# Remington Sendero issues



## redexpress

I know this is the reloading board but this is as close as it gets. I have issues with a 264 Sendero I bought a couple of years ago. It will shoot fair but that ain't good enough for the dollars I have in it. It's been back to Remington and they diagnosed a rough chamber and replaced the barrel. They included a target they shot that had about a 2" group like "this is good". Does anyone know a shop in the Houston area that can inspect the rifle and maybe "tune it up"? I could send it to Hill Country Rifles but it's $500 to accurize it, and I'm just not spending that much with a "maybe it will help and maybe it won't" promise.


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## Muddskipper

Briley... It's not cheap...but they can turn it into a custom rifle.

Check their web site for pricing and to get an idea

Taking it over now is better than doing it in the fall


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## B-Money

Agree with MSkipper on the timing. But...don't throw good money after bad. If the Sendaro is not doing it for you, sell it and use that cash to have a 264 built the way you want it.

You can buy a $300 Marlin bolt action 270 that will give you better than 2" using a $99 Simmons scope.


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## Bantam1

I wouldn't have accepted the rifle from Remington. The Sendero is not one of their cheaper models by any means. 2" is not acceptable considering they had the rifle to repair a poor shooting problem prior.


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## Bottomsup

2" sucks at 100 yards sucks. I would take a look at the bedding first. Does your stock have the aluminum plate in it? Also make sure the barrel is free floating. No offense but we dont know what kind of shooter you are. I have met many at the range that cant shoot a 2" group with gun that will shoot one hole groups. In this heat take one shot and let the barrel cool back to ambient temp before the next shot. Also try to do it on a calm day. A 20 MPH cross wind can move the bullet over and inch.


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## THE JAMMER

AS bottomsup says, lots of other things could be the problem: ammo, bedding, loose scope screws, trigger, etc.

What kind of scope do you have on it??

Kerry O'Day at Match Grade does some awfully good work locally.


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## nasakid

I'd sell it and start over. Not worth the effort or money you're going to put into it trying to fix the factory issue. I like Remingtons, but for the money and accuracy out of the box, a Savage with an Accu-Trigger is the way to go these days.


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## Bottomsup

nasakid said:


> I'd sell it and start over. Not worth the effort or money you're going to put into it trying to fix the factory issue. I like Remingtons, but for the money and accuracy out of the box, a Savage with an Accu-Trigger is the way to go these days.


But can you sell it in good faith knowing it doesnt shoot right? I disagree that a lot of money needs to be spent on it.


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## THE JAMMER

What scope???????? That could be your problem- putting a Kia scope on a Ferrari gun.


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## Bantam1

You would think that Remington would have used quality stuff in their testing and that the action was torqued correctly. He said they sent him a test target. I was going to mention everything that everyone else said until I read that they sent him the 2" test target.


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## THE JAMMER

Yeah Bantam. That's true. If the best they could get out of it is 2" ?????? Like you said, you would think they would have everything right.

Have to say I was impressed with Bottomsup comment about "can you sell it in good faith..." Sure nice to know there are still some honest people out there. Good on ya.


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## Bottomsup

Thank you Jammer. Its the right thing to do or disclose the target to the potential buyer. Torque on the action screws means very little unless the bed is uneven and binding the action. I learned how to pillar bed rifles from Mobe Renalds who tested barrels for Ed Shillen. I would never shoot a Rem 700 where the barrel wasnt fully floated.


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## Bottomsup

Hell send it to me and I will find out whats wrong with it. You pay shipping both ways.


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## Ernest

I'd break in the new barrel while working up some loads on a good, solid rest. 

The platform itself should shoot well under an inch at 200 yards. Not with some POS scope, but with decent glass/mounts, decent hand loaded ammo, and any decent shooter. 

If this is just factory ammo, buy a bunch of different brands, and work your way thru them to find out if any of them will shoot.


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## muddyfuzzy

senderos are otb tack drivers, they plain shoot for a factory rig...... i've never heard otherwise. i shoot a .25-06 sendero and wouldn't trade it for the world; therefore, i think there is some underlying issue here. give active tuning solutions a call @ 713-725-2497 or e-mail them @ www.activecamo.com . they do great work on custm rifles and don't break the bank.


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## coogerpop

Chuck Sisk is one of the finest gunsmiths around here.....


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## redexpress

I was shooting it with a Leupold VX2 4 x 12 x 40 in Talley 1 piece mounts/rings. It's now on a Rem XCR 308 compact tactical, and it shoots good. I'm a decent shot...I used to shoot my 300 H&H in a 1" group if I was doing it right. But I AM getting older. Granted I'm also trying to use factory ammo, which isn't great for 264.
I didn't think there was a smaller caliber than 264 in the Sendero line. 
If O'Day has that shop near Carter's, nothing I own will ever go there again. He absolutely butchered a Colt 1911 for me. With an attitude to boot.
I'll try the other shop mentioned besides Sisk. I do have a budget for this rifle. 
Thanks for the help folks.


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## THE JAMMER

Wow, sorry about that with Match Grade. First time I've heard that. Although he is really a "rifle guy." Never had him do any pistol work for me.


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## MARK MACALUSO

Man. I have a 7mm Ultra Mag that I almost went through the same problems. Sent it back to Remington. Same answer as above. Had a Zeiss scope, overheard a person saying had problems. Sent scope back got new one same thing. FINALLY, I was in Carters and overheard a guy say he has the same gun and will only shoot 160 grain Nosler Partitions in REMINGTON ONLY. Oh well, I tried it and Holly Sh$t, the gun will literally drive nails. Shooting a hole in a hole. Never in my life did I think that would make such a big difference. Has not skipped a beat yet.


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## THE JAMMER

MARK MACALUSO said:


> Man. I have a 7mm Ultra Mag that I almost went through the same problems. Sent it back to Remington. Same answer as above. Had a Zeiss scope, overheard a person saying had problems. Sent scope back got new one same thing. FINALLY, I was in Carters and overheard a guy say he has the same gun and will only shoot 160 grain Nosler Partitions in REMINGTON ONLY. Oh well, I tried it and Holly Sh$t, the gun will literally drive nails. Shooting a hole in a hole. Never in my life did I think that would make such a big difference. Has not skipped a beat yet.


Who knows? Maybe remington only uses one brand of ammo, maybe Remington, and that ain't the best to shoot in that rifle. Your cheapest solution might be to try some federal premium, and see how that goes.


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## Bantam1

I had a friend that went through a similar problem with a Rem 700 in 300WSM. They had the rifle for months and called him and offered him another rifle in a different caliber. He ended up with a 7mm and is happy with his decision. 

Every rifle will be picky with the ammo it wants. I have loads for my 308 that shoot 1/4 MOA and will go 1+ in a friends rifle. They are almost identical. We did it just to see if they shoot well. Then what really messes with your mind is why does Federal Match 308 shoot awesome out of every 308 rifle...anyways maybe you need to try some more brands and see if you can find a good load it likes.


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## RB II

I have Weatherby 7 mag that shot 6"+ (absolutely not an exaggeration)with premium 139 gr. Hornady loads. Shoots 150 gr hand loads at 1/2" or better. Go figure.


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## redexpress

I tried the cheap Remington ammo and the cheap Winchester, both of which was the only available loads in their brand. The best I have done is with Conley Precision. I see Nosler has several loads and that is my next move.


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## THE JAMMER

redexpress said:


> I tried the cheap Remington ammo and the cheap Winchester, both of which was the only available loads in their brand. The best I have done is with Conley Precision. I see Nosler has several loads and that is my next move.


NO NO NO!!! The most consistent premium ammo is Federal Premium match.

OOPS. Just checked no Federal ammo in 264 mag. Sorry.


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## Bigj

Handloading or Factory ammo


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## JDog

redexpress said:


> I tried the cheap Remington ammo and the cheap Winchester, both of which was the only available loads in their brand. The best I have done is with Conley Precision. I see Nosler has several loads and that is my next move.


I was going to tell you that I have had great luck with Hornady custom ammo in my .300WM Sendero, but I didn't see any .264WM ammo on the hornady site. I can say that even though my Sendero is super accurate, just like any other rifle there is certainly some ammo it just doesn't like. It's shot some 2-3" groups before until I tried the Hornady and the Winchester Powerpoint ammo. It loves both of those and will usually shoot them at 3/4 of an inch. It hated core-loks, accubonds, weights different than 180's, etc. etc. etc. Until you've tried quite a few different brands I wouldn't do anything drastic just yet.


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## redexpress

Yeah, I hate to sell it. I think the 264 is a great caliber and I don't think I've given it a fair chance yet. I'll try the Nosler and Double Tap ammo, but I think it is tipping the scales to get me back into reloading. 
I've got some spending to do. I took the Leupold scope off it and put it on the 308. Now I need to decide what to replace it with, or put the Leupold 4x12 back on the 264 and buy something else for the 308. Never ends, thankfully!


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## Myanmar_Shave

I had the same problem with a 700 mountain rifle in 7mm mag. I tried everything, different scope, factory ammo, hand loaded ammo using different bullets and powders. I finally just sold it and moved on.


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## Bottomsup

HydraSports said:


> I have Weatherby 7 mag that shot 6"+ (absolutely not an exaggeration)with premium 139 gr. Hornady loads. Shoots 150 gr hand loads at 1/2" or better. Go figure.


Not trying to start anything but 6"? I have never owned or shot a rifle that shot that poor with any ammo.


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## redexpress

I've got a Remington XCR 308 compact tactical that shoots <1" groups with Federal Premium Sierra 165 Gameking and 6" groups with Hornady Superformance. Go figure x2.


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## spurgersalty

Same issue with the old Hornady "Light Mag" and my wifes 700 243. Switched to Hornady Custom with the interlock and it hangs around an inch.
But with IMR4064 pushing an 80 TTSX, it drops below moa.


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## RB II

Bottomsup said:


> Not trying to start anything but 6"? I have never owned or shot a rifle that shot that poor with any ammo.


Agree and neither have I until this one and it is only with that Hornady superformance ammo. Don't know if it is so hot that it takes a longer barrel or different twist or what, but I am not exaggerating about 6" nor the <1/2" with the handloads. Same rifle and scope.


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## redexpress

same here. 
same rifle, same scope, same day.


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## Bottomsup

HydraSports said:


> Agree and neither have I until this one and it is only with that Hornady superformance ammo. Don't know if it is so hot that it takes a longer barrel or different twist or what, but I am not exaggerating about 6" nor the <1/2" with the handloads. Same rifle and scope.


I bet it has more to do with how far the bullet is from the lands. With factory ammo and chambers that are a tad large to accept all ammo brands. I have found on lowly .22 rimfires the bullet distance from the lands makes a huge difference and almost all of my centerfires like the bullet just touching the lands. If the throat is a little large compared to the brass neck the bullet has to jump start into the lands and if the factory ammo isnt a good fit in the chamber the bullet has no chance of starting down the bore perfect. I bet some hand loads would turn this rifle into a tack driver.


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## redexpress

I agree with you about the leade. When I used to handload that was my first check. Load a bullet "long" in an empty brass case, mark the bullet with a marks a lot, chamber it, check contact, and keep backing the bullet down until you get the desired leade.


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## woods

IME 264 win mags are notoriously finicky as with most seriously overbore calibers. I've had 2, sold one and rebarreled the other to a different caliber. The factory ammo is anemic at best and has a *LOT* of head clearance for a very sloppy fit in the chamber


















Remington quality is not what it used to be but can be *MADE *to shoot with a lot of effort. Of course, some will get lucky and have a shooter right out of the box but most consider the Remington useful because of the design of the action/bolt and fast lock time. Most Remington factory rifles I have dealt with have been long throated, short shouldered and large case bodied chambers. All of which can be dealt with.

You can have the action squared at a gunsmith relatively cheap and that is not something you should do yourself. Then you can buy a box of Acraglas and bed the recoil lug, the action just behind the recoil lug at the action screw and under the chamber portion of the barrel. It is skeery the first time but with lots of release agent it is not that hard to do. Torque the screws down to the recommended foot pounds. Then free float the barrel with judicious use of a dremel.

Once you do any of this or reload for it the factory will be happy to tell you that it voids the warranty but I doubt you will get and good results from them anyway.

That and reloading will more than likely make a huge improvement. The dies that I like to use for making straight ammo are not available in 264 win mag (Lee Collet/Redding Body Die) but you can have them made fairly cheaply or go the conventional route with expander balls and standard dies.

A pre-64 Winchester Model 70 in 264 win mag was the reason I started reloading many years ago but don't own one now.


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## redexpress

Looks like you are showing 0.038" difference on Win factory ammo and your load? That's quite a "jump" to the barrel.


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## woods

redexpress said:


> Looks like you are showing 0.038" difference on Win factory ammo and your load? That's quite a "jump" to the barrel.


Yes, the worst before this particular 264 win mag was the previous Model 70 in 264 win mag at .0295". Most of the other belted mags fall around .020" or so.

It would be interesting to see how much clearance you have. You can make the measurements with a socket in a pinch as long as it hits about the middle of the shoulder and you have a caliper.


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## deckh

Woods, Whoa! You torque action screws to given INCH POUNDS definitely not foot pounds.


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## Bottomsup

Torque on action screws doesnt mean a **** thing if the action fits the bed properly. If not your only gambling with them.


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## woods

deckh said:


> Woods, Whoa! You torque action screws to given INCH POUNDS definitely not foot pounds.


Ooops! Good thing my torque wrench knows the difference and is keeping track! hwell:


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## kanga69

Ammo problem? I shoot a 264 in a win mod 70. With factory ammo there were only 2 choices that I found. Winchester and Remington in 140 grain bullets. Winchester shot a little over 2 inches and remington shot a little over an inch. I used to hand load some 120 grain spear hollow points that shot hole in a hole. To sum up, my gun didn't like the 140s but it would flat eat up the 120s.


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## kanga69

One other thought. Nosler will hand load you a box with different bullet weights. My buddy did that with his. Worth a shot.


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## redexpress

I've got 125 and 140 Partitions on order from Nosler. I'll do the scope swap and try them.


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## davidb

Did you check the bedding, muzzle crown, all screws and trigger? If the barrel is contacting anything unevenly you will be wasting ammo trying to get smaller groups.

Most good gunsmiths can do a tune up and bedding job at a reasonable price that will fix most problems. If the barrel is out of alignment then it takes more drastic measures, by that point a re-barrel job may end up being the only sure fix.


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