# Does white antlers mean a protein deficiency?



## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

We got a new lease up in N. Blanco Co. this year and it's crazy how white all the bucks antlers are. We're all lifelong hunters and actually had a hill country lease for years and we've never seen so many white horned deer, some here and there but nothing like this. We're guessing it's because of a lack of protein, but we're no biologists. Anybody have any opinions on this?


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## mywifeshusband (Nov 19, 2006)

I dont know we have a mixture of both light and dark. Have been told there is a lot of protein from plants in our area and I load my feeders with roasted sowbeans and protein with corn and milo for the birds. If you find out please let me know. Beau


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Antlers get their color from the bushes the bucks use to rub off the velvet.


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## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

M16 said:


> Antlers get their color from the bushes the bucks use to rub off the velvet.


Interesting, i never thought of that.


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## diamondback72 (Aug 10, 2011)

http://www.whitetailhunting.info/whitetail-deer/what-determines-antler-color-in-bucks/


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## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

Thanks Diamondback for the read, learn something every day.


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## BMD (Dec 7, 2012)

No it does not have anything to do with it.


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## Rusty S (Apr 6, 2006)

M16 said:


> Antlers get their color from the bushes the bucks use to rub off the velvet.


 Really? How do you explain those chocolate horn McMullen county deer, I know for a fact thats a genetic trait. rs


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## jgale (Mar 4, 2011)

Rusty S said:


> Really? How do you explain those chocolate horn McMullen county deer, I know for a fact thats a genetic trait. rs


So, you are saying antler color is genetic?


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## ksk (Aug 9, 2008)

*Horn Color*

I worked on a south Texas ranch for three years with a biologist and this is what he told me: horn color will vary because of age,diet and health of the deer.Minerals found in the shrubs they eat and minerals in the ground[shrub growth] are one of the biggest factors.He also said that yes, a buck rubbing his velvet against certain plants would affect them also.He said that the amount of blood left in the velvet and the type of plant that is being rubbed on could affect the color out come with the blood being mixed with the plant. Genetics could also be a factor.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Rusty S said:


> Really? How do you explain those chocolate horn McMullen county deer, I know for a fact thats a genetic trait. rs


McMullen county has more chocolate trees than other counties.


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## BretE (Jan 24, 2008)

M16 said:


> McMullen county has more chocolate trees than other counties.


Lol.........


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## BMD (Dec 7, 2012)

The answer to the guys question is a simple no!


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## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

Here's a prime example, this buck needs a bullet bad, but we have an 8 or better rule so he got a reprieve.


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## BMD (Dec 7, 2012)

Who ever made the 8 or better rule doesn't understand mgt at all.


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## Law Dog (Jul 27, 2010)

There needs to be some exceptions to the 8 pt rule!


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## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

Law Dog said:


> There needs to be some exceptions to the 8 pt rule!


No doubt, we tried to plead to the landowner but to no avail. We got some funky bucks up there and i'm sure plenty of doe bred with the funky genes, but that's his rules so we abide.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

Ever notice how most pen raised buck have light colored antlers?


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## Capt. Marcus Canales (Aug 25, 2005)

Rack Ranch said:


> Ever notice how most pen raised buck have light colored antlers?


winner winner, chicken dinner. :cheers:


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

Rack Ranch said:


> Ever notice how most pen raised buck have light colored antlers?


Ya, cause they rub them on steel posts.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Anter is bone. Bone is white. Something has to stain them. Blood leftover from velvet will stain some. But the majority comes from the bushes where they rub their antlers.


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## Rusty S (Apr 6, 2006)

M16 said:


> Anter is bone. Bone is white. Something has to stain them. Blood leftover from velvet will stain some. But the majority comes from the bushes where they rub their antlers.


I have never seen a buck with green antlers, most bushes have green leaves. rs


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Rusty S said:


> I have never seen a buck with green antlers, most bushes have green leaves. rs


I have never seen a buck rub his antlers on leaves. Most rub on bark. Bark contains oil and sap which color the antlers.


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## Too Tall (May 21, 2004)

Rusty S said:


> I have never seen a buck with green antlers, most bushes have green leaves. rs


and brown/gray trunks. :brew2:


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## Rusty S (Apr 6, 2006)

You guys are 2 much, I will be looking for green antlered deer next year though, because when you brake the bark guess what the color is before it is white--green. Next time you are close to a tree, lets say a mesquite, take your knife out and scrape the bark and see if it is not green--unless it's dead. I will say that cedar trees might not have a green under skin, thus I will also keep my eyes open for red antlered deer also. I can't believe ya'll haven't come up with a black brush explanation. And M you have never seen a buck rub his head in mesquite branches that have green leaves? I bet you have. rs


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## SSST (Jun 9, 2011)

Just when i thought my question was answered, here come Rusty...i really don't know what the deal is, i've been on quite a few different places and have never seen so many white antlers, one thing about it, they make it easy to tell that a buck is coming out.


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## Rusty S (Apr 6, 2006)

ksk said:


> I worked on a south Texas ranch for three years with a biologist and this is what he told me: horn color will vary because of age,diet and health of the deer.Minerals found in the shrubs they eat and minerals in the ground[shrub growth] are one of the biggest factors.He also said that yes, a buck rubbing his velvet against certain plants would affect them also.He said that the amount of blood left in the velvet and the type of plant that is being rubbed on could affect the color out come with the blood being mixed with the plant. Genetics could also be a factor.


 Here is the best answer on this thread. rs


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Rusty S said:


> Here is the best answer on this thread. rs


Actually it is the least factual response. Genetics and diet have nothing to do with the coloring of antlers. Antlers are bone and bone is white. Genetics and nutrition have nothing to do with the color of antlers. Age can be a factor. An old buck can have lighter antlers because he can no longer rub the velvet off on brush like a younger buck. Hence the whiter horns as the velvet dries and drops off on it's own.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Rusty S said:


> You guys are 2 much, I will be looking for green antlered deer next year though, because when you brake the bark guess what the color is before it is white--green. Next time you are close to a tree, lets say a mesquite, take your knife out and scrape the bark and see if it is not green--unless it's dead. I will say that cedar trees might not have a green under skin, thus I will also keep my eyes open for red antlered deer also. I can't believe ya'll haven't come up with a black brush explanation. And M you have never seen a buck rub his head in mesquite branches that have green leaves? I bet you have. rs


The resins in the brush produce the majority of the staining not the color of the bark.


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## TXShooter (Aug 13, 2007)

In Kansas where I hunt, I have never seen a dark horned buck. I don't have the answer as to why.


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## dalaka (Jun 25, 2009)

I tend to lean towards genetics and diet. Seems to me that the coloration comes from the inside out....and not from the outside in. I would think that if it came from the bark/brush/leaves...that the horns would be blotched in areas and not so uniformly colored. All of the chocolate horned deer that I have seen are very uniform in color...except for lighter tips. We have both white and dark horned deer on our place....and they tend to carry that trait year to year....which leans me to genetics.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

dalaka said:


> I tend to lean towards genetics and diet. Seems to me that the coloration comes from the inside out....and not from the outside in. I would think that if it came from the bark/brush/leaves...that the horns would be blotched in areas and not so uniformly colored. All of the chocolate horned deer that I have seen are very uniform in color...except for lighter tips. We have both white and dark horned deer on our place....and they tend to carry that trait year to year....which leans me to genetics.










Here is the base of a shed antler. The core is bone white. How would the color come from the inside? Antler points and tips are lighter because these are the least rubbed areas. Bases and beams are darker because they get rubbed the most. Why do antlers become lighter before they are shed? It's because they quit rubbing after the rut. Antler color begins to fade after the rubbing stops.


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## gulfcoast200 (Jun 26, 2004)

I was told the earlier they rub the velvet off the darker the horns will be, and the later they loose the velvet during the process the lighter color they will be. Just my 2 cents to the thread. I really dont have a clue or care as long as they stop long enough for me to shoot them.


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## cgerace19 (Jul 17, 2008)

M16, i think if your photo can't convince them otherwise nothing will.


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## dalaka (Jun 25, 2009)

I'll can see that logic along with when they rub in the velvet cycle.....good stuff



M16 said:


> View attachment 565540
> 
> Here is the base of a shed antler. The core is bone white. How would the color come from the inside? Antler points and tips are lighter because these are the least rubbed areas. Bases and beams are darker because they get rubbed the most. Why do antlers become lighter before they are shed? It's because they quit rubbing after the rut. Antler color begins to
> fade after the rubbing stops.


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## limpline (Sep 15, 2009)

Just get you some warm, soapy, and a scrub brush and wash them. If it's from the inside out, nothing will happen but if it's what they rub on, some of it will come clean and turn bone color. Don't do this on the trophy you have hanging on the wall cause the dark will wash off!


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

limpline said:


> Just get you some warm, soapy, and a scrub brush and wash them. If it's from the inside out, nothing will happen but if it's what they rub on, some of it will come clean and turn bone color. Don't do this on the trophy you have hanging on the wall cause the dark will wash off!


Yep. Just like those deer horns do during a wet winter, they turn almost snow white by the time they are ready to drop.


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## tokavi (May 6, 2006)

If you have ever seen a buck in velvet killed and the antlers stripped you would know the color comes from rubbing. When a dead buck is stripped of velvet the antlers are extremely white, almost unnatural. Blood stains, tree bark, resin, sap, all combine to color the antlers. I hunt Kansas also and I agree, you do not see many dark horned deer there. You also see most rubs on cedar, ash and plum trees. All trees that have little sap. In Montana you see lots of white horned mulies on the prairies, all they have to rub is sagebrush. When you move to areas with pine the bucks have darker horns, this is where 90% of the rubs you see are on pine trees, lots of sap. See a pattern forming here. Hunted Missouri a couple of times in January. All the bucks are white horned but the guy I hunt with has killed lots of dark horned bucks. He said it happens every year, the later in the season the whiter they get because they stop rubbing and the antlers bleach out. Nuff said, my .02


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## Rusty S (Apr 6, 2006)

M16 said:


> View attachment 565540
> 
> Here is the base of a shed antler. The core is bone white. How would the color come from the inside? Antler points and tips are lighter because these are the least rubbed areas. Bases and beams are darker because they get rubbed the most. Why do antlers become lighter before they are shed? It's because they quit rubbing after the rut. Antler color begins to fade after the rubbing stops.


 A shed antler is a dead antler, but to make you happy, you are right and your logic is correct. Range conditions, nutrition, and genetics have nothing to do with it. I will make a call tomorrow and ask a man this question, but then again if his answer disagrees with yours---I guess you will argue he is wrong. Even if his dad started what we call normal in South Texas hunting, I will admit if I am wrong, you will show another shed probably---it is what it is. rs


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## broadonrod (Feb 26, 2010)

The dark horn deer only feed at night... The lighter horned deer feed during the day and the sun bleaches them out...  LOL


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Rusty S said:


> A shed antler is a dead antler rs


An antler is basically dead when the velvet is shed. During the growth stage deer are very protective of their antlers. Because it is painful when they get injured. Once the blood flow stops things change. Deer start rubbing them on hard surfaces and start sparring with other bucks. Thats because the antlers are dead bone. If the antlers were "live" deer wouldn't fight because it would be too painful.

I'll be interested in what your man has to say. From your description of the man who started the management philosophy in South Texas that would be Roy Hindes Sr. His son is Roy Jr. Who is a friend of mine. Roy not only has some of the best tracking dogs around he also is one of the most knowledgeable fellows around when it comes to deer management.

I'm sorry if I came across as all knowing. Just stating my opinion. The fun thing about deer and deer hunting is that we always learn something new and never get it completely figured out.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

broadonrod said:


> The dark horn deer only feed at night... The lighter horned deer feed during the day and the sun bleaches them out...  LOL


Winner! LMAO


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