# MM off-road march 12th



## Mantisworx

who is in/out?


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## B4Maz

I should be there


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## danthrc

Im in.....


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## sfleuriet

I'll be there


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## rcrona

We should be there but Hockey and baseball have started. So far no sat afternoon games but that will probably change.


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## tebone626

gotta work so we wont be there.


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## cjtamu

I want to, need to see what I can work out about getting a hall pass 3 weekends in a row. If y'all see Jimmy Avila or Cristian at on-road this Thursday, ask them about running 2wd SC this weekend. I'll try to get hold of John Payson, he asked me Saturday at RC Pro about running 2wd SC at M&M. He has 4wd SC and 1/8 also.


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## BIG DOE

You can count me in!


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## jelias

I'll probably be there. E-Buggy and possibly 1/10 4WD.


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## kstoracing

If I make it, I'll be down for 4wd and possible 2wd stadium truck or 4wd SC.

Still have to put in a request though. lol.


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## LowBlueRanger

I'm gonna make my racing debut. I'm in 4x4 sc, have a 2wd, but its not really a racer. I'm also getting a 1/8th Ebuggy going pretty soon. Going with an RC8be

What time do you guys start and finish up there usually?


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## Mantisworx

i have to be home by 6 so we usually get done around 5. depending on who shows up i am going to have to run 2w SC with 4w SC, i can probably score them seperately but with as many people that are already showing up, not sure if i can squeeze another class in.


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## LowBlueRanger

In SC, do we have to lockout reverse?


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## Mantisworx

yes


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## Zach7

ill be there e buggy and i have a 2wd stock sc if you seperate


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## B4Maz

1/10 4wd
1/8 ebuggy
1/10 2wd maybe if I can get my motor working


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## cjtamu

Nick, don't work too hard on the 2wd. If we run 2wd SC I won't run my B4, and pretty sure Steve is not going to run his 2wd this weekend also. Marcus, if we don't have 2wd buggy, can 2wd SC just take it's place and still keep the event time the same?


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## Mantisworx

thats perfectly ok with me, what about melvin and Duane? i know Duane has a SC but not sure about melvin, would you rather run 2W SC with a few buggies or keep all of the SC truck together? i saw George's SC10 run yesterday and i think it is perfectly capable of hangin with 80% of the 4w trucks. too many classes and not enough time! we desperately need and indoor track!


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## Mantisworx

and to make more confusion i now have a T4!! i got it in trade will probably let my boy run it but thats yet another class that could grow. I AM ONLY ASKING THIS QUESTION SO DONT FREAK OUT but what if we dropped e buggy and added another 10th class? it looks like we could easily have a complete 2w SC and possibly stadium. on a personal note the E buggies make my life difficult as they really do mutilate the track, i wouldnt lose sleep over it!! ONCE AGAIN IM ONLY ASKING, NOTHING AT THIS POINT WILL CHANGE!!!!

With that being said, i plan on changing the layout soon and it will be tighter with more turns and small jumps and probably less appealing for E buggies........


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## B4Maz

Its not a big deal to me if we dont have 1/8 ebuggy. I think its fun, but if we just run 1/10 thats fine with me.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Not that I come that often, but having 1/10 only wouldn't hurt my feelings either.


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## Zach7

In the sc 2wd what motors are we allowed to run? And give us a final word on the classes this weekend please marcuz


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## kstoracing

If Nick, and Steve is cool with it. there shouldnt be a problem. Most guys usually run multiple classes. 

When the Losi comes out I will have a 2wd buggy. So are we planning to run 2wd all together or lets wait to see how big the classes grow? I may get the T3 back to running also. 

If this keeps up we may have alot of different classes from both 2wd truck and buggy, 4wd buggy and even possible both sc classes. Wow. 

The only other way to cut down on time would be to increase the class size...lol. Man I need to get more practice in...lol.


Oh, off road doesnt have a stock class yet, so run which ever motor you can handle. I think they usually run 10 or 13.5. Not sure though.


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## Zach7

Well thats sucks because I have a stock 2wd slash and I'm not gonna go out there and get embarrassed so if he cuts e buggy then I won't have anything to race


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## cjtamu

You can run and win with a stock Slash motor if you drive well. Especially on LiPo or 7 cells. When you put a lot of motor in a 2wd SC it's harder to drive fast, not easier. In 2wd buggy and SC, most of us have programmed things to slow the car down. So don't be scared to run a stock Slash.

Marcus, 2wd SC v 4wd isn't a fair fight. Not worried about positions, just about the 2wd being in the way in a really competitive class, because they will not corner or accelerate anywhere near the way 4wd does. Truthfully, 2wd SC against anything isn't a fair fight LOL. 2wd buggies and ST handle so much better than a SC. 2wd SC is like driving an overpowered 18 wheeler. Wherever we put them is fine, but I don't think you can really decide anyway until you see who shows up Saturday. Might be time to start thinking about bumping the start time to 11:00 or so. That would cover 2 additional classes.


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## Guffinator

Zach7 said:


> Well thats sucks because I have a stock 2wd slash and I'm not gonna go out there and get embarrassed so if he cuts e buggy then I won't have anything to race


Zach, I used to run my stock 2wd Slash against heavily modified ones and could always hold my own.

My only suggestion Marcus is figure out what classes we're going to run and STICK TO IT.


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## Mantisworx

Zach7 said:


> In the sc 2wd what motors are we allowed to run? And give us a final word on the classes this weekend please marcuz


you can run whatever motor you want, as long as you have a 2s battery its is legal, i cant give a final on classes until we see what shows up. we already have five classes and i dont have time to add another class without dropping one. for this weekend everything will be as it always has, the only delima is where to put the 2w SC truck since it looks like there are going to be a few. As Karl says when the TLR is finally released 2w is going to blow up in a fast way so that class is not going anywhere anytime soon. the only other thing i can do is alternate classes per weekend. so this weekend could be 2w SC for the alternate class and next race day 2w buggy will take its place???? OR we can start an hour earlier but that causes confusion because quite a few people cant get there in time and i dont want to turn away racers but i cant continue to just add people in when they decide to show up. Zach as much as i love the E buggies they force me to work HOURS fixing the damage they make, since i am the only one that works on the track i have to say that it is getting old. the backside of the track never sees sunlight so its is soft and the e buggies rut the **** out of it causing huge potholes that make it hard to get anything except SC through without bucking the cars in the air. i know its offroad but its a pain. Ebuggies have 2 or three other tracks to run on and 10th scale has NONE!


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## Mantisworx

Guffinator said:


> Zach, I used to run my stock 2wd Slash against heavily modified ones and could always hold my own.
> 
> My only suggestion Marcus is figure out what classes we're going to run and STICK TO IT.


yea, yea i know!! because of that i am leaning towards just running all SC together, the track is small enough that i dont think there is going to be that much of a performance gain. at least we can try it out and see, nothing to lose that way.


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## Tobey

I'm going to try and make it. I'll bring both 2wd and 4wd SC; I'll run whichever class Willy isn't running.


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## cjtamu

Mantisworx said:


> yea, yea i know!! because of that i am leaning towards just running all SC together, the track is small enough that i dont think there is going to be that much of a performance gain. at least we can try it out and see, nothing to lose that way.


You might want to revisit that hypothesis LOL. The one time I ran my 2wd SC against the 4wd, Karl and I think James?, beat me by a lap in qualifying. I think you're right though, size-wise they're too big to be in with true 1/10 cars. Just be sure that the 4wd start in the front so it's a few minutes before they're banging on our doors.


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## wily

Tobey said:


> I'm going to try and make it. I'll bring both 2wd and 4wd SC; I'll run whichever class Willy isn't running.


Ouch!


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## Mantisworx

Wily, bout time for a 4w buggy huh?


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## sfleuriet

I think Christian was counting on running E-buggy with me this weekend. Maybe just run a rotation of classes - one weekend will include E-buggy and the next date will not. That way you guys can rotate in these other SC classes that have interest, and maybe we can put together a bigger 2WD buggy class.


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## Mantisworx

that may be the way to go, that way the only class suffering will be 2w buggy since the 1/8 scalers can race anywhere, but that still doesnt solve 2w SC??


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## cjtamu

I'm going to bring my 2wd buggy also. If I need to run it to make the class, I'll just run it instead of 4wd since we always have enough for that.


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## wily

Mantisworx said:


> Wily, bout time for a 4w buggy huh?


Maybe....only if it is orange!


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## Mantisworx

i will paint it for ya!!


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## LowBlueRanger

I'm about to buy an 8th scale mainly for these races. I think its cool to alternate a couple of classes every other race day. I guess I might have to setup my 2wd for racing. This weekend I'm only bringing 4x4 SC.


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## Mantisworx

before you drop all of that money on an 1/8 scale make sure that you will be able to go and race at the other tracks because honestly sooner or later i will more than likely drop E buggy. the extra track maintenence isnt worth it. consider 4w mod buggy its a blast and a heck of a lot cheaper! a full set of tires is around 30.00!


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## jelias

Marcus, is the damage to the track being caused on race day or are you refering to the maintenance needed to get the track ready on Saturday morning? Whether they are part of the racing program or not, 1/8 scales will continue to do damage to the track unless Mier prevents them from running on the track all the time. 

I recently got me an 1/8 scale e-buggy but I did buy it with the intention of racing the bigger tracks with the HARC folks. Racing it at M&M is a bonus for me but I will always have my 1/10 4wd. 

Also, do you know if Mier has gotten a printer for the race program?


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## Mantisworx

the damage i am refering to is mostly on race day, because of them i have to keep the track dry and let it pack in which sucks for the smaller cars. all of us are scrambling for tire choices most of the day.
i usually go up to the track on friday morning or afternoon and spend about 6 hours working on it. that dirt has some strange tendencies and i am starting to figure it out, the grounds keeper has backed off of it which is a good thing, some of the parts are rougher but most of the holes are starting to stay away. roughness isnt a problem but holes suck!

there is s printer there but Russel has to set it up and i have asked him several times to do it but he wont. if someone has a printer they want to donate that may work out better.


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## LowBlueRanger

I've already got the electrics for the 8th scale. I'll just take it up there on practice days and toy with it. I hope the owner doesnt "ban" 8th scale.....lol

My plan was to run it mostly at m&m for this year, and then next year running at the other tracks. I just wanted to get my feet wet at m&m cuz its sort of a novice track.


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## Zach7

ok marcus so what are the classes this weekend? so everyone knows what is racing


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## Mantisworx

same as always, nothing is changing at this point
kids novice
2w mod
4w mod
Short course
Ebuggy

if the 2w mod guys collectively tell me they want to run 2w SC i will run it instead but that decision will not be made until race day.


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## kstoracing

Nick, Steve, Chris

What motors you are running on your 2wd buggies? I just ordered a 10.5 for my future buggy. Thinking should I order a 13.5 or rock the 10.5. I already have an 8.5 so no problem there.


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## B4Maz

I run a 8.5


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## cjtamu

10.5 is more than enough motor, that's what Steve is running and I think he's taking a little high EPA out. I'm still running brushed, waiting for the BL system I want to get back in stock.


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## Tobey

Tobey said:


> I'm going to try and make it. I'll bring both 2wd and 4wd SC; I'll run whichever class Willy isn't running.





wily said:


> Ouch!


And I don't even know you; it's your reputation that's got me running scared...


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## sfleuriet

Yeah 10.5 is good for 2wd


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## kstoracing

Yeah, I am thinking the 10.5 should have plenty of torque to move that 22 around too. Thanks guys.


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## Mantisworx

do you have it yet?


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## kstoracing

10.5 was ordered last night. Hopefully I can get the 22 a couple of days after they release it. I pre-oredered as soon as it was available to do so. Like in December...lol.


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## Big Phil

Can we start earler so we can get 3 rounds in just running 2 sucks.


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## sfleuriet

Big Phil said:


> Can we start earler so we can get 3 rounds in just running 2 sucks.


I would like to do 3 rounds also.. but not start earlier. Lol.

Marcus said he has to be home by 6pm - what if he leaves early, and a few of us step up and call the last few mains? And bring the laptop and whatnot inside the hobby shop.. just an idea.


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## Mantisworx

its my laptop, you dont want to have anything to do with the dinosaur they have!! Phil more people keep showing up and there is just not enough time. last week we were pretty quick and because we had two heats of almost all of the classes (and didnt even have a novice class) we still barely made it. i just dont think its possible unless we start early and the problem with that is people run late and i end up having to add racers and that always creates issues. so in short i would love to but i dont see it happening. My wife is a RN at ST lukes and works nights so i either gotta be home when she leaves at 6 or meet her somewhere on the road to pick up my kids, so there isnt much i can do, i could swing leaving at 6 but i have to clean up and put things away etc etc. since i am doing it all myself i would rather not stress over it and just run two qual's. Steve dont forget I AM RACING TOO!!! im not out here just to run races and im not missing my main!!! Another issue is those STUPID house transponders they suck up more time than anything else but since MM has alot of newbies its going to be hard to get around that for a while.


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## LowBlueRanger

lol. I'm going to need a house transponder saturday. I'm going to pic my own up before next time though so bear with me....It starts around 12 right? Now you also got me researching 10th scale buggies......I just hate ball diffs.....


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## Zach7

well since there is a series race going on at the river to yall think that many people will show up this weekend?


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## Mantisworx

doesnt matter we are racing anyway!! maybe we can have three qualifiers with a smaller crowd!


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## Mantisworx

LowBlueRanger said:


> lol. I'm going to need a house transponder saturday. I'm going to pic my own up before next time though so bear with me....It starts around 12 right? Now you also got me researching 10th scale buggies......I just hate ball diffs.....


yeah ball difs SUCK especially with the power of LIPO nowadays, your only choice is the durango 410/410r and my Caster (which has three gear difs but is a prototype). BUT i have a prototype center diff that will fit the B44's and maybe the LAzer, its a couple mths out before its ready to sale though, but i think it will solve the ball dif damage by transfering power to the front when needed.

registration closes at 11:30 each week i am getting faster at getting started and would like to start this saturday at 12:15


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## sfleuriet

I understand you race with us.. I was offering to lend a hand in some way if it could benefit the race day.


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## LowBlueRanger

Mantisworx said:


> yeah ball difs SUCK especially with the power of LIPO nowadays, your only choice is the durango 410/410r and my Caster (which has three gear difs but is a prototype). BUT i have a prototype center diff that will fit the B44's and maybe the LAzer, its a couple mths out before its ready to sale though, but i think it will solve the ball dif damage by transfering power to the front when needed.
> 
> registration closes at 11:30 each week i am getting faster at getting started and would like to start this saturday at 12:15


I think I'll just run the 4x4 SC a few times, and check out the other classes. I also like the look of the 2wd buggy. Seems like they would be pretty easy to maintain, driving will be a little harder though. I'm still getting an 8th scale first. But I'm ready for my first real race. Should be fun.


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## Mantisworx

the biggest delay is start up and getting everyone registered, it just seems like no matter what someone is always late. if i could close registration at 11 we could start at noon and should be able to get three qualifiers in. what i need help with is someone calling most of a round and that gives me time to maintain marcus's and my car and i get a small break. i need someone to handle the race day track maintenence (basically just water,sweep and fill holes that are starting). Last race went smooth and i wasnt stressed out at all. the two biggest time issues are late registration and house transponders, thats an hour easily. not much we can do about the transponders at this point.


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## Mantisworx

LowBlueRanger said:


> I think I'll just run the 4x4 SC a few times, and check out the other classes. I also like the look of the 2wd buggy. Seems like they would be pretty easy to maintain, driving will be a little harder though. I'm still getting an 8th scale first. But I'm ready for my first real race. Should be fun.


Shourt course is really a fun class


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## Jason Parson

Is the track open Sunday? Thats the only day I have off this week and want to get some wheel time in.


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## Mantisworx

nope shop and track are closed on sundays.


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## wily

Mantisworx said:


> Shourt course is really a fun class


I have gotten stuck on SC....its a blast!


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## Mantisworx

yea, that new losi is looking good! Jones just got a Rango SC. im debating between and Ebuggy (not to run at M&M) and a new SC.


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## Guffinator

Mantisworx said:


> yea, that new losi is looking good! Jones just got a Rango SC. im debating between and Ebuggy (not to run at M&M) and a new SC.


The new Losi does look very nice


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## B4Maz

Team Associated SC10 4x4 video The thing turns like crazy


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## B4Maz

Some cool news is that Brian Kinwald is back with Team Associated.

Here are pics of his B4.1 painted like his 1993 RC10 Worlds Car:




























1993 Worlds:


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## Jason Parson

Mantisworx said:


> nope shop and track are closed on sundays.


Hey I guess you were up at Randy's tonight. I saw your STI in their parking lot when I was in there picking up a few things. Nice ride BTW


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## Mantisworx

Thanx, who is this?


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## Jason Parson

oh you dont know me. I just recgonize the car from ur avatar.


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## cjtamu

Marcus has an RC stalker. Ha ha ha. About to see what's up with Lajuan's car. Could be battery, could be connection, could be alternator. I'm hoping for something that's an easy fix. Hopefully see y'all before 12:00. I have to swing Jason's PT up there no matter where I am with the car.


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## nik77356

Wife's car again Chris? Shouldn't you just get her a bus pass already?


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## cjtamu

LOL. At least this time it wasn't anything she did. That car eats batteries with all the automatic and power stuff on it. Fun stuff yesterday, glad I was able to make it.


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## LowBlueRanger

I had a lot of fun yesterday. I wish I could of finished the last 2 minutes of the sc a main, but I had a great time, and met a lot of nice people. I'll be back in 2 weeks. I guess I'll have to double up on the locktite to keep the pinion from falling off but not bad for my first race.

Also, I saw a guy taking some pictures. Is he a member on here, becuase I'd like to see if he can sell me some or E-mail me some pics.


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## Big Phil

LowBlueRanger said:


> I had a lot of fun yesterday. I wish I could of finished the last 2 minutes of the sc a main, but I had a great time, and met a lot of nice people. I'll be back in 2 weeks. I guess I'll have to double up on the locktite to keep the pinion from falling off but not bad for my first race.
> 
> Also, I saw a guy taking some pictures. Is he a member on here, becuase I'd like to see if he can sell me some or E-mail me some pics.


I like to see the pictures myself.


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## Tha skinny

It was Danny that was taking the pictures.


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## B4Maz

Big Phil said:


> I like to see the pictures myself.


Dan was takin pics. He took some pics during the last race too: http://teamhoustonradiocontrol.yuku.com/topic/1244/M-M-Feb-12-Off-Road


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## Mantisworx

definately appreciate the help everyone put in, it made things go alot smoother! i am working on a new track design and hope to rebuild the track next month. i may have a fundraiser event beforehand to raise money for the bobcat,tiller and packer.

results are posted : http://teamhoustonradiocontrol.yuku.com/topic/1263/M-M-Off-Road-March-12-2011?page=-1

lots of good racing! i think i will put the 2w SC trucks in with the 2w buggies as the laptimes are pretty much the same and we can also run stadium trucks. the 2w got overwhelmed by the 4x4's. i will call the class "houston BAJA" !! Chris Jones came up with a great idea which will cut time done between heats and we will do it at the next race. as soon as your race is over ALL RACERS MUST drive their car over to the gate and immediately go to the track to turn marshall. this cuts down on getting turn marshalls on the track and getting transponders back to me! i will have someone stand at the gate and remove transponders so we can begin the next round quickly.


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## wily

sounds like yall had a good time. i was an Corpus this weekend.


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## Mantisworx

three heats of short course!


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## LowBlueRanger

Wont be long before we start running out of tables.

And what type of fundraiser are you starting to plan, I'll contribute.


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## danthrc

I had a great time racing.... Thanks for putting it on Marcus! It was good to see so many people there.
Looking forward to next race...


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## Mantisworx

LowBlueRanger said:


> Wont be long before we start running out of tables.
> 
> And what type of fundraiser are you starting to plan, I'll contribute.


it will be a track renovation fundraiser!! i will need to raise about 300.00 to cover all of the equipment that will be needed.


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## LowBlueRanger

I guess we could raffle your 1:1? Just throwing it out there. :work:


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## Mantisworx

HAHAHA!!


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## Big Phil

I have a few things to say about the race sat 1st I had a blast and i can't wait for the next race. Marcus is doing an awesome job i personally am very grateful. 2nd thing isn't going to be popular but I'm sure every racer that ran in the 1/10 4wheel A-main is thinking the same.I can't believe the 1/8th A-main wasn't ran last the track was all but shot after that race if they are going to race they should be last. Although i also gotta say when i gathered up some 1/10 racing gear i thought racing at M&M was going to be 1/10 only.


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## kstoracing

Phil, I think we aren't too far from 10th scale only, Bro. I think latest by the end of the month, especially after 22 drops. It will get bumped to accommodate.


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## sfleuriet

I guess I can't really argue with banning the E-buggies from M&M. Unless there are only 4 on the track at one time, there just isn't enough room for it to be fun. That being said... I disagree with the guys saying E-buggies cause the most damage to the track. I still believe a novice driver in a Slash who is lawn-darting and cart-wheeling can cause an equal amount of damage to the track.

I hope we don't lose too many racers - there are at least a couple that only race E-buggy.


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## Mantisworx

at the start of the Ebuggy main there was a very small pc of wood showing out of the jump before the loop ,after the race almost the entire pc of wood was exposed!! i really should have run e buggy last and i will next time for sure. its not the cart wheeling that is making the ruts its the 10lbs and 300hp thats doing it!! you gotta break some eggs to make an omelette!! if 10th scale picks up at mikes then we really are going to be pressed for time. may not replace ebuggy with anything, just throw in the BAJA class and call it a day!


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## Tha skinny

Mantisworx said:


> at the start of the Ebuggy main there was a very small pc of wood showing out of the jump before the loop ,after the race almost the entire pc of wood was exposed!! i really should have run e buggy last and i will next time for sure. its not the cart wheeling that is making the ruts its the 10lbs and 300hp thats doing it!! you gotta break some eggs to make an omelette!! if 10th scale picks up at mikes then we really are going to be pressed for time. may not replace ebuggy with anything, just throw in the BAJA class and call it a day!


bwahahahha...BAJA CLass..your stupid...lol:rotfl:


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## sfleuriet

What? HPI Baja 1/5 buggies are allowed at M&M??? LOL jk


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## Guffinator

I always have a blast racing.

Someone said we're going to need more tables, this isn't far from the truth. We were limited on pit space last weekend.


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## danthrc

Guffinator said:


> I always have a blast racing.
> 
> Someone said we're going to need more tables, this isn't far from the truth. We were limited on pit space last weekend.


Nice problem to have!


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## cjtamu

Guffinator said:


> I always have a blast racing.
> 
> Someone said we're going to need more tables, this isn't far from the truth. We were limited on pit space last weekend.


Yeah, and someone put an onroad track where we used to put our EZ Ups! Ha ha ha. Marcus, there are a lot of things we can do to make it run faster, which means we can run more classes in same amount of time. Having an impound area after the race like you said is a good start. Cut the warmup time to 2 minutes between heats. No one minute calls. You're either there for the start or you're not. No extra laps after the heat, get your car off the track and go marshal. You'll be surprised how much time it saves. Having a printer would help too. I looked yesterday, couldn't fine one I liked.


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## Guffinator

cjtamu said:


> Yeah, and someone put an onroad track where we used to put our EZ Ups! Ha ha ha. Marcus, there are a lot of things we can do to make it run faster, which means we can run more classes in same amount of time. Having an impound area after the race like you said is a good start. Cut the warmup time to 2 minutes between heats. No one minute calls. You're either there for the start or you're not. No extra laps after the heat, get your car off the track and go marshal. You'll be surprised how much time it saves. Having a printer would help too. I looked yesterday, couldn't fine one I liked.


Also I don't believe there is a need to stop everybody and call them to start by name.
So...
1. One heat finishes, every body parks their car in the impound and immediately comes out to marshal.
2. The next heat comes out and starts warming up
3. Once EVERYBODY is checked in (and still taking warm up laps), the race announcer STARTS, no need to call racers one by one - the warm up turns into the race.

NOTE* Concessions will need to be made for house transponder swapping.

Also - I think it very important that we start having print outs of the heat setups so everybody knows they are up next.


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## Mantisworx

Very good, thats kinda how they do it at mikes but they stop everyone before saying "go". but there is still going to be issues with the transponders, need to do away with them permenantly. maybe only allow them for the first two races after that you just have to have one???? im going to buy a printer for the next race, not trying to deal with Russel anymore.


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## B4Maz

I had a great time Saturday. Marcus and everyone that worked on the track did a great job. I had fun helping out Mason with his Slash. I just wish I knew more on their electronics. 

The ebuggy main was crazy. I think 1/8 can be run at MM, just not that many. Maybe 5-6 at the most. If we do just 1/10 scale, thats not a big deal for me.

1/10 4wd and SC are a blast at MM. 2wd is fun too, just need more. I gotta get my B4 fixed up.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Marcus, 

Check out how we do our races this weekend.......we've got it pretty refined for the most part. Minimal time between heats, loop goes hot at a certain time instead of calling each person to start individually, and impound or not: if you're not out there marshalling by the time the next heat starts, you're losing laps. 

Oh, and transponders are part of racing........at some point, these house transponders need to go away. I have NEVER been to a race where jacking with house transponders wasted NO LESS than a total of about 30 minutes during the race day, and then comes the beyotching about how they missed laps because they're old and don't work well!

Everybody always says, "what about the beginners??!?!?!?!?!". IMO, this is a pay-to-play sport, and the days of getting into racing for $150-200 are long gone.........it's $500+ to go get a Slash, batteries, charger, and a transponder, and that's just the way things are......harsh reality or not.

The only other alternative that I could see would be that house transponders are allowed in the beginners class ONLY, and you can't run the beginners class more than once.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Oh, and talk to Darren........he's one of the best IMO about keeping things rolling and still keeping it relaxed.


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## Guffinator

Mantisworx said:


> Very good, thats kinda how they do it at mikes but they stop everyone before saying "go". but there is still going to be issues with the transponders, need to do away with them permenantly. maybe only allow them for the first two races after that you just have to have one???? im going to buy a printer for the next race, not trying to deal with Russel anymore.


Doing away with the house transponders would speed things up a tad and make it easier on the race announcers, but the obvious downside is the added cost to racers. We have quite a few folks that do still use the house transponders. I'd hate to turn them off of racing.


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## Guffinator

Courtney Vaughan said:


> Everybody always says, "what about the beginners??!?!?!?!?!". IMO, this is a pay-to-play sport, and the days of getting into racing for $150-200 are long gone.........it's $500+ to go get a Slash, batteries, charger, and a transponder, and that's just the way things are......harsh reality or not.


This is good


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## kstoracing

We should probably suggest them getting one. Because if they go to mikes and try to race there. It may be an issue. 

We should stress that it's to their benefit to have one or to put it at the top of the list of things to get. Get the PT before the faster motor. SOmething like that.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Guff, you going to grace us with your presence at Mike's this weekend?


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## Guffinator

Courtney Vaughan said:


> Guff, you going to grace us with your presence at Mike's this weekend?


No sir, going fishing with my pops.

I'm doing the racing-every-other weekend thing


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## Big Phil

It doesnt matter if its four 1/8 buggies or ten on the track you still have guys with 2200 kv motors tearing the track apart..i know there are some racers that can do it without ripping up the track but most cant..


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## Tobey

Guffinator said:


> Also - I think it very important that we start having print outs of the heat setups so everybody knows they are up next.


Agreed, even if it's just a single hand-written page posted where everyone can see it. Knowing what order the heats are being run, and which heat you are in, will be helpful.


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## danthrc

I will chime in on the personal transponders.... It is the only ONE thing in RC that holds its value and has a solid return on investment. Everyone should by one or more. You can always sell it for near 90% of what you paid for it.

I agree with requiring a PT to race. Maybe a little slack with one newbie class until they get one.


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## kstoracing

Yeah, Newbies get a couple of races or simply limit the number of loaners to 2 a race.


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## Guffinator

kstoracing said:


> Yeah, Newbies get a couple of races or simply limit the number of loaners to 2 a race.


Can't really do that.


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## cjtamu

Every other track in town, and just about all of them in the state, require you to have a PT to count. There's a reason for that. And when those PT's get FUBAR (which they will) or walk off in someone's car, do you think Meir is going to send them off to be fixed or replaced? 'Cause that ain't cheap. Maybe make an announcement at the next race that in 4 weeks, or 6, or whatever, PT's will be required. Maybe Meir can cut them a deal through the shop. If not, we can show them where to order the MRT ones.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Like I said, limit them to newbies only, and newbies can only race that class one time. 

If someone's name shows up in the computer when you're entering them, then they've obviously already raced and they need to have a PT and get in a real class.


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## LowBlueRanger

cjtamu said:


> Every other track in town, and just about all of them in the state, require you to have a PT to count. There's a reason for that. And when those PT's get FUBAR (which they will) or walk off in someone's car, do you think Meir is going to send them off to be fixed or replaced? 'Cause that ain't cheap. Maybe make an announcement at the next race that in 4 weeks, or 6, or whatever, PT's will be required. Maybe Meir can cut them a deal through the shop. If not, we can show them where to order the MRT ones.


I dont think they currently sell PT's at M&M. What are you talking about when you say MRT ones? I'm getting ready to buy my own, so any info will be helpful before I drop the 105 bucks amain wants.


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## sfleuriet

I would recommend the tried and true older style AMB transponders. Look around for a used one in the $75 range. EBay always has some as well. Just my opinion.


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## Guffinator

LowBlueRanger said:


> I dont think they currently sell PT's at M&M. What are you talking about when you say MRT ones? I'm getting ready to buy my own, so any info will be helpful before I drop the 105 bucks amain wants.


http://www.team-mrt.com/

They seem to be a bit cheaper, but they are from overseas.


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## cjtamu

have never heard anything but good about the mrt pt, but maybe steven knows something i don't. Big drawbck is the 4 to 5 week wait. If you look on ********, rc tech, or the for sale here, people are always selling the amb.


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## rcrona

Sounds like we may have to go back to bashing. One of the main reasons why we came to M&M was the house transponders. Planning on getting transponders but have to get at least 3 and dont have thats extra $350 right now. We've already used the loaners a couple of times so with the new thinking should we just stay home. We're already bringing our own table and chairs. This is a great way to thin the out the new guys.


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## darrenwilliams

You can easily get by with just one transpnder. Buy a 6" servo extension for each car you with to race. Install extension into RX and out of the RX box. Use Velcro to attach the transponder to the car. You can then easily move the transponder from one car to the other.


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## rcrona

Also seems to me more time is spent trying to get racers back out to marshal!! My son and I marshaled at least 4 different races that volunteers had to be asked for even though there was a great turn out. Saw many racers grab their truck with their personal transponder and run back the pit tables. Their were also a couple races we had to wait for racers to decide if they wanted to show up for the race. And a race with 2 cars? Most other tracks require at least 3 to start a class? So blame us for slowing everything up because we don't have personal transponders.


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## cjtamu

darrenwilliams said:


> You can easily get by with just one transpnder. Buy a 6" servo extension for each car you with to race. Install extension into RX and out of the RX box. Use Velcro to attach the transponder to the car. You can then easily move the transponder from one car to the other.


+1. And it doesn't have anything to do with thinning out the new people, it has to do with being able to accomodate all the people that are beginning to show up. Look for a used AMB which you should be able to score for $70 to $85 or so, or the MRT which you can get new for I think $65.


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## rcrona

@ Darren
I have 3 of us racing at the same time. And with my excellent driving skillz im running with them in the novice class but need to be bumped up now that i've run there 3 times and i understand that. But just 1 transponder won't work for us.


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## kstoracing

The MRT transponders are cloned PTs. They work great and since they are cloned you have additional numbers to use if one is taken. The only draw back is that on the mylaps, or whatever is used to track lap times online. You wont be able to register you pt# if it is already in use. Otherwise it is a cheaper alternative. They are made in England I believe. If you have a AMB and wanted to use the same number you could send yours in and they would clone it.


The PT is not to thin out the racers. MnM is pretty much the only track that still use loaners. As you grow as a racer and want to race other tracks, they are not used.


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## cjtamu

rcrona said:


> Also seems to me more time is spent trying to get racers back out to marshal!! My son and I marshaled at least 4 different races that volunteers had to be asked for even though there was a great turn out. Saw many racers grab their truck with their personal transponder and run back the pit tables. Their were also a couple races we had to wait for racers to decide if they wanted to show up for the race. And a race with 2 cars? Most other tracks require at least 3 to start a class? So blame us for slowing everything up because we don't have personal transponders.


And that's being addressed with the impound table so people can come marshal without getting back to the pits. Volunteer marshals have nothing to do with total turnout, it has to do with how many people were racing in the class before. And to my knowledge there were no classes with 2 people. 2wd buggy had 3 because Duane and Melvin decided not to run and Nick's buggy was out of commission. And there was a C Main for 4wd buggy that ended with 2 cars, but started with 4.

Nobody is blaming you for slowing things up. It's just one of the things that can be changed to speed things up, along with other things that were already discussed. The fact is, house transponders DO slow things up, and they also break, go missing, and are expensive to maintain. That's why there's not a track for hundreds of miles around that still uses them. Buying PT's stinks, I need a couple more, and I'm not happy about having to drop the $ on them. But, these days they're as much a fact of life for racing as batteries and motor.


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## darrenwilliams

River Track still has house transponders for free


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## B4Maz

I know we will sort a lot of these problems out as we go along. It will be nice to run 3 qualifiers. I know we can do it from 12-5. To summarize what we need to do to make things run efficiently:

-Minimize house transponders.
-Get print outs of heats
-Impound table (So drivers dont have to leave the track to marshal the next race. Can we put it where the start gate is? Is that ever used?)
-Minimize warm up time (once everyone is checked in and enough marshals are out, just turn on the loop. )
-Take shorter breaks in between rounds


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## jelias

Quick question about the impound table.. Who will be responsble to make sure someone's $300 transmitter doesn't get bumped and knocked off the table?

My suggestion would be that someone takes the time on race day and actually document where this time is lost and why. There have been times when we've had issues with transponders checking in but these issues were associated with PTs as well as house transponders. Already we're looking at loosing at least three racers to go along with the ones that only race e-buggy that will eventually be lost. I'm sure some will say what's five or six racers anyway when we have the current turnouts.

I know turnouts are great now but what will they be in the future. It's my opinion that careful consideration should be given to any changes that are implemented that can have a negative effect on future turnouts.

I'm also glad to read that we will soon have a printer. Heat printouts are a very important part of a race program and they do help keep things moving along.


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## Guffinator

rcrona said:


> Also seems to me more time is spent trying to get racers back out to marshal!! My son and I marshaled at least 4 different races that volunteers had to be asked for even though there was a great turn out. Saw many racers grab their truck with their personal transponder and run back the pit tables. Their were also a couple races we had to wait for racers to decide if they wanted to show up for the race. And a race with 2 cars? Most other tracks require at least 3 to start a class? So blame us for slowing everything up because we don't have personal transponders.


Just so you know, I NEVER allow people to 'skip out' on marshalling. I call them on the carpet..usually (as Thayer mentioned) the lack of marshalls is due to folks racing the next round. You volunteering is much appreciated.

The delay in folks getting to the track can be directly related to the lack of printouts (which will be rectified in the future) and not being ready once their name is announced.

We do not run classes with less then 3 people, so 2 in a class has to do with how the mains were setup. However, I agree that in the future we should modify the number of racers in each heat so we don't spend time running only 2 folks.

Nobody is blaming anybody, you or other novices, and we certainly don't plan on running anybody off. At this point it's simply brainstorming on how we can work more efficiently.


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## CristianTabush

The single best thing that can be done is to have an assigned race director that is just that. Someone who shows up and just calls the race and does not have to worry about racing.

This does not mean Marcus is no longer the organizer (and this is not a negative reflection on his race calling) Marcus is doing a great job at promoting and putting this together, but a little help (perhaps paid from a cut of the entry fees) would make the program run a lot smoother and would allow you to relax and take better care of your cars on race day.

On the E Buggy thing, I understand the track getting tore up from them running on it and I understand people wanting to phase them out. That will put me out of racing temporarily at M&M but it won't keep me away. I will just have to wait to be able to buy something else to race. I would, however re-consider the position on it and I personally would volunteer to come help out the Fridays before race day to do track maintenance IF THE E BUGGIES STAY. While the cars tear the track up, it will last a day of racing, given that the track is in better shape when we start racing. The track was bad Saturday, but it was already bad before we started. Lack of maintenance (from a lack of volunteers to help and lack of tools) is what has made it terrible, not so much the larger cars. If we had a tiller and a packer, the track would last much more and run much better on race days.


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## cjtamu

The only advantage I see to not having E 1/8 is the time factor. With more people coming in to race 1/10, and M&M being the only place in town with any going on (and every other track in town having planty of 1/8 racing) if you have to cut something to meet time constraints, 1/8-E makes the most sense. I've said before, and will say again, that I don't believe they do any more damage than 4wd SC, and esp now that you have 3 heats and still growing. If we can tighten up the timing so we can still fit it all in, doesn't hurt my feelings if 1/8 stays. Cristian, if 1/8 goes, I'll loan you a 2wd car. Buggy or you can take my SC10 and do battle with Jorge ha ha ha.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Just a reminder to keep things civil here. I see nothing antagonizing yet, but threads like this can turn sour really quick.

Again, JUST a reminder........


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## Guffinator

I don't mind the 1/8 myself, and I don't believe they tear the track up any worse then anything else.

I also didn't think the track was all that bad personally, it's off road people! C'mon! Yeh, that one jump had wood exposed, it's just time to re-build. That layout has been there for a very long time.

I think by 'cleaning up' our act a little we'll find extra time.

The entire program should be more fluid.


We start at 11:30 *on the dot*
The heats become fluid. Heat 1 ends, Heat 2 begins in 4 mins *on the dot *(this is actually built into Autoscore, it can run the program without delays) - you are ready to go for your heat, you get out and warm up and BAM, the buzzer goes and the race is on. No 'minute' calls for heats. 1 minute calls are allowed in the main...and you get 1 minute.
You race, you are on the track to marshal. Period.
No break between rounds, 15 minutes between final heat and mains.


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## Guffinator

Transponders- 

Transponders need to NOT be such an issue. If you use a house transponder, it would behoove you to find who uses it before you (if anybody) and you get the module FROM THAT PERSON ON THE TRACK. We are spending time between heats waiting on people to return them, then the next person to install and get on the track. This can be done quickly between heats ON THE TRACK. Then returned to the announcer as you come out to marshal the next race.

If you SWAP your personal transponder from car to car and do not inform the race announcer ahead of your heat, you do not count that race - this happens too often.


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## cjtamu

That works Guff, but why do we need 4 minutes b/w heats? It's all electric, no engines to warm up or tune. If you cut it to 2 minutes and have 9 (I think?) heats like we did the other day, over 2 rounds you save almost 40 minutes. At RC Pro we do 2 minutes b/w heats after Round 1, rolling starts, and it works. And that's with mostly nitro. And the "find the guy with your house transponder" thing takes me back, LOL. I remember those days, and I don't miss them. But yeah, that's the best way to make house transponders work. All of that would, of course, be aided if we had printouts.


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## kstoracing

Printouts....Check.

Marshals....Check.

I think the rest will fall into place.


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## Guffinator

cjtamu said:


> That works Guff, but why do we need 4 minutes b/w heats? It's all electric, no engines to warm up or tune. If you cut it to 2 minutes and have 9 (I think?) heats like we did the other day, over 2 rounds you save almost 40 minutes. .


Honestly it was just a number I pulled out of the air. 2 minutes works for me.


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## danthrc

On a softer note: Pictures from Saturday are posted on the THRC forum. By the time you host them across a few networks, the quality is not as good as I like but they will work.


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## sfleuriet

danthrc said:


> On a softer note: Pictures from Saturday are posted on the THRC forum. By the time you host them across a few networks, the quality is not as good as I like but they will work.


There are some great shots in there


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## LowBlueRanger

Guffinator said:


> Transponders-
> 
> If you SWAP your personal transponder from car to car and do not inform the race announcer ahead of your heat, you do not count that race - this happens too often.


In the future, I plan on sharing 1 PT with 2 vehicles. What is the reason I have to let the announcer know this. I'm still a little new to this, but I'm learning.

I think some of the ideas are leading in the right direction. I mainly saw the time wasted, due to un-organization. I think the impound table is a great idea. I just dont want this turning into a "serious" race day. I just come out to kick back and run around the track with you guys. I think once you get a set system, everyone will get used to it and things will flow better.


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## Courtney Vaughan

As there is no racing at M&M this weekend and no Swagger as well, I wanted to make sure all of you guys know that you are welcome at Mikes and we would LOVE to have all of you out to the HARC race this weekend! I promise, it's not near as serious as it seems on these boards sometimes! And we would glad to run 1/10 there As well....just takes four to make a class! Short course is always a blast at Mike's and it's a world class facility, so if your available, come play with us!!!


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## sfleuriet

4wd buggy is an option at the HARC race? Heck yeah - lets get a class together.


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## Mantisworx

got my motor in today, if we can run 4w buggy that woudl be freakin awesome!


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## Guffinator

LowBlueRanger said:


> In the future, I plan on sharing 1 PT with 2 vehicles. What is the reason I have to let the announcer know this. I'm still a little new to this, but I'm learning.


That's fine, if you change transponder numbers between heats (without informing Autoscore) then it doesn't know who you are when you cross the loop. This was the cause of a few delays as people would hit the track with different transponders then they registered with.

Trust me...this will never turn into a 'serious' thing...at least not from me.


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## Mantisworx

well, just read through the past few pages as i have been out of town with the fam until now. just like it always is everyone wants to volunteer to help maintain the track but noone ever shows up to do it!! which is why i just try and not depend on anyone and just do it my self, i am out there just about EVERY friday morning or afternoon getting thetrack in decent track, i am only one person and i only have two hands! i dont think the track was in bad shape to begin with saturday. especially since i am fighting with the grounds keeper that WILL NOT LISTEN TO ANYTHING I TELL HIM TO DO!! I plan on coordinating a track renovation soon and that will certainly help the track conditions. Since i am the only one working on the track and can tell you that the E buggies tear up the track more so than any other cars point blank, nothing to argue about, its a fact. NOW with that being said, I really enjoy watching them run and dont want them to go but guys i dont get paid enough to spend 30 hours a week working on a track! and unless someone to convince Meir to give a dedicated race anouncer out of his side of the cut it AINT coming out of mine, not worth it for me.

now on the transponders: We are going to do this in steps , nothing will be changed as far as classes and such. so what we will try next race day will be printer and post race pit tables. i am only going to allow transponders in the novice class, this will be announced at the next race so that wont go into effect until the following race. if these changes get us three qualifiers than nothing else needs to be changed. 

only reason i didnt start this past saturday at noon on the dot is because of my son breaking his car at the last minute so that was my fault . 30 minutes will not make or break us we need to squeeze about an hour and some change.


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## LowBlueRanger

Sounds like a plan. I'm trying to get an order gathered up within the next day or so, a PT will be on it. I'm also going with the b44 kit. Just need to figure out what motor system to stick in it, but I guess I need to get my hands on the buggy first. I'm looking to have it ready to go the race after the next.


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## Mantisworx

i have more speed than just about anyone with my boosted 8.5, its smooth enough not to have to baby it through the infield and allows you to drive the car harder. as long as you go with a tekin RS you dont have to go with a crazy motor. since you are just getting into it i dont suggest a 6.5 or lower. to be honest a boosted 10.5 would be a perfect match for you.

Mr Crona , one way to look at this is if you have three short course trucks plus all of the support items you already have a good amount of money tied up into it( at least 1k if not more!) and another couple hundred over time should not seem out of the question especially if you are actually racing (which you are!!!) pick up a used one a mth. Please dont feel like you are your family are responsible for anything bad happening at the track, thats not the case!


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## Courtney Vaughan

sfleuriet said:


> 4wd buggy is an option at the HARC race? Heck yeah - lets get a class together.


Only takes four Steven. You bring four or more people with similar cars and it's game on.

Between you and Marcus, you're halfway there!

It doesn't get talked about much anymore, but we used to run 1/10 4wd at all the tracks. I have even seen one make the quad at the River Track!


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## Mantisworx

Chris jones Brent Collier, larry R, Phil ,Chris Totcky Jason beam, Dee will all be there saturday anyway i am sure at least four of us will be willing to run, i know for sure Jones and Brent will, so we got a class!!


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## sfleuriet

Christian.. throw together a 4wd if you can!

Hopefully Twells, Thayer, Nick Maz, and Jason C will join us too...?


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## LowBlueRanger

Mantisworx said:


> i have more speed than just about anyone with my boosted 8.5, its smooth enough not to have to baby it through the infield and allows you to drive the car harder. as long as you go with a tekin RS you dont have to go with a crazy motor. since you are just getting into it i dont suggest a 6.5 or lower. to be honest a boosted 10.5 would be a perfect match for you.


I will look into the tekin rs 10.5 system. I might just go with the 8.5t, just in case I feel the need for more power down the road. I can always gear it down a tad. Does this ESC allow tuning on the pc like the castle link?


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## Mantisworx

LowBlueRanger said:


> I will look into the tekin rs 10.5 system. I might just go with the 8.5t, just in case I feel the need for more power down the road. I can always gear it down a tad. Does this ESC allow tuning on the pc like the castle link?


yes its lightspeeds better than the castle link, "gearing down" does not work with brushless, they can actually run hotter by doing so! you basically gear it by using a temp gun. if you want less power just use your radio.


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## kstoracing

8.5 works at MnM. had it with my MMP, but opted and got a 5.5. The 55 is quick as hell but, that 8.5 had a nice amount of torque. I am running the Epics Monster HP Series. Good motors IMO.

I have two MMPs, and will try the SpeedPassion on my 22 when it arrives. MMPs are ok but I need to try another esc. The Tekin was more than I wanted to pay for right now.


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## Courtney Vaughan

Mantisworx said:


> Chris jones Brent Collier, larry R, Phil ,Chris Totcky Jason beam, Dee will all be there saturday anyway i am sure at least four of us will be willing to run, i know for sure Jones and Brent will, so we got a class!!


Almighty! I'm excited to see some 1/10 4wd action again!


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## Tha skinny

Run this weekend at harc?


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## Courtney Vaughan

Yep!!!!


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## cjtamu

Dang fellas, wish i could make. But it's the end of spring break, i haven't taken any time off yet, and i raced the llast 2 weekends. I believe i will be doing family time.


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## LowBlueRanger

I just ordered a b44, but they were all out of transponders. Does anyone have one laying around for sale?

I'm 99% sure this what I need right?
http://www.rpphobby.com/product_p/ait10r078.htm


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## darrenwilliams

That is the latest and greatest. You can pick up a slightly older model for anywhere from about $65 and up on ebay or rctech.net. I would think that most cars are running the older ones like this. I am. http://cgi.ebay.com/AMBrc-Personal-...Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53e6572b6d


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## B4Maz

Whats the plan for March 26th?


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