bow of your new ECC back in Mule Slough...c'mon man give me one more shot!


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

LOL! No way you lost a shot. You just gotta ride the pole too!



Golden said:


> So does that mean I lost my shot at the bow of your new ECC back in Mule Slough...c'mon man give me one more shot!


----------



## Laguna Freak (Nov 15, 2006)

CG, got your message. Thank you! :cheers:


----------



## Boboe (Feb 11, 2009)

There's plenty of good fly fishing to do around Austin. Lady Bird Lake, Lake Bastrop, the Colorado below town, the Colorado up at Colorado Bend, etc. Certainly you can fly fish Lake Austin, Lake Travis, Marble Falls, Buchannon, Fayette, etc etc. Lemme know if you need any pointers on some local lakes.


----------

