# Weak Drag on a MG51



## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

Hello all,

I just did a major clean and put her back together and now the drag is loose. I tighten it slow and it does seem to get stronger, but the end result is after i tighten all the way down, it still pulls easy. 

Took it apart again and checked it.. There was some lube on the drag washer.. Cleaned it.. Same issue.

Thanks


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## reelthreat (Jul 11, 2006)

The drag washers should have drag grease on them... Did you make sure the two "key" pegs on the roller inter clutch tube fit in the slot on the key washer (outside metal drag washer)?

Here are the specs...

http://fish.shimano.com/media/fishing/SAC/techdocs/en/Low_Profile/05CH51Mg_v1_m56577569830641819.pdf


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

My guess is that the key washer is upside down.


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## Bantam1 (Jun 26, 2007)

Or the pressure washers are not arranged correctly. They should be () or )(.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

we will check a bit later.. looks like I did it right, but .. it always something.

Thanks


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

Will slap a touch of grease on it.. Yes on the washer..


reelthreat said:


> The drag washers should have drag grease on them... Did you make sure the two "key" pegs on the roller inter clutch tube fit in the slot on the key washer (outside metal drag washer)?
> 
> Here are the specs...
> 
> http://fish.shimano.com/media/fishing/SAC/techdocs/en/Low_Profile/05CH51Mg_v1_m56577569830641819.pdf


Those must be #15.. Never could see the specs on the way they were oriented.. Bet thats it Bantam1


Bantam1 said:


> Or the pressure washers are not arranged correctly. They should be () or )(.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

*No Go*

Set washers right.. reel is put together correctly.. maybe the spacer / pressure washers # 15 or flatter than normal.

I have been maintaining these reels for a few years now...


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## reelthreat (Jul 11, 2006)

Captain Dave said:


> Set washers right.. reel is put together correctly.. maybe the spacer / pressure washers # 15 or flatter than normal.
> 
> I have been maintaining these reels for a few years now...


Is there any drag??? or is it just weak?


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

It will slowly get stronger, but a 3-4 # fish will pull it when it is tighten up all the way. It will not tighten up more than that.

Thanks



reelthreat said:


> Is there any drag??? or is it just weak?


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## reelthreat (Jul 11, 2006)

Captain Dave said:


> It will slowly get stronger, but a 3-4 # fish will pull it when it is tighten up all the way. It will not tighten up more than that.
> 
> Thanks


Man, you got me.... I would get a reel maintenance kit which is something like $13 and includes new drag washers from academy and try that or send it in to get repaired. Good luck


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## trout250 (Aug 24, 2005)

don't you have a dartanium drag washer in that reel, it is really thin dark colored washer it does not require very much grease, if your washers #15 are oriented right and washer #2127 and #2361 are in the stack it should tighten down. 
This is the same basic setup on all of the simano casters.
I replaced the drag washers on my old gold chronarchs with the same washer that is in your reels and I noticed that I couldn't use as much grease on them as on the old cloth looking washers.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

This is true. The onlything different is that I used the Reel grease on the washer this time. I noramlly dont do it, Even if the book says too. The drag washer I am refering to is the the first one on on the inside. Not the 2 # 15 and other washer.

I was hoping the last time out that I would were that grease out with all the 9# sheeps head that I caught..LOL

Not so, Had to use my thumb ..


trout250 said:


> don't you have a dartanium drag washer in that reel, it is really thin dark colored washer it does not require very much grease, if your washers #15 are oriented right and washer #2127 and #2361 are in the stack it should tighten down.
> This is the same basic setup on all of the simano casters.
> I replaced the drag washers on my old gold chronarchs with the same washer that is in your reels and I noticed that I couldn't use as much grease on them as on the old cloth looking washers.


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

It sounds like you have everything in it's proper place so I have to ask, are you using braided line?


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

Yes and also just switched this reel to brass..

Burned up ?


MattK said:


> It sounds like you have everything in it's proper place so I have to ask, are you using braided line?


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## fishsmart (Dec 5, 2004)

Assume the line is not slipping on the spool.

Charles


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Captain Dave said:


> Yes and also just switched this reel to brass..
> 
> Burned up ?


Did you use some sort of backing like mono or tape before you tied the braid on?

It sounds like the line might be slipping on the spool. To check just tighten down the drag, grab the line and start pulling it out, while pulling the line out look at the spool and see if it is moving.


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## Mike in Friendswood (May 21, 2004)

My guess is that MattK nailed it.


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## 5Redman8 (May 7, 2007)

I made the braid mistake once. Cleaned a friends reel and could not get the drag to stick. After tearing it apart and putting it back together 5 times.......I left the side plate off and pulled the line. Then I noticed the line was spinning and not the spool.

Thought I was loosing my mind.

Stripped the braid off and put 2 sided tape on the spool. Everything was once again right with the world!!!!

Kyle


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

Thought U guys had ne in a Homer moment...( doh ) It is not the case. straight braid as in all my reels and not spooling. It just does not have its upper end tension. does get as tough over the 3\4 mark towards the end..... 

Could it be the # 15 are flattens from tighten it down all the way ?


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## trout250 (Aug 24, 2005)

Take that sucker apart and clean the grease off the drag washers, also if you are letting any oil get on the wahers. I have a couple of bass pro saltwater extremes and if you let any oil seep out and onto the drag washers they do the same thing you are experienceing with this mg. I have never run into a problem with the drag on any of my shimanos but they are all of the older varieties.


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Do you have the Star Drag Spacer in place?


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

sure do.. took it apart 3 times.. cleaned the grease of the inner washer..



MattK said:


> Do you have the Star Drag Spacer in place?


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## Bantam1 (Jun 26, 2007)

Does your reel have the hard dartanium drag washer or the soft graphite looking washer? The soft one could have comressed slightly causing you to lose drag pressure. The hard washer could be over greased causing a drop in drag pressure too.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

*Have a look*

hard one Bantam1. I menioned it earlier that I greased it for the first time according to some shimano directions. Normally I do not grease that innser washer. I broke it down last week and took the grease off.. Hoping time and help from you fine folks would prevail..

Check out the braid that has reeled in reds up to 43 in. The reel is just not made for fish like that. The 101 Curado is a touch heavier, but handles the tougher fish much easier. I have not tried the 207 or the core..Lack of spending funds for a while..

Thanks all



Bantam1 said:


> Does your reel have the hard dartanium drag washer or the soft graphite looking washer? The soft one could have comressed slightly causing you to lose drag pressure. The hard washer could be over greased causing a drop in drag pressure too.


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Ok, I'm determined to figure this out. It has to be something simple. Pressure and friction is what makes the drag system work. When you tighten down the star drag it tightens the nut which transfers pressure to the star drag spacer, then spring washers, then clutch tube, then key washer, then drag washer, then drive gear, then the other drag washer, and finally the ratchet part of the drive shaft. When you're pulling out line the drive gear slips between the two drag washers and the amount of pressure determines how tight the drag is.

I know you asked about the spring washers being too flat but I don't think that's the problem. The spring washers allow you to adjust the amount of pressure because they flex. If they were flat you would have a drag that was either on or off with very little adjustment in between. 

I saw the video, nice. Unfortunately I can't tell if the line is slipping on the spool or not but you said it's isn't so I'll take your word for it.

Question, does the star drag ever tighten where you can't tighten it anymore or does it keep turning? 

Here's a list of all the things that I think it could possibly be besides what we've already covered:

1) You're missing something, it's possible
2) The drag washers are worn and are very thin
3) The grease you used is some NASA super zero friction stuff
4) The star drag nut is cracked
5) The threads on the Drive Shaft have corroded or are stripped
6) You forgot to tighten the drag down...just kidding
7) ???


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## Bantam1 (Jun 26, 2007)

Its hard to tell in your video if the line is slipping on the spool. I watched it 5 times and it does appear to be slipping. Make a small mark with a black sharpie on the lip of the spool. This way you will be able to see if the line is slipping on the spool. 

I think the drag washer(s) may be in need of replacment. I'll be in Houston the middle of May but thats a long time away. If you can't get it figured out send the reel to me and I will get it fixed and back to you.


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## Mike in Friendswood (May 21, 2004)

The spool does not appear to be turning in the video, just the braid. At least that is how it looks to me.

Mike


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Bantam1 said:


> Its hard to tell in your video if the line is slipping on the spool. I watched it 5 times and it does appear to be slipping.





Mike in Friendswood said:


> The spool does not appear to be turning in the video, just the braid. At least that is how it looks to me.


I watched it 20+ times and I couldn't make a definite decision.


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## Jeepmanmike (Aug 17, 2005)

How about open the side plate hold the spool with your fingers and try pulling it, just to show if your braid is spinning on spool.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

spool and braid turn as one. i will try w the side open... though i dont thnk it will matters i wiil switch all parts with another 51.. Tif needed , i will get w bantman ...


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Captain Dave said:


> i will try w the side open..


Na, don't do that. The spool will be misaligned and it could damage something. Mark the edge of the spool like Bantam suggested and tighten down the drag all the way.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

will do Matt.... i wil try when i get home this evening....thanks all


MattK said:


> Na, don't do that. The spool will be misaligned and it could damage something. Mark the edge of the spool like Bantam suggested and tighten down the drag all the way.


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## reelrprman (Apr 2, 2006)

if you hve been using it for a few years maybe the metal drag washers or your fiber washers are just worn enough that it doesn't have enough drag. call me 832 316 6879


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## reelrprman (Apr 2, 2006)

832 618 6878 opps sorry capt dave.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

Spool does not move at all... mark it and yank it hard..... reelrprman, I tried that wrong # earlier.. LOL I will give you a buzz manana.


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## 5Redman8 (May 7, 2007)

"Spool does not move at all... mark it and yank it hard..... reelrprman, I tried that wrong # earlier.. LOL I will give you a buzz manana."

* If the spool is not moving.......the braided line IS slipping around the spool.

Backing will solve your problem.*

Kyle


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

The spool and the line are as one. no movement . noda... 

sorry for the confusion


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## 5Redman8 (May 7, 2007)

So....the line is no longer stripping off the reel?


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

same issue. weak drag... marked the spool and the line and the spool turn as one.. no slippage.


5Redman8 said:


> So....the line is no longer stripping off the reel?


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## Bantam1 (Jun 26, 2007)

It has to be a thin drag washer. Thats the only thing I can think of if everything else is correct.


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## MattK (Feb 9, 2006)

Probably from all those 43" reds.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

I am going to swap those washers tonight or tom night.. will let u know... thanks


Bantam1 said:


> It has to be a thin drag washer. Thats the only thing I can think of if everything else is correct.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

LOL, I definitely do not try to land fish out of the reels capabilities.. The reel is NOT meant for fish over 30 inches on a constant basis. It is more of a ultra light bait caster. anyway, going to switch innirds now..


MattK said:


> Probably from all those 43" reds.


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## Captain Dave (Jul 19, 2006)

*issue found*

After switching part from another mg, it seems to be the brass gear drive that i just put in. The # 15 drag washers a a touch flatten as well. THe reel works like it should with the other driver gear.

Now is it the brass gear or the # 15 pressure washers ??
It is late and did not want to switch em at this time...

time to zzz....


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