Stupid question #83

[Hawkeye]

All right... I have a secret to confess... I don't know how to catch bait... How do you all locate your baitfish and what method do you emply to catch enough to fish without having to haul anchor to go back and catch some more? I'm talking shad, or whatever else you're using... I can catch bluegills and other fish like that, but I'm a complete failure when it comes to locating shad and putting it into the baitwell or cooler to use later... HELP

[mudd_catt]

I cheat. I use a Sabiki rig to catch skipjack, usually in some type of current oriented location. Shad I catch in a cast net, depending on where i am. or you can cheat and use chicken/rooster livers.

[Hawkeye]

I don't think we have Skipjack here.... I guess what I'm trying to say is that I just don't "get" where I should be trying to catch the shad.... creek mouths? shallow water? deep water? around structure? Dern it if I know... I've seen large shad jumping all over the river at different times, but the only place I've caught them reliably (and maybe I should stick with what I know, huh?) has been in the river by my house on spoons..... I'd like to learn how to catch fresh bait while I'm on the water... it's something I probably should've learned thirty years ago, but I didn't fish for catfish back then LOL......
I have lots of "store bought" baits that work on little fish... everyone tells me that if I want to catch BIG fish I need fresh cut shad... big chunks... and lots of it.
Thanks Mudd Catt... I still laugh everytime I read that thing about vegetarian being an old indian word for someone who can't fish LOL

[mudd_catt]

u mite try where current is coming into the river, or if you fish at nite, under lights.

[Hawkeye]

I figured the under the lights thing out from reading NightTrains' posts regarding catching bait at night, but most of my trips will be early morning to late afternoon until I am comfortable with taking the boat out. I'll try everything I can think of until something works LOL.... thanks

[Mando]

i hear ya on that one hawkeye, its a pain catching bait. usually they are in the creek behind our house but lately i havent been able to find any bait. castnet is the only method we use to catch shad. there always sure to be under lights but if its in the day sometimes u just gotta move around till u find em, at least thats what i have to do.

[Tiny]

this is a cut n paste from my tips section ... hope this helps



A lot of people have asked me about finding shad ... or saying they don't know what to look for when searching for shad. Usually it's not too hard to find shad if there's a healthy population in the environment you're fishing. The most evident is the tell tale flipping on top of the water ... when you see a bright flash of white and a small splash on top of the water, that's usually shad and there's most always a lot of other shad with that one that just flipped on top. Get your thrownet ready to throw and when you see one flip, throw your net over where you seen the shad flip on top of the water. This is a good summer method when shad are swimming along sandy beaches or the shore.

If you're trying to find them in rivers it's pretty easy to figure out where they are ... usually along the edge of current is a good place to throw ... like in my fishin video in the Downloads section it shows me throwing right at the end of the retainer wall at the dam and netting about 30 shad with one throw. Current breaks or eddies is also a good place ... when there's water flowing past a point sticking out on the bank or a big boulder it creates a little current break where shad will congregate behind. Winter shad is a little tougher and usually requires a boat and good electronics. I use a nylon net for catching winter shad cause it seems to not close up as badly or you can use duct tape on the thrownet around the skirt to keep it from closing up ... you'll also need about a 50 ft handline cause they'll be deep ... troll around watching your graph and when you see a big school of shad throw your net ... take note to where your transducer is on the boat ... best to have one mounted or a built-in transducer on your trolling motor but if your transducer is on the back of the boat you'll have to have someone back there throwing ... wait until the boat moves about 5 to 10 ft past where you seen the shad on the graph and then throw behind the boat ... if you have a trolling motor mounted transducer then reverse the trolling motor and move back about 5 to 10 ft and throw where your transducer picked up the shad. good fishin!

I'll also add this, the lake you're fishing may not have a lot of shad .. this can be a problem as in clear water lakes the shad are very vulnerable to hybrids, stripers, and catfish so it may be a little harder to find shad in these situations. shad seem to do a lot better in muddy and murky water like here at keystone lake in oklahoma where it's muddy most of the year ...keystone has more shad per acre than any other lake in oklahoma and I think it's because of that ... the stripers and hybrids in keystone didn't do very well in keystone because of the muddy water also but the shad thrived. in the summer just be sure to watch the top of the water and visually locate the shad because most of the time just throwing the net where you see nothing will produce nothing and if there's shad near the area you're trying to catch them they will be pushed out of the area by the noise of the net hitting the water ... watch the water and throw only where you see them in the spring summer and fall ... in the winter they'll be deep and you'll have to locate them with electronics. also in the late spring when they're spawning there will be a lot of shad located on wind blown sandy shores ... most of the time sandy shores on the north side of the lakes is where I find most of my late spring shad due to most of the wind being out of the south ... hope this helps

[Hawkeye]

This is just what I was hoping for... and I'll give your suggestions a try this Saturday.... Thanks Tiny

[medulla762]

Also find algae covered structure such as rip rap, pier piles, styrofoam dock floats, bulkheads.

Culverts and small creeks that dump into the lake are also great shad haunts .

At first light the shad will likely still be around but they retreat to the deeper water shortly after daylight.

[Catfish]

Tiny ,

That was a great post ... Welcome to the board ...

Hawkeye ,

I might add ... If you are in your boat -- some of the rivers have small inlet creeks that open up to wide shallow water when you get into them .. This seems to be a wonderful place to find the shad -- Watch for the riffling water and dark spots .. A pair of polarized sunglasses is a must when finding shad ,,, It will make your life a lot easier ... Also if you have a dam with walk up access to the sides ... The swift water closer to the dam usually holds bait ... This is also a great place to get bait and it is usally easier to come by ... Again - polarized glasses are a big help ... Usually you can take these shad with a long shad net or dip net - whatever you want to call it -- I would get one with the longest handle you can find 8' would not be over doing it here .. I would be careful with cast nets in these areas - 2 reasons - If you are not really experienced with a cast net - you can lose them and tear them up in these areas .. I try to act like I know what I am doing with one and occasionally still lose them - The 2nd reason is that some states have laws about throwing a cast net within X amount of feet from a dam .... Hope this is helpful ...

[Hawkeye]

Thanks Catfish... I'll try all the advice you guys have offered... it sounds like I might be able to locate something to use for bait... One saving grace... today, I located a local guy who sells eels... big eels... so I'll have some bait, no matter what I do on the river... I also have some frozen finger mullet, squid and chicken parts... that ought to get me something I can use for cutbait if nothing else I try works to catch shad...

Thanks everyone!

Tom

[NightTrain]

All of the above posts are excellent(Tiny's got it down)...Bait is where you find it.One lake bait is abundant and deep...a river 20 mi. down the road,totally different techniques and times of day are the answer.
At any rate,you have been signed up for "CASTNET THROWING 101"...CLASS BEGINS@ o'DARK-THIRTY,July15,'04...Holly Grove Creek.Large fish will be wrestled with immediately following class.:bounce:

P.S.-dude,might get ya to give afew of them eels aride down the interstate.

[Hawkeye]

All of the above posts are excellent(Tiny's got it down)...Bait is where you find it.One lake bait is abundant and deep...a river 20 mi. down the road,totally different techniques and times of day are the answer.
At any rate,you have been signed up for "CASTNET THROWING 101"...CLASS BEGINS@ o'DARK-THIRTY,July15,'04...Holly Grove Creek.Large fish will be wrestled with immediately following class.:bounce:

P.S.-dude,might get ya to give afew of them eels aride down the interstate.I've got two in the freezer for you right now... the guy that catches them has an order from me for at least six more bigun's for you....

[NightTrain]

Yeehaaaaaaaw....thanks buddy!We still on for that Thursday night?GLAD YA GOT THE BOAT OUT AND RUNNIN'!Now just get your "routine" down and start buying gobs of gear ...and your set!

[Hawkeye]

As far as I know, I'll be there sometime after work on Thursday, next week. I'll be in touch toward the end of this week to make more exact arrangements... time to meet, place, etc... I have plenty of gear... I just don't seem to know how to catch fish in the boat... One of the catmen on the James let me in on his bait-catching secret. It's called a gill net... anyone know where I can buy one?

[NightTrain]

The ones I've SEEN used were at Hatteras Inlet,used to catch bunker(Menhaden)and were a major operation.Before you buy one,wait and see how simple(with practice)a castnet is.Alot more compact and versital,too,I would imagine.

[Hawkeye]

My friend Jerry showed me how to use a cast net a while back. I haven't bought one yet, because it doesn't make any sense to use it unless you can find the bait. I'm planning to go to school when we fish together, so I'm not such an embarassment to the rest of the catmen (or wanna be in my case) of the world.

[NightTrain]

WE ALL LEARNED SOMEWHERE...take that to the bank,buddy.Finding bait is a matter of studying your waters,and getting out and doing it.YOU CAN THROW FOR AN HOUR in one spot,leave,come back 30 mins. later, and fill the net in one throw.I used to be a''sponge" for fishing info,and still am.You ain't embarassin' nobody,podna.I try to learn something new every day!!

[Hawkeye]

Well... my "goal" for lack of a better word, for when we go fishing is to pay attention and try to learn something while relaxing and having a good time. If we catch some fish, then all the better... I'm thankful you invited me.

[NightTrain]

That's why I fish @ night,to kick back and enjoy the owls and the night sky.You just set up and (hopefully)the fish catch themselves while you're there.I look forward to you comin'.

[Hawkeye]

I'm also "leaning" toward leaving my boat at home, as you suggested for the first time down to the lake... less stress riding with someone familiar with the water. That's one thing I really need to do up here on the James.... ride and look around at the shape of the shoreline, check the depth of the water, and just cruise for a few outings with no expectation of catching anything of note... Last time I went, I rode around for a while upriver from the bridge to see the river and to try to figure out a few things. It's a big place and there are lots of holes, channels, points and gazillions of places for catfish... SO let me know what you want to do about a boat... mine or yours... your pick... and I'll either bring rods & reels or leave 'em home as you like. I think I would like to bring two combos to try out, but I'll bring what you want me to bring.

[NightTrain]

I call it "marking bottom"...just riding around marking drop-offs,humps,etc.and lining them up with a landmark on at least 2 sides,then try to remember it.I do small sections of lake and kinda look at each as a "pond".'Course @ night,you mark by shoreline lights,channel bouys,and instinct(bein' out there alot).
We'll take my boat and equipment.Bring a couple of rods if you like(not necessary).Those eels and some of that Smithfield Barbecue and hushpuppies will give you free-reign to pick my brain,bro.Ya'll laugh,but,as good as potted meat and crackers are at 0400,a BBQ/hushpuppy/cold Mountain Dew is"brainfood"(i.e.-makes you think what the fish are up to,instead of what time the breakfast grill at the marina opens)!!;)