# A Guide's Tale



## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

My wife's firm held a fishing tournament today, for employees and spouses. Turnout was light, with only about a dozen fishing. The RSVP sheet asked if we preferred to wade or fish from the boat. Only two of us wanted to wade, so we were assigned to one boat/guide.

As we loaded our stuff into the boat, he asked, "Are you guys planning to wade?" My partner said that we had put it on our preference sheet, but the guide said that nobody had told him. He was clearly unhappy. As we pulled away from the dock, one of the other guides yelled to him, "Hey _______, how did you get put with two wade fishermen?" It was obvious that this guy doesn't cater to wade fishermen. Not a good start.

Once we got going, my partner again started talking to the guide. "You don't have live bait?" The guide looked daggers at him and said, "No... I've got what's gonna work." Anybody know what that means? I did. I pulled out my phone and told her the guy was going to have us fishing with dead shrimp. So I decided to play good cop. I apologized for the fact that the organizers hadn't communicated well, and I said that was the reason only two of us were assigned to his boat. His response floored me: "Well I can dump you out on a shoreline, if that's what you want." That's a bad start to the day, and the only thing worse is getting dumped out on some random shoreline to fend for ourselves.

There is a weigh-in, but the guy makes a VERY long drive to our "spot". He pulls up on a lake drain, anchors, and has us start chunking dead shrimp with a nice heavy weight. (We brought our own equipment, but we weren't rigged for bottom fishing.) And what was the first fish to the boat? Anyone? Anyone? Beuller? Yes, a black drum. An undersized black drum. And the guide seems pleased with it. So now I know for certain what kind of guide this guy is.

I decided that I could either stay mad for several hours, or just relax and take whatever came our way. The guide wasn't a bad guy. I'm sure there are a lot of turistas who are happy to reel in anything, and he caters to them. In the end, we caught quite a few undersized reds and black drum. We boxed four each of legal redfish and blacks. I caught a flounder that he quickly grabbed and tossed back. It wasn't big, but I've floundered enough to know a legal flounder. I don't have a clue why he didn't measure it.

Now the sad part. Four guides, and a dozen people, and our four redfish and four small blacks was the best haul of the day. My 24 1/2" redfish was the biggest fish.

It was a nice gesture by the firm. They treated us to a great dinner last night, they paid for guides (including a good tip). They served us a great dinner last night, and hired a singing duo. This morning they had tacos for us, before we took off. And the people on the other boats never knew the difference about the fishing. They got to reel in a bunch of small fish, and they had stories to tell, and they were happy.

My instinct was to gripe about the guide, and call that style of guiding unforgivable. I wish he had been able to recognize that he had two experienced fishermen onboard, and been more flexible. But it became pretty obvious that this is how he makes his living, and if his customers leave happy, I guess that's what counts. I'm sure there are times when he rolls up on more bigger fish, and they leave even happier. I think a guide ought to be honest with his customers about the way he fishes, and respect what his customers want to do. But I think he was telling the truth that he had no idea about our expectations.

So I got to spend a morning fishing, and I got an Amazon gift card, and I put fresh redfish on the grill tonight. (Cooked to perfection, if I do say so myself.) A man would really have to be trying to gripe after a day like this.


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## Blk Jck 224 (Oct 16, 2009)

All you omitted was the outgoing tide part & the fact that you probably wouldn't have caught chit wading some random shoreline...LOL...I like your stories!


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## karstopo (Jun 29, 2009)

Not exactly kindred spirits you and the guide. Seems like a guide might appreciate a couple of sports that wanted to do something beyond the same ol same routine, but I guess that isnâ€™t how it works. 

Maybe he gets a lot of folks with â€œideasâ€ about how to fish, but little experience. Put some fish in the boat must be his single minded focus to the exclusion of all other considerations. 

Really not my first choice for fun soaking dead shrimp anchored up someplace, but that is probably the recipe for fishing fun for the majority of folks.


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

Sometimes good intentions donâ€™t go as planned, good intentions being your wifeâ€™s firm paying for an outing for the employees. Itâ€™s a shame you got stuck with that particular guide and vice versa. At least you caught some fish and had some good food. Could have been better, but all in all, not too bad.


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## ddakota (Jun 28, 2009)

Congrats...you made the very best of a bad situation. 

My mantra in life is â€œthe only thing in life you truly control is how you react to itâ€. You chose to react in a positive way and came out on top. I respect that a lot. 

I always hope I have the strength to do the same, sometime I do, sometimes I donâ€™t. I might have silently stewed longer than you, or just got out of the boat and said Iâ€™m wading that way, pick me up when you leave.


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## photofishin (Aug 7, 2009)

most guides work for their clients. This guy definitely did not. As a former guide, I regularly had fishermen who wanted to try something other than what I knew was working. I had no problem trying their methods if they knew what they were doing. They were paying me for my expertise...but also to take them fishing. I admire you for not getting bent out of shape, but I'd also let the organizers know that the next time, you'd suggest a different guide. This reminds me of the GYB "guides" that go take their clients out to the jetties to catch bull reds and come back filling 2 gallon baggies with useless rubberized redfish filets. Many people leave thinking they just got a lot of fish...I'd just like to see the look on their faces when they try eating it.


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## ChampT22 (Mar 7, 2011)

I like the fact that you assumed the guide knew how to fish other ways. That might have been his whole knowledge of fishing.


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## onplane (Jul 26, 2017)

pocjetty said:


> Once we got going, my partner again started talking to the guide. "You don't have live bait?" The guide looked daggers at him and said, "No... I've got what's gonna work."
> 
> There is a weigh-in, but the guy makes a VERY long drive to our "spot".


I'm guessing he didn't have live bait because he didn't want to pay for it and part of his attitude was because he figured you knew that was the reason for the dead bait as well.

Maybe he figured he'd use his bait savings to pay for the long drive.

Good for you to make the best of it, but I'll bet you didn't save his number.


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

ddakota said:


> I might have silently stewed longer than you


LOL. Trust me, another time I might have done exactly that. Some days the beast wins.



Blk Jck 224 said:


> All you omitted was the outgoing tide part & the fact that you probably wouldn't have caught chit wading some random shoreline...LOL...I like your stories!


Right on both counts. You're actually one of the voices of reason here who was in the back of my mind. It finally just came down to a decision to be righteous and miserable, or chill out and have a good day. All things considered, this way seems better.


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## loco4fishn (May 17, 2010)

All I got to say is â€œitâ€™s hard to drink beer while throwing plastics.â€ Soak that shrimp and drink beer. Lol


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## BBCAT (Feb 2, 2010)

If there were fish in the area and you brought your own equipment, why didn't you start chunking lures and have a more enjoyable trip. Congrats on winning and keeping your cool.


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## RedXCross (Aug 7, 2005)

Glad you had a good time (in general) company had a nice event planned (most never do)
The "Guide" you had, well,ok if you say so!


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## mccain (Oct 20, 2006)

you took one for the (wife's) team. good man.....and smart too


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

BBCAT said:


> If there were fish in the area and you brought your own equipment, why didn't you start chunking lures and have a more enjoyable trip. Congrats on winning and keeping your cool.


Partly for the same reason you don't insult the cook or the waiter. They have ways of getting revenge.

But I was dead serious about hearing Blackjack224 in the back of my mind. He has a way of telling people "Get over yourself." Sometimes that's irritating to hear, but mostly it's pretty good advice. If I had spent the day wrapped around that guy's axle I would have come home miserable. This way was better. Old dogs can learn new tricks, but we have to learn them very slowly.


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## Aggieangler (May 28, 2004)

I also agree that the guide may not know any other way to fish, or be prepared to work that hard for it. I have seen the same sort of behavior out of a Rockport area guide once, when we were booked with a good captain we had fished with a lot in the past. He had a very serious health issue about a week before our scheduled trip. He called, and asked if we could re-schedule or perhaps he could recommend someone? Well, we had the dates off from work, so we said we would go with who he recommended. Turns out, the guy he recommended, had just gotten divorced and had no boat. He borrowed one from a fella he knew, and wanted to go to the back side of mud island, and anchor up all day in one spot, with cut mullet, and wait for the tide to change. He routinely said, "You'll be surprised, Bubba", about what would happen when the tide changes.

Since it was August, with no wind, we cooked mercilessly, for 5 or 6 hours anchored in one spot, waiting on the tide change. During this time, I am watching trout slicks across the back of the flat, and I am really thinking about hopping out and wading to them. Of course, all my wading gear was back at the truck, so I hung around. Next, he proceeds to mention how good our lunch looks, which we brought, and evidently he didn't plan that, too far in advance either. So he borrows half a sandwich from a buddy's Dad on the boat with us. I've shared food with guides before, but usually because they brought something along, and mentioned that mine looked tastier and we had plenty. In fact, unrelated to this, I can think of a Port Mansfield legend, that we've shared our lunch with many times, because he is a helluva guy and our food was imported from a German smokehouse we passed on the way South. He just couldn't compete with that sausage locally  

Long story short, I would rather dig ditches, than sit in one spot all day soaking a piece of cut mullet in 95 degree weather with no wind from a guy that mooches a sandwich.

And, that was the last time we contacted or fished with either of those two guys again. It also was probably just about the last time we threw bait. I used to be able to fish enough that a day like that didn't bother me. Now, since I only get on the water a dozen days a year or so, with the kids so busy, I won't put up with much that irritates me. It's not worth my limited free time.

Then again, I hardly ever hire a guide now, and when I do, there are only 2 or 3 I will use.

I understand most of that was out of your control, POC, so I can appreciate your reaction to what the company got you into even more. I guess you can say, at least you got to go fishing. I agree that the style of fishing for lots of folks, would have been worth plenty, and can see, that for you, it was probably worth very little. Sorry it had to go down like that.


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## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

Who put the bait on your hook each time?


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

barronj said:


> Who put the bait on your hook each time?


Grrrrrr. I just told one person about that. You been talking, or was that just a guess? I finally convinced the guy that I could put my own shrimp on the hook. But, yeah, he was baiting hooks and taking fish off. I think I was a model of restraint.


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## barronj (Sep 30, 2013)

It wasn’t mentioned, and the thought of the dynamics of that put a smile on my face so big it hurts, so I had to ask :^)

I guess the tell on that was when he threw your flounder back.


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## fishin shallow (Jul 31, 2005)

Try jumping on a boat and the first words out of the guides mouth are "don't be surprised if we catch a 36" trout today" After that I knew it was going to be a long day and indeed it was.


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## pomakai (Jun 7, 2012)

Fun day at the jettys @ poc
















Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

Yâ€™all won? If I get it correct. Then he was the man with the plan!
What if yâ€™all had showed up at weigh in with a hefty stringer of trout reds and flounder. Shamed everybody else and then it would be like an albatross around your neck to the others. Mm mm m, that wouldâ€™ve sucked.
As it is you won graciously.
And ya did say he had â€œ niceâ€ heavy weights. They could have spark been plugs lol!
Just kidding you some, I enjoy reading your reports!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Prizepig (Jul 13, 2012)

Scott, you must post gps coordinates of this secret trophy black drum honey hole......or it never happened. LOL

On a serious note, you are a better man than me. I would have gotten some satisfaction out of the trip without having ever landing a fish. Hehehehehe


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## FISHIN COUG (Sep 28, 2004)

Reminds me of a trip that I had several years ago with a prominent guide service that fishes lake calcaseu (sp?). I got an invite from a vendor and we had a large party with about 5 boats. I got stuck on the wrong boat and Bait of choice was a jig head tipped with dead
Shrimp. Day 1 I made the best of it and had a great time and proceeded to get hammered while my guide out us on rat reds, sandies, small trout, and yes he baited and unhooked our fish. Days 2 and 3 I went with guides that focused on throwing plastics and we caught our fair share of nice trout and red fish. Kudos on making the best of it especially with the general being involved.


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

shadslinger said:


> Yâ€™all won? If I get it correct. Then he was the man with the plan!
> What if yâ€™all had showed up at weigh in with a hefty stringer of trout reds and flounder. Shamed everybody else and then it would be like an albatross around your neck to the others.





Prizepig said:


> Scott, you must post gps coordinates of this secret trophy black drum honey hole......or it never happened. LOL





FISHIN COUG said:


> Reminds me of a trip that I had several years ago with a prominent guide service that fishes lake calcaseu (sp?). Kudos on making the best of it especially with the general being involved.


You guys are great! I know I'm among friends when they're laughing at my misfortune. :biggrin: There are a few guys on here who I fish with who would tell you that I'm always happy to do the same.

Seriously, it's a good reminder to keep laughing. It rains on all of us once in a while. And Shadslinger, there's more truth to what you said than you know. If I had come in with some big bunch of fish, and the others didn't, it really would have looked bad. As it was, I only took credit for the one redfish, and it was just a matter of luck that it was bigger than any others. If I'm being honest, it was better this way.


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## Ethan Hunt (Dec 7, 2007)

there are guides known to cater only to beginners, tourists and kids by chunking live or dead shrimps and only take you to a couple of spots within a couple of miles from the boat ramp. All they do is just point where they want you to cast and rebait for ya all day long.


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## Snookered (Jun 16, 2009)

Ethan Hunt said:


> there are guides known to cater only to beginners, tourists and kids by chunking live or dead shrimps and only take you to a couple of spots within a couple of miles from the boat ramp. All they do is just point where they want you to cast and rebait for ya all day long.


and that's a good point worth echoing....most guides, day-in and day-out, are fishing with people who don't fish often or may not have fished much at all in the past....their typical customers are on board to learn and need the assistance, or they are just on board for the boat ride experience and maybe catch a couple fish...

POC, you're not a typical client....local fishermen AND adept at the whole gig...I promise the guide wasn't expecting someone like you on their boat when they heard it was a "corporate event"....ask shadslinger...
snookered


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

Snookered said:


> and that's a good point worth echoing....most guides, day-in and day-out, are fishing with people who don't fish often or may not have fished much at all in the past....their typical customers are on board to learn and need the assistance, or they are just on board for the boat ride experience and maybe catch a couple fish...
> 
> POC, you're not a typical client....local fishermen AND adept at the whole gig...I promise the guide wasn't expecting someone like you on their boat when they heard it was a "corporate event"....ask shadslinger...
> snookered


And once again, that's what friends are for. They give us some perspective when we're missing it. Some of the comments in this thread will stick with me in future situations. There has been a lot of talk lately about this website, but I have always found a lot of good people here.

And I have to admit - after I proved myself for an hour or so, the captain did allow me to bait my own hook some of the time. :biggrin:


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

I pray one day I have the patience of POCjetty. I would have rather waded the one shoreline all day and told the guy come pick ya up at lunch.


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## pocjetty (Sep 12, 2014)

BATWING said:


> I pray one day I have the patience of POCjetty. I would have rather waded the one shoreline all day and told the guy come pick ya up at lunch.


Echhhâ€¦ now you're going to make me get all philosophical. The truth is, I didn't settle down because I'm patient. I have this serious belief that we all have an expiration date. We have a limited number of days, and nobody gets a guarantee that there's a tomorrow. So I have this strong belief that I can't afford to waste any of them. If I spend that day fuming, I miss out on the fact that I'm on the water, the people I'm with are really both decent guys, and I still caught a few fish - which is absolutely one of my favorite things in the whole world. What kind of dope would I have to be to miss out on all that? The more time I spend saying "thank you", the less I feel the need to say "please".

That's the honest truth. Sometimes I lose sight of it, and it always costs me. And it really is nice to have friends who will remind me of things that I know, but seem to forget. BarronJ did that for me after the hurricane, and it kept me from spending a lot of time in a dark place.

If that's not good enough, then just remember what the Stones said: You can't always get what you want. But if you try sometimes you get what you need.

.


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## Duckchasr (Apr 27, 2011)

"the captain did allow me to bait my own hook some of the time. :biggrin:" This is Golden!


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## Sgrem (Oct 5, 2005)

Its funny to me....
I am a guide and i want my anglers to have the most relaxing day possible. On a trip as POCjetty describes i am headed to my customers with a shrimp and the net. I unhook and rebait so they can get back to catching.

UNLESS....They have indicated to me that they WANT to do those things themselves. Verbally or thru their actions and body language. If they are capaable and want to rock on i just extend the bait net their direction. Otherwise i set them up as best i can.

Like a server at Lubys. Yes you can get your own drink....but you usually let the server do it so you can continue with conversation at your table. But the server works their tail off for you to hopefully earn a nice tip.... Or not and you get your own drink as you prefer.


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## schoalbeast101 (Oct 23, 2014)

POC, you acted like the professional that you are. You made the best out of the situation and you didn't sulk like a 2 year old, like many people do these days. Fish long enough on the coast and you will have trips like that. The best thing to do is to make the best of it and move on after the trip.


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## Bayscout22 (Aug 9, 2007)

Checking yourself on the attitude lead to a good day. At least you weren't in Houston, Texas.


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## stdreb27 (Aug 15, 2011)

Iâ€™ve never had great luck fishing in those charity tournaments. 


IMO the muckity mucks get the quality guide they like to fish with and their normal rates, then they find discount guys for the masses. And I was typically the masses.


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## lure (Aug 15, 2005)

I can tell you this, I have ran a lot of corporate events as a guide. very few of them tell us anything about who we are getting or what they want to do prior to the them getting on the boat. I have had good fisherman and I have had people who have never held a rod before. All they tell us is the people want to catch fish. As a fisherman I see your side, and as a guide I see his. With that being said I would have changed my game plan once I realized what yall wanted to do.


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## Haynie21T (Jun 9, 2017)

Scott, you did well. Can you imagine the guide that thought he was going to have wade fishermen throwing artificials and got two guys that wanted to drown dead bait on the bottom? I know a lot of fishing guides that are very good at either bait fishing or wading w/artificials, but not many that do both. They are usually set up and geared up to fish one way or the other. As I stated, you did well, hope to see you in RP soon.


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## Whipray (Mar 12, 2007)

Any time I get invited on a corporate trip I just assume I'll be throwing bait and resign myself to the fact that I'm likely going to be fishing with people who never or seldom fish. Last one I went on, it was me and 3 other guys I didn't know on the boat. I told the guide up front I owned a skiff, fished all the time, and was happy to help him out with the beginners, which I did.


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## Prizepig (Jul 13, 2012)

I turn down invites from our vendors for last minute trips or fishing tournaments all the time. I always get asked â€œwhy would you turn down a free guided fishing trip or tournament entry?â€ My answer......â€why the heck would I spend tens of thousands of dollars on my own boat and all the gear to go with it to fish outta someone elseâ€™s?â€ Works for me every time.


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## jas415 (May 25, 2009)

*guided trips*

Fished with a Rockport guide 20 years ago. Met him at 7, bought his breakfast, left about 8, went several places netting finger mullet, and sat on pot holes for about 4 hours, caught 3 fish, all small specks. He was like a 'rent a horse' a 4 hour rent a horse. Went out two hours and came back two hours.

Went with a local guide on the Suwanee River in Florida. My buddy and I had brought our Texas plastics lures. Guide was 'deep south'. Crazy place, bought their 'best lures' and if we didn't use them they took them back. Also bought live shrimp, by the shrimp. Put them in bucket with wet newspapers, layer of wet tow sack, wet newspapers, and more wet tow sack. Astonishingly, it kept them alive all day and we returned them! Anyway, we used our plastics in that 'tea colored' water and killed them. Caught 2 limits and went in to lunch. He was bragging to anyone about us "Texas Toe Tappers', then we went back out and caught two more limits of specks.

Never fished with a really bad guide, just a couple that were not as 'into it' as others!


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## Txflyrod (Nov 11, 2016)

Many years ago, my family took a trip to Europe and my brother hired a flyfishing guide. The guide may have also been the taxi driver in this town called Gmunden, because he never left the car. He would drive my brother from one spot to the next and instruct him which fly to use. Then he would like up a cigarette and send him down to the river. This was a last minute fishing trip, so my brother had to borrow all the equipment including old worn out waders. When he got back to the taxi, the waders had a big tear in them. The guide then wanted to charge him 300 dollars to replace the waders!


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## SKIPJACKSLAYER (Nov 19, 2013)

Only guided trip ive ever been on that wasnâ€™t offshore, was to the Galveston jettyâ€™s for a friends birthday. Guide tells us that we are only using cut bait. We were all disappointed bc it really limits your options, but we canâ€™t do anything about it so we just stay cool. Then he informs us he owns a local bait shop... we though that was pretty rude. And his tackle consisted of rusty old hooks and weights. Lunch bags of bull bull reds arenâ€™t my thing, but like I said, it was a friends birthday he booked it and we pitched in. Live bait at the jettyâ€™s can open up so many options. Trout, smacks, sheepshead, sometimes Kings, Tarpon, or the rare Cobia can be caught on live shrimp, croaker, etc. Nope. 2 bull reds and one slot red after a 6 hour trip. Between 6 fisherman. Not what Iâ€™d call action but you live and you learn.


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