# neighbors shooting at hunters



## DeerSlayer (May 7, 2008)

My buddy just got back from his deer lease last night. I went over and we swapped hunting stories and to see how each others hunts went for the end of the season. Well, he told me something that happened to him that would have had me Pi_ _ ed off!!! He said he had shot a doe and she ran and jumped the neighbors fence. He left his gun on his side of the ranch and crossed the fence to track the doe. He said while he was tracking the doe, the neighbors shot at him. He said the bullet wizzed by his head and shot off a branch above him. I could not believe that! I asked him if he confronted them or anyone else about it. He said no, he didn't know where the neighbors lived, or even who to talk to. If that would have been me, Who knows what would have happened. Crazy things happen when people start shooting at each other. Any of you out there had any similar problems?


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

He was on someone elses property so he was trespassing but did he see someone shoot at him? Or could it have been a shot fired that was not fired at him?

Man I don't cross fences into neighboring property unless I have that worked out with the neighbors well ahead of time. I don't want someone on my property without my permission so it's a two way street.

TH


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

All I can say is - don't jump your neighbors fence unless you've:
1. received permission before you hunt or 
2. receive permission after you shoot and before you jump

I don't know what it's like now, but when I was a kid growing up in Corpus. If you jumped the fence line of the King Ranch you did so at your own risk. I know one person who did so. Shot a duck on the non-ranch side, it fell over the fence onto the ranch property. He put his gun down, jumped the fence and proceeded to go pick up his dead duck. He was shot in the leg by a fence rider. Not only that, but he was arrested charged, found guilty and paid a huge fine for jumping the fence.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

Sounds like your buddy is hunting a little to close to the fenceline. What he did was illegal. He took his chances and coulda got killed for it. Did he get the deer?


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## Dcrawford (Jan 3, 2008)

??? does someone crossing your fence give you the right to shoot ? what if it were a teen that was lost or something to that affect?


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## nasakid (May 21, 2004)

Sounds like he might hunt around Doss, TX.


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## DeerSlayer (May 7, 2008)

Yeah, I know what your saying. I have already spoken to my neighbor before the hunting season started and recieved permission to cross the fence if I need to track a deer, and I have given him permission to do so as well. BUT, it is understood that there should not be anyone crossing the fence with a firearm and that we have to call each other to let the other know what is going on before we cross fences. It is much safer that way ...also...we don't want to maybe cross an area where someone might be hunting. 

I told my buddy that he needs to find out who his neighbor is and get things straightened out...he is still ticked off and wants to handle things in a different manner. I also asked him the same question..."are you sure they were shooting at you or could it have been a stray bullet"? He said he doubted (sp?) it was a stray. I also told him to probably stay away from fence lines.


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## jake/jenny (Jul 18, 2008)

no reason not to shoot a doe in the head. she'll either be right there or she'll be fine till next year......jist my 2 cents


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## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

What your friend did was illegal but it doesnt justify deadly force. 

I would be a bit concerned and I might have even called the local authorities over that deal...Even if I did face a little heat of my own.

Man, people really do some stupid things man and dont think about the circumstances...That would have been a tragety for all involved if someone would have gotten hurt.


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## great white fisherman (Jun 24, 2008)

Man the fence stories keep getting bigger and bigger every year. First of all it is agtainst the law to shoot at someone on a tresspassing violation. It is against the law to shot someone for tresspassing. I don,t believe the king ranch deal for one minute. I am not saying anything bad about the writer as I am sure he is just passing along information he had heard. I would have owned the King ranch had someone shot me and I would have his arse in jail for shooting me. To shot someone you have to be in fear of your life under very tight circumstances. Where does tresspassing fit into that? Those stories are put out there to try and scare people and keep them off the land. Bottom line ask permission.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

don't care whether you believe it or not. It happened. Don't appreciate being called a liar either. I wouldn't post it if it weren't true. I knew the guy. My father knew his father. this isn't some "passed along" story it happened in 1959 or 1960.


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## great white fisherman (Jun 24, 2008)

No where did I state or call you a liar. I even made mention of that. Happy New Year!


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## sea sick (Feb 9, 2006)

he said it was 1959 or 1960. i can believe that. but if it were in todays day and age, id say it was a bogus story. laws sure have changed since then. that trespasser has more rights than the land owner now a days.


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## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

I will side witht hat story being the truth. I have heard many storys of people being shot at on the King Ranch... In 1960, I bet it was more common than not. I will bet you the King Ranch and that family was "running the show" in that area atthat time. 

I bet there are quite a few bodies that were never recovered on that ranch!


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

> No where did I state or call you a liar. I even made mention of that. Happy New Year!


fair enough I withdraw the comment. but I can tell you this did happen. The only reason I don't know the exact date anymore is 'cause I'm old fart and can't remember back that far. If either of the father's were alive I could provide more info. The guy who was shot left Texas a few years later for a number of reasons and he's dead now.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

looks like the thread is taking a right turn, didn't mean for it to become a "king ranch legend" thread. There are some interesting stories about that old ranch though.


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## Bukmstr (Nov 12, 2004)

The King Ranch stories are true. My friends grandfather worked on the King Ranch and from the stories I have, more than one person lost their life for treaspassing on the ranch.....



RogerB said:


> looks like the thread is taking a right turn, didn't mean for it to become a "king ranch legend" thread. There are some interesting stories about that old ranch though.


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## TXwhtlHNTR (Nov 19, 2008)

:smile:

Your friend should not have been shot at. However, since he wasn't hit, a stray shot could always be the claim. 

It was not legal for him to be there without permission. 

If unable to get permission, the legal course is to contact the local game warden. *From what I have been told*, the warden can:

1. Arrange with the landowner for you to retrieve the deer.

2. If permission is denied, he can access the property and find the deer.
A. He can ask the landowner if he claims the deer. If not, he can ticket the landowner for waste of Game.
B. If the landowner claims the deer, the warden can ticket him for claiming game you shot without your permission.

I don't know the above for fact, but was told it by someone I trust is correct.


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## BATWING (May 9, 2008)

I have been told many stories of poachers outlawin on the King Ranch and not coming back... 

Thats to bad about getting shot at. Never, never cross a fence unless you get permission. To many people out inthe field during deer season as your buddy just experienced. I was told on occasion by a land owner of a lease I use to hunt that if I caught anyone that was not suppose to be there to hold them at gun point if nessisary and call for authorities and him..


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## gundoctor (May 20, 2004)

The guy that jumped the fence is guilty of trespassing, while the person who shot at him is guilty of assault with a deadly weapon and both of them should spend some time in the local lock-up to contemplate the error of their ways(in the same cell might not be a good idea, but then it might). 
The proper way for a hunter to retrieve his deer in a situation like this, is to contact the owner of the property and ask permission(best handled before the hunt even starts). If the hunter doesn't know who the property owner is, he should then contact a game warden. If the property owner says "NO" then nobody can retrieve the deer. 
You can bet the game warden will be doing a little tracking, to make sure the deer was on the correct side of the fence when it was shot.

In this state most people know months in advance where they are going to be hunting. So it ain't a bad idea to go talk to the person in charge of the land across the fence, to nip problems like this in the bud.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I'm pretty sure if you call any game warden he'll tell you he can do exactly as you were told. How many people realize - Texas Game Wardens have more authority than any law officer in Texas (except perhaps Texas Rangers).


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## KYLE (Jun 6, 2007)

great white fisherman said:


> Man the fence stories keep getting bigger and bigger every year. First of all it is agtainst the law to shoot at someone on a tresspassing violation. It is against the law to shot someone for tresspassing. I don,t believe the king ranch deal for one minute. I am not saying anything bad about the writer as I am sure he is just passing along information he had heard. I would have owned the King ranch had someone shot me and I would have his arse in jail for shooting me. To shot someone you have to be in fear of your life under very tight circumstances. Where does tresspassing fit into that? Those stories are put out there to try and scare people and keep them off the land. Bottom line ask permission.


good post


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

LOL! We don't even know if someone shot at him or if it was a stray bullet from a miss or hell the guy may have been behind a shooting range.

I'd think if someone shot "at" him that he'd know where the shot came from cause if a hunter from a stand could see him, he should be able to see the stand where the shot originated.

In any case the guy screwed up by crossing the fence without having permission to do so. 

TH


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Trouthunter said:


> In any case the guy screwed up by crossing the fence without having permission to do so.
> 
> TH


 bingo. There's the bottom line - I wonder - and I guess I'll do a little research - does the castle doctrine apply here? just curious.


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## Fisher_Of_Men (Feb 28, 2008)

Ok,

This happened to us last year, except we didn't cross the fence. One of my buddys shot a spike, it jumped the fence and died about fifty yards from the fence line. We could see the deer but knew we couldn't go get it because of the posted signs. We never knew who owned the property, or for that matter, never saw anyone on the property. We called the Game Warden immediately and he showed up and retrieved the deer for us. Like many of you said, Game Wardens have legal access just about anywhere. We promptly tagged the deer.
The Warden said we did the correct thing. He also told us, that if we ever see the owner and he fails to let us retrieve the deer, we should always call the Game Warden and they will retrieve the deer and the owner can just sit and watch while he writes them a hefty citation. He reminded us that tresspassing is against the law no matter how close the animal is to the fence. He told us we must have "Written" permission. He told us too many hunters have verbal permission and that is not good enough.

Bottom line, he should have never crossed the fence without written permission, and if he was being shot at, he should have called the Game Warden, not the local sherif or police. Game Wardens do not need a warrant to cross into property to investigate wrong doing.


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## fishkillr (Dec 31, 2008)

If youre friend was wearing any OU paraphernalia then it was clearly a justified warning shot and he should change clothes immediately!!!


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## TXcop (Aug 24, 2008)

RogerB said:


> bingo. There's the bottom line - I wonder - and I guess I'll do a little research - does the castle doctrine apply here? just curious.


no.


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## predator22 (Feb 2, 2005)

This thread opened up a can of worms. On Sunday morning I was fishing the flats near aransas pass in dense fog. I didnt see the duck hunter's spread or I would have graciously given him his space. The *****-hole shot over my head. 

Its public water, let me put it this way, anybody that ever does that again and you hit somebody in my boat, I will defend myself, and I always carry.

I will guarantee my 230 grain round will do much more at 50 yards than your steel shot. 

Dont do it again. 

In order not to hijack this thread your friend should not have gone over the fence without permission, but he shouldnt have been shot at either. 

People have lost their freaking minds.


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## scubaru (Mar 28, 2005)

Does your buddy hunt next to Joe Horn?


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## ripleyb (Mar 20, 2006)

Maybe whoever shot thought your buddy was a deer. I've heard many stories of people who will shoot at d*rn near anything that moves.


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## deerdude2000 (Feb 17, 2006)

*king*



bzrk180 said:


> I will side witht hat story being the truth. I have heard many storys of people being shot at on the King Ranch... In 1960, I bet it was more common than not. I will bet you the King Ranch and that family was "running the show" in that area atthat time.
> 
> I bet there are quite a few bodies that were never recovered on that ranch!


Still do, south texas works a little differnt then the rest of the state !!!


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## Gim-me-1 (Jan 8, 2008)

RogerB said:


> I'm pretty sure if you call any game warden he'll tell you he can do exactly as you were told. How many people realize - Texas Game Wardens have more authority than any law officer in Texas (except perhaps Texas Rangers).


Hate to be the one to start this, but a Game Warden does not have any more rights than any other law officer in the State. This has been a myth for a long time. I had to get educated on this myself and I am not trying to create argument. A Texas Ranger really dont carry any more clout but when it comes to crime scene or lab investigation he is the bull of the pasture.


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## TXwhtlHNTR (Nov 19, 2008)

scubaru said:


> Does your buddy hunt next to Joe Horn?


:frown:

I was burglarized New Year's Eve, over $15k (handguns, loose gems, collector coins) loss. 

Wish I had a "Joe Horn" for a neighbor.


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## Red3Fish (Jun 4, 2004)

*Funny story....*

Talking about authority of law enforcement officials...a couple of decades ago, I knew a gal that left ole Steak and Ale a little late and must have been weaving around a little. At 2:00 AM a DOGCATCHER, pulled her over and said he had the authority to do it, and held her until the local gendarms got there. Got a DWI (old fashioned DUI), and went to jail!!

Dont ask me what a dogcatcher was doing out at 2:00 AM, or IF he has the authority, but it happened! She was the butt of many a joke....BEING ARRESTED BY A DOGCATCHER!! LMAO

Later
R3F


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## Don Smith (Nov 24, 2007)

Low light conditions, hunter bent over sneaking thru the brush tracking a deer, hunter a distance off looking for a doe and not expecting anyone to be on his property. Perfect recipe for disaster. I believe that he could defend his actions if he had shot someone under those conditions. Tragic hunting accident. Also if the trespasser was armed, that opens up a whole new can of worms about the deadly force issue against an armed person commiting a felony. (criminal trespass with a firearm) No doe is worth my life, so if I were to shoot one and it went onto neighboring property, the coyotes would eat good.


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## Hooked Up (May 23, 2004)

> Texas Game Wardens have more authority than any law officer in Texas (except perhaps Texas Rangers).


 I love these kind of posts (not). Please show us a copy of the "second" Constitution, Code of Criminal Procedure and any other legitimate documentation that supports your claim that Game Wardens have more authority than other Texas Peace Officers. We, the citizens of Texas are afforded certain inalienable rights. Some people unknowingly "choose" to waive those rights and THAT my friend is where we get these urban myths about Wardens, Rangers, etc. For the record, I am very pro law enforcement and even have a TGW in my family. I also have a pretty fair understanding of what's real and what's not when it comes to law enforcement in Texas. In regard to the original post, I think I'd have to just stay on my side of the fence. I guess I've been very fortunate in my deer hunting years and have never had to track a wounded deer (yet ). I would imagine the temptation to cross that fence would be pretty strong in that situation. This old world just isn't getting any smaller though and I've never tasted ANY backstrap worth losing my life over. Regards, H/U


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## predator22 (Feb 2, 2005)

I always thought that the Game Wardens had more leeway because they can search vehicles and homes for illegal game without a warrant and only need probable cause. I was told that is where the "myth" comes from. However, thats probably wrong to. 

Whats the difference between ingorance and apathy? Answer: I dont know and I dont care.


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## Hooked Up (May 23, 2004)

predator22 said:


> I always thought that the Game Wardens had more leeway because they can search vehicles and homes for illegal game without a warrant and only need probable cause. I was told that is where the "myth" comes from. However, thats probably wrong to.
> 
> Whats the difference between ingorance and apathy? Answer: I dont know and I dont care.


If you agree to the search they can search anything under your care, custody and control. The same holds true with all Texas Peace Officers. The laws / rules that prtect us from "unreasonable" search and seizure apply to all LEOs. If they do not "already" have probable cause then they need to secure a search warrant just like the rest of the men in blue. That being said, if you and I have nothing to hide, why would we worry about being "checked"? Game Wardens are sworn to uphold the same Constitution and enforce the same laws (plus some) that regular LEOs are. I don't worry about it as I do my dead level best to stay in compliance. Nossir, unreasonable search and seizure is just that and it doesn't matter what color your uniform is. I will admit that I would prefer to stay on the good side of our Wardens. These men and women are highly trained and are out there for us and our descendents. I just can't stand hearing that old nonsense about one type of Texas Peace Officer having more authority than another. Think about it for a while  Tight lines, H/U


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## catchysumfishy (Jul 19, 2008)

bzrk180 said:


> What your friend did was illegal but it doesnt justify deadly force.
> 
> I would be a bit concerned and I might have even called the local authorities over that deal...Even if I did face a little heat of my own.
> 
> Man, people really do some stupid things man and dont think about the circumstances...That would have been a tragety for all involved if someone would have gotten hurt.


 Do ya think we are getting the whole story? I'm not saying we aren't, but what if this happened repeatedly and the land owner wasn't getting any help from the Leo's? Also, if i was forced to put a shot in the air, and i say "if", i would definitely follow up to make sure the the trespasser knew what in the heck had happened and a stern warning would be followed up with Leo's right then and there! Sounds like he and his loved ones were very fortunate to me! But this being said, i wouldn't buzz one by anyones person, a tree 90 Degrees off would make a heck of a wollup and definitely get their attention! It worked three weeks ago :wink:


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## BIG PAPPA (Apr 1, 2008)

*wow*

shootin at a poacher, illegal or trespasser blows me away. I for one couldn't do it. But i would surely have the upper and more ready hand during the confrontation. Here in SA Tx we have a highly respected attourney who had his duck boat years back in a saltwater gut on the Kennedy Ranch when a man on horseback told him to get the *&%^ outta here and he refused. He then recieved 6 shots from a 30-30 in the hull of his airboat. needless to say, he left and did not attempt any law suit.
as far as who has more authority, I'm not sure but i think a game warden told me a Brand Inspector can go on anyones land to inspect Cattle brands with or without permission or warrants. but He is the only officer that can do that without any probable cause. I think the state of Texas only had 3 Brand Inspectors left a few years ago. and again, I'm not sure if that is true or not.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

Hooked Up © said:


> I love these kind of posts (not). Please show us a copy of the "second" Constitution, Code of Criminal Procedure


I'm not going to waste my time:



[FONT=CMMI10 said:


> Texas State University[/font]]
> After graduation from the Game Warden Training Academy and
> receiving a commission as a peace officer, the game warden will
> perform responsible field enforcement duties involving the
> ...


no where did I state that they would act as an "all powerful" agency - In Texas, as in Virginia Game Wardens are a division of state law enforcement and as such have broad powers, broader than most city and county law enforcement agencies. "Myth"? believe what you want. I don't need to try to educate. 
from the TPWD website:
http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/warden/


> The Law Enforcement Division provides a comprehensive statewide law enforcement program to protect Texas' wildlife, other natural resources, and the environment. The Division also provides safe boating and recreational water safety on public waters by ensuring compliance with applicable state laws and regulations. Texas Game Wardens are responsible for enforcement of the Parks and Wildlife Code, all TPWD regulations, *the Texas Penal Code* and selected statutes and regulations applicable to clean air and water, hazardous materials and human health. Wardens fulfill these responsibilities through educating the public about various laws and regulations, preventing violations by conducting high visibility patrols, and apprehending and arresting violators


last time I looked the Penal Code covers more than poaching a deer.
like I said - believe what you want.​


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

How do yall think a warden has more power? He may have more duties but not more power and yes I know


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

I've a cousin who's been a warden for a good number of years now (and in fact - may actually be retired by now) The provisions listed above can be used for a variety of "powers". Bottom line? A warden isn't going to waste his time on normal law enforcement duties that can be handled by the appropriate LEO.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

A warden was drug a few weeks ago for making a traffic stop in East Tx. He was waisting time? Tx Game wardens make more drug cases than game cases during hunting season.


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## Hooked Up (May 23, 2004)

BEER4BAIT said:


> A warden was drug a few weeks ago for making a traffic stop in East Tx. He was waisting time? Tx Game wardens make more drug cases than game cases during hunting season.


Now Alex, This guy "knows" somebody who used to be an LEO. How could guys like you and I possibly be right? I'm out, H/U


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

like I said, "normal" circumstances - read the law, read the code. Believe what ever trips your trigger. you just made my poiint with the comment about drug cases. nuff said.


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

Hooked Up © said:


> If you agree to the search they can search anything under your care, custody and control. The same holds true with all Texas Peace Officers. The laws / rules that prtect us from "unreasonable" search and seizure apply to all LEOs. If they do not "already" have probable cause then they need to secure a search warrant just like the rest of the men in blue.


Not at all. About three years ago (seems like, so it was probably five), the Texas Legislature did indeed settle this issue giving wardens far more power.

12.102. INSPECTION OF WILDLIFE RESOURCES. (a) In this 
section: 
(3) "Wildlife resource" means any animal, bird, 
reptile, amphibian, fish, or form of aquatic life or any part of an 
animal, bird, reptile, amphibian, fish, or form of aquatic life the 
hunting, catching, or possession of which is regulated by this 
code.
(b) *Except as provided by Subsection (d), a game warden or *
*other peace officer commissioned by the department who observes a *
*person engaged in an activity regulated by this code or under the *
_*jurisdiction of the commission or reasonably believes that a person *_
_*is or has been engaged in an activity regulated by this code or *_
_*under the jurisdiction of the commission may inspect:*_
*(1) any license, permit, tag, or other document issued *
*by the department and required by this code of a person hunting or *
*catching wildlife resources;*
*(2) any device that may be used to hunt or catch a *
*wildlife resource; *
*(3) any wildlife resource in the person's possession; *
*and *
*(4) the contents of any container or receptacle that *
*is commonly used to store or conceal a wildlife resource.*
*(c) Except as provided by Subsection (d), a game warden or *
*other peace officer commissioned by the department may inspect any *
*wildlife resource that has been taken by a person and is in plain *
*view of the game warden or other peace officer.*

They can also legally enter any private property where wildlife are known or likely to roam without a warrant (contained in another part of the code) for no particular reason.

A county sherrif or local PD CANNOT search these areas/places without either a warrant or your permission. A GW requires neither.

NOTE: This does NOT apply to permanent or temporary residences UNLESS the GW can plainly see a wildlife resource therein.

GWs can also inspect licenses and even collect fees and taxes from fish houses, etc., may order you to submit to a "safety inspection" of your boat, etc. Other waterpatrols may ask or get a warrant, otherwise they cannot inspect without your permission (USCG or USN can).


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## gundoctor (May 20, 2004)

Any commissioned peace officer in the state of Texas can enforce any law of the state of Texas.
If they want to, the local ISD cops, can bust you for game law violations or speeding and it'll stand up in court.
Most LEO stick to the area of the law that is their assigned duty, but if they observe a violation, they can make arrests.
So while some departments have a wider range of responsibilities, none of them have more power.


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## 02txceta (Jul 29, 2008)

I own property in SW TX and can tell you I would be ****** if someone was wandering on my property. A smart person would find out the names of the land owners via the county courthouse, and have that conversation before any hunting commences.


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## Levelwind (Apr 15, 2005)

gundoctor said:


> Any commissioned peace officer in the state of Texas can enforce any law of the state of Texas.
> If they want to, the local ISD cops, can bust you for game law violations or speeding and it'll stand up in court.
> Most LEO stick to the area of the law that is their assigned duty, but if they observe a violation, they can make arrests.
> So while some departments have a wider range of responsibilities, none of them have more power.


You're absolutely wrong. No peace officer EXCEPT a "*a game warden or 
other peace officer commissioned by the department*" enjoys the warrantless search powers and access to private property of a GW.


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## gundoctor (May 20, 2004)

Levelwind said:


> Not at all. About three years ago (seems like, so it was probably five), the Texas Legislature did indeed settle this issue giving wardens far more power.
> 
> 12.102. INSPECTION OF WILDLIFE RESOURCES. (a) In this
> section:
> ...


Yes that was passed, BUT it hasn't been challenged in the courts yet and there is some opinion that major parts of this law are unconstitutional.


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## RogerB (Oct 11, 2005)

gundoctor said:


> Yes that was passed, BUT it hasn't been challenged in the courts yet and there is some opinion that major parts of this law are unconstitutional.


 may not have been challenged yet but it's still the law until that happens.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

My first day in the academy was spent on how to read and use the codes, yall need to take a closer look at that.


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

call OGT and tell them beer4bait has 56 pintails at 11173 fm 1819 in Lufkin, after the warden shows up, and has a few jokes with me talking about the next time we have a fish fry and laugh about this we will find out


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## Slayer-o-Ling (May 21, 2008)

BEER4BAIT said:


> call OGT and tell them beer4bait has 56 pintails at 11173 fm 1819 in Lufkin, after the warden shows up, and has a few jokes with me talking about the next time we have a fish fry and laugh about this we will find out


You want someone to file a false report? Which academy did you attend?


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

I do have that many they are plastic, just trying to prove a point. I went to the Kilgore Police Academy in 1988. Wont be a false report when they see the address they will know who it is.


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## Bayscout22 (Aug 9, 2007)

BEER4BAIT said:


> A warden was drug a few weeks ago for making a traffic stop in East Tx. He was waisting time? *Tx Game wardens make more drug cases than game cases during hunting season.[/*quote]
> 
> Huh? You sure about that?


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## BEER4BAIT (Jun 24, 2005)

In the Angelina office they do. Meth is the majority.


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