# Lennar homes (foundation cracks)



## GWMERCER (Jun 30, 2010)

Well it is supposed to be one of the best times of your life to buy a new home. No one expects to have any major problems with a new home right. So I thought... Over the past 6 months I have been hearing and seeing crack develop. The crack goes across the foundation from one side to the other. Everything from the walls inside and out side. My house has 100% rock and even rock that is +-6" thick has fractures. I don't know but I feel like I might have a long dirty battle to fight. I am having an independent engineer come out tomorrow so he can work on my behalf. We have ruled out water leaks and drainage problems so the only thing I can think of I poor construction. I am doing my homework on this so I can be prepared for anything. Just wanted to know if any 2coolers have experienced what I am dealing with?????


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## RRfisher (Mar 5, 2007)

Maybe "hot" soils. Lennar or whoever developed the site should have done soils test for your foundation design, see if you can get those. You probably have a 10 yr foundation warranty as well, hopefully they'll take care of you, going to be a pain though. If it starts to get bad start throwing around the phrase buy-back and that should get their attention. Good luck.


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## Hogsticker24 (Oct 7, 2008)

what community? i wire lennar houses on south side of town


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

Is your slab a post tension design?


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## Mont (Nov 17, 1998)

> My house has 100% rock and even rock that is +-6" thick has fractures


I am not any kind of expert on slabs, but that part really jumped out at me. It would seem to take quite a bit of extra engineering to compensate for the weight as compared to normal construction. Good luck with getting them to fix it.


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

After your engineer has done his inspection and LOTS of pictures are taken, I would recommend contacting the builder and having them come out. Email them some of the pictures so that they know it is a big issue. Texas law requires any builder to provide a minimum of 1 year warranty on buildings, so if you fall under that timeline your odds go way up for getting them to fix it. Also, review your purchase contract for warranty items so that you know for sure what it says. IF the builder does not respond quickly, contact an attorney and have him write them a letter, don't wait. Good luck.


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## GWMERCER (Jun 30, 2010)

Hogsticker24 said:


> what community? i wire lennar houses on south side of town


 Off fm1103 Cibolo Valley Ranch


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## GWMERCER (Jun 30, 2010)

WilliamH said:


> Is your slab a post tension design?


 Yes sir it is


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## Mont (Nov 17, 1998)

> Texas law requires any builder to provide a minimum of 1 year warranty on buildings


It's been revised to require 2 years of warranty now. Honestly, it's hard to believe the single most expensive thing most of us will ever buy has one of the shortest warranty periods of almost any purchase you can make.


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## GWMERCER (Jun 30, 2010)

HydraSports said:


> After your engineer has done his inspection and LOTS of pictures are taken, I would recommend contacting the builder and having them come out. Email them some of the pictures so that they know it is a big issue. Texas law requires any builder to provide a minimum of 1 year warranty on buildings, so if you fall under that timeline your odds go way up for getting them to fix it. Also, review your purchase contract for warranty items so that you know for sure what it says. IF the builder does not respond quickly, contact an attorney and have him write them a letter, don't wait. Good luck.


 Ya thanks a ton I am having a friend who has a very nice camera and she is going to come by this thursday. I also just got a name of an attorney that handled a co-workers case. He had the same issue but different builder.We will see how it goes. I meet with an independent engineer tomorrow and the builder on thursday. I have not informed them of my hiring of an engineer....


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## Brokejeep (Oct 12, 2008)

A guy up here in North Texas is going through heck now because there is NO REBAR or any other metal in his foundation.


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## Paul S (Mar 18, 2008)

Lennar has had this same problem before with slabs cracking ect. If you need a highly respected engineer for this let me know. Also the slab should have been signed off/inspected by an engineer as a pre-pour inspection.


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

GWMERCER said:


> Yes sir it is


Maybe they didn't get the tendons stressed enough.

When I bought my Lennar home in 2001 it came with a 10 year slab warranty. They gave me a package explaining everything.

Wait and see what your engineer says, it may not be as bad as it looks.


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## chapman53559 (Jun 19, 2009)

WilliamH said:


> Maybe they didn't get the tendons stressed enough.
> 
> When I bought my Lennar home in 2001 it came with a 10 year slab warranty. They gave me a package explaining everything.
> 
> Wait and see what your engineer says, it may not be as bad as it looks.


You should read all of that stuff the builder gives you. I have worked for a few in the Austin area and I have seen slab problems. The quickest way to slow down the help from Lennar is you yell Lawyer. 
Jesus is the only perfect carpenter I have ever heard of. Stuff happens and any major builder has dealt with your situation before and I promise they don't want you to have a cracked slab either.

Good luck.


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## donkeyman (Jan 8, 2007)

well you have chosen not to accept . pm ......i purchased a 170g lenner cypress tx near outlet mall..hint hint ..a lemon but i cannnot disclose all the details in public...but have no problem telliing you in publuc what i paid for was a big headache ....good luck took me two yrs to fix my prob ....and still finding um


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## donkeyman (Jan 8, 2007)

yea i got a crack that goes across my entire garage floor ...they tell me its a settlement crack ...very common ...but alll doors on that side have been re framed 2x


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## teamgafftop1 (Aug 30, 2010)

GWMERCER said:


> Off fm1103 Cibolo Valley Ranch


Which one is Cibolo Valley Ranch? There are so many new subdivisions off of 1103 it's hard to keep up. Also, have you lived in the area long?


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Paul Sitarski said:


> Lennar has had this same problem before with slabs cracking ect. If you need a highly respected engineer for this let me know. Also the slab should have been signed off/inspected by an engineer as a pre-pour inspection.


I really doubt there was a pre pour inspection. What I would really try and get is the documentation on the tendon stessing before they were cut. If this is in the Austin area or an area where there is predominant rock, it might be possible that one side of the slab is on bed rock and the other is resting in the soil substrate. This will not work, if you hit bedrock and have a portion of it resting on such you have to dig down such that the whole slab hits bedrock. Most contractors will not do this given you might be looking at 6' or so to accomplish this.


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## teamgafftop1 (Aug 30, 2010)

I know which subdivision it is now. It turns out that all of the subdivisions off of FM 1103 (pretty much everything in that area east of IH-35) were built on old farm land. All of the soil is "black gumbo". Many of us thought it was criminal to build all of those subdivisions where they did because we hunted that land for years and the soil cracks and splits constantly depending on rain and drought, etc. We aren't talking little splits in the topsoil; we're talking about cracks 8-12 inches wide and over a foot deep in some places. I would bet my bottom dollar that the large majority of the homes built in that area over the last few years will all crack eventually. Many folks who bought in the area aren't from around here and had (and still have) no idea what kind of soil the homes are built on.

Google "black gumbo soil".


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

teamgafftop1 said:


> I know which subdivision it is now. It turns out that all of the subdivisions off of FM 1103 (pretty much everything in that area east of IH-35) were built on old farm land. All of the soil is "black gumbo". Many of us thought it was criminal to build all of those subdivisions where they did because we hunted that land for years and the soil cracks and splits constantly depending on rain and drought, etc. We aren't talking little splits in the topsoil; we're talking about cracks 8-12 inches wide and over a foot deep in some places. I would bet my bottom dollar that the large majority of the homes built in that area over the last few years will all crack eventually. Many folks who bought in the area aren't from around here and had (and still have) no idea what kind of soil the homes are built on.
> 
> Google "black gumbo soil".


In that case, the slab area should have been scarified at least 3' and structural fill brought in. I would get a copy of the soils report and see how bad the P.I. of the soil is and what that Engineer recommended.


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## teamgafftop1 (Aug 30, 2010)

Just of out curiousity, is the caliche clay that's under the gumbo any better? If you go down deep enough out there that's what you hit eventually (it's probably more than 3' though).


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

These builders build houses on black gumbo all the time using post tension. Supposedly it removes the need for select fill. I ain't buyin it. This is one example of those expansive soils destroying a slab.


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

bwguardian said:


> I really doubt there was a pre pour inspection. . . . . .


When my Lennar was built I was onsite when the structural engineer was doing his pre-pour inspection. Not saying they do it every time but they do do it some.


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

IMO, the cracking most likely isn't a process or install issue. It is a design problem. Post tension or not slabs on grade (house foundations) will crack if the subsoils are bad and or compaction and moisture content is not controlled even on good soil. If I was betting, I would bet that slab was poured in the hot dry summer. The soil was dry and when it rained or you started watering your lawn the soil beneath soaked up the water and expanded causing it to heave upwards and cracking the slab. Good luck. You might want to wait to see what the builder does before the lawyer but DO NOT let any critical contractual date expire before notifying them in writing of the problem and your expectation that they make the repairs or replacement. The "buy out" language would be best coming from your counsel.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

WilliamH said:


> When my Lennar was built I was onsite when the structural engineer was doing his pre-pour inspection. Not saying they do it every time but they do do it some.


For residential that is uncommon. I would bet they saw your interest and focused the Engineer in your direction. I also bet that there was more than one house slab being poured and the Engineer probably did not look at the others. Furthermore, I bet the Engineer did not look at it in detail. I have been at it many years and can come behind an Engineer after their inspection and observe many incorrect items...items an Engineer typically will not look for/at.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

HydraSports said:


> IMO, the cracking most likely isn't a process or install issue. It is a design problem. Post tension or not slabs on grade (house foundations) will crack if the subsoils are bad and or compaction and moisture content is not controlled even on good soil. If I was betting, I would bet that slab was poured in the hot dry summer. The soil was dry and when it rained or you started watering your lawn the soil beneath soaked up the water and expanded causing it to heave upwards and cracking the slab. Good luck. You might want to wait to see what the builder does before the lawyer but DO NOT let any critical contractual date expire before notifying them in writing of the problem and your expectation that they make the repairs or replacement. The "buy out" language would be best coming from your counsel.


Actually quite the opposite is true...a post tension slab is designed to move as one. It is when you get into long structures that create issues...like 200' plus long apartment buildings for example. Also, concrete is good in compression and not tension...so if the tendons are not stressed to the designed criteria it is not good.


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## jaredt (Nov 15, 2009)

I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver. Lennar goes above and beyond our competitors in construction as well as warranty, and yes their is a pre-pour inspection as well as an inspector on site when the slab is poured, everytime. I would communicate your concerns to the builder/warranty rep and go from there.


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## SolarScreenGuy (Aug 15, 2005)

jaredt said:


> I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver. Lennar goes above and beyond our competitors in construction as well as warranty, and yes their is a pre-pour inspection as well as an inspector on site when the slab is poured, everytime. I would communicate your concerns to the builder/warranty rep and go from there.


Yes. And the warranty on the foundation is 10 years isn't it?


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## jaredt (Nov 15, 2009)

Yes sir (Old Salty), 10 years on frame and foundation.


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## RB II (Feb 26, 2009)

bwguardian said:


> Actually quite the opposite is true...a post tension slab is designed to move as one. It is when you get into long structures that create issues...like 200' plus long apartment buildings for example. Also, concrete is good in compression and not tension...so if the tendons are not stressed to the designed criteria it is not good.


So you are saying post tension slabs won't break? I don't know much about post tension slabs but do know dirt, rebar and concrete and, as you said, concrete is not good under tension. Soil expansion causes tension and if it's in the middle of any slab it will break. Post tension may hold the pieces together but won't prevent breaks. Just my .02.


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## fishtale (Aug 24, 2006)

jaredt said:


> I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver. Lennar goes above and beyond our competitors in construction as well as warranty, and yes their is a pre-pour inspection as well as an inspector on site when the slab is poured, everytime. I would communicate your concerns to the builder/warranty rep and go from there.


I work for DR Horton in Land Development and also managed construction before accepting my LD position. I built in Belmont Park (1103 & I-35), which has terrible soils when it comes placticity index (PI) and Potential vertical rise (pvr). All lots have individual soil samples taken and the structural engineer designs the foundation based on the PI and PVR. For your home to qualify for the RWC 10 year warranty, a pre-pour inspection would have been conducted by the engineer who designed it to qualify for the coverage. If their design failed they will be held liable as it will be their stamp on the design.

If I were you, I would contact the builder to access the problem. It sounds to me as if the tendons were not stressed properly, if at all. If this is the case the problem will be easily fixed by properly stressing the tendons.

I can't speak for Lennar but I'm sure they will immediatly address the problem and make sure the problem is rectified.


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

bwguardian said:


> For residential that is uncommon. I would bet they saw your interest and focused the Engineer in your direction. I also bet that there was more than one house slab being poured and the Engineer probably did not look at the others. Furthermore, I bet the Engineer did not look at it in detail. I have been at it many years and can come behind an Engineer after their inspection and observe many incorrect items...items an Engineer typically will not look for/at.


I even have a set of the sealed foundation plans. He didn't come out just because of me. You sound like one of those architect's always trying to paint us engineers in a bad light, until you need us. LOL . . . .


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## fishtale (Aug 24, 2006)

bwguardian said:


> For residential that is uncommon. I would bet they saw your interest and focused the Engineer in your direction. I also bet that there was more than one house slab being poured and the Engineer probably did not look at the others. Furthermore, I bet the Engineer did not look at it in detail. I have been at it many years and can come behind an Engineer after their inspection and observe many incorrect items...items an Engineer typically will not look for/at.


Are you a structual engineer?


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## fishtale (Aug 24, 2006)

fishtale said:


> Are you a structual engineer?


I didn't think so your honor, no further questions!!!


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## deke (Oct 5, 2004)

jaredt said:


> I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver. Lennar goes above and beyond our competitors in construction as well as warranty, and yes their is a pre-pour inspection as well as an inspector on site when the slab is poured, everytime. I would communicate your concerns to the builder/warranty rep and go from there.


X2. You have a warranty, and should call the builder. They will send out an engineer. DO NOT call a lawyer! If you have any questions PM me, I am in the foundation repair industry.


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## SolarScreenGuy (Aug 15, 2005)

Having been in the new home building industry for about 13 years as a salesman, I can tell all of the "armchair building experts" here that required procedures by all builders when it comes to foundations are very rarely compromised. Too much money involved to get sloppy. Heads roll when an incident occurs no matter how slight it might be. I'm not saying it never happens, but it is rare.


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## fishtale (Aug 24, 2006)

Old Salty said:


> Having been in the new home building industry for about 13 years as a salesman, I can tell all of the "armchair building experts" here that required procedures by all builders when it comes to foundations are very rarely compromised. Too much money involved to get sloppy. Heads roll when an incident occurs no matter how slight it might be. I'm not saying it never happens, but it is rare.


You are so right Salty...Here's the process. On every lot a soil sample is taken...from there it is sent to a lab to determine the PI and PVR, once the PI and PVR is determined it is sent to the structural engineer to design the foundation based on the labs findings of the PI and PVR. The structural engineer then will draw up a foundation plan specifically designed to meet the structural necessity to withstand any movement in soils (assuming that the homeowner maintains the simple requirements of keeping the periameter of the foundation moist, etc...) From there the foundation plan is sent to the builder to install exactly what the engineer has designed. The next step will be for the engineer that designed the foundation to preform a pre pour inspection to determine if the builder has installed exactly what the engineer has designed. Most often, if not in the county, which the home in question is not, the city (Cibolo or Schertz) will come out and preform their own inspection to insure that all requirements are met. Once all inspections have passed the foundation is ready to pour.

Trust me, as Salty has said, this step in the building process is not taken lightly and is the "foundation" for the remainder of the construction process.

I have been in this business for over 10 years and have never seen a foundation fail. If on did happen to fail you're covered by RWC or another third party insurance company who will make any necessary repairs to fix the problem.

Based on the current situation from the OP, it sounds to me as if the tendons were not stressed properly, if at all.

Before you waste your money on an attorney contact the builder as it is written in your contract that any issues such as this will go to mediation, and therefore any legal fees you incur before this will be wasted money.

I trust that it will be made right, you just need to go through the proper procedures.

Best of luck to you, I wouldn't worry too much though!!!


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## RRTex (Jun 21, 2010)

They (Lennar) had that same problem in Hutto. Soil conditions are the same. Here is the link the home owners put up: http://www.searchhutto.com/huttoparke/


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## fishtale (Aug 24, 2006)

The problem I see in the one (foundation) picture is a blow out of the brick lug, very common and easily repaired, not a problem with the foundation itself. Nail pops and settlement cracks, very common. It looks to me in most of the pictures that they are addressing the problems. Show me some pictures of a real problem, such as a crack across the foundation. I don't see anything but a bunch of homeowners who don't understand settlement.


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## CHARLIE (Jun 2, 2004)

Foundation cracked. Now what does that mean heck they all have cracks. How bad ? 
I bet an engineer was around to inspect the steel in the slab, beam sizes and the concrete before the pour. Contact the builder. The engineer would not sign off on it unless it was correct. But in every type of business out there "things happen"

Charlie


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## kinja (May 21, 2004)

Hope its rectified quickly and cheaply. My first house(not Lennar) was a nightmare. We had to hire an attorney, engineers, etc. I paid for all plus the foundation repair and all building repairs as the builder was not moving. So I'm out 72k or so prior to trial. Cannot go to trial due to arbitration clause. Long story short, the slab was never tensioned. Arbitor ruled in my favor. Had all expenses reimbursed plus plus. Ended up selling the house for about 40% more than I paid as the buyer loved the fact that it already had problems and was repaired correctly. Granted, this was in 2001 before the housing bust.

My wife shed a lot of tears, and I was under a lot of stress but the arrogance of the builder was unreal. -t


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## Paul S (Mar 18, 2008)

Fishtale is correct like him I have been doing this for a couple of decades and their is no excuse for slabs to have this problem even if the house needed to be on piers or pilings (DO IT). you will always see cracks but most are due to drying and speed of drying 99% of the cracks you see are superficial and only a few millimeters deep. now if you can go stick a penny, nickel or something in the crack something isnt right. it could have been as simple as not having the concrete right. and even after being around it for a while you will notice sometimes inspectors never even get out of their cars!!! I actually do all of our own 3rd party frame, windstorm, slab inspections....because we dont rely on the proper people inspect correctly.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

HydraSports said:


> So you are saying post tension slabs won't break? I don't know much about post tension slabs but do know dirt, rebar and concrete and, as you said, concrete is not good under tension. Soil expansion causes tension and if it's in the middle of any slab it will break. Post tension may hold the pieces together but won't prevent breaks. Just my .02.


No, concrete will get harder and crack over time...period. The theory with post tension slabs is that they are stressed with alot of tension to put the slab into compression and should move as one. For a small slab such as a residence it works. Now, you take a three story 200' plus building and you can see where the problems might start.

What I am saying is that if the tendons were not stressed correctly before they were cut and the P.I. of the soil is say over 42 it could create some issues.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

jaredt said:


> I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver. Lennar goes above and beyond our competitors in construction as well as warranty, and yes their is a pre-pour inspection as well as an inspector on site when the slab is poured, everytime. I would communicate your concerns to the builder/warranty rep and go from there.


I have yet to see an Engineer check for slab depth in all the years I have been at it. Just because you have an inspector or Engineer there for a pre pour doesn't hold much water...what is observed and corrected does.


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## Barbarian (Feb 12, 2009)

On every house in the Houston area (assume San Antonio is the same), Lennar has an engineering firm that draws up the foundation plans for every house according to soil test and other things. Beam depths vary, rebar quantity and size varies and cable quantity and placement varies from house to house even in the same subdivision. That engineering firm then comes out prior to the pour and inspects the work. They then send a 'pour monitor' to the site in inspect the job while the concrete is being poured. They are considered independent from Lennar since they are help somewhat accountable also. Things still can happen and they do, but Lennar and most builders take their foundations very serious and go through great lengths to make sure they are done right. There has been a couple of subdivision around the Houston area that were built in some bad ground that was not accounted for properly and settlement became a huge problem. All of the builders involved took care of the home owner. I've known of multiple instances where they had to add pier holes to/under an existing house and couple of those the builder did buy the home back. 

Your house should have a 10 warranty on the foundation and Lennar is a very reputable company from what I have experienced and I would expect them to make sure you are happy. I will suggest you focus your conversations with Lennar on your structure and settlement issues and not the crack. Cracks in concrete are very common and are very over blown by the amateur eye. If the concrete was bad, there would be many other issues going on and most would have happened long before you moved in.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

WilliamH said:


> I even have a set of the sealed foundation plans. He didn't come out just because of me. You sound like one of those architect's always trying to paint us engineers in a bad light, until you need us. LOL . . . .


Nope, just like anything else there are good ones and not so good ones...just like there are Architects that are good on paper and those that are good in the field. I have been at it many years and grew up around construction and can typically see a solution before the Engineer ever lays their eyes on the problem and is close to what is reccomended.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

fishtale said:


> Are you a structual engineer?


No!


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## donkeyman (Jan 8, 2007)

jaredt said:


> I have to ask, why would you not call the builder first before you pay an inspector/engineer to "work on your behalf"? I have worked for Lennar homes for over 6 years and am extremely proud of the product we deliver.


 i know i will never buy a lennar home again ...ive spent 4 years fixing all the problems.. wasted alot of vacation /personal days waiting on stuff to be repaired , ive seen a many customer service reps come and go, they cut corners every way possible ..they sell you a house with flat paint,cheap carpet, ive replaced most of the faucets ,dishwasher , i have a repair folder that is unbelievable, person spend this kinda money on a new house shouldnt be having to deal with this kind of problems in such a short time. you should have seen all the nails,sawdust etc, i found when i pulled out the dishwasher...yea that showed me the pride they put in new construction


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

fishtale said:


> I didn't think so your honor, no further questions!!!


...well, you obviously are further away from being an Engineer so what is your point...last time I checked 2Cool was not a court room.:work:


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## Paul S (Mar 18, 2008)

like bwguardian....i have been doing it long enough 18 years that I actually catch alot of engineering errors before they are built sometimes they miss line loads, point loads, undersize beams, .....no i am not an engineer either but when you have enough experience doing it you sometimes are just as good or better than an actual engineer... like the other guy said only one of our engineers actually measures beam widths, beam depths, and pier depths....95% of what we build are 3 story homes and some 4 story and we dont have slab issues. for a one or two story house if the soils report was done and followed and the slab was done correctly you shouldnt have problems.


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## Deep C 915 (Jul 19, 2010)

Sorry to hear that hope things work out for you. 

It's hard to get good undocumented workers these days....


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## PBD539 (May 4, 2010)

Lennar has a long track record of foundation issues. If the warranty is out I would hire a lawyer.


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## flatsfats (May 21, 2004)

Lot of engineer talk going on. :smile: I have personally watched builders pour house foundations with water/cement ratio waaaaay out (slop). Then the very *next morning* the framers were on that slab going to town. I'm not an engineer by any means but that gave me the willies.

You can engineer all you want but if you got guys on the ground that don't give a give a rats patoot you will still have garbage. See it all the time.


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## Barbarian (Feb 12, 2009)

PBD539 said:


> Lennar has a long track record of foundation issues. If the warranty is out I would hire a lawyer.


I think that is an incorrect statement. I do not work for Lennar, but have been in the industry for a long time and have never heard of a track record of problems with Lennar. Have they had a problem with a foundation? Sure, as has every other builder. Things can happen and do even with the best of the best. I know for a fact in the Houston area that the company that Lennar has hired to pre-inspect their foundation work and monitor the pour itself is very possibly the strictest in town. I also know that Lennar uses a higher psi concrete than 90% of the builders around town.


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## fish-r-ride (Jan 5, 2009)

I have been building home in E Texas for 35 years. I have seen very few slabs that did not crack even with our soil conditions around here,sandy loam. My daughter bought a house a couple of years ago off cr157 that was a model home from Lennar and I thought it is a well constucted house. My problem is the concrete. When a slab is finished in that area the concrete is alot chalkier or whiter looking than around here. They have a blue finish on our slabs. It is almost like the concrete is softer , or bigger rock, or too much calcium I don't know but I do know it seems to be different.


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