# Curious behavior



## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

My brother and I came across from Dove Is, (no luck there) to Ind Hills. A guide with 4 clients was catching up a storm, jigging off bottom. I passed trolling, within 30 yards, no less, and asked if any were of any size. I got a cold stare for a good 5 minutes and I trolled on down a couple hundred yards from him. So he pulls up his clients rigs, and proceeds to do donuts at high throttle over his school of fish and leaves. Where he was anchored is a known good spot...been fishing it for 30 years. I didn't know he was there and was not infringing on him a bit...just a friendly hello.
I suppose he thought I was birddogging his excellent skills. I thought it was rude and on top of that..what guide, who is on fish with four clients, would halt the catching and try to spoil the spot for others. You folks that know me, know I go out of the way to not impact anyone's fishing. I have my spots already...and have shared them on gpx files. He finally waved goodbye when I did a *** with my hands as he sped off.
Anyway, the fishing is great, still lots of smalls, but got a few of decent size today.


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

You went within 30 feet from him or 30 yards?


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Whitebassfisher said:


> You went within 30 feet from him or 30 yards?


 yards! Auto correct made it 30 yes. I fixed. They were vertically jigging and I would have given him even more space but I was running out of sea room.


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

With 30 yards of room, I would say that guide has anger management issues. It will make life less fun for him.


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## Tails-Up (Mar 4, 2017)

30 yards can be a little tight if they were flipping out to a moving school and bouncing the jig back. Itâ€™s only 4 Boat lengths.


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## pz316wa (May 23, 2010)

*????*

well ?is did you know he was a guide if so why would u bother him while he was working I say this if he could have cast his line to your boat then you were to close to him .I understand wanting to be friendly but not when the guy is working unless you knew him even then I don't think I would even bother him and I think 30 yards is too close just my 2 cents worth I am sure you meant well as for his actions I agree with you he was a jackass and showed his clients how unprofessional he was . CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG :headknock:cheers: :dance:


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## Mattsfishin (Aug 23, 2009)

You have to understand that there are a couple guides that own the water and they were there the day before so it makes it there water. Most of the guides on Livingston are professional in the way they run their business but then you have the couple of bad apples in the bunch. Would you like to describe the boat or leave it be. Had a similar experience this morning also. Bit my tongue really hard because I can cuss like 10 sailors and don't really give a rats backside. Medicine I take can give me mood swings and I really don't care.Went on down the lake and did not let it bother me but if this same person does it again I hope I am in a good mood again. There have been previous reports of a guide in that area that owns the water, just ask him. Yeh he is a real weiner.

Heck I almost forgot, Mark how come you are fishing and not working on your dock? LOL !!!!!!


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

fishypete said:


> well ?is did you know he was a guide if so why would u bother him while he was working I say this if he could have cast his line to your boat then you were to close to him .I understand wanting to be friendly but not when the guy is working unless you knew him even then I don't think I would even bother him and I think 30 yards is too close just my 2 cents worth I am sure you meant well as for his actions I agree with you he was a jackass and showed his clients how unprofessional he was . CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG :headknock:cheers: :dance:


I really don't know if he was a guide, I didn't recognize him. Just supposed he was with 4 fishing and one guy at the helm. I agree 30 yards is too close, but I ran out of room between him and the rocks when I got close enough to see hoe close he was too shore. If they had been casting, I would have reeled in my trolling rigs and backed out, but since they were jigging vertically, I thought I was OK. I also left his vicinity and didn't return. I would have supposed that would be cool. My astonishment was him doing donuts to sidperse where he was catching and then hightailing out of there.
If I was too close for his comfort, I understand and I did leave him 100s of yards away after that one ill advised pass. But to spoil a school of fish where his 4 were hauling them in by the bucketful was cutting his nose to spite his face. Good grief anyone trolling can get too close for a minute...he didn't know me but I am no potlicker, I've got my own spots. Plus I usually trade advice with everyone I meet, guide or no guide. This was no secret spot...there are usually a dozen boats there.


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Tails-Up said:


> 30 yards can be a little tight if they were flipping out to a moving school and bouncing the jig back. Itâ€™s only 4 Boat lengths.


I personally like to cast and work my slab back. I call it slabbing vs vertical jigging.



fishypete said:


> *well ?is did you know he was a guide if so why would u bother him while he was working* I say this if he could have cast his line to your boat then you were to close to him .I understand wanting to be friendly but not when the guy is working unless you knew him even then I don't think I would even bother him and I think 30 yards is too close just my 2 cents worth I am sure you meant well as for his actions I agree with you he was a jackass and showed his clients how unprofessional he was . CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG :headknock:cheers: :dance:


I don't understand why the person being a guide or not enters into it. Do you give a guide wider berth than non-guide fishermen?


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Mattsfishin said:


> You have to understand that there are a couple guides that own the water and they were there the day before so it makes it there water. Most of the guides on Livingston are professional in the way they run their business but then you have the couple of bad apples in the bunch. Would you like to describe the boat or leave it be. Had a similar experience this morning also. Bit my tongue really hard because I can cuss like 10 sailors and don't really give a rats backside. Medicine I take can give me mood swings and I really don't care.Went on down the lake and did not let it bother me but if this same person does it again I hope I am in a good mood again. There have been previous reports of a guide in that area that owns the water, just ask him. Yeh he is a real weiner.
> 
> Heck I almost forgot, Mark how come you are fishing and not working on your dock? LOL !!!!!!


Already fixed it this year. I'm not going to advertise his boat, maybe he just had a bad day. I hope he sees himself on this forum and recognize his behavior only hurt his fishermen.


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Whitebassfisher said:


> I personally like to cast and work my slab back. I call it slabbing vs vertical jigging.
> 
> I don't understand why the person being a guide or not enters into it. Do you give a guide wider berth than non-guide fishermen?


Yup...everybody deserves the space they need for casting if they got there first. I was too close.


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

markbrumbaugh said:


> Yup...everybody deserves the space they need for casting if they got there first. I was too close.


If you went back and forth it would be different to me, but one pass at 30 yards doesn't deserve that type reaction in my opinion.


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## Bankin' On It (Feb 14, 2013)

Trolling doesnâ€™t hurt them fish. I can troll a stationary school of white bass marked on the fish finder and just about predict when my rod is gonna bounce. Back and forth, time and time again. I wouldnâ€™t do that to a boat that is jigging but just saying. Those jiggers will park right in the middle of a good trolling lane too. With their high falootinâ€™ anchor lock trolling motors. Hmph.

Do yo thang Mark.

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## Tails-Up (Mar 4, 2017)

Whatâ€™s a trolling lane?


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Tails-Up said:


> Whatâ€™s a trolling lane?


Popcorn time!!


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## Mattsfishin (Aug 23, 2009)

Tails-Up said:


> Whatâ€™s a trolling lane?


As a guide I am sure you have heard that term before.


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## Bankin' On It (Feb 14, 2013)

â€œTails Up is blocked. View message?â€

Press button: Ignore. 

Done.


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## Tails-Up (Mar 4, 2017)

Mattsfishin said:


> As a guide I am sure you have heard that term before.


Iâ€™ve heard the term. Iâ€™m looking for a definition


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Tails-Up said:


> Iâ€™ve heard the term. Iâ€™m looking for a definition


Northwest by southeast, approximately 6 inches off my dock, is one! Bonus if you can drop an anchor on my underwater light.


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## Bankin' On It (Feb 14, 2013)

markbrumbaugh said:


> Northwest by southeast, approximately 6 inches off my dock, is one! Bonus if you can drop an anchor on my underwater light.


Mark, if that light is in a good trolling lane some of â€˜em will just spot lock over it with one of them high falootinâ€™ trolling motors and jig that light until someone hooks the â€˜lectric feed brother. Lol

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## saved (Feb 1, 2014)

Many of the guides think thy own certain areas of the water. Just get the number off the boat and report him.


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## I'llbecoastin (Apr 18, 2016)

:walking


saved said:


> Many of the guides think thy own certain areas of the water. Just get the number off the boat and report him.


Report him for what, hurt feelings? I'm not condoning his behavior but I can't see where he broke any laws. I thought we would at least make it until summer before we had this annual debate. I've had people meet me at the cleaning table and tell me I was parked in their trolling lane, so I'm familiar with the term.


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

I'llbecoastin said:


> :walking
> 
> Report him for what, hurt feelings? I'm not condoning his behavior but I can't see where he broke any laws. I thought we would at least make it until summer before we had this annual debate. I've had people meet me at the cleaning table and tell me I was parked in their trolling lane, so I'm familiar with the term.


Actually it is, TPWD has a law regarding the harassment of fish by use of a boat to disburse, harass, or herd fish in any way.
Y'all look it up while I pop some popcorn.

And I can testify that BOI can make a trolling lane out of flat water, I have seen him do it, lol!

Y'all go fishing and have some fun, leave all this squabbling for,....uh,..those other fishing boards.


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## Tails-Up (Mar 4, 2017)

saved said:


> Many of the guides think thy own certain areas of the water.


Oh, you mean like someone who sets up a â€œtrolling laneâ€?


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## Bankin' On It (Feb 14, 2013)

shadslinger said:


> And I can testify that BOI can make a trolling lane out of flat water, I have seen him do it, lol!
> .


Ha! Beep! Beep! I should install a horn. Are those train horns illegal on a boat? Then you would always know when Iâ€™m on the water...from the Beacon Bay cleaning table! Hahahaha! Good stuff. Might attract fish like a boat beater, who knows?

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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

I will _try _to make this my last post on this thread. (No promises :headknock)

The debate over fishing vs boat riding will go on forever. At the end of the day, being respectful of each other (and I mean both directions) will increase the odds of being in a good mood later on. :cheers:


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## I'llbecoastin (Apr 18, 2016)

shadslinger said:


> Actually it is, TPWD has a law regarding the harassment of fish by use of a boat to disburse, harass, or herd fish in any way.
> Y'all look it up while I pop some popcorn.
> 
> And I can testify that BOI can make a trolling lane out of flat water, I have seen him do it, lol!
> ...


Actually 62.0125 (d) states below, per the OP's original story he was 100 yards away from him when the person in question did the donut on the fish. I think what he did was wrong but I don't see where he broke the law.

(d)â€‚No person may intentionally harass, drive, or disturb any wildlife for the purpose of disrupting a person lawfully engaged in the process of hunting or catching wildlife.


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## Mattsfishin (Aug 23, 2009)

If you really want to see something watch the vermin come out when the stripers are schooling on top. Look like a bunch of ignorant sheep following the wolf. NO consideration for anyone. Someone mentioned giving casting distance, yeh right. I cast more than most, I think most people on here jig or troll. Let them see me catch a fish and heck it is a free for all. Don't dare and fish old school with a buoy. Back off 10 to 15 feet and they are on it. I told one guy thanks for rolling up my buoy now give it to me. I like to use a buoy for a marker but others seem to think that is where the fish are. Well I guess I need more popcorn and my meds are kicking in. Maybe 2 or 3 fingers of whiskey and a hydrocodone will relax me.


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Mattsfishin said:


> If you really want to see something watch the vermin come out when the stripers are schooling on top. Look like a bunch of ignorant sheep following the wolf. NO consideration for anyone. Someone mentioned giving casting distance, yeh right. I cast more than most, I think most people on here jig or troll. Let them see me catch a fish and heck it is a free for all. Don't dare and fish old school with a buoy. Back off 10 to 15 feet and they are on it. I told one guy thanks for rolling up my buoy now give it to me. I like to use a buoy for a marker but others seem to think that is where the fish are. Well I guess I need more popcorn and my meds are kicking in. Maybe 2 or 3 fingers of whiskey and a hydrocodone will relax me.


Haha! Been there, left that.


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

Sorry I guess to stir things up. Geez, my bro and I get to fish together once every 2-3 years. Nice day, having fun. I shouldn't let a jerk spoil it, and I didn't. Like I said below, I just hope the offended party reads this and decides to chill. I meant him no harm. But to disturb feeding fish, just so no one else, especially his own clients or passengers, whatever...good lord almighty. Take away his guns, cars, knives, whatever! He has issues. I hope he can relax a bit, and enjoy the summer.


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## markbrumbaugh (Jul 13, 2010)

But, the good news is...fish are biting, water is clearing, bigger ones today. If you are too close move! Say hello to other fishermen, be polite. Share some info, non specific of course, and enjoy life which is too **** short.


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## McSpoon (May 18, 2016)

shadslinger said:


> Actually it is, TPWD has a law regarding the harassment of fish by use of a boat to disburse, harass, or herd fish in any way.
> Y'all look it up while I pop some popcorn.
> 
> And I can testify that BOI can make a trolling lane out of flat water, I have seen him do it, lol!
> ...


I like what Shadslinger posted, go fish and have fun. Be respectful but have fun. I saw Loy last Sunday and wanted to say hi without disturbing him and his clients. I Pulled in about 120 yards away at a very slow speed yelled over how it going, he replied back good in a friendly manner and said hello back and I moved on, respectfully. I hope that Loy did not feel I was to close and I could visually see it did not disturb the fishing. You never know who you could meet on the water just by being nice and saying hello, heck I have met some of the best people I know on the water, and fish in close proximity with those guys almost every weekend. So donâ€™t let one bad event on the water get the great people on this forum going at each other. 
Be safe and Enjoy

McSpoon

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## McSpoon (May 18, 2016)

And Mr Mark I am glad you didnâ€™t let that get you down, and kept enjoying the day with your Brother. Keep fishing 


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## shadslinger (Aug 21, 2005)

No problem Ricky, it was good to see you out fishing.
You have to get close and yell for me to hear you !


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## SetDaHook (Oct 21, 2010)

Years ago, I had a very rude guide cut me off on LL and we had a slightly unfriendly exchange on the water. I didn't know who he was at the time, just knew he was a guide (and no, it wasn't Loy). Fast forward a year or so and I hire a guide to show me some new areas on LL. I show up at the dock and Bingo...same guy, same boat! We made it through the day, but uncomfortable to say the least. Moral of the story is I wish I had never said anything to him in the first place and just gone on to another spot. Problem solved and lesson learned. Hope everybody has fun on the water.


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## I'llbecoastin (Apr 18, 2016)

SetDaHook said:


> Years ago, I had a very rude guide cut me off on LL and we had a slightly unfriendly exchange on the water. I didn't know who he was at the time, just knew he was a guide (and no, it wasn't Loy). Fast forward a year or so and I hire a guide to show me some new areas on LL. I show up at the dock and Bingo...same guy, same boat! We made it through the day, but uncomfortable to say the least. Moral of the story is I wish I had never said anything to him in the first place and just gone on to another spot. Problem solved and lesson learned. Hope everybody has fun on the water.


Man that is an awkward day to say the least. Did y'all discuss it at all and hash it out?


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## texasGG (Mar 12, 2007)

There is a lesson to be learned there Setdahook, should have hired LOY! Everyone just get along... I like butter on my popcorn.


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## SetDaHook (Oct 21, 2010)

I'llbecoastin said:


> Man that is an awkward day to say the least. Did y'all discuss it at all and hash it out?


In a roundabout way, yes. He asked me what kind of boat I'm running so he pretty much knew who I was. My boat is pretty distinct due to some mods I've made over the years, so it stands out. Other than that, we just fished. After he cleaned the fish, we shook hands, I said thank you (and tipped him) and away we went.


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## SetDaHook (Oct 21, 2010)

texasGG said:


> There is a lesson to be learned there Setdahook, should have hired LOY! Everyone just get along... I like butter on my popcorn.


I've been out with Loy several times and always had a great experience. I just wanted to give another guide some business and get a different perspective.


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## texasGG (Mar 12, 2007)

You've got a great attitude SetDaHook, if you ever want to fish for catfish in the winter give me a call I'll keep a seat open in my boat...


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