# Lost Custody of Children Due to Spanking !!



## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

My brothers ex-wife has tried for 8 years to gain custody of their two daughters (ages 9 and 10) from my brother... This past Thursday, a District Bench Judge here in South Texas, took custody away from my brother and awarded them to his ex because he believes in SPANKING.. No joke, this is what the lady judge told my brother in court. NO other reason. The judge stated that its her opinoin that in this day in age, that spanking is a form of ABUSE... UNBELIEVEABLE..... With all the broken homes in the this world without a father figure, the drop out rates, kids in gangs, all this **** going on with kids on the internet, this Judge has the balls to tell my brother you cannot spank your kids..... I'm not talking about beating your kids, I'm talking about a swat or two. I'm not up on Family Law right now but when did it become against the law to spank your child ???? Of course he is filling an appeal because there was tons of B.S. that went on during this proceding that I'm not going to get into here. The kids are with him untill they get out of school the end of this month and then they will leave for Clevend, Ohio..... OH by the way, my brother's ex has never paid her child support. She owes my brother over 10,000 dollars. The Judge told my brother she is going to set his child support somewhere between 500 and 700 dollars a month. They will knock that off each month and when he has burned up the 10 grand he will have to start paying his ex.... This is just unbelieveable.... No one in my family can believe this... And not one member of my brother's ex's family showed up to support her. Not one. And she has a brother that is in the Border Patrol that testified against her getting custody in the orginial trial ..... All of us are hoping he is granted an appeal but who knows.....

Furious as Hell !!!!!
Mike


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## WestEndAngler (Jan 30, 2007)

Ouch! You always hate to hear about kids getting caught in the middle of something they had nothing to do with, I hope for there sake that everyone works out for there best interest and sounds like your brother needs to file a quick appeal and get back into court. It should be easily over turned assuming he has a good custody lawyer. Prayers go out to your brother and the kids involved!


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## texanlegend (Dec 9, 2004)

....prayers sent his way. it usually works itsself out just might take a long time .


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## D-kirk2 (Sep 4, 2007)

That shows you how messed up our judicial system can be. You already have the under hand just being a guy in a custody situation. Well best of luck to your brother and your family hopefully everything will work out.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Ok dont be so nice who was the Judge and where ?? Needs to be some kinda accountability here 

Charlie


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## Rainy (Jul 30, 2005)

Nothing worse than going into court with a woman judge.


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## TxFig (May 4, 2006)

Judges hate negative publicity.

I would suggest (in addition to the other court-related stuff he is doing) starting with a letter to the editor of the local newspapers in the area in which this judge presides.

Trying to get Bill O'Reily (foxnews.com) involves might be good too - he hates activist judges as much as anyone.


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## Fish-a-mon (May 21, 2004)

Why were they back in court? Your brother has custody by the court correct? Was this the same court that gave him original custody? Seems to be more than what you typed. Your brother wasn't doing his part by not forcing his ex to pay. If she works then she pays taxes, therefor she has SS#. This is what the AG uses to let employers know that said person owes and deducts up front. As well the divorce decree also should stipulate on children being moved from one state to another or even distance. He needs to find a better lawyer and he need to have the AG involved. The AG will look at the childrens interest before the parents.

Also, What County? What Court? What Judge? We could also hammer the court with calls and emails. Call the judge and voice our opinion over her opinion.


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## Bigwater (May 21, 2004)

When the ex didn't pay the child support she signed away her rights period!!!

Now spanking two girls like that 9 and 10 years old isn't a good idea. Especially with the ex pushing for appeal. 

If he gets them back he needs to stop believing in spanking them. Figure out another way like telephones, Tv's , computers grounding. 

I raised my girl from the age of 4. She is 18 now...I still gotta ways to go. 

The judge is dead wrong here of course unless this spanking is over board. We're only getting one side of the story. 

How bad is one of his spankings???

Bigwater


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## fishinfool3846 (Apr 24, 2005)

Bigwater not to be confrontational but it is his parental right to disipline his children however he sees it necessary- this right is given to every parent in the Texas Family Code. It was your right not to spank your children just as it is his right to spank his children and if the above senerio is correct I could see a judge loosing his or her license from the BAR. Please post the Judges Name and the official court this occured in so that I can write a letter or two as well as others on this site.


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## Bigwater (May 21, 2004)

fishinfool3846 said:


> Bigwater not to be confrontational but it is his parental right to disipline his children however he sees it necessary- this right is given to every parent in the Texas Family Code. It was your right not to spank your children just as it is his right to spank his children and if the above senerio is correct I could see a judge loosing his or her license from the BAR. Please post the Judges Name and the official court this occured in so that I can write a letter or two as well as others on this site.


Yes I know it is his right. There is a point where spanking can become somewhat overbearing...what i mean is leaving marks and bruises etc. For a judge to make the recomendation that was posted something just sounds wrong.

I did not mean for my post to sound as if you shouldn;t spank...be very careful if your a male and have custody and do a lot of spanking.

Biggie


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## Reel-tor (May 21, 2004)

Is the Judge elected to her office? WHat's her name, what court and does she have an opponent this November?

I can probably guess what political party w/o asking.


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## deerspotter (Apr 8, 2008)

o brother, Why have you not posted the judges name? You seem to have a lot of people on your/brothers side with some good info. Spanking and abusing are two different things. Spanking yes,abusing NO. There is a time and place for everything. Some kids can be corrected by talking and some cannot. Your brother does for sure need to get a better lawyer. Some kids will test parents to see what they can get by with. This is a personal call.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

I know what you mean Bigwater... I know you are only hearing my side and no, my brother doesn't go overboard on spanking. My brother had a trial by jury the first go around and the jury awarded my brother custody. It went to trial the first time because she didn't want my brother to have any visitaion rights at all. This is the third time she has filed for custody and she has had Child Protection investigate my brother 4 times with official reports filed that no abuse was ever found. The AG office has made her pay a time or two but she would change jobs everytime they found her. My brother has contacted a Higher Profile lawyer from San Antonio to handle his appeal. My brothers lawyer and the court appointed lawyer to represent the girls, all have and will continue to have cases in front of this same judge, so it appears they didn't want to go against her.. My brother found out there are several grievences(sp) filed on this judge for the same type of decisions and he will file one as well.. I'm not going to post her name at this time. We are not sure what is going to happen with the appeal, so I don't want to do something that might hurt my brothers case right now.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Her term doesn't expire untill 09....


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## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

If this is the entire story and he has spanked them as "swats" then he is well in his legal rights to do that. Texas still allows this type of discipline and a Judge has to follow the laws. Your brother should be able to have an atty overturn this decision. 

I would also do as some others have stated here...Write some letters, call some newspapers, make some complaints...If a Judge is blantanly ignoring the law because of personal opinion then something can be done but man, what a mess...

Sorry to hear about all of this because in the long run, the ones who loose the most and are the most damaged from cases of custody battles are the children.


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## Txfirenfish (Jan 8, 2005)

Score another for the Texas Attorney General. As I have said before, our family law system is corrupt. They saw him as a dollar sign. Now every dollar that is taken out of his check for child support will be matched by the federal government and given to our state. How long will we let this continue? My condolences for your brother.


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## Fish-a-mon (May 21, 2004)

O Brother, the reason we are asking for the judges name is that we the people can influence this judge. You see no one knows your brothers name and no one is asking for it. This is not like 1980, the power of technology is greater than most know. I can tell you if you were to post the judges name, this judge would rue the day she made a decision based on her own opinion. The LAW is what she must follow and her opinion is not the law. Seriously post the womans name.


This is a elected Judge. Let me tell you about elected officials they can be replaced and they really react when they know the people are going to boot them.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

no name of the Judge huh? Sorry something is just not rite with this picture.. See ya

Charlie


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## highspeed (Aug 8, 2005)

Rainy said:


> Nothing worse than going into court with a woman judge.


Going to the court with a woman driver. All kidding aside, this is **** and needs to be brought up someone higher.


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## Mustad7731 (May 23, 2004)

*Family Injustice*

o brother;
I feel your brother's pain...The situation as described your brother at least has
a chance of getting the decision overturned. 
The 'Family Law' situation now is not as screwed up as in days past.
If he has a high price top of the line family lawyer he has a shot...
Good Luck and I'll be praying for him...
Mustad7731
Jackie


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## fishbowl365 (Mar 9, 2005)

one does not lose rights because of non-payment of child support.according to my eldest daughter as a cps supervisor spanking is not against the law.


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## ChickFilet (May 20, 2004)

yep. This is part of a story no doubt.


CHARLIE said:


> no name of the Judge huh? Sorry something is just not rite with this picture.. See ya
> 
> Charlie


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## BALZTOWAL (Aug 29, 2006)

If It Is In Alice I Thought They Had Bigger Problems With Puddles Custody. For A Judge (not Including The Dumbass Ones In South Texas) To Swap Custody When One Parent Has Had The Children For That Long There Has To Be A **** Good Reason Besides Just Spanking. Are There Any Cps Complaints Of Child Abuse. There Is A Difference


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## adpostel (Jan 14, 2006)

o_brother said:


> The judge stated that its her opinoin that in this day in age, that spanking is a form of ABUSE...
> I'm not up on Family Law right now but when did it become against the law to spank your child ????
> Mike


*Legally, What Child Abuse and Neglect Are*

In Texas, the definitions of child abuse and neglect include specific acts or omissions by a person responsible for a child's care, custody or welfare. Here are important legal definitions from Section 261.001 of the Texas Family Code.

*"Abuse" includes the following acts or omissions by a person:*


mental or emotional injury to a child that results in an observable and material impairment in the child's growth, development, or psychological functioning;
causing or permitting the child to be in a situation in which the child sustains a mental or emotional injury that results in an observable and material impairment in the child's growth, development, or psychological functioning;
physical injury that results in substantial harm to the child, or the genuine threat of substantial harm from physical injury to the child, including an injury that is at variance with the history or explanation given and excluding an accident or reasonable discipline by a parent, guardian, or managing or possessory conservator that does not expose the child to a substantial risk of harm;
failure to make a reasonable effort to prevent an action by another person that results in physical injury that results in substantial harm to the child;
sexual conduct harmful to a child's mental, emotional, or physical welfare including conduct that constitutes the offense of indecency with a child under Section 21.11, Penal Code, sexual assault under Section 22.011, Penal Code, or aggravated sexual assault under Section 22.021, Penal Code;
failure to make a reasonable effort to prevent sexual conduct harmful to a child;
compelling or encouraging the child to engage in sexual conduct as defined by Section 43.01, Penal Code;
causing, permitting, encouraging, engaging in, or allowing the photographing, filming, or depicting of the child if the person knew or should have known that the resulting photograph, film, or depiction of the child is obscene as defined by Section 43.21, Penal Code, or pornographic;
causing, permitting, encouraging, engaging in, or allowing a sexual performance by a child as defined by Section 43.25, Penal Code;
the current use by a person of a controlled substance as defined by Chapter 481, Health and Safety Code, in a manner or to the extent that the use results in physical, mental, or emotional injury to a child; or
causing, expressly permitting, or encouraging a child to use a controlled substance as defined by Chapter 481, Health and Safety Code.
*"Neglect" includes:*


the leaving of a child in a situation where the child would be exposed to a substantial risk of physical or mental harm, without arranging for necessary care for the child, and the demonstration of an intent not to return by a parent, guardian, or managing or possessory conservator of the child;
the following acts or omissions by a person:
placing a child in or failing to remove a child from a situation that a reasonable person would realize requires judgment or actions beyond the child's level of maturity, physical condition, or mental abilities and that results in bodily injury or a substantial risk of immediate harm to the child;
failing to seek, obtain, or follow through with medical care for a child, with the failure resulting in or presenting a substantial risk of death, disfigurement, or bodily injury or with the failure resulting in an observable and material impairment to the growth, development, or functioning of the child;
the failure to provide a child with food, clothing, or shelter necessary to sustain the life or health of the child, excluding failure caused primarily by financial inability unless relief services had been offered and refused; or
placing a child in or failing to remove the child from a situation in which the child would be exposed to a substantial risk of sexual conduct harmful to the child; or

the failure by the person responsible for a child's care, custody, or welfare to permit the child to return to the child's home without arranging for the necessary care for the child after the child has been absent from the home for any reason, including having been in residential placement or having run away.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

OK Charlie and Fishinchick.... 293rd District Court Judge Cynthia Muniz... She covers Maverick, Dimmit and Zavala Counties.... Thats Eagle Pass, Carrizo Springs and Crystal City... And yes, its in black and white this Judge handed down her ruling based on her opinion. She said this in Court.... Thanks adpostal for the insert on Family Law... My brother did contact a Family Law Lawyer from San Antonio yesterday that has agreed to take this case. He said that it will be an uphill fight but not impossible. They went over the whole case from day one and this new Lawyer pointed out numerous un-ethical processes that the Judge did in court... This Judge went so far as to call the girls Lawyer, that the Judge appointed, into her chambers for a 5 minute discussion without the court reporter or my brothers lawyer present. Then she comes out and gives her decision.... I'm telling you folks, this all happened.... This is all sounds totally absurd but this Judge did all this. I only started this thread to let people know that there are still Judges out there handing down decisions based on opinion and not by the law..... My brother will file a grievence anyway... He found out that this Judge has had numerous grievencs filed on her already.... Oh and one last kick in the pants.. If my brother does not get this turned over and the girls live in Ohio for six months, they become residents of Ohio and he would have to file for custody up there. Then the burden would be on my brother to prove his ex is an unfit parent..... Thanks everyone for your prayers and support..... This is going to be an emotional roller coaster for quite some time....

Mike


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## Lezz Go (Jun 27, 2006)

*Nailed It*



Rainy said:


> Nothing worse than going into court with a woman judge.


+1000 on that one. Michael Berry was railing about a local family law judge (woman) who was going to allow unsupervised visitation to a dirtbag guy who was in prison most of his daughter's life and now wants to be super dad. Forget the fact that he's never paid any CS or been there for his kid. He just wants to get back at the girl's mother.

I'll keep my thoughts om women judges as a whole to myself.......


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Update.. My brother hired another lawyer to file an appeal to the District Appeals Court. The appeals court has agreed to hear his case. In the mean time, the new lawyer asked Judge Muniz to freeze her new order untill the Appeals court rules on it. She agreed to freeze her new order which shocked everyone.... Now it gets even better... With the Judge freezing her new orders, my brother and his ex must go back to what the orginal custody agreement was. Which means his ex is supposed to bring the two girls back from Ohio to Texas. Well, guess what... The ex refuses to bring them back. She was served papers last Friday stipulating she has untill this Friday to bring the kids back to Texas. She told the officer that served her, she has no intensions to do so. So now my brother has to wait untill Friday and see if she shows up or not. He has already done the paper work for a State Issued Warrant for her violating custody orders if she doesn't show up. But get this, he has contacted Child Protective Services in Ohio and faxed them all the legal paper work and asked them to go check on the kids because he has not talked to them in over two weeks now and they refused too. This has turned into the biggest pile of bull____ that anyone of us has ever seen.. My brother has been raked over the coals four times by CPS here in Tx bye his ex making a simple phone call. My brother has legal papers in hand and he can't get CPS to even go and check on them up there... Unbeliveable..... More on this later...

Mike


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## Pocketfisherman (May 30, 2005)

This is the kind of thing Neil Boortz would be all over on his radio show.


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## capt. david (Dec 29, 2004)

what's sad is the only losers in this situation are the children.


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## jabx1962 (Nov 9, 2004)

As my friend Johnny would say:

"Family Court- The Original Weapon of MASS DESTRUCTION"


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## pepo211 (May 1, 2007)

O Brother sorry to hear about your brother, nieces and all frustration. I can assure you their are good people who work in Texas Family Court however, my father is a family judge here in Texas....I would guess to say if this was in his court room things would be different because he used to spank my arse when i was growing up and honestly i will do the same. Heck looking back I NEEDED IT!! I love and respect my parents and I hope that my kids feel the same way. Good luck with this issue!!


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## iridered2003 (Dec 12, 2005)

"The judge stated that its her opinoin that in this day in age, that spanking is a form of ABUSE... UNBELIEVEABLE"

this is whats wrong with the system that we all think is so high and mighty. one person can fix all the problems in the world. if this is true, they need to DEBENCH the judge! hope you bro get this all worked out. for the kids first and then himself. good luck. nothing wrong with a little butt whipping. like so many others have already said, i got my butt popped to many times to even think about counting. i was still getting it in high school in a auto tech class. you leave tools out or dirty work area, friday was payday and you knew what you had made for the week.


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## srmtphillips (Oct 3, 2007)

My wife has family in Carrizo Springs - that is the most corrupt judicial system in the country. Is your brothers ex by chance form that area?


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## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

I feel for your brother. Your niece as well, they are caught in the middle and your brother is now dishing out monies he otherwise would not have to if not for this corrupt judge and worthless ex.


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## jt2hunt (May 13, 2006)

prayers for your brother. I think this is judicial abuse. I also believe that your brother should fight for all it is worth, based on the comments above. she should never be allowed to deny communication with his kids.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

My brother has filed a complant through the legal channels and found this judge has had several filed on her already. Just in the appeal alone he has spent over 15,000 dolars in lawyer/filing fees. Several of us in the family has pitched in money to help him..
Hey srmtphillips, no my brothers ex is not from Carrizo. She is from Ohio, she ended up in Carrizo when her brother was stationed there for the Border Patrol.. Thats how my brother met, married and had two daughters. When the youngest girl was about 2 yrs old, the ex decided she didn't want to live in TX any more and left one day while my brother was at work. She never talked about leaving or that she was unhappy or anything. 
Thanks everyone for your prayers and best wishes.. My family is very close and these two little girls are just like daughters to me. And yes, the worst part of all of this is the girls caught in the middle... I hope to get some good news over the weekend and will ya'll know....

Mike


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

*UPDATE*

My brother filed an appeal seven months ago to try and get the District Appeals Court to grant him a new hearing. He was able to get a stay on the new ruling so he has had his girls while waiting for an answer on his appeal. Well, he was notified yesterday that his appeal was denied.... It was unbelievable that he lost custody of his girls because he believes in spanking but now the appeals court has turned him down to have a jury hear his case instead of a Liberal Judge deciding what should happen with these two little girls. My brothers ex still owes him over 10k in back child support and nothing was ever done to her. Now watch, let my brother miss one child support payment and she will have him in jail before God gets word...... We found out there is 5 other cases on appeal from this same judge were she has reversed custody on other Fathers as well.. I think the girls will be allowed to finish the school year before they leave for Ohio..We won't get to see them again untill Thanksgiving or Christmas...

Mike


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## KylesKenner2 (Nov 19, 2008)

Aren't the kids at the age where they can decide who they want to be with? I think there is an age where the kids can decide.
What part of South Texas are they in? My wife's Aunt is a judge in Jim Wells county. Maybe she can have some input or another route to take.


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## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

Sorry to hear that Mike, I was hoping that your brother would get the appeal


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Hey Kyle, the girls are 11, 12, I believe, and both girls told the judge they want to stay with there Father. The judge does not have to honor the childrens wishes, only take them into consideration.. Witch she did not.. My brother lives in Carrizo Springs which is North West of here... I don't think my brother has any other options for now. I think he has to wait a year or two and file for custody again. All my brother wanted was somone else to look over the case and see were the Judge mishandled the whole thing.. Either another judge or by jury.... Thanks fishin shallow.....

Mike


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## JDM1967 (Oct 16, 2006)

capt. david said:


> what's sad is the only losers in this situation are the children.


You are so right


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## surfwalker (Jul 14, 2006)

THIS IS WHY OUR COUNTRY IS IN SUCH A F**KIN MESS!! NO DISAPLIN NO PROPER GUIDENCE.. HE NEEDS TO APPEAL, KIDS NEED DISAPLIN, I BEAT THE **** OUT OF MINE A COUPLE OF TIMES. SHES OLDER NOW AND WE'RE TIGHT AS WE CAN BE. BUT SHE NEEDED TO BE PUT IN HER PLACE THEN. SHE GOT IN ALL KINDS OF TROUBLE AT SCHOOL WHEN SHE WAS IN 1ST GRADE. I CALLED THE PRINCIPLE AND HAD TO TELL THEM TO BUST HER LITTLE BUT, THEY MADE ME SIGN A LETTER OKAYING CORP PUNISHMENT, SHE GOT SWATS 2 TIMES IN 1ST GRADE ONCE IN SECOND AND QUIT ACTING UP.. WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL, WE GOT SWATS FOR ACTING LIKE IDIOTS IN SCHOLL, IT KEPT US IN LINE... 

SPANKING IS NOT ABUSE!!! STOP THIS MADNESS IN THE IDIOTIC LEGAL SYSTEM IN AMERICA, BEFORE ITS WAY TO LATE.


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## drfishalot (Sep 9, 2004)

well, you know-judges don't have to follow laws. as he stated it was her "opinion". I will never go into court again-not even small claims with out a court reporter or tape recorder.

a few years ago I was filling in for another doctor and just happened to get a question about one of his patients. that patient just happened to be the judge, elected official, who had " handled" my divorce. made mistakes at each session that we would have to go back to court to fix. anyway, I had to look in her chart to figure out what ever it was to answer the question and you would never guess what I found. she was on VALIUM. ???? this is in Oklahoma, but just goes to show anyone can be a judge.


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## country7 (May 27, 2007)

I feel for your brother, i have a 9 year old daughter and if i lost her i would be devistated, and i disagree the children are not the only losers, this father is also a loser in this situation, he is losing his babies, he must be a good father or he would not have gained full custody in the first place. i have an aunt who used to be a family district court judge and she was an admitted man hater and ruled in the mothers favor almost every case, and it sounds like this could be the case here, i hope he finds a way to keep his daughters.


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## KylesKenner2 (Nov 19, 2008)

I will try to send this to my wife's Aunt.
Long story short, kids acted up, got a couple of swats and the ex is gaining custody of the kids because it's refered to as abuse. 
The kids are 9 & 10. The Father gained custody from the get go because he's a good man and a great Father. 
The ex has to be a real screw up to loose custody in the first place or financially couldn't support the kids. 
The skank is way behind on child support. 
Is that in a nut shell?


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Yeah Kyle, thats most of it.. My brother made the mistake of not requesting a hearing with a jury this past go around because his ex had nothing.. My brothers lawyer agreed.. They both thought it would be a routine court hearing. My brother will never make that mistake again and leave a decision to a judge.. I hope that everyone reading this will do the same on anything.. Don't ever let a judge decided anything any more... 

Mike


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## Hotrod (Oct 11, 2006)

surfwalker said:


> THIS IS WHY OUR COUNTRY IS IN SUCH A F**KIN MESS!! NO DISAPLIN NO PROPER GUIDENCE.. HE NEEDS TO APPEAL, KIDS NEED DISAPLIN, I BEAT THE **** OUT OF MINE A COUPLE OF TIMES. SHES OLDER NOW AND WE'RE TIGHT AS WE CAN BE. BUT SHE NEEDED TO BE PUT IN HER PLACE THEN. SHE GOT IN ALL KINDS OF TROUBLE AT SCHOOL WHEN SHE WAS IN 1ST GRADE. I CALLED THE PRINCIPLE AND HAD TO TELL THEM TO BUST HER LITTLE BUT, THEY MADE ME SIGN A LETTER OKAYING CORP PUNISHMENT, SHE GOT SWATS 2 TIMES IN 1ST GRADE ONCE IN SECOND AND QUIT ACTING UP.. WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL, WE GOT SWATS FOR ACTING LIKE IDIOTS IN SCHOLL, IT KEPT US IN LINE...
> 
> SPANKING IS NOT ABUSE!!! STOP THIS MADNESS IN THE IDIOTIC LEGAL SYSTEM IN AMERICA, BEFORE ITS WAY TO LATE.


Theres a difference in spanking and beating the **** out of your child. I really hope you mis-worded what you posted. And I would not give the school permission for corporal punishment in the 1st grade to a little girl, but thats just me.


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## KylesKenner2 (Nov 19, 2008)

Do you have the judges name sir?
I am calling her at 11:00 at lunch


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

293rd District Judge Cynthis Muniz. She covers Dimmit, Zavala and Maverick counties.. 

Mike


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## KylesKenner2 (Nov 19, 2008)

I'm on the phone now with her. I will be sending her the info in a few minutes.


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## Pocketfisherman (May 30, 2005)

Neal Boortz loves stories like this and he has an audience well beyond this boards coverage.


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## country7 (May 27, 2007)

unfortuntley at 12 the child can say who they would like to live wth but the judge DOES NOT have to agree. A child who is 12 years or older can execute an affidavit stating who he or she wants to be his or her managing conservator. The child’s choice is not binding on the judge. However, the closer the child gets to age 18, the more likely the judge is to agree with the child’s choice.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

I sent you a PM Kyle that explains some other stuff as well..

Mike


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## shanker (Jan 15, 2006)

I just read this thread, I am at utter shock this would be allowed to happen over a belief in spanking.

I will pray for the girls in church, that they be raised in a well diciplined, secure, safe environment.

I hope everything works out...


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Yeah pocketfisherman, I've tried to get my brother to call Neal but he just can't talk about losing his girls without getting emotional right now... Your right country7 about the girls age and what they want. My brother did the affidavit and its all on file and in the court records.. My brother has done everything he could for right now.. Unless his appeals lawyer knows of something else we are told my brother is out of options for now...

Mike


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## regulator (May 21, 2004)

O Brother, will be praying for the kidos and your brother, this is just sickening, KK2 thanks for stepping up, please keep us updated. and hang in there


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Thanks regulator and everyone else... People need to know that stuff like what has happened to my brother could happen to you or someone you know... You can not leave anything up to chance or think common sense will prevail...

Mike


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## geezuphosdn (Jun 5, 2006)

o_brother said:


> My brothers ex-wife has tried for 8 years to gain custody of their two daughters (ages 9 and 10) from my brother... This past Thursday, a District Bench Judge here in South Texas, took custody away from my brother and awarded them to his ex because he believes in SPANKING.. No joke, this is what the lady judge told my brother in court. NO other reason. The judge stated that its her opinoin that in this day in age, that spanking is a form of ABUSE... UNBELIEVEABLE..... With all the broken homes in the this world without a father figure, the drop out rates, kids in gangs, all this **** going on with kids on the internet, this Judge has the balls to tell my brother you cannot spank your kids..... I'm not talking about beating your kids, I'm talking about a swat or two. I'm not up on Family Law right now but when did it become against the law to spank your child ???? Of course he is filling an appeal because there was tons of B.S. that went on during this proceding that I'm not going to get into here. The kids are with him untill they get out of school the end of this month and then they will leave for Clevend, Ohio..... OH by the way, my brother's ex has never paid her child support. She owes my brother over 10,000 dollars. The Judge told my brother she is going to set his child support somewhere between 500 and 700 dollars a month. They will knock that off each month and when he has burned up the 10 grand he will have to start paying his ex.... This is just unbelieveable.... No one in my family can believe this... And not one member of my brother's ex's family showed up to support her. Not one. And she has a brother that is in the Border Patrol that testified against her getting custody in the orginial trial ..... All of us are hoping he is granted an appeal but who knows.....
> 
> Furious as Hell !!!!!
> Mike


The #1 reason i chose to never ever ever have kids. Eff that.


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## Argo (May 21, 2004)

KylesKenner2 said:


> I'm on the phone now with her. I will be sending her the info in a few minutes.


so what happened?


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## alant (Dec 7, 2006)

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I've been dealing with family court with a divorce. My wife has ignored every agreement and court order, and has stolen more than $100k she was to turn over to me in the final decree. I have an enforcment hearing next month. The last time I was in court the docket call was one half enforcement hearings. The courts don't enforce the laws, so their case load keep growing as a result. My ex is going to get away with this. I've lost all faith in our courts systems. I hope somebody gets justice.


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## coastalbend74 (Feb 20, 2008)

Come on spanking is not a crime and we all know the difference. If a kid 9 or 10 needs a spanking then they need it. Why do we have to live in a society where we should live in fear of disciplining our own children boys or girls. This is ridiculous, then they get to an age acting like fools running amuck and everyone who said don't spank that kid is looking at the parent wondering why they let their kids act like deliquents. 

I will pray for your brother

and Fishermon if someone doesn't want to pay child support they find ways around it, court order or not, AG or not......my ex owes me about $18,000....guess I'm not doing my part or the AG for that matter.


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## atcNick (Apr 7, 2005)

Oh My God! This sounds like the twilight zone! Get you some hired goons, you know, the ones that eat spaghetti, have them dig a hole in the desert! Who was the judge on this? She needs to be tossed out of court and back to chasing ambulances.


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## saltwatersensations (Aug 30, 2004)

capt. david said:


> what's sad is the only losers in this situation are the children.


I think that the dad is also. He obviously love shis kids.


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## o_brother (Jul 26, 2007)

Well, my brother emailed me the Appeals Court brief. The short version of the brief shows the Justice's baseing their decison to deny an appeal based on three or four items. One was that my brothers ex claimed he didn't provide proper health care for the girls. She claimed the girls had severe tooth decay, and a staph infection at one time among several other minor things. The Justice's said this was proof he didn't provide proper care for them. The Justice's *did not* mention that the orginal court had ordered my brothers ex to provide insurance for the girls and she did. The only problem with that was the insurance was only good in the State of Ohio and *not in Texas*. My brother had a seperate policy for the girls and he had all the records of when they were taken to the doctors of witch the ex never help cover. Another item was the girls missing school last year. One missed seven days and the other missed ten days *for the whole year.* These three Justice's believe that was too many days????? This is just a small part of the B.S. in the brief... The Justice's picked and choosed to quote the girls on some things and left out were they said they want to stay with there Father... The Justice's also left out the ex owing over 10k in child support or the fact she never provided insurance for the girls that would cover Texas.... The Justice's never mention that the District Judge based her decision to re-verse custody on my brother because he belives in spanking.. They left that out completly..... I don't know if all three Justice's being female had anything to do with my brother being denied an appeal or not, but what is wrote in this brief makes absolutely no sense... We still don't know if the girls are goining to finish the school year or if my brother is going to have to put them on a plane to Ohio this weekend.... I swear this is so nerve racking..... Thanks everyone for your prayers and support....

Mike


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## capn_billl (Sep 12, 2007)

It has kind of come down to this, in this country once either parent files for divorce the children don't belong to you anymore, they become the proprty of the state. Good Luck. The good news as the kids get older the less the Ex can pull. I just went through 12 years of stuff like this, now the child is in High School the court listens to his opinion on custody, and what parent is abusing. And the fight is over. No more dropping most of my paycheck to Lyers and court costs, just an occaisional whine that only cost a few letters to clear up. Hang in there, just a few more years until they are teenagers.


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## surfwalker (Jul 14, 2006)

Maybe beating was over zelious but yeah, corp punishment in 1st grade, all these bleeding heart liberals can let your kids run buck wild. Mine got hers 3 times early from the school, strait A student now, were as clsoe a father and daughter can be. And yeah I tore her little but up for acting like an idiot. You want to let your kids get away with murder, get back to me when their in their teens.. Let me know how thats working for as Dr Phil will say.. Disiplin Love and guidence,, Thats what all kids need, thats the only way they learn and grow up with a since of commitment right and wrong and family values and thats why the country is the shape its in, no one has to pay to play.. We have taught our kids they have to answer for nothing, my daughter knows right from wrong and thet she will have to pay for mistakes she makes,,, >> AND SHE WONT HAVE TO FIGURE IT ALL OUT WHEN SHE'S 40 or 50 like so many others are doing now// Good luck to you and yours.. Mine is on the fast track to true happiness and success.. threw design


Hotrod said:


> Theres a difference in spanking and beating the **** out of your child. I really hope you mis-worded what you posted. And I would not give the school permission for corporal punishment in the 1st grade to a little girl, but thats just me.


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## goatchze (Aug 1, 2006)

BUMP

O Brother, how'd this turn out?? Did the girls get to stay with their dad?


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## YoungGun1 (Jan 8, 2009)

"I believe when a kid reaches the age of one, you have the right to hit in the stomach or throat!" - Bernie Mack


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## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

saltwatersensations said:


> I think that the dad is also. He obviously love shis kids.


You are right bro! I watched what a woman I knew did to an Ex of hers. Her parents had $ & hired this bigshot attorney named John Gay in Clear Lake. She denied letting him see their daughter. Everytime he took her to court for contempt, her high dollar attorney would find a technicality to have it postponed. This went on for a long time & the poor guy essentially went broke & gave up. She had restraining orders on him the whole time & he never had a chance. She was a fine looking woman, but I quit seeing her for two reasons...1...I eventually lost respect for her watching the afore mentioned divorce games...& 2...I didn't want to be around when this guy lost it & came looking to kill her.


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## TimW Texas (Apr 15, 2009)

Dr Spock offspring speaking of the judge that is. Sorry to hear this just as many have expressed.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

05-05-2008, 02:09 PM 
o_brother








Member



goatchze said:


> BUMP
> 
> O Brother, how'd this turn out?? Did the girls get to stay with their dad?


People.. before responding see above.. goatchze ask about outcome,, this thread is two years old!


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

waterspout said:


> 05-05-2008, 02:09 PM
> o_brother
> 
> 
> ...


People.. before responding see above.. goatchze ask about outcome,, this thread is two years old!


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## Mahibosa (Sep 27, 2009)

YoungGun1 said:


> "I believe when a kid reaches the age of one, you have the right to hit in the stomach or throat!" - Bernie Mack


 *WTH*?


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## InfamousJ (May 21, 2004)

waterspout said:


> 05-05-2008, 02:09 PM
> o_brother
> 
> 
> ...


thank you spout, we could not operate here efficiently without an internet ninja like yourself pointing out the obvious LMAO


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

InfamousJ said:


> thank you spout, we could not operate here efficiently without an internet ninja like yourself pointing out the obvious LMAO


I think it was Harbor burn handle that did it!  :slimer:

you get a text.. lmao!


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## Main Frame 8 (Mar 16, 2007)

goatchze said:


> BUMP
> 
> O Brother, how'd this turn out?? Did the girls get to stay with their dad?


I think the question is how does one stumble upon a 2 year old thread that hasn't had a post since 4/09.


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## goatchze (Aug 1, 2006)

Main Frame 8 said:


> I think the question is how does one stumble upon a 2 year old thread that hasn't had a post since 4/09.


I dug it up cause I was curious the outcome. The situation came up this morning as I have a buddy going through something similar.

Just curious!

Thanks, Spout, I didn't mean to cause confusion!


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## C'est Bon (Oct 19, 2009)

After reading all this, I'm curious about the outcome, too...even if it was 2 years ago!


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## Downandout (Dec 24, 2004)

OH!!! And now lets get to the good part, as of Sept. 1 of last year their is a "no drop" policy for family violence. If you spank your kids and someone calls the law, neighbor, whatever doesn't matter the state automatically prosecutes you under their new family violence industry. Oh and it gets better if you get any conviction for family violence whatsoever it can never be expunged from your record and now he biggie!!!!! You lose your second amendment gun rights, thanks to politico Frank Lautenberg. So no more hunting, or protecting your family from the ghetto. This is how they are quietly disarming America. Its also expost facto, so if you spanked your kid in 1972 you cant have a gun either. The feds will lock you up!!! They law wants all the kids to be a bunch of thugs and not be disciplined. Oh and also never never never let a judge sentence you, all that is is a slow way of pleading guilty. Follow the money and how they get paid.


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## monkeyman1 (Dec 30, 2007)

Downandout said:


> OH!!! And now lets get to the good part, as of Sept. 1 of last year their is a "no drop" policy for family violence. If you spank your kids and someone calls the law, neighbor, whatever doesn't matter the state automatically prosecutes you under their new family violence industry. Oh and it gets better if you get any conviction for family violence whatsoever it can never be expunged from your record and now he biggie!!!!! You lose your second amendment gun rights, thanks to politico Frank Lautenberg. So no more hunting, or protecting your family from the ghetto. This is how they are quietly disarming America. Its also expost facto, so if you spanked your kid in 1972 you cant have a gun either. The feds will lock you up!!! They law wants all the kids to be a bunch of thugs and not be disciplined. Oh and also never never never let a judge sentence you, all that is is a slow way of pleading guilty. Follow the money and how they get paid.


d&o...lawyer or cps?


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## ChickFilet (May 20, 2004)

Don't apologize to spout. You will just confuse him! He takes asswhoopins in stride. Apologies, not so much.


goatchze said:


> I dug it up cause I was curious the outcome. The situation came up this morning as I have a buddy going through something similar.
> 
> Just curious!
> 
> Thanks, Spout, I didn't mean to cause confusion!


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