# alligator problems while duck hunting



## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

I'm just looking for advice....

I've been hunting public marsh around texas since I started duck hunting. Never really had any concerns about gators until I started hunting a dog. I worry about my dog like shes my kid but i guess since i've started hunting her so much, i've now noticed a lot of gators around the areas we hunt. I was told that texas parks and wildlife do some thinning of the alligator population in certain wma's. Last season i kind of ran into a personal delima on what to do if a certain situation arised. 
One morning last year we were hunting and saw a bunch of birds going down in this pothole area. After we were done hunting we went and scouted it out while driving in the boat. We turned this one corner and an alligator about 8 feet long was sunning on the bank. He didn't move as we drove within a few feet of him and luckly my dog was not looking in that direction. Well it made me a little nervous to think that gator is only about 300 yards from the area we normally hunt. I really don't want to bring my dog in an area where there are large gators, i just didn't find out this gator was there till about a month after we started hunting the area. Here's my delima...I'm not an outlaw and I always follow the safety guidelines and hunting regulations. But I would have to say that if the gator came after my dog while i was hunting that i would definitly shoot it. I'm pretty sure everyone would do the same thing. I've actually had a few people come and tell me that they would scout the area and if i see a gator to kill it and leave it. That just sounds a little cruel too me. I didn't know if i could tell parks and wildlife and see if they could trap it and remove it. But there is always a catch and i guess its because i'm hunting in its environment. Has anyone ever run into this problem?


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

You want TPWD to move a Gator on public waters so it will not get your dog? I would not make that call to them.


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## Cajuncranker (Jul 26, 2006)

Sounds like a tough situation. I would mention it to Parks and Wildlife first. If they can't help, I would either look for another place or not bring my dog . . . I personally wouldn't want to deal with a fine associated with killing a gator with our the proper tags.


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## Topwater blowup (Feb 20, 2006)

I usually will leave my dog at home durring the early months of duck season if hunting the marsh areas. Wait until they go into hibernation. Not worth the chance of loosing a companion or paying a hefty fine for shooting a gator.


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## cudacat (Dec 14, 2006)

Don't carry your dog during teal season! Be careful up until the first freeze. I think that's about all you can do.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I've seen gators in almost all of the ponds I hunt, have had them swimming in the decoys, and have even kicked one.

If everyone rode around shooting gators when they were scouting, we wouldn't have many gators. Really, anywhere in SE Texas, thinking you're not within 300 yards of a gator even if you don't see them is just naive, I don't care where you are. Fact is, they are there and killing one before teal season isn't going to change that because another will just move in.

If you are worried about gators where you are hunting, just simply leave your dog at home or go someplace else where you don't have to worry about them. You can kill birds in lots of places. Why shoot a 15 minute limit and risk losing a dog to a gator, when you can either leave the dog at home or go someplace else and shoot a few teal and have an enjoyable morning?

No matter where you go in this area, never ever ever let your dog get very far away from you or cross a deep channel to get to a bird during teal season. As a very general rule, if the dog has to swim in it, it's too deep and you shouldn't send them on that retrieve. If you see a bird fall a couple hundred yards away, you need to walk over there with your dog to make sure there isn't a random gator in a pothole over there. And I'm a firm believer that you need to have your dog under control enough to make it break off a retrieve if you suddenly deem it unsafe (like seeing a gator suddenly appear). If you don't have that kind of control, wait till big duck to bring your dog.


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## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

JDF Turtle said:


> You want TPWD to move a Gator on public waters so it will not get your dog? I would not make that call to them.


well in the area we hunt is a federal wildlife refuge. Its one of the areas you have to check in and check out type of thing. They told me that they try and thin the gators out of the areas they allow people to hunt. I just never told them about that gator because it was at the end of the season and I didn't want to bother them about it.


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## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

Capn.


Your right, and i also never bring my dog during teal season because of that exact reason. 

This all happened during regular duck season, late january.


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## wahoosdare (Mar 7, 2007)

fatrat82 said:


> I'm just looking for advice....
> 
> I've been hunting public marsh around texas since I started duck hunting. Never really had any concerns about gators until I started hunting a dog. I worry about my dog like shes my kid but i guess since i've started hunting her so much, i've now noticed a lot of gators around the areas we hunt. I was told that texas parks and wildlife do some thinning of the alligator population in certain wma's. Last season i kind of ran into a personal delima on what to do if a certain situation arised.
> One morning last year we were hunting and saw a bunch of birds going down in this pothole area. After we were done hunting we went and scouted it out while driving in the boat. We turned this one corner and an alligator about 8 feet long was sunning on the bank. He didn't move as we drove within a few feet of him and luckly my dog was not looking in that direction. Well it made me a little nervous to think that gator is only about 300 yards from the area we normally hunt. I really don't want to bring my dog in an area where there are large gators, i just didn't find out this gator was there till about a month after we started hunting the area. Here's my delima...I'm not an outlaw and I always follow the safety guidelines and hunting regulations. But I would have to say that if the gator came after my dog while i was hunting that i would definitly shoot it. I'm pretty sure everyone would do the same thing. I've actually had a few people come and tell me that they would scout the area and if i see a gator to kill it and leave it. That just sounds a little cruel too me. I didn't know if i could tell parks and wildlife and see if they could trap it and remove it. But there is always a catch and i guess its because i'm hunting in its environment. Has anyone ever run into this problem?


Hey fella.
I'm right there with yah. I live here in Beaumont and the places I hunt, I as many, deal with the same concerns you are having. I see your in southeast Texas. Give me a P.M. if you would like to discuss things. I'm open for TPW enlightenment, or a comparative legal means of preventitive maintenance...
THANKS


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

never during teal or till it cold for gator reasons and those cotton mouths also.... Just one good hit from either and,,,,,,,,, well ,,, you get the point.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

The gator I kicked was in late December. I've seen them out and about when it was way too cold for them to be, there's really never a guarantee. But, their metabolism slows down so much when they're cold that even if they're out, they represent a very minimal threat to a dog. But I would still never send my dog out into something that could be holding a gator.

The same rules still apply unless it's really bitter cold out. Never let your dog cross channels over thigh deep, don't let your dog make retrieves where you don't know exactly what they are going to encounter, and make sure your dog is always under your control. Or go hunt someplace else.


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## MajekSpec&Red (Aug 21, 2007)

I was hunting with my grandfather when we lost one of his dogs to a gator. If we are ever worried about gators in the area we never bring our dogs and retrieve the ducks ourselves.


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

fatrat82 said:


> well in the area we hunt is a federal wildlife refuge. Its one of the areas you have to check in and check out type of thing. They told me that they try and thin the gators out of the areas they allow people to hunt. I just never told them about that gator because it was at the end of the season and I didn't want to bother them about it.


_Sorry should have explained it better.

TPWD gets so many calls about Alligators that are really causing no threat to people, calls about Alligators that could harm your dog will get no response in a rural area. I do not work for TPWD but go out on calls with them about nuisance Alligators around Lake Houston. In the past 15 years 1 was relocated because construction had encroached on his area and he was standing his ground.

Your best bet would be to leave you Dog at home untill Big Duck.
_


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

like I said I do not hunt where gators are during teal BUT teal is not the time to put dog in any water... snakes and gators are no no's!


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## DogDoc (Dec 1, 2004)

So what DOES the law say you can do if you are in the blind, your dog is on retrieve, and you see a large gator headed for him? At what point (if any) is the gator considered a nuisance and/or dangerous animal that can be dealt with? Surely we are not expected to just watch? Or are we only permitted to take action if a PERSON is threatened? What if a large gator is threatening livestock? Any different than a dog?

Truly interested in an answer to this.

Steve


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## S-3 ranch (May 26, 2004)

i had one pose a real danger to us 2 years ago and after haveing the gator come up and vibrate the water in a bad way we just put a load of #4 shot steel in the head , there are so many gators there i never worryied about it . they are a problem year round don't let the first freeze thing be a rule of thumb !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! they are there year round


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I would recommend deleting that last post, as there are gw's that read these boards and they will prosecute based on posts. The gator you just described was being territorial and letting you know you were too close to her area - it doesn't sound like you were in any danger. They'll also hiss, pop their jaws, bow their backs to make them look bigger, and slap the water with their tail.

And in regards to what you can do if you feel a gator is a threat to your dog, I recommend you call your local game warden (local to the area you hunt) and talk it thru with him. It's his interpretation that will matter when you have to report that you shot one, or they find one floating a few days later.


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## justletmein (Feb 11, 2006)

DogDoc said:


> So what DOES the law say you can do if you are in the blind, your dog is on retrieve, and you see a large gator headed for him? At what point (if any) is the gator considered a nuisance and/or dangerous animal that can be dealt with? Surely we are not expected to just watch? Or are we only permitted to take action if a PERSON is threatened? What if a large gator is threatening livestock? Any different than a dog?
> 
> Truly interested in an answer to this.
> 
> Steve


The law says you may have to pay a fine to save your dog, but does that matter? I know I wouldn't think twice about it if my dog was at risk, paying a fine is the least of my concerns at that moment.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

capn said:


> I would recommend deleting that last post, as there are gw's that read these boards and they will prosecute based on posts. .


wouldn't be the first time and it won't be the last.







and he sure doesn't want pictures of it with it in his possession! OUCH! Think people.

I have a question for a few of you,,, why would you even think of putting your dog in that position? Is it that hard to retrieve a bird or two on your own? you are not looked at by others to be any less of a hunter for NOT having your High dollar dogs out dodging Gators.....


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## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

Let me clairfy...i would not bring my dog in an area that had a bunch of gators, if i noticed it before hand. I had been hunting this pond on 5 or 6 different occassions. I didn't notice him until the end of the season when i was just driving around in a cove area off of the huge pond i was hunting. It has nothing to do with me not wanting to get up out of the blind and walk into the water for a couple of birds. I did it for years before i trained a dog to hunt with me. And my dog cost me $250 and 2 years worth of hard training from myself to get her to hunt.



waterspout said:


> wouldn't be the first time and it won't be the last.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## wahoosdare (Mar 7, 2007)

Sometimes you just gotta do whacha gotta do..But you *need* to allways do the right thing......When it all boils down to it, it really seams like a personal matter. One guy might shoot to save his dog, And well, one guy might not. There will be only one name per citation. And thats how that works. I don't ask people what bag limits are on species...Its my job to know. I have heard (but don't know if its fact) that it is illegal to feed wild gators!!!! If so, that might just be your out..
j/k.


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## skinnyme (May 24, 2004)

Here's how I see it. If a gator wants to make a move on my dog, I will shoot him on site without hesitation. (I always carry some 00 buck in the front chest pocket of my waders just in case but I don't know that I'll have time to load them when the time comes) If a GW sees it go down and wants to give me a ticket, fine with me. He might as well go ahead and write me another ticket because I'll do it again if put in the same situation.

Having said that, I hunt in gator territory majority of the time but take some necessary precations. I wait to take the mut until the water temp takes a nice dip and I hunt in shin deep or less water. I never let the dogs out of sight and I dont' let them go out into deeper water.


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

A few observations and opinions, which I'm sure many of you will not enjoy. 

If you're really worried about it, leave the dog at home. On second thought, stay home yourself. Alligators eat a person once in a while, also. 

I have hunted the Texas coastal marshes and rice fields, with dogs, since you could hunt Barrows Ranch for $5 a day. I've known literally hundreds of guys who have done the same. I have been tail swiped by gators, watched a friend run over a submerged one (accidentally) with a four wheeler, trapped them, and had them come charging out of a ditch at me (because I had unknowingly "trapped" them. Virtually everywhere I have hunted, around Beaumont/Winnie/Anuhuac, southern Brazoria County, Seadrift, POC, the freshwater marshes around Refugio, have had LOTS of alligators. I have never personally known ANYONE to have a dog killed by a gator. But I know it happens, and I take steps to MITIGATE the risk. 

#1, like Cap'n says, avoid deep water. If you keep Fido away from water which is over knee deep, you are FAIRLY safe. Rice canals are the absolute worst. Never, EVER let a dog go in a rice canal. 

#2. If there is any deep water nearby, do not use your dog until the temperature drops. But this is not a very practical or useful practice here in S Texas. 

#3. Be able to control your dog and keep your eyes open. If you see a gator cruising near your blind/setup, keep the dog heeled up, tied to the blind, whatever. Especially if you have one that is brazenly helping himself to your ducks. 

#4. Beware the little guys and of the warm winter days. Big gators get big because they are very shy and have learned to avoid human activity. They are old and what passes for "smart" in the reptile world and have learned over the years that people are bad news. I'd much rather be around a 12 footer than an 8 footer, which is an adolescent, full off pee and vinegar, like a teenage boy. Gators come out on warm winter days to forage and they are likely HUNGRY as heck and their usual forage is scarce. If you see a gator over 5' long who looks as if it is hunting on a warm December/January day, it may be way more dangerous than a big one you see in September. Now it may be a little sluggish and easier to evade, but the desire to eat is probably stronger. 

#5. Do not shoot an alligator with something that won't kill it. They are very difficult to kill and most "problem gators" are cripples with .22 holes in them, shot out eyes, crippled legs, etc. As a LAST DITCH EFFORT to save a dog (or a person) I would definitely gun a gator with whatever I had in the gun, but when you do, expect a good fine, maybe some jail time. 

"I was skeered he was a gonna eat mah dog" probably is not going to go too far (and shouldn't) in court. As Capn also said, gators will be territorial. I've hunted all morning with a big one under the blind, making very unhappy noises. Also, plenty of people (like me) will do what we can to MAKE SURE you are prosecuted if you break the law in this manner. Crippled gators can become a very serious threat to young children, livestock, anything that is easier to catch than their natural prey. I will turn in anyone I witness gunning a gator in violation of the law and provide pictures,license plates, TX numbers, and depositions or court appearances as necessary to aid in prosecution. Alligators are part of the natural order of things, they are important to the health of a marsh, they are NOT yours to gun as you see fit, even if you're skeered, they belong to all the people of the State of Texas.


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## wahoosdare (Mar 7, 2007)

Levelwind said:


> A few observations and opinions, which I'm sure many of you will not enjoy.
> 
> If you're really worried about it, leave the dog at home. On second thought, stay home yourself. Alligators eat a person once in a while, also.
> 
> ...


Just curious on your opening statement: About you being sure that 
many of us would not enjoy???? Thats a broad statement, but seamingly vaige. I'm quite sure that *could *appear inappropriate to many people on this thread. I know where I stand. And I don't stand for many of us.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

Levelwind's post is right on.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

I would and will shoot any Gator attempting to make a move on mine or another's dog or a person. I will then call the GW and tell him what happened, where I'm at, etc. and if need be, take him to the gator in question and take my lumps all the same. I try and make all attempts to minimize possible contact between my animal and the lizards, but having said that, the lizard will lose every time when it comes to deciding between him or my dog, order of things or not. We have to share the same enviroment with these creatures and I understand its the natural order of things and I even enjoy seeing them on occasion, I have no problem with all that and all will be pleasent in Mother Natures world as long as her lizard friends behave themselves otherwise the peace will be broken.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

It tough not being at the top of the food chain,, this seems to put fear in many people. understanding the nature of the beast is the main problem, And I see lots of folks here that have a fear of not being at the top anymore... you don't go to someone else's house and make your rules,,,, face it.. the gators house is where your playing,, respect and Knowledge go a long way.... you guys that want to play in a gators house need to understand his rules... IT'S VERY SIMPLE!


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## mjmaxwell8 (Aug 28, 2007)

make sure your dog behaves on a commanded halt. he'll learn your way or the gator's. dont tank the gator


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

wahoosdare said:


> Just curious on your opening statement: About you being sure that
> many of us would not enjoy???? Thats a broad statement, but seamingly vaige. I'm quite sure that *could *appear inappropriate to many people on this thread. I know where I stand. And I don't stand for many of us.


Oooh. Wouldn't want to appear inappropriate! 
Sorry. I hate the way that term is used nowadays. I believe, from reading the posts on this board, that a lot of people would find my opinions on this subject somewhat offensive. Skinnyme and I have probably had the discussion before - I know how he feels and he knows how I feel and we agree to disagree. But hunting is NOT a right. It's a privelege. And IMO it BORDERS ON abuse of that right to knowingly put yourself (or your dog) in a situation, on public lands, that makes you afraid, and then to contemplate and discuss committing an illegal shooting of a protected animal, possibly robbing others of the pleasure of viewing it, and even possibly converting it from a quite benign part of nature to a dangerous monster, by crippling it.

If you believe that is in the range of possibilities with more than a freaky, miniscule chance of occurring you should STAY HOME.

That includes breaking the law banning possession lead shot while hunting ducks every time you go out, for the sole purpose of breaking ANOTHER law, because you are paranoid or too lazy to retrieve your own ducks.

I carry a large caliber handgun when I fish in Alaska. If I ever have to gun a bear, I EXPECT to be prosecuted, unless I have physical evidence of having been mauled.

About 3 people on this board (no, I don't know many of you, but I read your writings) might have a SLIGHT CHANCE of killing a gator or deterring an attack with a shotgun - and then only in the most perfect of circumstances.

If a gator takes your dog, you might possibly hear a cry from it just as it goes under. That's consistent with every attack (the three or four I know about). You and your two buckshot in your pocket will be as effective as Barney Fife when the real bad guys came to Mayberry to rob the bank. All the big talk is going to do is nerve people out and cause them to cripple alligators (which are quite curious critters).


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

Oh, another point. Be **** sure you know what you are sending your dog after when in gator company. I know of one tragedy where the dog (and possibly the owner) believed the gators head was a crippled duck (that dog was lost), and another where a friend SENT his dog after what he thought was a crippled duck - that dog just got a good hissin at but scared my friend half to death.


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## aquafowlr (May 21, 2004)

I'm with TXDRAKE on this. I'm not going to go looking for them, but I will not hesitate to take one out if the need arises. A mans got a right to protect himself and or his property. The use of deadly force is allowed.


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## duckiller (Feb 6, 2006)

> About 3 people on this board (no, I don't know many of you, but I read your writings) might have a SLIGHT CHANCE of killing a gator or deterring an attack with a shotgun - and then only in the most perfect of circumstances.


You are ignorant.

I would be willing to bet that more that 3 people on this board have killed a gator with a shotgun.


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## justletmein (Feb 11, 2006)

duckiller said:


> > About 3 people on this board (no, I don't know many of you, but I read your writings) might have a SLIGHT CHANCE of killing a gator or deterring an attack with a shotgun - and then only in the most perfect of circumstances.
> 
> 
> You are ignorant.
> ...


It would obviously have to be at extremely close range.


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I have killed several with a shotgun... but they were on the end of a line with a big freekin hook in their belly at point blank range. Steel shot to a gator's head is about the worst method for killing a gator I can think of. Just because you shoot it, see blood, and the gator goes under doesn't mean you killed it. You probably didn't.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

Personally,, I'd Rather Wrestle Them Like Tarzan And Just Plain Ol Whip Their Arrrrz!


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

> I carry a large caliber handgun when I fish in Alaska. If I ever have to gun a bear, I EXPECT to be prosecuted, unless I have physical evidence of having been mauled.


Let me get this straight? You would wait for the bear to be knawing on your scalp before feeling it was necessary to shoot it to possibly avoid prosecution? Is that what I am understanding or am I reading more into this? And you feel that you should be prosecuted if you stop or kill the bear before it gets to you or somebody in your party? So, if I am out enjoying the marsh or the tundra, I should just assume that the large carnivore that is charging or swimming towards me, my dog, my children, or people I am with, is just curious and just wait to see it's intentions before unloading rounds in it's direction? I tell ya what, you can enjoy nature as its devouring you, but I for one will be pumping lead or steel into it and wondering about it's intentions later as it lays dying or running off injured and not lose a wink of sleep, feeling that I just shot an innocent animal. I enjoy nature and all of its grand sights, but will not at the expense of enjoying it, fall victim to stupidity and also not be able to enjoy it because I feel I am no longer at the top of the food chain. It's all good!


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

I think all he's saying is that you should do your very best to prevent ever having to shoot a bear or gator, including getting the heck out of it's way.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Capn,

I am all for avoiding and doing your best to prevent a situation and I was just referring to the above situation after all other preventive measures have been taken. I try not to put myself in those types of situations knowingly, but if all known precautions have been taken and things still go bad, I will not hesitate to take action before becoming a statistic. Again, it's all good! To each his own.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

ya, please do not get into a debate with him,,, bwwahahaha


Hey Capn,, that a genius idea..! lol I wanna wrestle one still though!


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## huntinguy (Aug 22, 2005)

waterspout said:


> Personally,, I'd Rather Wrestle Them Like Tarzan And Just Plain Ol Whip Their Arrrrz!


Hey Spout ya mean like this? Granted this one is just big enough for a sauce piquant.










My motto is, where Gators play, the dog stays.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Huntin, 

I agree, nice eats their, bud.


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## huntinguy (Aug 22, 2005)

*note to all

I did NOT eat said Alligator, he was released unharmed in a beaver infested bayou on the farm..........I just made note of how I'd cook him:rotfl:


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Huntin,

Roger that, bud. Still good eats though. LOL


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

huntinguy said:


> My motto is, where Gators play, the dog stays.


Why ya want your dog to stay where the gators play?


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

> Why ya want your dog to stay where the gators play?


 He He, thats funny right their, I don't care who ya are!!


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

hunting guy .... good motto! 


Scenario: I was hunting the marsh down on the other side of the ICW at high island off to the east as you go over the bridge.... Downed ducks everywhere. I start picking them up, (watching everywhere around me in the marsh grass) as I reached out for one of the Pintails it disappeared.... what the heck! I saw nothing in the pond for the last hour..... I head for the next bird,,, bam, he's gone,,,, OH Crud! I now think I know the problem... five minute later a gator surfaced right in the middle of the pond I was standing in.. So I walked on water and headed to the Hustler and back to the camp... 

Moral of the story: leave you dog home when hunting around gator infested waters because you do NOT always see them before they attack!


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

TXDRAKE said:


> Let me get this straight? You would wait for the bear to be knawing on your scalp before feeling it was necessary to shoot it to possibly avoid prosecution? Is that what I am understanding or am I reading more into this? And you feel that you should be prosecuted if you stop or kill the bear before it gets to you or somebody in your party?
> 
> When I go into the bears habitat to fish, I assume some risk. Before he lays a paw on me, he will have some .44 cal. holes in him and be leaking pretty badly. I would HOPE not to be physically hurt by the bear. And yes I would expect a high probability of being prosecuted by the state of Alaska for gunning a bear out of season because if that weren't true, every goofball cheechako in Alaska for a week would be shooting holes in every bear that came around him. I have been bluff charged by grizzly bears. I have been run off a piece of riverbank by a sow grizzly and her cubs. Never had to gun one yet.
> 
> ...


The thing you don't understand is how little chance you stand when a ten foot bear or a large alligator actually does decide to attack you. With a bear, you may have some chance if you are extremely well armed. With a gator, behaving true to form, you have none. In the meantime, you will be maiming and possibly crippling animals that are exhibiting territorialism or curiosity by "pumping lead or steel into it and wondering about it's intentions later".

You should not be allowed off the pavement.


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## huntinguy (Aug 22, 2005)

Cap'n maybe you missed, I said that gators are good eats, my dog catches 'em and brings them too me like any good retriever would. YOUR dog won't fetch gators for you? Must not have good command of him then lol :tongue:


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Level,

Yes, yes, I know. I am a terrible person. I grovel at your feet. Your are the all knowing. I am a law breaking, all around unjust person and I should be flogged for all my sins. I'll just have to live with it. I'm sooooo ashamed. Ohhh God, How do I go on? NOT hehe ROTFLOL


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

TXDRAKE said:


> Level,
> 
> Yes, yes, I know. I am a terrible person. I'll live with it.


:headknock :headknock

Hahaha. Doubt it. Talkin about gators and dogs gets everybody worked up. As if we needed it. Come on teal season.

Nice edit Drake. Try to keep it in mind! Write yourself a note and stick it to your shotgun.

"This will not kill an alligator" hahaha.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

16 days and 9 hours plus a few... maybe we all get rid of this sicknesss by the 17th day from now. LOL


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

LW - I have a serious question for you that I need to know. After that 13 footer swam up within 5 feet of you and you turned around to suddenly see him...
































did you ever manage to get the stain in your waders out?


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## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

TXDRAKE said:


> Let me get this straight? You would wait for the bear to be knawing on your scalp before feeling it was necessary to shoot it to possibly avoid prosecution? Is that what I am understanding or am I reading more into this?


:rotfl: Well?


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

Waders were no problem. My overalls might still be in that blind. Funny story. The client brought his dog, a nice chessie. As I was leaving the boss man called out my name and so the client couldn't hear him said "keep that dog in the blind" and made the chomp chomp signal with his hand. 

I briefed the guy and he was ummh, piazzed. Whined like a baby, said that's why I came duck hunting blah blah blah. I looked at him and said "run your effing dog then. I'm tired of listening to it" We had a fast hunt and the dog did pretty good for a Chessie. Didn't bite me or anything. I was picking up and "big boy" went cruising along the far bank a couple hundred yards away. The sport was watching him in his binoculars turning white. Didn't say a WORD on the way back in. Lit into the boss who asked him, 

"didn't the guide tell you to keep the dog in the blind?" 

"Uh,yeah, I guess so"

"Get out of here. Don't come back". 

Turned out to be a really good client and a good friend. But when I tell him something, he listens up.


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## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

Levelwind said:


> With a gator, behaving true to form, you have none. In the meantime, you will be maiming and possibly crippling animals that are exhibiting territorialism or curiosity by "pumping lead or steel into it and wondering about it's intentions later".


What is the problem with that? I guess you would never know for sure, the gator may be just wanting to play with your 6yo. It has gotten pretty bad when we start defending the rights of cold blooded lizards.hwell:


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

jjtroutkiller said:


> What is the problem with that? I guess you would never know for sure, the gator may be just wanting to play with your 6yo. It has gotten pretty bad when we start defending the rights of cold blooded lizards.hwell:


They putting something in the water supply up in Crosby?


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

save the geko


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

Level,

Maybe! LOL and hey, whats the problem with Chessies? Do we have to start a whole new thread on Chessies so that me and you can debate it? This is beginning to be a hobby for me. "The Levelwind & TXDRAKE Hour"!!! I Like it! We could be like the Sonny & Cher show. Sorry, to Hijack the thread. Just thought I would throw the idea out there. Oh, by the way, my Chessie is better than all your dogs combined!! Na, na, Na, na, "Go away or I will taunt you some more"!! he heh LOL


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## capn (Aug 11, 2005)

Levelwind said:


> We had a fast hunt and the dog did pretty good for a Chessie. Didn't bite me or anything.


I'm sorry TXDRAKE cause I know this was prolly pointed out as a shot at you... but I just fell out of my chair laughing at this statement!









Now, you two are arguin and don't even see that you're both sayin the same thing, just fyi.


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

Hahaha. Couldn't resist. I think the dog was actually a Golden Rug. Purty good doggie, anyhow. haha. I like CBRS, actually. If I was 20 years younger and had an unlimited supply of tire irons I'd probably get one. Labs are just easier.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

capn said:


> I'm sorry TXDRAKE cause I know this was prolly pointed out as a shot at you... but I just fell out of my chair laughing at this statement!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


good thing their alter ego's aren't jumping in!


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## madf1man (Jan 28, 2005)

I wonder if the gators are discussing having problems with humans while they are hunting!


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

madf1man said:


> I wonder if the gators are discussing having problems with humans while they are hunting!


Nope,, they're all trying to find a hiding spot for the opener!


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## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

waterspout said:


> Nope,, they're all trying to find a hiding spot for the opener!


i think you nailed it on the head. LMAO


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## EndTuition (May 24, 2004)

Txdrake, I'm with you buddy. It's soooo simple.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

> If I was 20 years younger and had an unlimited supply of tire irons I'd probably get one. Labs are just easier.


Ok, ok, as I know it will disappoint you and probably floor ya, but I will have to agree with you on that statement. Although, my Chessie is different from most other Chessies (Thank Goodness) as he is more similar to a lab in his attitude (again thank goodness).

Ok, Level, lets find something else to have a debate on, I'm getting bored. LOL It's all good, Bud. Being able to Debate things is what this country is all about (otherwise if we lived in another country somewhere we could be shot for our opinons) and an occasional good healthy arguement (debate to be PC) is good for the soul.

Level,

it's all good and I meant no ill-will towards you. Believe me, I took nothing to heart, even if you did talk about my dog. Me and you are alot alike in the fact that we are highly opinionated and thats not always a bad thing nor is it always a good thing.

With all that said, I will see you in the funny papers.


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## TXDRAKE (Jun 24, 2004)

> I wonder if the gators are discussing having problems with humans while they are hunting!


Mad,

Thats funny right their. You guys are killing me. LOL My sides hurt from laughing. Stop it, I can't quit laughing. Momma, make the bad man stop!!!


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## wahoosdare (Mar 7, 2007)

I heard if you put a little *purple paint* on your dogs collar then,,,,wait,wait,,,,,,,no thats not right........Lets see,,,,,,,,,,,,hum,
dang it, what was that,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,anyway something to do with putting purple paint on something........Maybe a gator or a dog.............Anyway its supposed to *fix everything*............You know what I mean??
WHOOOOOOOOO AAHHHHHHHH!!!

I just had to.......Dang things allready been hijacked 3-4 times now....


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## justletmein (Feb 11, 2006)

wahoosdare said:


> I heard if you put a little purple paint on your dogs collar then,,,,wait,wait,,,,,,,no thats not right........Lets see,,,,,,,,,,,,hum,
> dang it, what was that,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,anyway something to do with putting purple paint on something........Maybe a gator or a dog.............Anyway its supposed to *fix everything*............you know what I mean??
> WHOOOOOOOOO AAHHHHHHHH!!!
> 
> I just had to.......


LMAO!!! I think if the gator has the purple paint the dog is supposed to know to stay away from it! So don't shoot them with your shotguns, just load up some purple paint balls and blast'em before the season.


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## wahoosdare (Mar 7, 2007)

justletmein said:


> LMAO!!! I think if the gator has the purple paint the dog is supposed to know to stay away from it! So don't shoot them with your shotguns, just load up some purple paint balls and blast'em before the season.


Yeah paint balls.....thats alot safer than a short handled brush or a spray can........good point.


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## jjtroutkiller (Jan 28, 2005)

TXDRAKE said:


> We could be like the Sonny & Cher show.


So which one of you is going to be Sonny and which one is Cher?:rotfl:


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

TXDRAKE said:


> Ok, ok, as I know it will disappoint you and probably floor ya, but I will have to agree with you on that statement. Although, my Chessie is different from most other Chessies (Thank Goodness) as he is more similar to a lab in his attitude (again thank goodness).
> 
> Ok, Level, lets find something else to have a debate on, I'm getting bored. LOL It's all good, Bud. Being able to Debate things is what this country is all about (otherwise if we lived in another country somewhere we could be shot for our opinons) and an occasional good healthy arguement (debate to be PC) is good for the soul.
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more, and enjoy it. Cyberworld is not the real world, take it too seriously you end up in banned camp or in an Acadamy parking lot with Psycho Trout! hahaha

How boring would it be if we agreed on everything. NO FUN!

Have a great dove opener one and all. Lord willing I'll be sitting on a NC Kansas farm pond bank with childhood friends shoving .410 shells into my Model 42 as fast as I can empty it.


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## Freshwaterman (May 21, 2004)

I visited with a game warden last weekend about this very issue. He was clear to me that alligators are protected and have the right of way. I used the example of the gator attaching my dog and he was on the gators side. If you kill one there are reporting requirements. check the tpwd site.


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## fatrat82 (Feb 27, 2006)

this thread has been hijaked about 10 times, lol.


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## Sea Aggie (Jul 18, 2005)

*Here is what TP&WD publishes on the subject:​​http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_bk_w7000_1011.pdf​​IMPORTANT INFORMATION​A person may kill an alligator in​​immediate defense of his or her life or the lives of others
​
or to protect livestock or other domestic animals from​​imminent injury or death. An
​
alligator killed under this subsection shall be​​immediately reported to the department.
​
*

*http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publications/annual/hunt/alligator/*

*Alligators Rules and Regulations*

Except when engaged in hunting, it is against the law to intentionally feed a free-ranging alligator. Alligators may be taken under any resident or non-resident hunting license. In Angelina, Brazoria, Calhoun, Chambers, Galveston, Hardin, Jackson, Jasper, Jefferson, Liberty, Matagorda, Nacogdoches, Newton, Orange, Polk, Refugio, Sabine, San Augustine, San Jacinto, Trinity, Tyler, and Victoria counties ("core" counties), and on properties in other counties for which Texas Parks and Wildlife Department has issued CITES tags to the landowner, the open season for alligators is September 10 - 30. In core counties and on special properties, no person may hunt an alligator without possessing a valid *CITES* tag on their person. *CITES* tags in these counties are issued to landowners following a site inspection and evaluation by TPWD for information about tag issuance and requirements, contact the J.D. Murphree Wildlife Management office at (409) 736-2551. In all other counties (non-core counties): 

Open season: April 1 - June 30. Alligators may not be taken during this season on any property where alligators were taken during the September season.
Bag Limit: One alligator per person per license year.
Alligators may be taken on private property *ONLY*. Alligators may be taken from public waters by all lawful means *EXCEPT FIREARMS*; however, the person taking the alligator and the taking device *MUST* be on private property.
Tagging: Upon killing an alligator, a person must:
IMMEDIATELY complete a Wildlife Resource Document (WRD). See Transfer of Wildlife Resources, which shall accompany the alligator until it is permanently tagged with a *CITES* tag;
Complete an Alligator Hide Tag Report Form







(PDF 179 KB) and mail to TPWD Headquarters, 4200 Smith School Rd., Austin, TX, 78744, along with a $20 hide tag fee (check or money order); and
Permanently tag the alligator with a *CITES* tag IMMEDIATELY upon receipt of the *CITES* tag in the mail from TPWD

Lawful hunting hours: From one-half hour before sunrise to sunset. Between sunset and one-half hour before sunrise, no person shall set any baited line capable of taking an alligator, remove an alligator from a line set, or use any means and methods other than line sets.
Means and Methods:
Hook and line (line set). *Line sets must be secured on private property.* Hook-bearing lines may not be set prior to the open season and shall be removed no later than sunset on the last day of the season. Each baited line shall be labeled with a plainly visible, permanent, and legibly marked gear tag that contains the full name and current address of the person who set the line and the hunting license number of the person who set the line. Line sets shall be inspected daily and alligators shall be killed, documented, and removed IMMEDIATELY upon discovery.
Alligator gig
Han-held snare with integral locking mechanism
Lawful archery equipment (with barbed arrow)
Lawful firearms. *IMPORTANT NOTICE:* FIREARMS MAY BE USED TO TAKE ALLIGATORS *ONLY* ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. IT IS UNLAWFUL TO TAKE AN ALLIGATOR BY MEANS OF *FIREARMS* FROM, IN, ON, ACROSS OR OVER PUBLIC WATER. Centerfire *ONLY*; rimfire *UNLAWFUL*, except for dispatch.
An alligator captured on a taking device (line set, lawful archery equipment, gig, or snare) *must* be killed *immediately*. An alligator, in public water, caught on a taking device lawfully attached to private property, may be dispatched with a firearm.
No person may employ more than ONE taking device at any time.
A line of at least 300-lb. test must be securely attached to all taking devices other than firearms.
Hook-bearing lines must be attached to a stationary object, *on private property*, capable of maintaining a portion of the line above water when an alligator is caught on the line.
Using natural vegetation on crops to conceal a blind, provided that if crops are used, no grain or other feed is exposed, deposited, distributed, or scattered in the process.
A line attached to an arrow, snare, or gig must have a float attached to the line. The float shall be no less than 6" x 6" x 8" or, if the float is spherical, no less than 8" in diameter.

*NOTE: Additional regulations apply and can be found in the department publication entitled "Alligators in Texas"







(PDF 1 MB), also available at all TPWD Regional Law Enforcement offices or by calling (800) 792-1112 9menu 5). Alligators may be sold ONLY to a licensed wholesale dealer or alligator farmer.*


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## EndTuition (May 24, 2004)

The good news is for 99.9% of us, we will never find out what we would really do, because it isn't going to happen. But just in case it does&#8230;

If I'm hunting with TXdrake and a gator decides he wants Chisel for breakfast, I don't need to have a long conversation with him concerning what he and I should do about it. Got it.

If I'm hunting with Levelwind and a gator decides he wants him for breakfast (he doesn't use a dog cause he thinks people who do are just lazy) I'm going to respect his wishes and let the gator have him, but I should expect his family to be comforted by the fact that the gator was unharmed and that's what old Levelwind (Bless his heart) would have wanted. 
Got it.

Just Kidding &#8230;..but not really.(quote from Dodge Ball) 

I think there have been some really interesting points made and it's always good to know what laws you are breaking (or not) as you protect yourself and/or your dog, but not necessarily your hunting partner.

Just Kidding, seriously.


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## awally (Mar 12, 2007)

jeez !! give it a rest already


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## Lezz Go (Jun 27, 2006)

All of this can be put to rest by using the S S S method.

Shoot

Shovel

Shutup

Kidding! LOL!!!!!!!


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