# American Muscle vs. Rice Burner



## Cabin-Fever76 (Sep 5, 2008)

I had a debate with my brother in-law about which was better. I'm a fan of American muscle...love the sound of a roaring V-8. What's your opion?


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Pure bred American muscle does it for me!


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

My opinion is that 2Fast and 2Curious, bumble bee/coffee fart can mufflers, and excessive wings and air dams are a sign of gayness.


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## thundertrout (Jun 22, 2006)

i relly hate those rice burners wth those fart cans on them,they really sound awful sounding!i 100%amrican muscle all the way,CHEVY RULES


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## GMTK (Sep 8, 2008)

Too many variables. I love American Muscle (especially the new Challenger and Camaro) but in a 1/8 or 1/4 mile, a rice burner with all wheel drive and nitrous would probably beat most non-nitrous V-8s.

Of course, show up with the new 600 HP Vette and its rice for dinner:

http://www.leftlanenews.com/600-horsepower-corvette-to-arrive-in-2009.html


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Don't get me wrong...I like the rice burners to. I like it when they pull up next to the F350 and want to race (cocky little you know whats) and I blow black smoke in their window.


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## GMTK (Sep 8, 2008)

Raw V-8.


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## mastercylinder60 (Dec 18, 2005)

no question ... raw v-8 muscle.


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## squidmotion (Apr 5, 2007)

ha!

as if you had to ask...


american V8


though supras are cool...


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## MEGABITE (May 21, 2004)

thundertrout said:


> i relly hate those rice burners wth those fart cans on them,they really sound awful sounding!i


They sound like weedeaters. haha


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

Any questions?


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## mastercylinder60 (Dec 18, 2005)

i'm glad i grew up in the 60's and early 70's. those were the glory days of the american muscle car.


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## raz1056 (Jun 16, 2006)

Let's do it!!!


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

There is no replacement, for displacement!


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## yakfisher (Jul 23, 2005)

You know, I really hate to say this, but I am a bigger fan of foreign "sport" cars (not necassarily "rice burners", I do hate those silly exhausts and gratuitous use of spoilers and ground effects). Fit and finish are almost always better, handling is better, and what I like is engine efficiency, small engines pushing lots of juice. Aesthetically though, some American muscle cars are hard to top


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

jeff.w said:


> Any questions?


Those purple carburetor spacers look a little gay. Just messin with ya...that is bad to the bone. What does the rest of the chasis look like.


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## Animal Chris (May 21, 2004)

Big Block V-8 before the catalytic converter.


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

This is about as ricey as I'd get.

A 1975 Pantera DeTomaso. I WILL have one someday!


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## mtaswt (Aug 10, 2007)

The good 'ol "blowing black smoke in the window" trick........love it.....american muscle all the way!!!!!


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## MEGABITE (May 21, 2004)

Used to see one cruising up and down Westheimer on Saturday nights, Jeff.


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

bwguardian said:


> Those purple carburetor spacers look a little gay. Just messin with ya...that is bad to the bone. What does the rest of the chasis look like.


haha, this is the rest of the car. Not mine, but they are from Danciger. Anyone familiar with street racing know them as "The Twins". Dewayne and Lewayne.


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## bill (May 21, 2004)

http://video.thedieselgarage.com/video/27ff3206-5b1b-42d9-a028-9a230022c199.htm

and I still want one of these grills


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## txjoker (Jun 21, 2005)

I hate to admit it, but if that vette shows up to the track right off the street it will probably get smoked. 600 HP street vettes won't get enough traction to get down the track and usually get squirrely and end up in the wall...



GMTK said:


> Too many variables. I love American Muscle (especially the new Challenger and Camaro) but in a 1/8 or 1/4 mile, a rice burner with all wheel drive and nitrous would probably beat most non-nitrous V-8s.
> 
> Of course, show up with the new 600 HP Vette and its rice for dinner:
> 
> http://www.leftlanenews.com/600-horsepower-corvette-to-arrive-in-2009.html


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## jabx1962 (Nov 9, 2004)

jeff.w said:


> This is about as ricey as I'd get.
> 
> A 1975 Pantera DeTomaso. I WILL have one someday!


That Car has a FORD engine. No rice anywhere.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

jeff.w said:


> haha, this is the rest of the car. Not mine, but they are from Danciger. Anyone familiar with street racing know them as "The Twins". Dewayne and Lewayne.


That is sweet. I have been out of the street racing scene for a while.


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## Gilbert (May 25, 2004)

I would rather drive a twin turbo Supra.


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

jabx1962 said:


> That Car has a FORD engine. No rice anywhere.


I know, that's my point.


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## raz1056 (Jun 16, 2006)

This is Reher-Morrison's motto!


Gary said:


> There is no replacement, for displacement!


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

raz1056 said:



> This is Reher-Morrison's motto!


And Big Daddy's!


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## bill (May 21, 2004)

one of my good friends from high school had a Nova, we use to go look for vetts to race LOL Nothing like a sleeper to make grown men (with big egos) cry


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## Buffett Fan (Aug 31, 2006)

American muscle, all the way...late 60's and early 70's MOPAR !!! YEAH BABY !!!

Hey, Cabin Fever, I bet you wish ol dad still had this to pass your way...


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

bill said:


> http://video.thedieselgarage.com/video/27ff3206-5b1b-42d9-a028-9a230022c199.htm
> 
> and I still want one of these grills


Cool vid...the guy in the Beamer is a little nutso though.

The only thing I don't like about that pit is the bow tie.


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## Ckill (Mar 9, 2007)

This is not even a contest, of course the American muscle...


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## cabosandinh (Jun 7, 2007)

a Chevy hotrod friend of mine said to me

" any idiot can get more HP by putting in a bigger engine but it takes brain and skills
to squeeze more HP out of a smaller engine "

he's right, but I like my muscle as in stump pulling 2000 RPM 7.3 L of iron


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## speckledred (Jun 1, 2004)

jeff.w said:


> This is about as ricey as I'd get.
> 
> A 1975 Pantera DeTomaso. I WILL have one someday!


My buddy I worked with had one of these in 1978 and slid into the pastures around Sugarland prison at around 90 mph off Hwy 6. Only broken his wrist & leg, no problem! I love Bad ***** cars!!


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## Blue Water Breaux (Feb 6, 2008)

even though I like and grew up around my dads american muscle car (dodge challenger and moms GTOs(original era) not this new ****, foreign builders like porsche and bmw may not be quite as fast as a new vette or viper unless turbo models, but you can bet anything the porsche and bmw will last 5x longer than this american made junk and will handle like a real sports car. the latest vette's are starting to catch up with the curve though and offer much better handling and performance. another argument would be the fact that i dont enjoy having the same toys as everyone else i.e.-vettes, camaro ss, mustang cobra...just my .02

those old supras are bad babies though.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Hey Blue Water...don't count out the Mustang KR 500.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

cabosandinh said:


> a Chevy hotrod friend of mine said to me
> 
> " any idiot can get more HP by putting in a bigger engine but it takes brain and skills
> to squeeze more HP out of a smaller engine "
> ...


I would say any idiot can put more HP by putting in a bigger engine but it takes brain and skills to get it hooked up from a chasis that works.


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## espanolabass (Jul 20, 2006)

American muscle anyday over a rice burner that sounds like a high pitched fart.


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## Blue Water Breaux (Feb 6, 2008)

hey bwguardian; glad you reminded me!


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## Whitebassfisher (May 4, 2007)

Although I think Honda makes great cars and great motorcycles, I can't stand those Hondas with the "fart can" mufflers. They are ridiculous.

The old school muscle cars were great, but I sure would not turn down a new Vette with the modern engineering either.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Blue Water Breaux said:


> hey bwguardian; glad you reminded me!


The KR 500 Stangs and 600 hp vettes are running neck to neck...but as always, the Mustang cannot get hooked up. This was always my problem with mine until the 9" slicks went on...then the left front wheel goes air born.


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## Cabin-Fever76 (Sep 5, 2008)

Buffett Fan said:


> American muscle, all the way...late 60's and early 70's MOPAR !!! YEAH BABY !!!
> 
> Hey, Cabin Fever, I bet you wish ol dad still had this to pass your way...


Yep!!!! I'll settle for the new CHALLENGER...


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## Dunc (May 29, 2004)

Pony Cars


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## jdsuperbee (Jun 13, 2007)

Give me old school muscle any time. The muscle is much better on the straight line but usually gives up alot in the twisties. Yeah, the "fart cans" and idiotic wings are pretty lame (except for the origin of the big wing cars--SUPERBIRD!!!), but I don't generally count them as sporty cars anyway. Oh, and yeah the last gen of Supra's are bad to the bone.


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

You guys are funny. Like a big cigarette boat that's all engines (and a-holes), I prefer finesse. While that doesn't include cantaloupe shooters and fly-me-to-the-moon wings, it does included quite a few "rice-burners" and small cars designed to do big things.

As a teenager, I loved auto racing, didn't care much for lumbering American Muscle and NASCAR (or precursors), but loved rallye and F1. I started out with an MG Midget and late moved to a GT-6. I still remember the feeling I got when my little 110hp (tuned) MG smoked my friend in his GTO. Yes, the road was windy. That was the challenge. On a straight run, I was a speed bump to him, but there was nothing like a car that sticks to the road.

My kids love rally AND American Muscle. My 15yr. old dreams of a '69 Camaro or maybe, being practical, a mid 70's Trans Am he can fix up.

My current ride? A real ricer...with more oomph than most stock "muscle cars". By next year, a lot more oomph than a lot of so-called muscle. Plus, it has all wheel drive, enough ground clearance to run in the dirt and enough control to outhandle all but a few stock cars on a serpentine road.

Subaru Impreza subcompact. 300hp stock from little 4-banger. Next step: 450hp (if i can be assured it will remain a daily driver--I know that 350hp+ is readily available)

http://www.enginelogics.com/achiev.html

Lest I be remiss: I agree that nothing sounds as sweet as 8 American cyclinders on a rumble...well maybe a P&W radial.


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## FountainJunky (Aug 14, 2007)

I took my Cobra out for a ride this morning, then came home and saw this thread. You just can't beat the sound and feel of the V-8. 

Those ricers always remind me of my weedeater!


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## Captain Kyle (Oct 1, 2008)

I like the american muscle but some of those little rice burners run w/ the best of them. 

I have a Nissan Xterra and it off roads amazing and it is faster than the base line porsche cayenne, BMW X5, Benz ML, with 33 inch M/T tires. My point, not all Japanese engines suck. My Nissan tows my Kenner 85 mph (to pass) no problem. Off roads better, tows faster, goes way faster, gets better mpg than our Suburban Z71.


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## TKoenig (Apr 8, 2007)

give me a 69 chevelle SS with a 396 and i will die a happy man!


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## RubenZamora (Oct 19, 2005)

TKoenig said:


> give me a 69 chevelle SS with a 396 and i will die a happy man!


I agree!!! I hate Rice Burners. Heck I hate Rice in general unless its Mexican or Fried 

I would drive a rusted late 60's camaro with no paint before I would ever accept ANY amount of RICE ****. I HATE THEM. They sound like ARSE and I think my 4cycle Weed eater sounds better.

I also do the smoke trickin my Dmax. Especially when they think they are a bad with windows down and fart sounds and bass blasting.


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## SALT LIFE (Nov 8, 2007)

*700 hp street car crx at ennis tx*






I'M A LOCAL SHOP HERE ON THE NW SIDE,SPECIALIZE IN HONDA/ACURA SERVICE.ANYONE NEED A TUNE-UP(SEE VID)ENJOY. HPS-530-2206.


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

Id like to see a riceburner keep up with this!


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## Gilbert (May 25, 2004)

Gary said:


> Id like to see a riceburner keep up with this!


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## SALT LIFE (Nov 8, 2007)

*hehe*

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://images.turbomagazine.com/tech/0202tur_02s%2Bacura_integra_funny_car%2Bframe_view.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/0202tur_norwoods_racing_funnycar_integra/index.html&h=135&w=180&sz=12&hl=en&start=17&um=1&usg=__WzUCXmEhkzUUBi9CEFd0kYB6aL4=&tbnid=vU_vhwirtqntyM:&tbnh=76&tbnw=101&prev=/images%3Fq%3DNORWOOD%2BAUTOCRAFT%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN


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## 6.5 shooter dude (Jan 8, 2008)

I just want the one with A/C


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

This was my 1/10th scale Muscle car. A 1/10th scale 1/4 mile is 132'. I ran a 2.1 second at 56.3 mph pass with it.


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## killa52 (Jun 19, 2007)

im gonna put nos on my weedeater


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## Palmetto (Jun 28, 2004)

jeff.w said:


> haha, this is the rest of the car. Not mine, but they are from Danciger. Anyone familiar with street racing know them as "The Twins". Dewayne and Lewayne.


I live 2 miles south of those guys. Can hear their cars when they crank them up.


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## texas scarecrow (Sep 6, 2006)

i don't like most guys that drive rice burners they don't know a thing about how a motor works or going fast its all about looks
don't get me wrong there are some fast foreign cars out there but the majority are all show and no go 
btw i smoked a mazda miata on my way to work this morning he took me off the line but at about 30 the cummins came alive. the miata got really small really fast in the review along with the drivers ego im sure
nothing like stomping a 2500lb car with a 8000lb truck


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## 69RRVERT (Sep 21, 2006)

Good ole american muscle. I do have a Chevy Cobalt, but that don't count as a ricer does it? *M *ove *O* ver *P* lymouth *A* pproching *R* apidly. Thanks - 69rrvert










videos: 
http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/sbc383bowtie/?action=view&current=100_5776.flv

http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/sbc383bowtie/?action=view&current=000_0436.flv

http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/sbc383bowtie/?action=view&current=100_4220.flv

http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f328/sbc383bowtie/?action=view&current=100_2338.flv


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## Sweet Action (Mar 27, 2008)

CHEVY MUSCLE


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## txjoker (Jun 21, 2005)

I think you're wrong about this statement. I think those guys know quite a bit about working engines and speed. Ever plumbed an engine for turbos, etc...? I'm guessing you have since you boast about driving a cummins.

It's not quite like replacing a quadrajunk with an edelbrock where all you have to do is put the adapter on the intake manifold to make it fit.



texas scarecrow said:


> i don't like most guys that drive rice burners they don't know a thing about how a motor works or going fast its all about looks


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

A few comments from a 44 yr old guy that has stayed with the times as much as possible.

I still like RockNRoll....I primarily listen to new music just like I did beginning in the 1960's. I'm still with new music.

I still like muscle cars...have had several, miss them all.
No matter what you do to them they are still just squeakey 'ole creakey 'ole muscle car that smell funny.

Last one I sold about 5 yrs ago and had it for 12 yrs. 1969 MACH I that I re-did from ground-up at least 1 full time and it was low mileage car when I bought it from the second owner.
300 hp stock and 450 after I balanced it ++++
Very good handling car
"still just squeakey 'ole creakey 'ole muscle car that smell funny."

New Cars:

Wouldn't give you $50 for all the dang clickety clackety smokedy little diesel pick-ups.

Fart Can cars...The fart can is advanatageous for performance but more can be achieved without one. Man Oh Man does a correct exhaust sound sweet on an import!

My latest is 34MPG and turns like it is on rails.
Low maintainence...Looks good...comfortable.
It won't go to a drag strip and do anything but if it were there I wouldn't have driven it as I know of another type of racing....Road Racing

I don't hate anyone because of their car even if it is not at all my taste.
Room for us all I think?


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

I am not a Cheby guy but this is kinda cool...would like to see more of it though.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw9FTFlSsB0


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## raz1056 (Jun 16, 2006)

This is "PLUMBING 101"...............



Now you ARE living the "HIGH LIFE"


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## CoastalOutfitters (Aug 20, 2004)

american muscle all the way for me, 

but, my uncle had a low production nissan or toyota twin turbo somethingrnuther back in the late 90's that was stupid fast, never seen another one like it, was 350 hp or so, 2 seat coupe as i recall.


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## bzrk180 (Jan 7, 2008)

I think they both have their place... I would love to have a hadling, roadhugging, rice burner and open roads here int he hill country but to have in my garage, clal my own and go sunday riding or to the track once in a while...I am going to have to take the 70-71 CUDA with a 440 6-pack, 4 speed pistol grip, nut-tearer!!


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## FXSTB (Apr 23, 2008)

SALT LIFE said:


> I'M A LOCAL SHOP HERE ON THE NW SIDE,SPECIALIZE IN HONDA/ACURA SERVICE.ANYONE NEED A TUNE-UP(SEE VID)ENJOY. HPS-530-2206.


If he would turn that seat around and put the tranny in upside down he could knock a good second off that ET with weight transfer alone.







Kinda like a Porsche 911.


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

txjoker said:


> I think you're wrong about this statement. I think those guys know quite a bit about working engines and speed. Ever plumbed an engine for turbos, etc...? I'm guessing you have since you boast about driving a cummins.
> 
> It's not quite like replacing a quadrajunk with an edelbrock where all you have to do is put the adapter on the intake manifold to make it fit.


I'm with you on that...I had to learn an entirely new technology when I moved from my normally aspirated British four-bangers to a boosted modern powerplant.

Most of the kids I've met (I'm 50,btw) know quite a bit about their cars and how to get more out of them. 1000HP Supras aren't that rare. I bet I've run into half a dozen Subaru's with more than 500hp. That's a lot to get out of small displacement. AND, none of them sound like weedeaters. The boxer rumble can sound pretty sweet.

My stock Subaru puts out about 120hp/liter. I know KIDS who get over 160/liter. That involves more than just a coffee can muffler, a KN filter and some plastic bits from PEP Boys. Closed vs. open loop systems, mapping, engine heat flow dynamics add up to big gains when done knowledgeably. You'd gain more respect for them if you spent some time getting to know them and their cars. Oh, yea...160hp a liter translates to more than 900hp in your classic 351 CID. That is real muscle.

Plus, these same kids do their own suspension mods. It's almost laughable to hear someone say that these cars aren't "sports cars" then try to imply that term applies to an overweight behemoth that knows no middle ground between oversteer and push. Turn on speed vision and watch the WRC one night or go to a solo event down at the gulf greyhound park. You'll see that these are serious machines worthy of the moniker, "sport".

Yes, some of these ricers you see on the street are junk. Just as some so-called muscle cars, owned by the ignorant or fiscally challenged are also junk.


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## Blue Water Ho (May 21, 2004)

American. Fart can mufflers sound so annoying. That and someone needs to tell these kids a 6" tach doesnt give them 600 HP.

My preffered entertainment.


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## texas scarecrow (Sep 6, 2006)

Tx joker i agree 100% i was just making the point that most of the time the cars we see on the street are all show. scoops, wings, ground effects, a coffee can and maybe a cold air intake then they talk and act like they have something fast

No disrespect to any one that is trying to build for speed. there are plenty of rice burners that can scoot and the guys know there stuff 

I just dont like possers


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## JavelinaRuss (Jul 24, 2007)

Like some said the ones with the fart can mufflers are all hat and no saddle... BUT the ones I've seen with flowmaster or import impersonations of flowmasters usally are bad ***** little cars. 

Me, that black supra(?) first few pages is nice IMHO, bet it does not have a fart can.

BUT anything MOPAR is kewl with me too, I just like the best of both worlds I reckon.


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## David_Conroe (Aug 11, 2008)

Here you go...


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## rvj (May 14, 2006)

American muscle all the way. 
But the SL63 AMG (MERCEDES) with the 6.2 V8 is nice.... It has an awsome transmission.
There are four shift programs - Comfort, Sport, Sport Plus and Manual - with increasingly rapid shift times. In manual mode, the SL will swap cogs in just 100 milliseconds, as fast as the single-clutch automated manual transmission used in the Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano. Gears are selected using either the paddles mounted on the steering wheel or via the traditional Mercedes lever on the center console.

The new transmission also features a Race Start function. Once you select Sport Plus, you place your left foot on the brake pedal and your right on the throttle. The car then decides the optimum engine speed for take-off before you launch the car at the horizon. It's great for the stoplight grand prix, even if it doesn't do much for the driver's skill set.


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## Speck Tackler (May 28, 2004)

I really like the new rat rods they are building now days.


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

I miss my Nova

click me


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## fisherfool (Feb 19, 2006)

American muscle all the way..


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

Gilbert said:


> I would rather drive a twin turbo Supra.


I'll take one of those.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/Autobahn-Supra-228-mph_137670.htm

Doesn't sound "fart canny" to me.


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## Newbomb Turk (Sep 16, 2005)

*Rice, rice baby*



txjoker said:


> I hate to admit it, but if that vette shows up to the track right off the street it will probably get smoked. 600 HP street vettes won't get enough traction to get down the track and usually get squirrely and end up in the wall...


No so,
0 to 60 in 2.35
0 to 100 in 6.03
1/4 mile in 9 flat




Although he passed away in a racing accident his company and his legend lives on. John Lingenfelter was one of the pioneers in street legal horsepower.
http://www.lingenfelter.com/


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## Newbomb Turk (Sep 16, 2005)

And....


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Newbomb Turk said:


> No so,
> 0 to 60 in 2.35
> 0 to 100 in 6.03
> 1/4 mile in 9 flat
> ...


I think he is talking about the new LS7 vette...Lingenfelter is a whole nother enchalada.


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

Kinda like the Enzo.


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## LDL (Jun 10, 2006)

V-8 for sure !


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

Ferrari vs. Lamborghini.


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## wmvoss (Sep 23, 2008)

My son has two 300zx twin turbos. One is his daily driver a 3.0 liter that he rebuilt while attending the US Air Force Academy and majoring in areonautical engineering and it has dynoed over 500 hp at the wheels and should be over 600 when he gets it dialed in. The other is a track car that is over 700 at the wheels and blows by Porsches and Vettes in the straights. These cars have been rebuilt from front to back. When he and his buddies get together it is all high tech discussion. Most have engineering degrees or are finishing up. I can tell you that everything is a pain to work on. No room to speak of. Also the other advantage is that you can program the engine for perormance and then reprogram the settings and get over 20 miles per gallon if he keeps his foot out of it. I was glad when he started to receive a paycheck and could pay his way, but he got his little brother hooked and now I guess I'll have to continue to supplement their hobby.


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## bone (May 28, 2004)

this whole threads begs to be catagorized, are we talking track cars, trailer queens, or daily drivers. a rear wheel drive V8 will be the best bet for a 1/4 mile track car, but can it turn or get 20+mpg? 600hp trailer queens are nice, but are they set up to put the power to the ground? its all a matter of perspective. most arm chair car enthusisast will say V8 american muscle, but they have a camery in the driveway. also a chevy pickup is not american muscle, most 4banger rice sedans will walk away from them. i even hate to bring up the toyota tundra. anyhow, the technology in SOME of those imports on the streets with the loud exhaust will blow most of your minds away. BUT no matter what you have some body is always faster, turns better, etc..... yes somebody on here may have a 700hp vette that'll tear up a 1/4 mile, but it wont take a trip to dallas or the grocery store. that being said how many have a yamaha, suzuki, or honda on their boat? die hard american V8 fans had better have a merc or e-tech. 

hi, i'm Lee, i drive an import. and my boat has a suzuki. i may have a rice problem. HA HA

love the pics keep them coming.


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## txjoker (Jun 21, 2005)

I was referring to the 600HP Vette, which I quoted in my reply. There is no way that thing could hook up going down the track.



Newbomb Turk said:


> No so,
> 0 to 60 in 2.35
> 0 to 100 in 6.03
> 1/4 mile in 9 flat
> ...


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## David_Conroe (Aug 11, 2008)

Honda's cant do this either... 
http://i135.photobucket.com/player.swf?file=http://vid135.photobucket.com/albums/q121/road-runnerOCC/CHUCK2-10-07.flv


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## cabosandinh (Jun 7, 2007)

rockhound76 said:


> I'm with you on that...I had to learn an entirely new technology when I moved from my normally aspirated British four-bangers to a boosted modern powerplant.
> 
> Most of the kids I've met (I'm 50,btw) know quite a bit about their cars and how to get more out of them. 1000HP Supras aren't that rare. I bet I've run into half a dozen Subaru's with more than 500hp. That's a lot to get out of small displacement. AND, none of them sound like weedeaters. The boxer rumble can sound pretty sweet.
> 
> ...


You and TxJoker are correct, these little punks with 
ricers know more about engines mod than many of the 
old farts with money and muscle. I don't drive a rice
but my friend taught me(old fart) most everything I needed to know,
he's 24 and can rebuild and work on any motors out there.
Like I mentioned above, it takes brain and skills to squeeze
more HP out of a small engines, + consider HP to weight
ratio and you can throw the muscles away . They're all good, i don't like dissin' them, to each his own.


----------



## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

David_Conroe said:


> Honda's cant do this either... http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q121/road-runnerOCC/?action=view&current=CHUCK2-10-07.flv


When you can carry it like that...that's HP.

Guess the rice burners could do it in reverse...if they could see where they are going.


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## bigdaddyriverrat (May 24, 2004)

*Twins*



jeff.w said:


> haha, this is the rest of the car. Not mine, but they are from Danciger. Anyone familiar with street racing know them as "The Twins". Dewayne and Lewayne.


Brown is the last name? They used to have a Nova or maybe Chevelle that was an awsome machine!


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## bone (May 28, 2004)

bwguardian said:


> When you can carry it like that...that's HP.
> 
> Guess the rice burners could do it in reverse...if they could see where they are going.


some of them rice burners are AWD(thats all wheel drive for you american guys) and they dont have that nasty problem of wheelies. i bet that chevy doesnt do alot of grocery hauls. you can pull up videos till your butt hurts, it'll never end. track car, daily driver??? would you want a V8 or an import?


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## berto (Oct 14, 2004)

No Replacement For Displacement

Ill never own a burner


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## Cabin-Fever76 (Sep 5, 2008)

69 charger....This Video is sick!!!! Turn your speakers up.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

bone said:


> some of them rice burners are AWD(thats all wheel drive for you american guys) and they dont have that nasty problem of wheelies. track car, daily driver??? would you want a V8 or an import?


AWD...its called a Subaru...and a good friend has one hopped up. Look at the history of how long cars have been at the race track.

Daily driver.

Not an import...that's why we are in trashed economy now.


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## Sonnysmarine (Mar 18, 2007)

I have a 1993 5.0 Gt. 302 Reef blue, opal grey leather, 114,000 miles.99% orginal. 1 of 346 made just like it. for 1993,it's on the mustang register.


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

bwguardian said:


> AWD...its called a Subaru...and a good friend has one hopped up. Look at the history of how long cars have been at the race track.
> 
> Daily driver.
> 
> Not an import...that's why we are in trashed economy now.


Wrong Man....American Car Manufacturers in trouble because of BIG heads and too slow to grow into new technology + poor quality for many yrs..since the early 1970s.

Look at the cars they are coming out with NOW that should have been around 10yrs + back.
10yrs ago the total focus was SUVs and how to keep them from rolling.

Wings have purpose....BUT, they don't really need anything about speed/handling on a little pick up smoking and clickety clackin down the highway.


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## raz1056 (Jun 16, 2006)

nasty problem of wheelies? Shift don't lift!!!


bone said:


> some of them rice burners are AWD(thats all wheel drive for you american guys) and they dont have that nasty problem of wheelies. i bet that chevy doesnt do alot of grocery hauls. you can pull up videos till your butt hurts, it'll never end. track car, daily driver??? would you want a V8 or an import?


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## mastercylinder60 (Dec 18, 2005)

TKoenig said:


> give me a 69 chevelle SS with a 396 and i will die a happy man!


when i was about 16, my cousin bought a '69 chevelle ss 396. beautiful car - orange with two black stripes down the middle. i went over to his house to drool over it for a bit, and tony said, "hey, take it for a spin and see what it'll do."

i just drove around for about 10 minutes admiring the sound of the engine and trying to look cool in case i saw anybody i knew. i had pulled up to a stop sign and decided i'd take tony's advice and see what it could do. about 10 seconds later, i was in somebody's front yard and shaking like a leaf.

i was a real dork back then.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

BonesNTX said:


> Wrong Man....American Car Manufacturers in trouble because of BIG heads and too slow to grow into new technology + poor quality for many yrs..since the early 1970s.
> 
> Look at the cars they are coming out with NOW that should have been around 10yrs + back.
> 10yrs ago the total focus was SUVs and how to keep them from rolling.
> ...


Hey, if you want to keep buying foriegn and support another economy...that is your decision.

Personally, I choose to buy American...whatever they may be.


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

bwguardian said:


> Hey, if you want to keep buying foriegn and support another economy...that is your decision.
> 
> Personally, I choose to buy American...whatever they may be.


Yeh...Being and American Engineer I used to stand firm on that shakey ground as well.
Domestic vehicles these days are primarily constructed of parts made overseas so YOUR theory of American really hasn't held water for many years when you look at it that way?
(FORD Explorers are MADE by MAZDA for cryin out loud)

After Ferraris, Porsches in the 1970s I realized (started to realize) that they ran more often and properly than my Pontiacs.

1987 I got my first TOYOTA and it was a 4 Runner. That was after many years of saying NO JAP **** for me. Awesome 4Wd and towed like a mule.

I understand the mentality....I love a V8 Ride (you see my MACH I a few pages back....450HP and set up for road courses....180 MPH Ride and the sound of that engine shames most NASCAR.

I also love a car that is in my driveway most of the time and not in a shop. AC works great, safe, *SAFE*, handles very well, comfortable. Passes most anything on the road these days in Texas.
*34 MPG*

WHEN I haul my boat....CHEVY V8 all the way!


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

bigdaddyriverrat said:


> Brown is the last name? They used to have a Nova or maybe Chevelle that was an awsome machine!


Yes, that's them. Those two guys have built some wild hot rods. They are pretty much at the top of the food chain when it comes to street racing.

Here's another one of their weekend projects they had a hand in building. 
383ci. stroker SBC (500hp) with a 250 shot of happy juice (NOS). Not only did this mini van eat rice, it also picked some up from the grocery store.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

BonesNTX said:


> Yeh...Being and American Engineer I used to stand firm on that shakey ground as well.
> Domestic vehicles these days are primarily constructed of parts made overseas so YOUR theory of American really hasn't held water for many years when you look at it that way?
> (FORD Explorers are MADE by MAZDA for cryin out loud)
> 
> ...


Oh, I see what the problem is here...Engineer.

My family only drives Super Duty trucks and there is probably some kind of switch made in China on it but at least it is not the whole vehicle!

If you have a Stang you can't be all that bad (but in your original post a couple pages back you stated you sold it 5 years ago)...to each his own my friend.


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## thundertrout (Jun 22, 2006)

don't get me wong,there are some really nice rice burners out there.it's just the ones that put wings on them and a big ol fart cans on thier cars, and think they relly have
something to be proud of,it really burns my butt when they install the wings most of time homemade wings and big fartcans on them,and the smokes really bad and sounds just like
well a piece of junk.but american muscle was here first and will remain first.


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

The "them vs. us" argument holds no water. Heck, I own Toyota stock (and drive an '89 4x4 that I've owned since new).

My Subie is indeed Japanese built. But look at their major stockholders. Subie is just about American. 

My POS Jeep Wrangler was built in Canada. Your GM truck? Some pretty major pieces were likely assembled in Mexico using Japanese parts. 

A Toyota or BMW might have used American workers from plants in North Caroline or Tennessee...plants that pay American taxes.

Btw, despite my avowed love my Subie and of "real" road performance cars, I used to own a '64 1/2 Mustang and my dream is own another, a convertible this time. I have my eye on a '68 California addition GT that is literally, a barn find my kid's made. I'm sure it would get hopped up a little, and it will sound sweet, but it will never challenge a good performance ricer for real world driving.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

thundertrout said:


> but american muscle was here first and will remain first.


Amen.


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## RubenZamora (Oct 19, 2005)

All I know is my 2500HD Chevy was made and assembled here in Michigan


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

RubenZamora said:


> All I know is my 2500HD Chevy was made and assembled here in Michigan


The World is now assembled vi what is known as "Global Sourcing".

Parts come from all over the world to a warehouse and then to assembly.

Your truck assembled in Michigan is no different, same as my TAHOE Assembled Texas.

Heck, even many foreign cars as already mentioned are assembled in USA being that is final point of sale.

I don't like that one bit as it has as we know, cut a lot of American jobs.

A lot of my job is dealing with Chinese and their **** parts and **** English that some teacher somewhere that barely can speak English gave them an "A" in !!!!


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## Blue Water Ho (May 21, 2004)

The argument for ricers is funny.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Blue Water Ho said:


> The argument for ricers is funny.


And I supposed you have not flogged a few cause I know that Cummins can?


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## mako11 (Aug 13, 2005)

*both*

I want BOTH>


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## Blue Water Ho (May 21, 2004)

bwguardian said:


> And I supposed you have not flogged a few cause I know that Cummins can?


I would rather have a DD that can spank a ricer at the same time pull 14,000 LBS, throw 2,500 in the box then go to the store for groceries.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Blue Water Ho said:


> I would rather have a DD that can spank a ricer at the same time pull 14,000 LBS, throw 2,500 in the box then go to the store for groceries.


DD = Dodge dually?

I hear ya. I am sad though cause now I burn bio and it don't throw smoke like it used to.


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## Gilbert (May 25, 2004)

RubenZamora said:


> All I know is my 2500HD Chevy was made and assembled here in Michigan


with Japanese parts


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

Gilbert said:


> with Japanese parts


And a dashboard and harness assembled in mexico.....


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

About those smokey diesels...I get smoked on almost every bicycle ride I go one by at least one doofus in a dually. What's with that?

I have a 6.0L diesel, but if it smokes like that, I"m dumping (and wasting) too much fuel.

Btw, I wonder how many bragga-docious dieselers can really put the stink on a good ricer. Even my box-stock Subie (with that big spoiler my wife hates) runs 0-60 in under 5 seconds. 

That stuff about blowing away ricers sounds like some real smoke blowin' (said with a smile, not smirk)


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## Slim-N-None (Sep 16, 2005)

i think my avatar answers the question......


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

Slim-N-None said:


> i think my avatar answers the question......


My son, the one who wants, at various times, a '69 Camaro or a mid 70's Trans Am just told me he would love to have a mid-70's Chevy truck that he could "hop up".

While the idea of loading him up with HP until he gets better at driving scares me, I think the idea of a truck is a good one. I don't know how anyone gets by without one. We saw one at auction in Livingston about two months back and I loved it; a '72 completely restored with crate motor. It sounded like it was ready for the strip, but the owner told me it was a daily driver (no way. It was too perfect.).

No doubt it would eat me alive on the strip or on a straight line, but I LOVE the feel you get when you are pulling Portenzas from all four wheels on the limits of adhesion--that magic point where you go to the edge of the push, knowing just a little move and you can drift the car around.

With a big ol' truck, it's all about the pull and the smoke and the rumble. That's sweet, too. No doubt.


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## Blue Water Ho (May 21, 2004)

DD= daily driver.

Also, rockhound I can show you videos of a guy in Houston and with his DD Cummins he'll put the stink down on mustangs and all. Keep in mind we have AWD too. 4x4


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## country7 (May 27, 2007)

1971 Hemi cuda or 1968 olds 442 please!!!


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Blue Water Ho said:


> DD= daily driver.
> 
> Also, rockhound I can show you videos of a guy in Houston and with his DD Cummins he'll put the stink down on mustangs and all. Keep in mind we have AWD too. 4x4


I understand the DD now...you don't want to know my first thought...hehehe.

Man, don't give all our secrets away.


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## Blue Water Ho (May 21, 2004)

Most of them know, but refuse to face the fact that a 6" tach and a fart can muffler doesnt add 600HP.  Ive seem tham tell people that AWD and 4x4 dont mean the samething. Ohwell, see them on the line


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## bone (May 28, 2004)

*this needs to come to an end.*



Blue Water Ho said:


> DD= daily driver.
> 
> Also, rockhound I can show you videos of a guy in Houston and with his DD Cummins he'll put the stink down on mustangs and all. Keep in mind we have AWD too. 4x4


we can all find videos of any kind of car/truck laying down nice times on the track. this will never end. all these track cars are that, track cars. the DD on the internet are that, on the internet. i'd love to see a truck out run my 2liter import. that'll give me reasons to upgrade the turbo, etc..... but i think thats not gonna happen anytime some. how about some real DD that people on ttmb have, not pic/vidoes on the net. cool cool. i love a good race, just havent had one in awhile.

all good in the neighborhood.

bone


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## Tombo (Mar 15, 2005)

I tried to lay off but gave in . To make an import perform you have got to spend more money per horsepower. I love a lope in a cam, hearing the tuned headers on a V8 gets me going in the morning. And the smell of racing fuel is better than coffee. 

The only replacement for cubic inches is cubic dollars. I did grow up in the sixties and seventies. But, by the time I could afford a car it was 1980 and there was no performance around.


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## bigdog (Feb 3, 2005)

I have also held out a long while on this one.
There is horsepower and then there is Torque, 2 completely different monsters.



bone said:


> we can all find videos of any kind of car/truck laying down nice times on the track. *how about some real DD that people on ttmb have, not pic/vidoes on the net*.


My 526 cubic inches in my '72 Camaro


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## bigdog (Feb 3, 2005)

With regard to the import guys knowing their cars, I will give them this... the guys who have them running high HP numbers on boost or spray or whatever usually have a very HIGH understanding of what goes into them, ...dare I say more so than the backyard mechanic with a Jeg's catalog.





I still don't like them though.


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## Captain Kyle (Oct 1, 2008)

I have heard you can make a diesel really fast if you put special chips in them. Is this true?


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## 69HEMI-R/T (May 25, 2004)

Boy am I late for this thread! American Muscle does it for me!


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## delliott00 (Mar 6, 2007)

Hehe.... I probably should stay out of this.... BUT.....

I love American Muscle. I grew up with them. My family has 2 drag cars and a completely restored 67 Corvette 426/390 (was Vette Magazines 50th anniversary frame off resto project car). My first car was a 1970 Monte Carlo SS that I JEGS'd up. My mother in law drag races a Vega in OH that runs 9 flats and she has trophies all over her house. One of my wish list cars is a COPO Camaro RS (yeah right!). Or maybe just settle for the black 68? in Better Off Dead.

BUT....... Not a single one of them could ever take a turn worth a ****.... Since my commute is not a straight line, I started to have impure thoughts and eventually found myself in a BMW M3. Then a few more BMWs, a 2000 Porsche 911, a recently a Lotus Elise. My biggest mistake was that I drove a Mitsubishi Evo on a whim. Walked out with one after a test drive caused me to completely question reality. Wife drove it and ended up confiscating it and ditched her M3. So I sold the porsche and bought another one for me. 4 years and 100K plus miles on 2 Evos and we just replaced one with the new 2008 Evo.

These cars are unreal. I swear the laws of physics are really just suggestions. AWD, turbo, 2.0L. My 2005 has ~380hp and well over 400lbs of torque....at the WHEELS. And its driven hard every day for 3.5 years without $1 in repairs. The new one will soon have a chip that adds 108hp at the wheels and 99 torque (should put it well over 400 crank for both).

Yes, I suppose they are ricey. I dont care, nothing I've ever driven is as fun to drive. I don't drive a car based on what other people think. I hate the typical rice cars.... Nothing is worse than a beat up civic automatic with a fart can exhaust and black spray painted hood and some primer gray jc-whitney body kit on it. Because its trying to be something its NOT. All show and no go. My evo's pretend nothing.

Have a buddy of mine with a t-shirt that reads "My lug nuts have more torque than your honda"....

But anyways, my recommendation is if you love cars that are fast in straight line AND in a corner..... don't drive an Evo.

And if you drive a truck, have fun teaching civics Torque 101.... but make sure you don't mistake one of these. My old boss has an F250 tuned by Austin Diesel with propane inj and the works. Pure ridiculous torque (800 I think if he turns it to the wild setting). Even he admits its not even worth the challenge and always wants to go to lunch in the evo.....

Heres the new one... Still stock for now but not for long.... Not bad for $30K.










That said, I wouldn't kick a new Challenger out of my garage. They are drop dead hawt. But I'd still never question one is faster.

But I can appreciate just about anything cool with a motor in it..... So its all :cheers: from me....

-Dave


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## jeff.w (Jan 22, 2006)

bigdog said:


> I have also held out a long while on this one.
> There is horsepower and then there is Torque, 2 completely different monsters.
> 
> My 526 cubic inches in my '72 Camaro


More pics please! My brother is the biggest Gen2 Camaro fan in the world I believe. 
And he lives in Lake Jackson as well. It's possible you know him, I don't know. Here's a pic of his 70-1/2 Camaro...


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## Gary (May 21, 2004)

It aint fast, but its my style!


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## spuds (Jan 2, 2005)

*I love rice, but not in my car.  *


*I prefer my cars to have a Teutonic flavor and a voracious appetite for bratwurst. *
*:cheers: *


*But for the money, you can't beat a new Corvette. *
:flag:


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

I have never been passed in any of my vehicles by a smokity smoke pick up unless it is in town and they got a hard on to be stupid (I live in the country on the coast). These guys seem to be from somewhere else. None of my friends that have or have had one thought they were fast.

I used to race professionally for 14 yrs, not straight line. If you wanna race me be sure to tell me before it's over?

Newt Point.

Whatcha gonna do when you come to a turn? Pick ups aren't really known for handling...Weight bias issue.


----------



## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

EVO's rawK!!!



delliott00 said:


> Hehe....
> These cars are unreal. I swear the laws of physics are really just suggestions. AWD, turbo, 2.0L. My 2005 has ~380hp and well over 400lbs of torque....at the WHEELS. And its driven hard every day for 3.5 years without $1 in repairs. The new one will soon have a chip that adds 108hp at the wheels and 99 torque (should put it well over 400 crank for both).
> 
> Heres the new one... Still stock for now but not for long.... Not bad for $30K.
> ...


----------



## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

Delliote,

I agree with William!



WilliamH said:


> EVO's rawK!!!


Even though STI drivers are supposed to HATE EVO's, I think they are sweet. When Subie goofed up (IMO) the '08 STI, I looked hard at the EVO. I ended up with the 2007 STI, since I'd already had an '03 and loved it. Like you, I never spent a single $ on fixing the thing.

Who will do your work?

I'm looking at something very mild, maybe Cobb Stage II (AP, catback, 350HP, 385 ft. lbs.) , with an intake/airbox change and re-map that can add up to 50 more HP. Engine Logics in Houston has an AWD dyno, but I've been told they push more radical changes that aren't quite warranty friendly.

Subie's SPT kits have gotten mixed reviews and with the Cobb Access Port, I can flash back to warranty specs. Right now, I'm getting a surge at 4K rpm that is related to the Californian complaint ULEV ratings for these cars. The darn thing hauls butt, but the computer cuts back when it gets close to pre-detonation. I don't want to run it too lean, but I do think the map is too conservative.

I'm also looking at adjustable coilovers for trying my hand at Solo, but that will wait. What i don't won't is more car than I have the skills (or time) to manage.

Nice Evo, tho'. Don't tell my kids. I tell them I hate Evo's just to tick them off.


----------



## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

EVO!!!!


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

I'd like to get a WRX in the future. A little sleeper car. 



> I used to race professionally for 14 yrs, not straight line. If you wanna race me be sure to tell me before it's over?


Details Bones.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Captain Kyle said:


> I have heard you can make a diesel really fast if you put special chips in them. Is this true?


Yes, if you chip them and do a few other minor modifications. There are a couple trucks...some on this board that run through the quarter in the 10-11 second range...then turn the A/C on and drive home.


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## rambler (Sep 17, 2005)

I always thought it was more important where you're going than what you're going in, but in this great abyss that is Houston, TX, it may be more important what you're going in.


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## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

WilliamH said:


> I'd like to get a WRX in the future. A little sleeper car.
> 
> Details Bones.


WRX = way cool as well. Get one out in the wet!!!!!

Details?

14 yrs racing I guess you mean...
MXCross all along the way and even to this day.
Started go karts in 1970s. The slowest go kart I ever had topped out at 70MPH. Ran those on very short "road course" tracks.
Went into faster karts on full size road courses. The slowest of those I ever ran were 120MPH top speed and the fastest I ran were 180MPH top speed.
The Superkarts hold many track records...0-60-0 in about 3 seconds...0-100 in about 5 seconds. GForce achieved turning is un-matched. Full ground effects. Most exciting....FUN 4 wheels you can drive! Needless to say, a little dangerous / deadly.
This pic is one set-up for low speed track...150MPH Top speed,

Made the North America circuit several years and then off to Europe where I ran the Superkarts and F2.
In 1980 after testing at TWS I turned down an almost good offer, in my mind, most people thought it was the best in world but that was Houston people, to go INDY and went to college. One of the few times I took my Dad's advice. Car racers didn't make all that much $ back then and of course the cars weren't so safe = Very different to today's.

After 5 yrs of college I luckily managed another sponser and off to F2000 around North America for a few years. Back to Europe for a few runs.

In the late 1970's I did help a good friend build-up a 1970s Chevy pick up with a hot 327. We welded part of a train track rail to the frame in the rear attempting to get better weight balance. That's the last of any quick street pick ups I've seen.

I went to the drags once ever...Late 90s I guess it was??? at Baytown and saw the first 300MPH run. I was very impressed on a lot of aspects. My British Wife said that it was not the first 300MPH 1/4 in the world...Just America. UK had that going on for sometime before.

All a matter of perspective of what "FAST" is.

Check this video of Euro Karting!!!!!


----------



## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

Cool deal Bones.

I'm about to hit my mid-life and want to take a 3 day school; just to get it out of my system - maybe Skip Barber or Boundurant or I'd even try a Derek Daly course.


----------



## RubenZamora (Oct 19, 2005)

delliott00 said:


> My 2005 has ~380hp and well over 400lbs of torque....at the WHEELS. And its driven hard every day for 3.5 years without $1 in repairs. The new one will soon have a chip that adds 108hp at the wheels and 99 torque (should put it well over 400 crank for both).


Ya but can it tow 10k  ok ok j/k


----------



## delliott00 (Mar 6, 2007)

rockhound76 said:


> Delliote,
> 
> Even though STI drivers are supposed to HATE EVO's, I think they are sweet. When Subie goofed up (IMO) the '08 STI, I looked hard at the EVO. I ended up with the 2007 STI, since I'd already had an '03 and loved it. Like you, I never spent a single $ on fixing the thing.
> 
> ...


Hehe.... Yeah I never understood why I was supposed to hate STi's? They are both AWD turbo rally cars.... Thats like the pot calling the kettle black.

I dig Scoobies. The flat four definitely sounds awesome with a good exhaust on it (loved the flat 6 in my 911!). I bought the evo because, out of the box at least, it handled noticeably better than the STi. The STi had a bit of an edge in power. Have a couple of friends with STis, and I always wave or nod when I see an STi, most wave back.

My black evo 8 has a Buschur stage 2. 3" turbo back (no fart can sound here), boost controller, intake, cams, FPR, and a custom dyno tune by Al @ Dynoflash. Its been de-riced for the most part. Its all easy bolt ons except for the tune/cams.










The powertrain on the new Evo X is ridiculous. Tuners are getting ludicrous results. Mitsu really left a lot of power on the table by running it so rich from the factory. I'm getting a TTP Engineering Z-Chip with a MBC. For ~$500 I'll get a plug-n-play chip that adds 108whp and 99wtq. I'm also waiting on the Cobb Tuning Evo X dual exhaust (with quad tips, 2 per side, like an M3 or M5). Combined it should bump up stock hp/tq from 291/305 (crank) to over 400/400. For $1200 in bolt on mods! I run a boost controller on the evo 8 and dial it down to 21psi (probably 340hp?) and run it there most of the time. Will probably do the same on the Evo X.

I have thought about getting a scooby wagon as a windsurfing and utility vehicle. Maybe a WRX wagon or Legacy. But what I really want is a Saab 9-2x. Has a lot of STi parts on it that the wrx did not.

Don't like driving trucks/suv's except for towing the boat or hauling lumber etc. Love it when they try to follow me up a hill.... whoosh.....buh-bye, thanks for playing.....I'm sure there are a couple diesels on here that could run with me (certainly a 11s quarter will), but haven't met any of them and most folks think their silverado is fast 'cause it has dual pipes. LOL.... I just introduce those guys to Darwin's theory 

BonesNTX: I'll bet we know a lot of the same folks. I have been to TWS a bunch of times in a bunch of different cars doing DE's. Also am good friends with the Harris Hill Road Raceway folks (they used to own the Lotus dealer in Austin) and have run a bunch of laps at that track. It is a great facility. Would be awesome for a shifter kart race. I loved running that track in my Lotus. Also, some good friends are running 24hrs of Lemons in Houston and I have been helping when I can....

Anyways, I'm with you. Straight line speed is easy -- just add cubic inches or add boost. Getting a car to turn a fast lap around a road course is not easy. I passed a lot of Vipers in my 1.8L turbo Audi because the owners could only point and floor it.

Was having a ball yesterday driving the evo in the wet!! 3 limited slips and 400 pounds of torque! Yee HA!

-Dave


----------



## BonesNTX (Aug 14, 2006)

RubenZamora said:


> Ya but can it tow 10k  ok ok j/k


NO

And you accidentally agreed....different vehicles for different jobs.

That tow vehicle is not fast and does not handle well...according to my experience. Just because it may be the fastest pick up they ever had doesn't mean it is fast to others.

All relative to one's experience. Most teenagers think whatever they hve is faster than owl splat! That is based on very little experience and often this thinking just carries on into middle age. No growth due to a closed mind = no growth.

ONE of my first cars when I was 14 was a 67 GT350. Life is all a matter of perspective....what we do...what we do with it...what we get...what we do...and so on.

AWD is not equal to 4WD for example.

As well....What me going on this thread was the condemnation of folks that don't drive a crickety clakin smokin pick up. Those trucks disgust me for several reasons but I don't "hate" the people that drive them.
I've had real Tractors for towing trailers...My idea of a proper tow vehicle...Not everyone's idea obviously.


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## delliott00 (Mar 6, 2007)

RubenZamora said:


> Ya but can it tow 10k  ok ok j/k


Yeah. Thats my only gripe... But the evo actually looks pretty cool with a roof rack hauling a couple of windsurf boards to the beach. I think my warranty is voided by putting a tow hitch on it though 

I will pick up an F250/350 diesel someday as I want to upgrade to a 28-30ish express fish in a year or two and will need a tow vehicle. But thankfully you can find used ones really cheap so it would mainly stay put except for when I need a truck. Can't bring myself to drive one daily as I enjoy my twisty roads too much, but I certainly understand the utility argument. Would own one now except I have a pal with a 4runner that will tow the sea hunt if I need to.

-Dave
'22 Sea Hunt


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## robul (Apr 26, 2007)

I like Australian built American muscle  Doesn't hurt to slap some power adders on either.

My Twin Turbo GTO


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## Yams (Jul 16, 2008)

Ill go a step further and say neither.

over 200MPH top speed, 0-60 in 4.3... stock...










Some day when i retire, sell my house, boat and cash in my investments...ill live in this car for a few years!


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

I hope I didn't ruin my driver-in-training 15yr. old son a few weeks ago. I let a friend take him for spin in his 550 Maranello, then ride in his wife's Maseratti GT.

The boy comes back from the Ferrari ride, breathing hard. 
"How fast did you go?" I ask.
He takes a deep breathe, then stutters, "A, aah, about, maybe, uh, seventy. Yeh, seventy".
"Say again?"
"Okay. 140, but then I didn't look anymore. You know, now I know what they mean when they say an engine sings."

My wife says he'll need to be retrained. He gets the "talk" after every driving lesson. But, he also asks if I will give him a "tire allowance" and asks about "spec cars". Sounds ominous to me.


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## Tombo (Mar 15, 2005)

One of the greatest pick up lines "I own a Ferrari".


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## Arlon (Feb 8, 2005)

bwguardian said:


> Yes, if you chip them and do a few other minor modifications. There are a couple trucks...some on this board that run through the quarter in the 10-11 second range...then turn the A/C on and drive home.


Drive home with the AC and get 20mpg doing it..

Check the smoke free Cummins in the left lane..


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

Arlon said:


> Drive home with the AC and get 20mpg doing it..
> 
> Check the smoke free Cummins in the left lane..


That one is dialed in...the other guy needs to burn more of that fuel.


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## wingnut (Jul 18, 2006)

There's NO replacement for Displacement!!


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Ive got the best of both worlds..lmao


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

22/30 mpg and 160mph....lol


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## Cabin-Fever76 (Sep 5, 2008)

OxbowOutfitters said:


> Ive got the best of both worlds..lmao


This is my brothers.....it loves to eat rice!


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

160 is that all....:slimer: 
I banged 186 against a Z06 last weekend on hwy 249...
Had that Guy by 4 links the whole way...he didnt catch me for 3 miles..lmao
American Muscle Super Tuned..lol:rotfl:



Profish00 said:


> 22/30 mpg and 160mph....lol


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## edex (Jul 18, 2008)

jeff.w said:


> My opinion is that 2Fast and 2Curious, bumble bee/coffee fart can mufflers, and excessive wings and air dams are a sign of gayness.


Now now, there are aweful representations of muscle cars also. nascar stickers, whole rack of 6x9's, flames everywhere, shag carpeting, etc.

Some import cars that aren't 'rice burners':


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

OxbowOutfitters said:


> 160 is that all....:slimer:
> I banged 186 against a Z06 last weekend on hwy 249...
> Had that Guy by 4 links the whole way...he didnt catch me for 3 miles..lmao
> American Muscle Super Tuned..lol:rotfl:


No video, no care


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Bring The cam & the Vette n we'll do 1...:slimer:



Profish00 said:


> No video, no care


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## berto (Oct 14, 2004)

OxbowOutfitters said:


> 160 is that all....:slimer:
> I banged 186 against a Z06 last weekend on hwy 249...
> Had that Guy by 4 links the whole way...he didnt catch me for 3 miles..lmao
> American Muscle Super Tuned..lol:rotfl:


your ws6 ran 186 mph for 3 miles?? what mods do u have?? ive been 140 in my z28 and theres no way it could handle 186. **** car was all over the place.


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Ive got all kinds of goodies..
150lb injectors a hp map & mass sensor,,a Hard fuel system..a tremic 6 speed..411 gears ..Plus a special chip & program for my laptop...:biggrin:
& a button that says....Go baby Go...
& to answer the Next ? 
Ive never had the Gal to hit the button except ,when I ran it at Pinks in Bayclown & was DQ'd for breaking outta my trap & that I walked on the guy by 3 links @ the last 60ft..:slimer:
everything Ive done is Bolt on except for the Axles & gears



berto said:


> your ws6 ran 186 mph for 3 miles?? what mods do u have?? ive been 140 in my z28 and theres no way it could handle 186. **** car was all over the place.


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## berto (Oct 14, 2004)

a bolt on car with a tall gear going 186mph... no motor work... i sure wish u had a video of that 180+mph run.. i figured with 411 gears and a bolt on car u would run out of power and gear to hit that type of speed... especially in that heavy ws6..

heres my DD... she gets awesome gas mileage..


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## Naterator (Dec 2, 2004)

*tough call*

I have owned 3 mustangs - 67 fastback w/ tricked out custom 302 (bad @ss car!), a 92 5.0L coupe (great car), and a 2004 GT (junk)...now I drive a Lexus IS350 w/ 310 HP. I have been around muscle cars all my life, and someday I may build another retro late 60s stang or camarro...but for pure driving enjoyment around town, the Lexus wins hands down any day of the week...I recently dated a girl with a Vette>>>man, that thing was a great engine and chassis with junk wrapped around it...but can't beat it for bang for the buck performance. I love the sound of raw American V-8 muscle, but its a straight line acceleration deal only. I personally believe that the best sports car on the planet is the 911 Turbo. I knew a guy that had a tricked out 06' w/ 675 HP that he drove everywhere, every day w/ the AC going full blast....alll 4 tires would light up at 80 MP on the highway when he hit third gear...ran low 10s...man, THAT is some serious car!!!


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## Tombo (Mar 15, 2005)

When asked about a 69 Z28 with factory cross ram, how fast will it run? My answer was whatever the speed limit was.


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## Tombo (Mar 15, 2005)

Since there seems to be some question of who is fastest, isn't next weekend the Texas Mile?


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## Profish00 (May 21, 2004)

berto said:


> a bolt on car with a tall gear going 186mph... no motor work... i sure wish u had a video of that 180+mph run.. i figured with 411 gears and a bolt on car u would run out of power and gear to hit that type of speed... especially in that heavy ws6..
> 
> heres my DD... she gets awesome gas mileage..


Your tail pipe is bent...The 4:10 gears threw his speedo off...lol


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## rockhound76 (Feb 22, 2007)

Tombo said:


> Since there seems to be some question of who is fastest, isn't next weekend the Texas Mile?


A little Subaru ad (click the video at the bottom):

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/04/12/video-subaru-ad-reminds-us-why-the-sti-rocks/

That's what I'm thinking...take it to the Texas Mile. Time to put up or shut up.....

http://www.wilsoncountynews.com/article.php?id=15076&n=sports-texas-mile-event-draws-crowd-to-goliad

Some guy in his Subaru Forester was sent back to tech to have his babyseat removed. He got back in his slightly modded baby-hauler and made a 158+mph. Hehehe.


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## LT280z (Oct 23, 2008)

wingnut said:


> There's NO replacement for Displacement!!


Sure there is....Turbo's and N2o. The two go together like peanut butter and jelly.


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## berto (Oct 14, 2004)

LT280z said:


> Sure there is....Turbo's and N2o. The two go together like peanut butter and jelly.


hmmm so do 500 + ci motors...


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## Brassnadz (Jun 18, 2007)

The best sounding engines in the world are good old american muscle. From the Radial types from WW2, the Allison V-1710 12 cylinder such as what powered the P51 Mustangs, all the way down to my Briggs&Stratton lawn mower. Every one of these sounds better than grandmas old Honda with the Folgers Fart Can exhaust 'systems' that we see the riceboys driving around in these days. Its no wonder they all have the boom box cranked up to 10. I couldnt take listening to that noise for more than a few minutes without pulling a Clint Eastwood move and putting a .44 through the engine block!

Nothing sounds like a good American pushrod engine. Put a Harley Sportster with a stock exhaust next to the most high dollar built up Japanese rice rocket and tell me which one sounds better. Now put a $500 set of Vance & Hines Side Shots or Short Shots on the Harley and if that doesnt do a better job than Viagra on you, you must be deaf.

Anyone who has ever stood next to a real original Hemi with some zoomies will attest to this. Also, in order for the ricers to make decent torque and HP they need to get the RPMs WAY up there. Ever wonder why some of the ricers redline at 15000 rpm, while the typical V-Twin rarely sees 1/3 of that? its because the stroke of the twins makes the power from idle on up. My sportster makes 70 foot pounds of torque while idling. A honda wont get that without revving up past the Harleys redline.

Even a Harley that is running on one cylinder sounds better than those fart cans.


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## royboy42 (Apr 28, 2007)

nothing can fk with that new mustang super snake. Best stang since the old classic muscles.


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## boom! (Jul 10, 2004)

bottles are for babies...


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## WilliamH (May 21, 2004)

berto said:


> hmmm so do 500 + ci motors...


I know what site you have been surfing.


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## bwguardian (Aug 30, 2005)

boomgoon said:


> bottles are for babies...


Haha...I like it. The last engine I built was with parts for laghin gas...never could bring myself to put it on the bottle.


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## drred4 (Aug 12, 2005)

Hey Berto, Looks like Justin Curry's new 10.5 ride. They burned it up pretty good last weekend.


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Thats a lie..youd rather drive a Yugo & a Fatchic..



Gilbert said:


> I would rather drive a twin turbo Supra.


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Since when is an all aluminum Ws6 a heavy ride? its just as heavy, if not lighter than the vette..I also have a Tremic 6 speed in it...or did I neglect to say that :biggrin:

It'll be @ the Kroger on Spring Cypress & Champion forrest next weekend..Sat Night:an2:
All you Car Buffs need to come out & take a peek @ the rides there..
Lots of Real American Muscle:an2:

a bolt on car with a tall gear going 186mph... no motor work... i sure wish u had a video of that 180+mph run.. i figured with 411 gears and a bolt on car u would run out of power and gear to hit that type of speed... especially in that heavy ws6..


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## Gilbert (May 25, 2004)

OxbowOutfitters said:


> Since when is an all aluminum Ws6 a heavy ride? its just as heavy, if not lighter than the vette..I also have a Tremic 6 speed in it...or did I neglect to say that :biggrin:
> 
> It'll be @ the Kroger on Spring Cypress & Champion forrest next weekend..Sat Night:an2:
> All you Car Buffs need to come out & take a peek @ the rides there..
> ...


lmao.....186mph in that POS ws6. Good one. :rotfl:


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## OxbowOutfitters (Feb 17, 2006)

Dang Boy...Im seein red...
You got away...this time..:rotfl:

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Gilbert again.


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## berto (Oct 14, 2004)

Holy **** are u for real? If u think your ws6 is lighter then a corvette your crazy, my z28 striped out weighs 3300 lbs. And yes its a ls1 also. No magic t56 but my vette bas a t56 and wont do 180. Guesz i guess i got a lemon lol I'm willing to bet your ws6 is 3600 lbs.


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## bone (May 28, 2004)

Nothing sounds like a good American pushrod engine. Put a Harley Sportster with a stock exhaust next to the most high dollar built up Japanese rice rocket and tell me which one sounds better. Now put a $500 set of Vance & Hines Side Shots or Short Shots on the Harley and if that doesnt do a better job than Viagra on you, you must be deaf.

"You have got to be kidding???? really!"


Anyone who has ever stood next to a real original Hemi with some zoomies will attest to this. Also, in order for the ricers to make decent torque and HP they need to get the RPMs WAY up there. Ever wonder why some of the ricers redline at 15000 rpm, while the typical V-Twin rarely sees 1/3 of that? its because the stroke of the twins makes the power from idle on up. My sportster makes 70 foot pounds of torque while idling. A honda wont get that without revving up past the Harleys redline.


"Really? So my 1300cc inline 4 suzuki doesnt have any torque? heck a typical V-twin has trouble getting out of its own way, much less out doing jap bikes. that 70 foot pounds of torque go downward the more you rev it, and louder is not fast or better. ever research anything?"

bone


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