# Jaws of the Beast



## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Several have stated they wanted to take a stab at the age of the "Beast" by looking at his jaws. We are having him, along with all of our "trophy" deer CA'd. When those results are in we can see how close we are with our predictions. Here is the link if you haven't seen him and want to look at him on the hoof first.
http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/showthread.php?t=316248

RIGHT SIDE


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## TooShallow (May 21, 2004)

Yep, he's an old timer, don't have a tooth wear chart handy but he's 8.5 at least, maybe older depending on forage and soil in the area. Good dentin showing all the way back on the last molars.


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## TooShallow (May 21, 2004)

Oh yeah, congrats on the harvest. Real nice buck.


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## aggiemulletboy (May 31, 2006)

TooShallow said:


> Yep, he's an old timer, don't have a tooth wear chart handy but he's 8.5 at least, maybe older depending on forage and soil in the area. Good dentin showing all the way back on the last molars.


I don't trust tooth wear. Seen fawns to 2.5 year olds with teeth that would warrant you calling them 8.5. That obviously isn't the case here from the pictures of him beforehand but just wanted to throw that out there. You'd be surprised how many of those worn fawn and 1.5 y/o jaws showed up on wildlife exams and had kids calling them old since they didn't pay attention to the the number of teeth or the pre-molar.


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

Dude you shot grandpa...lol


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Good pics BS, I would say 5 1/2 looking at the dentin wear and the crowns, I have seen deer with the 3rd, 4th and even the 5th molar wore FLAT on both sides of the jaws. Yrs back I was told if the dentins as wide as the white add a yr IF the top of crown is worn and be sure to check both side as some deer will chew on one side more than the other, BUT that was YRS n YRS back, BTW Ive never herd of CA'd....WW


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## BigBuck (Mar 2, 2005)

*Age*

Snort, that was a great buck you shot, and he was a beast, but I have to disagree with the age, based on a pic of the teeth. I know tooth wear ageing is really being challenged lately. By looking at the teeth that are shown in the pic, I would put that buck as no more than 4.5. Just not enough wear on the teeth for more than that. Dentine still not as wide as the enamel on #5. 
My .02
Let us know the results of the section of the tooth.
BB


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

BigBuck said:


> Snort, that was a great buck you shot, and he was a beast, but I have to disagree with the age, based on a pic of the teeth. I know tooth wear ageing is really being challenged lately. By looking at the teeth that are shown in the pic, I would put that buck as no more than 4.5. Just not enough wear on the teeth for more than that. Dentine still not as wide as the enamel on #5.
> My .02
> Let us know the results of the section of the tooth.
> BB


I went with 5 1/2 after seeing how the top of the last tooth was somewhat rounded, I'm thinking the dentin showing is the same width as the enamel...WW


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

aggiemulletboy said:


> I don't trust tooth wear. Seen fawns to 2.5 year olds with teeth that would warrant you calling them 8.5. That obviously isn't the case here from the pictures of him beforehand but just wanted to throw that out there. You'd be surprised how many of those worn fawn and 1.5 y/o jaws showed up on wildlife exams and had kids calling them old since they didn't pay attention to the the number of teeth or the pre-molar.


Indeed ... it goes the other way as well. In a great number of South Texas "Coastal Bend Counties", the silica content of the soil is so slight that it causes less wear on the teeth than in South Texas proper (Golden Triangle) and the Hill Country.

We've had a lot of problems with aging deer because of this. From the looks of the video Buck posted of the beast I'd say he's in one of these counties based on the brush and grass content.

We typically find that our deer are 1 - 2 years older than their teeth would tell.


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## rebelangler (May 21, 2004)

my guess is 8.5


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

rebelangler said:


> my guess is 8.5


What do you see that would lead you to believe they are from a 8 1/2 y/o deer, the way I was tought the 4th, 5th molar would be absolutley flat, but the guy that I learned from was mostly dealing with deer that came from a area with a sandy loam type of soil>E Texas...WW


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## txnitro (Jun 4, 2004)

nice buck.... i would guess around 4.5 - 5.5 yo...


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## Grizzly1 (Dec 12, 2008)

I'm just gonna say "the Beast" needs dentures!


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## DonnyMonty (Apr 27, 2009)

4.5 - 5.5. At 8.5 the dentin will be flat.


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## texasbagman (Oct 1, 2007)

By the video then teeth pictures I say 5.5 years.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

This is exactly why we are doing the cementum annuli test. This isn't the first deer that has came off of our place who's body structure doesn't match his tooth wear. This may even be the guy we are using. http://www.deerage.com/


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## Feathershredder (Nov 29, 2009)

5.5


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## Buck Master (Oct 19, 2004)

I know one thing Danny .... he ain't gettin any older..... lol


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

BigBuck said:


> Snort, that was a great buck you shot, and he was a beast, but I have to disagree with the age, based on a pic of the teeth. I know tooth wear ageing is really being challenged lately. By looking at the teeth that are shown in the pic, I would put that buck as no more than 4.5. Just not enough wear on the teeth for more than that. Dentine still not as wide as the enamel on #5.
> My .02
> Let us know the results of the section of the tooth.
> BB


I'm with you based solely on the teeth. But, I saw this deer on the hoof early in the season and videoed the shot. Also, have a game cam pic from last year. And there is know way this deer is 4.5. Which is exactly the reason we are doing CA analysis on him.

The results should be interesting.

BTW....I am also basing my opinion on his interaction with other known deer in the area.


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## nate56 (Dec 11, 2010)

4th molar says 5-1/2 but its hard to tell in pics... You need to invest in a tooth aging set..I've got a set at the ranch and wouldn't hunt without it... Well, and I've got to age every deer too anyway. [email protected] MLD permits...


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

Not sure what you guys are looking at, but that is NOT an old deer. He is maybe 3.5....


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

bigfishtx said:


> Not sure what you guys are looking at, but that is NOT an old deer. He is maybe 3.5....


... the deer he shot ... I tell you what man, if you're that off on all your aging and pass young deer ... you can hunt with us anytime.


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

6.5 no way 8.5


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

nate56 said:


> 4th molar says 5-1/2 but its hard to tell in pics... You need to invest in a tooth aging set..I've got a set at the ranch and wouldn't hunt without it... Well, and I've got to age every deer too anyway. [email protected] MLD permits...


I have one of those kits. I don't trust them anymore. I've just seen them wrong to many times. Especially on this ranch. We will know who got it right in a couple of months. I'm still calling the deer 7.5 but I agree the jaws do not match that.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

bigfishtx said:


> Not sure what you guys are looking at, but that is NOT an old deer. He is maybe 3.5....


Exactly why aging by the jaw is not 100% accurate. At best it is an aid to determining age. Look at the video of him on the hoof and still tell me this.


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## Feathershredder (Nov 29, 2009)

however old he was...it was a great cull for sure! Nice buck!


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Feathershredder said:


> however old he was...it was a great cull for sure! Nice buck!


Best 130" cull I've ever shot.:smile:


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## Animal Chris (May 21, 2004)

txnitro said:


> nice buck.... i would guess around 4.5 - 5.5 yo...


x2. Still sharp on top and no cupping in the front.


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## Zereaux (Jul 18, 2006)

You sure that's the correct jawbone? j/k Those sure don't look like the teeth of a deer
older than 5-1/2...

Here's the jawbone of an 8pt that we had aged at 5-1/2


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## Cynoscion (Jun 4, 2009)

Based on my experience, 10+yrs. looking at harvested jaws and then comparing to cemmentum annuli ages in Kleberg county, deer over 3.5yrs old will age TWR 1 year less than cemmentum age.

There is research done at Ceasar Kleberg to verify my observations. Don't have the links but shouldn't be hard to find. I believe it is part of the ongoing south texas buck capture project. These were known age deer and TWR did not match after 3.5.

What we have figured out is this:

-Up until age 3.5 TWR is fairly accurate
-After age 3.5 TWR becomes about 50% accurate which as good as a guess

The opposite is true of Cemmentum annuli:

-Age 3.5 or younger, cemmentum annuli is not very accurate
-Above 3.5 it becomes about 85% accurate

This probably doesn't make you feel any better but it is the best tool we have. The only thing you can do to help is to watch the deer grow for a couple of seasons and take him when you feel he is mature and don't be too hard on yourself if you make a mistake. I have been guiding deer hunts for a little over 10 years now and have yet to have a season where I did not make a mistake and shoot a deer that was at least a year too young.

BTW, by standard TWR aging that I was taught in school, your deer shows 4.5 based on the fact that the lingual crests are still present and sharp. A 5.5 yr. old deer or older will lack sharp crests.

Ceasar Kleberg was (not sure if they still are) working on refining the TWR technique to allow for the findings in the project.

We sent off all of our deer for cemmentum aging for years but have now gone to only sending off those that we age by TWR at older than 3.5.

Hope this helps.


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## nate56 (Dec 11, 2010)

Cynoscion said:


> Based on my experience, 10+yrs. looking at harvested jaws and then comparing to cemmentum annuli ages in Kleberg county, deer over 3.5yrs old will age TWR 1 year less than cemmentum age.
> 
> There is research done at Ceasar Kleberg to verify my observations. Don't have the links but shouldn't be hard to find. I believe it is part of the ongoing south texas buck capture project. These were known age deer and TWR did not match after 3.5.
> 
> ...


I second all that, especially the aging on the hoof.. It all depends on the environment/water/nutrition.. I shot a 9-1/2 buck last year and it still look good on the hoof...teeth told the difference though..


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

I had him at 5.5 or maybe 6.5 before I saw his teefus. I still think that is where he will end up now after the dental exam. Thanks for posting this up Snort! 

We had a guy on the lease a few years back that shot what we thought to be a 3.5 year 10 point. Dude promptly kneeled down on the ground beside the deer and stuck his finger in his rear then pulled it out and sniffed it. Then he says matter-of-factly "four and a half". LMAO Hated to see that guy go.... kind'a


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Yeah, I'm looking forward to getting the results back. These post are exactly why we are doing this this year. So we will know. We have a few really good deer roaming around and we are calling them 4.5-next year deer. With all trophies being ca'd it will give us a better assessment of age.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

Cynoscion said:


> Based on my experience, 10+yrs. looking at harvested jaws and then comparing to cemmentum annuli ages in Kleberg county, deer over 3.5yrs old will age TWR 1 year less than cemmentum age.
> 
> There is research done at Ceasar Kleberg to verify my observations. Don't have the links but shouldn't be hard to find. I believe it is part of the ongoing south texas buck capture project. These were known age deer and TWR did not match after 3.5.
> 
> ...


That is the same data we looked at that made us decide to start sending all of our older deer off too. We are just want to compare how old we believe the deer to be, to what CA says they are.

I have hunted ranches where the TWR indications were pretty spot on to what we thought. But, for whatever reason, the deer on this ranch do not have consistent tooth wear. Now we are adding protein feeding into the equation, which is going to make the TWR analysis even more screwy.


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

TXPalerider said:


> That is the same data we looked at that made us decide to start sending all of our older deer off too. We are just want to compare how old we believe the deer to be, to what CA says they are.
> 
> I have hunted ranches where the TWR indications were pretty spot on to what we thought. But, for whatever reason, the deer on this ranch do not have consistent tooth wear. Now we are adding protein feeding into the equation, which is going to make the TWR analysis even more screwy.


Alot depends on how sandy or rocky the soil is also. Picking corn or protein niblits out of sand or rock ain't real easy on the teeth. Ask State Vet...


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

Haute Pursuit said:


> ...... Picking corn or protein niblits out of sand or rock ain't real easy on the teeth. Ask State Vet...


I've seen him picking corn out of stuff, but, it was never corn or rocks.:redface:


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## the wood man (Sep 14, 2006)

I would say 5.5 I have seen older deer and they are worn smoother


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

TXPalerider said:


> I've seen him picking corn out of stuff, but, it was never corn or rocks.:redface:


 Me too, with a cupcake within his snout range... boy is different. :cheers:


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## Sumdog (Dec 23, 2010)

Wondering what jaws we are looking at? I am looking at about a 3.5yr old deer. Not near 5.5 or 6.5


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Crabclaw said:


> Wondering what jaws we are looking at? I am looking at about a 3.5yr old deer. Not near 5.5 or 6.5


look at the vid of him on the hoof. I would love to hear your opinion on the age again after you view it. I'm not disagreeing (too much) on your assessment of the teeth. Yes, these jaws came out of that deer. No tricks being played here. http://2coolfishing.com/ttmbforum/sh...d.php?t=316248


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## Sumdog (Dec 23, 2010)

He must be on a diet of mash potatoes and oatmeal!


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## CougarFisher'08 (Jul 6, 2006)

Old deer for sure, I think 7.5. To bad he didnt have his birth certificate with him.


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

I think that deer is 5.5 Danny. I know what he looks like on the hoof but those sharp teeth...let us know what the results of the tests are but from what I see of the teeth that deer is 4.5 to 5.5. 

I don't know how anyone who has seen those teeth could say otherwise if they're going by tooth wear.

TH


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

Crabclaw said:


> He must be on a diet of mash potatoes and oatmeal!


LOL

I think he breast fed until he was 4 years old.


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## Haute Pursuit (Jun 26, 2006)

Maybe C'mere Deer chewables??? :slimer:


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## KILT610 (Feb 24, 2006)

Teeth are not always an indicator but it's the best we have after they hit the ground...Based on my experience and viewing both the video and teeth, I put him at 6.5 to 7.5.........Whatever he is, he is truly a "beast".


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## State_Vet (Oct 10, 2006)

Based on my years of deer aging experience I say he's between 1 and 10 years old

by the way, HP and Palerider I see a "nubbing" in your future


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Looks Like a 2yo 6 pointers jaws to me!!! Just saying!!!


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

I didnt look too long at the teeth they are most of the time are misleading. That has happened many times at the king ranch by ageing the teeth. Deer seem to be always older that the ageing process says. From looking at that deer I would say he was 7.5 on the hoof and that is what I go by. The teeth ageing process is certainly not an exact science.

Charlie 

Charlie


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## asolde (May 22, 2004)

*Mature deer*

That's a good deer. I am going off the video and his teeth. I got him at 5 1/2 yrs old. I am having a hard time making him a 6 1/2 yrs old. It will be interesting to see the results when you get them back.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

TXDRAKE said:


> Looks Like a 2yo 6 pointers jaws to me!!! Just saying!!!


Further proof you don't know what you are doing. Just saying!!


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

TXPalerider said:


> LOL
> 
> I think he breast fed until he was 4 years old.


I like breast feeding.


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## hammerdown (Jan 10, 2009)

State_Vet said:


> Based on my years of deer aging experience I say he's between 1 and 10 years old
> 
> by the way, HP and Palerider I see a "nubbing" in your future


That was my guess.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Bucksnort said:


> Further proof you don't know what you are doing. Just saying!!


ROFLMFAO!!!!!


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## broadonrod (Feb 26, 2010)

Can anyone age ME ?


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

broadonrod said:


> Can anyone age ME ?


42 and most likely breast fed.


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## broadonrod (Feb 26, 2010)

Hey I havn't breast fed since I was 14 what are you trying to say ? LMASO...........


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

broadonrod said:


> Hey I havn't breast fed since I was 14 what are you trying to say ? LMASO...........


14?? I hate to tell you this but that might be against the law in Texas. Well maybe not in East Texas. LOL.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

I'm 57 and still not weened, hey Snort, East Texas has nothing to do with it, its just less filling but still taste great...WW


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## railbird (Jan 2, 2009)

Trouthunter said:


> I think that deer is 5.5 Danny. I know what he looks like on the hoof but those sharp teeth...let us know what the results of the tests are but from what I see of the teeth that deer is 4.5 to 5.5.
> 
> I don't know how anyone who has seen those teeth could say otherwise if they're going by tooth wear.
> 
> TH


Based on video, i don't see him any older than 5.5, leaning toward 4.5. I see the teeth confirming that, kinda hard to say for sure. I hunted in mcmullen county for a few years and deer teeth wear was extremely hard around that ranch. Molars were commonly worn completely to the gums, on very young deer. I always thought it was sand from the soil causing it.


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## bigl (Mar 3, 2008)

I have to agree with Bigbuck 4 1/2 at best. But a very fine animal. It would be interesting to know the type of soil at your location. If you use a typical tooth chart it will show him to be younger than most predictions.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

TXDRAKE said:


> Looks Like a 2yo 6 pointers jaws to me!!! Just saying!!!


I'm just wondering, does every camp have a comedian?


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

TXPalerider said:


> I'm just wondering, does every camp have a comedian?


As the Joker would say "Why SO Serious"!?!?!?!? ROFLOL!!! You guys are the best!!!


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

TXDRAKE said:


> As the Joker would say "Why SO Serious"!?!?!?!? ROFLOL!!! You guys are the best!!!


Its just like ya know. Your kinda the Rodney Dangerfield of the deer lease. ROFL! I'm just saying!


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

"I get no Respect!"


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

I will say again from information from a ranch that keeps very good records on deer and know the actual age when the teeth were sent in for an "age" check the deer were most always two years older than the teeth analysis said. Teeth are an indicator but not exact. So dont put all your money in one basket.. Just sayin..

Charlie


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

One thing this thread shows is that most people don't have a clue on aging deer by the wear on their teeth. Although the photos could have been at better angles he is 3.5 and possibly 4.5 at the most.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

CHARLIE said:


> I will say again from information from a ranch that keeps very good records on deer and know the actual age when the teeth were sent in for an "age" check the deer were most always two years older than the teeth analysis said. Teeth are an indicator but not exact. So dont put all your money in one basket.. Just sayin..
> 
> Charlie


Charlie your correct sumwhat, the guy that taught me has since retired with over 30yrs with the TPW, one thing I do remember him saying after 4 1/2-5 1/2 it turns into a guessing game and at that time teeth was all they had to go by. BTW I'll still hold on at least 4 1/2 but no more than 5 1/2 and leaning towards the latter...WW


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

M16 said:


> One thing this thread shows is that most people don't have a clue on aging deer by the wear on their teeth. Although the photos could have been at better angles he is 3.5 and possibly 4.5 at the most.


Hey man!!! don't be trashing my pics Just curious did you watch the video? I'll be honest when it comes to looking at the teeth I have to get my jaw aging kit out. I would have to say there is no way this deer is 3.5 or even 4.5.


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Bucksnort said:


> Hey man!!! don't be trashing my pics Just curious did you watch the video? I'll be honest when it comes to looking at the teeth I have to get my jaw aging kit out. I would have to say there is no way this deer is 3.5 or even 4.5.


I was kind of thinking "says the next posting self proclaimed expert" when I read that post ... but you quoted it before I could ... !

Any biologist in the area will tell you that deer is older than that based ont he weight alone. Funny how people think that teeth are the only way to tell a deers age. Our biologist will guess the age based on live weight ... 60% of the time, it works every time.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Bucksnort said:


> Hey man!!! don't be trashing my pics Just curious did you watch the video? I'll be honest when it comes to looking at the teeth I have to get my jaw aging kit out. I would have to say there is no way this deer is 3.5 or even 4.5.


By the video he is at least 6.5. I see this constantly on my ranch. We killed two bucks that I know were at least 6.5 and 7.5 years old. The teeth aged 4.5 and 5.5. Aging by tooth wear is a guess at best. Especially when feeding protein.


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

> Our biologist will guess the age based on live weight ... 60% of the time, it works every time.


Seriously? I've seen some very old bucks on the down hill slide that didn't weigh anything near what a young 4.5 year old buck weighs.

TH


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

I've seen them loose 30-40lbs during the rut...But then again I'm not a biologist 



Trouthunter said:


> Seriously? I've seen some very old bucks on the down hill slide that didn't weigh anything near what a young 4.5 year old buck weighs.
> 
> TH


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

Yeah seriously ... there are sliding scales, charts and algorithms that per county, per season (pre-rut, rut, post rut) that will ball park the age of any deer based on weight.

And if you biologist has been around awhile, or at least working in the same county for multiple years ... he's going to be able to make an educated guess.

This really shouldn't be that hard to swallow.


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## M16 (May 28, 2008)

Trouthunter said:


> Seriously? I've seen some very old bucks on the down hill slide that didn't weigh anything near what a young 4.5 year old buck weighs.
> 
> TH


That has been my experience as well. Body weights seem to peak at 5.5 to 6.5 years old. After that they go downhill.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Damm, maybe I still have a chance, My body weight keeps going up and I am over the hill. Maybe it will come down some day but I am not counting on it. Good hunting guys.. And I hope I dont get removed from the gene pool because I aint gonna hurt anything anyway.

Charlie


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Heres a cpl of pics of another beasts jaw, I'm posting this ask the guys that have said Bucksnorts deer was older than 7-8 >>by the pics of the jawbone he had posted. IF you aged the teeth posted at 7-8 then how old is this deers jaws >>>>>20, BTW this is a S Texas deer....WW


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

^^^^
Don't know man ... it's hard to tell after you use a dremmel tool to wear out and polish out all the dentin ... ! ha ha ha ha ha ha ...


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Those aren't even deer teeth. I know goat teeth when I see them. Nice try WW.


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> ... the deer he shot ... I tell you what man, if you're that off on all your aging and pass young deer ... you can hunt with us anytime.


Just looking at the pictures of the teeth, not sure about a video. If you think those teeth are off an old deer then you need to take "aging deer by tooth wear 101".

I know deer tooth wear varies from area to area, but, that picture really indicates a young deer.

Maybe that jaw was mixed up and came from a different deer?


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

I hate to quote myself ... but no one really seems like the actually read these threads.

I don't think he's "old" I think he's mature. You could probably classify most of the people on this board as needed to take some lessons in aging deer.

Half the time someone posts a trail cam photo of a deer that looks like it's about to fall over in death from old age you got 20 people screaming "2.5 - 3.5" ... rediculous.



Spec-Rig.006 said:


> In a great number of South Texas "Coastal Bend Counties", the silica content of the soil is so slight that it causes less wear on the teeth than in South Texas proper (Golden Triangle) and the Hill Country.
> 
> We've had a lot of problems with aging deer because of this. From the looks of the video Buck posted of the beast I'd say he's in one of these counties based on the brush and grass content.
> 
> We typically find that our deer are 1 - 2 years older than their teeth would tell.


I have my hands on over 120 sets of jaws a year from three different counties and they all wear differently.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

bigfishtx said:


> Just looking at the pictures of the teeth, not sure about a video. If you think those teeth are off an old deer then you need to take "aging deer by tooth wear 101".
> 
> I know deer tooth wear varies from area to area, but, that picture really indicates a young deer.
> 
> Maybe that jaw was mixed up and came from a different deer?


Then you my friend, are the one that needs to do a remedial in Aging deer by tooth wear 101. ROFL! because you are no expert like you elude. The more I look at deer teeth the more I think it is "junk" science.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I could make the statement, "There are a lot of stupid people on the internet," and not offend a single person on this thread because everyone would assume I was talking about someone else... even the stupid people.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

bigfishtx said:


> ...........
> 
> Maybe that jaw was mixed up and came from a different deer?


Yeah Snort, maybe you mixed that jaw up with one from another deer.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Bucksnort said:


> Those aren't even deer teeth. I know goat teeth when I see them. Nice try WW.


If you think they were goats teeth I got some beach front property in Caney Head (South Fred)for sale. Do you honestly think I would keep some %$&# goats teeth. I went to the shop and asked my bro if he had any jaws of a old deer and this is what he gave me, it was the most worn set he had on hand, in the next cpl of weeks I'm sure he will have some more. BTW in all the goats I've mounted I can say I've NEVER checked ones jaw and I have no idea how many teeth a goat has but if you were to count m you'll see they are from a mature deer, how do you know what a goats jaw looks like????....WW


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

wet dreams said:


> If you think they were goats teeth I got some beach front property in Caney Head (South Fred)for sale. Do you honestly think I would keep some %$&# goats teeth.........., how do you know what a goats jaw looks like????....WW


ROFLMAO! WW, No. I don't think you would possess or post pix of goats teeth and yes I have seen goat teeth but don't remember exactly what they look like. Check your greenies bro I was jabbin at ya. I do have to wonder though if you shot that buck on that beach front property your trying to get rid of.:rotfl:


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

So, you do know where Caney Head is, and no my buck came just across the Bayou from the golfcourse you have mentioned in the past....WW


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## Spec-Rig.006 (Nov 2, 2007)

capn said:


> I could make the statement, "There are a lot of stupid people on the internet," and not offend a single person on this thread because everyone would assume I was talking about someone else... even the stupid people.


Best post ever ...


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## Zereaux (Jul 18, 2006)

Caney Head... some high dollar real estate.


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## Bukkskin (Oct 21, 2009)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> 60% of the time, it works every time.


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

wet dreams said:


> ............... BTW in all the goats I've mounted I can say I've NEVER checked ones jaw ..................WW


 :redface:


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Danny, any word on the beast tooth yet, I stand 'pat' on 4 1/2 y/o....WW


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## bbridges (May 21, 2004)

Can't wait to hear myself. I can tell you though, I saw the deer at 18 yards and there is no way he is only a 4.5 year old deer. I think the teeth are going to deceive us on this one.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

wet dreams said:


> Danny, any word on the beast tooth yet, I stand 'pat' on 4 1/2 y/o....WW


sorry ment 5 1/2 at first I thought 6, if Im wrong it'l be 6 1/2


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## zrexpilot (Jun 14, 2007)

is hes 6 1/2 ive killed 15 year old deer


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## Swampus (Sep 1, 2005)

7.5=8.5


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## Screeminreel (Jun 2, 2004)

Heck I will throw in at 5 1/2 - 6 1/2. Thats what I had thought when I saw the initial pic's and then the jaw as well. But hey I am only learning the teeth thing and they do look different than those I have seen in E. TX for sure.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

I still think he was just a real fat and squatty yearling!!!! Just Saying!!! ROFLOL!!!!


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## Sea-Slug (May 28, 2004)

4 to 6 years old. I have saw a few that were wore down alot more than that we were thinking were 6 to 7. By the way, awesome buck!


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Well actually there was word on the age. We went to the ranch this weekend to get the jaws out of the freezer and ran off and forgot em. So now its gonna be a couple more weeks before we go back and hopefully somebody with a younger mind will remind us to get the jaws.:headknock


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## SpotChaser#2 (Feb 28, 2006)

Any word on age yet?? Ill say 4-5


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

SpotChaser#2 said:


> Any word on age yet?? Ill say 4-5


Still waiting.


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

Looks old to me


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Profish00 said:


> Looks old to me


I don't think they have been sent off yet. Hopefully soon.


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## bigfishtx (Jul 17, 2007)

There was an article in TTH Mag this month, (I think) that discussed aging deer, and, it said the tooth aging indicator was only accurante less than 50% of the time, and, the lab method was not much better, maybe 70%. Anyone else read it?


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## great white fisherman (Jun 24, 2008)

Really who cares what age. A good deer is a good deer!


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

bigfishtx

I have known(or heard) about the ageing process for years regarding using teeth for ageing. Comes from the King ranch operations. Absoloutely knowing the age of a deer and having the teeth sent off to be tested. Most every time the teeth process shows the deer much younger than it really is. If you dont know when the fawn actually hit the ground it is just what folks say. Its a guessing game..


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

I'm thinking by looking at the jaws up to 4 1/2 is acurate but after that its a crapshoot....WW


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## STEVE SA (Dec 15, 2010)

I'm still hanging with 5 !/2 teeth and 6 1/2 body. Good deer and nothing better to age um' then being able to watching um' grow up.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Bucksnort said:


> Still waiting.


Looks like we can add 1 year on the age by the time the results get back. Sometimes it seems like things take way longer than they should. Nice deer. On our lease my experince is that WHO shoots the deer has as much to do with the age as the teeth.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Spec-Rig.006 said:


> I was kind of thinking "says the next posting self proclaimed expert" when I read that post ... but you quoted it before I could ... !
> 
> Any biologist in the area will tell you that deer is older than that based ont he weight alone. Funny how people think that teeth are the only way to tell a deers age. Our biologist will guess the age based on live weight ... 60% of the time, it works every time.


60% of the time???? What about the other 50% of the time???


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

capn said:


> I could make the statement, "There are a lot of stupid people on the internet," and not offend a single person on this thread because everyone would assume I was talking about someone else... even the stupid people.


For the most part the smart ones are the ones that reads the posts, then there are us who proove our smarts with our posts. lol.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Just a thought, things that could affect tooth wear from deer to deer on the same ranch. Protein feeders that do not let the feed fall to the ground. Water that comes out of a well instead of a pond , A naturally more dominant deer that gets the choice food without competeing for the scraps.

For reference ; SEE POST # 112 
SotOl Buster


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

sotol buster said:


> Looks like we can add 1 year on the age by the time the results get back. Sometimes it seems like things take way longer than they should. Nice deer. On our lease my experince is that WHO shoots the deer has as much to do with the age as the teeth.


ROFLMAO. Now that is funny and how so true!


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## edwinanders (Aug 12, 2005)

Sorry, but 3.5 at the most!!!


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

edwinanders said:


> Sorry, but 3.5 at the most!!!


LOL, no way I shoot a 3.5 year old. Even if I wanted to shoot a 3.5 year old I would not be here to type this today. My hunting buddies would have buried me where no one would find me. Understand why you are thinking that but did you look at the deer?


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## bbridges (May 21, 2004)

edwinanders said:


> Sorry, but 3.5 at the most!!!


Interested to know where you gathered that or what you looked at to guess him at a 3 year old deer. Not being a smart arse, just wondering what brought you to that number?


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## LightsOut (Sep 14, 2010)

my guess...5 years old

It's really any body's guess. your doin good to get within a year, either side of which he really is... Good deer no matter what and as earlier stated, he isn't getting older lol


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

The teeth are at the lab right now. Just waiting on the return.


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## FREON (Jun 14, 2005)

Bucksnort said:


> The teeth are at the lab right now. Just waiting on the return to verify what Freon said the age is.


 Fixed it for you Snort


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## Swampus (Sep 1, 2005)

older Buck--Good Deer--worn teeth--good kill --Congrats to the Snortmiester!


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## AM Cloutier (Jun 17, 2005)

I would be very surprised if that deer isn't at least 6 1/2 yrs old. In the pictures he has a sway back, short legs, extended dewlap, short snout, etc.

Check out whitetaildomains.com. On the site it has a shoot or wait feature that tells you how to judge a whitetail deers age on the hoof. It's pretty fun and interesting to test your aging abilities. They also have a feature where you try to guess the score of a deer and then it tells you the actual score. Also, lots of other great management information.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Did we ever get the lab results ? I have not been able to sleep just wondering about how old that deer was .


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

4 1/2


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## TXPalerider (May 21, 2004)

sotol buster said:


> Did we ever get the lab results ? I have not been able to sleep just wondering about how old that deer was .


Yes. 5-1/2.

Sleep well.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

capn said:


> I could make the statement, "There are a lot of stupid people on the internet," and not offend a single person on this thread because everyone would assume I was talking about someone else... even the stupid people.


 Oh, I get it now. Did we ever get the age from the Lab? We can add 4 years to it now. lol. This was a very entertaining thread, in it's day.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Lol. If my memory serves me correctly he was 5.5.


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## sotol buster (Oct 7, 2007)

Bucksnort said:


> Lol. If my memory serves me correctly he was 5.5.


 Good , I was hoping it wasn't 2 1/2 and you were scared to post it. lol.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Lol. No. I think I actually posted a thread stating the age. I'm still surprised. Thought he was older. Never the less he was as old as he was gonna get. I did a skull mount on him.


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