# I don't understand action and speed...



## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

I read a short post in this forum about action and speed but it didn't get basic enough. It was mostly recommendations. So I found what i thought to be the most knowledgeable fellers on the site. 

rod builders can you help me understand what the heck a rod is indicating by Action and speed of the tip. I'm gathering the fast tip is more sensitive, but I still am not sure how to apply these facts to finding the best rod to pair with a reel for fishing a certain technique or species. Any help for what I'm sure you can all figure out by now is a NOOB is appreciated.
:texasflag


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## Sgrem (Oct 5, 2005)

Action is how stiff.
Speed is how quickly the rod will load up when you pull/set the hook.

So imagine heavy cover and bony mouth fish. You want heavy extra fast. You need instant hook set and power to get then out. Bass fishing jig rods and flounder rods are like this.

Imagine paper mouth fish in open water. You want light and slow so the hook won't rip out of their mouth on hook set or every time they surge....crappie and trout rods are like this.


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## PhotoFish (Aug 9, 2015)

Watch this video


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

I still like to refer to this:


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## teamfirstcast (Aug 23, 2006)

Interesting and fun video and good chart. That chart is how most manufacturers try to describe their blanks, and they vary greatly from one company to the next, and even within their specific product lines. (I wish Batson would offer light and ultralight power rods in their Eternity Series!) But it does give you at best a general guideline when trying to choose.


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## [email protected] (Mar 7, 2008)

*blanks*



sgrem said:


> Action is how stiff.
> Speed is how quickly the rod will load up when you pull/set the hook.
> 
> So imagine heavy cover and bony mouth fish. You want heavy extra fast. You need instant hook set and power to get then out. Bass fishing jig rods and flounder rods are like this.
> ...


sgrem nailsd it, simply put its

action -power, how much weight it takes to bend rod.

Speed- how long it takes to return.


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## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

Thanks for the info. Now may I ask a question that deals with the same question but from an application standpoint. I see rods labeled Crankbait, Tops/Tails, or Spinnerbait; what characteristics make these specific rods for those baits? I'm getting ready to buy some better equipment and I'd like to have a little variety in my selection. Do the action and speed really have a lot to do with the way a lure or bait "acts" in the water?
:texasflag


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## Red3Fish (Jun 4, 2004)

I have always bought rods by whipping them in the air for action, and gently pushing the rodtip against a ceiling for speed (stiffness). I didn't know those fancy terms back when, but you can tell a lot about a rod by these tests, to find what you are looking for. 

Lighter lures want a more "whippy" tip. Heavier lures want a more stiffer tip. Those are big general statements......everyone has their own opinion and "feel" for what suits them. Lots of spinner baits/crankbaits put a pretty good "drag" on your rod and handle better with a little stiffer tip. 

I fish for mainly bay redfish with arties, and buy most of my rods to conform to that need....long and kinda/slightly stiff.....if I hook a trout or flounder, just loosen drag and play them easier with only a slight bend in rod. Bass fishing is another discussion. Crappie another. Catfish another. We haven't even gotten to offshore yet! LOL You didn't tell us your application.

Try borrowing some different rods and see what you like. That is half the fun of fishing .....trial and error. In my personal opinion, the label of what it is for is mostly a sales gimmick. You can fish all those lures effectively with one/two rods.

Picking a rod is kinda like picking a wife or girlfriend.....only you will know!! LOL 

PS I only have about 20 rods, and use 3 or 4 mainly, and others for specific applications. LOL

Good Luck
Later
R3F


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## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

Thanks Red. I fish mostly Bay and back lakes for trout, reds, and flounder. If I ever go offshore again it will most likely be with a guide. I do want to try and hit some of the areas here in Texas for Tarpon one day. Thanks for the info.
:texasflag


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## Red3Fish (Jun 4, 2004)

Several decades ago, I spent about $250 and built my own flounder rod. Wrappings, eyes, handle and all. I thought it was just the ticket for flounder, light sensitive tip, some back bone to set the hook etc etc. Caught a couple of fish with it, and decided it was a "wet noodle" way too limp. Never fished with it again. It was pretty too, with fancy wrappings!!

Like I say, trial and error.

Later
R3F


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## Fishsurfer (Dec 14, 2014)

It seems like my rods these days are much faster than the ones I used back in the 80s and early 90s. When I started building with G.L. IMX blanks in the mid 90s I found these to be much faster than previous blanks and now it seems like most all the blanks are like this but with greater weight reduction. The thing that has helped me understand what it is doing is to realize what the bait is doing and how fast it will react in the water (faster = less of a delay). When we retrieve line or "pop" the rod the resistance caused by the water delays the action of the lure/bait. I want to have a feel as to how I want this to react to the action of the fish. Once I have a good idea (by catching fish) of the action I want, I control my retrieve or movement of the rod accordingly. I can always slow down my fishing action but I can only fish as fast as the rod will let me.


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## INDIANAINTEXAS (Nov 12, 2006)

To get a "look" at the different actions of rods try this. Use 2 to 4 oz weights and a paper clip and attach them to the last eye or if it's a straight blank just use tape. Put a towel on a countertop and lay the rods down with as much rod out as possible. You'll see the different flex points and you can bounce the weights to actually watch the action the rod has. After you have an idea how your favorite rod flexes you'll be able to match/stiffen/lighten the "feel" the next blank has.


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## Goags (May 28, 2004)

To me, WBF's charts say it. Action is independent of power....action only means where the initial flex in the rod occurs. Power generally refers to the resistance in bending, and is more closely related to the lure and line weight recommendations. All blank manufacturers have their own definitions of specific powers. It does seem like the blank makers are making faster action blanks than they did 20 yrs ago.


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## Red3Fish (Jun 4, 2004)

Just to show you how "personal" picking a rod is, I will tell the following story.

Pop, cousin Bob and I fished together a lot, our whole life....like every single week the weather was decent for 60 years....virtually all wading the salt flats. One might think we would all wind up with more or less the same rod? Nope!

Cousin Bob built a rods out of a flyrod blank, 9' long and very "whippy". He could cast a 3/8 oz Sprite a country mile. It would nearly bend like a horse shoe when he had a RF on. He loved it. 

Pop had artheritus in his casting shoulder and used a shorter stiffer rod (~7'), he could cast about 2/3 the distance of Cousin Bob, but with a lot less flexing of shoulder.

I was kinda in between, with 8' rod, medium stiff. I could cast about 10 yards shy of Cousin Bob.

You would think after 60 years of fishing together, fishing the same waters in the same way, we would settle on a "common" best rod for our type of fishing? We all caught about the same number of fish. Not often, but occasionally, the 10 extra yards Bob could cast WOULD make a difference in number of fish, but not every trip.

You just have to find the best rod for YOU. You want it to be balanced with the reel you use (not tip or butt heavy), flex just right to cast the lures you use as far as you want it to cast, and have the stiffness (flex) that you like when playing a fish. The balanced part is pretty "fixed", but the other two options are just personal preferences. 

If you pick a long rod, just be aware of ceiling fans and tail gates!! LOL

Good Luck
Later
R3F


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## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

I'm really enjoying the thread. I've learned more in the last couple of months on this site than I have in years of people taking me fishing and saying throw here and do this with the rod and reel. Thanks and keep it coming.
:texasflag


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## Pods (Jan 11, 2006)

Power is a blank's stiffness, Action is where the initial flex is.

Pods


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## Smackdaddy53 (Nov 4, 2011)

Pods said:


> Power is a blank's stiffness, Action is where the initial flex is.
> 
> Pods


I love it. The KISS principle.


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## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

Right on Smack!
:texasflag


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## CroakerJO (Mar 16, 2011)

*Action, Power, Speed*

Manufacturers try to tell you as much as possible about the rod or blank using these three basic descriptive terms. To measure these features many use a technique similar to one designed for fly rods some years ago called the Common Cents System.

In a nutshell, approximately 8-inches of the butt is racked in a level horizontal fixture and weight is added to the tip until the blank is bent 1/3 of it length (this is done by adding pennies to a bag a few at a time until the tip drops the calculated amount - hence the "cents" system). The total amount of weight in cents is representative of the POWER of the rod since it takes more weight to bend a stronger rod to 1/3 of its length.

While under this exact load, a protractor attached to a level is placed behind the bent tip and the ANGLE of the tip is measured in degrees. If this measurement is high...like 68-degrees - the blank is considered "extra fast". If it is low, like 60-degrees, the blank is considered "moderate". POWER and ACTION are completely independent.

Powerful rods can have very fast tips and noodley rods can have very slow tips. They are not related but together can tell you a LOT about the blank.

SPEED is more difficult to measure and in most cases is a subjective judgement rather than measured information provided by the manufacturer. Today there are so many higher modulus carbon fiber blanks around that most have great "speed". A better term from the standpoint of picking a blank might be "recovery".

Recovery describes how fast a blank stops moving after it is bent. If a blank "wobbles" after a cast is made it would be said to recover slowly. If it snaps back to its original straight axis quickly - it has a fast recovery (Carbon fiber provides very fast recovery and high modulus carbon fiber is off the charts - almost no "wobble" at all). The most important thing to remember in all of this is not to confuse action with power, they are two different animals.


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## BigFishinTank (May 30, 2015)

*Putting it together*

Ok. first of all the info is awesome. Now I want to make sure I understand how it translates, in particular to the fish I'm catching. I am thinking that for a "so0fter" mouth fish, trout, a "lighter" weight rod with a "slower recovery" would be best? I say that thinking that will keep from pulling through it's mouth. Then a red fish on the other hand would be able to take a "heavier" weight rod and a "faster recovery" because their mouth is stronger and takes a little more to set the hook. Is my conclusion correct, or does it become a non-issue when you become experienced enough to not rip a hole in a trout's face?
:texasflag


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## cfulbright (Jun 24, 2009)

Med lite-fast for tails, or med-mod/mod fast for corkys, popping corks for trout.

You got to watch out different companys have different takes on the speed they get mod and fast mixed up a little imo. Like Batson there ratings compared to others are a little on the soft side. Also the CRB mudhole brand, their fast are a mod-fast at best.


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