# $69 million hs football stadium in Katy?



## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Just saw it on the national news. They are voting on it today. High School? WTH? No wonder kids become obsessed with bling.


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

We only have one stadium for 7 high schools. This may be a bit over the top, but something has to be built.


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## fishingwithhardheadkings (Oct 10, 2012)

Those guys deserve it.


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## Spots and Dots (May 23, 2004)

it's a shame they didn't build the Merril Center to accomodate football.

I'd rather see some road expansion in Katy before a stadium.


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## TunnelVision (Aug 16, 2005)

I think cy fair had an 80 million (berry)


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

We can't let Cy Fair beat us.


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

I don't know, a nice stadium brings in nice homes which brings in more tax revenue. Not a bad investment.


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## roundman (May 21, 2004)




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## texcajun (Feb 22, 2009)

This is freakin' Texas! We've got the best lookin' high school stadiums in the country. No need to be ashamed of that. We fill them with parents and supporters every Friday night. I guarantee it will not go to waste if it's built. If the voters approve it, then build the darn thing. Since when has Texas ever worried about what the rest of the country thinks?


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## Won Hunglo (Apr 24, 2007)

It is ok. The tax payers will fund it so it is free.


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

69 Million? Wow. Nothing is too good for those kids. Gonna be a real step down if they play ball at a second teir college.


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## br549 (Jan 17, 2006)

Are they keeping the old stadium or will they still have the same problem? For seven schools to share one is crazy but seven schools sharing two isnt much better. With the area growing as fast as it is and no signs of it slowing, why not spend that same amount on 3 or 4 nice stadiums instead of one "look at how cool our place is" stadium?


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## manwitaplan (Dec 9, 2005)

Won Hunglo said:


> It is ok. The tax payers will fund it so it is free.


What is sad is that there are some on here among us who believe it and do not understand it!


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## budreau (Jun 21, 2009)

waste of money.


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## bluefin (Aug 16, 2005)

RRfisher said:


> I don't know, a nice stadium brings in nice homes which brings in more tax revenue. Not a bad investment.


I, errr, nevermind...


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## andre3k (Dec 3, 2012)

Big stadiums are sure nice to look at. But if I were in Katy I would rather see 69 million spent on educating rather than playing. If thats what the voters want then let them build it and enjoy it. 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

What message are you sending to the kids? Thats ghetto economics.


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## chumy (Jul 13, 2012)

manwitaplan said:


> What is sad is that there are some on here among us who believe it and do not understand it!


"Some" is an understatement.


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

Katy ISD has no shortage of funds. The education is top notch as far as public schools go and obviously the football is top notch. As a taxpayer on two houses within Katy ISD, I have no issue with this. The stadium will be packed every game. Go try and buy season tickets for Katy High School currently at Rhodes Stadium. Can't be done. I've tried.


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## Spots and Dots (May 23, 2004)

RRfisher said:


> I don't know, a nice stadium brings in nice homes which brings in more tax revenue. Not a bad investment.


Have you been to katy? No shortage of new, nice homes, or tax revenue out here.


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## jcorkysgirl (Aug 6, 2012)

It's a 99 million dollar grant for a stadium science center and a bunch of other stuff. They plan on having 14 high schools in katyisd by 2014. Thank god I am moving from that he!! Hole this summe


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

So you build 1 stadium. Katy continues to grow. Hmmm. What Katy needs is more roadway to the great corporate teet downtown


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## Mustad7731 (May 23, 2004)

I screwed up and voted for that stadium...The good side is I'm moving soon and 
those of you left will have to pay for the stadium that like the astrodome, will never
get paid for...
My $0.02
Mustad7731


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Katy needs to finance a class in financial responsibility


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## whistlingdixie (Jul 28, 2008)

Have any of you seen the Beaumont football stadium? It is friggin ridiculous. It cost $47m but it caters to 3 High Schools I believe.


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

jcorkysgirl said:


> It's a 99 million dollar grant for a stadium science center and a bunch of other stuff. They plan on having 14 high schools in katyisd by 2014. Thank god I am moving from that he!! Hole this summe


As mentioned earlier, assuming it is correct, they have 7 presently. They'll double that next year?

7 is incredible. When I left Katy, there were 4.


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## seadoons (Jul 4, 2012)

I'm impressed they are going to construct 7 new high schools between now and the end of next year. Care to share where they are being built?


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## charlie23 (Jan 11, 2005)

poppadawg said:


> 69 Million? Wow. Nothing is too good for those kids. Gonna be a real step down if they play ball at a second teir college.


this new one will come with retractable roof and a 80 foot screen


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

As long as Jerry Jones isn't one of the investors, I'd vote for it.


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

If they do it I will take it as further proof that we have lost our collective minds in todays society.

8 mill? ok 80 mill????? insanity


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## andre3k (Dec 3, 2012)

Just imagine where our kids would be if we emphasized math, science, and medicine as much as we do hs football in american schools.


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

andre3k said:


> Just imagine where our kids would be if we emphasized math, science, and medicine as much as we do hs football in american schools.


Add healthful eating choices and exercise before all of that.


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## manwitaplan (Dec 9, 2005)

andre3k said:


> Just imagine where our kids would be if we emphasized math, science, and medicine as much as we do hs football in american schools.


I guess a lot of kids do not see Science professionals getting 100 Million dollar contracts out of High school / college.

"What does the Fox say"


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## Mont (Nov 17, 1998)

andre3k said:


> Just imagine where our kids would be if we emphasized math, science, and medicine as much as we do hs football in american schools.


The Johnny Football frenzy has been good to the tune of 170 million dollars this year for just that at TAMU. My daughter is a BioMed student there and most of the 170 is going towards the sciences. Gotta think like a businessman sometimes and step back and see the bigger picture. Football is on the income side of the ledger in a major way. Creek is also putting up a brand new state of the art stadium. I am all for it.


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## flatscat1 (Jun 2, 2005)

Take about $1 million of that and teach those kids to play golf instead. The return on investment is infinately better....maybe not for the city's revenue, but for the students, who are the ones that matter.

In 5 years the kids will be in college and not give a **** about high shool football, it will be a fading memory except for the fact that their knees are screwed up and they have a lifetime to suffer through that. In later life, no one will ever ask if they played high school football, or how nice their field was, or if their parents went to every game. Football is fun, but short lived, and not worth the expense.

But if you are a single digit handicapper in golf, a lifetime of business opportunities, invitations, and travel awaits you. It is a lifetime sport and will open many doors for them. 

Having played both football and AJGA golf, and now being a business owner, I can tell with certainty which is the better sport to master.


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

Spots and Dots said:


> Have you been to katy? No shortage of new, nice homes, or tax revenue out here.


Right, and you keep the district competitive and attractive to higher income earners, you'll keep the homes higher end.


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

flatscat1 said:


> Take about $1 million of that and teach those kids to play golf instead. The return on investment is infinately better....maybe not for the city's revenue, but for the students, who are the ones that matter.
> 
> In 5 years the kids will be in college and not give a **** about high shool football, it will be a fading memory except for the fact that their knees are screwed up and they have a lifetime to suffer through that. In later life, no one will ever ask if they played high school football, or how nice their field was, or if their parents went to every game. Football is fun, but short lived, and not worth the expense.
> 
> ...


Truth. That is one of two things that I wish they would have taught in high school. How to play golf and how to do your own taxes. I preach it every day.


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

I hope it includes a mosquitoes spraying system. The traffic will double.


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

Football is a money loser for many D1 Universities. Sure, there are some that are quite profitable, but for many schools, thats the exception, not the rule. 

Couple stats - 2009, only 14 Universities in D1-A/Football Bowl Subdivision (out of 120 or so) had profitable athletic departments. In 2010, 22 were profitable.


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## boltmaster (Aug 16, 2011)

May as well waste the money for that......we already suck at education on the world stage so we may as well turn out the best gladiators!

When in America do as the Romans did....:headknock


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

Ernest said:


> Football is a money loser for many D1 Universities. Sure, there are some that are quite profitable, but for many schools, thats the exception, not the rule.
> 
> Couple stats - 2009, only 14 Universities in D1-A/Football Bowl Subdivision (out of 120 or so) had profitable athletic departments. In 2010, 22 were profitable.


I find this very hard to believe. Football programs are what keep all of the other sports afloat. Especially at your larger universities. I just can't imagine that only 22 programs are profitable.


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## On The Hook (Feb 24, 2009)

I'm not in favor of big education dollars being spent on sports, I think its wrong. School tax funding is about education, and crazy amounts of tax money spent on stadiums does not increase the education levels. I'm all for the sports programs, just not the lavish stadiums and other big ticket items that are not required to play the sport. Football can be played in a field, no stadium required. If schools want these big ticket items not related to education, then, those facilities need to be self supportive and should have their costs covered by the users, not those being taxed for education.

The tax payers, especially those without kids do not owe anyone a multi million dollar stadium to play sports in. I feel generally the same about bussing, the general public does not owe your kid a ride to school on a bus. It's your kid, you get them there, that's part of the responsibility that comes with being a parent.

If you took the crazy money spent on sports and busses, school tax would not be at the ridiculous level it is at now, and there would be plenty of money to pay qualified teachers a fair wage. Sure, there are lots of bad teachers that are paid much more than they are worth, but there are lots of great teachers who are under paid. That does not give mention to those who would teach if it were not for the relatively low salaries.

School spending on lavish extras is way out of hand, and this stadium is a prime example. This is not about education, its about sports being funded under the guise of education. It's wrong. I don not believe that any student in school would be less apt to develop to their full potential because they could not play football in a multi million dollar stadium. Sports are great, and surely help develop team skills, but I cannot see how an expensive stadium plays into those skills.

I fully expect that many of you will disagree and likely a few will start bashing, but you really owe it to yourself and others to look at the school budgets and see how out of balance the spending is on sports vs education. Remember, lots of folks don't have kids and they are burdened with the cost of supporting yours, so there is more to this than what you want for your kids.



jcorkysgirl said:


> It's a 99 million dollar grant for a stadium science center and a bunch of other stuff. They plan on having 14 high schools in katyisd by 2014. Thank god I am moving from that he!! Hole this summe


Wonder where that grant money came from? Taxpayers maybe?



RRfisher said:


> I don't know, a nice stadium brings in nice homes which brings in more tax revenue. Not a bad investment.


Schools are not designed to be financial investments in the community infrastructure, they are designed to educate the students.


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## whistlingdixie (Jul 28, 2008)

Any other ideas on how to raise more money for these high schools? The great thing about Texas is that Texans love them some football from pee wee all the way to professional.


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## Bull Red (Mar 17, 2010)

Katy definitely needs some new football fields, but $69MM for one does seem a little extravagant.


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## On The Hook (Feb 24, 2009)

Deany45 said:


> I find this very hard to believe. Football programs are what keep all of the other sports afloat. Especially at your larger universities. I just can't imagine that only 22 programs are profitable.


You would need to seriously examine how the money is spent and in what amounts. You'd be shocked at the numbers.


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

On The Hook said:


> Schools are not designed to be financial investments in the community infrastructure, they are designed to educate the students.


I'm going to have to disagree, I chose the community I live in because of the schools among other things.


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## On The Hook (Feb 24, 2009)

RRfisher said:


> I'm going to have to disagree, I chose the community I live in because of the schools among other things.


Did you choose it because of the stadiums & the buildings themselves, or the quality of education? Are you saying that your family said, this school looks good, lets buy a house here? I'm using looks good referencing aesthetically pleasing for the purpose of this question? If the school was highly rated educationally, but in an ugly building, would you not have chosen that community?

Side note: I'm not saying the facilities have to be ugly,or poor quality, just not lavish at the public's expense.


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

http://www.forbes.com/sites/aliciaj...ok-at-the-top-25-teams-revenues-and-expenses/

Here are the top 25 teams in the country this year. None of them are struggling for money.


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## fwoodwader (Jul 18, 2008)

Deany45 said:


> I find this very hard to believe. Football programs are what keep all of the other sports afloat. Especially at your larger universities. I just can't imagine that only 22 programs are profitable.


Because of Title IX.

Football programs in major universities often or most likely fund the general athletic fund which all other sports programs are operating.

Do you think Women softball, Lacrosse or Soccer post a profit on the ledger? Not a chance the operate on football money.

As for a 70 million dollar stadium, I just don't get it. So you can't build a stadium for half that cost and use the other funds for new buildings, education programs like shop and tech classes etc. Do you really need the "fancy stadium' or do you just need capacity seating?


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

On The Hook said:


> Did you choose it because of the stadiums & the buildings themselves, or the quality of education?


Quality of education, but it didn't hurt that one of the high schools was in the state playoffs a couple years ago. I don't really have a dog in the hunt though, our most recent stadium was built in 2003 and "only" cost $18.9m.


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## colbyntx (Jul 18, 2013)

That's why there is a vote. The people of Katy will decide if they want to pay for the new stadium. I don't think it's a bad investment for the community. I live in a small town with a 3A team that has the largest HD video screen in Texas. The community paid for it in a bond election. Carthage takes pride in its football team. 
http://www.news-journal.com/etvarsi...cle_d2f16c8b-3519-5a39-ba64-7a9007e18476.html


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

Deany45 said:


> I find this very hard to believe. Football programs are what keep all of the other sports afloat. Especially at your larger universities. I just can't imagine that only 22 programs are profitable.


You have to have the big TV money and bowl money. Going to the Bing Cherry bowl will cost your more money then you will make. I remember one team turned down a bowl invitation because they would lose money in the deal. Some of the games have to be on Thursday to accommodate all the teams. If you are already playing on Thursdays you might as well play Monday-Saturday.


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## colbyntx (Jul 18, 2013)

To go along with our new stadium, new screen, we just finished a new indoor practice facility for $3.5M  We are a town of 6,600, I think Katy will do just fine!

http://www.arklatexhomepage.com/sto...ing-completion/d/story/LwD4f-LvvkCRJjdpshwZ5w


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

My issue with all this is that we have one group of people voting on whether to spend the money. Then, we have a different group of people that is supposed to pay for it. 

Its like four of us voting that Mont is buying us surf and turf on Saturday night. I'll vote for Mont to buy me surf and turf every night of the week and for lunch on Sunday.


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## colbyntx (Jul 18, 2013)

Ernest said:


> My issue with all this is that we have one group of people voting on whether to spend the money. Then, we have a different group of people that is supposed to pay for it.
> 
> Its like four of us voting that Mont is buying us surf and turf on Saturday night. I'll vote for Mont to buy me surf and turf every night of the week and for lunch on Sunday.


The polls are open today. Everybody in Katy can go down and vote, not just one group.


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

But, not everyone pays the same, right? Hence my point. One group voting on whether to spend money that they will never have to repay (or repay only a fraction).


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## On The Hook (Feb 24, 2009)

colbyntx said:


> That's why there is a vote. The people of Katy will decide if they want to pay for the new stadium. I don't think it's a bad investment for the community. I live in a small town with a 3A team that has the largest HD video screen in Texas. The community paid for it in a bond election. Carthage takes pride in its football team.
> http://www.news-journal.com/etvarsi...cle_d2f16c8b-3519-5a39-ba64-7a9007e18476.html


I wonder if those large video screens help provide a higher level of education for those kids? I don't think they do, therefore I don't think they have any place in a school budget or bond election. Sure they are nice, but not necessary.

If the PTA or other social group wanted to raise donated funds and donate such a lavish item, I'd be all for it. But to think tax payer money is spent on such luxury items turns my stomach. I wonder how many people realize that bond money is no different than loan money, which means that you pay more than the cost of the item when using bond money. Borrow a dollar, pay back three, that's not good usage of tax money.

I'm glad to see people enjoy sports, but don't think education tax money should be spent on luxury, especially when our education system is doing so poorly.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Katy won't regret it! 

We're the smallest 5a school around our parts. Here's our stadium. I love it! You can even buy a air conditioned room for 1k for the season. Free food too! Our score board is huge.Instant replay and everything! The colored seats are season passes. All the high school kids and band sit on the lower seats. It is really really nice. I hate going to away games.


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## Deany45 (Jul 24, 2011)

colbyntx said:


> The polls are open today. Everybody in Katy can go down and vote, not just one group.


Exactly.


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

The chron had a good write up on it if anyone cares to know the specifics:

http://www.chron.com/neighborhood/k...m-bond-package-heads-to-the-polls-4936741.php


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## whistlingdixie (Jul 28, 2008)

devil1824 said:


> Katy won't regret it!
> 
> We're the smallest 5a school around our parts. Here's our stadium. I love it! You can even buy a air conditioned room for 1k for the season. Free food too! Our score board is huge.Instant replay and everything! The colored seats are season passes. All the high school kids and band sit on the lower seats. It is really really nice. I hate going to away games.


awesome stadium. Is there such thing as a small 5A school?


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## colbyntx (Jul 18, 2013)

On The Hook said:


> I wonder if those large video screens help provide a higher level of education for those kids? I don't think they do, therefore I don't think they have any place in a school budget or bond election. Sure they are nice, but not necessary.
> 
> If the PTA or other social group wanted to raise donated funds and donate such a lavish item, I'd be all for it. But to think tax payer money is spent on such luxury items turns my stomach. I wonder how many people realize that bond money is no different than loan money, which means that you pay more than the cost of the item when using bond money. Borrow a dollar, pay back three, that's not good usage of tax money.
> 
> I'm glad to see people enjoy sports, but don't think education tax money should be spent on luxury, especially when our education system is doing so poorly.


Most everybody in my county owns land or is a home owner. Not much rental property here. Most everybody does pay their school tax. As for making their GPA's higher, no. Every school has good and bad students. I have 2 kids in Carthage high school. Both are athletes and both in the top 2% of public school students in the country. These athletes bring in so much money for the school and community. Stadium is packed every game and throughout the playoffs. Carthage has won 3 of the last 5, 3A state titles. These are local taxes that pretty much everybody pays. If you don't like it then go vote.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Katy can get big time sponsors for the scoreboard too. 


Notice how small the track looks. The instant replay really does make a difference. Sponsors air during timeouts and halftime. I find myself constantly watching the plays on it.


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## Spots and Dots (May 23, 2004)

On The Hook said:


> I'm glad to see people enjoy sports, but don't think education tax money should be spent on luxury, especially when our education system is doing so poorly.


It's a BOND, not a tax increase. Of course, taxes will repay the bond issuance, but in theory the tax base will grow because of added infrastructure.

I'd still like to see some moola tagged for roads!!


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

colbyntx said:


> That's why there is a vote. The people of Katy will decide if they want to pay for the new stadium. I don't think it's a bad investment for the community. I live in a small town with a 3A team that has the largest HD video screen in Texas. The community paid for it in a bond election. Carthage takes pride in its football team.
> http://www.news-journal.com/etvarsi...cle_d2f16c8b-3519-5a39-ba64-7a9007e18476.html


The city of Carthage, Carthage ISD and its voters should be ashamed of themselves for that waste. That is ridiculous. That stadium is used 6 times a year.


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## Bily Lovec (Sep 26, 2005)

Mont said:


> *The Johnny Football frenzy has been good to the tune of 170 million dollars this year for just that at TAMU*. My daughter is a BioMed student there and most of the 170 is going towards the sciences. Gotta think like a businessman sometimes and step back and see the bigger picture. Football is on the income side of the ledger in a major way. Creek is also putting up a brand new state of the art stadium. I am all for it.


false.
more like $20,000 bucks 
http://blog.chron.com/sportsupdate/...ons-from-manziels-heisman-victory/?cmpid=hpts



> The first paragraph of the Bloomberg story certainly earns readersâ€™ attention: â€œTexas A&M University made only about $20,000 from Johnny Manzielâ€™s Heisman Trophy last season, according to the school.â€


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

I'd just ask the author of this whole proposal, why?


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## colbyntx (Jul 18, 2013)

Backwater1 said:


> The city of Carthage, Carthage ISD and its voters should be ashamed of themselves for that waste. That is ridiculous. That stadium is used 6 times a year.


6 times a year, how do you figure? It is used all year long for many sports and events. All three high school football teams, all 4 JH teams. It is also used all playoffs long for football. All the HS & JH kids use it for track & field, soccer, ect. The little kids also use it for soccer and football. Churches use it for concerts and events. It is in use all the time. Carthage is a very gas wealthy town and if we want to spend our money to better our kids high school experience then we will. What better investment can a town make than in it's kids?


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## carryyourbooks (Feb 13, 2009)

Deany45 said:


> Katy ISD has no shortage of funds. The education is top notch as far as public schools go and obviously the football is top notch. As a taxpayer on two houses within Katy ISD, I have no issue with this. The stadium will be packed every game. Go try and buy season tickets for Katy High School currently at Rhodes Stadium. Can't be done. I've tried.


I agree. I voted for it. katy sells out almost every game. we play 7/10 games at Rhodes a year whether we sit on the visitor or home side. cinco does about the same. seven lakes is catching up slowly. that is a lot of revenue. as a fan of katy high, I can tell you most schools (berry, Baylor, rice, Pasadena memorial....just to name a few) can't even keep up at the concessions. katy fans usually show up at the game 3 hours before kickoff and start buying concessions when they let us in. sure, it costs a lot up front, but they'll make the money back.

in case you hadn't noticed, texas high school football is where its at.:bounce:


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## On The Hook (Feb 24, 2009)

Spots and Dots said:


> It's a BOND, not a tax increase. Of course, taxes will repay the bond issuance, but in theory the tax base will grow because of added infrastructure.
> 
> I'd still like to see some moola tagged for roads!!


Actually the monies available for education will shrink, because someone has to pay the interest and that will be the taxpayer. There is only so much tax revenue, and interest must be paid, what's left goes to education. It's a bad deal. If they don't have the cash, they have no business financing stadiums. The more interest that is paid, the lower the educational budget will be assuming a similar revenue in future years.

If you take 100 and put it toward education, then all is good, start taking 10, 20, 30, or more out for interest payments and you no longer have the basis needed to support the education of our future. Nice stadiums do not lead our country. Educated kids will.


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## capt.sandbar (Aug 31, 2007)

Wait a couple years when they go off to college... Texas A&M $450,000,000 REMODEL....


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## gater (May 25, 2004)

*Inflation*



poppadawg said:


> Just saw it on the national news. They are voting on it today. High School? WTH? No wonder kids become obsessed with bling.


Poppadog this is Texas, everything is bigger and better especially high school football. This is what 60 million would get you a few years ago. Katy will have the most expensive but not the biggest. I don't think this 18,000 seat stadium is not even the biggest in the state. Either way, this takes Friday Night Lights to a different level.

Allen High School Stadium, When you have the largest high school in Texas and the largest high school band in the Country you need to have some bling. Gater


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## Jerry-rigged (May 21, 2004)

For all my neighbors, Alvin is next. Maybe not $69MM big, but the current bond on the ballet has a huge sports complex in it. Football stadium "Like Katy's (I am guessing Rhodes, not the new one), Natatorium, baseball, training facilities, etc. Also AHS#3 is on this bond. both AHS#3 and the sports complex will be over by Pearland Mall., ***?


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

I am fairly certain all the people of Katy does not care if their property taxes go up for a fuseball stadium.. How much do you wanna bet a high percentage of apartment dwellers and low budget home owners vote YES!!!

No SKIN in the game..


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## TheGoose (Jan 22, 2006)

The article that was linked stated that Katy ISD is over $1 BILLION in debt already, and now they are proposing this new bond. 

Yup, looks like they've got plenty of money alright.


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

And, I love the way they sell it like its a used car or something. Sure, all this will cost a whole bunch of money, but don't worry, with our easy finance terms your monthly payment will not change. 

Katy bond debt is only $1.167 billion before this offering.


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

Lmao! Suckers!!!


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

colbyntx said:


> 6 times a year, how do you figure? It is used all year long for many sports and events. All three high school football teams, all 4 JH teams. It is also used all playoffs long for football. All the HS & JH kids use it for track & field, soccer, ect. The little kids also use it for soccer and football. Churches use it for concerts and events. It is in use all the time. Carthage is a very gas wealthy town and if we want to spend our money to better our kids high school experience then we will. What better investment can a town make than in it's kids?


BS. Track meets draw little to no crowds, neither do 7th grade football games or some peewee soccer matches. You may have a random concert event here and there, but lets be honest here, how big of a venue does the First Baptist Church of Carthage, Tx need for its gospel concert? If you didn't have 2 HS aged athletes, you wouldn't want to waste your money on that thing.

Carthage has 5 varsity football games in that stadium this year. They MAY bring in $250k in revenue between concessions, ticket sales, box sales and advertising.

With those kind of numbers, it would take 4 years just to cover the cost and maintenance of the scoreboard alone.

No business or investor in their right mind would make a financial decision like that, so the city and school district just made a big pretty presentation for you guys and yall fell for it. How you think that a football stadium is investing in a town's youth is beyond me.

How about putting 500k a year towards scholarship programs instead? That is investing in your town's youth.


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## flatscat1 (Jun 2, 2005)

Ernest said:


> And, I love the way they sell it like its a used car or something. Sure, all this will cost a whole bunch of money, but don't worry, with our easy finance terms your monthly payment will not change.
> 
> Katy bond debt is only $1.167 billion before this offering.


I bet at one time Cleveland had $1.167B in debt but people didn't worry about it.....and kept approving more of....


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

I've read through this thread and looked at the pictures. 2 words

Beautiful and obscene. We live in a world gone mad.


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

Stumpgrinder said:


> I've read through this thread and looked at the pictures. 2 words
> 
> Beautiful and obscene. We live in a world gone mad.


Agreed. Our socialist education system is out of control.


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## whistlingdixie (Jul 28, 2008)

I am all for it but I live in Lumberton so I will go back to our metal stands and generic scoreboard.


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## flatsfats (May 21, 2004)

Stumpgrinder said:


> I've read through this thread and looked at the pictures. 2 words
> 
> Beautiful and obscene. We live in a world gone mad.


X2. My brother almost fell out of the truck when I told him what the property taxes are on my little place. Its ridiculous.


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## Mont (Nov 17, 1998)

Bily Lovec said:


> false.
> more like $20,000 bucks
> http://blog.chron.com/sportsupdate/...ons-from-manziels-heisman-victory/?cmpid=hpts


Take a look at the total money raised compared to 3 years ago vs this year and then tell my why it's changed. It's certainly not the economy.

from your link



> After university fundraising jumped more than 44 percent this year through September,


As for spending money, I would rather blow it on a nice stadium that spend it on more prisons. Expenses are just that, expenses.


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## carryyourbooks (Feb 13, 2009)

Mont said:


> The Johnny Football frenzy has been good to the tune of 170 million dollars this year for just that at TAMU. My daughter is a BioMed student there and most of the 170 is going towards the sciences.* Gotta think like a businessman sometimes and step back and see the bigger picture.* Football is on the income side of the ledger in a major way. Creek is also putting up a brand new state of the art stadium. I am all for it.


they just don't get it.


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## Bily Lovec (Sep 26, 2005)

Mont said:


> Take a look at the total money raised compared to 3 years ago vs this year and then tell my why it's changed. It's certainly not the economy.
> 
> from your link
> 
> As for spending money, I would rather blow it on a nice stadium that spend it on more prisons. Expenses are just that, expenses.


I'll happily agree johnny hancock is worth more than $20k, we're not naive enough to think hes worth $170M are we ?
this link is from AM, it clears up a lot of the questions...
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...ought-texas-a-m-about-20-000-school-says.html



> ...As our fans know well, we are in the middle of a perfect storm in which many things â€" SEC move, Coach (Kevin) Sumlin, Johnny, the Texas economy, enrollment growth, law school â€" have all come together to elevate the Texas A&M brand. Johnny has certainly been a major component and catalyst of our tremendous growth â€¦


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## wfishtx (Apr 10, 2006)

If you build it....they will come.


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## Lone-Star (Dec 19, 2009)

Deany45 said:


> Katy ISD has no shortage of funds. The education is top notch as far as public schools go and obviously the football is top notch. As a taxpayer on two houses within Katy ISD, I have no issue with this. The stadium will be packed every game. Go try and buy season tickets for Katy High School currently at Rhodes Stadium. Can't be done. I've tried.


If they had the funds they could just built it without a vote, obviously they need to borrow more to build it.


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## Bull Red (Mar 17, 2010)

Jerry-rigged said:


> For all my neighbors, Alvin is next. Maybe not $69MM big, but the current bond on the ballet has a huge sports complex in it. Football stadium "Like Katy's (I am guessing Rhodes, not the new one), Natatorium, baseball, training facilities, etc. Also AHS#3 is on this bond. both AHS#3 and the sports complex will be over by Pearland Mall., ***?


I'm sure I'll be able to hear the band from my house. I guess it wouldn't be so bad if I enjoyed band music.... and traffic. :headknock


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

TunnelVision said:


> I think cy fair had an 80 million (berry)


 They (and Allen) got enough negative press that Katy wanted to keep it significantly below that to avoid the complaining...


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## bearwhiz (Jan 30, 2011)

jcorkysgirl said:


> It's a 99 million dollar grant for a stadium science center and a bunch of other stuff. They plan on having 14 high schools in katyisd by 2014. Thank god I am moving from that he!! Hole this summe


No, they are not planning on having 14 high schools in the next 50 years. Number 8 is currently on the drawing board and scheduled for the north side of the freeway. Maybe opening in 2017.


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## rsmith (Jun 29, 2007)

Hey they will produce a couple of pro's every 5 or 6 years. Maybe.


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## SaltwaterTom (Jun 23, 2013)

It is easy to tell what is important to people; look at what they dedicate their resources to. Time, money, effort, whatever the resource is, they spend it on what they deem important. Some cultures place a high value on education and academic achievement because they feel it will pay for itself over and over in the future. I guess Texas places a high value on high school sports (well, some of them) because it makes players, parents, and fans feel excited and succesful "in the moment". I can sympathize, I know how excited I got when my daughter played travel softball all over the country, it's intoxicating. But would I have pulled resources (time, attention, energy) from her academics that would pay off in scholarships and make her succesful in college? No way!! 

Maybe if towns posted little signs at their city limits boasting about their Rhodes scholars, engineers, doctors, etc... Or how a certain percent of their high school grads go on to complete college degrees? But no, they just brag about how they won a football championship many years ago. Whatever, their money........


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## capt4fish (Dec 4, 2004)

*Just how many....*



colbyntx said:


> 6 times a year, how do you figure? It is used all year long for many sports and events. All three high school football teams, all 4 JH teams. It is also used all playoffs long for football. All the HS & JH kids use it for track & field, soccer, ect. The little kids also use it for soccer and football. Churches use it for concerts and events. It is in use all the time. Carthage is a very gas wealthy town and if we want to spend our money to better our kids high school experience then we will. What better investment can a town make than in it's kids?


How many of these functions actually are spectator paid events? Just football?

Do the math. The math does not lie. High school stadiums to the tune of 69 million will NEVER pay for themselves. Much like the city of houston and Reliant stadium.

This country has lost its mind when it comes to sports.


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## jeffm66 (Sep 14, 2010)

SaltwaterTom said:


> It is easy to tell what is important to people; look at what they dedicate their resources to. Time, money, effort, whatever the resource is, they spend it on what they deem important. Some cultures place a high value on education and academic achievement because they feel it will pay for itself over and over in the future. I guess Texas places a high value on high school sports (well, some of them) because it makes players, parents, and fans feel excited and succesful "in the moment". I can sympathize, I know how excited I got when my daughter played travel softball all over the country, it's intoxicating. But would I have pulled resources (time, attention, energy) from her academics that would pay off in scholarships and make her succesful in college? No way!!
> 
> Maybe if towns posted little signs at their city limits boasting about their Rhodes scholars, engineers, doctors, etc... Or how a certain percent of their high school grads go on to complete college degrees? But no, they just brag about how they won a football championship many years ago. Whatever, their money........


Well said! When the economy took a dump and Cy Fair had just built the Berry Center I thought it looked bad to have to cut bus routes and talk about laying off teachers.


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## manwitaplan (Dec 9, 2005)

Jerry-rigged said:


> For all my neighbors, Alvin is next. Maybe not $69MM big, but the current bond on the ballet has a huge sports complex in it. Football stadium "Like Katy's (I am guessing Rhodes, not the new one), Natatorium, baseball, training facilities, etc. Also AHS#3 is on this bond. both AHS#3 and the sports complex will be over by Pearland Mall., ***?


Yes you are correct. Here is a little bit of info that you may not know. The new stadium was going to be in Manvel more centrally located. The city administrators of Manvel wanted all the Bling but did not want to help. Alving gave them plenty of time and they balked. Alvin had to do something so they found another track of land which happens to be near the Pearland mall.

Alvin ISD spans 252 square miles? The District encompasses the cities of Alvin and Manvel and the communities Liverpool, Amsterdam, Rosharon, Iowa Colony, and parts of Pearland. Successful bond elections in 2000, 2003, 2005 and 2009 have enabled the district to build new schools, make renovations and additins to existing schools, provide learning technology needs, purchase new buses and add air conditioning and monitoring systems on buses; build a safety and technology center; add air conditioning, fire alarm systems and parking lots at older campuses; provide additional bleachers, backstops and entry gates at the AHS softball field; and make renovations to Alvin ISD Memorial Stadium.


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## Tortuga (May 21, 2004)

Moot point...stadium is down the toilet...as it should be


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## Ratred20 (Apr 11, 2007)

It may be down the drain right now but it'll come back up soon enough and be built. I've been here for 20 years and still amazed this didn't pass with all the monies pi55ed away on some ridiculous upgrades. Not all upgrades or new construction has been a waste but I have seen some stupid expenses on an elementary school in my neighborhood my own kids attended not too long ago. 

I believe the incredible rate of waste at Katy ISD didn't bode we'll with the majority of the tax payers last time and the results were reflected tonight.


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## Ratred20 (Apr 11, 2007)

BATWING said:


> I am fairly certain all the people of Katy does not care if their property taxes go up for a fuseball stadium.. How much do you wanna bet a high percentage of apartment dwellers and low budget home owners vote YES!!!
> 
> No SKIN in the game..


Probably not. There weren't any handouts at stake at the polls tonight so hose voters stayed away.

Another stadium - yes, it's really needed but $69M. Pffft!


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## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

Deany45 said:


> I find this very hard to believe. Football programs are what keep all of the other sports afloat. Especially at your larger universities. I just can't imagine that only 22 programs are profitable.


I can if they're run by daum democrats. They could lose money running an organization that prints money.

As for a 70 million dollar high school stadium. Who Cares? It's one of the wealthiest private sector economies in the nation. If they have the money, and can do it by not raising taxes, go for it...
Sure beats wasting money indoctrinating little left wing nut jobs. I can honestly say The tools I took away from high school/college sports have proven far more useful than most of the "academics" I had while on high school.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

SaltwaterTom said:


> It is easy to tell what is important to people; look at what they dedicate their resources to. Time, money, effort, whatever the resource is, they spend it on what they deem important. Some cultures place a high value on education and academic achievement because they feel it will pay for itself over and over in the future. I guess Texas places a high value on high school sports (well, some of them) because it makes players, parents, and fans feel excited and succesful "in the moment". I can sympathize, I know how excited I got when my daughter played travel softball all over the country, it's intoxicating. But would I have pulled resources (time, attention, energy) from her academics that would pay off in scholarships and make her succesful in college? No way!!
> 
> Maybe if towns posted little signs at their city limits boasting about their Rhodes scholars, engineers, doctors, etc... Or how a certain percent of their high school grads go on to complete college degrees? But no, they just brag about how they won a football championship many years ago. Whatever, their money........


Not around here. Our teachers are the highest paid around. Our test scores are very high also.

Midway is just outstanding. So much community involvement. Of course we are about 70% white too. Not all schools are what you make them out to be. I'm very happy with the athletic dept. And the Academics.


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## tec (Jul 20, 2007)

Sounds ridiculus to me unless there is a reasonable return on investment.


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## Jerry-rigged (May 21, 2004)

manwitaplan said:


> Yes you are correct. Here is a little bit of info that you may not know. The new stadium was going to be in Manvel more centrally located. The city administrators of Manvel wanted all the Bling but did not want to help. Alving gave them plenty of time and they balked. Alvin had to do something so they found another track of land which happens to be near the Pearland mall.
> 
> Alvin ISD spans 252 square miles? The District encompasses the cities of Alvin and Manvel and the communities Liverpool, Amsterdam, Rosharon, Iowa Colony, and parts of Pearland. Successful bond elections in 2000, 2003, 2005 and 2009 have enabled the district to build new schools, make renovations and additins to existing schools, provide learning technology needs, purchase new buses and add air conditioning and monitoring systems on buses; build a safety and technology center; add air conditioning, fire alarm systems and parking lots at older campuses; provide additional bleachers, backstops and entry gates at the AHS softball field; and make renovations to Alvin ISD Memorial Stadium.


Yes, I have heard most of that before. Including the "bunch of old guy in Manvel" that block all expansion / development plans. What I don't get is why people living in the Pearland City Limits are going to AISD schools. Shadow Creek and most of South fork are in the Pearland City limits, but AISD.

That area needs a High School, I get that. But if Alvin is going to pay for a new sporting complex, I wish we were not building it in Pearland.

Bond passed, 67-32, BTW.


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## Jerry-rigged (May 21, 2004)

Also, on the subject of High school football stadiums, Does anyone know what it cost to build something like "The Rig" - Pearlands stadium on hwy 35? That seems like a nice, large, no-frills stadium.


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

This is what $18.9m got back in 2003, that's about $25m in today's dollars.

http://www.kaharchitects.com/projects/architecture/educational/rrisd-stadium-complex/


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## Fish_On! (May 25, 2012)

The voters said "No Thank You".


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## chuck leaman (Jul 15, 2004)

The Rig is a nice stadium for sure. Been there to watch Dawson several times. Im sure the voters in Katy felt that they could get another Rhodes type stadium for a lot less money. They do need another stadium. I like our little stadium in Altair. Nice place to spend a Friday night.


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## MapMaster (May 25, 2004)

A new stadium sounds like a great idea...IF they pay for it in cash from ticket sales from the old stadium. I don't want to be on the hook, paying for kids to go to school when I don't have kids and dang sure don't want to build a stadium for your brats to play a game in. 
I will never understand why parents get to use a child as a dependent for a tax credit and I don't get a break for not having a child to use the resources. I vote against every bond on the premise that everything should be paid for in cash from savings. I run my personal budget that way and do not need a credit card as a result. You folks with a spend now and pay later mentality have your priorities in the wrong place. Just the view from a single man with no kids and no debt.


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## wfishtx (Apr 10, 2006)

MapMaster said:


> A new stadium sounds like a great idea...IF they pay for it in cash from ticket sales from the old stadium. I don't want to be on the hook, paying for kids to go to school when I don't have kids and dang sure don't want to build a stadium for your brats to play a game in.
> I will never understand why parents get to use a child as a dependent for a tax credit and I don't get a break for not having a child to use the resources. I vote against every bond on the premise that everything should be paid for in cash from savings. I run my personal budget that way and do not need a credit card as a result. You folks with a spend now and pay later mentality have your priorities in the wrong place. Just the view from a *single man with no kids* and no debt.


And there you have it....


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## houtxfisher (Sep 12, 2006)

MapMaster said:


> A new stadium sounds like a great idea...IF they pay for it in cash from ticket sales from the old stadium. I don't want to be on the hook, paying for kids to go to school when I don't have kids and dang sure don't want to build a stadium for your brats to play a game in.
> I will never understand why parents get to use a child as a dependent for a tax credit and I don't get a break for not having a child to use the resources. I vote against every bond on the premise that everything should be paid for in cash from savings. I run my personal budget that way and do not need a credit card as a result. You folks with a spend now and pay later mentality have your priorities in the wrong place. Just the view from a *single man with no kids and no debt.*
> 
> 
> ...


There you have what? A financially responsible anomaly?


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

houtxfisher said:


> There you have what? A financially responsible anomaly?


A man with no kids. It cost approximately $250K to raise one child. If you don't have children, why on earth do you live in the city. My butt would be out in the country! You sound like a freaking liberal. You don't like it so no one should. MOVE!


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## SpikeMike (May 16, 2007)

i live in Katy ISD. two years ago the district fired a bunch of teachers and got rid of a bunch of busses and routes.

not to mention, the school board is totally antagonistic to the public.

lets address these issues, then we can talk about a stadium.


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## houtxfisher (Sep 12, 2006)

devil1824 said:


> A man with no kids. It cost approximately $250K to raise one child. If you don't have children, why on earth do you live in the city. My butt would be out in the country! You sound like a freaking liberal. You don't like it so no one should. MOVE!


What does the cost of raising a child have to do with adding debt for a stadium? I didn't know having children was a requisite of living in the city, besides, I was living in the "city" when it was all farms. I suppose I am a "freaking liberal" because of my conservative fiscal beliefs of spending less than you earn. Good day sir.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

If he votes "no" on every bond because he has no "brats" in school, then he should move. A single man with no "brats" should be able to afford the gas money to get to work from somewhere else.


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

Pretty sure the guy voted no against ALL spending because the State is broke. Why on Earth would someone think it's ok to spend 70Mil on a GD highschool football stadium. LOL!!!!!


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## ATX 4x4 (Jun 25, 2011)

MapMaster said:


> A new stadium sounds like a great idea...IF they pay for it in cash from ticket sales from the old stadium. I don't want to be on the hook, paying for kids to go to school when I don't have kids and dang sure don't want to build a stadium for your brats to play a game in.
> I will never understand why parents get to use a child as a dependent for a tax credit and I don't get a break for not having a child to use the resources. I vote against every bond on the premise that everything should be paid for in cash from savings. I run my personal budget that way and do not need a credit card as a result. You folks with a spend now and pay later mentality have your priorities in the wrong place. Just the view from a single man with no kids and no debt.





devil1824 said:


> If he votes "no" on every bond because he has no "brats" in school, then he should move. A single man with no "brats" should be able to afford the gas money to get to work from somewhere else.


Who sounds like a "freaking liberal"?


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

devil1824 said:


> If he votes "no" on every bond because he has no "brats" in school, then he should move. A single man with no "brats" should be able to afford the gas money to get to work from somewhere else.


Does it mean a person cant have an opinion because they have no kids ? I danged sure pay through the teeth in League CIty for school taxes to educate other peoples kids.

69 million dollars for a high school football stadium is irresponsible, unjustifiable, unnecessary , arrogant and just plain stupid. It's plain old meanspirited to us of us that have to pay for the danged things and get zero benefit.

Plus, dont they already owe a billion in bond obligations over there ?


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Our property tax is freaking high too. When my kids graduate and are out of the house we are probably going to move so we won't be "on the hook" for other kids going to school. Vote no, that's fine. I just don't understand why someone would complain about having to pay for kids to go to school when no one is forcing them to live there. lol. 
If you don't have kids and for sure if you don't have kids in sports you will never understand. I live to watch my son play football. He's also a A,B student.


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## flatscat1 (Jun 2, 2005)

devil1824 said:


> If he votes "no" on every bond because he has no "brats" in school, then he should move. A single man with no "brats" should be able to afford the gas money to get to work from somewhere else.


What is the helll are you talking about? I have no kids but I can afford to live wherever I want, and I make such decisions on whatever metrics I choose.

I don't live in Katy, but I would certainly have voted NO for such a school bond proposal if it were applicable to my area...it is simply the fiscally responsible thing to do.

And by the way, I went to private school so public school bonds have hurt my pocketbook my entire life - I vote NO on them. I've paid $100k in taxes over the years to educate other people's kids, but I'm not bittching, it's my decision to live where I do. If you want to vote for them, fine, but I certainly have the right to vote the other way if I choose. Money has nothing to do with it. My 30 minute round trip door-to-door drive to my office downtown is worth more than spending 2 hrs. in the car each day living where the taxes are less, but I don't give a **** if my neighbor's kid has a new football stadium to play in.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Few post up dude.


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

Curiosity is getting the better of me.. So with kids playing sports how much more would you be willing to pay or donate to the cause to have said stadium?

$1500 a month?
$5000?


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Ha. Not that much!!


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## whistlingdixie (Jul 28, 2008)

I am married and do not have any kids yet and the only debt I have is debt so that I can keep my credit score up. Saying all that I would have voted yes to the stadium for a lot of reasons. Football on Friday nights does a lot for the community including raising money for the school, providing a kid an opportunity to excel in sports at a school they can be proud of, and my favorite reason is to keep kids off the streets and out of trouble. Sports help kids build responsibility, time management, team work, and many other great attributes. Anyone who is too grumpy to want to help out our future generation is only contributing to the fall of our future. I agree a $70 mil stadium sounds extravagant but I do know that if a kid is proud of his school then he is more then likely to want to attend. You can agree with me or not but that is my honest opinion.


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

Stadiums don't raise money for schools. They are expense items. Stadiums do not create a revenue stream adequate to cover the costs. If they did, there would be private enterprises building stadiums like mad in order to host these events in exchange for the gate and concessions. 

To cover the costs, the stadium would need to book concerts many nights per week and sell beer and wine at Minute Maid pricing. That's how they could conceivably make money. 

I don't think anyone disputes the positive character traits developed by sports. But, those same positive traits can be developed by participation in a variety of sports, and even developed during football played in a small stadium. 

The either/or fallacy is laughable. Pay big taxes to support unnecessary expenses or you are contributing to the fall of our future. How in the world did we ever survive and prosper in the years before 14,000 seat stadiums for high schools? I don't know. Must have been just dumb luck. 

Pride in your high school? What is this, a pep rally? Spartan Pride will never Die! Go Spartans! Save that nonsense for the Ritalin addled 8th graders. 

If the pride of a community is a High School football stadium, that says a heck of alot more about the community than it does about the stadium. None of it good.


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## houtxfisher (Sep 12, 2006)

whistlingdixie said:


> I am married and do not have any kids yet and the only debt I have is debt so that I can keep my credit score up. Saying all that I would have voted yes to the stadium for a lot of reasons. Football on Friday nights does a lot for the community including raising money for the school, providing a kid an opportunity to excel in sports at a school they can be proud of, *and my favorite reason is to keep kids off the streets and out of trouble*. Sports help kids build responsibility, time management, team work, and many other great attributes. Anyone who is too grumpy to want to help out our future generation is only contributing to the fall of our future. I agree a $70 mil stadium sounds extravagant but I do know that if a kid is proud of his school then he is more then likely to want to attend. You can agree with me or not but that is my honest opinion.


This is essentially the same extortion argument used by Queen Sheila, et.al. last summer regarding pool closures. If they don't have _________ then they will be on the streets "getting into trouble". "Getting into trouble" of course is codeword for screwing up the neighborhood, stealing, etc... So, taxpayer, cough it up and give these kids a stadium if you don't want a bunch of hooligans roaming your neighborhood! Um, no - how about _*the parents*_ keep the kids off the street and out of trouble. My parents raised me well despite not having an expensive stadium, so I can't agree with this argument.


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## spurgersalty (Jun 29, 2010)

devil1824 said:


> Our property tax is freaking high too. When my kids graduate and are out of the house we are probably going to move so we won't be "on the hook" for other kids going to school. Vote no, that's fine. I just don't understand why someone would complain about having to pay for kids to go to school when no one is forcing them to live there. lol.
> If you don't have kids and for sure if you don't have kids in sports you will never understand. I live to watch my son play football. He's also a A,B student.


Where ever you go, you will pay school taxes. Moving will only change the amount if you move out of the spend crazy districts to one a little more level headed.

Â©


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

devil1824 said:


> If he votes "no" on every bond because he has no "brats" in school, then he should move. A single man with no "brats" should be able to afford the gas money to get to work from somewhere else.


If your neighbor came over tomorrow and asked you for $500 to build a playground for their toddler to play on 5 times a year, would you do it?

Because, that is exactly what you are asking of your neighbors.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

I plan on moving where I can't see another house. We're talking population of 500 or less.


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

devil1824 said:


> I plan on moving where I can't see another house. We're talking population of 500 or less.


So basically the same thing that people who moved to Katy 30 years ago wanted. haha


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

My neighbor and I did that exact thing at our previous house. His kids were always in my backyard so we split the cost of a playhouse that I built. $500. We moved and I left it there. We moved here because of the schools academics. We knew it was going to be more expensive too. They were building our new stadium when we moved. We played all our games that year at Baylor. 

I have friends that are originally from Katy. They tell me it has grown big time over the last few years.


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

devil1824 said:


> My neighbor and I did that exact thing at our previous house. His kids were always in my backyard so we split the cost of a playhouse that I built. $500. We moved and I left it there. We moved here because of the schools academics. We knew it was going to be more expensive too. They were building our new stadium when we moved. We played all our games that year at Baylor.
> 
> I have friends that are originally from Katy. They tell me it has grown big time over the last few years.


No no no. Your kids are too big for the playground. Your neighbor wants $500 from you to put that jungle gym in their fenced backyard and you will never get any use or return on it.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

No one is locking you out of the stadium. Go support them. Buy a hotdog and enjoy some friday night lights. My son is only a freshman and I've had season tickets the last 3 yrs. So yes, I support it. I always go to friday night football.


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

devil1824 said:


> No one is locking you out of the stadium. Go support them. Buy a hotdog and enjoy some friday night lights. My son is only a freshman and I've had season tickets the last 3 yrs. So yes, I support it. I always go to friday night football.


OK, let me rephrase that then. You can use the jungle gym. Just buy at $10 ticket.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Once again. I do every Friday. It's cool. Y'all don't have to go. Texas high schools will always have big extravagant stadiums. Texas is known for it. Our bond was 11 milloin and updated 2 intermediate schools and built a new administration building in addition to our stadium. Our stadium was already there. We updated it. Well worth it.


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

LOL! Really no clue... I am fairly certain this is one of the reasons why the states and country is broke.


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

devil1824 said:


> Once again. I do every Friday. It's cool. Y'all don't have to go. Texas high schools will always have big extravagant stadiums. Texas is known for it. Our bond was 11 milloin and updated 2 intermediate schools and built a new administration building in addition to our stadium. Our stadium was already there. We updated it. Well worth it.


$11 Million is not = to $69 million

Obviously stadiums are not free. The problem is the extravagance of the price tag. BBVA Compass Stadium was $90 million and it will bring in 500 times the amount of revenue that a high school stadium would.


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

BATWING said:


> LOL! Really no clue... I am fairly certain this is one of the reasons why the states and country is broke.


Dont worry, at some point the tooth fairy or the Easter bunny is gonna come pay all these nonsensical bills we continue to pile up in the name of "whats good for the kids" and " fair"

( psst I'll tell you what would be good for those kids- a clean balance sheet and sound, practical , sensible facilities that dont overly burden the community at large)


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## Ernest (May 21, 2004)

I'll tell you what would be good for the kids - explaining to them that the rewards from participating in sports comes from within, not from without. 

Its the discipline from training in the rain or at the crack of dawn, day after day. The personal sacrifice to be the best you can be. The strength of character to continually push yourself and truly apply yourself towards a goal. The will to get up after that failure or humiliating loss and rededicate yourself towards improvement. 

That's what its about. Not the bright lights or the score board or any of that. 

Unfortunately, we live in a world in which fame has replaced character.


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## reeltimer (Feb 5, 2010)

andre3k said:


> Just imagine where our kids would be if we emphasized math, science, and medicine as much as we do hs football in american schools.


That place is called Katy one of the better districts for our kids to get a education in the state.My two went there for a year because of Ike and were a grade ahead of the other students in disd and lcisd.If a few of you know it all would have looked a little closer the 69 million wasn't just for a stadium but were in Texas and football is king as it should be.

sent from my taxpayer-funded sail phone and yes the government is tapped into my talk


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## Backwater1 (Apr 25, 2013)

One thing I don't understand is that they keep preaching about overcrowding at the current stadiums. What is it? 7 High Schools battling for scheduling in one stadium?

My logical mind tells me why not build 3 additional 10 million dollar stadiums and not be in this same boat in 2 more years when population increases demand another stadium quantity increase?


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## Gemini8 (Jun 29, 2013)

houtxfisher said:


> This is essentially the same extortion argument used by Queen Sheila, et.al. last summer regarding pool closures. If they don't have _________ then they will be on the streets "getting into trouble". "Getting into trouble" of course is codeword for screwing up the neighborhood, stealing, etc... So, taxpayer, cough it up and give these kids a stadium if you don't want a bunch of hooligans roaming your neighborhood! Um, no - how about _*the parents*_ keep the kids off the street and out of trouble. My parents raised me well despite not having an expensive stadium, so I can't agree with this argument.


Exactly! It also chaps me that sports always trumps the education of kids. How many salaries & much needed supplies & materials would that fund? If people are so "concerned" about kids, then make the priorities accordingly.


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## Notenoughtime (Mar 7, 2011)

Backwater1 said:


> One thing I don't understand is that they keep preaching about overcrowding at the current stadiums. What is it? 7 High Schools battling for scheduling in one stadium?
> 
> My logical mind tells me why not build 3 additional 10 million dollar stadiums and not be in this same boat in 2 more years when population increases demand another stadium quantity increase?


Good questions: Using this years schedules, there was an additional 12 game opportunities to be held at Rhodes (additional Thurs games and additional Saturday early games). Plenty of room for 1 additional High School.

Secondly, Katy vs Cinco Ranch is the ONLY game each year that the stadium reaches capacity. All other games at Rhodes are less than 60% full. Rhodes still has room to put in additional seating on all four corners of the stadium. There are plenty of alternatives but the school board wants the Taj so they can keep up with the Jones's.


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

Ernest said:


> I'll tell you what would be good for the kids - explaining to them that the rewards from participating in sports comes from within, not from without.
> 
> Its the discipline from training in the rain or at the crack of dawn, day after day. The personal sacrifice to be the best you can be. The strength of character to continually push yourself and truly apply yourself towards a goal. The will to get up after that failure or humiliating loss and rededicate yourself towards improvement.
> 
> ...


I agree 100%.

I learned the biggest life lesson ever my senior football season on a bad 2-8 team ( we had won the state championship the year before in our small private school division and lost 22 seniors) We lost our first 7 games that year but we didnt quit and we didnt give up and we kept fighting and getting better. We won 2 of our last 3 and held our heads high. Nobody quit and nobody gave up that year. We did that on a small budget at a ratty high school stadium in Galveston. That season taught me everything I know about perserverance and commitment.

What I learned about life and success that year would not have been enhanced a single iota by a jumbotron or a 70 million dollar stadium.

Those edifices theyre building around our state aint about football. Theyre about ego and excess. Nothing more, nothing less


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

> ts the discipline from training *AT HOME ON WEEKENDS*, day after day. The personal sacrifice to be the best you can be. The strength of character to continually push yourself and truly apply yourself towards a goal. The will to get up after that failure or humiliating loss and rededicate yourself towards improvement.


I think that's the same for academics as well.

TH


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## daniel7930 (Jun 16, 2011)

69 mil is not a lot for a stadium..my old football stadium.is.get a 20 mil upgrade. And its to bring it up to code 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk


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## gater (May 25, 2004)

*Stadiums*



Notenoughtime said:


> Good questions: Using this years schedules, there was an additional 12 game opportunities to be held at Rhodes (additional Thurs games and additional Saturday early games). Plenty of room for 1 additional High School.
> 
> Secondly, Katy vs Cinco Ranch is the ONLY game each year that the stadium reaches capacity. All other games at Rhodes are less than 60% full. Rhodes still has room to put in additional seating on all four corners of the stadium. There are plenty of alternatives but the school board wants the Taj so they can keep up with the Jones's.


You can't build a stadium for 10 million and with the scheduling are you including the lower level games. Most school will not schedule a Saturday day game if they can help it. Gater


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## carryyourbooks (Feb 13, 2009)

daniel7930 said:


> 69 mil is not a lot for a stadium..my old football stadium.is.get a 20 mil upgrade. And its to bring it up to code
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk


they need to do that with rice stadium.


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## daniel7930 (Jun 16, 2011)

The place I played football in is alamo stadium. In san antonio the old rock pile. It was way out of date

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk


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## scwine (Sep 7, 2006)

Well, it got voted down right?


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## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

scwine said:


> Well, it got voted down right?


It did not pass, this was for more than the stadium. It was also to include another AG building and Science/Technology building. Just in the 77494 zip code there are from 150 - 250 homes being sold each month and this has been going on all year.


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## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

The commute to Baytown may start to take its toll.


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## teamgafftop1 (Aug 30, 2010)

I don't know about the Katy area, but a winning football season around here did not bring in more high-end homes and taxpayers. It has really proven to be the opposite; more trash moving in so their kids can play football thinking that's their way to riches and fame. It would be nice if they were just honest with the kids and explained the odds of that happening and stressed academics instead.


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## Johnny9 (Sep 7, 2005)

All you football people can come to my place down the road about 6 miles and play in my pature for 1/3 of that cost. PS bring you own lights for a night game.


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

Big government is horrible. Outragious expenditures on ridiculous pork is out of control. But a 69 million dollar stadium is a really good idea. I will never understand the mentality. The best one was the post where the pro build called the anti build a liberal. Ha. Gotta love 2cool


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

Open your eyes. The bond is also for a ag building and a science building. Y'all somehow over looked that part.


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## scwine (Sep 7, 2006)

jjtroutkiller said:


> Just in the 77494 zip code there are from 150 - 250 homes being sold each month and this has been going on all year.


I believe it. I know a gal I grew up with that sells quite a few homes each month off FM 1463...Hard to believe that area. All I ever did was hunt and fish that area when younger.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

devil1824 said:


> Open your eyes. The bond is also for a ag building and a science building. Y'all somehow over looked that part.


Both of which probably would have been approved if they hadn't bee packaged with a 69 million dollar stadium.


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## Bledsinger (Oct 7, 2006)

Katy needs to plant some money trees! At least the citizens realized that the cost is just BS. Hell for 69M they can play in the Reliant Stadium for 20 years.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

Bledsinger said:


> Katy needs to plant some money trees! At least the citizens realized that the cost is just BS. Hell for 69M they can play in the Reliant Stadium for 20 years.


Well, lesseee:

here's the "deal" that UH got:

â€¢ $75,000 license fee per game.
â€¢ $85,000 facility expense per game based on attendance of 30,000. There is an additional $2 fee per attendee over 30,000.
â€¢ Quick â€œturn-aroundâ€ field conversion for USF and SMU game will be determined.
â€¢ UH will keep all ticket revenue for suites.
â€¢ 1,250 parking spots will be provided for donor parking. All additional spots are $10.
â€¢ All parking and concession revenue will go to Reliant.
â€¢ 20 percent of merchandise sales will be paid to Reliant.
â€¢ SMG and Texans will promote game dates to respective fan bases to increase ticket sales.

I don't see the deal being all that much better for anybody that wants to rent it for an entire season as you suggest: that's $160K per game plus the schools' basic expenses to get two teams, two bands, two sets of cheerleaders and pep squads, etc. etc. to the stadium. Katy ISD will be at 8 teams, let's call that 4 games a weekend just for the sake of argument. 10 weeks a year, that's 40 games. Add probably 6-8 playoff games. Call it 45 games a year. Twenty years, 900 games. That's $144 million without non-stadium expenses. Sounds like the stadium was a heck of a deal...


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## Gluconda (Aug 25, 2005)

Let's vote!

Everyone on 2coolfishing.com pays me $100 each so that I can buy my 500K sportfisher and a private boat ramp in Freeport. I need a bigger boat so that I can catch bigger fish, so that I can have better self esteem and feel better about my fishing skills.... With your donation, you will be entered into drawing to win an expense free offshore trip on board my boat and if you would like to use the launch for your personal use, it will only cost you $20. What? You don't own a boat? No problem, you can come pose and take pictures with my catch and share in the joys of me and my friends/family.

So who's all in?


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## chuck leaman (Jul 15, 2004)

Scale the cost way back and move it South of I-10 and it would have past. Its a shame that the Ag science center got voted down because it was in the deal with the stadium.


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## wfishtx (Apr 10, 2006)

I read something before Tuesday that said this would not raise taxes thanks to the current and projected new home growth and the rise of house prices in Katy ISD.

If there is no additional tax burden on the citizens of Katy ISD, why the outrage with the proposal and voting it down?


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## MapMaster (May 25, 2004)

poppadawg said:


> Big government is horrible. Outragious expenditures on ridiculous pork is out of control. But a 69 million dollar stadium is a really good idea. I will never understand the mentality. The best one was the post where the pro build called the anti build a liberal. Ha. Gotta love 2cool


I have been laughing about that for days and the guys at the office thought it was pretty funny as well. My Grandad told me to never continue to argue with an idiot because you will only lower yourself to his level. You can always tell when you have won an arguement because the other side resorts to name calling and personal attacks as opposed to defending their side of the arguement. :dance:


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## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

Ernest said:


> Stadiums don't raise money for schools. They are expense items. Stadiums do not create a revenue stream adequate to cover the costs. If they did, there would be private enterprises building stadiums like mad in order to host these events in exchange for the gate and concessions.


You forget most government lifer's can't say private enterprise without spitting and cursing profit...


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

wfishtx said:


> I read something before Tuesday that said this would not raise taxes thanks to the current and projected new home growth and the rise of house prices in Katy ISD.
> 
> If there is no additional tax burden on the citizens of Katy ISD, why the outrage with the proposal and voting it down?


Just the stigma: everybody's been hearing people complain for years now about the berry center, the stadium in Allen, etc. etc. etc.: nobody wanted to vote for an expenditure for a stadium and have to listen to people complain about teachers not getting paid enough, etc...

They could have pulled out the plans to Rhodes Stadium from 1982, gotten a competitive bid on another identical one, and people still would have complained about it being a lavish waste of taxpayer money. Just the nature of the beast in a world where high school athletics are looked at by a vocal proportion of the electorate as an unnecessary extravagance.. All those people smoking dope in the parking lot while the rest of us were at football practice grew up and vote, too.


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## devil1824 (Sep 4, 2010)

dwilliams35 said:


> Just the stigma: everybody's been hearing people complain for years now about the berry center, the stadium in Allen, etc. etc. etc.: nobody wanted to vote for an expenditure for a stadium and have to listen to people complain about teachers not getting paid enough, etc...
> 
> They could have pulled out the plans to Rhodes Stadium from 1982, gotten a competitive bid on another identical one, and people still would have complained about it being a lavish waste of taxpayer money. Just the nature of the beast in a world where high school athletics are looked at by a vocal proportion of the electorate as an unnecessary extravagance.. All those people smoking dope in the parking lot while the rest of us were at football practice grew up and vote, too.


My son is a freshman this year and the coach made it mandatory to go to tutoring from 3:30 to 4:00 so the kids could do homework and mainly to keep away from the after school hangouts. 
Kids in athletics have a reason to do good in school. No pass,no play. If they get in trouble in school the coaches deal with them. Anyone that competed knows what I'm talking about. Lol. I feel like some of y'all are water boys Mom. Fooseball is the devil. LOL!!! Maybe they can scale back and get some votes. I sure hope so.


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## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

wfishtx said:


> I read something before Tuesday that said this would not raise taxes thanks to the current and projected new home growth and the rise of house prices in Katy ISD.
> 
> If there is no additional tax burden on the citizens of Katy ISD, why the outrage with the proposal and voting it down?


Don't believe that for a minute.

Gonzales is a good example of tax increases on school bonds. The GISD residents tax will go up about $196 per year on a $100,000 home. That's on a $24 million bond to build a new taxfunded day care center disguised as an early learning center. And we are in the middle of an oil boom and housing boom. And the population is projected to almost double over the next ten years.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

ChuChu said:


> Don't believe that for a minute.
> 
> Gonzales is a good example of tax increases on school bonds. The GISD residents tax will go up about $196 per year on a $100,000 home. That's on a $24 million bond to build a new taxfunded day care center disguised as an early learning center. And we are in the middle of an oil boom and housing boom. And the population is projected to almost double over the next ten years.


The growth in KISD and GISD isn't exactly an apples-to-apples comparison. Gonzales has 2800 kids in 5 schools: Katy has 66,500 in 58 campuses. Sixty-nine million in Katy is a heck of a lot less of a significant hit than 24M is in Gonzales. Consider the size and value of the tax base, and it's pretty believable that Katy's could absorb it with no tax increase, especially in a facility that will provide whatever amount of positive cash flow as a stadium will: it's arguable whether it will pay for itself, of course, but it comes a heck of a lot closer to it than most other facilities a school will have.. You're talking about eight times more of an expenditure on a per-student basis in Gonzales..

Katy has bond ratings,etc. going in their favor too that smaller districts don't have:they can simply borrow the money at pretty favorable rates as well.


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

It's about financial respnsibility. 69 million dollars is a huge amount of money. 69 million so kids can play a game? That's obscene.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

poppadawg said:


> It's about financial respnsibility. 69 million dollars is a huge amount of money. 69 million so kids can play a game? That's obscene.


 There's a heck of a lot more to it than playing a game..


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## OnedayScratch (May 23, 2012)

poppadawg said:


> It's about financial respnsibility. 69 million dollars is a huge amount of money. 69 million so kids can play a game? That's obscene.


This is Merkah! The land of the bling and home of the shame. We have been sold a billion dollar bag of lies that most of us don't realize we don't NEED. We are so obssessed with the Jones' we never realize we can say NO.

Are any on here scarred and need counciling because you had to ride a bike to school? Doubt it.....

I for one voted against our local bond issues. Building science and math facilities, fine, and don't get me wrong, I love sports just as much as the next guy, but sometimes...err most of the time govment and other taxing entities may not be using their heads as we requested them to do and make really poor decisions.


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## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

dwilliams35 said:


> The growth in KISD and GISD isn't exactly an apples-to-apples comparison. Gonzales has 2800 kids in 5 schools: Katy has 66,500 in 58 campuses. Sixty-nine million in Katy is a heck of a lot less of a significant hit than 24M is in Gonzales. Consider the size and value of the tax base, and it's pretty believable that Katy's could absorb it with no tax increase, especially in a facility that will provide whatever amount of positive cash flow as a stadium will: it's arguable whether it will pay for itself, of course, but it comes a heck of a lot closer to it than most other facilities a school will have.. You're talking about eight times more of an expenditure on a per-student basis in Gonzales..
> 
> Katy has bond ratings,etc. going in their favor too that smaller districts don't have:they can simply borrow the money at pretty favorable rates as well.


It's big apples to small apples.


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## ChuChu (Jan 23, 2010)

dwilliams35 said:


> There's a heck of a lot more to it than playing a game..


Like what?


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

ChuChu said:


> Like what?


Well, where to begin:

As far as the kids go, extracurricular activities are a big positive:
On top of the aforementioned incentive to keep your grades up so you don't get benched over grades, there's a pretty major discipline and character-building component to sports and any other of the extracurricular groups that you have to essentially volunteer for, rather than just be required to go to like core classes: Public games are the culmination of that: be it band, the team, managers, and trainers, cheerleaders, pep squad, etc., it's the culmination of a heck of a lot of work; it's showtime after a lot of preparation that those kids took on of their own accord. That's a pretty good preparation for life in general: just do what you have to and you are likely to be working for the guy who took on extra responsibility and extra effort, giving up his afternoons and saturdays, etc.: it's just a good character builder that goes far, far beyond getting decent grades in the "3R's"...

Secondly, back to the stadium: those public games are pretty much the primary showplace for promotion of the school: if you can put on a home game like Katy does, with successful teams, a (relatively) safe family event, obviously great community participation, etc. it reflects quite well on the district as a whole: that figures into "recruitment" of new residents, which makes your property values, resultant tax base, and resultant tax revenues go up, which has the effect of higher possible investment in academics, which makes test scores and graduation rates go up, which etc.etc. etc.: you get the picture. It's just a good advertising venue for the school if it's done right. KISD is currently seen as top-notch as far as a good place to raise your kids, along with a handful of other districts around: a lot of the exposure that lets prospective residents know just what the KISD community is all about is evident at those games..

Third: the bond issue: no matter whether a facility like this CAN pay for itself or not, it's certainly capable of bringing in a significant sum: there's two "levels" of school funding at work in Texas: capital expenditures, which generally require voter participation such as these bond issues,, and general every day budgeting, which does not: while the outlay for the construction is firmly in the capital expenditure camp, the income from the stadium goes directly into the general fund, and can be used for whatever avenue of expense that the administration determines: They are basically getting the opportunity to use bond money, which with their bond rating is pretty cheap money, to develop a daily-use income stream: buying books, paying teachers, all that academic stuff which everybody is bemoaning the lack of when they're complaining about the stadium cost . Whatever that sum is, when applied as income against the present-value expense of the stadium, it probably makes that stadium one of the better deals of any capital expenditure they can make..


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

ChuChu said:


> It's big apples to small apples.


 You're right: on that per-student and per-tax dollar basis, Gonzales' apple is spectacularly huge by comparison. Which was my point.


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## MikeV (Jun 5, 2006)

Well the voters spoke. I think a lot of people are opposed to rampant spending and any possibility of paying more taxes than they currently pay. And it is best to take any school district's, or city's, or county's projections with a grain of salt. With ever increasing property values, more and more folks will oppose these sorts of projects.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

MikeV said:


> Well the voters spoke. I think a lot of people are opposed to rampant spending and any possibility of paying more taxes than they currently pay. And it is best to take any school district's, or city's, or county's projections with a grain of salt. With ever increasing property values, more and more folks will oppose these sorts of projects.


A stadium is always going to be a hard sell: tell somebody there's going to be a new school built, and they're all for that, and usually rightfully so: with the same enrollment, nothing else is going to cut down class size, average distance to any given kid's school from their house, etc. etc.: plus, we've been conditioned to think more schools =good in all cases. Of course, look at some of the schools: do we really need a 100' glass facade at the entrance? How about the hand-laid terrazzo depiction of the mascot on the floor of the lobby? The current "state" of school construction in many ways contributes no more, and arguably less,to the actual education of the kids than does the stadiums, arenas, etc. which are seen as ridiculously extravagant expenditures.. That "keeping up with the joneses" is a heck of a lot more prevalent than just stadiums: school constructions are often just architect's pipe dreams that are taken hook-line-and-sinker by school boards or expansion committees; they're well above and beyond what is really needed for education.


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## Rip"N"Rob (Jun 30, 2013)

I've lived in Katy and been to many games a Rhodes stadium, no need for a new stadium that thing only sales out in the Katy/Cinco game, and the occasional KatyHS home playoff game. If they were smart they would have done a proposal on expanding the stadium. Several districts play a game on Thursday and Friday nights and you can have 2 game on Saturday. And then you have teams that use Rhodes as their home stadium some are on the road at Tully or St. Jesuit. Probably would have been easier to pass a seating expansion plan and then the other stuff they where wanting to do instead of building a new stadium.


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

Rip"N"Rob said:


> I've lived in Katy and been to many games a Rhodes stadium, no need for a new stadium that thing only sales out in the Katy/Cinco game, and the occasional KatyHS home playoff game. If they were smart they would have done a proposal on expanding the stadium. Several districts play a game on Thursday and Friday nights and you can have 2 game on Saturday. And then you have teams that use Rhodes as their home stadium some are on the road at Tully or St. Jesuit. Probably would have been easier to pass a seating expansion plan and then the other stuff they where wanting to do instead of building a new stadium.


 Actually, the Katy side sells out every game: the UIL rules require that the visiting team can demand half the tickets: if they can't sell those out, that's on them. The other teams in the district aren't selling out theirs as often currently, but you've pretty much got to plan for the worst-case scenario.

Rhodes really isn't set up very well, traffic-wise, for subsequent games on a saturday.. That was my main complaint with having two stadiums on the same property, as well.


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## Stumpgrinder (Feb 18, 2006)

I guess it boils down to this. As a taxpayer I dont mind getting the kids what they need. I'll be danged if the average taxpayer should have to pay for the "wants" 

A 69 million dollar stadium is a "want" for danged sure


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

Stumpgrinder said:


> I guess it boils down to this. As a taxpayer I dont mind getting the kids what they need. I'll be danged if the average taxpayer should have to pay for the "wants"
> 
> A 69 million dollar stadium is a "want" for danged sure


 An additional stadium is pretty much a need in Katy. The 69 million part is the arguable aspect.. I really would like to know what it would cost to build another Rhodes stadium now: I bet it'd be a whole lot more than a lot of people seem to think... 
If you look at KISD's "info sheet" on the proposal, it's pretty obvious they were trying to make it salable as a facility that could provide some usage, and thus income, well beyond just KISD football games..


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## MikeV (Jun 5, 2006)

dwilliams35 said:


> A stadium is always going to be a hard sell: tell somebody there's going to be a new school built, and they're all for that, and usually rightfully so: with the same enrollment, nothing else is going to cut down class size, average distance to any given kid's school from their house, etc. etc.: plus, we've been conditioned to think more schools =good in all cases. Of course, look at some of the schools: do we really need a 100' glass facade at the entrance? How about the hand-laid terrazzo depiction of the mascot on the floor of the lobby? The current "state" of school construction in many ways contributes no more, and arguably less,to the actual education of the kids than does the stadiums, arenas, etc. which are seen as ridiculously extravagant expenditures.. That "keeping up with the joneses" is a heck of a lot more prevalent than just stadiums: school constructions are often just architect's pipe dreams that are taken hook-line-and-sinker by school boards or expansion committees; they're well above and beyond what is really needed for education.


We were able to beat three runs at a bond issue in just a few months, primarily for buildings (classrooms and a new administration building) but with some wasted money on those (extravagance) as well as wasted money on athletic facilities, though not a new stadium. Taxpayers were just tired of ever increasing property values, even during a huge downturn in the economy, and what the I&S rate would do to those taxes. They are quick to tell you that it is only $110 a year on some median home price, but fail to point out many people own more than just their home, and that home would probably double or triple in value over the life of the bonds (as would the other property owned). Much of what was asked for was needed, but there was just enough unnecessary spending, and questionable conduct (primarily by the superintendent looking to resume pad) that it was defeated. Three times.


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## poppadawg (Aug 10, 2007)

A new stadium is one thing. A 69 million state of the art, no expense spared is irresponsible. Extracurricular activities do not require a 69 million dollar stadium. People are interested in first class schools not a blinged out stadium. I don't think many people look up stadium specs before making a decision on where they want to raise their kids


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## dwilliams35 (Oct 8, 2006)

poppadawg said:


> A new stadium is one thing. A 69 million state of the art, no expense spared is irresponsible. Extracurricular activities do not require a 69 million dollar stadium. People are interested in first class schools not a stadium. I don't think many people look up stadium specs before making a decision on where they want to raise their kids


 If they're already paying taxes, they're interested in first class schools: if they're looking around for somewhere to live, they are looking at the whole package. You can put together a first class school in a barn if you've got your act together, but the first impression for prospective homeowners sucks.. The stadiums are much more of a face for the district than the schools are, as far as the general public outside the district.


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## fmlyfisher (Apr 29, 2013)

I don't really have a dog in the fight on what Katy wants to do with their money or football programs but as a father of 2 elementary school kids in a small 2A school I can tell you this.... Having more money in education programs doesn't make a **** when none of the parents of these little future convicts will even try to work with them at home. The highest paid teachers and nicest schools with the most state of the art curriculum won't make up for years of indifference at home. Sports in Texas at least where I grew up was the only reason some of the kids I played with even bothered to worry about their grades!! If getting to play in an awesome stadium encourages a few of them to actually study and pass their classes, you've accomplished way more than most parents and teachers.


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