# Common Policy for Terrible guided hunts?



## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

Decided I would book a duck hunt since I was not having much luck on my own. Booked with a guide that is pretty local, within an hour. Kept in touch with him this week to ensure birds were around etc. According to him, best season ever. Had 2 guys back out at the last minute the evening before. guide was adamant that i find others and come with a full party. so luckily I did based on his scouting reports and recent hunting reports.

Anyhow, went on the hunt yesterday. I have booked hunts before, I understand hunting waterfowl and how here one minute and gone the next. See where I am going with this? Anyhow, met up and went to the spot on a public lake. He set out about a dozen decoys. I didn't say much as he was the guide and should know more than I do. After sitting there for 2 hours and seeing only a couple dozen ducks all of which were way out in the distance, he moved us to another spot, same result. We managed to sky bust one duck right before leaving. None ever came into his decoy set if you will. 

Upon conclusion we got the old sorry it sucked, that's hunting, must have moved out last night. Rather than a confrontation I simply asked what I owed him, as we had already paid 50% deposit on a 150 per gun hunt of 4 people. He said the remainder of the balance of 300.00 dollars, then after a few secs and several glares offered up another hunt at half price. I reluctantly paid him just to get out of there.

Question is, what should I have done or what is common unwritten policy? I feel like part of a guides responsibilities is to get you out to a hunt, then to deliver a product. He only delivered on half in my opinion, whether his fault or not. I also feel like if he wants to keep repeat customers or keep a good reputation he should be more reasonable when it comes to a terrible hunt.

Thoughts / Suggestions?


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## JFolm (Apr 22, 2012)

I went on a guided hunt for the first time three weeks ago. Sounds about like yours. 

The "guide" didn't have a dog so he brought his buddy and his non trained brittney spaniel. She was running through the decoys while we had birds working. Guides didn't call shots. They started shooting and then I guess it was our turn. We had birds on the water and he jumps up and starts shooting. Didn't even ask if the clients wanted to shoot. I guess I have too high of expectations of humans. Should of known better. Anyways it's a lesson learned for me. He'll run out of clientele soon. 

Do you mind pm'ing his info so I can avoid him? 

Thanks


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

JFolm said:


> I went on a guided hunt for the first time three weeks ago. Sounds about like yours.
> 
> The "guide" didn't have a dog so he brought his buddy and his non trained brittney spaniel. She was running through the decoys while we had birds working. Guides didn't call shots. They started shooting and then I guess it was our turn. We had birds on the water and he jumps up and starts shooting. Didn't even ask if the clients wanted to shoot. I guess I have too high of expectations of humans. Should of known better. Anyways it's a lesson learned for me. He'll run out of clientele soon.
> 
> ...


Yes I will, please do the same for the guide you used.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

you paid to go hunting and he took you, You are not guaranteed a limit every time, thats hunting and fishing, sure it sucks when its slow and you paid a guide but it happens, you said he even moved and tried another spot so it sounds like he was at least making an effort and working for you, it gets slow sometimes thats part of hunting and fishing, if you have never had a slow day then you havent hunted much JMHO, with a that being said a guide should have good equipment and a well trained dog, he should be professional on time and courtious to customers and let them shoot first and all that good stuff, but if you have a slow hunt and you dont feel you have to pay the full amount then I would think that guide could do without customers like that, its slow sometimes thats the way it is and if somebody doesnt understand that then they dont need to go with me, they can find someone else because any hunter that has hunted a while should know that.....should it be slow a lot ? no, a good guide scouts constantly and will try to get you on the birds as hard as he can, now if you didnt fire a shot that might be a diff. story, I would ley you go another day for a discounted price but if we were to only shoot say 5 or 6 and you dont wanna pay in full it would be your last trip with me


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## shhhh...ducks (Feb 22, 2010)

Folks may be critical of me for saying this but I have been hunting waterfowl for over 30 years and sometimes, they are there one day and not there the next........it is hunting.
I said that to say this......I have guided quite a number of hunts most were successful some were not. I know that folks spend their hard earned money on hunts and expect success to a certain point. Those that think that just because they paid a guide, they should expect limits everytime and that is not reasonable at all. However, when I run hunts and folks have sent me a 50% deposit and I fail to get them on ducks.......they owe me nothing else. In my mind, when they pay 50% upfront.......that gets them to the hunt, the other 50% is on me until I do my job and get them on birds. I hate takin folks' money and not delivering the goods. Sounds like this dude was just in it for the money and that is not the right frame of mind for a guide as far as I am concerned


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## 4thbreak (May 20, 2005)

Lookinforfish said:


> . According to him, best season ever.


Red Flag #1



> guide was adamant that i find others and come with a full party.


Red Flag #2. Best season ever and can't fill spots?



> Anyhow, met up and went to the spot on a public lake.


Red Flag #3 if he told you this initially.

Sounds like a lot of the warning signs were there. Unless you know the guide personally, you stand a chance of getting one that has the mentality of a used car salesman trying to get you to buy a crappy car. The dishonest ones will say anything to get you to come out, and then throw in the " well, that's just hunting" when you get skunked, Knowing full well it would happen. To me that's an unacceptable practice. Duck hunting is not hard, it's pretty **** easy. There are reputable guides out there that will tell you like it is, good or bad. Find them and use them.

The simple answer is yes, you should expect more out of a guided duck hunt.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

If you dont like paying a guide go price good decoys, a highly trained lab, a nice boat with all the bells and whistles, fuel to scout and get you to a from the lake or bay, storage for your boat, insurance, repairs on equipment, and all the other stuff that guides have to pay for, trust me it adds up quick and as far as needing a 3 person minimum to make the hunt, it aint worth it to take one person, a guide is not providing a free service, he needs to make some money too, hell if not he would just take everybody for free lol


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## Main Frame 8 (Mar 16, 2007)

I don't think I'd ever agree to pay a guide to hunt anything without some significant personal / professional references. 

Heard too many bad stories over the years.


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## aaronpatterson (Mar 23, 2011)

Any duck hunting "guide" who only puts out a dozen decoys has no clue what he is doing. Sounds like you got swindled. Skyblasting one duck as he is flying by is NOT duck hunting...might as well be sitting on a stool in a corn field shooting doves. Finding a duck hunting guide w/ a well trained lab that will actually sit and stay until sent is extremely rare. Most either have no dog or the "dog" they bring will typically fart around in the decoys after the dog breaks while birds are decoying. I have been duck hunting my whole life and know what real duck hunting is. What you paid for was nothing short of a joke.


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## teeroy (Oct 1, 2009)

You should hunt with a guide that has access to private property and has a good reputation.


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## aaronpatterson (Mar 23, 2011)

It is also my opinion that anyone can call themself a "guide"...doesn't mean they have the slightest clue what the he!! they are doing, much less know anything about what a true hunting experience is.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

he didnt say wether the guide had a dog or not, but you are right a lot of guides dogs suck and there are a lot of idiots out there but a good guide with good equipment and a good retriever that works hard should be paid a fair price even if it slow, you are paying for a service not a product, if you want a limit every time then yopu better go to the grocery store and quit griping cause its way cheaper, ok im done


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## fowlwaters (Jun 14, 2006)

You are paying for a service and not ducks as long as the guide made a good effort then that is what you paid for not a limit of ducks. I dont care if he put out 300 decoys if the birds are not there then there not there. I have shot limits of ducks with just 3 decoys out. You paid for a service and got a service sounds like he did make a effort because he moved to a diff. spot. As far as the dog committ I know alot of guides that have well trained dogs that well only go when sent and return the same matter they left. As far as knowing what a true hunting experience is. It is the chance to get out and hunt and enjoy the outdoors that is why it is called hunting. How many guys spend the money to get on a deer lease and not kill a deer do they whine? They are not paying for the deer. Or the guy that buy a dozen minnows and does not catch a limit of crappie.


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

Yes the guide had a dog, actually 2 with him. His veteran dog and a puppy he was training. Not that it mattered, as there was nothing to retrieve. Let me just clarify my position. I have been hunting a number of years, and just usually book a guided duck hunt once a year to enjoy the outdoors, hunting, and blasting some ducks. I fully understand hunting is called hunting and not killing for a reason. I am not a novice duck hunter nor an expert. I was simply wanting opinions on this. I have received some and I am appreciative, but do not mistake me for some pimple faced 18 yr old. I simply wanted to know what others would do in this situation so I can learn from it and move forward, not start a ******* contest. I have been on plenty of duck hunts ranging from the worst one yesterday, to limits all around.

I know a guide has upfront expenses bla, bla, bla. I also realize he has to be compensated. But his job is also to do everything possible to put his clients on the animals. Just my way of thinking was If I can not deliver at least half a limit, should I still charge someone the same as those that I do deliver full limits too? Maybe I'm wrong at thinking this. If so, then I will just start guiding as I can do as well as he did. And yes, I have the boat, decoys, truck, etc to hunt myself. Just need the dog is all. But picked up plenty of birds myself in the past.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

you better get to guiding then, and when its slow just tell them not to worry about paying you even though you have bills and expenses and all, good luck to you, BTW a good dog is usually well over 4k and thats being liberal, what do you think he could have done to better please you if I may ask ?


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

I guess awally is a guide. No, I'm just saying that I should start guiding and charging everyone full price, even though I never put them on the birds. At least they got a boat ride out of it.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

yes I am and I work very very hard to put people on birds and do very well most of the time, I have first class equipment and a very good dog, and have a lot of money invested in gear and my dog, and scout everyday, and act very professional and do my best to accomidate customers requests and always freindly but thats just me, BUT sometimes every now and then you have a slow hunt, not often but it does happen, and people still pay full price, you paid for my time and service and I provided it and I think I do a better personable service and work harder than most and if that aint enough then I dont need a customer that doesnt appreciate that because the customers that I have are mostly repeat and they understand that it is slow every now and then


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## Bily Lovec (Sep 26, 2005)

awally said:


> you better get to guiding then, and when its slow just tell them not to worry about paying you even though you have bills and expenses and all, good luck to you, BTW a good dog is usually well over 4k and thats being liberal, what do you think he could have done to better please you if I may ask ?


please tell us your guide service's name so I'll know never to hire you, you really come across as a tool.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

when you do a job you like to get paid dont you? well we do to, how does that come across as bad ?when we work hard and its slow it just ok to foot the bill for everybody???


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

There are reputable professional guide services that give you a great service, and others that are just in it for the money is what I am figuring out.

What could he have done differently? Put some ducks in front of us in shooting range. Period, bottom line, that's why I hired a professional (supposedly) guide. I can do bad by myself, I don't need any help. I just think or believe that it should be a shared responsibility. A guide put you on some ducks and me to shoot them. Why should a hunter bear the full responsibility for a non existent day of duck hunting? Had he tried to the best of his abilities and we killed 3 or so each, then he deserves every penny. But to transport me to a spot on a public lake, throw out a handful of decoys, then transport me back emptily handed and expect full price is what gets me. I could not look someone in the eye, and take their money for something like that. That's just me and the way I was raised and feel about it. I work hard for my money, and expect a value out of it when I spend it.


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## flatsmaster14 (Mar 25, 2011)

I'm sure every year is "the best year ever"


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

you are right one duck I couldnt have made you paid, I wouldve worked something out, but you have do have to realize that slow days happen, but I do see your point, now he may have shot 30 the day before you never know, thats just a fact but anyway it does suck that you had a bad hunt but what do you do ?? IDK??


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

awally said:


> you are right one duck I couldnt have made you paid, I wouldve worked something out, but you have do have to realize that slow days happen, but I do see your point, now he may have shot 30 the day before you never know, thats just a fact but anyway it does suck that you had a bad hunt but what do you do ?? IDK??


As said, I do realize there are bad days in all types of hunting. I did not have an issue with that. Had he even offered another hunt for free, I would have taken that and felt ok with it. I guess his offer of another at half price is better than nothing, but I have a hard time spending another dime with him for the same results.


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## fowlwaters (Jun 14, 2006)

How do you know you have the results? It looks like he did what you paid him for to me maybe you should just not go on guided hunts.


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## Brandon Zahn (Jan 12, 2012)

Did u know up front that the hunt was going to be on a public lake?

That is the biggest question. Sometimes on public lakes where ducks are pressured more..... It's better to put out just a few decoys... 

As a guy who has hunted all ur life you should know that guiding hunts on public water is very hard to predict. ( I for one guide full time but on private land because I feel I can control the birds and hunt results better).... I may be spoiled by the land I get to hunt and numbers we typically hold but I wouldn't hunt public land and expect to always kill ducks... As good as our hunting is we still have slower days, but they are few and far between.

There are good guides/outfits out there, you just have to do your homework and check references. $150 a gun is cheap nowadays..... With the cost of water and equipment... I'd expect to pay more if you go with the top end outfits.... You get what you pay for.

All in all I think if you knew it was a public land hunt... Then you are whining a little too much.... Maybe he coulda offered a little discount but I think by him offering the half price other hunt was a discount...

If you didn't know it was a public lake hunt when u booked, I would say u got took by one of the many wannabe guides who are Tryin to make a quick buck.


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## 4thbreak (May 20, 2005)

awally said:


> when you do a job you like to get paid dont you? well we do to, how does that come across as bad ?when we work hard and its slow it just ok to foot the bill for everybody???


If my job doesn't support myself or my family, I FIND A NEW JOB that does. I don't screw my clients just to cover my expenses. This is the used car salesman mentality I'm talking about folks. Now If you tell your clients it's going to be slow and they still want to go, I have no beef with that. But if you knowingly sell it for something it is not, and chalk up a bad hunt to "Thats just hunting" to cover your expenses, you should be run out of town.


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

Yeah, I didn't think about it that way. I did know before hand it was public waters. 

I guess I learned something new. Have some new knowledge to take away from this. Maybe someone else learned something as well. In future I will know to ask what if any policies they may have concerning a slow or no day they may have, public vs private, etc. this way I have this information to make a better informed decision. Appreciate everyone's input, I just like others views on it.


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## sqiggy (Aug 30, 2007)

My 2 cents, it happens. I do hog hunts on the side. I don't actually "guide" but take the hunters to stands that I think will provide the best results via trail cams.
Just last yr and on more than one occassion, I put a hunter in a stand where the hogs were coming in religiously. During that hunt, not one hog ever showed up. Of course I felt bad, because this new to hunting hunter did everything I told her to do. At the end of the hunt, she took it like a champ and still left with a smile on her face. I had her come back later and on my dime, where she killed her first hog and missed on another one.
Had another big group. Pics showed hogs coming in morning and evenings all week long, till they showed up that Sat morning. Out of 6 people, not one hog was even seen.
What can you do???
Although they had paid a deposit, I just couldn't accept the remaining balance. I felt like the hogs made a complete liar out of me.
On the other hand, if this would have been my livelyhood, my only income, then I would have took the remaining balance.
I know a guy that went on a deer hunt. Cost him $3500. That was for the hunt alone, not including out of state license, tag, and fuel. Then, not see one big buck for 5 days. Now that's a hard pill to swallow. But, it happens.


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## camarokid (Dec 27, 2011)

I have mixed emotions about this topic. I can understand both sides of the fence "client vs. guide". 

A guy that I regularly hunt with put it to me this way..."By the time you add up the cost of the boat, insurance and maintenace for the boat, registration for the trailer, FUEL for the boat, boat storage, tackle for the trip, etc; you are probably coming out ahead every year if use a guide service vs. if you are the kind of fishermen that only puts his own boat in the water a handfull of times a year". This is the classic arguement of "should I own a boat or should I just go on guided trips". 

I would have been dissappointed if a guide took me on a public hunt. I feel like that is something that I could do on my own without spending $150. The first thought that pops into my head when I hear "Guided Hunt" is a hunt on private land. If for some reason I did get a guide who took me on a hunt on public water, then I would expect something unique. 

It sucks when you only get to go on one or two hunts a year and you don't get to crush the birds. I would have a bad taste in my mouth too. But I also understand that there are days when the ducks/fish are there one day, and they are gone the next.

So the Lesson Learned from this thread is to do your homework beforehand. I hope you can go out on a better hunt with what little bit of season we have left.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

4thbreak I dont screw anybody and I also tell them if its slow or if its good, i just tell em how it is good or bad and most peoiple understand, and they usually go anyway, most of the time its good but like i said a million times it gets slow every now and then and if you cant accept that then you havent hunted very much


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## fowlwaters (Jun 14, 2006)

I am glad some of yall that are posting on this are not my customers. One day is great the next could be slow it is not the guides fault. If you are a hunter you should know this. If the guide was out of line that is one thing.


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## El Capitan de No Fish (Sep 20, 2007)

It's tough for guides to put their clients on the X every time. As long as they aren't lazy and make an effort to make changes if necessary, that's all you can ask for.
I have been on a couple of guided hunts where the guides weren't doing their job, and its pretty **** irritating. One guy fell asleep and started snoring, and was just pretty clueless the whole time. Our goose spread was a perfect square. He hardly said a word during the hunt, then it came time to settle up and he grew a personality. I think he got a $20 tip between 6 hunters. He didn't even earn that.
That being said I've had some great experiences with guides. Did a guided goose hunt a couple years ago, we shot one bird between 8 guys but tipped him as if we'd had a great hunt because he busted his *** trying to make it work.


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## the hook (Aug 8, 2011)

Wasn't gonna reply, ....I guess, just because....Been on both sides of the fence here..I guided on the Katy prairie back in the 70s/80s with mediocre goose and excellent duck numbers...I had enough good goose hunts for me to hunt geese, but I LOVED duck hunting...If we had a bad day, you paid in full, with the offer to come back, and if you do good, full price again. BUT, if bad, half price...Prices were only $60/day/man and min 4ppl...Then, I had newspaper ads, gear/etc then, $30/man went to outfitter or landowner....I had 1 client(4X, 1 yr) that left it up to me to make the call....Had geese piling into a bean field for 2 days...Can't fail...Called, he confirmed ok for next day....Forget how many people total, but...we were in a bar ditch with high Johnson grass which was best you could ask for....NOTHING!!! Could hear the birds coming, but they just never got there..was extremely foggy that day though....Had 1 lone canada come in and he had a cyst on his face...They paid....

I moved north and my first Dec decided to go on a guided hunt because I knew nobody in NJ that hunted, and I mean NJ!! I made a few phone calls from names(information) in Ducks Unlimited and 1 guy mentioned he had a hunt planned and if I want to go...Dang Tootin!!...We set up facing the hard west wind on a barrier island and he put about a dozen diver deks out where it was only 2' deep....I never shot ALL day...They, 2 hunters/guide, shot 2 bufflehead and an injured brant, then in the afternoon they unloaded on some snows flying about 70yds high...They scratched 1 and the guide was saying he shot it....I forget the price, but that was my last guided hunt here...

I fished with a highly recommended guide in Trinity in the 80s and all we caught were 10" specks, which he proceeded to slam on the top of the water when he could...We paid(4)...He is WELL known now

Should I start the popcorn??

You will get both sides, but if it was a public lake, he did not have that much overhead...


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## Garwood57 (Jul 1, 2007)

On my last guided goose hunt, (it was myself and my 3 girls), we got skunked. Zippo. Took a few high shots on birds that flared. That was a first for me. I understand hunting, it happens, but I was really put off by the guide's attitute. One of the first things he said early morning in the spread before shooting "this row crop angle with this wind direction is about the toughest hunting there is" (why didn't he adjust)? And second, after getting skunked, he did not offer any kind of apology or offer something better in the future like a discount to make up for it. Not a professional in my book.


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## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

I dunno how you'd predict waterfowl. There is one spot I hunt, where I've literally seen thousands of ducks then the next day, not a single one. (But then I don't do it for a living).


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## InfamousJ (May 21, 2004)

do your homework, research, etc. then pick a guide... after you pick it and send deposit in, you are bound to the agreement... pay the price even if it sucked. Try again in the future or not, you made the choice in what you did. Half assing it because you did not limit out or the trip sucked, ,hold your tip.. but the cost of the hunt was known up front. **** happens, lessons learned, etc. The guide will dictate how his rep will be in the industry with a make up or not and how you were treated in trying to attain that limit. If he worked hard and it just did not pan out, oh well. It sometimes does not work out. I agree on the private land though, hell no to public hunting unless it is like a gas price to drop you off in some spot because you aint got the resources.


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## JFolm (Apr 22, 2012)

Guides lie all the time. On my experience we were told they have been slaughtering birds by the main guy. Well our guide told us it had been slow all year. Are you that lousy that you have to lie to make a dollar?

Is it standard procedure to meet up with new clients while drinking miller lite at 5am????




You guys crying about the guide...

I can look busy at work all day but if I don't finish a task I will get terminated for lack of production... Yeah I have tools and uniforms I pay for. I had to fill up my truck to get there. Sorry boss, I just couldn't do the job. By the way, Where's my pay check?


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## SpottedAg (Jun 16, 2010)

Should've been here yesterday is the most cliche guide line in existence. If your job is to put folks on birds, it's not hard to go out and at least shoot 3-6, not necessarily full straps of big ducks... You got screwed.


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## CaptJadams (Jul 27, 2012)

Just come hunt la and don't worry bout it i guarantee min 10 birds or trip is 100$ to cover fuel and lil bit of time missed limit once this yr had 26 instead of 30 had 3 kids


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## Instigator (Jul 6, 2004)

If you are active on here and end up on a poorly guided trip of any kind you just have to look in the mirror to find the source of error. Guys post glowing reports of guide services all the time. Do a quick search of the hunting board for testimonials, make a few calls to find a good personality fit and go have fun (with or without birds/fish/deer/whatever). 

I prefer to DIY on leases because figuring out how to be successful is more rewarding than just shooting or setting the hook, but every couple of years I have occasion to hire a professional for access or just to see if I can learn a new trick or two. I have had both good experiences and bad ones and in every case my bad experiences were because I didn't take the time and effort to do the homework or I tried to do it on the cheap. 

My misspent youth was filled with guiding hunters and fishermen and so I totally understand how water hauls happen. I also understand that there are clients who cannot be satisfied and guides who are lazy bums, that is just the way of the world. Bottom line is that if you get burned on a hunt it is as least as much your fault as it is the guide.


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## Jpaulp (Nov 14, 2012)

awally said:


> BTW a good dog is usually well over 4k and thats being liberal


that made me chuckle


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## Gethookedadventures (Jan 1, 2007)

A lot of people who call themselves "Guides" out there. Sorry you had a bad experience. If I don't produce I do a re-hunt with my customers if we have a bad hunt. Also if it's slow or not good hunting conditions, I call and tell them it isn't worth going, explain why, and let them decide if they still want to try it. That's just my 2 cents about the topic.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

_that made me chuckle _

you had better check again, a started dog goes for about 1k - 2k and a good one is a lot more than that, now what I call good and you call good may be 2 diffrent things, but what I call good is force fetched, steady, does blind retrievers, hand signals, a turn key dog, and they are expensive


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## Jpaulp (Nov 14, 2012)

awally said:


> _that made me chuckle _
> 
> you had better check again, a started dog goes for about 1k - 2k and a good one is a lot more than that, now what I call good and you call good may be 2 diffrent things, but what I call good is force fetched, steady, does blind retrievers, hand signals, a turn key dog, and they are expensive


I got my dog for free. He's rock steady, force fetched, hes decent on blinds and hang signals out to about 100 yards, but he is only a year and a half. Spent 15 minutes a day with him probably 3-5 days a week depending on how busy I was with work or school. That's a good dog in my book but on the other hand I can not argue with you about good finished dogs being well over 4k. I know someone who just spent 10k for a three year old finished dog. I was just trying to say it can be done by yourself if you have the time for very cheap. I should have said that in the original post. That's my bad. :cheers:


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

you are right, 15 min a day goes a long way, if you are dedicated and willing to do that you can have yourself a really nice dog, I wish i was dedicated enough to do that religiously lol


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

I have ALWAYS paid, good or bad and never asked for anything in return , like half priced hunts or re-do's.
Do your homework, pay your money and take your chances...thats huntin and fishin.
Tips , now thats another topic.


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

Well the plot thickens. Through the miracle of the Internet, I found one of the guys that was in the group the morning before ours. The "guide" split them into 2 groups in different areas of the lake. Had one group use their own dekes and mojo and left em. One group killed 4 of 7 birds, other 5 of 7 birds. I had texted guide Sat afternoon to see how they had done. He said awesome, whacking and stacking, be better if he had some shooters. Based on those numbers doesn't sound like shooting was the problem. Lack of ducks was. 

Also evening before hunt I had 2 of my group back out, guide was adamant I feel those spots. Now I see why, mo money for him. I did get 2 at the last minute. Also the holes we hunted were hunted the previous 2 days. He also said he had 200 or so mallards and gadwall there in these coves day before. Only to shoot one?? Yeah, I wasn't born yesterday.


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## CaptJadams (Jul 27, 2012)

He won't stay in business long 150$ a gun is the reason.... If he had birds he'd be charging more we charge 2 for 500 3 for 600 4 for 700 but guaranteed ducks... And Cadillac hunting u can literally hunt in tennis shoes sounds like this guy just trying to make money knowing he doesn't have anything I would rather call a client and cancel if I didn't have birds than lie.... Clients will respect u bn honest.. Short term benefit he made 450 long term he shot himself in foot...


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## capt4fish (Dec 4, 2004)

*Welll....*



fowlwaters said:


> You are paying for a service and not ducks as long as the guide made a good effort then that is what you paid for not a limit of ducks. I dont care if he put out 300 decoys if the birds are not there then there not there. I have shot limits of ducks with just 3 decoys out. You paid for a service and got a service sounds like he did make a effort because he moved to a diff. spot. As far as the dog committ I know alot of guides that have well trained dogs that well only go when sent and return the same matter they left. As far as knowing what a true hunting experience is. It is the chance to get out and hunt and enjoy the outdoors that is why it is called hunting. How many guys spend the money to get on a deer lease and not kill a deer do they whine? They are not paying for the deer. Or the guy that buy a dozen minnows and does not catch a limit of crappie.


I call BS on only putting out a dozen decoys, on a public lake, in TEXAS. 
The "guide" definately did not know his stuff. 
Limits....not to be expected. Zero birds decoying....I call BS again. 
This "guide" did not do his scouting, was only worried about being paid.


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## flatsmaster14 (Mar 25, 2011)

Sometime only putting out a dozen decoys works better IMO, I either put out 6-12 decoys or 5-8 dozen decoys depending on what the birds like.

It's hot in Texas so we have the same birds for a while sometimes. They get call, blind, decoy, and mojo shy quick


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## fowlwaters (Jun 14, 2006)

Capt4fish why are you calling BS on my post? You do not need a large decoy spread to kill ducks if you are in the right places I have killed limits by not putting out more the a dozen on public lake in TEXAS. You have not ducked hunted much if you think the ducks will stay in the same place all the time here one day gone the next. I call BS on this whole whinning crying post.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

Ive shot a lot of ducks with just a dozen decoys, if you are in the right spot decoys and calling dont matter, calling is way over rated too, most of my good days I dont call at all, because we are too busy shooting and picking up ducks


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## the hook (Aug 8, 2011)

awally said:


> Ive shot a lot of ducks with just a dozen decoys, if you are in the right spot decoys and calling dont matter, calling is way over rated too, most of my good days I dont call at all, because we are too busy shooting and picking up ducks


WINNER WINNER!!!!...This IS a great statement...I, however believe in numbers, especially in Tx, however, I hunted the rice prairie around Katy(lot of competition from hunters) and the marsh around Port A(lot of competition from birds)...
As far as calling, "IF" I saw birds that just were not in the slightest bit interested, then I may give a toot or 2...If not, you are hoping you are in a spot where they want to be(scouting) or let the deks do their job...Feeding chuckle/whistle worked better for me, if I called at all...This has carried for about 40 yrs now with me as a great tip.

I posted earlier, but hunting IS hunting...I think he offered another trip at reduced rate??...This price does seem rather high for public land(little overhead??)...

You'd like to think AND hope that all guides are honest, and I had a lot of bad days...Sometimes it had a lot to do with clients that just would not listen as far as concealment or shooting...You did not have the opportunity to "miss" birds, as this can drastically effect your bird count without making it the guides fault...A lot of live and learn...Do YOU think the guide in question is a 2cooler, or will see this?? A lot of time on these problems, it is a communication problem....Talking goes a long way..


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## shauntexex (Dec 12, 2007)

awally said:


> Ive shot a lot of ducks with just a dozen decoys, if you are in the right spot decoys and calling dont matter, calling is way over rated too, most of my good days I dont call at all, because we are too busy shooting and picking up ducks


Ever hunted the Arkansas, Platte or White river for greenheads? Don't bring a call and see how successful you are breaking them off their flight path. 99% of duck hunters can't blow a call any better then a kazoo anyways.


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## Lookinforfish (Jan 7, 2011)

Guys lets just kill this thread. Getting way out of hand. I have read and understand all replies. I got some answers and see this is pretty much a split on this. I learned a lot from the different points of views, and maybe others considering a guided hunt can take something away from this or help them to make a better decision. I appreciate everyone's time and input. As for me, IF I ever go on another guided hunt, I will be prepared to pay no matter what the results are. Period. So in light, doubt I ever go again, just take my chances on my own.


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## Backlash Billy (Nov 22, 2009)

Lookinforfish said:


> Yes the guide had a dog, actually 2 with him. His veteran dog and a puppy he was training. Not that it mattered, as there was nothing to retrieve. Let me just clarify my position. I have been hunting a number of years, and just usually book a guided duck hunt once a year to enjoy the outdoors, hunting, and blasting some ducks. I fully understand hunting is called hunting and not killing for a reason. I am not a novice duck hunter nor an expert. I was simply wanting opinions on this. I have received some and I am appreciative, but do not mistake me for some pimple faced 18 yr old. I simply wanted to know what others would do in this situation so I can learn from it and move forward, not start a ******* contest. I have been on plenty of duck hunts ranging from the worst one yesterday, to limits all around.
> 
> I know a guide has upfront expenses bla, bla, bla. I also realize he has to be compensated. But his job is also to do everything possible to put his clients on the animals. Just my way of thinking was If I can not deliver at least half a limit, should I still charge someone the same as those that I do deliver full limits too? Maybe I'm wrong at thinking this. If so, then I will just start guiding as I can do as well as he did. And yes, I have the boat, decoys, truck, etc to hunt myself. Just need the dog is all. But picked up plenty of birds myself in the past.


If you go once a year and blast ducks with a guide why didn't you book the guy you have had good experiences with? You build a relationship and even though it's a guded hunt, it's like out hunting with your buddies which is what it is. Once you find someone you like to hunt with, stick with them. They will tell you if it's not worth a ****. Sometimes it is slow but if you have hunted with him for a while, you know what it is. Somedays ducks, somedays feathers.


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## wennis1 (Nov 5, 2008)

aaronpatterson said:


> Any duck hunting "guide" who only puts out a dozen decoys has no clue what he is doing. Sounds like you got swindled. Skyblasting one duck as he is flying by is NOT duck hunting...might as well be sitting on a stool in a corn field shooting doves. Finding a duck hunting guide w/ a well trained lab that will actually sit and stay until sent is extremely rare. Most either have no dog or the "dog" they bring will typically fart around in the decoys after the dog breaks while birds are decoying. I have been duck hunting my whole life and know what real duck hunting is. What you paid for was nothing short of a joke.


Agreed, unless it is a small private pond that he knows is holding ducks. 12 decoys can even be hard on a large pond or small lake. Ive hunted with 30+ decoys on a large pond and ducks were everywhere except where we were. A good guide will scout birds and find out where they want to be. The rest is a piece of cake.


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## Brute (Apr 29, 2009)

I have been on a few bust fishing/ hunting trips. The guides always deeply discounted the trips. I always pay the full price any ways. It's the gesture that counts. It shows they intended to put you on what ever we were going after because they wouldn't go out expecting to lose money. A guide that charges full price every time is shady to me. Both sides have to understand stuff doesn't always work out and adjust accordingly IMO.


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## bubbas kenner (Sep 4, 2010)

teeroy said:


> You should hunt with a guide that has access to private property and has a good reputation.


This always.


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