# What to buy, budget $800-1000



## JamesAggie

I didn't want to jump in the AR thread although they are quite similar. I'm looking to buy a lightweight tactical type rifle. It will be used primarily for honlme defense, carrying around the ranch, target shooting, and shooting hogs. I would like to have something accurate to 200-300 yards. I have plenty of shotguns and handguns already, but no rifles. My dad was suggesting mini 14 or mini 30, but I've read many mixed reviews with these. Been looking a little at the AR platform but really don't know much about them. If I should save up more money that is fine as well, just looking for 2cool suggestions.

Thanks
James


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## Sgrem

Alexander Arms 6.5 Grendel is hard to improve on. Except it's accurate to 1000....hope thats ok....good for anything in North America except Brown Bear. Ammo is easy to get and a normal inventory regular stock item at all the normal ammo places. Recoil is similar to a .243 so any shooter can learn on it with a much more versatile and capable cartridge.

Mini 14 / 30 would have been awesome 30 yrs ago....


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## Csafisher

Haha I have a mini 14. It's been very relaible. As for accuracy, I can usually shoot about 1.5-1.75MOA at 100yd. So some ARs can beat that no doubt but it gets the job done. I know you can pick up a Colt 6920 for about 1k. But there are endless options, go find a gun store and pick some up.


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## theeyeguy

My custom builds start right at $800. There are definitely good ARs out there for less, but when you start customizing, you'll end up spending as much or more than building out like you want from the get go. At $800, for a light weight build, I have several options using recon profile barrels and light weight lowers (not poly) and everything I build uses a free float hand guard with either a quad rail or an optics rail with slots for other rails to placed where needed. Upgrading triggers, barrels, etc are all options as well.


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## Bigj

http://www.primaryarms.com/Radical_Firearms_RF_15_16_SOCOM_Rifle_with_12_MC_p/rf-580.htm 
https://www.primaryarms.com/Radical_Firearms_RF_15_Complete_Rifle_with_Free_Fl_p/rf-578.htm

Great gun good people to deal with There in Pearland


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## THE JAMMER

Bigj said:


> http://www.primaryarms.com/Radical_Firearms_RF_15_16_SOCOM_Rifle_with_12_MC_p/rf-580.htm
> http://www.primaryarms.com/Radical_Firearms_RF_15_Complete_Rifle_with_Free_Fl_p/rf-578.htm
> 
> Great gun good people to deal with There in Pearland


Will certainly 2nd the radical arms ad's and primary arms. Bought one of their ar pistols, and it shoots lights out. Especially for the price.


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## JamesAggie

sgrem said:


> Alexander Arms 6.5 Grendel is hard to improve on. Except it's accurate to 1000....hope thats ok....good for anything in North America except Brown Bear. Ammo is easy to get and a normal inventory regular stock item at all the normal ammo places. Recoil is similar to a .243 so any shooter can learn on it with a much more versatile and capable cartridge.
> 
> Mini 14 / 30 would have been awesome 30 yrs ago....


Read up on this one, how much do they run? Seems pricy.


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## cajunautoxer

I'd go with a Palmetto 20" AR in either a 5.56 or .308. You can get the blemished 5.56 lower with str stock for less than $200 right now. And upper for $350ish. 1/7 twist so 75 grain should do well. Of course the 308 will cost you a little more. I just received my 20" 308 upper from them. I'm gonna 0ut the lower together soon


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## Sgrem

JamesAggie said:


> Read up on this one, how much do they run? Seems pricy.


Search the normal gun sources. Can be had in the $900-$1400 range.


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## muney pit

The only cool thing about a mini is its looks and being able to use a staple to blow threw ammo IMHO. And I own one.


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## speckle-catcher

you can put together a 6.5 Grendel for less than about $850:

Uppers:
http://www.radicalfirearms.com/category-s/1856.htm

get an assembled lower from CDNN Sports or PSA for $250 or less.


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## JamesAggie

speckle-catcher said:


> you can put together a 6.5 Grendel for less than about $850:
> 
> Uppers:
> http://www.radicalfirearms.com/category-s/1856.htm
> 
> get an assembled lower from CDNN Sports or PSA for $250 or less.


Sorry for being naive about this. Would this build have the same ballistics as the Alexander Arms?


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## Bigj

Can you buy loads or do you have to hand load ??????


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## speckle-catcher

JamesAggie said:


> Sorry for being naive about this. Would this build have the same ballistics as the Alexander Arms?


 Somebody else can explain this better than I can - but a 6.5 Grendel is a 6.5 Grendel, no matter who makes it.

Alexander Arms created/developed the round - but has "released" it so that other manufacturers can make guns for that round.


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## JamesAggie

Does the 6.5 mean anything?


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## Sgrem

It is 6.5 mm......(like a a 7mm etc).... it is .264 (like .270 or .308 or .223 etc)

AA is just a top name manufacturer. They have lower end, middle, and top end offerings. But as mentioned above you can get the same caliber from numerous manufacturers or part out and build your own. As with most things you can go as bare bones get the job done to as high end as you want.


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## RB II

6.5mm/.264 caliber


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## Bocephus

I had a Mini 14 and sold it to another 2Cooler. It was very reliable, and fairly accurate, fun to shoot. It just became a safe queen once I started shooting AR's.

If I were you I'd get an AR. More accurate, tons of things you can do to trick one out. And Liberals hate them....that's the best reason of all to get one.

Bottom line I still enjoy the AR's and if I still had the Mini it would still be a safe queen. But don't get me wrong Mini's are fine overall if that's what you decide.


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## JamesAggie

Grendel ammunition is quite expensive compared to other rounds. Over $1 per round.


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## Sgrem

Check out gunbot.Com or ammoseek.Com....or academy or gander mtn or BPS....it is same price as similar quality ammo.


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## Jungle_Jim

This guy isn't ready for a 6.5 or a custom build. It looks like he wants a 5.56/.223 that he can get ammo for at walmart. Come on guys, are you pushing your pet caliber on a new guy?


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## Ernest

*Somebody else can explain this better than I can - but a 6.5 Grendel is a 6.5 Grendel, no matter who makes it.*

All properly built 6.5G's should fire factory ammo.

The differences in the available chambers include the tightness of the neck and the manner in which the throat is cut. AA sells weapons with a compound throat and NOT a tight neck. All around good performance. Others sell weapons with chambers cut to purportedly max. performance with certain bullet weights/shapes.

That's a general summary of a much longer story associated with the development/evolution of the round.


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## Sgrem

Jungle_Jim said:


> This guy isn't ready for a 6.5 or a custom build. It looks like he wants a 5.56/.223 that he can get ammo for at walmart. Come on guys, are you pushing your pet caliber on a new guy?


Silly.
6.5G is the max performance you can get out of an AR-15 platform period. They are no more expensive than any other quality AR.

.223 are great too for a different purpose And .223 definetely has the cheaper ammo options. But for all around home defense, hunting etc you can do so much more with a 6.5G.

I got rid of my .223 and got an AR 15 in .204 for predator/varmint hunting and 6.5 Grendel is the go to for everything else.


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## Bigj

sgrem said:


> But for all around home defense, hunting etc you can do so much more with a 6.5G.
> Now way I use it for home defense ....... Best home gun Shotgun by a longway


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## Sgrem

I agree. Shotgun for me too. But OP asking about AR's for All around use including hunting , plinking and HD.

AR makes a great backup to a shotgun for HD and certainly better than a Mini .... which is what he was asking.

OP doing his homework....


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## JamesAggie

I have a tactical shotgun and a few handguns, no rifles though. Looking for a good all around rifle for home, ranch, hogs, etc. I don't currently hunt big game, but may in the future. I do LOTS of outdoors activity and want to add something to my arsenal. Anything I buy I will lake excellent care of. AR platforms seem very versatile, I just don't know much about them, so I cone to the 2cool "experts." I grew up with ranch rifles. I appreciate any advice any of you can give me, no matter your experience level. 

James


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## cajunautoxer

Why would someone want a Grendel round for 300 yard shots? Or much less inside for self defense. I use to be those guys who said a shotgun is best for home defense. That's until I started shooting 3 gun and realized how much slower a shotgun. Plus the fact that if your shooting buck you really can't say one of the buck shot won't miss it's target and hit a family member on another side of the wall.


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## cajunautoxer

And taking a quick look the cheapest cost per round was .85 that's a big price difference imo. Your only as good as you practice and I like to shoot 5k rnds per yr.


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## Jungle_Jim

Shotgun is not the best for home defense for many reasons. 6.5 Grendel is a great round. I never said it wasn't. The OP was looking for an AR15 within a certain budget. The advice he got was to build or buy an Ar15 in a caliber that ammo is not plentiful or readily available. All of you need to remember where you started with ARs. You didn't start with a 50 Beowulf or Grendel for a reason. My post was not silly. It was practical.
OP go to midway and price a box of 6.5 Grendel vs a box of 5.56/.223 and tell me what you would rather pay.


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## Ernest

*Why would someone want a Grendel round for 300 yard shots? Or much less inside for self defense.*

The 6.5G is the AK round, necked down to 6.5 from 7.62, and then the shoulder is blown forward. It does everything the AK round does, and then some. 129 grains of soft point goodness is a heck of hammer inside 300 yards. And, if you want, it spits out this 129 grains of soft point goodness at velocities higher than an AK.

Tough to argue the AK is a poor choice for shots at closer ranges. May not be the best choice, but its a decent choice. The 6.5G is an improved AK round. Considerably improved.


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## Sgrem

I started with an AR in .204 when that round first came out.
Then got a Grendel when that round first became a stocking item at all major ammo dealers. Have never had a problem finding or buying ammo. Never even looked very hard. The ammo argument just isn't valid. 

It doesn't compare to a .223 cuz a .223 can't compare....

So what is the cheapest .223 vs the cheapest Grendel price wise.... or even a decent AR build in either caliber....both would be in his price range.

Choice is very simple in my opinion. Very light easy to handle, takes all AR 15 accessories and custom gear, infinitely more capable at 300 and still supersonic at 1000. No other AR 15 caliber available can generate that performance. 

Where is the downside? What is a better choice? Mini 14 maybe....roll eyes...not.

For possibility of big game hunting opportunities 6.5G would be excellent choice. Lots of elk have dropped to the 6.5G at 400 yds and beyond. Culling operations using it extensively.


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## Jungle_Jim

I think you are missing my point.


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## Sgrem

You are right. Lots of .223 AR's out there. Getcha some.

What are we missing? OP doing his homework and fleshing out the options. Many of us have done the Same. These are the conclusions some of us have come to after doing similar homework. Or are you saying somehow he needs to be an expert for anything that isn't a .223?

.223 ammo is cheaper than .243 or 6.5G.....Or .270....or 7mm....


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## Jungle_Jim

sgrem said:


> You are right. Lots of .223 AR's out there. Getcha some.
> 
> What are we missing? OP doing his homework and fleshing out the options. Many of us have done the Same. These are the conclusions some of us have come to after doing similar homework.
> 
> .223 ammo is cheaper than .243 or 6.5G.....Or .270....or 7mm....


 6.5 Grendel is ballistically superior to 5.56. I never said it wasn't. You must admit that ammo availability is sketchy, especially when buying in bulk. Most people who are using an AR for an all around gun including plinking do not want to pay over $1.00 per shot to do that. There are other considerations as well, but you are just being snarky with your "getcha some" comments....


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## Sgrem

Never had a problem getting ammo in bulk from ammoseek, gunbot 500 to 1000 or so rounds at a time. academy, BPS, or gander have as standard stocking inventory. 

.223 is cheaper If that is main motivator.


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## Jungle_Jim

sgrem said:


> Never had a problem getting ammo in bulk from ammoseek, gunbot 500 to 1000 or so rounds at a time. academy, BPS, or gander have as standard stocking inventory.
> 
> .223 is cheaper If that is main motivator.


What length barrel are you running on your Grendel?
What scope?


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## Sgrem

two upper setups one with a 24" barrel and another with 14.5" with a pinned/welded flash hider For legal 16" overall.

Zeiss HD5 5x25

Quick simple search on ammo seek or gun bot shows plenty of wolf plinking ammo at $0.47 a round and plenty of quality ammo in bulk quantities.


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## muney pit

sgrem said:


> two upper setups one with a 24" barrel and another with 14.5" with a pinned/welded flash hider For legal 16" overall.
> 
> Zeiss HD5 5x25
> 
> Quick simple search on ammo seek or gun bot shows plenty of wolf plinking ammo at $0.47 a round and plenty of quality ammo in bulk quantities.


And 223 is half that at .21 â‚¬ a rd. Its also at every academy & bps. I wouldnt tell someone to start with anything other than a 223/556 to just plink and get use to the platform myself, now if he said he was wanting another upper, then sure.


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## Sgrem

If someone never owned a truck and needed something for good all around daily driving, taking to the lease, and might get a boat to tow in the future would you tell them to get a Good entry level Ford Ranger because they are cheaper and way cheaper to feed?.... or is an F 150 or even F 250 simply a much better option.

If you are going to have one truck.....or one rifle and that rifle will be an AR15 to use for everything....what is the best option?


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## Jungle_Jim

sgrem said:


> If someone never owned a truck and needed something for good all around daily driving, taking to the lease, and might get a boat to tow in the future would you tell them to get a Good entry level Ford Ranger because they are cheaper and way cheaper to feed?.... or is an F 150 or even F 250 simply a much better option.
> 
> If you are going to have one truck.....or one rifle and that rifle will be an AR15 to use for everything....what is the best option?


To be blunt about it a 5-25X scope is not optimal for home defense, in fact it is stupid.. How much home defense do you do at 300 yards? I also don't buy an F250 to haul my 4wheeler. You have a fine long range and hunting gun. It is not a home defense general purpose rifle.


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## Sgrem

Agreed. That scope is on 24" barrel certainly not on my 16" HD setup.....HD setup doesn't have a scope....but that's not what was asked.


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## Jungle_Jim

sgrem said:


> Agreed. That scope is on 24" barrel certainly not on my 16" HD setup.....HD setup doesn't have a scope....but that's not what was asked.


It was what was asked. The OP said *"I'm looking to buy a lightweight tactical type rifle. It will be used primarily for honlme defense, carrying around the ranch, target shooting, and shooting hogs. I would like to have something accurate to 200-300 yards." *

If I was buying an AR15 for hunting and long range only I would get exactly what you have (6.5 Grendel) with variable scope. 
He wants a light weight tactical rifle primarily for home defense, target shooting and shooting hogs.


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## Sgrem

Jungle_Jim said:


> What length barrel are you running on your Grendel?
> What scope?


In this you asked barrel...and scope.

I never mentioned scope till this question.

For the OP I would recommend open sights, 18" barrel.....with a quick detach Zeiss HD5 2x10. For normal access HD leave scope off.....add scope when ranch riding/hunting.


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## JamesAggie

Great discussion guys. Lots to think about. I've messaged several of you and am doing more research. Going to go lay my hands on some ARs. Please keep suggestions coming. If you see any good deals please pass them along.


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## Jungle_Jim

I suggest that you go to Lezz Go's place and put your hands on a Daniel Defense. You won't be disappointed.


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## JamesAggie

Jungle_Jim said:


> I suggest that you go to Lezz Go's place and put your hands on a Daniel Defense. You won't be disappointed.


What place would that be?


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## Bigj

Jungle_Jim said:


> I suggest that you go to Lezz Go's place and put your hands on a Daniel Defense. You won't be disappointed.


1000.00 budget just went out the door ...... But well worth the money!!!!!!!!


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## Jungle_Jim

JamesAggie said:


> What place would that be?


Big Guy's Shooting Supplies in Pearland. He is a sponsor here. 281-731-4850

I am in no way affiliated with that store, I live 10 hours from there and have never met the owner. He posted a few days ago that he was carrying them now. It will be more than 1K, but not much more.


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## Lezz Go

I have some more Daniels coming in 

Have a new Battle Rifle BR4 Spectre in the store. FDE with black furniture. $1295.


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## JamesAggie

I will find a day in the next couple weeks and come by for an education.


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## Pocketfisherman

Look at a PTR in .308, it's a civilian version of the well respected H&K 91/ 92 assault rifle.


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## JamesAggie

Pocketfisherman said:


> Look at a PTR in .308, it's a civilian version of the well respected H&K 91/ 92 assault rifle.


Very interesting weapon. Will have to lay my hands on one. Really like the price point for what you get.


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## Jungle_Jim

Be aware of some issues with the PTR-91. They have a fluted chamber which has the potential to ruin your brass. The PTR-91 also has very strong extraction/ejection and will tear the rim off of cases. if you are a reloader the PTR 91 will ****** you off.
The PTR91 is also not modular. It is difficult to attach lights, optics etc that you may want to add.
All the being said they are very reliable and while they are not tack drivers they are more accurate than similar rifles such as the FAL.

Jim

eta: Brand new HK magazines are about $80.00 each. You can get used ones much cheaper.


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## JamesAggie

What is the general concensus on steel cased ammo. I know my Kimber hates it. Are AR platforms just as temperamental? Looking at 5.56 and 7.62. Feeding issues?


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## MrG

My two Windhams eat steel like candy. I had a Colt that was a bit pickier but usually ran fine. Some say it's hard on extractors.


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## el dorado

MrG said:


> My two Windhams eat steel like candy. I had a Colt that was a bit pickier but usually ran fine. Some say it's hard on extractors.


^^x2. Most Mil spec AR's will feed it just fine until that extractor breaks. I will say that I've only broke two extractors, both with brass cases and both on 3 rd bursts.


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## theeyeguy

Steel case is fine, just most is dirty. Clean after and you're good. Now, most of your brass cased rounds are more consistent and more accurate, so I usually run brass for that reason.


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## CHARLIE

Here's an idea

Get you and old at least 70 year old GI 30 carbine. Great ranch and truck gun. Fun to shoot only short coming wont do the 300 yard deal. Good to 100. Just caint hurt them.


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## JamesAggie

I've been doing alot of thinking and research. I think I'm going to step it up to a .308 caliber. I may have to save a bit more but that is ok. I really like the reliability if the ptr91, seems like a great SHTF gun. Any other .308 battle rifles come in close to this same price point and rugged reliability? I don't plan on reloading.


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## Sgrem

6.5 Grendel ballistics are not far off of a .308....but to step up to .308 you are looking at that ptr91 or AR10 platform....everything there is much more expensive and heavier....

Good luck let us know what you end up with.


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## muney pit

Have you considered an ak. Like a WASR or a 74 like this? Just an idea
https://www.classicfirearms.com/ak74-rifle-bulgarian-us-parts


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## andre3k

muney pit said:


> Have you considered an ak. Like a WASR or a 74 like this? Just an idea
> http://www.classicfirearms.com/ak74-rifle-bulgarian-us-parts


Man they just had those on sale for $499. I looked really hard at one. They've been getting consistent good reviews.


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## Superman70

Wal mart here has a true Colt AR for 890. And they are out there for 600 from others. Unless you spend a whole bunch, They all do the same thing.


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## muney pit

andre3k said:


> Man they just had those on sale for $499. I looked really hard at one. They've been getting consistent good reviews.


Whatcha doing following the AK world.


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## Jungle_Jim

OP, you do realize that rifle weighs 9.7 lbs unloaded, over 10 loaded? They are good rifles but in your original post you stated you wanted a light weight rifle.
I am a bit confused as to what you are looking for. if you are wanting a "battle rifle" then the PTR 91 is great. If you are wanting to stay lighter than that and still have the ability to hit at long range the 6.5 Grendel is a top contender weighs less than PTR91 and hits accurately at least as far, maybe farther...


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## Ernest

*Any other .308 battle rifles come in close to this same price point and rugged reliability?*

AR-10's and FAL - the right arm of the free world.

FAL will tend to exhibit less felt recoil compared to the HK91. But, to accurize an FAL, truly accurize them, its more money. But, if its just a SHTF sorta weapon, they are an excellent choice.

Then, of course, there are the versions of the M1A.


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## Pocketfisherman

Jungle_Jim said:


> Be aware of some issues with the PTR-91. They have a fluted chamber which has the potential to ruin your brass. The PTR-91 also has very strong extraction/ejection and will tear the rim off of cases. if you are a reloader the PTR 91 will ****** you off.
> The PTR91 is also not modular. It is difficult to attach lights, optics etc that you may want to add.
> All the being said they are very reliable and while they are not tack drivers they are more accurate than similar rifles such as the FAL.
> 
> Jim
> 
> eta: Brand new HK magazines are about $80.00 each. You can get used ones much cheaper.


You can get magazines all day long for the PTR for less than $5 for 20 rounders. That is one of the big pro's for it IMHO. Though not modular, there are versions with either a half rail on the receiver, or a full rail down the barrel. There are also folding and telescoping and wood stock options. Like an AR, it is super easy to take down. The biggest plus IMHO is no gas system. The biggest minus is they dent the brass, some way worse than others. I am lucky to have on that just puts a dimple in the case mouth which comes out during re-sizing. Mine feeds every 308 round I have ever tried without problem.

Magazines - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/19...-cetme-308-winchester-20-round-aluminum-black


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## JamesAggie

Jungle_Jim said:


> OP, you do realize that rifle weighs 9.7 lbs unloaded, over 10 loaded? They are good rifles but in your original post you stated you wanted a light weight rifle.
> I am a bit confused as to what you are looking for. if you are wanting a "battle rifle" then the PTR 91 is great. If you are wanting to stay lighter than that and still have the ability to hit at long range the 6.5 Grendel is a top contender weighs less than PTR91 and hits accurately at least as far, maybe farther...


Hey Jim,

You are correct. I was originally looking for something in the lighter weight range and the 6.5 Grendel was a top contender (may still be). The biggest issue with the Grendel is ammo availability. I would most likely have to order it online, academy on the north side of Houston does not carry it (haven't checked Gander). If there was another ammo shortage I would definitely not be able to find it, whereas 7.62 x 51 is available everywhere. I like the PTR because it is just a rugged, badass, simple rifle. It easily has the range I'm looking for, simple to break down, and not as finicky as an AR10 (from what I've read). I recognize they aren't as modular as ARs, but they do make some that are. Appreciate all the feedback guys!

http://www.ptr91.com/products/PTR 91 KFM4R?id=5
http://www.ptr91.com/products/PTR TXR?id=48
http://www.ptr91.com/products/PTR 91 KFM4 Legacy Model*?id=3


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## Jungle_Jim

Good luck James


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## capt mullet

Many factors to think about.
1. cost of gun
2. cost of bullets

An M1A Scout (20 inch barrel) is a great ranch gun.

It is probably one of the funnest guns for plinking since it is semi and holds 20 rounds. 

Great for hogs, plinking or taking out a small band of muslim terrorists threatening your property.
It is a great weapon for what you mentioned. However it is about $1200-1300.

If ammo and gun costs are to be kept at a minimum then no doubt a slightly custom AR in 5.56 would be your best choice. If ammo cost was not an issue then a 6.8 AR would be my next choice.

Lots of factors you really have to decide on.


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## cajunautoxer

I just picked up 2 DPMS 3g2 for $780 each


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## Lezz Go

I have a Windham AR-15 with Magpul ATACS camo for $750. It will be here Wed.


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## JamesAggie

Haven't got anything yet. Budget is a bit higher, around $1300. Have been so busy haven't been able to get my hands on any rifles yet.


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## Blindluck

Any thoughts on an ak-47 ? Ammo is cheap and plentiful. Larger round can really smack a hog. For under 1k you can get some great rifles.


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## muney pit

Blindluck said:


> Any thoughts on an ak-47 ? Ammo is cheap and plentiful. Larger round can really smack a hog. For under 1k you can get some great rifles.


LOL, thats what i said a few pages back. I loves AR's but AK's are...well....AK's . Arsanal slr 104's are a bit above 1K. There was a deal a few weeks ago for a ddi 74 for $500. Got good reviews but thats over with and sold out. WW 74's were good until they started using there own in house recievers and they were ****t. supposedly they have fixed the heat treating problems. For a first time AK buyer i would point toward a WASR right now. Best buy out there and the wood usally comes out awesome when redone. Either way, check out this website. Lots of AR's & AK's for under 800.

https://www.classicfirearms.com/long-guns/


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## Ernest

*Any thoughts on an ak-47 ?*

Quality ammo is not cheaper.

Poor sight radius, crude sights, more difficult to mount optics, few premium barrel choices, only two caliber choices, and large reciprocating mass tends to undermine accuracy. Poor triggers.

Further, it has junk for ballistics relative to the caliber choices available on the AR platform. Out of your typical AK (not a longer barreled SKS), you are looking at real world 2100 fps on a 123 grain projectile with garbage for a BC for much of the ammo. In the 6.5, you are looking at 2500 on a 123 gr. projectile with excellent BC. Or, a 100 grain projectile specifically designed for a hunting application at 2750.

In a hunting application, an SKS is likely a better choice than an AK. Better accuracy, better sight radius, and higher velocity with the longer barrel. Still, garbage ammo.


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## Blindluck

Many scope mount options for Ak that don't involve dust cover. He said he was pretty much having fun. He's not shooting 1000 yards. 2-300 yards is what the Ak was built for. You can get an arsenal for about 1k and the rifle will continue to go up in value. The Grendel is a far superior round. Quality ammo can be had for the 7.62x39 round. It also has ammo that you can afford to shoot all day with friends and family. I love my ar's and my ak's.


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## muney pit

Compairing the ak vs ar has been done and beat to death. Op is looking for a reliable gun for under 800 and an ak is a fine choice for all of folks. As far as accuracy its known a ak is usally a 3moa gun with a lighter trigger than a ar but longer. So what. Junk ballistics? The 762x39 is right with a 30-30 and i dont believe anyone would call that round junk. Ammo, well wolf, tula, red army, surplus yugo, golden tiger are all fine ammo and with a soft point can take a 2 or 4 legged animal down pretty F in quick. No need to be one sided about which is better, they're just different.


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## Bharvey

If your budget is going upwards, check out Texas Black Rifle Company out of Shiner, TX. The gun is machined there on site. They have a regular MOE model AR for right at a $1000. Everything else runs upwards from there. I have one and love it! The MOE has all Magpul furniture. If you get one of the higher-end ones then everything is magpul except for the rail/handgaurd; which is custom made at TBRC.


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## Lezz Go

Just got in a new Daniel defense DDW-V9 LW Awesome AR.


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## muney pit

Lezz Go said:


> Just got in a new Daniel defense DDW-V9 LW Awesome AR.


Thats a nice stick for sure. I like the looks of those.


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## muney pit

Had a buddy just send me a link to a rifle kit minus the lower for $370. Buy a lower at a local store for $100 or less and ya got a starter AR for less than $500. Not bad. I dont know the company but they are selling the kits with 1in 8 barrels so at least it looks good on papper. LoL

http://www.groundzeroprecision.com/collections/ar-15-carbine-rifle-complete-build-kits


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## theeyeguy

Those don't include a handguard or stock, so you'll have to add that in. Those don't have to be much, but need to be factored in. Not a bad deal regardless, but you're still pushing about $475 when it's all said and done with. 

Delta ring is $16
Handguard $15
Lower $75
FFL fee at Texian Firearms $20 (coudn't resist)


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## Sgrem

Legos for adults.


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## Jungle_Jim

sgrem said:


> Legos for adults.


I have always said it's Barbie for men...


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## muney pit

theeyeguy said:


> Those don't include a handguard or stock, so you'll have to add that in. Those don't have to be much, but need to be factored in. Not a bad deal regardless, but you're still pushing about $475 when it's all said and done with.
> 
> Delta ring is $16
> Handguard $15
> Lower $75
> FFL fee at Texian Firearms $20 (coudn't resist)


You dont carry those Anderson lowers for $40?http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.a....+Lower+Receiver+w/+Trigger+Guard&groupid=722

& i guess you ment $20 for online ffl transfers right?

I wish someone local would carry those $40 lowers in store. Thats would be cool to pick one up a week till ya had a whole box full for the next panic


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## theeyeguy

Yeah, those are being clearanced out and is not a permanent price for them. Anderson went way overboard on production and are still trying to get rid of parts. My cost on getting those is about $39 and a lot of places are doing those as loss leaders. We generally try to avoid selling stuff that people are doing crazy prices on because even if I have fair pricing on it, people absolutely freak out and think I'm ripping them for having a $65 price tag on it. Forget the fact that you're not having to deal add in shipping or FFL fees. As such, I do stay away from them usually. That being said, if you want to I do actually have Mag Tactical lowers in stock at all times for $99 ($85 for 2cool)


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## muney pit

theeyeguy said:


> Yeah, those are being clearanced out and is not a permanent price for them. Anderson went way overboard on production and are still trying to get rid of parts. My cost on getting those is about $39 and a lot of places are doing those as loss leaders. We generally try to avoid selling stuff that people are doing crazy prices on because even if I have fair pricing on it, people absolutely freak out and think I'm ripping them for having a $65 price tag on it. Forget the fact that you're not having to deal add in shipping or FFL fees. As such, I do stay away from them usually. That being said, if you want to I do actually have Mag Tactical lowers in stock at all times for $99 ($85 for 2cool)


If i wasnt 2 hours away i would swing by and buy a few. I only get that way when i go shoot at American shooting center and use there 600 yard line. With the weather its hard to do any shooting or fishing much but i might try and make over that way in the next few weeks. Thanks for the info


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## CoastalOutfitters

I have a Ruger mini-30 , which is the mini14 in 7.62X39 which is no more than a 30-30 automatic ballistic-ally.

factory trigger pull is pathetic, spare magazines online only, shoots a 3MOA group at 100 at best off bags.

has dropped many hogs and a few deer, none seemed to care about the group size.


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## theeyeguy

CoastalOutfitters said:


> I have a Ruger mini-30 , which is the mini14 in 7.62X39 which is no more than a 30-30 automatic ballistic-ally.
> 
> factory trigger pull is pathetic, spare magazines online only, shoots a 3MOA group at 100 at best off bags.
> 
> has dropped many hogs and a few deer, none seemed to care about the group size.


Cool gun but most have major issues with steel case.


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## Jeff Dean

Lezz Go said:


> I have some more Daniels coming in
> 
> Have a new Battle Rifle BR4 Spectre in the store. FDE with black furniture. $1295.


Any chance you still have this one? If so can you post a pic? I am interested.


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## Lezz Go

Jeff Dean said:


> Any chance you still have this one? If so can you post a pic? I am interested.


I'm picking up the Battle Rifle tomorrow. It's the Spectre in FDE.

I have a DD M4 V9 LW at the shop.


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## dwilliams35

JamesAggie said:


> I've been doing alot of thinking and research. I think I'm going to step it up to a .308 caliber. I may have to save a bit more but that is ok. I really like the reliability if the ptr91, seems like a great SHTF gun. Any other .308 battle rifles come in close to this same price point and rugged reliability? I don't plan on reloading.


 Not hard to get a DPMS Oracle or similar in .308 for under $900.. Basic guns, reliable, reasonably accurate.


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## muney pit

dwilliams35 said:


> Not hard to get a DPMS Oracle or similar in .308 for under $900.. Basic guns, reliable, reasonably accurate.


And dont let people tell ya that dpms is junk. My lr308 is a solid 1moa performer. One of the best targets id ever done with a semi was with that gun. Got a pic somewhere. Crazy group at 100.

Eta. I knew i had a pic. I shot it years ago when i first got it. Before i started reloading and only used federal gold match.







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## Jungle_Jim

DPMS is not junk, unless you get a junk one. QC is the problem. Muney's DPMS appears to be a great one. A Dr. friend of mine bought a DPMS 308 and it is a single shot..... It is currently back at DPMS to be fixed. It's been there 2 months. DPMS and Bushmaster are hit and miss.


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## dwilliams35

Jungle_Jim said:


> DPMS is not junk, unless you get a junk one. QC is the problem. Muney's DPMS appears to be a great one. A Dr. friend of mine bought a DPMS 308 and it is a single shot..... It is currently back at DPMS to be fixed. It's been there 2 months. DPMS and Bushmaster are hit and miss.


I've got an LR308 that is a solid, solid performer: the main thing that is "junk" about them is the trigger. I've yet to see a factory DPMS trigger that wasn't awful. $279 and a call to Mr. Geissele and the gun's awesome..


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## Jungle_Jim

dwilliams35 said:


> I've got an LR308 that is a solid, solid performer: the main thing that is "junk" about them is the trigger. I've yet to see a factory DPMS trigger that wasn't awful. $279 and a call to Mr. Geissele and the gun's awesome..


 I am a Geissele fan big time. I do not own an AR that doesn't have one in it.


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## theeyeguy

dwilliams35 said:


> Not hard to get a DPMS Oracle or similar in .308 for under $900.. Basic guns, reliable, reasonably accurate.


I do them for $799. Haven't had any problems with the ones that I've sold, but the cool part is I can trouble shoot most things without sending them back in.


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