# Reef Permit?



## A Salt Weapon

Can someone please shed some light on this "Reef Permit"? I heard recently that a local guide got busted for chartering a trip offshore for some sanpper fishing, where he was checked by federal game wardens. He didn't have a "Reef Permit" and was ticketed for a potentially large fine.

I had not heard of this.

Is this for real and where the heck did this "permit" come from?

Thanks


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## whos your daddy

*Permit*

To legally charter you must have a reef fish permit if you are fishing for snapper or other reef fish. This permit at one time was issued by the NFMS and now because of the moritorium , they must be purchased by an individual who already owns one and wants to sell it. It is pricey though. Make sure the permit is current and is tranferable before you buy one. You also need to have a highly migratory species or a Peligic fish permit to target kingfish , etc etc. Both sets are usually going for 8k to 10k.


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## Sixtoe

The permits have been around for a long time. There are three of them I think that you need to run charters. The government has put a moratorium (sp) on them so no one is allowed to buy them unless you buy them from a capt. that is selling them at his price. The prices I have seen are around $12000 for them and have even seen them for sell as high as $18000. It is just more political bs that any charter capt. tryin to make a living has to deal with.


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## Sixtoe

Man Mark you type fast; I was the only one on this thread when I started typing.


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## fonz

What was the price on those before they stopped issuing them??


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## Sixtoe

I want to say in the hundreds not thousands? Really not sure though.


fonz said:


> What was the price on those before they stopped issuing them??


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## Levelwind

you need two to run reef fish charters, basically. 

A HMS permit (not under moratoriam and not expensive) is a good idea in case you want to keep a shark, billfish, or tuna other than blackfin. Can't remember if it's reqd for wahoo. 

they were around $60 before the moratoriam.


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## Mike Jennings

there are several of those stories floating arround,,the most recent that i have heard was supposed to have happened to someone out of Sabine Pass,,i know of no confirmed cases ,, maby someone else can shed some light on that one

the permits that you are referring to are Federal Permits for Vessels Fishing in the exclusive economic zone 
or EEZ , and are required for all Charter / Headboats fishing in the Zone,,(federal waters) there is a HMS or highly migratory species permit that can be purchased and there are two others that are currently under a moratorium , they are the Coastal Migratory Pelagic and the Reef Fish Permits, these can only be purchased from someone who holds a current , transferable set..and are issued by the U.S. Department of Commerce NOAA and are selling anywhere from $ 7,000 to $ 12,000 ,, look at the next charter boat you see and you will notice a sticker on the port side of the hull, wheel house, or console that sticker accompanies the permits and is to be displayed at all times...hope that helps.....Mike


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## A Salt Weapon

So, what you're saying is that, financially, someone would have to be nuts to start a charter service, since it would be many years before you re-coup your $$


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## Mike Jennings

fonz said:


> What was the price on those before they stopped issuing them??


about 35 bucks


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## Mike Jennings

A Salt Weapon said:


> So, what you're saying is that, financially, someone would have to be nuts to start a charter service, since it would be many years before you re-coup your $$


LOL,,dont tease me now,
you mean you can actualy recoup it.???????
.
seriously,,you can recoup if you build a base and run enough trips,,but your not going to get rich


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## Levelwind

A Salt Weapon said:


> So, what you're saying is that, financially, someone would have to be nuts to start a charter service, since it would be many years before you re-coup your $$


Who's saying that? It's quite probably that your $75K boat will depreciate a lot faster than your $10K permit. With any luck, and if the feds don't go crazy one way (lifting the moratoriam or cutting the limit to zero), or the other, the permits will probably hold their value. They're a speculative investment, though.

Reasons not to go into the charter business abound. Permits are a minor one.


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## CHARLIE

I think some of the stories get twisted. What has happened is some folks with a 200 # permit (snapper) were using it to fish during the closed season(to recreationals anyway) and taking folks charter fishing to catch snapper. That is a no no but it happens all the time.

Charlie


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## bsheep

Actually, even private, recreational boats are supposed to have a Highly Migratory Species Permit to fish for sharks, tuna, and billfish in Federal waters over 9 miles from the Texas shoreline. It is $25, and can be obtained on the NOAA Fisheries website - give them a credit card number and prinit it yourself. There is a separate one for Charter/Headboats. Before the moratorium on Reef and Pelagic permits, they could not be sold or transferred, and the renewal was about $35 apiece. When I got my original permit, there was only one, no charge, supposedly just for government information on the number of charterboats operating. It would be good to hear they were finally enforcing this law, but I haven't heard of any confirmed cases, either. As far as I know, wahoo, dolphin, and blackfin tuna are about the only sportfish not covered by one permit or the other right now, but that could change soon.


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## Bill Fisher

glad y'all said sumpin....... 

i see my '06 rec HMS permit expires the end o'this month and i haven't rec'd the the usual e-mail notice yet

so, heads up! everybody......... it's that time o'year again

looks like some changes have been made too........ now it's gonna be valid from the date of issuance through December 31, 2008


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## THE JAMMER

ROGER THAT MIKE ON THE STICKER ON THE BOAT,

If a boat is chartering without that sticker, they are not licensed to charter.

I'm one of the guys who paid a lot of money for mine, and am doing it legally. It really incenses me that people are out there "breaking the law" and getting away with it. I guess it's no worse than just walking across the border though.

Why is it that if I lend someone $500, and they don't pay me back, and I ask them to pay me -- *I'M THE JERK *??

It's gotten to where laws don't seem to matter anymore. Whether it's catching undersized fish, commercial over fishing, guiding without permits, immigration, etc. But they will sure bust my _ _ _ for having a flare that's expired by one month. WHAT THE _ _ _ _ IS GOING ON HERE??

THE "DOING IT LEGALLY" JAMMER



Mike Jennings said:


> there are several of those stories floating arround,,the most recent that i have heard was supposed to have happened to someone out of Sabine Pass,,i know of no confirmed cases ,, maby someone else can shed some light on that one
> 
> the permits that you are referring to are Federal Permits for Vessels Fishing in the exclusive economic zone
> or EEZ , and are required for all Charter / Headboats fishing in the Zone,,(federal waters) there is a HMS or highly migratory species permit that can be purchased and there are two others that are currently under a moratorium , they are the Coastal Migratory Pelagic and the Reef Fish Permits, these can only be purchased from someone who holds a current , transferable set..and are issued by the U.S. Department of Commerce NOAA and are selling anywhere from $ 7,000 to $ 12,000 ,, *look at the next charter boat you see and you will notice a sticker on the port side of the hull, wheel house, or console that sticker accompanies the permits and is to be displayed at all times...hope that helps.....Mike*


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## Levelwind

There IS a little list. You're not the only legal operator who feels this way and the little list has been compiled over a couple years - pretty accurate - and TPWD and USCG have it. Sooner or later.


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## Capt. Dustin Lee

It does make you mad when you see someone out there breaking the law and we are spending lots of $$$$$ to be legal. I am glad that I dont have to be watching over my shoulder wondering if I am going to get busted for not having everything needed to be legal.

Capt. Dustin Lee
Fish'N Addiction Guide Service
[email protected]
www.TexasBigFish.com

Team Lone Star Graphite Rods
Team Brown Lures
Team AMP Lures
Coming Soon Team Mosca Boats


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## Gethookedadventures

theres alot of people out there running charters who do not have that permit, some because the choose not to buy one others because they did not know about it dont go gettin all pissy on someone trying to figure out whats up and why things are happening


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## Capt. Dustin Lee

Well I'm not to worried about those who dont have what they need but their customers should. The way I look at it is, if anyone goes hunting or fishing, then they better know the bag limits and size limits. The Game Wardens are not going to give someone much of a break or any of a break at all if they do not know the laws. I do agree that it is not that easy finding what all is needed to be legal, written or on the internet for charter boats. When I was looking it took a few phone calls to find the right person that knew what I needed. The state tells you all you need is a state guide's license and the feds tell you all kinds of stuff.

Capt. Dustin Lee
Fish'N Addiction Guide Service
[email protected]
www.TexasBigFish.com

Team Lone Star Graphite Rods
Team Brown Lures
Team AMP Lures
Coming Soon Team Mosca Boats


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## Mont

> seriously,,you can recoup if you build a base and run enough trips,,but your not going to get rich


that's an understatment according to the latest numbers handed to me by NMFS. On average a 6 pack charter boat earns $34,949 per year in profits. Nearly all of them have mates, so anyway you divide that figure out, don't leave much grocery money when it's all said and done.


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## Rockfish

This the story I heard from someone with CCA. A priviate charter capt. had taken a group that had won a trip through a CCA banquet when he was boarded by the coastguard. The checked the boat over and left. Later they came back and and asked for his permits that he didnt have. The government fined and was going to take his boat. CCA is working to help get this guy off due to a loop hole in the system. The customers did not actually pay the charter capt for the trip, so CCA is working to get him out of this mess.


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## Levelwind

Gethookedadventures said:


> theres alot of people out there running charters who do not have that permit, some because the choose not to buy one others because they did not know about it dont go gettin all pissy on someone trying to figure out whats up and why things are happening


As much publicity as the moratoriam had, if they didn't know about it they didn't WANT to know about it. Same thing. Outlaws.


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## Gethookedadventures

Levelwind said:


> Huh. I'd love more details on that. If the guy was running illegal charters, CCA shouldn't be trying to get him off.
> 
> If he donated a gas money trip, with everyone aware of the arrangement, it wasn't a charter.


ok mr board warden your right outlaws some people are trying to make a lively hood out of fishing and when the goverment steps on someones lively hood people get mad the person who got the ticket out of sabine is a very respectable person in our area and has done more for people in a year than most will do in a lifetime sorry to ruffle your feathers sir i wish people on this site would just get off their high horse and come back down to earth


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## Levelwind

Rockfish said:


> This the story I heard from someone with CCA. A priviate charter capt. had taken a group that had won a trip through a CCA banquet when he was boarded by the coastguard. The checked the boat over and left. Later they came back and and asked for his permits that he didnt have. The government fined and was going to take his boat. CCA is working to help get this guy off due to a loop hole in the system. The customers did not actually pay the charter capt for the trip, so CCA is working to get him out of this mess.


Huh. I'd love more details on that. If the guy was running illegal charters, CCA shouldn't be trying to get him off.

If he donated a gas money trip, with everyone aware of the arrangement, it wasn't a charter.


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## snapper slapper lures

*picts*

Where is the fishing picts from your trip the other day? Woody


Gethookedadventures said:


> theres alot of people out there running charters who do not have that permit, some because the choose not to buy one others because they did not know about it dont go gettin all pissy on someone trying to figure out whats up and why things are happening


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## Levelwind

Gethookedadventures said:


> ok mr board warden your right outlaws some people are trying to make a lively hood out of fishing and when the goverment steps on someones lively hood people get mad the person who got the ticket out of sabine is a very respectable person in our area and has done more for people in a year than most will do in a lifetime sorry to ruffle your feathers sir i wish people on this site would just get off their high horse and come back down to earth


Not a board warden. I'm a guy who paid the $9000 to do it legally. It's a cost of doing business and if I'm competing against guys who save $9K by doing illegally, well, maybe you can figure out how that works.

And as far as that goes 
"when the goverment steps on someones lively hood people get mad"

If your friend was making his living legally fishing for red snapper, and paying taxes on the income derived therefrom, he either HAD a permit before the closure OR the NMFS would have issued him a "Historical Captains" license to keep fishing.

I could be wrong but it still sounds like he was a late entrant and just didn't want to pay.


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## Gethookedadventures

snapper slapper lures said:


> Where is the fishing picts from your trip the other day? Woody


 sure do i will pm them to you


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## Mike Jennings

Mont said:


> that's an understatment according to the latest numbers handed to me by NMFS. On average a 6 pack charter boat earns $34,949 per year in profits. Nearly all of them have mates, so anyway you divide that figure out, don't leave much grocery money when it's all said and done.


I would say that figure is prety accurate Mont,,that is why most of them hold more than one job, especialy in the winter.....Mike


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## THE JAMMER

I don't know anything at all about the Sabine deal, but:

Levelwind, I am with you 100% on this one. You and I both *wrote the check*.

I mean how can we, on this board and elsewhere, complain about the feds not enforcing the law regarding taking undersized fish, commercial over limits, etc., but it's ok for some one to guide without the permits. They are all "trying to make a living," but they are all *doing it illegally*.

Let's see: *not ok* to catch an extra 2000# of snapper on your commercial license, *not* *ok* to keep 11" snaps, *not ok* to kill thousands of pounds of bycatch shrimping, *but Ok to guide without the permits*???? Hmmmm!!!

So who determines which laws we are supposed to keep, and which ones are ok to break???

THE "CONFUSED" JAMMER


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## Mike Jennings

Levelwind said:


> There IS a little list. You're not the only legal operator who feels this way and the little list has been compiled over a couple years - pretty accurate - and TPWD and USCG have it. Sooner or later.


i personaly am not going to loose any sleep over the permit issue,,i have also seen a couple of those list's,,and they are not accurate,there was one a couple of years ago that was sent out to several captains unsigned and from a person claiming to be with NOAA from a houston area road runner address,some of the names on the list had there permits , some of the boats running with out them were not listed...and some of them have recently seen the light..
,i personaly do not know of a boat in Freeport that is currently running trips into the EEZ without permits,,if there is one ,,he has done a good job of not advertising the fact that he is running a charter vessel....


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## Mike Jennings

> I mean how can we, on this board and elsewhere, complain about the feds not enforcing the law regarding taking undersized fish, commercial over limits, etc., but it's ok for some one to guide without the permits. They are all "trying to make a living," but they are all *doing it illegally*.


you are justified in you feelings and absolutly correct my friend,,but it is going to take some enforcement to stop it,,and i dont have the answer for that one...my gut feeling tells me that it is comming though,,,just a matter of time


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## Levelwind

Mike Jennings said:


> personaly do not know of a boat in Freeport that is currently running trips into the EEZ without permits,,if there is one ,,he has done a good job of not advertising the fact that he is running a charter vessel....


I didn't mean to say the lists are complete, or comprehensive. The one I know about is accurate as far as it goes - i.e. the boats listed are unpermitted and are running charters. Not my list, by the way and no I won't say where it's from.

I think non compliance has gone down the past couple of years. Some unlicensed guys have given up the business and sold their permits (AKA - The Smart Ones - lol), and some have gotten the required permits.

OBTW, I don't think seizure of a man's boat, at least for a first offence, is justified. They issue tickets to the commercial boats that are thousands of pounds over. I believe the fine should be calculated to more than offset the gains made by operating illegally - otherwise it becomes a cost of doing business - and incentivize the operator to get out or get a permit.


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## Geaux Deep

*Illegal operators*

What is it about the word illegal that is so hard to understand?

The poor guy up the street is only trying to make a living but he is dealing illegal drugs. What is the problem? IT IS ILLEGAL.

What does illegal charters, illegal drug dealers, or illegal fishing methods have in common? They are all ILLEGAL.

So if you are operating illegal charters it is just a matter of time before you will lose your boat and equipment. Just ask the charter captain that was illegally taking passengers from SPI to Corpus Christi. He lost a $450,000.00 boat in the deal. RH


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## Mike Jennings

didn't mean to sound as if i were looking to argue LevelWind,,i agree with you on this issue,, a list of the offenders would be a good thing , enforcement would be better , hopefully ,,things are changing....Mike


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## gulf_addict

I didn't write the check, but I work for the man who did. Bottom line is, the permits are as much of a requirement as Capt. Licences and life vests. Either you write the check, get out, or if you want to run illegal, then have your boat siezed when you get caught. Simple. And yes, I believe having their boat siezed does fit. They willingly and knowingly did it illegally.

Too many people struggle and work too hard for that whopping sum of $35k a year to put up with outlaws. People call and ask the price for a charter, then you tell them, and then they say "well so and so can do it for half that much." I politely reply that if they wish to book a charter with a first class LEGAL operation on a great boat, then we're the people. If not, have a nice day and enjoy your trip.


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## jtburf

A friend contacted a charter service that came recommended off 2cool and asked the capt what about the reduction in snapper and the Capt said that there are no reduced limits and it's 4 a man and he plans to keep 4 a man !!! 

So point of my post is make sure the charter knows the rules!!!!


John


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## Levelwind

jtburf said:


> A friend contacted a charter service that came recommended off 2cool and asked the capt what about the reduction in snapper and the Capt said that there are no reduced limits and it's 4 a man and he plans to keep 4 a man !!!
> 
> So point of my post is make sure the charter knows the rules!!!!
> 
> John


Probably just means the captain has some good inside spots. I know 2 limits were caught two miles off the jetties a couple of weeks ago. Left them biting.

Early in the season I'd try to do the same. Scratch a couple fish out in state waters on the way in.

Point of my post is he probably know the rules.


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## jtburf

Levelwind said:


> Probably just means the captain has some good inside spots. I know 2 limits were caught two miles off the jetties a couple of weeks ago. Left them biting.
> 
> Early in the season I'd try to do the same. Scratch a couple fish out in state waters on the way in.
> 
> Point of my post is he probably know the rules.


I doubt that seeing as they were discussing snapper, grouper and Mahi ....
making a 40-60 mile run...

John


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## Levelwind

I'm discussing snapper. The limit in Texas waters (to 9 ms) is 4 per person. There is no limit on mahi. And they weren't talking about four ling per person unless they were smoking crack.

Best anyone has been able to tell, it's perfectly legal to keep two fish per angler in Federal waters and try to catch a couple more inside 9 ms. ON THE WAY IN. Not legal the other way around (illegal to possess more than 2 in Fed. waters). Guys are doing it. It won't last forever but while it does, bring your people back with four snapper apiece. Just do it legally.


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## captlee

the permits are $50 for the first and each additional permit is $20, so this means
you buy the reef for $50 and the pelagic is $20 , and yes to get the permits now you
will have to purchase them from some charter outfit for what ever and pay the fees
for transfer to your boat and each year after you pay the feds the $70 for the combo,
at least that was the rate last year to the feds capt lee


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## Levelwind

Sounds about right, Capt. Lee. Just got my renewal notice and havent sent it in yet. Best do that. Expires 5/31.


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## bsheep

The permits are required for red snapper and other reef fish in federal waters, kings and other pelagics in federal waters. HMS permit covers tuna, shark, billfsh in federal waters.No permit required to CHARTER for wahoo, dophin, blackfin tuna, bonito, etc. or to charter for red snapper (I don't believe any come from 2 miles off Galveston) kings, etc. in state waters. I have the permits, they are for sale because I am disgusted with the snapper regulatory process, and tired of fighting it. I am on the Coastal Pelagic Advisory Panel to the Gulf Council, have applied for the new Ad Hoc Advisory Panel being formed to FURTHER reduce recreational snapper catches, which is expected to be mostly manned by commercial interests.


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## captlee

If you run a charter off the atlantic to the west off of florida you have to have a dorado/
wahoo permit plus a pilot permit to get the wahoo/dorado permit, reef permit, your pelagic,
and if you want to ding hms fish you need that too???????? oh ya plus your
capt lic. my feelings on the moritorium is the feds screwed up and should have
made it manditory that any exiting charter outfit returns their permits back to
nmfs and the next guy in line would get them at the fed rate instead of leaving
it to the private charters to take advantage of new charters, however we know
that the nmfs is just a bunch of bureaucratic idiots corrupted by commercial fishing interests rather than what really is good for the general public that means recreational fishierman.recreational fishing used to incorporate the
those people who fished for meat and those who fished for the sport, it is
become more for the sport because of over fishing and limits set now to protect whats left of the fisheries, and the nfms has created a blackmarket
called moritorium charters and turned people into pirates legally and otherwise
capt lee


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## Levelwind

NMFS new strategy to get rid of charter boats. Make us carry so much paper and turtle release **** the boat won't float anymore.


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## captlee

If you run a charter off the atlantic to the west off of florida you have to have a dorado/
wahoo permit plus a pilot permit to get the wahoo/dorado permit, reef permit, your pelagic,
and if you want to ding hms fish you need that too???????? oh ya plus your
capt lic. my feelings on the moritorium is the feds screwed up and should have
made it manditory that any exiting charter outfit returns their permits back to
nmfs and the next guy in line would get them at the fed rate instead of leaving
it to the private charters to take advantage of new charters, however we know
that the nmfs is just a bunch of bureaucratic idiots corrupted by commercial fishing interests rather than what really is good for the general public that means recreational fishierman.recreational fishing used to incorporate the
those people who fished for meat and those who fished for the sport, it is
become more for the sport because of over fishing and limits set now to protect whats left of the fisheries, and the nfms has created a blackmarket
called moritorium charters and turned people into pirates legally and otherwise
capt lee


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## Hughoo222

The limit was 4 fish in federal waters till 5/2/07


jtburf said:


> I doubt that seeing as they were discussing snapper, grouper and Mahi ....
> making a 40-60 mile run...
> 
> John


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## A Salt Weapon

What's also sad about this whole mess is that most of us know people that run offshore and bring along their filet knife and zip-lok bags. It happens all the time, partly because they are a maverick and partly because their fed up with all the regulations. But the "honest" ones get busted heavily for having one over in an honest mistake while those guys hold a fish fry.

And if they outlaw recreational snapper fishing all together, we'll _STILL _be killing snapper while we fish for other species, since we still own a "white elephant" offshore boat so we might as well go fishin'!

I just don't see a clear answer for this huge problem, because if you shut down the commercial boys, now you're stepping on THEIR lively-hood.


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## jemfisherman

I see at least one thing clearly. The Rec limit has been reduced to 4 fish for how many years? And then our season cut to only half a year for how many years? And the snapper are still overfished. That points a very clear picture that there is some other source besides Rec fishing that is depleting the stocks. Stop the Rec fishing completely, and the snapper stocks will still get smaller.

It is time to put limits on the source of the depletion. Until that happens, snapper are in trouble.


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## A Salt Weapon

Preach on brutha!


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## hstnboatguy

I have seen a website that has permit listings. Does anyone know what site that is? I am in the market for a permit


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## Angler 1

http://marinersguide.com/dockswap/gulfcoast/


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## stang65

*How do you get one then?*

I've looked on several sites and I guess I'm just not lookin for the right thing. I can't find anything about these permits. I'm lookin to start up a small charter on the side, and was never told by USCG or TPWD bout these permits. If you guys find any links on it or any more info let me know please. That's what sucks bout laws these days, yu can get caught doin somethin you did't even know you were doin wrong.


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## bsheep

Although many charter operators have other, full time jobs because there just isn't all that much money in it, doing it "on the side" is getting more and more difficult. The permits are a big obstacle if you plan to fish for red snapper, kings, and a whole bunch of other species covered by the two federal permits. Because there is a moratorium on issuing new permits, you will have to buy them from someone who has them and is willing to sell (mine are for sale right now). Current asking prices seem to be running $8,000 to $10,000 for the pair. You also need a Highly Migratory Species permit to charter for sharks, tuna, and billfish in Fedral waters, but these are easy and cheap - and recreational anglers need them, also. Then there is captain's licensing, which is about to get more confusing, drug testing, the new alcohol test kit requirement, commercial liability insurance - and finding business in a world of "sport" fishermen who still think they should haul home a freezer full of meat every trip -and can't do that on two snapper and two kings.


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## Mont

don't feed the troll, gents


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## WildHare

*Reef Permit ...the law*

http://cfr.vlex.com/vid/622-4-permits-and-fees-19896535

This is a link to the actual regulation. If you have a charter boat / head boat license and you are not "selling" your catch this is all you need. Charter Boat Operators do not need a reef permit unless they are fishing outside of the "recreational" season and are keeping more than the "recreational" limit.... As long as you have a Charter Boat / Head boat you can take guests as long as you stay within the guidelines of "recreational" limits and season. I took the two hours of staying on the phone to Marine Fisheries to verify.
Stories of people getting hefty fines is related to issues where Charter Boat / Head Boat captains with Reef permits are taking paying customers to fish during commercial only season.


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## WildHare

http://cfr.vlex.com/vid/622-4-permits-and-fees-19896535

Check out this web site...has the legal definition - If you have a licensed captain on board and only fish within the recreational dates and keep recreational limits you don't need a reef permit.


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## REELBEAST

Arrrrrgggg!!!!!!!! This thread is five years old, May 2, 2007. What is this 2Cool Cold Case Files.

Straight from the CFR,

1) Charter vessel/headboat permits. (i) For a person aboard a vessel that is operating as a charter vessel or headboat to fish for or possess, in or from the EEZ, species in any of the following species groups, a valid charter vessel/headboat permit for that species group must have been issued to the vessel and must be on board?

(A) Gulf coastal migratory pelagic fish.

(B) South Atlantic coastal migratory pelagic fish.

(C) Gulf reef fish.

(D) South Atlantic snapper-grouper.

You need to have a Reef fish permit(C.) and a pelagic permit(A.) to take people on charters in the GOM!!!


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## jamisjockey

Sweet thread necrophilia, batman!


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## buzzard bill

*?????*

Wildhare, I don't know you so please don't take offense when I tell you that you are incorrect about permits not being required. You are confusing the permits needed by commercial fishermen who sell their catch to licensed fish wholesalers / restaurants, with the permits needed for a charter/head-boat captain to take people fishing. Yes, one captain / boat might have both commercial and charter permits and charter part of the time and commercially fish part of the time, but the two permits each have totally different purposes and restrictions.

There are many experienced and knowledgeable charter captains who have already posted their answers on this thread and have correctly stated that a charter captain in the GOM needs both reef and pelagic permits to fish for and retain reef and pelagic species in federal waters beyond the 9-mile TX state water limit. Both charter captains and private rec fishermen also need an HMS Angling permit https://hmspermits.noaa.gov/default.asp if they want to retain billfish, swordfish, sharks and yellowfin tuna.

A Salt Weapon - if you still have questions about permits, a captain's license, other charter fishing requirements, etc. feel free to call me or PM me. My number is listed below.

Bill Bahr


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## buzzard bill

*Links To Current Permit Owners*



hstnboatguy said:


> I have seen a website that has permit listings. Does anyone know what site that is? I am in the market for a permit


Here is the link to who currently owns the pelagic and reef permits in the GOM. Some of these owners will transact directly with you, some might be selling their permits through a broker.

*Gulf of Mexico Charter / Headboat for Pelagic Fish**

Gulf of Mexico Charter / Headboat for Reef Fish*

You might also contact Steve Roberge at Great Sage - he is a broker for permits. Good luck.

Great Sage, Inc.
10201 South Padre Island Drive, Suite 310
Corpus Christi TX 78418
Ph. 361-904-0924
Fax. 1-206-888-0441
[email protected]


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## fishbillz

*That is correct.*

Bottom line. If your chartering in federal water without those permits your not in compliance and subject to a fine. I charter and bought my permits from a captain in Florida who went out of business.


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## gbeardjr

I'm looking to buy a set of permits if any know of any good deals send them my way. I have been running diving sight seeing only charters out of freeport for the last two years but want to add spearfishing as an option.

Captain Beard
832-603-1698

http://www.captainbeardcharters.com


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