# No trolling motor.......



## gethookedadventures01

Well my plan was to run our Sailfish 2660 out of Galveston and bump troll some live mullet or troll some **** pops. Mainly to just to play around on a north wind off day this week. But from all the reads I guess I'm ******* in the wind without a trolling motor as far being able to troll? Would I be better off setting up and drifting? 

I'm one of those people that's well versed in fishing just haven't messed with tarpon because when it's usually calm enough to run the beach front I run deep chasing bills.


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## Permit Rat

I'm not sure I understand your question. Sure people troll for tarpon all the time, if the water is deep enough and lack of boat traffic allows for it. You just don't want to be trolling through a bunch of boats that are already anchored up on fish. Does your Sailfish have 2 engines? If they both troll too fast, try using just one at a time.....alternate them to keep the engine hours more/less equal.

The key will be to get your bait(s) to the depth at which the tarpon are actually feeding and usually this is at or near the bottom. Also remember that tarpon are inherently lazy fish and won't usually go much out of their way to pursue a bait.


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## gethookedadventures01

Permit Rat said:


> I'm not sure I understand your question. Sure people troll for tarpon all the time, if the water is deep enough and lack of boat traffic allows for it. You just don't want to be trolling through a bunch of boats that are already anchored up on fish. Does your Sailfish have 2 engines? If they both troll too fast, try using just one at a time.....alternate them to keep the engine hours more/less equal.
> 
> The key will be to get your bait(s) to the depth at which the tarpon are actually feeding and usually this is at or near the bottom. Also remember that tarpon are inherently lazy fish and won't usually go much out of their way to pursue a bait.


Ok from reading posts on here people are acting as if I will run every tarpon in the gulf off if I troll with one of my outboards. You've answered my question thank you.


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## dpeterson

*First you have to find the fish and*

this requires covering a lot of water. Looking for the concentrations of bait off the beach or further out; then set up a drift thru the bait. watch your sounder for the larger images that indicate some object. vary the depth of your baits or ****-pops. some near the bottom, some mid-depth and some shallow. with todays conditions you will be hard pressed to sight the fish. Using the troll motor will help you cover more water and probably won't spoke the fish. The use of the outboard motor is generally not used for slow trolling as this is thought to spook the tarpon. If you use the motor, locate the bait, and troll with the outboard and hookup to a tarpon, then let us know. I would love to remove the three batteries from my console and my troll motor from my boat. I was going to hit the water this morning and cruise tarpon alley until i drove down to the beach and saw the water conditions. Good luck.


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## RockportRobert

I worked a school of small tarpon a couple of years ago w/o a trolling motor. Hooked several and landed 2. It was a Suzuki 90 4 stroke, and was a very quiet motor. We were just off the 3rd bar of St. Jo.


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## gethookedadventures01

RockportRobert said:


> I worked a school of small tarpon a couple of years ago w/o a trolling motor. Hooked several and landed 2. It was a Suzuki 90 4 stroke, and was a very quiet motor. We were just off the 3rd bar of St. Jo.


Good to hear I'm running f150's I plan to kill one and just ease along slow with the other


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## gater

*Motor*



RockportRobert said:


> I worked a school of small tarpon a couple of years ago w/o a trolling motor. Hooked several and landed 2. It was a Suzuki 90 4 stroke, and was a very quiet motor. We were just off the 3rd bar of St. Jo.


Doesn't matter what the motor sounds like above the water, it exhaust below the water. If you troll through the fish on the upper coast with the outboard your probably are going to get an ear full if there are other boats around.


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## RockportRobert

Gater2 said:


> Doesn't matter what the motor sounds like above the water, it exhaust below the water. If you troll through the fish on the upper coast with the outboard your probably are going to get an ear full if there are other boats around.


That's what I've heard. Maybe less pressure on lower coast, who knows? These were also smaller fish, #30-40.


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## Scott A

Using and outboard to troll or approach tarpon on the Texas coast is a bad idea, all the way around. RockportRobert you likely had the benefit of being near the beach with enough background noise that it didn't matter much. In Nicaragua in the San Juan river they troll using outboards and it works, but that is because they are in a river where the water is moving at about 3-6 knots and is making a huge amount of noise going over rocks and structures on the bottom (been there and seen it). In typical tarpon depths in Texas, especially off Galveston you don't want to use your big motor, no matter how small it is. The professional guides don't do it and that is all you need to know to conclude that it doesn't work. If a small gas motor worked, I'm sure they'd all have one and forego the batteries. I also have first hand experience of having tried it with a little 115hp motor and it didn't work. It is a sure fire way of getting everybody ****** at you. Pressure really has nothing to do with it. A tarpon has a large swim bladder, larger than most fish (that they use to breath with)(that's also why they show up so well on a fish finder), that extends up into the back of their head. I think it is probably like holding a glass to a door to listen to a conversation in the other room. That is why they are so noise sensitive. Drifting is the way to go and it works, sometimes better than any other method, even with ****-pops.


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## Permit Rat

Scott, I've seen more than 1 video, right here on 2cool, of people trolling those **** pops and live mullet for tarpon here in So. Texas. For decades, the WR tarpon on 20 lb., was 243 lbs. and was caught trolling in Key West harbor. Capt. Bob West used one of those Atom swimming plugs with a single hook in the rear, intead of the treble.

I believe the key is water depth. Key West harbor is dredged to 32 ft. That water you mentioned in Nicaragua is pretty deep too (unless I'm thinking of another place, which is entirely possible) Water clarity might be a factor too, but it seems that So. Texas' water, at least south of POC is about like the basins in the Keys....at least this is true for the Laguna Madre. 

I'm not sure what sound does, at least in deeper water, 30 ft. or more. First, tarpon hold under the bridges in the Keys, where car and truck traffic (noise) is obvious. Perhaps worse would be the vibrations sent through the water when one of those big semis passes by. I have felt this when diving for lobsters around the bridge abuttments down there, so you know the fish feel it. Yet folks catch tarpon from under the bridges all the time.

Down here in open water with no boats around, one might think that engine noise would have a different effect, but it doesn't, as long as the operator doesn't change the rpms of his engine when the fish are near. This way, the fish become accustomed to the noise as it approaches...or as the fish approach the boat, as might be the case here in So. Texas, since the fish here are mostly all migrating and moving pretty fast. I can see where a school of tarpon would overtake a boat that was slow trolling in the same direction as they were moving.

One time in the Keys, I was running the bakcountry early one glassy morning. Off in the distance I saw the glisten of tails in the sunlight, about 500 yards away. I could not slow down because the water was too shallow. They were on a flat at the edge of a small channel that I would be turning into, right where these fish were. So keeping my rpms the same, I ran my boat to within 20 feet of these fish, which turned out to be 4 bonefish. They didn't spook until I had to turn into the channel and reduce my speed to make the rather sharp turn. So I don't think that tarpon in deep water are going to spook.....again, as long as you are idling and do not change your rpms.

This is just conjecture.....I have never trolled for tarpon. I just know that people do it successfully in the Keys and also in So. Texas, at least according to the videos I have seen right here on this forum.

PS.....we also used to drift and jig for tarpon in Key West harbor. I'm pretty sure we kept out engines running when doing so. Again, that water is 32 ft. deep and the fish were eating very close to the bottom.


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## POCsaltdog

We catch them on fly between the inside of the POC jetties and Brownsville jetties with boats flying by. Sometimes they spook, but many times they don't.


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## Montie

Scott A said:


> Using and outboard to troll or approach tarpon on the Texas coast is a bad idea, all the way around. RockportRobert you likely had the benefit of being near the beach with enough background noise that it didn't matter much. In Nicaragua in the San Juan river they troll using outboards and it works, but that is because they are in a river where the water is moving at about 3-6 knots and is making a huge amount of noise going over rocks and structures on the bottom (been there and seen it). In typical tarpon depths in Texas, especially off Galveston you don't want to use your big motor, no matter how small it is. The professional guides don't do it and that is all you need to know to conclude that it doesn't work. If a small gas motor worked, I'm sure they'd all have one and forego the batteries. I also have first hand experience of having tried it with a little 115hp motor and it didn't work. It is a sure fire way of getting everybody ****** at you. Pressure really has nothing to do with it. A tarpon has a large swim bladder, larger than most fish (that they use to breath with)(that's also why they show up so well on a fish finder), that extends up into the back of their head. I think it is probably like holding a glass to a door to listen to a conversation in the other room. That is why they are so noise sensitive. Drifting is the way to go and it works, sometimes better than any other method, even with ****-pops.


Very good points Scott A. What are your thoughts about those ridiculously loud inboard gas boats that are always blowing up schools of tarpon up and down the coast?


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## Scott A

Montie said:


> Very good points Scott A. What are your thoughts about those ridiculously loud inboard gas boats that are always blowing up schools of tarpon up and down the coast?


:biggrin:  Yep, guess that's why those are the most common tarpon boats in Louisiana....  We don't want to catch them, just scare them away -- "save the tarpon"....


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## blackjack runner

Fished Boca Grande multiple times with guides. All boats trolled/ran with their outboards. Not an electric trolling motor one. We fished deep, with bottom jigs. We used crab and sight cast to feeding tarpon, and we also fished the guts on a different occasion. The noise did not bother FL tarpon. Not sure why Tx would be different.


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## Hunter

blackjack runner said:


> Fished Boca Grande multiple times with guides. All boats trolled/ran with their outboards. Not an electric trolling motor one. We fished deep, with bottom jigs. We used crab and sight cast to feeding tarpon, and we also fished the guts on a different occasion. The noise did not bother FL tarpon. Not sure why Tx would be different.


I have also fished Boca. I saw what you saw. I cannot explain it but they do behave differently here.

The fact is that inboard boats and high voltage trolling motor set ups are expensive and a pain to maintain. We wouldn't set up specialized tarpon boats for the Texas fishery if we didn't have to. Look at the tarpon guides: they all use trolling motors. Their business would be way more profitable if they could just troll around on a four stroke outboard but they don't troll around with outboards because it almost never works.

As for inboards spooking fish...uh no. They don't.


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## Scott A

blackjack runner said:


> Fished Boca Grande multiple times with guides. All boats trolled/ran with their outboards. Not an electric trolling motor one. We fished deep, with bottom jigs. We used crab and sight cast to feeding tarpon, and we also fished the guts on a different occasion. The noise did not bother FL tarpon. Not sure why Tx would be different.


The long time Boca Grande guides use inboards. Back when the jigging controversy over there got started, they called the jiggers "As-s Grinders". There has been a long discussion that the jigger boats have in fact impacted the pass fishery and caused the fish to move out of the pass and not come into the pass as consistently or as comfortably as they have been in the past (which has negatively impacted the fishing - except for the jiggers who snag most of their fish anyway - that's why the pass jig is now outlawed and the PTTS is a thing of the past). Every single beach guide and bay tarpon guide that I know of in the Boca Grande area that runs an outboard has a trolling motor and uses it to approach fish on the beach or areas outside of the pass. I have fished Boca Grande since 1992 and pretty consistently and I've never seen a beach guide without a trolling motor. You can get "around" tarpon on your big motor but they all use a trolling motor to get "close".

The debate about the outboard vs. no outboard can go on with anecdotal comments forever, but Hunter is correct. Investments in time and money would not be made by folks with lots of time, experience and knowledge about tarpon fishing if we did not know what works and what doesn't.


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## Permit Rat

Fishing the beach and fishing in a harbor or between the jetties is like apples and oranges. Water between the PI jetties is 50 ft. deep on average. At least in Florida, the tarpon along the beaches are often in water less than 10 ft. deep. Depends on several factors, time of day, etc., but no outboard used there. Here I understand the tarpon can be moving just outside the first break (again no outboards) ....or out to 30 ft. deep (or more?)....where the main engine might be OK. Like I said, I have never trolled for tarpon, so I can't say.

In the Keys, I dumped my 2 trolling motors back in the 80's and never looked back. There, there are just too many places (confined areas of shallow water) where they will affect the fish.

Off Sanibel, I used one of the techniques Scott described. I'd run out to an area and just drift. Using my GPS I would note the direction of my drift. At night out there you can hear the fish breathing as they roll, if the conditions are calm enough. Then use the outboard to position myself about 200 yds. or more from an approaching school and calculate my drift to be on a collision course with the school. This worked like a champ on most days.


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## garyatcb

Belize, Pine Island Fl, Galveston the only time a trolling motor was used was in Galveston to reposition the boat (basically turn it) relative to the fish being played. Get in front of and in the area of the fish and set out a drift. No TM on my rig.


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## Scott A

Sorry, but I can't help but be blunt. This is my last post on this silly subject. That fact this "discussion" keeps going is getting comical. Sorry it just is. 

Bottom line, no debate - this is a Texas Tarpon board - if you are going to fish tarpon on the upper, middle or lower coast, in an outboard, get a trolling motor. There is a very good reason why all but one tarpon guide (who drifts dead bait 99% of the time anyway) have trolling motors on their outboard boats. It allows them to troll and approach tarpon within casting distance. This is also true for just about every single regular and serious amateur tarpon angler on the Texas coast as well. Otherwise, they have an inboard. This is also true in Louisiana. This is not because we all own stock in and are attempting to prop-up the share price of Minkota. Take all this silly back and forth out of it. All the hundreds of combined years of tarpon fishing experience of guides and hard core amateurs means something. If you want to tarpon fish in Texas, go buy a trolling motor and quit trying to legitimize it otherwise by all these anecdotal comments. Your success rate will go up as well. 

Sorry, I don't mean to be a horse's back side here, but this is really getting silly. If you show up without a trolling motor on your outboard, you will get cursed at, yelled at or at best, grumped at. You will not be well liked. There really is a reason for that. 

PS - this is all true whether the pro or amateur is fishing in 20 feet or 80 feet of water. Water depth is meaningless for this discussion in Texas. I could spend an hour explaining why things are different in each anecdotal situation mentioned above, but if you want to do it in Texas, buy a trolling motor. Please, end of discussion!!


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## grman

Scott - it's not that I don't believe you - we are religious about using the trolling motor and jealous of the inboards. We got yelled at over the radio this summer because we now have a bigger Minkota talon and it obscures the TM. 

My question is why? New 4 strokes are extremely quite and this "rule" has been around for a long time. What does an outboard scare a tarpon 300-400 yards away and they will swim 15 ft under an inboard to grab a bait. Science please?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## gater

*Tarpon*



grman said:


> Scott - it's not that I don't believe you - we are religious about using the trolling motor and jealous of the inboards. We got yelled at over the radio this summer because we now have a bigger Minkota talon and it obscures the TM.
> 
> My question is why? New 4 strokes are extremely quite and this "rule" has been around for a long time. What does an outboard scare a tarpon 300-400 yards away and they will swim 15 ft under an inboard to grab a bait. Science please?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sure the guides would love to use their outboards but not because of the expense and up keep of the TM. Most are bay guides the rest of the year and that TM is standard equipment.

Can you catch an upper coast Tarpon with the big outboard, sure you can, I have seen it done by one of the guides, 2-4 one day with the big motor. Is it the norm, no it is not and you will definitely get the message real quick.

I'm still think you can consistently and will prove it to myself one day when I'm that big school all alone with no other boats around.


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## Scott A

grman said:


> Scott - it's not that I don't believe you - we are religious about using the trolling motor and jealous of the inboards. We got yelled at over the radio this summer because we now have a bigger Minkota talon and it obscures the TM.
> 
> My question is why? New 4 strokes are extremely quite and this "rule" has been around for a long time. What does an outboard scare a tarpon 300-400 yards away and they will swim 15 ft under an inboard to grab a bait. Science please?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This remains the stupidest debate to ever land on this board. Sorry, but it is. okay, I'll bite - thousands upon thousands of hours of experience between guides and top recreational tarpon anglers in Texas and Louisiana who troll lures for tarpon mean nothing and they are all wrong. Good luck with your big motors. whatever.

PS - its the noise differences. Just because a 4stroke is quiet above the water doesn't mean it is below. Get in the water and figure it out yourself, but you'll have to have an inboard to compare it to.


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## tommy261

*scott a*

Guys , i dont know scott and have never met him but if you watch his videos or check out his pics; you might just learn alot. I would take his advice cause he is doing something right. I have sent him messages about tarpon fishing techinques and he has never once steered me in the wrong direction.....


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## Montie

Scott A said:


> This remains the stupidest debate to ever land on this board. Sorry, but it is. okay, I'll bite - thousands upon thousands of hours of experience between guides and top recreational tarpon anglers in Texas and Louisiana who troll lures for tarpon mean nothing and they are all wrong. Good luck with your big motors. whatever.
> 
> PS - its the noise differences. Just because a 4stroke is quiet above the water doesn't mean it is below. Get in the water and figure it out yourself, but you'll have to have an inboard to compare it to.


I thought this thread was over, but since we are continuing on...

In your thousands upon thousands of hours of experience, would you say that electric trolling motors are quieter than inboard gas engines?


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## Scott A

Montie said:


> I thought this thread was over, but since we are continuing on...
> 
> In your thousands upon thousands of hours of experience, would you say that electric trolling motors are quieter than inboard gas engines?


Great question!!! Yes, trolling motors are quieter (if used properly), but both work well. There are times the gas inboards out perform trolling motors and there are times trolling motors will out perform an inboard boat - either is a good choice. If you need to use your boat for other things, like bay fishing etc., then an outboard with trolling motors is likely the choice. If you are buying a boat just to troll tarpon, go with an inboard. There are weather conditions and times that inboards can do things that trolling motor boats can't. Plus, with an inboard, you don't have to worry about running out of battery juice. Bottom line, it is a preference.


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## Scott A

tommy261 said:


> Guys , i dont know scott and have never met him but if you watch his videos or check out his pics; you might just learn alot. I would take his advice cause he is doing something right. I have sent him messages about tarpon fishing techinques and he has never once steered me in the wrong direction.....


Thanks Tommy for having my back - in the 1980's, I was tarpon fishing off Galveston and about the only other boat I would see out there was Mike Williams. He and I still talk about the good-ol-days of the late 1980s (funny, the 1980s are the "good ol days") Back then I was renting boats to fish.

In the early 1990's, i bought a Shamrock, just because I liked the idea of an inboard. The first year I had the boat, I went to Louisiana on a whim after reading a Saltwater Sportsman article. Over there, I was amazed at how everybody cooperated, were friends and fished well together. In a two day period of time, the guys over there gave me a crash course in trolling ****-pops. That same year, I came back and smacked tarpon with ****--pops off Galveston. I think I can confidently say I was likely the first person in Texas to troll a ****-pop. I'm pretty sure none of the guides off Galveston were doing it at the time, because one of them showed up and *****ed me out about it - in his defense, he just didn't know.. I spent the next eight years fishing in Louisiana and Texas every year. One year I left the boat in LA and fished almost every weekend over there.

One thing I also learned over there was that they all knew how to do it right and if somebody showed up, they worked with them to get them up to speed fast. From that experience, I learned one simple truth about tarpon fishing.... "You can have ten boats fishing tarpon in an area and doing it right and you can all catch fish, but if you have ten guys doing it right and one guy shows up and is clueless, he can screw it up for everybody."

With that in mind, the tournaments we ran out of Galveston and now further down the coast were created with the goal of fostering a similar type of communication and cooperation among anglers. Its not perfect and the goal has not been completely realized, but at least it has helped. (we still have our occasional drama, but... we get over it).

I would rather help people learn then leave them in the dark and have them show up and mess it up because they didn't know better. We aren't going to stop people from showing up to try tarpon fishing (but unlike lots of other forms of fishing, tarpon fishing takes a lot of patience that most people don't have and most give up or lose interest) - but people showing up to try it is simply the nature of the beast - we can however minimize the impact. I catch a lot of grief for what I've done, but I think we continue to make progress.

More than happy to help.


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