# A head scratcher



## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

I am amazed how many people will attend a church year after year and go to countless bible studies but their hearts are seldom changed. Perhaps that are in love with the church or studies and not the Word of God.


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## MarkU (Jun 3, 2013)

I wonder if they think the same of their other church/bible study members?


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

MarkU said:


> I wonder if they think the same of their other church/bible study members?


Hopefully they do.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

Because in their hearts they have not made a commitment to Christ. Either that or you need a new preacher.  Satan is an angel of light it is always there trying to pull us down. Some people struggle more than others. That being said, you still need to be there for those people. What would Jesus do?
"If you don't wake up in the morning and meet the devil head on, your probably going in the same direction"


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## KeeperTX (Jul 8, 2013)

Paul the apostle told us that would happen.

So did Matthew.
_And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold._


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

Rack Ranch said:


> Because in their hearts they have not made a commitment to Christ. Either that or you need a new preacher.  Satan is an angel of light it is always there trying to pull us down. Some people struggle more than others. That being said, you still need to be there for those people. What would Jesus do?
> "If you don't wake up in the morning and meet the devil head on, your probably going in the same direction"


I was thinking along the same lines about Satan. It is more of a blinding or falling in love with a program. I heard through the grapevine that several people were disappointed that I did attend a bible study. No one ever asked me directly why I didn't attend. When finally asked I told them that for one I had already studied that book and two I was not comfortable with how the study was run. Never mind I had attended the bible study for over 11 years.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

People are also spreading gossip and rumors? No offense, but it sounds like there are several people involved in this that have their hearts and minds in the wrong place.



fishingcacher said:


> I was thinking along the same lines about Satan. It is more of a blinding or falling in love with a program.* I heard through the grapevine that several people were disappointed that I did attend a bible study.* No one ever asked me directly why I didn't attend. When finally asked I told them that for one I had already studied that book and two I was not comfortable with how the study was run. Never mind I had attended the bible study for over 11 years.


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

Rack Ranch said:


> People are also spreading gossip and rumors? No offense, but it sounds like there are several people involved in this that have their hearts and minds in the wrong place.


No offense taken. That is my point exactly. They attend year after year but they gossip behind my back and grumble.


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## Right_Hook (Sep 12, 2015)

fishingcacher said:


> No offense taken. That is my point exactly. They attend year after year but they gossip behind my back and grumble.


Sounds like an AA meeting.


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

Too many people look to the church to fulfill their spiritual needs. As long as they attend church and say I put faith in Jeses Christ, there is nothing else they need to do. How far from the truth that is.

To be a true disciple of Christ requires much. Besides being the ransom sacrifice and the salvation of mankind, Jesus main purpose was to sanctify the name of his father Jehovah. If you look at the model prayer he left for us, the first think he said we need to pray for is the sanctification of Jehovah's name, "our father who art in heaven, hallowed (or made holy, sanctified) be thy name."

The next thing he told his followers was to "Go, make disciples of peoples of all the nations....". To be a true disciple you need to follow that commission. It is not a choice, it is a command. 

When someone dedicates their lives and symbolizes that dedication with water baptism, they are giving their life to God, they do His will, not their own will. To do His will they must know, through the scriptures, what His will is. They must bring their life in harmony with His will and repent of their sins. That is why the scriptures say we must Exercise faith.... Exercising faith means their are actions that demonstrate our faith. There is no such thing as "once saved always saved."


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

shaggydog said:


> Too many people look to the church to fulfill their spiritual needs. As long as they attend church and say I put faith in Jeses Christ, there is nothing else they need to do. How far from the truth that is.
> 
> To be a true disciple of Christ requires much. Besides being the ransom sacrifice and the salvation of mankind, Jesus main purpose was to sanctify the name of his father Jehovah. If you look at the model prayer he left for us, the first think he said we need to pray for is the sanctification of Jehovah's name, "our father who art in heaven, hallowed (or made holy, sanctified) be thy name."
> 
> ...


I agree with everything you posted except the last sentence.


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

fishingcacher said:


> I agree with everything you posted except the last sentence.


Let me ask you a question. We are all sinners, but to be a true follower of Christ we must always be trying to "put on the new personality." In other words we need to try to be more Christ like. We go out and steal something, we realize this is wrong and is a sin, and approach God through Jesus Christ and pray for forgiveness. Yet knowing it is a sin we go out next week and steal again.

When we REPENT of our sins, it means we are aware of our transgression and will not repeat it. If we knowingly sin, and continue to do so, that is not "exercising faith." The ransom will not cover over deliberate transgressions. "Faith without works is dead."


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## KeeperTX (Jul 8, 2013)

It actually sounds like you might have been offended by your brother or sister. If that is the case, you need to go to them and try to resolve it.


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

KeeperTX said:


> It actually sounds like you might have been offended by your brother or sister. If that is the case, you need to go to them and try to resolve it.


I am not offended just saddened by the fact they someone would spent all the time and energy at church and bible study yet never really be changed by the Word. Of course finding a pastor to properly teach the Word is harder than you think. Fortunately I think our pastors do properly teach the Word. Even so, the Holy Spirit must open the hearts of the hearers. I remember sitting with a good friend who was going through some physical pain. I thought the message might touch her. When I asked if she felt the sermon had any application to her life she seemed like it had no effect.


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## tngbmt (May 30, 2004)

i am totally unqualified to comment on this thread
i too have been there, done that and not qualify to untie His sandal strap.

knowledge, understanding, fear of the Lord, wisdom, counsel, fortitude, piety
come Holy Spirit


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## DA REEL DADDY (Jun 7, 2005)

fishingcacher said:


> I am amazed how many people will attend a church year after year and go to countless bible studies but their hearts are seldom changed. Perhaps that are in love with the church or studies and not the Word of God.


Maybe in their hearts they are seeking the word of God, but are struggling with transgression. If they are I applaud them for seeking and pray for strength. Temptation, pride, anger, etc, are strong forces which leads to a lot of flaws.

Mathew 9:10-11

10 While Jesus was having dinner at Matthewâ€™s house, many tax collectors and sinners came and ate with him and his disciples. 11 When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, â€œWhy does your teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?â€

12 On hearing this, Jesus said, â€œIt is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 13 But go and learn what this means: â€˜I desire mercy, not sacrifice.â€™[a] For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.â€

Sorry if I got away from your question, but we should pray for those with harden hearts, as as well ours.


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## KeeperTX (Jul 8, 2013)

Jesus has given us much authority but too many are afraid to use it. They are too afraid to offend somebody or to give the slightest impression of being too prideful. Political correctness has taken too many Christians captive. This has zero to do with untying Jesus' sandal strap. Where are the men of God with a vertebra?


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## DA REEL DADDY (Jun 7, 2005)

KeeperTX said:


> Jesus has given us much authority but too many are afraid to use it. They are too afraid to offend somebody or to give the slightest impression of being too prideful. Political correctness has taken too many Christians captive. This has zero to do with untying Jesus' sandal strap. _*Where are the men of God with a vertebra?*_


Hating the sin and loving thy neighbor.


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## fishingcacher (Mar 29, 2008)

Perhaps far too often we straight-arm God and do not let him into our secret rooms?


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## DA REEL DADDY (Jun 7, 2005)

fishingcacher said:


> Perhaps far too often we straight-arm God and do not let him into our secret rooms?


I think you are right. IMO the Good Lord wants a relationship with us. He knows are needs and are actions. He wants us to turn or return to him. It is our free will and are decision to open our hearts for repentance, wisdom, direction, and salvation.

BTW nice thread sir. Thanks.


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## KeeperTX (Jul 8, 2013)

DA REEL DADDY said:


> Hating the sin and loving thy neighbor.


If that is true, it should cause us to say something or do something. Spur us into action. God so loved the world that he did something - he sent his only son. We need to stick our neck out sometimes instead of staying silent.


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## tngbmt (May 30, 2004)

we do.
ever so slightly to trigger one another's examination of conscience because we know that the Holy Spirit dwell in each of us, constantly reminding us, watching us.
DRD posted mercy is what God desire. that mercy is between you & i
we're told not to judge or we are judge by the criteria we used. smile, the transgression by our brother should trigger love & mercy (hard to remember in anger)

just because we used soft words .. doesnt mean we've forgotten how to love one another as Jesus loved us. have a blessed day


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## tennisplayer2 (Feb 6, 2008)

I would pray for those people. 

When I encounter people that have hurt me, the following verses come to my mind.

Matthew 5:43-48

â€œYou have heard that it was said, â€˜You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.â€™ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.


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## Rack Ranch (May 25, 2004)

If this is your impression you might think about surrounding yourself with a different of Christians or pray even more for the ones around you. I can tell you that the men of my church have plenty of back bone and are searching high and low to bring followers into the church.



KeeperTX said:


> Jesus has given us much authority but too many are afraid to use it. They are too afraid to offend somebody or to give the slightest impression of being too prideful. Political correctness has taken too many Christians captive. This has zero to do with untying Jesus' sandal strap. Where are the men of God with a vertebra?


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## TrueblueTexican (Aug 29, 2005)

*Church is a hospital*

Where sinners can hear the truth surrounded by other sinners - forsake not the gathering of like minds on similar journeys, yet many attend a church out of a sense of duty to the community - not to Worship God with other brethren -

Ask FIRST is why do you attend a house of worship?

As for me I go to sing praise as I imagine standing before my King someday among billions in a choir so great , the sound of praise to a worthy God echoes throughout his creation.

I go to listen to sound teaching, sometimes in agreement with what is taught, sometimes not,

I realize that just about every kind of sin is represented among that congregation, and pray that lives are changed as a result of fellowship of like minds -

There will always be an attraction for those who are there for other reasons not in line with what God teaches, they will be judged accordingly, and they are some of the same self righteous, long time members who run off people truly seeking an experience with their creator - its just a fact of the human condition.


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## WillieT (Aug 25, 2010)

TrueblueTexican said:


> Where sinners can hear the truth surrounded by other sinners - forsake not the gathering of like minds on similar journeys, yet many attend a church out of a sense of duty to the community - not to Worship God with other brethren -
> 
> Ask FIRST is why do you attend a house of worship?
> 
> ...


I go because I want to learn more about my God, Jehovah. The more I learn about Him and all His righteousness, the more my love for Him grows, and the closer my relationship with Him gets.

As I learn more about Him, and what He requires of His followers, it makes it more clear to me how much of a sinner I am. And as I learn the things I need to work on to bring my life more in harmony with His will, I can be a better servant, as I try to correct my shortcomings.


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