# Game Warden ?????s



## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Last Sat morn, I was down in my back and tcouldnt hunt so I talked a good friend into sitting on my tripod and taking a doe. He saw 10 deer and did take a shot at a doe, at 10 he called me at home and told me he thinks he missed a deer and would I come and help him look some more. I threw on a pr of overalls which happened to be camo and got my 22mag and left for the hunting club. I live less than a 1/4 mile from gate which is down a county rd. Upon investigating his shot and it was indeed a miss we started towards my house. In the short trip down the county rd we passed a game warden (new to the area) and he pulled us over. He thretened us with tickets for riding down rd, he then asked us for our hunting lisc. I had failed to pick mine up when leaving the house and told him so and told him I live less than 200yrds from where he had us pulled over and told him I could run get them. In short he told me I was getting a ticket for hunting without a liscense and was NOT going to let me get them for him to see. This really ****** me off and I told him I hadnt been hunting, to say the least he was ****** at what I said. He said I was on a four wheeler and had camo and had a gun and I WAS hunting. I told him I was NO different than someone riding down the road with a gun in there car or truck and that what he was saying gave him the right to stop anyone with a gun in there vehicle and ask for hunting lisc. and ticket them if they didnt have one. Then I proceeded to eat his *** out for doing DPS work and getting paid with $$$ taken from my hunting lis fees not the same $$$ that a DPS officer gets paid with, and for my $$ I would much rather see him do the job he was trained for. I guess we will see radar in there trucks next. I told him if he did write me for no hunting lis I would plead NG and then appeal it to county crt. He ended up writing me a warning ticket as I dont think he wanted to appear in court with a bunch of hunters as a jury. would like a little input about this incedent both the hunting with no lis and a Game Warden/Highway Patrol


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## CHunter (May 25, 2004)

One thing I know is not to **** 'em off, I believe they have more power than a DPS officer. Its always good to score the relationship with them before you go out hunting or invite them into your camp for a soft drink or coffee. I pulled a Warden out of 2 different mudholes after he got stuck, ended up being a really nice fellow after getting to know him, you'd be surprised at the stuff they will let you get away with after developing a relationship.....then they transfered him to the San Angelo area....figures...LOL


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## Palmetto (Jun 28, 2004)

What a jerk. Sounds like an abuse of power.


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## TooShallow (May 21, 2004)

Probably a new young warden. Sometimes they are gung ho right out of the gate. A little time in the field will probably fix that. On the other hand you would be surprised at the stuff people try to pull on them. So don't be to quick to judge his demeanor. He obviously realized that you guys were on the good side after a while, hence the warning ticket. If he is going to be in your neck of the woods for a while it would be a good idea not to get on his bad side. Most all wardens I know are really good people once you get to know them and can be really helpful if you ever have a problem.


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## Reel_Blessed II (Jun 24, 2004)

FYI guys....I just learned this last week. My uncle hunts up by Buchannon Lake and a game warden came to their camp site. One hunter had a deer strung up and the warden asked who shot that deer and asked for his license. My uncle asked the warden if he needed to see his license. Here is the gest of what the warden told him. "You can show me your license but we cannot ask to see your license unless you are in the act of hunting or there's evidence of hunting" Obviously, a shot deer hanging in a tree is evidence of that so he just asked for the guy who shot that deer. According to this warden, unless you are sitting in a deer blind or a ground blind, you're not hunting. Riding around on a 4-wheeler with a gun wearing camo doesn't constitute hunting. I would have pleaded my case to this warden as well. He probably knew he didn't have a case. Seems like he wants to rule that area by fear. Just my $.02.


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## Spots and Dots (May 23, 2004)

You have to figure that the law has heard a million LAME excuses about why somebody did something......in your case, the guy saw what he saw, and had to do what he thought was right.

I agree with you that he took it a bit too far, but they are human too, and stuff happens. THat is why you have the right to a trial by jury.


just my $.02. Not trying to ruffle any feathers.


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## FormerHR (May 21, 2004)

> I threw on a pr of overalls which happened to be camo and got my 22mag and left for the hunting club.


If it dresses like a hunter, carries a gun like a hunter, and rides a four wheeler like a hunter....then it must be a hunter.



> He thretened us with tickets for riding down rd


It is illegal to ride a four wheeler on the road, the ditches are included in this.



> In short he told me I was getting a ticket for hunting without a liscense and was NOT going to let me get them for him to see.


Supposed to have it on you at all times while hunting. The guys around here would do the same thing. You can take it to the judge and they can dismiss.



> Then I proceeded to eat his *** out for doing DPS work and getting paid with $$ taken from my hunting lis fees not the same $$ that a DPS officer gets paid with, and for my $ I would much rather see him do the job he was trained for.


He was using your illegal riding of the four wheeler down the road as probable cause for his stop to investigate a possible violation of game laws. And the "my money pays your salary" thing is a little old.



> I guess we will see radar in there trucks next.


Doubtful



> I told him if he did write me for no hunting lis I would plead NG and then appeal it to county crt. He ended up writing me a warning ticket as I dont think he wanted to appear in court with a bunch of hunters as a jury.


I think during his interview he probably determined you were not in fact a road hunter, if he thought you were you would have received a trip to the pokey. And I for one would jump at the chance on a jury to hammer a road hunter. I'm assuming you probably got a warning for operating an ATV on a public roadway?

Cut this warden some slack. From the little bit I read here you could of been scratched a lot of tickets for the atv violations alone, maybe you ought to thank him for that.

I've changed a lot in this post from when I started so it didn't come off so harsh. My intent here was to look at it from the warden's point of view, not slam you.


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## BoHonk445 (Oct 8, 2004)

You were in the wrong. Your attitude seems poor, although I'm sure his was not the best. Why would you take a .22Mag with you to possibly put down the deer? You cannot shoot a deer with a .22Mag under any circumstances. You also cannot drive an unregistered vehicle (ATV) on a public roadway. You have to remember he acted upon what he OBSERVED. A guy in camo, without a license, on a 4 wheeler with a gun. The game warden has the right to pull you over without observing any (DPS) traffic violations. Fight it in court if you feel you were legal. Or, you can continue to whine about a small percentage of persons willing to work for little money and even less respect, yet still protect the citizens of this state from illegal hunting practices.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

I have been stopped by 4 wardens in my life. And I can say that each time the warden was very professional and friendly..of course I have been in compliance with the law each of those 4 times. A game warden has more authority than any law enforcement officer in this state. They have more lienency when it comes to search and siezure laws and can enforce any and all laws in the state. Wet D you said you ate his *** out? Really your lucky you didn't go to jail. Saying that there are definetly A-holes in every profession. From your story it sounds like this warden had all the probable cause he needed to stop you. Alot of times our attitude dictates their attitude. You said He threatened you with tickets. That statement in itself says that he was not going to give you a ticket....you probably would have been better off telling him you were sorry and it wouldn't ever happen again and thank him for not writing you up. If I were a warden and you chewed me out like you said you did him...you would have left with more than a warning ticket. And the statement that he would not let you go back to your house and get your license. That would have been the stupidest thing he could have let you do. That is just opening up the door for him to get hurt. He has no idea if you would have retrieved a weapon or if someone else would be at the house that could hurt him....He wants to go home after his shift is over...not leave in a pine box. If I were you next time I saw him I would shake his hand and apologize for the entire event. I bet money he would say it was okay and ya'll could be buds for a long time.


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## Reel_Blessed II (Jun 24, 2004)

Good post Bucksnort. I agree with you. My post was mainly dealing with a warden writing a ticket for no hunting license. But he did have a right to pull an ATV over to make sure there are no shinanagans (that's a funny word really) goig on.


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## Suthsayer (Sep 27, 2004)

Bucksort, Bohonk, FormerHr, you all have really good points and I completely agree. Sort of took the words right out of my mouth. I would like to add that what these guys do for a living helps to insure our hunting and fishing resources will be there in the future and 98.6% of everyone they deal with has a gun or a knife on them! And that can be a little scary in the backwood of East Texas, in an isolated back bay, or in the dark of night!!!


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

I had to cut and run on my earlier post as daylite was comming and I had to get in my stand. I did drive my ATV down the side of the rd. and I did carry my hunting and fishing lisc. I got ragged a little in a cpl the earlier post about riding down the rd, carring and useing a 22mag. to put down a deer, a possible rd hunter. First of all let me say I'm 51 been hunting since a very early age (7) and have to utmost respect for the law. I have been dealing with Game Wardens and are VERY close friends with the present and past Dist head here in the Golden Tri. for a number of yrs., as my family ran a deer processing and Taxidery bussiness for yrs and was constantly visited by them and drank several cups of coffe at the shop BSing with them. As a matter of fact our Taxidermy bussiness has mounted 6 whole deer for the TPW to use in there Rd. hunting problem. I know the laws of the hiway and game laws, and I was taught at a early age to get respect you had to show respect. Yrs ago when you were pulled over for a check by the GW you were guilty until you proved youself innocent thank God this has changed. This guy left with a better opion of me than when he started. He did NOT threaten me he told me shortly he was going to write me up for hunting with no lisc. upon him saying this my friend who I had helped look for the deer told him outrite that I did not go hunting that morning and offered to go 200 yrds to my home and get them for me while we wait, once again he said I was getting a ticket. I know for a fact he could have made a call on his radio or cell and in a few seconds he would have been assured I had a lisc. This guy is a new GW and is about 24, from Harris Co. and has been in this area since July 1, and has a lot to learn and is going to make a good one, once he finds out that not everybody here in SeTexas is a "Backwoods outlaw *******". Now to the 22mag issue I think everybody over 10 knows its against the law to shoot deer with a rimfire but to finish up a deer its one of the best and also very deadly on hogs. As far as riding a ATV down the side of a Farm Rd. it is against the law that I know but here close is a Subdivision (Pinewood) where 8yr old kids drive golf carts down the streets as well as adults to and from the store and golf course, what about the little scooters both 2 and 4 wheeled you see EVERYWHERE. I WAS in the ditch, which I KNOW IS state property, but come on guys a little common sense here. As far as the radar it was mostly BS but who knows what mite happen in the future, its just my opinion BUT I would like to see the money I spend for hunting n fishn lisn. and money spent in anything the TPW promotes stay in TPW and not have GWs doing work the DPS get paid for with other tax $$, when he can be doing something to protect our resources, I dont EVER recall seeing a DPS officer checking hunting lisc. and looking for game violations. From what you guys said it would be ok to take our tax money from hunting and use for our hiways by having them ticket people for driving violations. We have enough problems with trying to fight to keep our right to hunt. Once again whats the difference in me riding a ATV in the ditch with a gun and a guy driving a truck or car down I 10 to or from his hunting area with a gun, does the guy on I 10 need a hunting lisn????


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## Northtexan (Sep 21, 2004)

The game warden saw a guy on a 4 wheeler, wearing camo, and posessing a rifle during hunting season, he had every right to stop and question you about what you were doing. He is a law enforcement officer and in his mind he was investigating whether a law was being or had been broken. Game wardens are not out there to harrass you or anyone else, they are there to enforce the law and for our protection and the protection of the natural resources this great state has to offer.


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

Just like the sorry a-- beaches here in galveston, you can ride electric carts or what have you on them but not motorized, such as 4 wheelers.
I had the same complaint and was informed of the discremanant law.


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## gundoctor (May 20, 2004)

Bucksnort said:


> A game warden has more authority than any law enforcement officer in this state. They have more lienency when it comes to search and siezure laws and can enforce any and all laws in the state. .


TP&W Game Wardens are commissioned peace officers of the state of Texas and have been since the 1960s. As such, they have no more authority for search than any other Texas commissioned peace officer. TP&W has tried to give them special search authority several times, but it has always not held up in court.
To make a legal search, they have to obtain a search warrant or have probable cause, like any other commissioned peace officer.
Also, any other commissioned peace officer can give tickets for game law violations. These include Rangers, DPS troupers, sheriff department, constables, ISD police, or city police. Most times they will call the game warden to handle a game violation as a courtesy and to make sure all the paper work is correct.


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## Sace (May 21, 2004)

*Val Verde County*

Just wanted to give a "that a boy" to the Game Warden in my neck of the rocks in Val Verde County. Officer Tamayo is out there, and I had to call him once to check on some other hunters. He couldn't have been any nicer. He came back by to explain what he had found, and pretty much pleaded with me to feel free to call him anytime I thought there might be something peculiar going on and to let the other hunters in the area to know the same thing. His phrase was "the hunters and landowners are our eyes and ears, without them our job is almost impossible". Even offered to check on my place, just had to give him a call and ask him to run by. Super nice guy. Made me feel a whole lot better about how these guys do their job. But on a differant note. I was hunting in Crockett one year, and an officer saw us heading into the woods. Came back in with his truck, walked around until he found a couple of us in the trees to ask for licenses. I thought it was good that he was concerned about hunters without licenses, but thought it would have made more sense to grab us prior to us heading into the woods and getting set up in our climbers. It's a big pain in the rear to get 20+ ft up in a tree to only have to climb down to show the officer your license. Loud enough heading up the first time..lol...but all in all...I think they all do a good job.


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## InfamousJ (May 21, 2004)

We had a game warden tell my Dad, who likes to just sit at camp and not hunt, that if he even catches him hunting hub caps on the side of the road he'd give him a ticket. LOL Dad likes to check the hog traps with everyone, but dont hunt. He started buying a license each year after that.


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## roger1shot (Jul 28, 2004)

*First Day Game Wardens*

Hey,
If you hunt on Public land, 99% of the time you will get checked by a Warden before the season is over. And you can always tell a first day Game Warden,because he's not real easey going and relaxed.He's jumpy but, over time he'll calm down and turn out to be a nice guy.
One first day Game Warder had me to but the head of the deer in a icechest with the deer meat. But not before he was about to write me a ticked for not having the head with the meat. In the rule book it states that the head has to be with the meat.So I went a but the head in a plastic bag,and then placed the head in with the deer meat,just to make him happy.At first I thought he was joking. But he wasn't,and was fixxing to write me up.


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## Brewgod (May 21, 2004)

*Ya know,*

These are guys that are willing to go out there ALONE, to check up on people they KNOW are carrying weapons, usually LOADED (weapon and/or person). If you had been in my neck of the woods, you would have been face down in the road, cuffed and stuffed. These guys probably place their life closer to the line everyday than any other branch of law enforcement, so if one seemed a bit jumpy to me, I would do my utmost to reassure him that I was in full comliance. Remember the first rule of driver's ed school? DON'T **** OFF THE COP!
Cut the guy some slack, make up, and you will probably have an easier time in the future. Go make an ally, not an enemy.


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## Reel_Blessed II (Jun 24, 2004)

Sace: "but thought it would have made more sense to grab us prior to us heading into the woods and getting set up in our climbers. It's a big pain in the rear to get 20+ ft up in a tree to only have to climb down to show the officer your license. Loud enough heading up the first time..lol...but all in all...I think they all do a good job."


Hey Sace, this goes back to my original post about my uncle had a game warden at their camp and the warden said that they cannot ask for your hunting license unless they witness you in the act of hunting.


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## Sace (May 21, 2004)

Right....we were unloading...stands, bows, wearing camo...lying to each other about where we were headed....stuffing beer in our backpacks...we were hunting???? Lol...I've been stopped heading out of my ranch for a search of my truck. You aren't exactly "hunting" then. Don't get me wrong, I would rather them check then, then not at all......Clarify real quick...if you get pullled over in your truck...have all the items in your truck to hunt...it's hunting season. You do not have an animals....you are asked for your license...you don't have one...is that a violation? Just posing the question..


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## CHunter (May 25, 2004)

Just because you don't have any game doesn't mean you haven't been hunting. If you have camo, hunting gear, guns, wood, feed and 4 wheeler, your gonna play hell trying to explain to the warden that you haven't been hunting. In his mind its for the judge and jury to decide, he just enforces the laws and writes citations for the ones the don't or cannot comply. Put yourself in his shoes.

These guys have been hired to do a job, some do their job better than others as with anything. Anything you do to try to impede their job just makes it worse for you. Its just like sitting in your car in a parking lot and the keys are in the ignition but you dont have a drivers license. Whats he gonna do?


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## Reel_Blessed II (Jun 24, 2004)

Sace said:


> Right....we were unloading...stands, bows, wearing camo...lying to each other about where we were headed....stuffing beer in our backpacks...we were hunting???? Lol...I've been stopped heading out of my ranch for a search of my truck. You aren't exactly "hunting" then. Don't get me wrong, I would rather them check then, then not at all......Clarify real quick...if you get pullled over in your truck...have all the items in your truck to hunt...it's hunting season. You do not have an animals....you are asked for your license...you don't have one...is that a violation? Just posing the question..


LOL...Yea...it seems weird. I'm just going by what my uncle told me. The warden just wanted to see the license of the guy that shot a deer that was hanging up. My uncle asked if he needed to see his and he said you can show it to me but I can't ask for it unless you're in the process of hunting. I'm assuming "hunting" would mean in the act of stalking or pursueing an animal. Walking through the woods with your gun strapped over your shoulder isn't hunting per say. You might be GOING to hunt but you have not yet begun to hunt. To answer your question, according to this warden, they can't ask for your license if you're not hunting or there's no evidence of a hunt, ie. a deer or deer head in your truck. Obviously, a guy wearing cammo, has his gun and deer corn in his truck would be evidence of GOING hunting but I guess the law states a person has to be in the ACT of hunting. I guess, the moral of the story would be to have your hunting license on you at all times.


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## Sace (May 21, 2004)

Don't get me wrong...I'm with whatever a Warden decides to do......I knew a guy who took his kid hunting...boy shot two does....dad had never shot a buck...buck comes out..dad had brought a "back up gun"....and pops the buck...on the way out of the ranch...they have to go through a check point of wardens..warden is suspicious of 3 deer..one boy....two guns...pops doesn't have a license...so he doesn't buy the "back up gun" story....finds are problem with the cuts on the tags for the date..and tickets the boy $400....I thought he did a good job......I would like to see Wardens check anything that is a bit suspicious...I would like to see them get people whenever they can...but if you are suspicious...grab me before I head out..I think the officer could discern if I was going to hunt or not...and check for my license..that's all I was trying to say..


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## Reel_Blessed II (Jun 24, 2004)

I agree with you totally. Especially when there is a kill in view, they need to make sure everything is legal.


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

Wet dreams 

This is a tough crowd, looks like your not gonna get much simpathy.

sorry for your bad luck!


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

Wasnt asking for sympothy, I just thought and STILL do that theres a rite way and a wrong way (which mite be rite by law) to take care of bussiness. I dont guess any of you have ever rushed out and forgot your billfold. I stated that we had a Deer processing (brother still does Taxidermy) and would process 6-9 hundred deer a season and have seen and visited with more GWs than the most of you ever will in a lifetime. I have seen Gws rite tickets for a very minor offense and some others give a a-- eating, the guy who gave the tounge lashing and let the guy go made a friend, and could call on the hunter for help in a area if needed. I have seen my dad now 79 run a GW out of our shop for not knowing the law and told him to come back when he learned it, which he did with an apoligy, this was over a tag not being on a set of horns to be mounted. In the last cpl of yrs the laws have changed and it now requires the taxidermist to get all info from hunter lisc# county taken in just about everything short of your SS# along with making sure it all legal and I'm SURE thats OK with some of you too but NOT me (whos doing whos job) I also said I DO KNOW what authority the law has be it a GW, DPS, Deputy or whatever. The only thing I was *****ing about is the second thing out of his mouth was wheres your hunting lisc. you've been hunting and next was your getting a ticket for hunting without a lisc., refusing to let friend go 200 yrds to my house and get them and refusing to contact office to check he just wanted to write a ticket. And I also know if he would've let him my friend could've brought back Osama Bin back with him. After we and he made his points he said he was gonna let me off with a warning, and I explicity told him to write me ANY tickets he wanted. Dont know why he just give me a warning ??????????????????????


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## Redfishr (Jul 26, 2004)

Like everybody said , you looked like you had been hunting and the law says that you must have a lisence on your person , not at the house, two hundred yards away.
You were riding a 4 wheeler down the rode, also not good in his eyes.
So it doesnt matter how many game wardens you've patted on the back and invited to coffee.
You were percieved as breaking the law and rightfuly so.
Because your a local and he didnt treat you like a friend , you got ****** and thats just the way it goes, because he was in the right, not you.
No sympathy given!


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## Suthsayer (Sep 27, 2004)

Just so you know WD, if he were to write you a ticket for not having your license on you, you can simply send a facsimile(fax) with your info along with a copy of your license, to the concerned location and they will dismiss the ticket. "and I explicity told him to write me ANY tickets he wanted." Why did you say that to him? Were you patronizing him or he patronizing you?


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## Walkin' Jack (May 20, 2004)

Shawn, Just let me say up front that I'm proud of you for standing your ground (you were in the right, no doubt about it) and putting up a very logical and eloquent argument. It is always risky to do a thing like this but I'm glad it worked out for you. Of course this mook had no way to know if you were honest or not but he should have considered your comments and the circumstances more carefully before jumping to conclusions and whippin' out the ticket pad. I believe that he did eventually see your point and even though he would never admit it to you, that he'd been wrong. He gave you the warning ticket, IMHO, to save face.

I know this will be like preachin' to the choir but it would always be a lot more simple for all concerned if you will always take your wallet with ID, licenses and permits, etc, with you anytime you leave the casa. 

You might need to keep your eyes out for this guy for a while, He might be waiting to trip you up on some little thing or other for a while. Just make sure all your stuff is on the up and up.


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## Bucksnort (Jun 29, 2004)

gundoctor said:


> TP&W Game Wardens are commissioned peace officers of the state of Texas and have been since the 1960s. As such, they have no more authority for search than any other Texas commissioned peace officer. TP&W has tried to give them special search authority several times, but it has always not held up in court.
> To make a legal search, they have to obtain a search warrant or have probable cause, like any other commissioned peace officer.
> Also, any other commissioned peace officer can give tickets for game law violations. These include Rangers, DPS troupers, sheriff department, constables, ISD police, or city police. Most times they will call the game warden to handle a game violation as a courtesy and to make sure all the paper work is correct.


Gundoc, Yes Game Wardens are commissioned peace officers by the State and are also Commissioned by the Texas Parks and Wildlife as Game Wardens. Regular State Commissioned Officers are not...and that is the difference and why Game Wardens have more authority. You have to be commissioned by both


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## gunnut (Aug 3, 2004)

Few thoughts...

Several violations could have been issued, by a game warden or regular police officer. 

As for the pay, the difference b/t DPS and TPWD. None, both paid for by the state of TX. License fees dont pay wardens salaries. It pays for habitat, training, grants, restocking, shrimping buy backs, youth programs...etc. But, t doesn't pay their salaries.


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## swTXSU (Aug 17, 2004)

Sorry Gunnut you are incorrect, although the salaries are the same, DPS funding comes from Fund 6, the highway fund. Game Warden salaries are paid from fund 9, fish and game fund, the same fund your hunting and fishing licenses are paid into.


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## oneleggedwader (Dec 2, 2004)

Correction made by a fellow bobcat, way to go swTSTU.


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## waterspout (May 21, 2004)

I thought a new ruling came out last year where they didn't have to ask anymore. They use to ask us to see in the icechest. You had the right to refuse(not smart but you could). Anyway, I thought the new rule(law) gave them the right to look period now. If you are out and have a gun or fishing pole it is cause to search.


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## deke (Oct 5, 2004)

I belive you are right waterspout.


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## bald_and_grumpy (Jan 10, 2005)

*It's a good thing it wasn't me...*

As a former state commissioned law enforcement officer (in another state) whose duties included enforcement of fish and game laws, my take on this story is this: Had that been me on the job, I would have "pokey-fied" you. (That's fancy talk for being TAKEN TO JAIL)

Come on! You were "looking" for a wounded deer (that's fancy talk for HUNTING) to "finish" (that fancy talk for KILLING, which is also called HUNTING) with a 22 mag (which is ILLEGAL TO HUNT DEER with) without your hunting license on you...

Wow! You're lucky that you found such a nice warden. You should buy him a beer...heck, I think I'll buy him a beer...

Seriously, I'm glad you didn't get in trouble, and I'm sure you'll be more careful in the future.


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## Copzilla (May 21, 2004)

I concur. I'm a current Texas peace officer, and there were more violations than what people are thinking of here. It's illegal to be out riding the ATV on the road, and it's also illegal to not produce an ID on demand of the officer. And if you were going out to finish off a deer, you were in fact hunting with an illegal gun without a license on your possession.

It's my personal policy that if someone gets crappy with me and challenges me to write them a ticket, I do exactly that, or take them to jail. If they want their day in court, I give it to them, and I do not abide by people who are disrespectful of me. And no doubt about it, you were disrespectful, by your own admission.

If people don't respect the law, the next best thing is fear of the law.

I've heard a lot of sob stories, and coming onto a message board and griping about a written warning and talking about abusiveness takes the cake. While it's real nice you got a rookie - you had best be glad you didn't get this grizzled 16 year veteran cop. I would have given you a real reason to gripe.


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## wet dreams (May 21, 2004)

If you 2 last posters would have read my ENTIRE post you would have read I wasnt on rd which dont matter as I was on state property and I did have a 22mag and I DO know its against the law and have known that since about 8 and I'm now 51, this AINT my first rodeo BUT. Next time I'll take my 7mm mag to finish off a down deer as I'm SURE you law abiding citizens would have done>>NOT<<. Why dont you do a little checking around and see what guides use to finish off a deer on bigger ranches (YO, Escondito, ect) than you have hunted on. My MAIN ?? was a LITTLE common sinse was NOT USED. The attitude expressed by the warden FIRST led to my questons and his answers it lit me up. I still say he could have used avanues that are available to him for just this type of incedent. Now I'm sure all people that break the law WOULD have gotten tickets from the both of you no matter what the conditions. I DO know the importance of his job and all peticulars surrounding it, the most important aspect of being peace oficer is dealing with the public and first and foremost not everybody is guilty rite off the bat. Why dont you read the constition. Seems as if you would make really good peace oficers in a THIRD WORLD COUNTRY. I DO know and have known you can get more out of a jacka*^ with sugar than a 2x4 WW


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## bald_and_grumpy (Jan 10, 2005)

*Even if a 22 mag was the best, it is still illegal...*

Actually, I prefer the 2X4. Rough-sawn walnut has always been my first choice...


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## Copzilla (May 21, 2004)

Thanks for the lecture, Wet Dreams.

I assure you I have read the C-O-N-S-T-I-T-U-T-I-O-N. I understand the concept of innocence until proven guilty; however, that is a concept for the courts, not for the cops. If peace officers assumed everyone were innocent, we'd not ever investigate anything or ever arrest anyone, because we'd automatically believe everything we heard from everyone, despite what our own eyes were telling us. Cops are not required to assume innocence until guilt is proven; only juries and judges.

But really, this is as much an issue about respect for the law and the lawman as anything, and I have not seen a whole lot of it from you. By your own admission, you *****ed the guy out, and I'm simply telling you that you had probably best feel grateful that it was a rookie you got, because that would not work with me... ever. Because by your crabby attitude, you show that you do not care that you broke the law, and if someone shows me that they do not care, I'll insure that they DO care the next time.


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## Copzilla (May 21, 2004)

And with that, I'll ask the admins/mods to lock this thread, please? It's not likely going to stay civil if it stays open.


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## MouletteRouge (Aug 11, 2004)

I have never had trouble with wardens in the past...The very few I have encountered have been pleasant, but even if they had not been, I would never question their authority, the same way I would never question a traffic cop...If I know that I have been in the wrong, I will appologize and find out what he thinks that I have done wrong himself, if I disagree, I would take it to a higher level, after he leaves peacefully...Most of the time, if you seem concerned, and have decent reason for what you are doing or did, there will not be any problems...Tickets are money, something I have very little of...I think even the cockiest of peace officers can be handled by a little respect, something that they are not too used to...No matter how nasty they get with you...if you have a problem, report it...The middle of nowhere with just you and him is no place to argue...


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## InfamousJ (May 21, 2004)

It is civil and we do not need moderation on here. Each has their own opinion. I can see both sides clearly but the real point to this whole matter is the "law is blind" as it should be. We do not care if someone mouths off to you, you have the authority to take them to jail.


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## Trouthunter (Dec 18, 1998)

One thing that I know for sure and certain is that as a citizen you should respect the law...but, there are a lot of crummy law enforcement people out there, some who don't deserve and who will never earn the respect that they think is due to them simply because they wear a badge and a firearm. I hate hearing or reading about a peace officer who is going to "teach" someone to respect them simply because they wear a badge. BS. With that badge comes a huge responsibility to protect and to SERVE. You want respect? Act respectfull and more times than not you'll get that respect right back.

What Copzilla said above..."Cops are not required to assume innocence until guilt is proven; only juries and judges"., may be true, but we also have to assume that the "cop" in question has a little common sense. Without that important law enforcement tool, our jails would be spilling over into the streets with arrests made by overzealous officers of the law. The "let's just arrest them all and let someone else sort it out" attitude is all too common these days.

Unfortunately the TCLEOSE certification doesn't guarantee common sense in those who pass the test. We can sure see that these days, can't we?

TH


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