Fan Boats Outlawed on Conroe Lake?

[Salty1]

I just started bowfishing and got to go out on Lake Conroe one time and I am hooked. My friend that took me out told me he has heard from some of his buds that they have recently been issued warning tickets by TPWD for bowfishing from the fanboats. They said that TPWD said that a new regulation is in effect for Lake Conroe that you can't have any fan boat over 90 decibals.

He said that the federal PWD is issuing tickets on the north end of the lake with no warnings even though this is a new reg and nothing has been published or is in writing anywhere that we can find.

Does anyone know about this? Does anyone know where to find this in writing? His boat is really quiet but not at 90 decibals. From what he told me 90 decibals is about what a normal conversation is carried at.

A normal outboard is a lot louder than that so we all better be ready for that to be next...

Every time he takes his boat out near Lewis Creek there is a lady that complains on him and any other fan boats that comes up in there. She has a house on the water on Pelican Island with a pier and a submerged light and places a lot of complaints on anyone that bow fishes in the cove. The MCSO and Constables all know her by name.

Anyway, if anyone knows anything about this NEW reg, please let me know?

[bowfishrp]

90 decibels is pretty loud. A vacuum is 70 and my generator is about 70 also.

We have been trying to find where and who has this law and the only thing we have been able to find out is that it has to do with the National Forest. From what we understand from the local TPWD is that they are NOT going to enforce it. However, a federal game warden would give you a ticket. We have been fishing up on the north end since we heard this and did not have a problem, but those park rangers were no where to be found. I have going to have to head up there and have them SHOW me where it says we cant fish with my fan boat.

I have not heard anything or seen anything in writing anywhere that says that airboats or fan boats cannot fish Conroe. We looked through the forestry regs but the only thing we found was that you were not allowed to HUNT out of an airboat.

[CoastalOutfitters]

The Federal Parks noise ordinance is not new, it started over 30 yrs ago and was directed at motorcycles and snow mobiles and chain saws etc..even covers flyovers by planes.

there may be a county ord. in place too, the sherrifs dept will know about it if you call them.

[trodery]

Approx. Decibel Level





Whisper, quiet library. 30db



Normal conversation, sewing machine, typewriter. 60db



Lawnmower, shop tools, truck traffic; 8 hours per day is the maximum exposure to protect 90% of people. 90db


Chainsaw, pneumatic drill, snowmobile; 2 hours per day is the maximum exposure without protection. 100db


Sandblasting, loud rock concert, auto horn; 15 minutes per day is the maximum exposure without protection. 115db



Gun muzzle blast, jet engine; noise causes pain and even brief exposure injures unprotected ears. Maximum allowed noise with hearing protectors. 140db

[bowfishrp]

Well if it is a noise ordinance that is the problem then I have nothing to worry about. My fan is quieter than my generator at idle....it is loud when I get on it. HOWEVER, how are they are going to enforce it????? Does the noise ordinance say at what distance it is to be measured? You see you cannot judge noise level unless you state how far away you are to the noise object. In other words they would have to say no more than 90 db at a distance or 10 ft away.

Guess I will have to run down to Radio Shack and buy one of those noise testers....I think they are about $50 and if I get hassled I can whip it out and answer any questions they might have.

[Salty1]

Coastal Outfitters, it sounds like you are pretty knowledgeable on the matter. What is the federal CFR, USC, or federal regulation citation number? It makes sense because the guys that we have heard about getting the tickets from the federal PWD have been on the far north end of the lake near the national forest. Is the federal threshold 90 decibels? May be this is what they are referring to? If so, that would leave the rest of the lake for us to enjoy?



Has anyone been cited by the federal PWD for this violation on Lake Conroe or stopped by the TPWD and received a warning or a citation for this? What did they cite you for? What did they tell you? Has anyone heard of a county ordinance on this?



My friend’s boat is really quiet at idle and probably only exceeds the 90 decibels initially to get the fans going but then it gets pretty quiet.



I have to admit that I probably make more noise than that when I actually connect with a fish…

[CoastalOutfitters]

no, can't cite a regulation, but pull some federal parks on the net.

http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/texas/recreation/sam_houston/samhouston_gen_info.shtml
It has to do with if the park is considered a wilderness area and also if it has posted noise ordinences at the check in.

I suspect they enforce all park regs if they feel you are crossing their boundaries.....even if you aren't a guest...

http://www.fs.fed.us/r8/texas/maps/forest_map_sam_2005.pdf

2 other things to know

you have to have a nat. park approved flame arresting muffler on generators and motors in general

generators can't be run late at night

good luck


good luck

[bowfishrp]

I spoke with another bowfishing team this weekend and they had some bowfishing friends that got a ticket above 1097 about 3 weeks ago. They did not say if they were in a fan or airboat or what the actual ticket was for.

I got the phone number of the law enforcement officer for the Sam Houston Nat
Forest....he is not in yet but I will call him back this afternoon. The lady I spoke with said that if any tickets were being written he would know about it.

At this point I just want to know what the tickets are for.....I will let you know what I find.

[Salty1]

I am anxious to hear too. I get home too late to call their office so if you can find out for the rest of us, we would all appreciate it. I saw 2 fanboats in Lewis Creek this weekend when I was passing over the bridge.

[CoastalOutfitters]

Is there any chance these guys are getting a ticket for being in the park without a park day pass or

"hunting" in a park with a non approved weapon???

[bowfishrp]

The enforcement officer for Sam Houston Nat forest will not answer the phone or return my calls....I am about to post his name and number but dont know if that would get me in trouble. I THINK it is a noise ordinance but I want to know where that is written and what the db level has to be...if that is it I will be buying a db meter and test my fan.

Again I just want to know what law we are supposed to be breaking.

[Salty1]

bowfishrp-I have left detailed voicemail messages at the Sam Houston National Forest as well and he has not returned my call either. I left voicemails with a detailed message at the Lake Conroe Lake Patrol office (Montgomery County Constable Precinct 1 Don Chomley's office) and at the San Jacinto River Authority and no one has returned my calls.

According to a website I found, the San Jacinto River Authority is actually the governing authority for all rules, regulations, and laws implemented for Lake Conroe. I have not had my voicemail message returned.

I believe the National Parks fall under the Department of the Interior. I believe they have an office in Houston, TX. I guess that will have to be the next avenue?

I am really frustrated that no one will answer the question or return a phone call. Does anyone know the answer out there?

I am not sure if the guys that got the tickets were on the national Parks land but as far as I know they were on Lake Conroe.

[bowfishrp]

We were on Lewis creek last week and it was pretty muddy....not near as good as above 1097.

We pay at the park entrance just like everyone else, but that is the rub, we dont even KNOW what they are ticketing people for.

[bowfishrp]

I have not been able to talk to the guy still, however, I spoke to a guy who did. The problem is noise. Apparently there are a few airboats with no mufflers running around Cagle camp grounds and upsetting a lot of campers. When they complain, the officers start writing tickets....cant say that I blame them much. Those non-muffled airboats are very loud and they launch and load right at the boat ramp right next to the camp grounds. There was even some discussion about generators since after 10PM there are not supposed to be any generators running in the camp grounds.

He heard 90db at 90ft but he was not certain. No non-muffled airboat would stay under 90db even at idle. However, not 100% sure on the db numbers.

If you are fishing up that way, respect the campers and keep the noise down! NO ONE likes to be woke up at 2AM by a loud airboat loading up their boat.

[Quackerbox]

I was told ANY boat with above water exhaust was not allowed on Conroe, this including all the scarabs and weekend warriors that cruise the lake in half plane circles...

[remi19]

That can't be right, Half the boats on conroe would be breaking the law.

[Bowhntr]

That law (which happened this year is true) guess people with money really can make their own rules when it makes them happy. What was the ticket for? bowfishing or the fan boat? As of Sept 1, 2008 you CAN'T bowfishing for cats anymore-but gar/carp okay. AS last meeting this was only a proposal-NOT LAW to use air boats on the lake. They (TPWD) is still considering it. However, ther river authority can set this rule as well, check with them to see if they passed it

[bboswell]

This is NOT new. I was stopped over 4 years ago north of 1097 by a game warden for this very thing.

It is not a SJRA deal and it is not a Lake Conroe deal. It is a National Forest issue. The warder told me that 1097 was the line between Lake Conroe and the National forest for this and other matters.

I have always expected them to outlaw fan boats on the whole lake since this law forces fan boat to only operate in the populated end of the lake which causes disturbance issues.

[Salty1]

I am trying to get through to the same number at the National Forest but he won’t return may calls either. I did get through to the SJRA last Friday and the lady immediately referred me back to the Sam Houston National Forest when I explained to her that I was trying to find out about bow fishing from airboats on Lake Conroe. I told her that he would not return our calls so she confirmed that on the North end of the lake near the Sam Houston National Forest that there is some type of Federal law that is being enforced by them but she could not give me the specifics of it.


She did not know there was a difference between a fan boat and airboat so I educated her on it. She did warn us to stay away from people’s homes on the lake in the early morning hours though because it could be considered a “nuisance”. When I asked her to tell me what the actual law is that prevent us from being on the lake at a certain time, she said I would have to talk to the Parks and Wildlife. I asked her if the SJRA is the governing body for Lake Conroe for the laws, regulations, and rules and she said ”yes” but could not quote the law for the “nuisance”.



I am pretty frustrated. Everyone is trying to do the right thing and abide by the law but the law won’t tell us what the laws are…



My friend has had his fan boat out a few times but he is staying away from the north end of the lake for now. Does anyone know someone at the Dockline Magazine, the Conroe Courier, or the Houston Chronicle to do a story on it? May be then we could find the actual answers...

[CoastalOutfitters]

She did not know there was a difference between a fan boat and airboat so I educated her on it

i'm on your side , but what did you tell her ? was it noise or cubic inches or primary power?

[bboswell]

I copied the info below from another site that is having the same discussion. Seems to be the most factual and exactly in line with what the Warden explained to me while he was writting!


The upper end of Lake Conroe from FM 1097 North is within the TP&W Wildlife Management Area (Unit 905) in cooperation within the U.S. Forest Service.

On page ix of the Public Hunting Lands booklet it states " A person hunting on Public Hunting Lands commits an offense if that person: operates an airboat within the boundaries of public hunting lands, except as authorized by executive order for specific activities and time periods on specific units;"

The Forest Service authorities are promulgated under 36 CFR (Code of Federal Regulations)

36 CFR 261.10(i) Occupancy and Use states:

The following are prohibited: (i) Operating or using in or near a campsite, developed recreation site, or over an adjacent body of water without a permit, any device which produces noise, such as a radio, television, musical instrument, motor or engine in such a manner and at such a time so as to unreasonably disturb any person.

This answer is in no way an official response.

[Pocboy]

Ok, I'm going to ask because no one else wants to. What is the difference between a fan boat and an airboat?

[CoastalOutfitters]

any device which produces noise


yep, that's the way I remembered it, it's so broad that they can use it on anything

[Pocboy]

So they are the same thing?

[mudkat]

an airboat, air is the only source of propulsion .A fan boat the outboard is the main source ,the fan is a secondary trolling motor.

[bboswell]

Airboat (aka Full Blown)

Big horsepower and prop (air) is the only power source.

[bboswell]

Fan Boat

Outboard motor is primary power source and uses the fan motor on back as a shallow water trolling motor.

[bowfishrp]

Heh that's my fan boat! :) Of course it looks quite different now!
http://www.bowfishtexas.com/images/boat/boatwrail.jpg

"...any device which produces noise ...such as motor or engine in such a manner and at such a time so as to unreasonably disturb any person."

Basically this means that if someone complains about the noise, they can write you a ticket. That means STAY AWAY FROM THE CAMPGROUNDS! We went to Conroe this past weekend in my fan boat. Launched the boat in half dark and never fired the generator until we were well away from the campgrounds. My fan is not very loud (yes I have a db meter now!) but I made sure it never got above half throttle anyways and it was also never started until we were well clear. Coming back to Cagle boat ramp in the dark was no fun but we made sure there was no generator or fan running. I wanted to make sure we were not disturbing anyone. Personally I think this is what the rangers want.

While unofficially, basically airboats are banned from launching at cagle campground.

[bboswell]

Sorry for hihacking your pic without permission but I had limited time to respond to the mans question and remembered having seen those pics.

Coming into Cagle in the dark on the outboard could cost you lots of props!

[bowfishrp]

No problem boswell. :)

I know there is a stump off cagle's boat ramp but SO FAR I haven't found it....knock on wood....not using the prop! :)

[Cat O' Lies]

Saturday an airboat went by me as I was trolling NW of the 1097 bridge. I was talking on the phone when he went by and had to wait till he passed so I could hear the conversation.

[bowfishrp]

Was that during the day? I dont think they are outlawed during the day....at least based on the language.

[Cat O' Lies]

About 1:30pm

[sawgrass]

I fish above the 1097 out of my airboat and I have not had anyone say anything to me.I do know the law was changed this year to were we could run airboats on type 2 areas.

[Dave aka Regulator]

Has anyone thought about calling the Coast Guard. They can come in to all the inland lakes and patrol as well as off shore. "Has something to do with the Running Water Act or something that sounds like that...."

They may be able to get the answers for you. Im gettin the itch to get back into bow fishing myself. Still have my old bow just need to restring it and do a little tuning. Need to get some new fishin gear to hook it up with though.

Wheres a good place besides Gander or Bas Pro?

If I ever get to get back on my lil fan boat Project Ill post pictures.

[bowfishrp]

www.backwaterbowfishing.com (http://www.backwaterbowfishing.com) is a place you can go if you dont mind mail order. As for local places, you named them. Academy has some stuff but not much.

As for the noise on Conroe, keep it down around the campgrounds and I doubt you will have much of a problem. If you are in an airboat and coming back to the ramp at 2 AM you WILL make people mad and the park rangers have the right to ticket you. At Cagle you cant even run a generator after 10PM at night!
When I come back to Cagle in my fan boat we turn off everything except the outboard and nobody bothers me.

[Dave aka Regulator]

Cool Thanks.

I got ran off of Conroe about 10 Years ago. We where in an airboat heading in to get fuel and they shut us down quick. Didnt get a ticket. They told us the boat is way to loud and everyone was complaining. So we loaded up and headed up to livingston. Didnt have any problems there.

A few years later while I was volunteering with a local Fire Department I was asked if I could take an airboat up to Conroe and help with some rescue training and had to decline after remembering they dont like airboats and decided to tell them they just need to give all the local complainers swimming lessons.

[Robert10]

I live in montgomery and hunt, fish, and bowfish a lot on the north end of conroe and I can yall a couple things. You wont get a returned phone call from the TPWD, I have tried several times and if the game warden catches you he will ticket you. He checked me during duck season, I was completely legal, had boaters registration, TX numbers and even my title on hand! But my hull id number must have fallen off and my boat and he asked me where it was and I told him it was an old boat and he told me to unhook it from my truck and that he was going to take it because it was stolen! I laughed and was like are you kidding me.......needless to say I got it back 3months later after duck season and it was a "mistake" on his part.

[texas two guns]

Dude are you kidding me? Sounds like a GW with a chip on his shoulder to me.

[shauntexex]

Nope that's a true story 100% i was there of course I've heard this particular gw would write his own mother a ticket....

[sawgrass]

Its not just him its dang near all of them,I thank there mad about how much they are being paid!

[bowfishrp]

They are not all bad and you know it.

The Texas game wardens I have talked to said that it is NOT illegal to run an airboat on Lake Conroe. It is the federal game wardens that complain about airboats.

[W8kski]

This has been a law for a long time in Florida for airboats. Like one guy said, it is all about the distance that they are measuring the db's from. 90 db's is alout louder than many are saying on here. In Florida it's easy for an airbout to be under 90 db's according to the distance that they are measuring it at. I don't see how a fan boat motor would produce enough noise to break the 90 db barrier at a distance. Those of you that have them need to convert to carbon props and get rid of the noisy wooden ones to cut down on the noise. Having a db tester and knowing the distance that it is to be measured at would be the answer. Just my 2 cents.

[Dave aka Regulator]

I think a couple hundred of us should have an airboat meet / show / ride up on conroe. just all show up on the same day hang out and look like were up to something. Not make any noise and fish with cane poles just to anoy folks with the sight of our boats.

Bet they wouldn't even notice us.

[bowfishrp]

W8kski you are right but they will NOT say what the distance is on the DB reading. If I stand on the front deck of my boat and open my fan up all the way I am right at 98db....from about 15 ft away...and that is with a composite prop. I have not measured it from further away yet.

[W8kski]

I know over in Florida, their's is 90 db at 50 ft. That's not that hard to comply with when you are courteous around homes, boat docks etc. We just need to know what the distance is here.

[paragod]

Thay dont like jet boats or v-drives either !

[dang_ol]

i have ran into alot of gw, but the one on conroe, is the only one i got a ticket from, had every thing legal but my front light, was coming in before dark, when he stoped me he checked every thing, looked all though the boat, wasn't fishing or hunting, just riding, when he finally was about to let me go he asked where my front light was, told him i was coming in before it got to late, but he stoped me, he wrote me a ticket, for it, and it was his fault, i would have been at my moms house way before it even got late if it was not for him, the house was like 200 foot down the bank. i was upset, i think he seen i did not have it and held me there to give the ticket.

[dang_ol]

also, i am all for taking the fan and airboats out there, i will do it.

[bboswell]

I live in montgomery and hunt, fish, and bowfish a lot on the north end of conroe and I can yall a couple things. You wont get a returned phone call from the TPWD, I have tried several times and if the game warden catches you he will ticket you. He checked me during duck season, I was completely legal, had boaters registration, TX numbers and even my title on hand! But my hull id number must have fallen off and my boat and he asked me where it was and I told him it was an old boat and he told me to unhook it from my truck and that he was going to take it because it was stolen! I laughed and was like are you kidding me.......needless to say I got it back 3months later after duck season and it was a "mistake" on his part.

Sounds like something Brandon Minkowski would do.

[HAIRCUTTER]

Big Brother at work get use to it or Vote Wise !!!!!!!!!! Vote Early and Often!!
Get orgianized and make your reps. know who you are .Vote..
Next your paddles will be to noisey or sails will block the view.LoL.
R.E.B.